From michael at spacerocksinc.com Mon Dec 1 00:09:41 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2008 21:09:41 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 1, 2008 Message-ID: <23882353.1539721228108181203.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_1_2008.html From bristolia at yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 09:19:54 2008 From: bristolia at yahoo.com (Paul) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 06:19:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] UPHEAVAL DOME: CONFIRMATION OF IMPACT ORIGIN Message-ID: <818938.39898.qm@web36208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Stefan Brandes wrote: " a newly discovered Crater in Utah: http://lpod.wikispaces.com/November+29%2C+2008 " Look at: http://www.mail-archive.com/meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com/msg64615.html The paper discussing the shocked quartz is: Buchner, E., and T. Kenkmann, 2008, Upheaval Dome, Utah, USA: Impact origin confirmed. Geology. vol.36, no. 3, pp. 227-230. In part, this abstract stated: "In this study, we document, for the first time, shocked quartz grains from this crater in sandstones of the Jurassic Kayenta Formation. The investigated grains contain multiple sets of decorated planar deformation features. ... The shocked quartz grains were found in the periphery of the central uplift in the northeastern sector of the crater, which most likely represents the cross range crater sector." http://www.gsajournals.org/perlserv/?request=get-abstract&doi=10.1130%2FG24287A.1 and http://geology.geoscienceworld.org/cgi/content/full/36/3/227?ck=nck and there is : I. Upheaval Dome, Utah - Bibliography By Alpha and By Reverse Date by K. Fisher, November 25, 2008 at: http://members.csolutions.net/fisherka/astronote/observed/Upheaval/Bibliography.html III. Buchner, E., and T. Kenkmann, 2008, Upheaval Dome, Utah, USA: Impact Origin Confirmed. Large Meteorite Impacts and Planetary Evolution IV, held August 17-21, 2008 at Vredefort Dome, South Africa. LPI Contribution No. 1423, paper id. 3005. http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2008LPICo1423.3005B Some interesting related papers are: W. Alvarez, E. Staley, D. O'Connor, and M. A. Chan, 1999, Synsedimentary deformation in the Jurassic of southeastern Utah; a case of impact shaking? Geology. v. 26; no. 7, pp. 579-582. Abstract at: http://geology.geoscienceworld.org/cgi/content/abstract/26/7/579 http://www.gsajournals.org/perlserv/?request=get-abstract&doi=10.1130%2F0091-7613(1998)026%3C0579%3ASDITJO%3E2.3.CO%3B2 PDF file at: http://eps.berkeley.edu/~platetec/125.pdf Dan Bridges, L. W., W. Alvarez, E. Staley, D. O'Connor, and M. A. Chan, 1999, Synsedimentary deformation in the Jurassic of southeastern Utah; a case of impact shaking?; discussion and reply. Geology. v. 27, no. 7, pp. 661-662 http://www.gsajournals.org/perlserv/?request=get-abstract&doi=10.1130%2F0091-7613(1999)027%3C0661%3ASDITJO%3E2.3.CO%3B2 Yours, Paul H. From bristolia at yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 09:22:55 2008 From: bristolia at yahoo.com (Paul) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 06:22:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Free PDF File About Possible Impact Generated Seismites Message-ID: <63656.49600.qm@web36207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear Friends, PDF files of a study of possible impact related seismite can be found online. It is: Simms, M. J., 2003, Uniquely extensive seismite from the latest Triassic of the United Kingdom: Evidence for bolide impact? Geology. v. 31, no. 6, p. 557-560. http://geology.geoscienceworld.org/cgi/content/abstract/31/6/557 PDF File at: http://www.habitas.org.uk/staff_pdf_files/Impact.pdf Yous, Paul H. From cynapse at charter.net Mon Dec 1 10:53:26 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2008 10:53:26 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Better shot of the new Canadian main mass In-Reply-To: <2944.97758.qm@web30701.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <2944.97758.qm@web30701.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: http://www.newstalk650.com/story/20081201/9219 And since that shot didn't include the official spokes-model: http://www.physics.uwo.ca/research/spotlight/m-campbell-brown-students-may2008.html From dmerchan at rochester.rr.com Mon Dec 1 11:29:49 2008 From: dmerchan at rochester.rr.com (Don Merchant) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 11:29:49 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? References: <000301c9535d$56756d50$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant> <00e701c9535e$e2e9e3a0$4564fea9@TITAN> Message-ID: <000301c953d2$07d75580$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant> Thanks List for your input on this. At least now I know it's not my imagination. One thing I did want to note and of which has just started happening, is that when I go to the EBay Site (not even logging on yet) my CA virus/spyware/website inspector security pops up with a red stop sign warning that this is a dangerous site!!!! This has NEVER happened. One of 2 things are going on....1. EBay's server is tracking your comp via cookies/cache or 2. hackers are tapping into the EBay Servers and thus following your comps where abouts via EBay. Please be careful, complain to EBay that it takes forever to load a page and change your password frequently. I know my meteorite search on EBay has been very very sour for the last 2 months because of this, so I hope something can be done soon. Be careful. Sincerely Don Merchant IMCA #0960 ----- Original Message ----- From: "John.L.Cabassi" To: Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? > G'Day Don > You're not alone in this. Several months ago, I had problems, I even > vented to Mike Farmer in regards to issues and also to eBay, never got a > response back from ebay. Possibly because of the way I vented to them. At > the time, the problems I was having was that exactly at 17 seconds on a > bid, I would be bumped off the site and have to sign in again, but the > auction was over. I had a tech check it out and it was definitely a > problem with ebay. But I've also noticed over the last month pages are > also taking a long time to load up and worse yet, if you're bidding on > something, usually the first refresh takes 3 seconds. But as you keep > refreshing, the pages are taking up to 30 seconds. So as for bidding on > ebay, I've given up. It's a lost cause. > > Cheers > Johnno > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Don Merchant" > To: > Cc: "Don Merchant" > Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 6:34 PM > Subject: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? > > >> Hi List. Has anybody noticed that when you are on EBay searching for >> anything including meteorites that the pages load up slower and slower >> the longer you are on EBay! I am so frustrated that I want to head butt a >> 15kg Iron Meteorite!! At first I thought it was my computer but I have 7 >> Comps.....3 PC's and 4 laptops and the same thing occurs! I then of >> course cleaned out my cache and temp files and STILL after a few minutes >> on EBay checking out the meteorite pages the pages slowly get longer and >> longer to load up and I MEAN LONG. Sometimes up to a minute or 2!! I have >> had a few friends say they too have noticed this with EBay on their >> comps. This has been going on now for several months! I have just >> complained to EBay that I feel they have server issues. Nevermind to tell >> me it's Xmas time and people are overloading EBay since I have noticed >> this long before Xmas time. My server is high speed internet so it is not >> my server. Now when I get off the EBay Site to any other Site runs fast >> as lightning. This is seriously ruining my search of items particularly >> meteorites on EBay. I want to vent out so bad but thought I would ask you >> my friends if anyone else notices this. >> Thank you and Happy Belated Thanksgiving. >> Sincerely >> Don Merchant >> IMCA #0960 >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From sterling_k_webb at sbcglobal.net Mon Dec 1 12:10:07 2008 From: sterling_k_webb at sbcglobal.net (Sterling K. Webb) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 11:10:07 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? References: <000301c9535d$56756d50$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant><00e701c9535e$e2e9e3a0$4564fea9@TITAN> <000301c953d2$07d75580$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant> Message-ID: <046a01c953d7$a9e6a970$1143e146@ATARIENGINE> Don wrote: > One of 2 things are going on.... Can I add #3 to that List? That the malicious activity of which you complain originates not from eBay and its servers but from a malicious agent that has installed itself in ("infected") your computer and/or server. This is a far more likely explanation, sad to say. Sterling K. Webb ------------------------------------------------------------ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Merchant" To: "John.L.Cabassi" ; Cc: "Don Merchant" Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 10:29 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? Thanks List for your input on this. At least now I know it's not my imagination. One thing I did want to note and of which has just started happening, is that when I go to the EBay Site (not even logging on yet) my CA virus/spyware/website inspector security pops up with a red stop sign warning that this is a dangerous site!!!! This has NEVER happened. One of 2 things are going on....1. EBay's server is tracking your comp via cookies/cache or 2. hackers are tapping into the EBay Servers and thus following your comps where abouts via EBay. Please be careful, complain to EBay that it takes forever to load a page and change your password frequently. I know my meteorite search on EBay has been very very sour for the last 2 months because of this, so I hope something can be done soon. Be careful. Sincerely Don Merchant IMCA #0960 ----- Original Message ----- From: "John.L.Cabassi" To: Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? > G'Day Don > You're not alone in this. Several months ago, I had problems, I even > vented to Mike Farmer in regards to issues and also to eBay, never got a > response back from ebay. Possibly because of the way I vented to them. At > the time, the problems I was having was that exactly at 17 seconds on a > bid, I would be bumped off the site and have to sign in again, but the > auction was over. I had a tech check it out and it was definitely a > problem with ebay. But I've also noticed over the last month pages are > also taking a long time to load up and worse yet, if you're bidding on > something, usually the first refresh takes 3 seconds. But as you keep > refreshing, the pages are taking up to 30 seconds. So as for bidding on > ebay, I've given up. It's a lost cause. > > Cheers > Johnno > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Don Merchant" > To: > Cc: "Don Merchant" > Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 6:34 PM > Subject: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? > > >> Hi List. Has anybody noticed that when you are on EBay searching for >> anything including meteorites that the pages load up slower and slower >> the longer you are on EBay! I am so frustrated that I want to head butt a >> 15kg Iron Meteorite!! At first I thought it was my computer but I have 7 >> Comps.....3 PC's and 4 laptops and the same thing occurs! I then of >> course cleaned out my cache and temp files and STILL after a few minutes >> on EBay checking out the meteorite pages the pages slowly get longer and >> longer to load up and I MEAN LONG. Sometimes up to a minute or 2!! I have >> had a few friends say they too have noticed this with EBay on their >> comps. This has been going on now for several months! I have just >> complained to EBay that I feel they have server issues. Nevermind to tell >> me it's Xmas time and people are overloading EBay since I have noticed >> this long before Xmas time. My server is high speed internet so it is not >> my server. Now when I get off the EBay Site to any other Site runs fast >> as lightning. This is seriously ruining my search of items particularly >> meteorites on EBay. I want to vent out so bad but thought I would ask you >> my friends if anyone else notices this. >> Thank you and Happy Belated Thanksgiving. >> Sincerely >> Don Merchant >> IMCA #0960 >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From dmerchan at rochester.rr.com Mon Dec 1 13:11:39 2008 From: dmerchan at rochester.rr.com (Don Merchant) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 13:11:39 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? References: <000301c9535d$56756d50$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant><00e701c9535e$e2e9e3a0$4564fea9@TITAN> <000301c953d2$07d75580$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant> <046a01c953d7$a9e6a970$1143e146@ATARIENGINE> Message-ID: <000601c953e0$420eb690$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant> Hi Sterling and List. Very good point! This may be true with other members on the List and their comps. As far as my comp I have used a very decent anti-virus program/spam/Trojan ect protector. I have also (with my main security protection temporarily disabled) used 2 other program that seek, destroy, and quarantine any malicious type cookie followers, cache trackers and virus/Trojan files. My computer has come up totally clean. I hope others will take your thoughts on this seriously and check their comps as well. Thank you Sincerely Don Merchant IMCA #0960 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sterling K. Webb" To: "Don Merchant" ; "John.L.Cabassi" ; Cc: "Don Merchant" Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 12:10 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? > Don wrote: >> One of 2 things are going on.... > > Can I add #3 to that List? That the malicious > activity of which you complain originates not > from eBay and its servers but from a malicious > agent that has installed itself in ("infected") your > computer and/or server. This is a far more likely > explanation, sad to say. > > > Sterling K. Webb > ------------------------------------------------------------ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Don Merchant" > To: "John.L.Cabassi" ; > > Cc: "Don Merchant" > Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 10:29 AM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? > > > Thanks List for your input on this. At least now I know it's not my > imagination. One thing I did want to note and of which has just started > happening, is that when I go to the EBay Site (not even logging on yet) my > CA virus/spyware/website inspector security pops up with a red stop sign > warning that this is a dangerous site!!!! This has NEVER happened. One of > 2 > things are going on....1. EBay's server is tracking your comp via > cookies/cache or 2. hackers are tapping into the EBay Servers and thus > following your comps where abouts via EBay. Please be careful, complain to > EBay that it takes forever to load a page and change your password > frequently. I know my meteorite search on EBay has been very very sour for > the last 2 months because of this, so I hope something can be done soon. > Be > careful. > Sincerely > Don Merchant > IMCA #0960 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John.L.Cabassi" > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 9:45 PM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? > > >> G'Day Don >> You're not alone in this. Several months ago, I had problems, I even >> vented to Mike Farmer in regards to issues and also to eBay, never got a >> response back from ebay. Possibly because of the way I vented to them. >> At >> the time, the problems I was having was that exactly at 17 seconds on a >> bid, I would be bumped off the site and have to sign in again, but the >> auction was over. I had a tech check it out and it was definitely a >> problem with ebay. But I've also noticed over the last month pages are >> also taking a long time to load up and worse yet, if you're bidding on >> something, usually the first refresh takes 3 seconds. But as you keep >> refreshing, the pages are taking up to 30 seconds. So as for bidding on >> ebay, I've given up. It's a lost cause. >> >> Cheers >> Johnno >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Don Merchant" >> To: >> Cc: "Don Merchant" >> Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 6:34 PM >> Subject: [meteorite-list] EBay Server issues????? >> >> >>> Hi List. Has anybody noticed that when you are on EBay searching for >>> anything including meteorites that the pages load up slower and slower >>> the longer you are on EBay! I am so frustrated that I want to head butt >>> a >>> 15kg Iron Meteorite!! At first I thought it was my computer but I have 7 >>> Comps.....3 PC's and 4 laptops and the same thing occurs! I then of >>> course cleaned out my cache and temp files and STILL after a few minutes >>> on EBay checking out the meteorite pages the pages slowly get longer and >>> longer to load up and I MEAN LONG. Sometimes up to a minute or 2!! I >>> have >>> had a few friends say they too have noticed this with EBay on their >>> comps. This has been going on now for several months! I have just >>> complained to EBay that I feel they have server issues. Nevermind to >>> tell >>> me it's Xmas time and people are overloading EBay since I have noticed >>> this long before Xmas time. My server is high speed internet so it is >>> not >>> my server. Now when I get off the EBay Site to any other Site runs fast >>> as lightning. This is seriously ruining my search of items particularly >>> meteorites on EBay. I want to vent out so bad but thought I would ask >>> you >>> my friends if anyone else notices this. >>> Thank you and Happy Belated Thanksgiving. >>> Sincerely >>> Don Merchant >>> IMCA #0960 >>> ______________________________________________ >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From ensoramanda at ntlworld.com Mon Dec 1 17:17:16 2008 From: ensoramanda at ntlworld.com (ensoramanda) Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2008 22:17:16 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Marsden Canadian fall/first sedimentary meteorite?? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4934626C.5050708@ntlworld.com> Hi All, Looks like the Canadian meteorite might be the first sedimentary ever found eh!!!! :-) http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/My-pet-Rock-found-south-east-of-Lone-Rock-Saskatchewan_W0QQitemZ260324758120QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_2?hash=item260324758120&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1301%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 Graham Ensor UK Rob Matson wrote: >Hi All, > >One aspect of this new Canadian fall amuses me in particular. In >the original report, we had quite a few "facts" about the bolide: > > > >>SASKATOON - A fireball that lit up the skies of Alberta and >>Saskatchewan last Thursday evening was a chunk of low-flying >>asteroid that weighed about 10 tonnes before it struck Earth's >>atmosphere, according to a University of Calgary investigation. >> >> > > > >>University of Calgary researcher Alan Hildebrand has outlined a >>region in western Saskatchewan where he expects to find desk-sized >>fragments of the space rock. >> >> > >Of course, these first two paragraphs are quite inconsistent with >each other -- a bolide that weighed only 10 tonnes *before* it hit >the atmosphere would be the size of a SINGLE desk. That's prior to >atmospheric ablation, which certainly would have reduced the mass >by 70-90%. How do you find "desk-sized fragments" on the ground >following ablation of a single desk-sized original object? > > > >>The fireball pierced the atmosphere at a steep angle of about >>60 degrees off the horizontal and lasted about five seconds. >> >> > >The steep entry angle suggests catastrophic break-up into many >pieces -- most of them small compared to the size of the original >meteoroid. Obviously not desk-sized or even television-sized. Mind >you, it's still an impressive fall. But I don't understand the >need for hyperbole. > >How quickly people forget that we had an asteroid of KNOWN size >(to within a factor of two) and orbit that entered over Sudan at >a lower initial velocity and a much shallower angle, and yet >"officials" poo-pooed that anything significant would reach the >ground. This asteroid was at least 40 tons and quite possibly >over 100 tons, had an orbit that intersected that of Mars >(suggesting a possible SNC), and impacted in a location that >would have been child's play to recover -- if it weren't for >the minor matter of its landing in a third-world, genocidal >disaster area of a country. > >I guess the point I'm trying to make is that the Sudan fall went >off the radar almost immediately, yet was a far more substantial >and scientifically important fall. But it seems not even meteorites >are immune from sectionalism. -Rob > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > >Internal Virus Database is out of date. >Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com >Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.9.10/1810 - Release Date: 24/11/2008 14:36 > > > From endophasy at yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 04:56:28 2008 From: endophasy at yahoo.com (Thaddeus Besedin) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 01:56:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] test Message-ID: <983901.53163.qm@web62505.mail.re1.yahoo.com> empty From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 18:10:24 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 15:10:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Marsden Canadian fall/first sedimentary meteorite?? In-Reply-To: <4934626C.5050708@ntlworld.com> Message-ID: <809835.27437.qm@web45613.