[CitizensTruth] Zeitgeist addendum (very dangerous!)

[Geri Perry]

Excellent observations and analysis from Andrew, with one reservation 
and that is about monetary based societies, and possible solutions.

My point here: Except for VERY brief periods, the "civilized nations" 
have operated under a fractional reserve, debt-based monetary system for 
1000's of years. Those in control used this system against the masses 
and relied on war as a major profit center. Read the Preface to Part 3 
of my book for insight from Smedely Butler and others: 
http://www.thetwofacesofmoney.com/index.php/Site/PrefaceToPartIII

The solution: issue debt free Treasury Notes, the way Lincoln did, as 
described by the makers of The Money Masters and others, see this page: 
http://www.thetwofacesofmoney.com/index.php/Site/MonetaryReformProposals

NOW --- My own two cents per Griffin's incorrect analysis on money creation:

RE Griffin's point #1, QUOTE: The information about the Federal Reserve 
is, for the most part, is right on target. However, I practically fell 
out of my chair when the program repeated that old, silly argument about 
the Fed not creating enough money to cover the cost of interest on debt; 
and, therefore, the world must forever be in debt.

MY RESPONSE: Fractional Reserve (along with incomplete facts on Colonial 
Scrip and Greenbacks and inflation) is where Griffin's book begins to 
fall apart and helps promote the misleading assumption that the dollar 
is devalued by inflation caused by "too much fiat money being printed". 
Contrary to Griffin's assertion dollar devaluation actually IS occurring 
because of the cumulative effects of unpayable interest. I am working on 
a 7 part series of articles on derivatives, and here is what I say about 
the money supply and debt in part 4 which I hope clarifies things a bit, 
because a glance at the money supply vs debt should speak for itself:

<SNIP> Despite the current and substantial contraction taking place in 
the M3 money supply, the fact is that over the long term – and 
especially since the 1980's - the U.S. money supply has increased 
dramatically, going from less than $2 trillion in 1980 to an estimated 
$14 trillion in 2008. Significantly, in 1980 total public and private 
debt totaled roughly $5 trillion, with about $1 trillion of that 
representing public debt. Today public and private debt totals roughly 
$50 trillion, with over $10 trillion of that representing public debt.

What these figures clearly show is that total debt has been outstripping 
the money supply for many decades due to the cumulative effects of 
unpayable interest. This fact alone makes it ever more difficult to deny 
- among all but the most hardened apologists - that the entire money 
creation system is, as Dick Distelhorst of the American Monetary 
Institute wrote in a recent newsletter, “an oxymoron - 'the more money 
we have, the deeper in debt we are.' This is ridiculous on its face, and 
yet we continue to accept it.”<END SNIP>

Griffin's point #2, QUOTE: The next jolt came when the program praised 
Civil War Greenbacks, calling them debt-free. Actually, Greenbacks were 
contrary to the U.S. Constitution and, although they were not fiat money 
issued by the banks, they were fiat money issued by the government. That 
was better than paying interest on nothing to bankers, but they still 
wiped out the purchasing power of American money through massive 
inflation. They can not correctly be called debt-free, either, because 
they represented debt on the shoulders of the government, which means, 
of course, on the shoulders of the taxpayers. It never ceases to amaze 
me how people think that the solution to money created out of nothing by 
those big, bad bankers is to have money created out of nothing by those 
nice, trustworthy politicians. Yet, that is what this program supports.

MY RESPONSE:

**FIRST, the Civil War Greenbacks - especially those issued BEFORE the 
financiers attached the Exception Clause in Feb 1862 WERE NOT CREATED 
OUT OF DEBT, as nearly all "money" (actually bank notes serving as 
money) had been up to that time. Instead the government issued Treasury 
Notes, unemcumbered by interest charges.

*** SECOND: The Greenbacks were NOT unconstitutional!! READ the 
Constitution! Part of the problem here comes with original vs 
evolutionary interpretation of the Constitution, so read this: 
http://www.umt.edu/law/faculty/natelson/articles/Coinage%20Clause.pdf

***THIRD: The Greenbacks did NOT cause massive inflation; READ chapter 
16 of my book for a brief explanation.

****FOURTH, Greenbacks can be called debt free (particularly before the 
Exception Clause watered them down and provided a profit center, yet 
again, for financiers) and they did NOT represent debt on the shoulders 
of the government, they represented a "medium of exchange", see 
explanation below.

***Fifth: What John Perkins failed to realize is that the "ECONOMIC HIT 
MEN" have operated inside the US since its inception.

Now, hopefully clearing up misconceptions about money and its true function:

FIRST, money is a medium of exchange - nothing more nothing less. An 
item becomes money when involved parties decide to accept the medium. So 
in the past everything from beads and shells to wheat and cattle to iron 
and gold to paper - and even, as in FRNs, "promises to pay" - have been 
used as money. Today about 1900 communities world wide are partially 
operating with a version of "hour dollars." So time is money in these 
communities.

SECOND, fiat money is something that is authorized or sanctioned (by the 
state) to be money. Thus, cow dung could be money if the state declared 
it to be.

