Proposed table specification (long!)

[Simon Bull]

Thanks for your support Duke,

It's good to get some positive feedback mixed in with the constructive
criticism.

I will take it all on board, as you recommend.

Simon

On Thu, May 12, 2011 at 12:02 AM, Duke Normandin <dukeofperl at ml1.net> wrote:


> On Wed, 11 May 2011, Simon Bull wrote:

>

> > Thanks for your comments Michel.

> >

> > In reply to the points you raise:

> >

> >

> > Regarding complexity:

> > It is not clear to me whether folks are objecting to _parsing_ complexity

> or

> > *reading/writing* complexity.  Subjectively I don't think the example is

> > difficult to read; it couldn't be much simpler.  So I will assume that

> > people are concerned about parsing complexity.  On this I cannot comment

> > except to say that I believe reading/writing considerations should drive

> the

> > specification which should drive the implementation.  Implementation

> > considerations should not drive the formulation of the specification

> except

> > where some absolute technical limitation dictates otherwise.

> >

> >

> > Regarding spacing:

> > Firstly may I say that I do believe good spacing is good practice for

> > tables.

> > >From my original post...

> > >It is the _visual alignment_ of terms into rows and columns that enables

> a

> > reader to recognise a table.

> > >Without any recognisable alignment, a reader sees a jumbled "cloud" of

> > terms

> > "good" doesn't have to mean "perfect", however.

> >

> > Secondly, as an author I take pride in producing beautiful documents.  If

> a

> > document looks a mess then the author looks careless, lazy and less

> > credible.  Additionally, from JG's introduction at Daring Fireball:

> > >The overriding design goal for Markdown’s formatting syntax is to make

> it

> > as readable as possible.

> > >The idea is that a Markdown-formatted document should be publishable

> as-is,

> > as plain text,

> >

> > A markdown document should be *publishable* _as-is_.  Wobbly mis-aligned

> > tables do not make publishable documents in any profession as far as I

> know.

> >

> >

> > Regarding ease of editing :

> > The difficult with inserting text into a column is a general problem with

> > text editing tools and table formats in general.  It is not a specific

> > problem with the proposed table syntax.  Moreover, various text editors

> do

> > support a "block" or "column" select feature which enables the author to

> > select, copy, cut and paste columns (or blocks) of text.  This editor

> > feature facilitates exactly the kind of operation you mentioned.

> >

> > That aside, the proposed table syntax supports a more trivial (lazy)

> method

> > of inserting text into the middle of a column in a few seconds, like

> this:

> >

> > Before:

> >

> >       People     Homeland     Tongue

> >     ====================================

> >       Elves      Rivendell,   Quenya,

> >                  Mirkwood,    Sindarin,

> >                  Lorien       Nandorin

> >

> >       Dwarves    Erebor       Khuzdul

> >

> >       Hobbits    The Shire,   Westron

> >                  Breeland

> >

> >

> > After:

> >

> >       People     Homeland     Tongue

> >     ====================================

> >       Elves      Rivendell,   Quenya,

> >                               Telerin,   <--- inserted text

> >                  Mirkwood,    Sindarin,

> >                  Lorien       Nandorin

> >

> >       Dwarves    Erebor       Khuzdul

> >

> >       Hobbits    The Shire,   Westron

> >                  Breeland

> >

> >

> >

> > Regarding cell alignment :

> > In my original post I wrote this

> > > The author has already provided the desired text alignment in the

> original

> >

> > >(mono spaced) markdown text.

> > >

> > >It is therefore plausible for a parser to derive cell alignment by

> > comparing

> > > the amount of leading and trailing white space in each table cell of

> each

> > row

> > > and each column.

> >

> > I am the first to concede that this would require near-perfect spacing in

> > the document, and would be very hard to implement.  It is therefore

> unlikely

> > that anyone would bother to implement it.

> >

> > However, there's no reason not to include MMD-style cell alignment

> > meta-characters in the specification as a more practical short-cut if

> that

> > is what people want.

> >

> >

> > Thanks again for your comments Michel -- I hope I was able to communicate

> my

> > answers effectively and politely.

>

>

> I want to go on record as a strong supporter of your efforts. Your

> willingness to consult your peers with this brain-storming effort does

> you credit! However, IMHO, at the end of the day, you must follow your

> intuition and good sense after taking all informed and uninformed

> opinions into consideration. I like your proposal! It will be

> interesting to use your proposal in due course.

>

> --

> Duke Normandin

> Turner Valley, Alberta, Canada

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>

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