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> It was only a matter of time for someone to try to pass off a fake meteorite from this fall. --- On Mon, 12/1/08, ensoramanda wrote: > From: ensoramanda > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Marsden Canadian fall/first sedimentary meteorite?? > To: > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Monday, December 1, 2008, 5:17 PM > Hi All, > > Looks like the Canadian meteorite might be the first > sedimentary ever > found eh!!!! :-) > > http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/My-pet-Rock-found-south-east-of-Lone-Rock-Saskatchewan_W0QQitemZ260324758120QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_2?hash=item260324758120&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1301%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 > > Graham Ensor UK > > Rob Matson wrote: > > >Hi All, > > > >One aspect of this new Canadian fall amuses me in > particular. In > >the original report, we had quite a few > "facts" about the bolide: > > > > > > > >>SASKATOON - A fireball that lit up the skies of > Alberta and > >>Saskatchewan last Thursday evening was a chunk of > low-flying > >>asteroid that weighed about 10 tonnes before it > struck Earth's > >>atmosphere, according to a University of Calgary > investigation. > >> > >> > > > > > > > >>University of Calgary researcher Alan Hildebrand > has outlined a > >>region in western Saskatchewan where he expects to > find desk-sized > >>fragments of the space rock. > >> > >> > > > >Of course, these first two paragraphs are quite > inconsistent with > >each other -- a bolide that weighed only 10 tonnes > *before* it hit > >the atmosphere would be the size of a SINGLE desk. > That's prior to > >atmospheric ablation, which certainly would have > reduced the mass > >by 70-90%. How do you find "desk-sized > fragments" on the ground > >following ablation of a single desk-sized original > object? > > > > > > > >>The fireball pierced the atmosphere at a steep > angle of about > >>60 degrees off the horizontal and lasted about five > seconds. > >> > >> > > > >The steep entry angle suggests catastrophic break-up > into many > >pieces -- most of them small compared to the size of > the original > >meteoroid. Obviously not desk-sized or even > television-sized. Mind > >you, it's still an impressive fall. But I don't > understand the > >need for hyperbole. > > > >How quickly people forget that we had an asteroid of > KNOWN size > >(to within a factor of two) and orbit that entered over > Sudan at > >a lower initial velocity and a much shallower angle, > and yet > >"officials" poo-pooed that anything > significant would reach the > >ground. This asteroid was at least 40 tons and quite > possibly > >over 100 tons, had an orbit that intersected that of > Mars > >(suggesting a possible SNC), and impacted in a location > that > >would have been child's play to recover -- if it > weren't for > >the minor matter of its landing in a third-world, > genocidal > >disaster area of a country. > > > >I guess the point I'm trying to make is that the > Sudan fall went > >off the radar almost immediately, yet was a far more > substantial > >and scientifically important fall. But it seems not > even meteorites > >are immune from sectionalism. -Rob > > > >______________________________________________ > >http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >Meteorite-list mailing list > >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > >Internal Virus Database is out of date. > >Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > >Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.9.10/1810 - > Release Date: 24/11/2008 14:36 > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From gmhupe at htn.net Mon Dec 1 18:35:28 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 18:35:28 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD Message-ID: <0039639DFF0445B3B9BFFD57B4572462@Gregor> Dear List Members, It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA 4223, the third member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to get to this point of first public offering so you know the science has been done! It has a TKW of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed through eBay's site, so you can find all of the available material and "Official" classification of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed these, most at reduced prices for the holidays: NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) NWA 1879 Mesosiderite NWA 2932 Mesosiderite NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot Unclassified 2kg Lot Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) Thank you for checking out what I have to offer, I appreciate it! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault From STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com Mon Dec 1 19:23:31 2008 From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com (STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 19:23:31 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD Message-ID: Hi list members, For those who are interested in thin sections. Greg has been kind enough to (previously) lend me the NWA 3151 Brachinite that he has for sale. My micrograph article in Meteorite Times December is on this thin section. I felt obliged to say it is a wonderful sample prepared splendidly! I worked with it up to a magnification of 760X with great results. If you are thinking of adding a thin to your collection, I would recommend this one and check out the article. Bernd Pauli has provided me with three excellent wide field cross polarized light micrographs that are also included. Tom Phillips In a message dated 12/1/2008 4:36:02 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, gmhupe at htn.net writes: Dear List Members, It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA 4223, the third member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to get to this point of first public offering so you know the science has been done! It has a TKW of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed through eBay's site, so you can find all of the available material and "Official" classification of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed these, most at reduced prices for the holidays: NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) NWA 1879 Mesosiderite NWA 2932 Mesosiderite NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot Unclassified 2kg Lot Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) Thank you for checking out what I have to offer, I appreciate it! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list **************Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try the NEW AOL.com. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Mon Dec 1 19:33:09 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 16:33:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Mars Exploration Rovers Update - November 13-20, 2008 Message-ID: <200812020033.QAA05234@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/mission/status.html#spirit SPIRIT UPDATE: Serious but Stable - sol 1730-1736, November 14 - November 20, 2008: Spirit's condition has improved during the past week, though skies remain fairly dusty after the recent Martian dust storm. Since sol 1730 (Nov. 14, 2008), solar-array energy has averaged 169 watt-hours (100 watt-hours is the amount of energy needed to light a 100-watt bulb for 1 hour). The latest measurement of atmospheric darkness caused by dust, known as Tau, is 0.858. The dust factor, representing the portion of sunlight penetrating the coating of dust on the solar panels, is 0.2912. Spirit performed a cursory check of the health of the miniature thermal emission spectrometer. After three nights with the spectrometer's heaters disabled, the instrument appeared to be undamaged as of sol 1730. Power is not yet sufficient to re-enable those heaters, though Spirit will continue to monitor the spectrometer while waiting for power to improve. For the most part, Spirit is limiting activities to those necessary for maintaining engineering health and safety. Spirit endured another challenge when new commands from Earth for sol 1734 (Nov. 18, 2008) did not arrive. At that point, Spirit began to execute a backup set of activities known as a runout plan. On Earth, engineers created a new sequence of commands for sol 1736 (Nov. 20, 2008) to manage communications and preserve power. Meanwhile, they are investigating why Spirit did not receive their previous commands. According to the latest Martian weather report for Nov. 15 (sol 1731), skies are expected to continue to clear during the next couple of weeks. No other storms have been identified within a couple of thousand kilometers of Spirit's location. Spirit is preparing for solar conjunction, where the Sun is between Earth and Mars, preventing communications. This period begins Nov. 29th. Before and during solar conjunction, Spirit's activities will remain conservative as the rover waits for the skies to clear and for the power situation to improve. Sol-by-sol summary In addition to measuring dust-related changes in atmospheric opacity with the panoramic camera, Spirit completed the following activities: Sol 1730 (Nov. 14, 2008): Spirit observed the sky briefly with the miniature thermal emission spectrometer. Sol 1731: Spirit rested and soaked up the Sun's rays to recharge the batteries. Sol 1732: Spirit rested and soaked up the Sun's rays to recharge the batteries. Sol 1733: Spirit rested and soaked up the Sun's rays to recharge the batteries. Sol 1734: Spirit completed basic activities in the runout plan. Sol 1735: Spirit completed basic activities in the runout plan. Sol 1736 (Nov. 20, 2008): Spirit completed basic activities in the runout plan. Odometry: As of sol 1736 (Nov. 20, 2008), Spirits total odometry was 7,529.02 meters (4.68 miles). ------------------------------------------------------------------------ OPPORTUNITY UPDATE: Opportunity Prepares for Two Weeks of Independent Study - sol 1709-1715, November 13-19, 2008: Opportunity is getting ready for solar conjunction, the time when the Sun is in the line of sight between Earth and Mars. During this two-week period, from Nov. 30, 2008 to Dec. 13, 2008, the mission team will not send new commands to the rover. The science team plans to position Opportunity on a rock outcrop, possibly near a cobble the rover can study with the Moessbauer spectrometer, during this time interval. Opportunity began the week with a 93-meter (310-foot) drive on Sol 1709 (Nov. 13, 2008). The drive allowed the rover to reach a large expanse of bare outcrop. Another drive on Sol 1710 (Nov. 14, 2008), covering 17 meters (56 feet), placed the rover near potential targets of scientific interest. A candidate target, a cobble about 8 meters (30 feet) away, became the objective of the drive on Sol 1713 (Nov. 17, 2008). The 8-meter drive positioned the cobble, now nicknamed "Santorini", within the work volume of the science instruments on Opportunity's robotic arm. The challenge for the team was the placement of the science instruments on Santorini using only 4 degrees of freedom of the robotic arm instead of the usual 6. The rover is not able to change the azimuth of the shoulder joint, that is, move it from side to side, because the shoulder azimuth joint (Joint 1) is disabled due to degraded performance. On Sol 1714 (Nov. 18, 2008), Opportunity successfully placed the Moessbauer spectrometer on a faceted surface of the cobble. The contact switches on the instrument confirmed that the spectrometer had touched the surface. An analysis by the spectrometer is now under way. Rover operators plan to have Opportunity integrate Moessbauer measurements of Santorini for the two-week period of solar conjunction. Opportunity is acquiring a panorama of images using multiple filters of the panoramic camera and making daily observations of atmospheric dust as well as measuring atmospheric argon using the alpha-particle X-ray spectrometer APXS. The rover is creating occasional, time-lapse movies of clouds with the navigation camera. This coming weekend, engineers plan another attempt to remove dust from the miniature thermal emission spectrometer mirror by shaking it. As of Sol 1715 (Nov. 29, 2008), the solar array energy was 565 watt-hours (100 watt-hours is the amount of energy needed to light a 100-watt bulb for one hour). The atmospheric opacity (tau) was 0.747 and the dust factor (a measure of sunlight-blocking dust on the solar arrays) was 0.694. Sol-by-sol summary In addition to measuring dust-related changes in atmospheric clarity with the panoramic camera and relaying data from Mars to NASA's Odyssey orbiter for transmission to Earth, Opportunity completed the following activities: Sol 1709 (Nov. 13, 2008): Opportunity drove 93 meters (300 feet) toward outcrop, made atmospheric observations with the panoramic camera, acquired targeted images with the panoramic and navigation cameras, and measured argon gas in the atmosphere with the alpha-particle X-ray spectrometer. Sol 1710: Opportunity drove 17 meters (56 feet) on outcrop, made atmospheric observations with the panoramic camera, acquired targeted images with the panoramic and navigation cameras, and measured argon gas in the atmosphere with the alpha-particle X-ray spectrometer. Sol 1711: Opportunity completed atmospheric observations with the panoramic camera, acquired targeted images with the panoramic camera, and measured atmospheric argon with the alpha-particle X-ray spectrometer. Sol 1712: Opportunity completed atmospheric observations with the panoramic camera, measured atmospheric argon with the alpha-particle X-ray spectrometer, and acquired navigation-camera images for a time-lapse movie in search of clouds. Sol 1713: Opportunity drove 8 meters (30 feet) toward Santorini, made atmospheric observations with the panoramic camera, and acquired navigation-camera images for a time-lapse movie in search of clouds. Sol 1714: Opportunity placed the Moessbauer spectrometer on Santorini, integrated measurements of the cobble with the spectrometer, and acquired targeted images and studied the atmosphere with the panoramic camera. Sol 1715 (Nov. 19, 2008): Opportunity continued the integration of data from Santorini with the alpha-particle X-ray spectrometer, acquired panoramic-camera images of multiple targets, and used the camera to make atmospheric observations. Odometry As of sol 1715 (Nov. 19, 2008), Opportunity's total odometry was 13,616.47 meters (8.46 miles). From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Mon Dec 1 19:35:53 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 16:35:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Dawn Journal - November 26, 2008 Message-ID: <200812020035.QAA06094@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://dawn.jpl.nasa.gov/mission/journal_11_26_08.asp Dawn Journal Dr. Marc Rayman November 26, 2008 Dear Indawnviduals, The Dawn spacecraft is healthy and on course for its flyby of Mars early next year. The planet's gravity will help boost the probe on its way to rendezvous with Vesta. While the spacecraft has its sights set on the asteroid belt (via Mars), its path is now bringing it closer to Earth. Meanwhile, from Earth's perspective, Dawn appears to be approaching a blindingly close encounter with the Sun. With so much happening in the solar system, all readers, whether local or not, are invited to turn their attention here. In the last log, we saw that Dawn was nearing the end of an extended period of thrusting with is ion propulsion system that began on December 17, 2007. When it left Earth on September 27, 2007, the Delta II rocket deposited the spacecraft into a carefully chosen orbit around the Sun. By October 31, 2008, the spacecraft had completed the thrusting it needed to change that orbit so it would encounter Mars at just the right time, location, and angle to sling it on its way to Vesta. During this interplanetary cruise phase, Dawn thrust for 270 days, or 85% of the time. Expending less than 72 kilograms (158 pounds) of xenon propellant, the spacecraft changed its speed by about 1.81 kilometers per second (4050 miles per hour). Although controlling an interplanetary probe across hundreds of millions of kilometers (or miles) of deep space and guiding it accurately enough to reach its remote destination seems as if it should be a very simple task, readers may be surprised to know that it is not. Let's consider just one aspect of the problem. Suppose you want to shoot an arrow at a target. Unlike typical archers, you are so far from the target that you can only barely see it. In that case, aiming for the bull's-eye is essentially out of the question. Adding to the problem may be a variable breeze that could nudge the arrow off course. Shooting sufficiently accurately to get the arrow even to the vicinity of the target would be challenging enough; hitting the precise point you want on the target is just too difficult. For readers who are principally interested in archery, this concludes our in-depth analysis of the sport. Now let's consider how to change the situation to make it more similar to an interplanetary mission. If the arrow had a tiny radio locator mounted on it, you would be able monitor its progress as it flew closer to the target. This would be like watching it on a radar screen. You might see your arrow miss the target entirely or, if you had made a particularly good shot, hit somewhere on it. Now if you could occasionally send a signal to the arrow, perhaps to change the angles of the feathers, you might not be able to alter its course drastically, but you could change it a little. So if your initial shot had been good enough, you could guide the arrow to the desired destination. (To buy your radio controlled archery set, visit the Dawn gift shop on your planet. The set may be found between the display case with xenon ion beam jewelry and the shelves and shelves and shelves and shelves of really cool new Dawn Journal reader action figures -- be sure to buy the one that looks just like you!) Shooting the arrow is akin to launching a spacecraft, and its flight to the target represents the interplanetary journey, although operating a spacecraft involves far greater precision (and fun!). Our knowledge of where the spacecraft is and where it is heading is amazingly, fantastically, incredibly accurate, but it is not perfect. This point is essential. Keeping most spacecraft on course is a matter of frequently recalculating the position, speed, and direction of travel and then occasionally fine-tuning the trajectory through burns of the propulsion system. Dawn's near-constant use of its advanced ion propulsion system for most of 2008 changes the story, but only a little. The thrust plan was calculated before launch and then updated once our arrow was free of the bow. Throughout the interplanetary cruise phase, a new thrust plan was transmitted to the spacecraft about every 5 weeks, each time with slight updates to account for the latest calculations of Dawn's orbit around the Sun. With this method, the small adjustments to the trajectory have been incorporated into the large, preplanned changes. The mission control team requires about 5 weeks to design, develop, check, double-check, transmit, and activate a 5-week set of commands. By the time the spacecraft is executing the final part of those instructions, it is following a flight plan that is based on information from 10 weeks earlier. During most of the mission, when there are months or even years of thrusting ahead of it, subsequent opportunities to adjust the trajectory are plentiful. In contrast, for the last period of preplanned thrusting before Mars, controllers modified their normal process for formulating the commands, making a fast update for the final few days of thrusting. By including the latest navigational data in the computations for the direction and duration of the concluding segment of powered flight, the mission control team put Dawn on a more accurate course for Mars than it otherwise would have been. Even with this strategy, navigators recognized long ago that subsequent adjustments would be required. The plan for approaching Mars has always included windows for trajectory correction maneuvers (which engineers are physiologically incapable of calling anything other than TCMs). Dawn's first TCM occurred on November 20. As navigators refined their trajectory calculations after thrusting finished on October 31, they determined that the spacecraft was quite close to the aim point they wanted, but still not exactly on target. In fact, rather than being on a course to sail a few hundred kilometers above Mars, the probe's path would have taken it to the surface of the planet. Despite the power of the ion propulsion system, Dawn does not have the capability to bore through the rocky planet and continue on its way to Vesta. Such a situation is not surprising. Suppose in the archery, the bull's-eye were 30 centimeters (1 foot) in diameter, but we preferred to hit a point 2.2 centimeters (7/8 inch) outside the bull's-eye, near the 11:00 position (corresponding to where we want Dawn to fly past Mars). As our arrow approached the target, it might turn out that it was going to miss the target entirely, it might be headed for some other point on the target, and it just might be that it was headed for the bull's-eye itself. Dawn's case was this last one, so TCM1 put it on track for the destination we desired. Amazing sports analogies for the fantastic accuracy of interplanetary navigation usually fail to account for TCMs, as most arrows, balls, and other projectiles do not include active control after they are on their way. Your correspondent has presented his own simile for the astonishing accuracy with which a spacecraft can reach a faraway destination, but most such analogies neglect TCMs, without which deep-space missions could not be accomplished. (Note that the accuracy is impressive with or without TCMs. We shall extend our archery example in a future log, making it more quantitative. It will be important, however, to keep in mind that the ion propulsion system provides so much maneuvering flexibility that Dawn does not need to achieve the degree of accuracy in its gravity assist that a mission using conventional chemical propulsion might.) For reasons we will not divulge, Dawn's first TCM has been designated TCM1. On November 20, just as it had for all of its previous thrusting, the spacecraft pointed a thruster (TCM1 used thruster #1) in the required direction and resumed emitting the familiar blue-green beam of xenon ions to alter course. While typical thrusting during the mission has lasted for almost 7 days at a time (followed by a hiatus of 7 to 8 hours), in this case only a short burn was necessary. Propelling itself from about 4:31 pm to 6:42 pm PST was just enough to fine-tune its course and change its speed by a bit more than 60 centimeters per second (1.3 miles per hour). This adjustment was modest indeed, as at that time Dawn was traveling around the Sun at more than 22.5 kilometers per second (50,400 miles per hour). Dawn and Mars, following their separate orbits that will (almost!) intersect on February 17, 2009, were moving relative to each other at 3.17 kilometers per second (7100 miles per hour). Dawn's second TCM window (inexplicably named TCM2) is in January. Traveling two-thirds of the way from here to Mars, the navigational accuracy then will be still better, with smaller deviations from the planned target point being detectable, so another refinement in the trajectory then is likely. In the meantime, Dawn will follow its orbital path with its ion thrusters idle. As Dawn travels through space on its own, its path has been essentially independent of Earth's. We saw in a previous log that the weaker grasp exerted by the Sun at Dawn's greater distance means that it travels more slowly around the solar system. While Earth has completed more than 1 full revolution (each revolution requiring 1 year) since launch, Dawn has not yet rounded the Sun once. After receding from the Sun until early August, the spacecraft began falling back, albeit only temporarily. The probe attained its maximum distance from Earth on November 10. (For anyone who was on Earth on that date and plans to use this information in an alibi, it may be helpful to know that the greatest range was reached at about 3:07 am PST.) The spacecraft was more than 384 million kilometers (239 million miles) from its one-time home. Although it will make substantial progress on its journey in the meantime, Dawn's distance to Earth will continue to decrease until January 2010, when it will be less than one-third of what it is today. In the summer of that year, however, as Earth maintains its repetitive annual orbital motion and the explorer climbs away from the Sun, it will surpass this month's distance to Earth. (Readers are encouraged to memorize the contents of this log for reference in 2010 in case we fail to include a link to this paragraph.) The complex choreography of the solar system's grand orbital dance rarely calls for a circular orbit; rather, the dancers follow ellipses (ovals in which the ends are of equal size) around the Sun. Thanks to the details of the shapes of their orbits, the greatest separation between Earth and Dawn did not occur when they were precisely on opposite sides of the Sun, although the alignment was close to that. On December 12, their dance steps will take them to points almost exactly on opposite sides of the Sun. For observers on Earth, this is known as solar conjunction, because the spacecraft and the Sun will appear to be in the same location. (Similarly, from Dawn's point of view, Earth and the Sun will be almost coincident.) In reality, of course, Dawn will be much farther away than Earth's star. It will be 147 million kilometers (91.5 million miles) from Earth to the Sun but 379 million kilometers (236 million miles) from the planet to its cosmic envoy. Its apparent proximity to the Sun presents a helpful opportunity for terrestrial readers to locate Dawn in the sky. On December 9 - 15, the spacecraft will be less than 1 degree from the Sun, progressing from east to west and passing just 1/3 degree south of that brilliant celestial