THIRD: A monetary system is a method of keeping track of the flow in and 
out of the system of the chosen medium of exchange. Our monetary 
authority is the Federal Reserve System, which in turn is coordinated - 
along with central banks around the world by the BIS. Constitutionally 
the Congress is charged with the responsibility and authority to act as 
the monetary authority through the phrase "The Congress shall have the 
Power . . . To coin - as in create - money and regulate the value 
thereof, and of foreign coin." Conversely, the states are limited by the 
Constitution in terms of what they can use as money by the phrase "No 
state shall MAKE any Thing but gold and silver Coin a tender in Payments 
of debts." Thus the states are and always have been free to use any 
money the Congress creates, although they can if they like MAKE gold or 
silver coin as money (not a good thing when you realize that precious 
metals are controlled by the globalists. See my website for lots of 
documentation on all of this)


gerip


andrew ritter wrote:

> Thanks for sending this Ragen as there's good discussion here.

>

> I am not familiar at all with Griffin's work, but I would have to 

> respectfully disagree with a lot of the analysis and I think both of 

> these movies are well worth anyone's time. To characterize a truth 

> seeking film as "very dangerous" is what is very dangerous. You don't 

> have to agree with every detail in order to gain some knowledge and 

> find some truth. I find the alarm about this movie from people who are 

> supposedly on the same side to be much more alarming than the movie 

> itself.

>

> I would also caution anyone who takes Alex Jones as the ultimate 

> beacon of truth and correctness because while I admire and respect his 

> work, I have read plenty of articles that turn out to be more hype 

> than truth and this undying fervent support for Ron Paul, (while 

> completely ignoring the amazing work of others like Cynthia McKinney) 

> while wonderful and helpful has served as a distraction a lot of times 

> from the fact that the system is not going to allow a Ron Paul into 

> power no matter how much the people might want it - and to ignore that 

> is to ignore the challenging realities we face.

>

> So let's review briefly what this movie does:

>

> The movie correctly exposes the Federal Reserve for what it is and how 

> it works - well gee that is super and great - thanks!

>

> The movie says that politicians (yes EVEN Ron Paul) are not the answer 

> - look, I think making small gains inside the system is certainly a 

> good thing, but if we don't recognize that people like Ron Paul and 

> Dennis Kucinich, as wonderful as they are, are also there to make 

> people like us feel like we might have a voice and a solution inside a 

> system so we become paralyzed by the system waiting for the day that 

> the system might change is an endless excercise in stupidity. I think 

> the bailout is a perfect example.... Obama and McCain are both in step 

> with the plan AND the Dems are about to come into big power, so DEMS 

> largely support the hideous Bush/Paulson plan while the GOP suddenly 

> became "the opposition" (partly due to wanting to be re-elected) but 

> gosh darn if it just wasn't enough oppostion to actually make the 

> people's voice matter for more than a few days. Kucinich and Paul and 

> many others spoke the truth during this time, but the truth lost out 

> to the bigger power again. Hmmmmmm....

>

> I'm not saying we need to give up entirely working with politicians - 

> but to say that politicians are not the answer is not to give up hope 

> as Mr. Griffin suggests, on the contrary that is what sets us free, 

> for once we realize that the solution lies elsewhere we can start to 

> work to create the world we all deserve without the false hope that a 

> politician will arrive and save the day (much like most Dems believe 

> about Obama)

>

> And John Perkins NEVER says that the Dictators in Latin America are 

> good guys, he says that 2 of them were basically decent guys partly 

> because they said NO to US interests and US meddling because they 

> wanted to actually help their own people and those 2 guys were both 

> assassinated by the US/CIA.

>

> Mr Griffin goes on to endlessly rip on the solutions offered in the 

> movie. First i want to point out that the movie spends almost an hour 

> on the solution aspect which immediately seperates it from most 

> documentaries - the movie is not just bitching and exposing like most 

> - but offering an in-depth alternative.

>

> And the alternative suggested? To abandon a monetary based society. 

> WOW! ok, does anyone want to argue that a monetary based society has 

> done well for the people, plants, animals of the world? Does anyone 

> here not think that the current financial system is being used to give 

> everything to the few and enslave the rest?

>

> So why are the undies in a bunch over the idea of getting rid of that 

> system?

>

> I personally have no clue how a world goes about getting a system like 

> this in place - that is an obvious hurdle - but frankly it is the most 

> plausible, viable solution to the worlds problems I have ever read 

> about and I get that the solution is radical and all, but I think we 

> could all agree that our current situation calls for radical 

> out-of-the-box thinking.

>

> Take a look for yourself at the ideas offered up by "The Venus 

> Project" and I think you will see this is not as scary and ideological 

> as Griffin tries to make it out to be:

>

> http://www.thevenusproject.com/resource_eco.htm

>

> And I'm not really sure this needs to turn into a religious debate 

> also.... BUT the fact that Griffin gets all huffy & puffy that 

> Religion plays a part in this is terribly strange.

>

> Someone here please count up the # of people who have been murdered 

> and tortured in the name of Christianity/Catholosism and then look me 

> straight in the eye and tell me what a great religion it is. Tell me 

> that the powers that be, who brought you 9-11, would think twice about 

> spewing religious nonsense in order to control the people. My gosh! 

> the bible has a sure-fire built-in control mechanism they call: HELL. 

> That's right kids, believe all this or YOU ARE GOING TO HELL!! Really? 

> Is that how Jesus works? obay his way or you are tortured for 

> eternity? Is that compassion? So an autistic child will spend his life 

> in hell? So a kid who is born and raised in a muslim household is 

> going to HELL? PAH-LEASE! And have you ever notice how the book is 

> dominated with the belief that we are powerless - god is powerful and 

> so we ask god to help us and we give up our power instead of realizing 

> that perhaps, just maybe, we are all a part of god and therefore the 

> power lies within us to change ourselves and change the world. So 

> please take back your own power first if you want to help take back 

> this world.

>

> love

>

> Andrew

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