[meteorite-list] Carnacas smoke-trail photos

[Jeff Grossman]

There is no such naming convention.

Jeff

At 01:03 AM 10/3/2007, Sterling K. Webb wrote:

>The name of the village closest to the

>crater site is CARANCAS, not Carnacas.

>Under the naming convention, the nearest

>named human settlement would end up

>as the name of the meteorite when all the

>dust settles, no?

>

>Let's all practice: CA - RAN - CAS.

>

>

>Sterling K. Webb

>-------------------------------------------------

>----- Original Message -----

>From: "Michael L Blood" <mlblood at cox.net>

>To: "Michael Farmer" <meteoriteguy at yahoo.com>; "Chris Peterson"

><clp at alumni.caltech.edu>; "Meteorite List"

><meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>

>Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 11:33 PM

>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Carnacas smoke-trail photos

>

>

>Perhaps I am dumber than a bag of hammers, but

>I am confused.... Are Carnacas and Titicaca two separate falls

>Or one in the same? Is anyone else confused on this issue?

>         Michael

>

>on 10/2/07 5:59 PM, Michael Farmer at meteoriteguy at yahoo.com wrote:

>

> > Chris, it is a hell of a crater, at least 13 meters in

> > diameter, more than one meter of uplift, looks

> > identical to Meteor Crater to me, on a much smaller

> > scale.

> > There in fact does seem to be shocked material at the

> > crater, I found only inside and just outside the

> > crater, large pieces of compacted sandstone, yet there

> > is no sandstone there, it seems to have solidified on

> > the impact, everything else is more like soft mud.

> > Large, and I mean larger pieces of sod, weighing at

> > least 40 or 50 kilograms were thrown more than 50-100

> > meters, and smaller dirt clod debris thrown up to 15o

> > meters in all directions. This is a serious impact, I

> > mean you can call it what you want, but with the

> > uplift, the incredible debris field thrown to all

> > sides, the huge size, and volume of the crater itself,

> > certainly leads me to believe that the mass weighed

> > many tons and is obviously in the hole under some

> > meters of fallback debris. The locals report mushroom

> > cloud lingered for more than a hour.

> > As far as more pieces, this meterite came in over lake

> > Titikaka, and if you have never seen this lake, it is

> > HUGE! I would guess that as fragil as the meteorite

> > is, that tons of debris fell off but would most likely

> > have all fallen into the lake, or perhaps some on the

> > mountains just inside of Bolivia. It is not populated

> > there, and I assume from talking to most witnesses,

> > that the large main mass, which was a massive ball of

> > fire much larger and brighter than the Sun, caught

> > everyones attention pretty well, and would be so

> > bright that smaller pieces would be drowned out by the

> > intensity of the main mass. That is what I think

> > happened, surely many more pieces broke off but from

> > where the main mass hit, back down the flightpath is

> > nothing but swamps and high mountains for about 10

> > miles, then 15 miles of lake. Perfect for most

> > material to be lost.

> > Michael Farmer

> > --- Chris Peterson <clp at alumni.caltech.edu> wrote:

> >

> >> What remains to be determined is if this is actually

> >> a crater, or just a

> >> big splash. In the first case, some shocked material

> >> should show up, and

> >> I think it's likely that nothing is left in the

> >> bottom. If there really

> >> is a big meteorite at the bottom, then this probably

> >> isn't a crater in

> >> the usual sense (that is, produced by a large energy

> >> release as the

> >> parent body explodes/vaporizes).

> >>

> >> I don't believe I've seen anything credible to

> >> suggest that the water

> >> was actually boiling or steaming. It doesn't take

> >> much energy to make a

> >> hole this size in soft ground- probably around 100

> >> kg TNT equivalent.

> >> And that's not enough to heat up that much water

> >> very much. So I expect

> >> that any apparent bubbling was nothing more than an

> >> effect of ground

> >> water filling in the new hole.

> >>

> >> If the recovered material is shocked fragments, it

> >> may be structurally

> >> quite different from the parent body.

> >>

> >> Chris

> >>

> >> *****************************************

> >> Chris L Peterson

> >> Cloudbait Observatory

> >> http://www.cloudbait.com

> >>

> >>

> >> ----- Original Message -----

> >> From: "Darren Garrison" <cynapse at charter.net>

> >> To: <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>

> >> Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 5:37 PM

> >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Carnacas smoke-trail

> >> photos

> >>

> >>

> >>> On Tue, 2 Oct 2007 15:54:57 -0700 (PDT), you

> >> wrote:

> >>>

> >>>> Is it indeed possible that a mass of say 3-7 tons

> >>>> could cause such intense heat on impact? We think

> >> that

> >>>> the compression of the soil, in an instant to many

> >>>> meteors deep could also cause intense heating.

> >>>> Every person we interviewed decribed boiling

> >> water,

> >>>> lots of steam, and horrible sulfer type smell. The

> >>>

> >>> What I wonder is if maybe the pressure/heat could

> >> have caused

> >>> dissolved gases to

> >>> bubble out from the water?  So it might not have

> >> been at a boiling

> >>> temperature,

> >>> but still bubbling/steaming?  Too bad we don't

> >> have samples of the

> >>> groundwater

> >>> and soil from the area to see if there is anything

> >> weird/extensively

> >>> poluted

> >>> about it.

> >>>

> >>> Also odd, of course, is a fraglie, porus stone as

> >> you describe

> >>> surviving to the

> >>> ground big enough and fast enough to make the

> >> crater.

> >>

> >> ______________________________________________

> >> Meteorite-list mailing list

> >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com

> >>

> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list

> >>

> >

> > ______________________________________________

> > Meteorite-list mailing list

> > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com

> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list

>

>--

>"God doesn't look at how much we do, but with how

>much love we do it."

>     Mother Teresa

>--

>When Jesus said, "Love your enemies" I think he

>probably meant don't kill them.

>

>

>

>______________________________________________

>Meteorite-list mailing list

>Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com

>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list

>

>______________________________________________

>Meteorite-list mailing list

>Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com

>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list


Dr. Jeffrey N. Grossman       phone: (703) 648-6184
US Geological Survey          fax:   (703) 648-6383
954 National Center
Reston, VA 20192, USA