landmark on December 12. (As Dawn does not orbit in the same plane as Earth, it will not pass directly behind the Sun.) The Sun itself is 1/2 degree across, so this is close indeed; the spacecraft will sneak in to less than 1 solar diameter from the disk. To demonstrate how small the separation is, if you blocked the Sun with your thumb at arm's length during this week around conjunction (and you are exhorted to do so), you also would cover Dawn. For those interested observers who lack the requisite superhuman visual acuity to discern the remote spacecraft amidst the dazzling light of the Sun, conjunction still may provide a convenient occasion to reflect upon this most recent of humankind's missions far into the solar system. This small probe is the product of creatures fortunate enough to be able to combine their powerful curiosity about the workings of the cosmos with their impressive abilities to explore, investigate, and ultimately understand. While its builders remain in the vicinity of the planet upon which they evolved, their robotic ambassador now is passing on the far side of the extraordinarily distant Sun. This is the same Sun that has been the unchallenged master of our solar system for 4.5 billion years. This is the same Sun that has shone down on Earth throughout that time and has been the ultimate source of so much of the heat, light, and other energy upon which the planet's inhabitants have been so dependent. This is the same Sun that has so influenced human expression in art, literature, and religion for uncounted millennia. This is the same Sun that has motivated scientific studies for centuries. This is the same Sun that acts as our signpost in the Milky Way galaxy. And humans have a spacecraft on the far side of it. We may be humbled by our own insignificance in the universe, yet we still undertake the most valiant adventures in our attempts to comprehend its majesty. Solar conjunction means even more to Dawn mission controllers than the opportunity to meditate upon what magnificent feats our species can achieve. As Earth, the Sun, and the spacecraft come closer into alignment, radio signals that go back and forth must pass near the Sun. The solar environment is fierce indeed, and it causes interference in those radio waves. While some signals will get through, communications will be less reliable. Therefore, controllers plan to send no messages to the spacecraft from December 5 through December 18; all instructions needed during that time will be stored onboard beforehand. Deep Space Network antennas, pointing near the Sun, will listen through the roaring noise for the faint whisper of the spacecraft, but the team will consider any signals to be a bonus. There is plenty of other work to do while waiting to resume communications after conjunction. In addition to preparing for the visit to Mars, engineers will continue to interpret the results of election day. On November 4, the Dawn team voted unanimously for more power. They commanded the spacecraft to execute a set of steps to yield data that will reveal the full potential of the enormous solar arrays to generate electrical power. The method was tested first on July 21, and then refined for a test on September 22. For this month's measurement, the commands were identical to those used for the second test with one exception that had been planned from the beginning: the solar arrays were rotated to point 60 degrees away from the Sun instead of 45 degrees. The solar arrays are so powerful that when they are pointed directly at the Sun, the spacecraft could not draw enough power to measure their full capability. The data collected show the electrical behavior of the arrays as the ion propulsion system was commanded through its start-up, drawing more and more power. Unlike the two tests, this calibration was designed so that with the arrays pointed so far from the Sun, they would not be able to provide as much power as was requested. Engineers wanted to find the point at which the arrays would no longer be able to satisfy the demands. They were not disappointed; power climbed up and up until no more was available. The prospect of having a spacecraft not be able to meet its own power demands may seem risky, but the procedure was carefully designed, analyzed, and simulated, and it executed perfectly. When the ion propulsion system asked for more power than the arrays could deliver, in the language of the trade, the solar arrays "collapsed." Now to some (including even some engineers unfamiliar with the terminology), this suggests something not entirely desirable, such as 2 bent and twisted wings, each with 5 warped panels, and 11,480 shattered solar cells, the fragments sparkling in the sunlight as they tumbled and floated away from the powerless probe. In this case though, "collapse" is an electrical, not a mechanical, phenomenon and hence would be somewhat less visually spectacular and quite reversible -- a key attribute for a mission with well over 6 years of space exploration ahead of it. Once all the data are analyzed, controllers will have a better prediction for how much power the arrays will be able to generate for the rest of the voyage. Dawn is 20 million kilometers (12 million miles) from Mars. It is 383 million kilometers (238 million miles) from Earth, or 950 times as far as the moon and 2.59 times as far as the Sun. Radio signals, traveling at the universal limit of the speed of light, take 43 minutes to make the round trip. From drtanuki at yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 19:38:11 2008 From: drtanuki at yahoo.com (drtanuki) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 16:38:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <154443.86932.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hello Tom and List, I would suggest that you check out the fantastic NWA 5471 brachinite that Martin and Stefan are selling for a VERY REASONABLE price; more than 2 grams of the material instead of a thin section (you can make your own thin sections- several). Thank you Martin and Stefan for your very generous price for such a rare classification. Dirk Ross...Tokyo http://www.meteoritesjapan.com http://www.insekijapan.com --- On Tue, 12/2/08, STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com wrote: > From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 9:23 AM > Hi list members, For those who are interested in thin > sections. Greg has > been kind enough to (previously) lend me the NWA 3151 > Brachinite that he has > for sale. My micrograph article in Meteorite Times > December is on this thin > section. > > I felt obliged to say it is a wonderful sample prepared > splendidly! I > worked with it up to a magnification of 760X with great > results. If you are > thinking of adding a thin to your collection, I would > recommend this one and check > out the article. Bernd Pauli has provided me with three > excellent wide > field cross polarized light micrographs that are also > included. > > Tom Phillips > > In a message dated 12/1/2008 4:36:02 P.M. Mountain > Standard Time, > gmhupe at htn.net writes: > Dear List Members, > > It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA > 4223, the third > member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to > get to this point > of first public offering so you know the science has been > done! It has a TKW > of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed > through eBay's site, > so you can find all of the available material and > "Official" classification > of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: > > http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed > these, most at > reduced prices for the holidays: > NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) > NWA 1879 Mesosiderite > NWA 2932 Mesosiderite > NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot > NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot > NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section > NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot > Unclassified 2kg Lot > Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) > Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) > Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) > Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g > Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) > > Thank you for checking out what I have to offer, I > appreciate it! > > Best regards, > Greg > > ==================== > Greg Hupe > The Hupe Collection > NaturesVault (eBay) > gmhupe at htn.net > www.LunarRock.com > IMCA 3163 > ==================== > Click here for my current eBay auctions: > http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > **************Life should be easier. So should your > homepage. Try the NEW > AOL.com. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From bobadebt at ec.rr.com Mon Dec 1 19:48:37 2008 From: bobadebt at ec.rr.com (David & Kitt Deyarmin) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 19:48:37 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] 25% - 35% of any Ebay Buy-it-Now auction Message-ID: <5074F0D4C7F3478099DFEFDD0731A127@David> This is not the easiest progream to use, it may take up to 60 days to get your money back but it's 25% - 35% off... Up to $200 an item and $2500 per person!!! Iit's only for USA customers that end Buy-it-Now items and you have to pay with PayPal I have already saved $119 on 2 items Details can be found here http://pages.ebay.com/cashbackoffer/terms.html Basically it goes like this... You need to got to www.live.com Do a search, I just did one for 'xbox' it really doesn't matter what you search for... Now look at the search results (up by the top in the sponsored links section) should be a link to Ebay... Click that link Now log into Ebay Now at the top of your Ebay screen there should be a green "Microsoft Cashback" logo with a red percent off banner on the right side Now do a search for ANYTHING you want it's doesn't have to be M$ related, click on the buy it now auctions and find one you like... Again you can search Ebay for anything at this point once you active the M$ session... To test availability you need to click the BIN button like you are purchasing it , now if there are more then one available it should take you to the next page where you choose the quantity the Microsoft Cashback logo should be on this screen as well under the quantity, click continue (notice it says you will confirm the purchase on the next page under the continue button) on the next page it will show you your cashback amount and you can purchase or exit out... Pay attention if there is only one of the items available there there is NO continue page just the commit to buy, don't click that unless you are ready to purchase! In either case verify the logo is on the purchase page to make sure it works on that auction... Be sure to follow the next steps after the purchase you need to setup an MS account and sorts or use your existing MS account so you get credited... Paypal is supposed to refund you the cash right back into your Paypal account within 60 days... After your purchase if you want to use the coupon again, you need to go back to step one to activate a new MS Cashback session for additional savings... You can do this 12 times! From gmhupe at htn.net Mon Dec 1 20:18:27 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 20:18:27 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 References: <154443.86932.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hello Dirk and List, Dirk, since you would like to promote brachinite material, here is a little insight you may not be aware of: NWA 4882 Brachinite (unpaired) - I have made private sales several months PRIOR to Martin's public offering, at much less than their great price per gram. I know MY customers are very happy with their greatly discounted rate! I simply do not have time to offer all of the different and new meteorites I have at one time publicly, AND I am not trying to interfer with their sales, but since Dirk brought this out in what I perceive in a negative tone, here is one heck of a Brachinite for serious collections: Click here to view complete slice of NWA 4882 measuring 130mm wide! http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882slice.jpg Click here to view complete NWA 4882 stone before cutting: http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882.jpg Click here to view close-up of polished NWA 4882 matrix: http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882closeup.jpg Official Classification: Northwest Africa 4882 Algeria Find: July 2007 Achondrite (brachinite) History: Purchased by Greg Hup? in July 2007 from a dealer in Tagounite, Morocco. Physical characteristics: Two dense, dark brown, broken rounded stones (2891 g and 206 g) with weathered fusion crust on some original exterior surfaces and thin desert varnish coatings on hackly broken surfaces. Petrography: (A. Irving and S. Kuehner, UWS) Coarse-grained rock (mostly 0.2-0.8 mm) with protogranular texture, composed predominantly of olivine with subordinate green, Cr-bearing diopside, K-poor plagioclase, chromite, iron sulfide, and kamacite (partially altered to iron hydroxides). Plagioclase is interstitial to mafic silicates and is heterogeneous in distribution. Very fine-grained (2-10 ?m), polyphase assemblages composed mostly of orthopyroxene, Ni-bearing pyrrhotite and Ni-free metal with variable amounts of fayalite and chromite occur around larger pyrrhotite grains within olivine, and also as small, isolated apparent inclusions within olivine. Geochemistry: Olivine (Fa35.0-35.2, FeO/MnO = 70.9-71.3), clinopyroxene (Fs9.3Wo47.1, FeO/MnO = 38.6, Cr2O3 = 0.76wt%, Al2O3 = 1.05 wt%), plagioclase (An32.1- 37.6Or0.3-0.5), chromite [Cr/(Cr + Al) = 0.717, Mg/(Mg + Fe) = 0.239, TiO2 = 0.71 wt%, ZnO = 0.30 wt%]. Oxygen isotopes: (D. Rumble, CIW) Replicate analyses of acid-washed silicate material by laser fluorination gave, respectively, ?18O = 2.064, 2.095; ?17O = 4.368, 4.455; ?17O = -0.234, -0.248 per mil. Classification: Achondrite (brachinite). Specimens: A total of 20.4 g of sample and one polished thin section are on deposit at UWS. GHup? holds the main mass (actually now in a private collection). I sent this to a professional cutter who used a wire saw and cut these at 3mm thick and polished to a high luster. If you want a large museum quality specimen at an even BETTER rate, be sure to contact me off list. I have already placed over half of this material into large collections, which only leaves 15 slices and the 206g fragment. Half are the larger slices like the one featured above. Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "drtanuki" To: ; Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 7:38 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD > Hello Tom and List, > I would suggest that you check out the fantastic NWA 5471 brachinite that > Martin and Stefan are selling for a VERY REASONABLE price; more than 2 > grams of the material instead of a thin section (you can make your own > thin sections- several). > > Thank you Martin and Stefan for your very generous price for such a rare > classification. > > Dirk Ross...Tokyo > http://www.meteoritesjapan.com > http://www.insekijapan.com > > > > --- On Tue, 12/2/08, STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com > wrote: > >> From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 9:23 AM >> Hi list members, For those who are interested in thin >> sections. Greg has >> been kind enough to (previously) lend me the NWA 3151 >> Brachinite that he has >> for sale. My micrograph article in Meteorite Times >> December is on this thin >> section. >> >> I felt obliged to say it is a wonderful sample prepared >> splendidly! I >> worked with it up to a magnification of 760X with great >> results. If you are >> thinking of adding a thin to your collection, I would >> recommend this one and check >> out the article. Bernd Pauli has provided me with three >> excellent wide >> field cross polarized light micrographs that are also >> included. >> >> Tom Phillips >> >> In a message dated 12/1/2008 4:36:02 P.M. Mountain >> Standard Time, >> gmhupe at htn.net writes: >> Dear List Members, >> >> It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA >> 4223, the third >> member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to >> get to this point >> of first public offering so you know the science has been >> done! It has a TKW >> of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed >> through eBay's site, >> so you can find all of the available material and >> "Official" classification >> of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: >> >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed >> these, most at >> reduced prices for the holidays: >> NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) >> NWA 1879 Mesosiderite >> NWA 2932 Mesosiderite >> NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot >> NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot >> NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section >> NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot >> Unclassified 2kg Lot >> Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) >> Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) >> Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) >> Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g >> Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) >> >> Thank you for checking out what I have to offer, I >> appreciate it! >> >> Best regards, >> Greg >> >> ==================== >> Greg Hupe >> The Hupe Collection >> NaturesVault (eBay) >> gmhupe at htn.net >> www.LunarRock.com >> IMCA 3163 >> ==================== >> Click here for my current eBay auctions: >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> **************Life should be easier. So should your >> homepage. Try the NEW >> AOL.com. >> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 20:21:55 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 17:21:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay issues of late In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <940683.86360.qm@web58401.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi Folks! Speaking strictly as a buyer, I dislike eBay's new look and interface. I've been on eBay as a member since 1999 and I have witnessed all of the changes eBay has been through over the years - the good and the bad. I find eBay's new look runs slower than previous incarnations and it annoys me alot. Search results take longer to appear, regardless of how you display or sort them. And it's now more tedious to select and deselect search criteria. I also dislike the masking of bidder's identities. I like to know who I am bidding against, and this is another change that makes eBay more faceless and anonymous. The sense of community that early eBay had is long gone, IMO. FWIW, in almost 10 years on eBay (and about 7 on PayPal), I have never had any virus or scam issues. Sure, I get the typical crude phishing email attempts every so often, but who doesn't? My mother gets PayPal phishing emails and she doesn't even use PayPal. I think this recent new trend of eBay tripping off firewalls is related to increased data gathering on eBay's part, and not part of any overtly malicious agenda. It's intrusive, but it's mostly harmless. Today's advanced antispyware and firewall software is much more sensitive to threats than it used to be, and that adds to the problem. I'm not discounting anyone else's experiences to the contrary. I'm just saying my PC has never been attacked with a virus or malware coming from eBay or PayPal in 10 years of frequent usage. The old saying of "if it isn't broke, don't fix it" applies here to eBay. IMO, the look and interface of eBay was fine before this last round of changes. I don't see any "improvements", and it makes me look at the eBay experience as a chore now, and not a pleasure - like it used to be years ago. I'd much rather deal directly with my fellow list members off eBay, than use the eBay interface anyway. It's more personal, it's friendlier, and it's cheaper for everyone involved. Regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 20:22:52 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 17:22:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] sikote-alins Message-ID: <765517.41744.qm@web57807.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi all.I have added 1.3 kilo's of sikote-alins to my collection,bringing my total to 7.5 kilo's or 50 iron individuals.Most of them from jim strope who bar none,sells the best sikote-alins I have ever seen.I saw bob evans this weekend,and even he said,with all my different collecting changes,that this one has made the most sence.Thanks for the compliment bob.LIKE MONEY IN THE BANK!I hope to be adding more soon.Thanks for all the great deals jim. Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From raremeteorites at yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 20:26:09 2008 From: raremeteorites at yahoo.com (Adam Hupe) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 17:26:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Issue Message-ID: <514936.20661.qm@web30707.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear List Members, I have been receiving disturbing emails and phone calls about a specimen entered in the Bonhams' Natural History Auction. The piece in question is lot #1124. The 90.6 gram weight of this single rock claimed to be NWA 4880 outweighs the entire Total Known Weight of NWA 4880 entered in the Meteoritical Bulletin. I appreciate IMCA members and scientists reporting this to me but this is not my stone and I do not want to engage in pairing issues which are up to scientists to determine, not me. No, I did not add more stones to the NWA 4880 designation as some are accusing. This stone is not NWA 4880 and I did not provide it to the seller or Bonhams. I was sold out long ago on this material and this piece did not come from the Hupe Collection. Please direct your complaints to Bonhams as this is not my auction. This issue is between perspective buyers and the seller of this stone and not me so please direct your inquiries elsewhere. Here is a link to the auction in question: http://www.bonhams.com/cgi-bin/public.sh/pubweb/publicSite.r?sContinent=USA&screen=lotdetailsNoFlash&iSaleItemNo=4147630&iSaleNo=16155&iSaleSectionNo=1 Here is the meteoritical bulletin entry: http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php?code=45804 I am not trying to start something here, just making it clear that this stone did not come from my collection and is not NWA 4880 as I handled every genuine piece of this material as did the scientists who studied it. Best Regards, Adam From raremeteorites at yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 20:29:30 2008 From: raremeteorites at yahoo.com (Adam Hupe) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 17:29:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Issue Message-ID: <666728.10272.qm@web30703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear List Members, I have been receiving disturbing emails and phone calls about a specimen entered in the Bonhams' Natural History Auction. The piece in question is lot #1124. The 90.6 gram weight of this single rock claimed to be NWA 4880 outweighs the entire Total Known Weight of NWA 4880 entered in the Meteoritical Bulletin. I appreciate IMCA members and scientists reporting this to me but this is not my stone and I do not want to engage in pairing issues which are up to scientists to determine, not me. No, I did not add more stones to the NWA 4880 designation as some are accusing. This stone is not NWA 4880 and I did not provide it to the seller or Bonhams. I was sold out long ago on this material and this piece did not come from the Hupe Collection. Please direct your complaints to Bonhams as this is not my auction. This issue is between perspective buyers and the seller of this stone and not me so please direct your inquiries elsewhere. Here is a link to the auction in question: http://www.bonhams.com/cgi-bin/public.sh/pubweb/publicSite.r?sContinent=USA&screen=lotdetailsNoFlash&iSaleItemNo=4147630&iSaleNo=16155&iSaleSectionNo=1 Here is the meteoritical bulletin entry: http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php?code=45804 I am not trying to start something here, just making it clear that this stone did not come from my collection and is not NWA 4880 as I handled every genuine piece of this material as did the scientists who studied it. Best Regards, Adam From drtanuki at yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 20:37:21 2008 From: drtanuki at yahoo.com (drtanuki) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 17:37:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 Message-ID: <434786.18622.qm@web53209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Greg and List, > Greg, Thank you for the offer. I was unaware that you were > selling it earlier at a discount rate. The post today was > the first that I heard that you had some new brachinite. Beautiful > meteorite!!! Great Job on cutting and polishing it. > Best Regards, Dirk...Tokyo > > Nothing negative was meant by my post. Sorry you felt so. > > > --- On Tue, 12/2/08, Greg Hupe > wrote: > > > From: Greg Hupe > > Subject: Brachinites & NWA 4882 > > To: drtanuki at yahoo.com > > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 10:18 AM > > Hello Dirk and List, > > > > Dirk, since you would like to promote brachinite > material, > > here is a little insight you may not be aware of: > > > > NWA 4882 Brachinite (unpaired) - I have made private > sales > > several months PRIOR to Martin's public offering, > at > > much less than their great price per gram. I know MY > > customers are very happy with their greatly discounted > rate! > > I simply do not have time to offer all of the > different and > > new meteorites I have at one time publicly, AND I am > not > > trying to interfer with their sales, but since Dirk > brought > > this out in what I perceive in a negative tone, here > is one > > heck of a Brachinite for serious collections: > > > > Click here to view complete slice of NWA 4882 > measuring > > 130mm wide! > > > > http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882slice.jpg > > > > > > > > Click here to view complete NWA 4882 stone before > cutting: > > > > http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882.jpg > > > > > > > > Click here to view close-up of polished NWA 4882 > matrix: > > > > http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882closeup.jpg > > > > > > Official Classification: > > Northwest Africa 4882 > > > > Algeria > > > > Find: July 2007 > > > > Achondrite (brachinite) > > > > History: Purchased by Greg Hup? in July 2007 from a > dealer > > in Tagounite, Morocco. > > > > Physical characteristics: Two dense, dark brown, > broken > > rounded stones (2891 g and 206 g) with weathered > fusion > > crust on some original exterior surfaces and thin > desert > > varnish coatings on hackly broken surfaces. > > > > Petrography: (A. Irving and S. Kuehner, UWS) > Coarse-grained > > rock (mostly 0.2-0.8 mm) with protogranular texture, > > composed predominantly of olivine with subordinate > green, > > Cr-bearing diopside, K-poor plagioclase, chromite, > iron > > sulfide, and kamacite (partially altered to iron > > hydroxides). Plagioclase is interstitial to mafic > silicates > > and is heterogeneous in distribution. Very > fine-grained > > (2-10 ?m), polyphase assemblages composed mostly of > > orthopyroxene, Ni-bearing pyrrhotite and Ni-free metal > with > > variable amounts of fayalite and chromite occur around > > larger pyrrhotite grains within olivine, and also as > small, > > isolated apparent inclusions within olivine. > > > > Geochemistry: Olivine (Fa35.0-35.2, FeO/MnO = > 70.9-71.3), > > clinopyroxene (Fs9.3Wo47.1, FeO/MnO = 38.6, Cr2O3 = > 0.76wt%, > > Al2O3 = 1.05 wt%), plagioclase (An32.1- > 37.6Or0.3-0.5), > > chromite [Cr/(Cr + Al) = 0.717, Mg/(Mg + Fe) = 0.239, > TiO2 = > > 0.71 wt%, ZnO = 0.30 wt%]. Oxygen isotopes: (D. > Rumble, CIW) > > Replicate analyses of acid-washed silicate material by > laser > > fluorination gave, respectively, ?18O = 2.064, 2.095; > ?17O > > = 4.368, 4.455; ?17O = -0.234, -0.248 per mil. > > > > Classification: Achondrite (brachinite). > > > > Specimens: A total of 20.4 g of sample and one > polished > > thin section are on deposit at UWS. GHup? holds the > main > > mass (actually now in a private collection). > > > > > > > > I sent this to a professional cutter who used a wire > saw > > and cut these at 3mm thick and polished to a high > luster. If > > you want a large museum quality specimen at an even > BETTER > > rate, be sure to contact me off list. > > > > > > > > I have already placed over half of this material into > large > > collections, which only leaves 15 slices and the 206g > > fragment. Half are the larger slices like the one > featured > > above. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > Greg > > > > ==================== > > Greg Hupe > > The Hupe Collection > > NaturesVault (eBay) > > gmhupe at htn.net > > www.LunarRock.com > > IMCA 3163 > > ==================== > > Click here for my current eBay auctions: > > http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: > "drtanuki" > > > > To: ; > > > > Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 7:38 PM > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - > NWA > > 4223 - AD > > > > > > > Hello Tom and List, > > > I would suggest that you check out the fantastic > NWA > > 5471 brachinite that Martin and Stefan are selling for > a > > VERY REASONABLE price; more than 2 grams of the > material > > instead of a thin section (you can make your own thin > > sections- several). > > > > > > Thank you Martin and Stefan for your very > generous > > price for such a rare classification. > > > > > > Dirk Ross...Tokyo > > > http://www.meteoritesjapan.com > > > http://www.insekijapan.com > > > > > > > > > > > > --- On Tue, 12/2/08, STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com > > wrote: > > > > > >> From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com > > > > >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine > > Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD > > >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > >> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 9:23 AM > > >> Hi list members, For those who are > interested in > > thin > > >> sections. Greg has > > >> been kind enough to (previously) lend me the > NWA > > 3151 > > >> Brachinite that he has > > >> for sale. My micrograph article in Meteorite > > Times > > >> December is on this thin > > >> section. > > >> > > >> I felt obliged to say it is a wonderful > sample > > prepared > > >> splendidly! I > > >> worked with it up to a magnification of 760X > with > > great > > >> results. If you are > > >> thinking of adding a thin to your > collection, I > > would > > >> recommend this one and check > > >> out the article. Bernd Pauli has provided > me > > with three > > >> excellent wide > > >> field cross polarized light micrographs that > are > > also > > >> included. > > >> > > >> Tom Phillips > > >> > > >> In a message dated 12/1/2008 4:36:02 P.M. > Mountain > > >> Standard Time, > > >> gmhupe at htn.net writes: > > >> Dear List Members, > > >> > > >> It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine > > Diogenite, NWA > > >> 4223, the third > > >> member of this exclusive group. It took me > three > > years to > > >> get to this point > > >> of first public offering so you know the > science > > has been > > >> done! It has a TKW > > >> of just 329 grams and is very > course-grained. I > > managed > > >> through eBay's site, > > >> so you can find all of the available > material and > > >> "Official" classification > > >> of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" > > feature here: > > >> > > >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > >> > > >> In addition to these rare specimens, I have > also > > listed > > >> these, most at > > >> reduced prices for the holidays: > > >> NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) > > >> NWA 1879 Mesosiderite > > >> NWA 2932 Mesosiderite > > >> NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot > > >> NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot > > >> NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section > > >> NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot > > >> Unclassified 2kg Lot > > >> Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) > > >> Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) > > >> Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) > > >> Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g > > >> Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just > 99 > > cents) > > >> > > >> Thank you for checking out what I have to > offer, > > I > > >> appreciate it! > > >> > > >> Best regards, > > >> Greg > > >> > > >> ==================== > > >> Greg Hupe > > >> The Hupe Collection > > >> NaturesVault (eBay) > > >> gmhupe at htn.net > > >> www.LunarRock.com > > >> IMCA 3163 > > >> ==================== > > >> Click here for my current eBay auctions: > > >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ______________________________________________ > > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > >> > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > >> > > >> **************Life should be easier. So > should > > your > > >> homepage. Try the NEW > > >> AOL.com. > > >> > > > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) > > >> > ______________________________________________ > > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > >> > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > ______________________________________________ > > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > From darryl at dof3.com Mon Dec 1 21:10:54 2008 From: darryl at dof3.com (Darryl Pitt) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 21:10:54 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Issue In-Reply-To: <514936.20661.qm@web30707.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <514936.20661.qm@web30707.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8C9E3E7C-F820-4147-AB70-736C449F585E@dof3.com> My bad. The caption should have been written to state that the specimen is paired with 4880, as was reported to me by the seller. Sincerely, Darryl On Dec 1, 2008, at 8:26 PM, Adam Hupe wrote: > Dear List Members, > > I have been receiving disturbing emails and phone calls about a > specimen entered in the Bonhams' Natural History Auction. The piece > in question is lot #1124. The 90.6 gram weight of this single rock > claimed to be NWA 4880 outweighs the entire Total Known Weight of > NWA 4880 entered in the Meteoritical Bulletin. I appreciate IMCA > members and scientists reporting this to me but this is not my stone > and I do not want to engage in pairing issues which are up to > scientists to determine, not me. > > No, I did not add more stones to the NWA 4880 designation as some > are accusing. This stone is not NWA 4880 and I did not provide it to > the seller or Bonhams. I was sold out long ago on this material and > this piece did not come from the Hupe Collection. Please direct > your complaints to Bonhams as this is not my auction. This issue is > between perspective buyers and the seller of this stone and not me > so please direct your inquiries elsewhere. > > Here is a link to the auction in question: > http://www.bonhams.com/cgi-bin/public.sh/pubweb/publicSite.r?sContinent=USA&screen=lotdetailsNoFlash&iSaleItemNo=4147630&iSaleNo=16155&iSaleSectionNo=1 > > Here is the meteoritical bulletin entry: > http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php?code=45804 > > I am not trying to start something here, just making it clear that > this stone did not come from my collection and is not NWA 4880 as I > handled every genuine piece of this material as did the scientists > who studied it. > > Best Regards, > > Adam > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From searchingforfun at sbcglobal.net Tue Dec 2 00:39:09 2008 From: searchingforfun at sbcglobal.net (Brian Cox) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 21:39:09 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] ebay is slow and it's everywhere Message-ID: <002501c95440$4d9b3ff0$4001a8c0@BRIANSCOMPUTER> Hi folks, Just had to add my feelings on ebay here. I've been complaining for 6 months. The ebay reps are nice, but always say in their canned response: " it must be your computer that is slow, since we haven't had "any other complaints" regarding our site!" "You should clean your cache and empty your files and run your virus protection." It's unfortunately the same old story from ebay and until we all stand up together and protest I don't think they're going to do anything about it. It might sound radical, but hey, we all need to contact them. I've had ebay go down while loading photos or just writing a listing. I've had to contact them because their site went down in the middle of loading a listing and then I had to start over and it somehow had saved the previous listing that I didn't even finish and then I had to cancel that and get a credit for it over this weekend. I have a 3.0-6.0 speed on my laptop and get on ebay at lunch at my office. Believe me, every single computer I use at my office has much faster speeds than here at home and every other website sails along smoothly, but ebay. I know it's ebay that is slow because with the office computers taking more than 10 seconds to go from one item to another. Write them or call them. They will be losing business and also losing business for us if people get fed up with trying to get on to ebay for our auctions. Brian Cox IMCA # 6387 ebay ID- searchingforfun From bigpineartifacts at yahoo.com Mon Dec 1 22:47:13 2008 From: bigpineartifacts at yahoo.com (mckinney trammell) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 19:47:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay issues of late In-Reply-To: <940683.86360.qm@web58401.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <325093.61569.qm@web53201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> ebay will be dead in 5 years. hi fees, no bad feedback, hidden identities, no recourse on bad paypal experiences, no phone support, etc., etc. a consolidated retro-fit of a not-yet formed craigslist-type site will be the new FREE venue. --- On Mon, 12/1/08, Michael Gilmer wrote: > From: Michael Gilmer > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] eBay issues of late > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Monday, December 1, 2008, 8:21 PM > Hi Folks! > > Speaking strictly as a buyer, I dislike eBay's new look > and > interface. I've been on eBay as a member since 1999 > and I have > witnessed all of the changes eBay has been through over the > years - > the good and the bad. > > I find eBay's new look runs slower than previous > incarnations and > it annoys me alot. Search results take longer to appear, > regardless > of how you display or sort them. And it's now more > tedious to > select and deselect search criteria. I also dislike the > masking of > bidder's identities. I like to know who I am bidding > against, and > this is another change that makes eBay more faceless and > anonymous. > The sense of community that early eBay had is long gone, > IMO. > > FWIW, in almost 10 years on eBay (and about 7 on PayPal), I > have > never had any virus or scam issues. Sure, I get the > typical > crude phishing email attempts every so often, but who > doesn't? > My mother gets PayPal phishing emails and she doesn't > even use > PayPal. I think this recent new trend of eBay tripping off > firewalls is related to increased data gathering on > eBay's part, > and not part of any overtly malicious agenda. It's > intrusive, but > it's mostly harmless. Today's advanced antispyware > and firewall > software is much more sensitive to threats than it used to > be, and > that adds to the problem. I'm not discounting anyone > else's > experiences to the contrary. I'm just saying my PC has > never > been attacked with a virus or malware coming from eBay or > PayPal > in 10 years of frequent usage. > > The old saying of "if it isn't broke, don't > fix it" applies here > to eBay. IMO, the look and interface of eBay was fine > before > this last round of changes. I don't see any > "improvements", and > it makes me look at the eBay experience as a chore now, and > not > a pleasure - like it used to be years ago. > > I'd much rather deal directly with my fellow list > members off eBay, > than use the eBay interface anyway. It's more > personal, it's > friendlier, and it's cheaper for everyone involved. > > Regards and clear skies, > > MikeG > > > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and > http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From rob at nakhladogmeteorites.com Mon Dec 1 23:33:32 2008 From: rob at nakhladogmeteorites.com (Rob Wesel) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 20:33:32 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Issue References: <666728.10272.qm@web30703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <008401c95437$21f998f0$6501a8c0@windows9bb74fe> And then there is Berduc, surprised to see that one in an IPO. Rob Wesel http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com ------------------ We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Adam Hupe" To: "Adam" Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 5:29 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Issue > Dear List Members, > > I have been receiving disturbing emails and phone calls about a specimen > entered in the Bonhams' Natural History Auction. The piece in question is > lot #1124. The 90.6 gram weight of this single rock claimed to be NWA 4880 > outweighs the entire Total Known Weight of NWA 4880 entered in the > Meteoritical Bulletin. I appreciate IMCA members and scientists > reporting this to me but this is not my stone and I do not want to engage > in pairing issues which are up to scientists to determine, not me. > > No, I did not add more stones to the NWA 4880 designation as some are > accusing. This stone is not NWA 4880 and I did not provide it to the > seller or Bonhams. I was sold out long ago on this material and this piece > did not come from the Hupe Collection. Please direct your complaints to > Bonhams as this is not my auction. This issue is between perspective > buyers and the seller of this stone and not me so please direct your > inquiries elsewhere. > > Here is a link to the auction in question: > http://www.bonhams.com/cgi-bin/public.sh/pubweb/publicSite.r?sContinent=USA&screen=lotdetailsNoFlash&iSaleItemNo=4147630&iSaleNo=16155&iSaleSectionNo=1 > > Here is the meteoritical bulletin entry: > http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php?code=45804 > > I am not trying to start something here, just making it clear that this > stone did not come from my collection and is not NWA 4880 as I handled > every genuine piece of this material as did the scientists who studied it. > > Best Regards, > > Adam > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael at spacerocksinc.com Tue Dec 2 00:00:28 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 21:00:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 2, 2008 Message-ID: <22448113.1669791228194028367.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_2_2008.html From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Tue Dec 2 07:03:56 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 13:03:56 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 In-Reply-To: References: <154443.86932.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001e01c95476$0e1a5290$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Good Morning list, and ooops what's going on? I'm sure Dirk wanted to express his enthusiasm rather than to offend someone. Friends! Brachinites! Can you have too many of them in the collection??? There are so few finds, such a tiny batch of material and yet they are so diverse and heterogeneous, that brachinites are still a really enigmatic class. Always a good read, David Weir's Studies: http://www.meteoritestudies.com/ When we decided to blow our NWA 5471, no matter whether it was the main mass or small-budget-sizes, the price-finding was simple. We checked the prices on the dealers' pages and the results on ebay of the few pieces offered there, to be sure, to have a silly low price. Check it by your own. 200$ a gram is affordable standard; everything below 200$ is a good buy; everything below 150$ is a bargain; everything below 100$ is a MUST and a categorical imperative. So we made 65$ a gram as a gift. Now Greg tells us, that his NWA 3151 is available at an even lower rate! What are the consequences? Good heavens - Buy them! Buy a NWA 3151, buy a NWA 5471, if you have already a 3151, take additionally a 5471, if you own a 5471, add a 3151. What are you waiting for, prices went silly! Bah, prices are in ruin Matteo 27:4 Follow me. Why "silly"? Stats, stats, stats! Use the formidable instrument of the Meteoritical Bulletin Database: http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php Nineteen (including ours not listed yet) finds and numbers. Pairing indications often mentioned in the descriptions, hence probably we're talking about less than a dozen different falls. Quantities, sum them up! 10kgs. That is all. Jump in the garden and grab 10kgs of stones from the rose bed to get a notion of the total volume in existence on Earth. What are you waiting for? Seen the numbers of finds and the weights, it's the same, as you would get offered a Moon at 10$ a gram. That tomorrow a ton of that stuff will fall? Unlikely, I guess. Since the day Jacob rested his weary head on the black baethyl to dream his dream of his ladder there were found only those few handfuls of tiny stones. Please - ANSMET, NIPR, EUROMET, PRIC with all their manpower and the primary and secondary means of maybe 1 billion together in these 31 years, they recovered half a pound of that stuff. Give 10,000$ to Greg or to us and you can have another half a pound. That's what I call a performance. And that's that "service to science", which sounds sometimes so solemnly, and where about some are smiling, but nevertheless is true. Huh, and revilers of dry food: Aren't these both not the best proves, that NWAs do have a "personality"? Eagles Nest. Found by a hunter in desert. Reid. Found by a hunter in desert. Hughes. Found by a hunter in desert. NWA 3151. Found by a hunter in desert. NWA 5471 Found by a hunter in desert. History reloaded! (Shhht have you noticed that NWA 3151 as well as NWA 5471 are looking prettier than Eagles Nest?). Quintessence of that little discussion is: Chladni's Heirs say: We give you the Koh-I-Noor for a dime! The Hup?s say: We give you the Millennium Star for a nickel! The collectors know that. Hey universities, colleges - these are our sweet pills to ease your pains of budget shortage! Good Morning Chicago, good morning London! Guten Morgen Wien! Bonjour Paris! Shubh Sanyankal Calcutta! Grueziwohl Bern! Salve Vatican........ Shhhhh, Perth, Adelaide, Victoria - homes of all brachinites are still slumbering on the other side of the globe. O joyful awakening, addition to the family! Wake up! And set for a moment these triceratops skulls, the fancy rock crystals, the silver curls, the rubies aside. Such expensive mass stuff you can buy in all eternity. Brachinites? You don't have something rarer but only today so cheap in your collections. And when they are gone, they're gone. Don't want to read as a doter your swan songs about the Golden Age of meteorites. You all were here, you all were informed. Ask NASA, ask ESA, ask IAXA - will it take a hundred years or 200 years - until probes will hunt for the remainders of the brachinite parent bodie(s) in space? Sounds all quite exaggerated, doesn't it? Sorry. These are the proportions, when we're talking about brachinites. These are the facts, when we're talking about meteorites. Brachinites are space exploration 2008-2050. And these are some and by far not all aspects, why we all and often the professionals too, do love and venerate our meteorites. Best! Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Greg Hupe Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Dezember 2008 02:18 An: drtanuki at yahoo.com Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 Hello Dirk and List, Dirk, since you would like to promote brachinite material, here is a little insight you may not be aware of: NWA 4882 Brachinite (unpaired) - I have made private sales several months PRIOR to Martin's public offering, at much less than their great price per gram. I know MY customers are very happy with their greatly discounted rate! I simply do not have time to offer all of the different and new meteorites I have at one time publicly, AND I am not trying to interfer with their sales, but since Dirk brought this out in what I perceive in a negative tone, here is one heck of a Brachinite for serious collections: Click here to view complete slice of NWA 4882 measuring 130mm wide! http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882slice.jpg Click here to view complete NWA 4882 stone before cutting: http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882.jpg Click here to view close-up of polished NWA 4882 matrix: http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882closeup.jpg Official Classification: Northwest Africa 4882 Algeria Find: July 2007 Achondrite (brachinite) History: Purchased by Greg Hup? in July 2007 from a dealer in Tagounite, Morocco. Physical characteristics: Two dense, dark brown, broken rounded stones (2891 g and 206 g) with weathered fusion crust on some original exterior surfaces and thin desert varnish coatings on hackly broken surfaces. Petrography: (A. Irving and S. Kuehner, UWS) Coarse-grained rock (mostly 0.2-0.8 mm) with protogranular texture, composed predominantly of olivine with subordinate green, Cr-bearing diopside, K-poor plagioclase, chromite, iron sulfide, and kamacite (partially altered to iron hydroxides). Plagioclase is interstitial to mafic silicates and is heterogeneous in distribution. Very fine-grained (2-10 ?m), polyphase assemblages composed mostly of orthopyroxene, Ni-bearing pyrrhotite and Ni-free metal with variable amounts of fayalite and chromite occur around larger pyrrhotite grains within olivine, and also as small, isolated apparent inclusions within olivine. Geochemistry: Olivine (Fa35.0-35.2, FeO/MnO = 70.9-71.3), clinopyroxene (Fs9.3Wo47.1, FeO/MnO = 38.6, Cr2O3 = 0.76wt%, Al2O3 = 1.05 wt%), plagioclase (An32.1- 37.6Or0.3-0.5), chromite [Cr/(Cr + Al) = 0.717, Mg/(Mg + Fe) = 0.239, TiO2 = 0.71 wt%, ZnO = 0.30 wt%]. Oxygen isotopes: (D. Rumble, CIW) Replicate analyses of acid-washed silicate material by laser fluorination gave, respectively, ?18O = 2.064, 2.095; ?17O = 4.368, 4.455; ?17O = -0.234, -0.248 per mil. Classification: Achondrite (brachinite). Specimens: A total of 20.4 g of sample and one polished thin section are on deposit at UWS. GHup? holds the main mass (actually now in a private collection). I sent this to a professional cutter who used a wire saw and cut these at 3mm thick and polished to a high luster. If you want a large museum quality specimen at an even BETTER rate, be sure to contact me off list. I have already placed over half of this material into large collections, which only leaves 15 slices and the 206g fragment. Half are the larger slices like the one featured above. Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "drtanuki" To: ; Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 7:38 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD > Hello Tom and List, > I would suggest that you check out the fantastic NWA 5471 brachinite that > Martin and Stefan are selling for a VERY REASONABLE price; more than 2 > grams of the material instead of a thin section (you can make your own > thin sections- several). > > Thank you Martin and Stefan for your very generous price for such a rare > classification. > > Dirk Ross...Tokyo > http://www.meteoritesjapan.com > http://www.insekijapan.com > > > > --- On Tue, 12/2/08, STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com > wrote: > >> From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 9:23 AM >> Hi list members, For those who are interested in thin >> sections. Greg has >> been kind enough to (previously) lend me the NWA 3151 >> Brachinite that he has >> for sale. My micrograph article in Meteorite Times >> December is on this thin >> section. >> >> I felt obliged to say it is a wonderful sample prepared >> splendidly! I >> worked with it up to a magnification of 760X with great >> results. If you are >> thinking of adding a thin to your collection, I would >> recommend this one and check >> out the article. Bernd Pauli has provided me with three >> excellent wide >> field cross polarized light micrographs that are also >> included. >> >> Tom Phillips >> >> In a message dated 12/1/2008 4:36:02 P.M. Mountain >> Standard Time, >> gmhupe at htn.net writes: >> Dear List Members, >> >> It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA >> 4223, the third >> member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to >> get to this point >> of first public offering so you know the science has been >> done! It has a TKW >> of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed >> through eBay's site, >> so you can find all of the available material and >> "Official" classification >> of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: >> >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed >> these, most at >> reduced prices for the holidays: >> NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) >> NWA 1879 Mesosiderite >> NWA 2932 Mesosiderite >> NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot >> NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot >> NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section >> NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot >> Unclassified 2kg Lot >> Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) >> Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) >> Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) >> Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g >> Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) >> >> Thank you for checking out what I have to offer, I >> appreciate it! >> >> Best regards, >> Greg >> >> ==================== >> Greg Hupe >> The Hupe Collection >> NaturesVault (eBay) >> gmhupe at htn.net >> www.LunarRock.com >> IMCA 3163 >> ==================== >> Click here for my current eBay auctions: >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> **************Life should be easier. So should your >> homepage. Try the NEW >> AOL.com. >> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Tue Dec 2 07:40:23 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 13:40:23 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 In-Reply-To: <001e01c95476$0e1a5290$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> References: <154443.86932.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <001e01c95476$0e1a5290$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Message-ID: <002301c9547b$25e38c70$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Oooops, little correction, was in a brachinite flush. Must be NWA 4882 not 3151. But NWA 3151 is cool stuff too. And Marcin's NWA 4969. Take them all. All are the money well worth. So, something forgotten? Crazy. To be able to buy 5 brachinites in one day. Never happened before in history. Best Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Martin Altmann Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Dezember 2008 13:04 An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 Good Morning list, and ooops what's going on? I'm sure Dirk wanted to express his enthusiasm rather than to offend someone. Friends! Brachinites! Can you have too many of them in the collection??? There are so few finds, such a tiny batch of material and yet they are so diverse and heterogeneous, that brachinites are still a really enigmatic class. Always a good read, David Weir's Studies: http://www.meteoritestudies.com/ When we decided to blow our NWA 5471, no matter whether it was the main mass or small-budget-sizes, the price-finding was simple. We checked the prices on the dealers' pages and the results on ebay of the few pieces offered there, to be sure, to have a silly low price. Check it by your own. 200$ a gram is affordable standard; everything below 200$ is a good buy; everything below 150$ is a bargain; everything below 100$ is a MUST and a categorical imperative. So we made 65$ a gram as a gift. Now Greg tells us, that his NWA 3151 is available at an even lower rate! What are the consequences? Good heavens - Buy them! Buy a NWA 3151, buy a NWA 5471, if you have already a 3151, take additionally a 5471, if you own a 5471, add a 3151. What are you waiting for, prices went silly! Bah, prices are in ruin Matteo 27:4 Follow me. Why "silly"? Stats, stats, stats! Use the formidable instrument of the Meteoritical Bulletin Database: http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php Nineteen (including ours not listed yet) finds and numbers. Pairing indications often mentioned in the descriptions, hence probably we're talking about less than a dozen different falls. Quantities, sum them up! 10kgs. That is all. Jump in the garden and grab 10kgs of stones from the rose bed to get a notion of the total volume in existence on Earth. What are you waiting for? Seen the numbers of finds and the weights, it's the same, as you would get offered a Moon at 10$ a gram. That tomorrow a ton of that stuff will fall? Unlikely, I guess. Since the day Jacob rested his weary head on the black baethyl to dream his dream of his ladder there were found only those few handfuls of tiny stones. Please - ANSMET, NIPR, EUROMET, PRIC with all their manpower and the primary and secondary means of maybe 1 billion together in these 31 years, they recovered half a pound of that stuff. Give 10,000$ to Greg or to us and you can have another half a pound. That's what I call a performance. And that's that "service to science", which sounds sometimes so solemnly, and where about some are smiling, but nevertheless is true. Huh, and revilers of dry food: Aren't these both not the best proves, that NWAs do have a "personality"? Eagles Nest. Found by a hunter in desert. Reid. Found by a hunter in desert. Hughes. Found by a hunter in desert. NWA 3151. Found by a hunter in desert. NWA 5471 Found by a hunter in desert. History reloaded! (Shhht have you noticed that NWA 3151 as well as NWA 5471 are looking prettier than Eagles Nest?). Quintessence of that little discussion is: Chladni's Heirs say: We give you the Koh-I-Noor for a dime! The Hup?s say: We give you the Millennium Star for a nickel! The collectors know that. Hey universities, colleges - these are our sweet pills to ease your pains of budget shortage! Good Morning Chicago, good morning London! Guten Morgen Wien! Bonjour Paris! Shubh Sanyankal Calcutta! Grueziwohl Bern! Salve Vatican........ Shhhhh, Perth, Adelaide, Victoria - homes of all brachinites are still slumbering on the other side of the globe. O joyful awakening, addition to the family! Wake up! And set for a moment these triceratops skulls, the fancy rock crystals, the silver curls, the rubies aside. Such expensive mass stuff you can buy in all eternity. Brachinites? You don't have something rarer but only today so cheap in your collections. And when they are gone, they're gone. Don't want to read as a doter your swan songs about the Golden Age of meteorites. You all were here, you all were informed. Ask NASA, ask ESA, ask IAXA - will it take a hundred years or 200 years - until probes will hunt for the remainders of the brachinite parent bodie(s) in space? Sounds all quite exaggerated, doesn't it? Sorry. These are the proportions, when we're talking about brachinites. These are the facts, when we're talking about meteorites. Brachinites are space exploration 2008-2050. And these are some and by far not all aspects, why we all and often the professionals too, do love and venerate our meteorites. Best! Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Greg Hupe Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Dezember 2008 02:18 An: drtanuki at yahoo.com Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 Hello Dirk and List, Dirk, since you would like to promote brachinite material, here is a little insight you may not be aware of: NWA 4882 Brachinite (unpaired) - I have made private sales several months PRIOR to Martin's public offering, at much less than their great price per gram. I know MY customers are very happy with their greatly discounted rate! I simply do not have time to offer all of the different and new meteorites I have at one time publicly, AND I am not trying to interfer with their sales, but since Dirk brought this out in what I perceive in a negative tone, here is one heck of a Brachinite for serious collections: Click here to view complete slice of NWA 4882 measuring 130mm wide! http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882slice.jpg Click here to view complete NWA 4882 stone before cutting: http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882.jpg Click here to view close-up of polished NWA 4882 matrix: http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882closeup.jpg Official Classification: Northwest Africa 4882 Algeria Find: July 2007 Achondrite (brachinite) History: Purchased by Greg Hup? in July 2007 from a dealer in Tagounite, Morocco. Physical characteristics: Two dense, dark brown, broken rounded stones (2891 g and 206 g) with weathered fusion crust on some original exterior surfaces and thin desert varnish coatings on hackly broken surfaces. Petrography: (A. Irving and S. Kuehner, UWS) Coarse-grained rock (mostly 0.2-0.8 mm) with protogranular texture, composed predominantly of olivine with subordinate green, Cr-bearing diopside, K-poor plagioclase, chromite, iron sulfide, and kamacite (partially altered to iron hydroxides). Plagioclase is interstitial to mafic silicates and is heterogeneous in distribution. Very fine-grained (2-10 ?m), polyphase assemblages composed mostly of orthopyroxene, Ni-bearing pyrrhotite and Ni-free metal with variable amounts of fayalite and chromite occur around larger pyrrhotite grains within olivine, and also as small, isolated apparent inclusions within olivine. Geochemistry: Olivine (Fa35.0-35.2, FeO/MnO = 70.9-71.3), clinopyroxene (Fs9.3Wo47.1, FeO/MnO = 38.6, Cr2O3 = 0.76wt%, Al2O3 = 1.05 wt%), plagioclase (An32.1- 37.6Or0.3-0.5), chromite [Cr/(Cr + Al) = 0.717, Mg/(Mg + Fe) = 0.239, TiO2 = 0.71 wt%, ZnO = 0.30 wt%]. Oxygen isotopes: (D. Rumble, CIW) Replicate analyses of acid-washed silicate material by laser fluorination gave, respectively, ?18O = 2.064, 2.095; ?17O = 4.368, 4.455; ?17O = -0.234, -0.248 per mil. Classification: Achondrite (brachinite). Specimens: A total of 20.4 g of sample and one polished thin section are on deposit at UWS. GHup? holds the main mass (actually now in a private collection). I sent this to a professional cutter who used a wire saw and cut these at 3mm thick and polished to a high luster. If you want a large museum quality specimen at an even BETTER rate, be sure to contact me off list. I have already placed over half of this material into large collections, which only leaves 15 slices and the 206g fragment. Half are the larger slices like the one featured above. Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "drtanuki" To: ; Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 7:38 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD > Hello Tom and List, > I would suggest that you check out the fantastic NWA 5471 brachinite that > Martin and Stefan are selling for a VERY REASONABLE price; more than 2 > grams of the material instead of a thin section (you can make your own > thin sections- several). > > Thank you Martin and Stefan for your very generous price for such a rare > classification. > > Dirk Ross...Tokyo > http://www.meteoritesjapan.com > http://www.insekijapan.com > > > > --- On Tue, 12/2/08, STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com > wrote: > >> From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 9:23 AM >> Hi list members, For those who are interested in thin >> sections. Greg has >> been kind enough to (previously) lend me the NWA 3151 >> Brachinite that he has >> for sale. My micrograph article in Meteorite Times >> December is on this thin >> section. >> >> I felt obliged to say it is a wonderful sample prepared >> splendidly! I >> worked with it up to a magnification of 760X with great >> results. If you are >> thinking of adding a thin to your collection, I would >> recommend this one and check >> out the article. Bernd Pauli has provided me with three >> excellent wide >> field cross polarized light micrographs that are also >> included. >> >> Tom Phillips >> >> In a message dated 12/1/2008 4:36:02 P.M. Mountain >> Standard Time, >> gmhupe at htn.net writes: >> Dear List Members, >> >> It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA >> 4223, the third >> member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to >> get to this point >> of first public offering so you know the science has been >> done! It has a TKW >> of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed >> through eBay's site, >> so you can find all of the available material and >> "Official" classification >> of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: >> >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed >> these, most at >> reduced prices for the holidays: >> NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) >> NWA 1879 Mesosiderite >> NWA 2932 Mesosiderite >> NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot >> NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot >> NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section >> NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot >> Unclassified 2kg Lot >> Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) >> Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) >> Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) >> Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g >> Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) >> >> Thank you for checking out what I have to offer, I >> appreciate it! >> >> Best regards, >> Greg >> >> ==================== >> Greg Hupe >> The Hupe Collection >> NaturesVault (eBay) >> gmhupe at htn.net >> www.LunarRock.com >> IMCA 3163 >> ==================== >> Click here for my current eBay auctions: >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> **************Life should be easier. So should your >> homepage. Try the NEW >> AOL.com. >> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr Tue Dec 2 09:20:53 2008 From: Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr (Zelimir Gabelica) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 15:20:53 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] status of NWA brachinites In-Reply-To: <002301c9547b$25e38c70$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> References: <001e01c95476$0e1a5290$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> <154443.86932.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <001e01c95476$0e1a5290$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20081202142351.02a6a008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Hi Martin, I fully agree. To be complete, here is what I have in my archives: ..."NWA 4969 (BRA, Algeria, tkw = 1 at 180 g) from Marcin, is paired with NWA 4882 (Algeria, from Hup?'s, BRA, tkw = 2@ 3096 g), but apparently not with NWA 3151 (BRA, Hup?'s, tkw = 1 at 1500 grams), nor with NWXA 5191 (1 at 26.5 g) With the new NWA 5471 from Heir's, this indeed makes 4 brachinites from the "NWA" vast strewnfield. However, in Met. Bull. database, we find the following brachinites from "NWA", this better completing the picture: NWA 595 (Cottingham, Morocco (?), 1 at 196 g) NWA 3151 (Hup?'s, NWA (Morocco ?), 1 at 1500 g) NWA 4872 (Aaronson, Algeria, 1 at 3000 g) NWA 4874 (Aaronson, Algeria, 1 at 28 g) (can it be paired with NWA 4872 above ???) NWA 4876 (anonymous, NWA ( Morocco ?), 1 at 130 g NWA 4882 (G. Hup?, Algeria, 2 at 3096 g) NWA 4969 (M. Cimala, NWA (Morocco ?), 1 at 180 g NWA 5191 (anonymous, found in Morocco desert, 1 at 26.5, said to be paired with NWA 3151, thus suggesting this latter was also found in Morocco NWA 5471 (C. Heir's, Morocco (??), 1 (??)@538 g, paired with ???? (not yet in Met. Bull.) ---------- Total: not copunting pairings, we find 9 different meteorite names (NWA numbers), probably 10 separate pieces, totalling 8694,5 grams Question: How far are these data (Met Bulll database + NWA 5471) correct and complete ? Who can complete, possibly remove the ???'s and add comments about pairings, so that we all can update our archives regarding NWA brachinites? Bernd? Greg ? Marcin ? Martin ? or Jeff ? Thanks and best wishes, Zelimir A 13:40 02/12/2008 +0100, Martin Altmann a ?crit : >Oooops, little correction, was in a brachinite flush. > >Must be NWA 4882 not 3151. > >But NWA 3151 is cool stuff too. >And Marcin's NWA 4969. > >Take them all. All are the money well worth. > >So, something forgotten? > >Crazy. To be able to buy 5 brachinites in one day. >Never happened before in history. > >Best >Martin > >-----Urspr??ngliche Nachricht----- >Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com >[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Martin >Altmann >Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Dezember 2008 13:04 >An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 > >Good Morning list, > >and ooops what's going on? > >I'm sure Dirk wanted to express his enthusiasm rather than to offend someone. > >Friends! Brachinites! Can you have too many of them in the collection??? >There are so few finds, such a tiny batch of material and yet they are so >diverse and heterogeneous, that brachinites are still a really enigmatic class. > >Always a good read, David Weir's Studies: http://www.meteoritestudies.com/ > >When we decided to blow our NWA 5471, no matter whether it was the main >mass or small-budget-sizes, the price-finding was simple. We checked the >prices on the dealers' pages and the results on ebay of the few pieces >offered there, to be sure, to have a silly low price. > >Check it by your own. >200$ a gram is affordable standard; >everything below 200$ is a good buy; >everything below 150$ is a bargain; >everything below 100$ is a MUST and a categorical imperative. > >So we made 65$ a gram as a gift. > >Now Greg tells us, that his NWA 3151 is available at an even lower rate! > >What are the consequences? Good heavens - Buy them! Buy a NWA 3151, buy a >NWA 5471, if you have already a 3151, take additionally a 5471, if you own >a 5471, add a 3151. What are you waiting for, prices went silly! >Bah, prices are in ruin > Matteo 27:4 > >Follow me. Why "silly"? > >Stats, stats, stats! > >Use the formidable instrument of the Meteoritical Bulletin Database: >http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php > >Nineteen (including ours not listed yet) finds and numbers. >Pairing indications often mentioned in the descriptions, >hence probably we're talking about less than a dozen different falls. >Quantities, sum them up! 10kgs. That is all. >Jump in the garden and grab 10kgs of stones from the rose bed to get a >notion of the total volume in existence on Earth. > >What are you waiting for? >Seen the numbers of finds and the weights, it's the same, as you would get >offered a Moon at 10$ a gram. > >That tomorrow a ton of that stuff will fall? >Unlikely, I guess. >Since the day Jacob rested his weary head on the black baethyl to dream >his dream of his ladder there were found only those few handfuls of tiny >stones. > >Please - ANSMET, NIPR, EUROMET, PRIC with all their manpower and the >primary and secondary means of maybe 1 billion together in these 31 years, >they recovered half a pound of that stuff. > >Give 10,000$ to Greg or to us and you can have another half a pound. > >That's what I call a performance. >And that's that "service to science", which sounds sometimes so solemnly, >and where about some are smiling, but nevertheless is true. > >Huh, and revilers of dry food: >Aren't these both not the best proves, that NWAs do have a "personality"? > >Eagles Nest. Found by a hunter in desert. >Reid. Found by a hunter in desert. >Hughes. Found by a hunter in desert. >NWA 3151. Found by a hunter in desert. >NWA 5471 Found by a hunter in desert. > >History reloaded! > >(Shhht have you noticed that NWA 3151 as well as NWA 5471 are looking >prettier than Eagles Nest?). > > >Quintessence of that little discussion is: > >Chladni's Heirs say: We give you the Koh-I-Noor for a dime! >The Hup??s say: We give you the Millennium Star for a nickel! > >The collectors know that. > >Hey universities, colleges - these are our sweet pills to ease your pains >of budget shortage! > >Good Morning Chicago, good morning London! Guten Morgen Wien! Bonjour Paris! >Shubh Sanyankal Calcutta! Grueziwohl Bern! Salve Vatican........ >Shhhhh, Perth, Adelaide, Victoria - homes of all brachinites are still >slumbering on the other side of the globe. O joyful awakening, addition to >the family! > >Wake up! And set for a moment these triceratops skulls, the fancy rock >crystals, the silver curls, the rubies aside. Such expensive mass stuff >you can buy in all eternity. > >Brachinites? You don't have something rarer but only today so cheap in >your collections. >And when they are gone, they're gone. > >Don't want to read as a doter your swan songs about the Golden Age of >meteorites. >You all were here, you all were informed. > >Ask NASA, ask ESA, ask IAXA - will it take a hundred years or 200 years - >until probes will hunt for the remainders of the brachinite parent bodie(s) >in space? > > >Sounds all quite exaggerated, doesn't it? > >Sorry. These are the proportions, when we're talking about brachinites. >These are the facts, when we're talking about meteorites. > >Brachinites are space exploration 2008-2050. > >And these are some and by far not all aspects, why we all and often the >professionals too, >do love and venerate our meteorites. > >Best! >Martin > > > > >-----Urspr??ngliche Nachricht----- >Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com >[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Greg Hupe >Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Dezember 2008 02:18 >An: drtanuki at yahoo.com >Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >Betreff: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 > >Hello Dirk and List, > >Dirk, since you would like to promote brachinite material, here is a little >insight you may not be aware of: > >NWA 4882 Brachinite (unpaired) - I have made private sales several months >PRIOR to Martin's public offering, at much less than their great price per >gram. I know MY customers are very happy with their greatly discounted rate! >I simply do not have time to offer all of the different and new meteorites I >have at one time publicly, AND I am not trying to interfer with their sales, >but since Dirk brought this out in what I perceive in a negative tone, here >is one heck of a Brachinite for serious collections: > >Click here to view complete slice of NWA 4882 measuring 130mm wide! > >http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882slice.jpg > > > >Click here to view complete NWA 4882 stone before cutting: > >http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882.jpg > > > >Click here to view close-up of polished NWA 4882 matrix: > >http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882closeup.jpg > > >Official Classification: >Northwest Africa 4882 > >Algeria > >Find: July 2007 > >Achondrite (brachinite) > >History: Purchased by Greg Hup?? in July 2007 from a dealer in Tagounite, >Morocco. > >Physical characteristics: Two dense, dark brown, broken rounded stones (2891 >g and 206 g) with weathered fusion crust on some original exterior surfaces >and thin desert varnish coatings on hackly broken surfaces. > >Petrography: (A. Irving and S. Kuehner, UWS) Coarse-grained rock (mostly >0.2-0.8 mm) with protogranular texture, composed predominantly of olivine >with subordinate green, Cr-bearing diopside, K-poor plagioclase, chromite, >iron sulfide, and kamacite (partially altered to iron hydroxides). >Plagioclase is interstitial to mafic silicates and is heterogeneous in >distribution. Very fine-grained (2-10 ??m), polyphase assemblages composed >mostly of orthopyroxene, Ni-bearing pyrrhotite and Ni-free metal with >variable amounts of fayalite and chromite occur around larger pyrrhotite >grains within olivine, and also as small, isolated apparent inclusions >within olivine. > >Geochemistry: Olivine (Fa35.0-35.2, FeO/MnO = 70.9-71.3), clinopyroxene >(Fs9.3Wo47.1, FeO/MnO = 38.6, Cr2O3 = 0.76wt%, Al2O3 = 1.05 wt%), >plagioclase (An32.1- 37.6Or0.3-0.5), chromite [Cr/(Cr + Al) = 0.717, Mg/(Mg >+ Fe) = 0.239, TiO2 = 0.71 wt%, ZnO = 0.30 wt%]. Oxygen isotopes: (D. >Rumble, CIW) Replicate analyses of acid-washed silicate material by laser >fluorination gave, respectively, ??18O = 2.064, 2.095; ??17O = 4.368, 4.455; >??17O = -0.234, -0.248 per mil. > >Classification: Achondrite (brachinite). > >Specimens: A total of 20.4 g of sample and one polished thin section are on >deposit at UWS. GHup?? holds the main mass (actually now in a private >collection). > > > >I sent this to a professional cutter who used a wire saw and cut these at >3mm thick and polished to a high luster. If you want a large museum quality >specimen at an even BETTER rate, be sure to contact me off list. > > > >I have already placed over half of this material into large collections, >which only leaves 15 slices and the 206g fragment. Half are the larger >slices like the one featured above. > > > >Best regards, >Greg > >==================== >Greg Hupe >The Hupe Collection >NaturesVault (eBay) >gmhupe at htn.net >www.LunarRock.com >IMCA 3163 >==================== >Click here for my current eBay auctions: >http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "drtanuki" >To: ; >Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 7:38 PM >Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD > > > > Hello Tom and List, > > I would suggest that you check out the fantastic NWA 5471 brachinite that > > Martin and Stefan are selling for a VERY REASONABLE price; more than 2 > > grams of the material instead of a thin section (you can make your own > > thin sections- several). > > > > Thank you Martin and Stefan for your very generous price for such a rare > > classification. > > > > Dirk Ross...Tokyo > > http://www.meteoritesjapan.com > > http://www.insekijapan.com > > > > > > > > --- On Tue, 12/2/08, STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com > > wrote: > > > >> From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com > >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD > >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 9:23 AM > >> Hi list members, For those who are interested in thin > >> sections. Greg has > >> been kind enough to (previously) lend me the NWA 3151 > >> Brachinite that he has > >> for sale. My micrograph article in Meteorite Times > >> December is on this thin > >> section. > >> > >> I felt obliged to say it is a wonderful sample prepared > >> splendidly! I > >> worked with it up to a magnification of 760X with great > >> results. If you are > >> thinking of adding a thin to your collection, I would > >> recommend this one and check > >> out the article. Bernd Pauli has provided me with three > >> excellent wide > >> field cross polarized light micrographs that are also > >> included. > >> > >> Tom Phillips > >> > >> In a message dated 12/1/2008 4:36:02 P.M. Mountain > >> Standard Time, > >> gmhupe at htn.net writes: > >> Dear List Members, > >> > >> It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA > >> 4223, the third > >> member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to > >> get to this point > >> of first public offering so you know the science has been > >> done! It has a TKW > >> of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed > >> through eBay's site, > >> so you can find all of the available material and > >> "Official" classification > >> of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: > >> > >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > >> > >> In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed > >> these, most at > >> reduced prices for the holidays: > >> NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) > >> NWA 1879 Mesosiderite > >> NWA 2932 Mesosiderite > >> NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot > >> NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot > >> NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section > >> NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot > >> Unclassified 2kg Lot > >> Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) > >> Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) > >> Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) > >> Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g > >> Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) > >> > >> Thank you for checking out what I have to offer, I > >> appreciate it! > >> > >> Best regards, > >> Greg > >> > >> ==================== > >> Greg Hupe > >> The Hupe Collection > >> NaturesVault (eBay) > >> gmhupe at htn.net > >> www.LunarRock.com > >> IMCA 3163 > >> ==================== > >> Click here for my current eBay auctions: > >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> ______________________________________________ > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >> > >> **************Life should be easier. So should your > >> homepage. Try the NEW > >> AOL.com. > >> > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) > >> ______________________________________________ > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Tue Dec 2 09:44:44 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 06:44:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] no pairings of the sikote-alin meteorite Message-ID: <741595.71233.qm@web57803.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Good morning list.It just has to be a mess with all these nwa pairings with these brachinite's.Well a good thing for me.I do not have any brach's in my collection,only sikote-alin's here.So no pairings will ever be a hassle for this greatest of falls.I have to take this back.I do have a piece of eagle's nest,a small fragment,but still small.But the sikote-alin meteorite is by far the best of all the non rusting irons.I do have one small question.I have a few pieces that shows lite bubbling.What would tend to cause that? Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From gmhupe at htn.net Tue Dec 2 10:02:47 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 10:02:47 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] status of NWA brachinites References: <001e01c95476$0e1a5290$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2><154443.86932.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com><001e01c95476$0e1a5290$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> <5.0.2.1.2.20081202142351.02a6a008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Message-ID: <464A232A28564398AFCBD71B889E2B2A@Gregor> Hello Zelimir, NWA 4882: Here is the statement I see in the Bulletin: "Classification: Achondrite (brachinite). This specimen (NWA 4882) is very similar in external appearance, texture, and mineral compositions to NWA 4969, with which it may be paired (Wittke et al. 2008). It also is very similar to NWA 3151 in texture, olivine, and plagioclase compositions, and patterns of staining around metal (Irving et al. 2005). However, the clinopyroxenes in these two specimens have somewhat different compositions, and NWA 3151 contains much less plagioclase and lacks the distinctive polyphase assemblages found in NWA 4882." I see they state NWA 4696 "may" be paired to NWA 4882. They do show that those two are not paired to NWA 3151. Concerning NWA 595, here is a link to an abstract that illustrates that it is actually not a brachinite: http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/metsoc2005/pdf/5213.pdf I hope this helps! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zelimir Gabelica" To: "Martin Altmann" ; Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 9:20 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] status of NWA brachinites Hi Martin, I fully agree. To be complete, here is what I have in my archives: ..."NWA 4969 (BRA, Algeria, tkw = 1 at 180 g) from Marcin, is paired with NWA 4882 (Algeria, from Hup?'s, BRA, tkw = 2@ 3096 g), but apparently not with NWA 3151 (BRA, Hup?'s, tkw = 1 at 1500 grams), nor with NWXA 5191 (1 at 26.5 g) With the new NWA 5471 from Heir's, this indeed makes 4 brachinites from the "NWA" vast strewnfield. However, in Met. Bull. database, we find the following brachinites from "NWA", this better completing the picture: NWA 595 (Cottingham, Morocco (?), 1 at 196 g) NWA 3151 (Hup?'s, NWA (Morocco ?), 1 at 1500 g) NWA 4872 (Aaronson, Algeria, 1 at 3000 g) NWA 4874 (Aaronson, Algeria, 1 at 28 g) (can it be paired with NWA 4872 above ???) NWA 4876 (anonymous, NWA ( Morocco ?), 1 at 130 g NWA 4882 (G. Hup?, Algeria, 2 at 3096 g) NWA 4969 (M. Cimala, NWA (Morocco ?), 1 at 180 g NWA 5191 (anonymous, found in Morocco desert, 1 at 26.5, said to be paired with NWA 3151, thus suggesting this latter was also found in Morocco NWA 5471 (C. Heir's, Morocco (??), 1 (??)@538 g, paired with ???? (not yet in Met. Bull.) ---------- Total: not copunting pairings, we find 9 different meteorite names (NWA numbers), probably 10 separate pieces, totalling 8694,5 grams Question: How far are these data (Met Bulll database + NWA 5471) correct and complete ? Who can complete, possibly remove the ???'s and add comments about pairings, so that we all can update our archives regarding NWA brachinites? Bernd? Greg ? Marcin ? Martin ? or Jeff ? Thanks and best wishes, Zelimir A 13:40 02/12/2008 +0100, Martin Altmann a ?crit : >Oooops, little correction, was in a brachinite flush. > >Must be NWA 4882 not 3151. > >But NWA 3151 is cool stuff too. >And Marcin's NWA 4969. > >Take them all. All are the money well worth. > >So, something forgotten? > >Crazy. To be able to buy 5 brachinites in one day. >Never happened before in history. > >Best >Martin > >-----Urspr??ngliche Nachricht----- >Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com >[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Martin >Altmann >Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Dezember 2008 13:04 >An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 > >Good Morning list, > >and ooops what's going on? > >I'm sure Dirk wanted to express his enthusiasm rather than to offend >someone. > >Friends! Brachinites! Can you have too many of them in the collection??? >There are so few finds, such a tiny batch of material and yet they are so >diverse and heterogeneous, that brachinites are still a really enigmatic >class. > >Always a good read, David Weir's Studies: >http://www.meteoritestudies.com/ > >When we decided to blow our NWA 5471, no matter whether it was the main >mass or small-budget-sizes, the price-finding was simple. We checked the >prices on the dealers' pages and the results on ebay of the few pieces >offered there, to be sure, to have a silly low price. > >Check it by your own. >200$ a gram is affordable standard; >everything below 200$ is a good buy; >everything below 150$ is a bargain; >everything below 100$ is a MUST and a categorical imperative. > >So we made 65$ a gram as a gift. > >Now Greg tells us, that his NWA 3151 is available at an even lower rate! > >What are the consequences? Good heavens - Buy them! Buy a NWA 3151, buy a >NWA 5471, if you have already a 3151, take additionally a 5471, if you own >a 5471, add a 3151. What are you waiting for, prices went silly! >Bah, prices are in ruin > Matteo 27:4 > >Follow me. Why "silly"? > >Stats, stats, stats! > >Use the formidable instrument of the Meteoritical Bulletin Database: >http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php > >Nineteen (including ours not listed yet) finds and numbers. >Pairing indications often mentioned in the descriptions, >hence probably we're talking about less than a dozen different falls. >Quantities, sum them up! 10kgs. That is all. >Jump in the garden and grab 10kgs of stones from the rose bed to get a >notion of the total volume in existence on Earth. > >What are you waiting for? >Seen the numbers of finds and the weights, it's the same, as you would get >offered a Moon at 10$ a gram. > >That tomorrow a ton of that stuff will fall? >Unlikely, I guess. >Since the day Jacob rested his weary head on the black baethyl to dream his >dream of his ladder there were found only those few handfuls of tiny >stones. > >Please - ANSMET, NIPR, EUROMET, PRIC with all their manpower and the >primary and secondary means of maybe 1 billion together in these 31 years, >they recovered half a pound of that stuff. > >Give 10,000$ to Greg or to us and you can have another half a pound. > >That's what I call a performance. >And that's that "service to science", which sounds sometimes so solemnly, >and where about some are smiling, but nevertheless is true. > >Huh, and revilers of dry food: >Aren't these both not the best proves, that NWAs do have a "personality"? > >Eagles Nest. Found by a hunter in desert. >Reid. Found by a hunter in desert. >Hughes. Found by a hunter in desert. >NWA 3151. Found by a hunter in desert. >NWA 5471 Found by a hunter in desert. > >History reloaded! > >(Shhht have you noticed that NWA 3151 as well as NWA 5471 are looking >prettier than Eagles Nest?). > > >Quintessence of that little discussion is: > >Chladni's Heirs say: We give you the Koh-I-Noor for a dime! >The Hup??s say: We give you the Millennium Star for a nickel! > >The collectors know that. > >Hey universities, colleges - these are our sweet pills to ease your pains >of budget shortage! > >Good Morning Chicago, good morning London! Guten Morgen Wien! Bonjour >Paris! >Shubh Sanyankal Calcutta! Grueziwohl Bern! Salve Vatican........ >Shhhhh, Perth, Adelaide, Victoria - homes of all brachinites are still >slumbering on the other side of the globe. O joyful awakening, addition to >the family! > >Wake up! And set for a moment these triceratops skulls, the fancy rock >crystals, the silver curls, the rubies aside. Such expensive mass stuff you >can buy in all eternity. > >Brachinites? You don't have something rarer but only today so cheap in your >collections. >And when they are gone, they're gone. > >Don't want to read as a doter your swan songs about the Golden Age of >meteorites. >You all were here, you all were informed. > >Ask NASA, ask ESA, ask IAXA - will it take a hundred years or 200 years - >until probes will hunt for the remainders of the brachinite parent bodie(s) >in space? > > >Sounds all quite exaggerated, doesn't it? > >Sorry. These are the proportions, when we're talking about brachinites. >These are the facts, when we're talking about meteorites. > >Brachinites are space exploration 2008-2050. > >And these are some and by far not all aspects, why we all and often the >professionals too, >do love and venerate our meteorites. > >Best! >Martin > > > > >-----Urspr??ngliche Nachricht----- >Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com >[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Greg >Hupe >Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Dezember 2008 02:18 >An: drtanuki at yahoo.com >Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >Betreff: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 > >Hello Dirk and List, > >Dirk, since you would like to promote brachinite material, here is a little >insight you may not be aware of: > >NWA 4882 Brachinite (unpaired) - I have made private sales several months >PRIOR to Martin's public offering, at much less than their great price per >gram. I know MY customers are very happy with their greatly discounted >rate! >I simply do not have time to offer all of the different and new meteorites >I >have at one time publicly, AND I am not trying to interfer with their >sales, >but since Dirk brought this out in what I perceive in a negative tone, here >is one heck of a Brachinite for serious collections: > >Click here to view complete slice of NWA 4882 measuring 130mm wide! > >http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882slice.jpg > > > >Click here to view complete NWA 4882 stone before cutting: > >http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882.jpg > > > >Click here to view close-up of polished NWA 4882 matrix: > >http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882closeup.jpg > > >Official Classification: >Northwest Africa 4882 > >Algeria > >Find: July 2007 > >Achondrite (brachinite) > >History: Purchased by Greg Hup?? in July 2007 from a dealer in Tagounite, >Morocco. > >Physical characteristics: Two dense, dark brown, broken rounded stones >(2891 >g and 206 g) with weathered fusion crust on some original exterior surfaces >and thin desert varnish coatings on hackly broken surfaces. > >Petrography: (A. Irving and S. Kuehner, UWS) Coarse-grained rock (mostly >0.2-0.8 mm) with protogranular texture, composed predominantly of olivine >with subordinate green, Cr-bearing diopside, K-poor plagioclase, chromite, >iron sulfide, and kamacite (partially altered to iron hydroxides). >Plagioclase is interstitial to mafic silicates and is heterogeneous in >distribution. Very fine-grained (2-10 ??m), polyphase assemblages composed >mostly of orthopyroxene, Ni-bearing pyrrhotite and Ni-free metal with >variable amounts of fayalite and chromite occur around larger pyrrhotite >grains within olivine, and also as small, isolated apparent inclusions >within olivine. > >Geochemistry: Olivine (Fa35.0-35.2, FeO/MnO = 70.9-71.3), clinopyroxene >(Fs9.3Wo47.1, FeO/MnO = 38.6, Cr2O3 = 0.76wt%, Al2O3 = 1.05 wt%), >plagioclase (An32.1- 37.6Or0.3-0.5), chromite [Cr/(Cr + Al) = 0.717, Mg/(Mg >+ Fe) = 0.239, TiO2 = 0.71 wt%, ZnO = 0.30 wt%]. Oxygen isotopes: (D. >Rumble, CIW) Replicate analyses of acid-washed silicate material by laser >fluorination gave, respectively, ??18O = 2.064, 2.095; ??17O = 4.368, >4.455; >?"17O = -0.234, -0.248 per mil. > >Classification: Achondrite (brachinite). > >Specimens: A total of 20.4 g of sample and one polished thin section are on >deposit at UWS. GHup?? holds the main mass (actually now in a private >collection). > > > >I sent this to a professional cutter who used a wire saw and cut these at >3mm thick and polished to a high luster. If you want a large museum quality >specimen at an even BETTER rate, be sure to contact me off list. > > > >I have already placed over half of this material into large collections, >which only leaves 15 slices and the 206g fragment. Half are the larger >slices like the one featured above. > > > >Best regards, >Greg > >==================== >Greg Hupe >The Hupe Collection >NaturesVault (eBay) >gmhupe at htn.net >www.LunarRock.com >IMCA 3163 >==================== >Click here for my current eBay auctions: >http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "drtanuki" >To: ; >Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 7:38 PM >Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD > > > > Hello Tom and List, > > I would suggest that you check out the fantastic NWA 5471 brachinite > > that > > Martin and Stefan are selling for a VERY REASONABLE price; more than 2 > > grams of the material instead of a thin section (you can make your own > > thin sections- several). > > > > Thank you Martin and Stefan for your very generous price for such a > > rare > > classification. > > > > Dirk Ross...Tokyo > > http://www.meteoritesjapan.com > > http://www.insekijapan.com > > > > > > > > --- On Tue, 12/2/08, STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com > > wrote: > > > >> From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com > >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD > >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 9:23 AM > >> Hi list members, For those who are interested in thin > >> sections. Greg has > >> been kind enough to (previously) lend me the NWA 3151 > >> Brachinite that he has > >> for sale. My micrograph article in Meteorite Times > >> December is on this thin > >> section. > >> > >> I felt obliged to say it is a wonderful sample prepared > >> splendidly! I > >> worked with it up to a magnification of 760X with great > >> results. If you are > >> thinking of adding a thin to your collection, I would > >> recommend this one and check > >> out the article. Bernd Pauli has provided me with three > >> excellent wide > >> field cross polarized light micrographs that are also > >> included. > >> > >> Tom Phillips > >> > >> In a message dated 12/1/2008 4:36:02 P.M. Mountain > >> Standard Time, > >> gmhupe at htn.net writes: > >> Dear List Members, > >> > >> It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA > >> 4223, the third > >> member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to > >> get to this point > >> of first public offering so you know the science has been > >> done! It has a TKW > >> of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed > >> through eBay's site, > >> so you can find all of the available material and > >> "Official" classification > >> of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: > >> > >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > >> > >> In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed > >> these, most at > >> reduced prices for the holidays: > >> NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) > >> NWA 1879 Mesosiderite > >> NWA 2932 Mesosiderite > >> NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot > >> NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot > >> NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section > >> NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot > >> Unclassified 2kg Lot > >> Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) > >> Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) > >> Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) > >> Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g > >> Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) > >> > >> Thank you for checking out what I have to offer, I > >> appreciate it! > >> > >> Best regards, > >> Greg > >> > >> ==================== > >> Greg Hupe > >> The Hupe Collection > >> NaturesVault (eBay) > >> gmhupe at htn.net > >> www.LunarRock.com > >> IMCA 3163 > >> ==================== > >> Click here for my current eBay auctions: > >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> ______________________________________________ > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >> > >> **************Life should be easier. So should your > >> homepage. Try the NEW > >> AOL.com. > >> > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) > >> ______________________________________________ > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr Tue Dec 2 10:15:05 2008 From: Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr (Zelimir Gabelica) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 16:15:05 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] status of NWA brachinites In-Reply-To: <464A232A28564398AFCBD71B889E2B2A@Gregor> References: <001e01c95476$0e1a5290$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> <154443.86932.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <001e01c95476$0e1a5290$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> <5.0.2.1.2.20081202142351.02a6a008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20081202160811.02b6f008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Yep Greg, you are fully right. I just made a wrong recopy from the database. Sorry for that. Even if NWA brachinites are not so numerous, it is easy to make confusions. Regarding NWA 595, this is new to me, though, as Met. Soc. member, I do have all the MAPS issues. Strange that, after this rather official statement (MAPS abstract), nobody brought corrections to the Met Bull data... Thanks a lot, yest it greatly helps. Best, Zelimir A 10:02 02/12/2008 -0500, Greg Hupe a ?crit : >Hello Zelimir, > >NWA 4882: Here is the statement I see in the Bulletin: >"Classification: Achondrite (brachinite). This specimen (NWA 4882) is very >similar in external appearance, texture, and mineral compositions to NWA >4969, with which it may be paired (Wittke et al. 2008). It also is very >similar to NWA 3151 in texture, olivine, and plagioclase compositions, and >patterns of staining around metal (Irving et al. 2005). However, the >clinopyroxenes in these two specimens have somewhat different >compositions, and NWA 3151 contains much less plagioclase and lacks the >distinctive polyphase assemblages found in NWA 4882." > >I see they state NWA 4696 "may" be paired to NWA 4882. They do show that >those two are not paired to NWA 3151. > >Concerning NWA 595, here is a link to an abstract that illustrates that it >is actually not a brachinite: >http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/metsoc2005/pdf/5213.pdf > >I hope this helps! > >Best regards, >Greg > >==================== >Greg Hupe >The Hupe Collection >NaturesVault (eBay) >gmhupe at htn.net >www.LunarRock.com >IMCA 3163 >==================== >Click here for my current eBay auctions: >http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > > >----- Original Message ----- From: "Zelimir Gabelica" > >To: "Martin Altmann" ; > >Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 9:20 AM >Subject: [meteorite-list] status of NWA brachinites > > >Hi Martin, > >I fully agree. > >To be complete, here is what I have in my archives: > >..."NWA 4969 (BRA, Algeria, tkw = 1 at 180 g) from Marcin, is paired with NWA >4882 (Algeria, from Hup?'s, BRA, tkw = 2@ 3096 g), but apparently not with >NWA 3151 (BRA, Hup?'s, tkw = 1 at 1500 grams), nor with NWXA 5191 (1 at 26.5 g) > >With the new NWA 5471 from Heir's, this indeed makes 4 brachinites from >the "NWA" vast strewnfield. > >However, in Met. Bull. database, we find the following brachinites from >"NWA", this better completing the picture: > >NWA 595 (Cottingham, Morocco (?), 1 at 196 g) >NWA 3151 (Hup?'s, NWA (Morocco ?), 1 at 1500 g) >NWA 4872 (Aaronson, Algeria, 1 at 3000 g) >NWA 4874 (Aaronson, Algeria, 1 at 28 g) (can it be paired with NWA 4872 above >???) >NWA 4876 (anonymous, NWA ( Morocco ?), 1 at 130 g >NWA 4882 (G. Hup?, Algeria, 2 at 3096 g) >NWA 4969 (M. Cimala, NWA (Morocco ?), 1 at 180 g >NWA 5191 (anonymous, found in Morocco desert, 1 at 26.5, said to be paired >with NWA 3151, thus suggesting this latter was also found in Morocco > >NWA 5471 (C. Heir's, Morocco (??), 1 (??)@538 g, paired with ???? (not yet >in Met. Bull.) >---------- >Total: not copunting pairings, we find 9 different meteorite names (NWA >numbers), probably 10 separate pieces, totalling 8694,5 grams > >Question: How far are these data (Met Bulll database + NWA 5471) correct >and complete ? > >Who can complete, possibly remove the ???'s and add comments about >pairings, so that we all can update our archives regarding NWA brachinites? > >Bernd? Greg ? Marcin ? Martin ? or Jeff ? > >Thanks and best wishes, > >Zelimir > > > >A 13:40 02/12/2008 +0100, Martin Altmann a ?crit : >>Oooops, little correction, was in a brachinite flush. >> >>Must be NWA 4882 not 3151. >> >>But NWA 3151 is cool stuff too. >>And Marcin's NWA 4969. >> >>Take them all. All are the money well worth. >> >>So, something forgotten? >> >>Crazy. To be able to buy 5 brachinites in one day. >>Never happened before in history. >> >>Best >>Martin >> >>-----Urspr??ngliche Nachricht----- >>Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com >>[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von >>Martin Altmann >>Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Dezember 2008 13:04 >>An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 >> >>Good Morning list, >> >>and ooops what's going on? >> >>I'm sure Dirk wanted to express his enthusiasm rather than to offend someone. >> >>Friends! Brachinites! Can you have too many of them in the collection??? >>There are so few finds, such a tiny batch of material and yet they are so >>diverse and heterogeneous, that brachinites are still a really enigmatic class. >> >>Always a good read, David Weir's Studies: http://www.meteoritestudies.com/ >> >>When we decided to blow our NWA 5471, no matter whether it was the main >>mass or small-budget-sizes, the price-finding was simple. We checked the >>prices on the dealers' pages and the results on ebay of the few pieces >>offered there, to be sure, to have a silly low price. >> >>Check it by your own. >>200$ a gram is affordable standard; >>everything below 200$ is a good buy; >>everything below 150$ is a bargain; >>everything below 100$ is a MUST and a categorical imperative. >> >>So we made 65$ a gram as a gift. >> >>Now Greg tells us, that his NWA 3151 is available at an even lower rate! >> >>What are the consequences? Good heavens - Buy them! Buy a NWA 3151, buy a >>NWA 5471, if you have already a 3151, take additionally a 5471, if you >>own a 5471, add a 3151. What are you waiting for, prices went silly! >>Bah, prices are in ruin >> Matteo 27:4 >> >>Follow me. Why "silly"? >> >>Stats, stats, stats! >> >>Use the formidable instrument of the Meteoritical Bulletin Database: >>http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php >> >>Nineteen (including ours not listed yet) finds and numbers. >>Pairing indications often mentioned in the descriptions, >>hence probably we're talking about less than a dozen different falls. >>Quantities, sum them up! 10kgs. That is all. >>Jump in the garden and grab 10kgs of stones from the rose bed to get a >>notion of the total volume in existence on Earth. >> >>What are you waiting for? >>Seen the numbers of finds and the weights, it's the same, as you would >>get offered a Moon at 10$ a gram. >> >>That tomorrow a ton of that stuff will fall? >>Unlikely, I guess. >>Since the day Jacob rested his weary head on the black baethyl to dream >>his dream of his ladder there were found only those few handfuls of tiny >>stones. >> >>Please - ANSMET, NIPR, EUROMET, PRIC with all their manpower and the >>primary and secondary means of maybe 1 billion together in these 31 years, >>they recovered half a pound of that stuff. >> >>Give 10,000$ to Greg or to us and you can have another half a pound. >> >>That's what I call a performance. >>And that's that "service to science", which sounds sometimes so solemnly, >>and where about some are smiling, but nevertheless is true. >> >>Huh, and revilers of dry food: >>Aren't these both not the best proves, that NWAs do have a "personality"? >> >>Eagles Nest. Found by a hunter in desert. >>Reid. Found by a hunter in desert. >>Hughes. Found by a hunter in desert. >>NWA 3151. Found by a hunter in desert. >>NWA 5471 Found by a hunter in desert. >> >>History reloaded! >> >>(Shhht have you noticed that NWA 3151 as well as NWA 5471 are looking >>prettier than Eagles Nest?). >> >> >>Quintessence of that little discussion is: >> >>Chladni's Heirs say: We give you the Koh-I-Noor for a dime! >>The Hup??s say: We give you the Millennium Star for a nickel! >> >>The collectors know that. >> >>Hey universities, colleges - these are our sweet pills to ease your pains >>of budget shortage! >> >>Good Morning Chicago, good morning London! Guten Morgen Wien! Bonjour Paris! >>Shubh Sanyankal Calcutta! Grueziwohl Bern! Salve Vatican........ >>Shhhhh, Perth, Adelaide, Victoria - homes of all brachinites are still >>slumbering on the other side of the globe. O joyful awakening, addition >>to the family! >> >>Wake up! And set for a moment these triceratops skulls, the fancy rock >>crystals, the silver curls, the rubies aside. Such expensive mass stuff >>you can buy in all eternity. >> >>Brachinites? You don't have something rarer but only today so cheap in >>your collections. >>And when they are gone, they're gone. >> >>Don't want to read as a doter your swan songs about the Golden Age of >>meteorites. >>You all were here, you all were informed. >> >>Ask NASA, ask ESA, ask IAXA - will it take a hundred years or 200 years - >>until probes will hunt for the remainders of the brachinite parent bodie(s) >>in space? >> >> >>Sounds all quite exaggerated, doesn't it? >> >>Sorry. These are the proportions, when we're talking about brachinites. >>These are the facts, when we're talking about meteorites. >> >>Brachinites are space exploration 2008-2050. >> >>And these are some and by far not all aspects, why we all and often the >>professionals too, >>do love and venerate our meteorites. >> >>Best! >>Martin >> >> >> >> >>-----Urspr??ngliche Nachricht----- >>Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com >>[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Greg Hupe >>Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Dezember 2008 02:18 >>An: drtanuki at yahoo.com >>Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>Betreff: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 >> >>Hello Dirk and List, >> >>Dirk, since you would like to promote brachinite material, here is a little >>insight you may not be aware of: >> >>NWA 4882 Brachinite (unpaired) - I have made private sales several months >>PRIOR to Martin's public offering, at much less than their great price per >>gram. I know MY customers are very happy with their greatly discounted rate! >>I simply do not have time to offer all of the different and new meteorites I >>have at one time publicly, AND I am not trying to interfer with their sales, >>but since Dirk brought this out in what I perceive in a negative tone, here >>is one heck of a Brachinite for serious collections: >> >>Click here to view complete slice of NWA 4882 measuring 130mm wide! >> >>http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882slice.jpg >> >> >> >>Click here to view complete NWA 4882 stone before cutting: >> >>http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882.jpg >> >> >> >>Click here to view close-up of polished NWA 4882 matrix: >> >>http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882closeup.jpg >> >> >>Official Classification: >>Northwest Africa 4882 >> >>Algeria >> >>Find: July 2007 >> >>Achondrite (brachinite) >> >>History: Purchased by Greg Hup?? in July 2007 from a dealer in Tagounite, >>Morocco. >> >>Physical characteristics: Two dense, dark brown, broken rounded stones (2891 >>g and 206 g) with weathered fusion crust on some original exterior surfaces >>and thin desert varnish coatings on hackly broken surfaces. >> >>Petrography: (A. Irving and S. Kuehner, UWS) Coarse-grained rock (mostly >>0.2-0.8 mm) with protogranular texture, composed predominantly of olivine >>with subordinate green, Cr-bearing diopside, K-poor plagioclase, chromite, >>iron sulfide, and kamacite (partially altered to iron hydroxides). >>Plagioclase is interstitial to mafic silicates and is heterogeneous in >>distribution. Very fine-grained (2-10 ??m), polyphase assemblages composed >>mostly of orthopyroxene, Ni-bearing pyrrhotite and Ni-free metal with >>variable amounts of fayalite and chromite occur around larger pyrrhotite >>grains within olivine, and also as small, isolated apparent inclusions >>within olivine. >> >>Geochemistry: Olivine (Fa35.0-35.2, FeO/MnO = 70.9-71.3), clinopyroxene >>(Fs9.3Wo47.1, FeO/MnO = 38.6, Cr2O3 = 0.76wt%, Al2O3 = 1.05 wt%), >>plagioclase (An32.1- 37.6Or0.3-0.5), chromite [Cr/(Cr + Al) = 0.717, Mg/(Mg >>+ Fe) = 0.239, TiO2 = 0.71 wt%, ZnO = 0.30 wt%]. Oxygen isotopes: (D. >>Rumble, CIW) Replicate analyses of acid-washed silicate material by laser >>fluorination gave, respectively, ??18O = 2.064, 2.095; ??17O = 4.368, 4.455; >>?"17O = -0.234, -0.248 per mil. >> >>Classification: Achondrite (brachinite). >> >>Specimens: A total of 20.4 g of sample and one polished thin section are on >>deposit at UWS. GHup?? holds the main mass (actually now in a private >>collection). >> >> >> >>I sent this to a professional cutter who used a wire saw and cut these at >>3mm thick and polished to a high luster. If you want a large museum quality >>specimen at an even BETTER rate, be sure to contact me off list. >> >> >> >>I have already placed over half of this material into large collections, >>which only leaves 15 slices and the 206g fragment. Half are the larger >>slices like the one featured above. >> >> >> >>Best regards, >>Greg >> >>==================== >>Greg Hupe >>The Hupe Collection >>NaturesVault (eBay) >>gmhupe at htn.net >>www.LunarRock.com >>IMCA 3163 >>==================== >>Click here for my current eBay auctions: >>http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> >> >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: "drtanuki" >>To: ; >>Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 7:38 PM >>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD >> >> >> > Hello Tom and List, >> > I would suggest that you check out the fantastic NWA 5471 >> brachinite > that >> > Martin and Stefan are selling for a VERY REASONABLE price; more than 2 >> > grams of the material instead of a thin section (you can make your own >> > thin sections- several). >> > >> > Thank you Martin and Stefan for your very generous price for such a > >> rare >> > classification. >> > >> > Dirk Ross...Tokyo >> > http://www.meteoritesjapan.com >> > http://www.insekijapan.com >> > >> > >> > >> > --- On Tue, 12/2/08, STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com >> > wrote: >> > >> >> From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com >> >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD >> >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> >> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 9:23 AM >> >> Hi list members, For those who are interested in thin >> >> sections. Greg has >> >> been kind enough to (previously) lend me the NWA 3151 >> >> Brachinite that he has >> >> for sale. My micrograph article in Meteorite Times >> >> December is on this thin >> >> section. >> >> >> >> I felt obliged to say it is a wonderful sample prepared >> >> splendidly! I >> >> worked with it up to a magnification of 760X with great >> >> results. If you are >> >> thinking of adding a thin to your collection, I would >> >> recommend this one and check >> >> out the article. Bernd Pauli has provided me with three >> >> excellent wide >> >> field cross polarized light micrographs that are also >> >> included. >> >> >> >> Tom Phillips >> >> >> >> In a message dated 12/1/2008 4:36:02 P.M. Mountain >> >> Standard Time, >> >> gmhupe at htn.net writes: >> >> Dear List Members, >> >> >> >> It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA >> >> 4223, the third >> >> member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to >> >> get to this point >> >> of first public offering so you know the science has been >> >> done! It has a TKW >> >> of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed >> >> through eBay's site, >> >> so you can find all of the available material and >> >> "Official" classification >> >> of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: >> >> >> >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> >> >> In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed >> >> these, most at >> >> reduced prices for the holidays: >> >> NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) >> >> NWA 1879 Mesosiderite >> >> NWA 2932 Mesosiderite >> >> NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot >> >> NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot >> >> NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section >> >> NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot >> >> Unclassified 2kg Lot >> >> Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) >> >> Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) >> >> Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) >> >> Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g >> >> Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) >> >> >> >> Thank you for checking out what I have to offer, I >> >> appreciate it! >> >> >> >> Best regards, >> >> Greg >> >> >> >> ==================== >> >> Greg Hupe >> >> The Hupe Collection >> >> NaturesVault (eBay) >> >> gmhupe at htn.net >> >> www.LunarRock.com >> >> IMCA 3163 >> >> ==================== >> >> Click here for my current eBay auctions: >> >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> >> >> **************Life should be easier. So should your >> >> homepage. Try the NEW >> >> AOL.com. >> >> >>(http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) >> >> ______________________________________________ >> >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > ______________________________________________ >> > http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> > Meteorite-list mailing list >> > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > >> >> >>______________________________________________ >>http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>Meteorite-list mailing list >>Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >>______________________________________________ >>http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>Meteorite-list mailing list >>Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >>______________________________________________ >>http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>Meteorite-list mailing list >>Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >Prof. Zelimir Gabelica >Universit? de Haute Alsace >ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, >3, Rue A. Werner, >F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France >Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 >Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From gmhupe at htn.net Tue Dec 2 10:25:38 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 10:25:38 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA Number Count - status of NWA brachinites References: <001e01c95476$0e1a5290$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> <154443.86932.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <001e01c95476$0e1a5290$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> <5.0.2.1.2.20081202142351.02a6a008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> <5.0.2.1.2.20081202160811.02b6f008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Message-ID: Hi Zelimir, One thing I forgot to mention, the NWA number count is at NWA 5480 (maybe a few more since last week). It looks like the brachinite count is what you have listed earlier, unless there are any currently under study, none that I have heard of from scientists here in the U.S. This goes to show that brachinites are still a very rare group of achondrites with a combined total of less than 9 kilos!! That is less than Lunar and Martian meteorites!!! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zelimir Gabelica" To: "Greg Hupe" Cc: Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 10:15 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] status of NWA brachinites Yep Greg, you are fully right. I just made a wrong recopy from the database. Sorry for that. Even if NWA brachinites are not so numerous, it is easy to make confusions. Regarding NWA 595, this is new to me, though, as Met. Soc. member, I do have all the MAPS issues. Strange that, after this rather official statement (MAPS abstract), nobody brought corrections to the Met Bull data... Thanks a lot, yest it greatly helps. Best, Zelimir A 10:02 02/12/2008 -0500, Greg Hupe a ?crit : >Hello Zelimir, > >NWA 4882: Here is the statement I see in the Bulletin: >"Classification: Achondrite (brachinite). This specimen (NWA 4882) is very >similar in external appearance, texture, and mineral compositions to NWA >4969, with which it may be paired (Wittke et al. 2008). It also is very >similar to NWA 3151 in texture, olivine, and plagioclase compositions, and >patterns of staining around metal (Irving et al. 2005). However, the >clinopyroxenes in these two specimens have somewhat different compositions, >and NWA 3151 contains much less plagioclase and lacks the distinctive >polyphase assemblages found in NWA 4882." > >I see they state NWA 4696 "may" be paired to NWA 4882. They do show that >those two are not paired to NWA 3151. > >Concerning NWA 595, here is a link to an abstract that illustrates that it >is actually not a brachinite: >http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/metsoc2005/pdf/5213.pdf > >I hope this helps! > >Best regards, >Greg > >==================== >Greg Hupe >The Hupe Collection >NaturesVault (eBay) >gmhupe at htn.net >www.LunarRock.com >IMCA 3163 >==================== >Click here for my current eBay auctions: >http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > > >----- Original Message ----- From: "Zelimir Gabelica" > >To: "Martin Altmann" ; > >Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 9:20 AM >Subject: [meteorite-list] status of NWA brachinites > > >Hi Martin, > >I fully agree. > >To be complete, here is what I have in my archives: > >..."NWA 4969 (BRA, Algeria, tkw = 1 at 180 g) from Marcin, is paired with NWA >4882 (Algeria, from Hup?'s, BRA, tkw = 2@ 3096 g), but apparently not with >NWA 3151 (BRA, Hup?'s, tkw = 1 at 1500 grams), nor with NWXA 5191 (1 at 26.5 g) > >With the new NWA 5471 from Heir's, this indeed makes 4 brachinites from >the "NWA" vast strewnfield. > >However, in Met. Bull. database, we find the following brachinites from >"NWA", this better completing the picture: > >NWA 595 (Cottingham, Morocco (?), 1 at 196 g) >NWA 3151 (Hup?'s, NWA (Morocco ?), 1 at 1500 g) >NWA 4872 (Aaronson, Algeria, 1 at 3000 g) >NWA 4874 (Aaronson, Algeria, 1 at 28 g) (can it be paired with NWA 4872 above >???) >NWA 4876 (anonymous, NWA ( Morocco ?), 1 at 130 g >NWA 4882 (G. Hup?, Algeria, 2 at 3096 g) >NWA 4969 (M. Cimala, NWA (Morocco ?), 1 at 180 g >NWA 5191 (anonymous, found in Morocco desert, 1 at 26.5, said to be paired >with NWA 3151, thus suggesting this latter was also found in Morocco > >NWA 5471 (C. Heir's, Morocco (??), 1 (??)@538 g, paired with ???? (not yet >in Met. Bull.) >---------- >Total: not copunting pairings, we find 9 different meteorite names (NWA >numbers), probably 10 separate pieces, totalling 8694,5 grams > >Question: How far are these data (Met Bulll database + NWA 5471) correct >and complete ? > >Who can complete, possibly remove the ???'s and add comments about >pairings, so that we all can update our archives regarding NWA brachinites? > >Bernd? Greg ? Marcin ? Martin ? or Jeff ? > >Thanks and best wishes, > >Zelimir > > > >A 13:40 02/12/2008 +0100, Martin Altmann a ?crit : >>Oooops, little correction, was in a brachinite flush. >> >>Must be NWA 4882 not 3151. >> >>But NWA 3151 is cool stuff too. >>And Marcin's NWA 4969. >> >>Take them all. All are the money well worth. >> >>So, something forgotten? >> >>Crazy. To be able to buy 5 brachinites in one day. >>Never happened before in history. >> >>Best >>Martin >> >>-----Urspr??ngliche Nachricht----- >>Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com >>[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Martin >>Altmann >>Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Dezember 2008 13:04 >>An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 >> >>Good Morning list, >> >>and ooops what's going on? >> >>I'm sure Dirk wanted to express his enthusiasm rather than to offend >>someone. >> >>Friends! Brachinites! Can you have too many of them in the collection??? >>There are so few finds, such a tiny batch of material and yet they are so >>diverse and heterogeneous, that brachinites are still a really enigmatic >>class. >> >>Always a good read, David Weir's Studies: http://www.meteoritestudies.com/ >> >>When we decided to blow our NWA 5471, no matter whether it was the main >>mass or small-budget-sizes, the price-finding was simple. We checked the >>prices on the dealers' pages and the results on ebay of the few pieces >>offered there, to be sure, to have a silly low price. >> >>Check it by your own. >>200$ a gram is affordable standard; >>everything below 200$ is a good buy; >>everything below 150$ is a bargain; >>everything below 100$ is a MUST and a categorical imperative. >> >>So we made 65$ a gram as a gift. >> >>Now Greg tells us, that his NWA 3151 is available at an even lower rate! >> >>What are the consequences? Good heavens - Buy them! Buy a NWA 3151, buy a >>NWA 5471, if you have already a 3151, take additionally a 5471, if you own >>a 5471, add a 3151. What are you waiting for, prices went silly! >>Bah, prices are in ruin >> Matteo 27:4 >> >>Follow me. Why "silly"? >> >>Stats, stats, stats! >> >>Use the formidable instrument of the Meteoritical Bulletin Database: >>http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/metbull.php >> >>Nineteen (including ours not listed yet) finds and numbers. >>Pairing indications often mentioned in the descriptions, >>hence probably we're talking about less than a dozen different falls. >>Quantities, sum them up! 10kgs. That is all. >>Jump in the garden and grab 10kgs of stones from the rose bed to get a >>notion of the total volume in existence on Earth. >> >>What are you waiting for? >>Seen the numbers of finds and the weights, it's the same, as you would get >>offered a Moon at 10$ a gram. >> >>That tomorrow a ton of that stuff will fall? >>Unlikely, I guess. >>Since the day Jacob rested his weary head on the black baethyl to dream >>his dream of his ladder there were found only those few handfuls of tiny >>stones. >> >>Please - ANSMET, NIPR, EUROMET, PRIC with all their manpower and the >>primary and secondary means of maybe 1 billion together in these 31 years, >>they recovered half a pound of that stuff. >> >>Give 10,000$ to Greg or to us and you can have another half a pound. >> >>That's what I call a performance. >>And that's that "service to science", which sounds sometimes so solemnly, >>and where about some are smiling, but nevertheless is true. >> >>Huh, and revilers of dry food: >>Aren't these both not the best proves, that NWAs do have a "personality"? >> >>Eagles Nest. Found by a hunter in desert. >>Reid. Found by a hunter in desert. >>Hughes. Found by a hunter in desert. >>NWA 3151. Found by a hunter in desert. >>NWA 5471 Found by a hunter in desert. >> >>History reloaded! >> >>(Shhht have you noticed that NWA 3151 as well as NWA 5471 are looking >>prettier than Eagles Nest?). >> >> >>Quintessence of that little discussion is: >> >>Chladni's Heirs say: We give you the Koh-I-Noor for a dime! >>The Hup??s say: We give you the Millennium Star for a nickel! >> >>The collectors know that. >> >>Hey universities, colleges - these are our sweet pills to ease your pains >>of budget shortage! >> >>Good Morning Chicago, good morning London! Guten Morgen Wien! Bonjour >>Paris! >>Shubh Sanyankal Calcutta! Grueziwohl Bern! Salve Vatican........ >>Shhhhh, Perth, Adelaide, Victoria - homes of all brachinites are still >>slumbering on the other side of the globe. O joyful awakening, addition to >>the family! >> >>Wake up! And set for a moment these triceratops skulls, the fancy rock >>crystals, the silver curls, the rubies aside. Such expensive mass stuff >>you can buy in all eternity. >> >>Brachinites? You don't have something rarer but only today so cheap in >>your collections. >>And when they are gone, they're gone. >> >>Don't want to read as a doter your swan songs about the Golden Age of >>meteorites. >>You all were here, you all were informed. >> >>Ask NASA, ask ESA, ask IAXA - will it take a hundred years or 200 years - >>until probes will hunt for the remainders of the brachinite parent >>bodie(s) >>in space? >> >> >>Sounds all quite exaggerated, doesn't it? >> >>Sorry. These are the proportions, when we're talking about brachinites. >>These are the facts, when we're talking about meteorites. >> >>Brachinites are space exploration 2008-2050. >> >>And these are some and by far not all aspects, why we all and often the >>professionals too, >>do love and venerate our meteorites. >> >>Best! >>Martin >> >> >> >> >>-----Urspr??ngliche Nachricht----- >>Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com >>[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Greg >>Hupe >>Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Dezember 2008 02:18 >>An: drtanuki at yahoo.com >>Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>Betreff: [meteorite-list] Brachinites & NWA 4882 >> >>Hello Dirk and List, >> >>Dirk, since you would like to promote brachinite material, here is a >>little >>insight you may not be aware of: >> >>NWA 4882 Brachinite (unpaired) - I have made private sales several months >>PRIOR to Martin's public offering, at much less than their great price per >>gram. I know MY customers are very happy with their greatly discounted >>rate! >>I simply do not have time to offer all of the different and new meteorites >>I >>have at one time publicly, AND I am not trying to interfer with their >>sales, >>but since Dirk brought this out in what I perceive in a negative tone, >>here >>is one heck of a Brachinite for serious collections: >> >>Click here to view complete slice of NWA 4882 measuring 130mm wide! >> >>http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882slice.jpg >> >> >> >>Click here to view complete NWA 4882 stone before cutting: >> >>http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882.jpg >> >> >> >>Click here to view close-up of polished NWA 4882 matrix: >> >>http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa4882/nwa4882closeup.jpg >> >> >>Official Classification: >>Northwest Africa 4882 >> >>Algeria >> >>Find: July 2007 >> >>Achondrite (brachinite) >> >>History: Purchased by Greg Hup?? in July 2007 from a dealer in Tagounite, >>Morocco. >> >>Physical characteristics: Two dense, dark brown, broken rounded stones >>(2891 >>g and 206 g) with weathered fusion crust on some original exterior >>surfaces >>and thin desert varnish coatings on hackly broken surfaces. >> >>Petrography: (A. Irving and S. Kuehner, UWS) Coarse-grained rock (mostly >>0.2-0.8 mm) with protogranular texture, composed predominantly of olivine >>with subordinate green, Cr-bearing diopside, K-poor plagioclase, chromite, >>iron sulfide, and kamacite (partially altered to iron hydroxides). >>Plagioclase is interstitial to mafic silicates and is heterogeneous in >>distribution. Very fine-grained (2-10 ??m), polyphase assemblages composed >>mostly of orthopyroxene, Ni-bearing pyrrhotite and Ni-free metal with >>variable amounts of fayalite and chromite occur around larger pyrrhotite >>grains within olivine, and also as small, isolated apparent inclusions >>within olivine. >> >>Geochemistry: Olivine (Fa35.0-35.2, FeO/MnO = 70.9-71.3), clinopyroxene >>(Fs9.3Wo47.1, FeO/MnO = 38.6, Cr2O3 = 0.76wt%, Al2O3 = 1.05 wt%), >>plagioclase (An32.1- 37.6Or0.3-0.5), chromite [Cr/(Cr + Al) = 0.717, >>Mg/(Mg >>+ Fe) = 0.239, TiO2 = 0.71 wt%, ZnO = 0.30 wt%]. Oxygen isotopes: (D. >>Rumble, CIW) Replicate analyses of acid-washed silicate material by laser >>fluorination gave, respectively, ??18O = 2.064, 2.095; ??17O = 4.368, >>4.455; >>?"17O = -0.234, -0.248 per mil. >> >>Classification: Achondrite (brachinite). >> >>Specimens: A total of 20.4 g of sample and one polished thin section are >>on >>deposit at UWS. GHup?? holds the main mass (actually now in a private >>collection). >> >> >> >>I sent this to a professional cutter who used a wire saw and cut these at >>3mm thick and polished to a high luster. If you want a large museum >>quality >>specimen at an even BETTER rate, be sure to contact me off list. >> >> >> >>I have already placed over half of this material into large collections, >>which only leaves 15 slices and the 206g fragment. Half are the larger >>slices like the one featured above. >> >> >> >>Best regards, >>Greg >> >>==================== >>Greg Hupe >>The Hupe Collection >>NaturesVault (eBay) >>gmhupe at htn.net >>www.LunarRock.com >>IMCA 3163 >>==================== >>Click here for my current eBay auctions: >>http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> >> >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: "drtanuki" >>To: ; >>Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 7:38 PM >>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD >> >> >> > Hello Tom and List, >> > I would suggest that you check out the fantastic NWA 5471 >> brachinite > that >> > Martin and Stefan are selling for a VERY REASONABLE price; more than 2 >> > grams of the material instead of a thin section (you can make your own >> > thin sections- several). >> > >> > Thank you Martin and Stefan for your very generous price for such a > >> rare >> > classification. >> > >> > Dirk Ross...Tokyo >> > http://www.meteoritesjapan.com >> > http://www.insekijapan.com >> > >> > >> > >> > --- On Tue, 12/2/08, STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com >> > wrote: >> > >> >> From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com >> >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD >> >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> >> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 9:23 AM >> >> Hi list members, For those who are interested in thin >> >> sections. Greg has >> >> been kind enough to (previously) lend me the NWA 3151 >> >> Brachinite that he has >> >> for sale. My micrograph article in Meteorite Times >> >> December is on this thin >> >> section. >> >> >> >> I felt obliged to say it is a wonderful sample prepared >> >> splendidly! I >> >> worked with it up to a magnification of 760X with great >> >> results. If you are >> >> thinking of adding a thin to your collection, I would >> >> recommend this one and check >> >> out the article. Bernd Pauli has provided me with three >> >> excellent wide >> >> field cross polarized light micrographs that are also >> >> included. >> >> >> >> Tom Phillips >> >> >> >> In a message dated 12/1/2008 4:36:02 P.M. Mountain >> >> Standard Time, >> >> gmhupe at htn.net writes: >> >> Dear List Members, >> >> >> >> It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA >> >> 4223, the third >> >> member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to >> >> get to this point >> >> of first public offering so you know the science has been >> >> done! It has a TKW >> >> of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed >> >> through eBay's site, >> >> so you can find all of the available material and >> >> "Official" classification >> >> of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: >> >> >> >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> >> >> In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed >> >> these, most at >> >> reduced prices for the holidays: >> >> NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) >> >> NWA 1879 Mesosiderite >> >> NWA 2932 Mesosiderite >> >> NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot >> >> NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot >> >> NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section >> >> NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot >> >> Unclassified 2kg Lot >> >> Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) >> >> Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) >> >> Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) >> >> Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g >> >> Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) >> >> >> >> Thank you for checking out what I have to offer, I >> >> appreciate it! >> >> >> >> Best regards, >> >> Greg >> >> >> >> ==================== >> >> Greg Hupe >> >> The Hupe Collection >> >> NaturesVault (eBay) >> >> gmhupe at htn.net >> >> www.LunarRock.com >> >> IMCA 3163 >> >> ==================== >> >> Click here for my current eBay auctions: >> >> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> >> >> **************Life should be easier. So should your >> >> homepage. Try the NEW >> >> AOL.com. >> >> >>(http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) >> >> ______________________________________________ >> >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > ______________________________________________ >> > http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> > Meteorite-list mailing list >> > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > >> >> >>______________________________________________ >>http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>Meteorite-list mailing list >>Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >>______________________________________________ >>http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>Meteorite-list mailing list >>Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >>______________________________________________ >>http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>Meteorite-list mailing list >>Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >Prof. Zelimir Gabelica >Universit? de Haute Alsace >ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, >3, Rue A. Werner, >F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France >Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 >Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From MeteorHntr at aol.com Tue Dec 2 11:06:07 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 11:06:07 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] status of NWA brachinites Message-ID: Greg, and List, So, does this place NWA 595 in another group (grouplet) or would it be totally unique and anomalous, being the only representative known from it's parent body (so far)? Looking at anomalous irons, we see a list of MANY such meteorites. In fact, being "anomalous" or "unique" seems, from the collector point of view as less significant than if a rock is "grouped" with at least 4 other similar falls into an officially named group. It would be impossible for a collector to collect one of every group AND one of every anomalous meteorite. So is this the logic behind a prejudice against non-grouped meteorites with collectors? If RARITY was a key factor in values, wouldn't now NWA 595 spike very high in value above what it was when it was thought to be a Brachinite? It is now unique. It is now not one of 10 other Brachintes, but it is now 1 of 1 known of an extremely low TKW from a different parent body. Is NWA 595 now LESS valuable to science since it is not grouped with Brachinites? I would think it is now MORE valuable to science. So, should it become more valuable collectors as well? OK, I can kind of see the lack of increased commercial values with anomalous irons, in that science isn't doing as much research with irons as with achondrites. And with no thin sections of irons, it is very hard to see or appreciate unique features that make ungrouped irons "special" or "different." But with the unique achondrites, and the unique chondrites I think they should be more valuable. If someone had a unique Silver Dollar, Ferrari, or dinosaur skeleton it would be worth more, so why not with meteorites? Of course, as a dealer and as a marketer myself, I can appreciate when a dealer will "romance" what they have. And when more and more of something previously (more) rare is diluted (say with a 5th of the same thing being found) and a new "group" is formed, then one should spin the positive with the "news" of the new group being formed. ;-) And, yes, as a new group is formed, there is usually at least one new research paper churned out to at least announce the occasion and the new name of the group. So, I can see why all of a sudden some people would want at least a representative sample from the new group, especially if they are a collector that collects one from each recognized group. And the more dealers that are romancing their particular specimen from a new group the more chatter there is in the community of collectors. But, in the case of Brachinites, that group has been recognized for some time, so it isn't really a "new" one. So, can anyone help me understand this a little better? Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com In a message dated 12/2/2008 9:16:35 A.M. Central Standard Time, Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr writes: Yep Greg, you are fully right. I just made a wrong recopy from the database. Sorry for that. Even if NWA brachinites are not so numerous, it is easy to make confusions. Regarding NWA 595, this is new to me, though, as Met. Soc. member, I do have all the MAPS issues. Strange that, after this rather official statement (MAPS abstract), nobody brought corrections to the Met Bull data... Thanks a lot, yest it greatly helps. Best, Zelimir **************Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try the NEW AOL.com. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) From MeteorHntr at aol.com Tue Dec 2 11:14:33 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 11:14:33 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Unique Achondrites Message-ID: Hey Guys, Speaking of Ungrouped Achondrites, is there a nice comprehensive list of Unique or ungrouped achondrites? Is there a list of "less than 5 member grouped" (or potentially future grouped) achondrites or chondrites for that matter? I was thinking that Coolidge was a carbonaceous chondrite in a grouplet of 4, waiting for the 5th to show up to give it it's own official and named group within the Carbonaceous Chondrite Class. What are the others that may not be unique but not yet officially grouped yet? If becoming grouped actually helps the value of a meteorite go up, should we expect Coolidge to spike in value soon? Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com **************Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try the NEW AOL.com. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) From mikewren at gilanet.com Tue Dec 2 11:29:09 2008 From: mikewren at gilanet.com (michael cottingham) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 09:29:09 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Auction Highlights Some Ending Today, Some Tomorrow! References: <964C19B1-5B73-4712-8B62-728F2F8F2D8B@gilanet.com> Message-ID: <041C91D6-04DB-48C6-9488-B59748805AAB@gilanet.com> > Hello, Worth A Look! > >> >> Store Link For All: >> >> http://stores.ebay.com/voyage-botanica-natural-history >> >> >> >> Special Highlights: >> >> METEORITE Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 20.48g >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280442107 >> >> METEORITE NWA 2621, L4, Really Nice, 206 gram CS >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280441048 >> >> Very Rare Brachinite, NWA 3151, 0.348 gram, nice specimen! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280427033 >> >> Awesome"Hammer Stone" WORDEN, Michigan, .358g >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280422643 >> >> Beautiful MORASKO, Poland, IAB, 1136g End Cut, A real deal for the >> price! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280531242 >> >> BRENHAM, Siderite From Kansas, 14.72 gram, Check this one out! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280427026 >> >> Very Beautiful FUKANG, Pallasite 18.03 gram, LAST ONE I HAVE! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280427010 >> >> Rare Ungrouped OC3, NWA 4294, 3.74 gram >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280424590 >> >> Superb Campo Del Cielo Complete Slice, 582g, A Really Nice Slice! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280422649 >> >> Beautiful L3, SAHARA 02500, 65.63 gram, My last slice to offer! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280422640 >> >> Super Rare GEORGETOWN, Australia, 12.89 gram, Down to my last! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278532483 >> >> Beautiful Flight Oriented Gao-Guenie, H5, 16g >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278533724 >> >> Ungrouped Ataxite, DRONINO, Russia, 850g, nice endcut! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277463181 >> >> (NEW) NWA 4851, L6 With Shock Lines, 38 Gram, A real beauty! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278531242 >> >> Very Rare and Beautiful, NWA 801, CR2, 6.00g, Check This One Out! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277236027 >> >> A very Rare EL3 From Africa, NWA 2965, 216g... >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277236018 >> >> RARE, SILVERTON, Texas, H4, LTKW, 0.61 gram, I only have a couple... >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277236002 >> >> Meteorite (NEW), NWA 4953, L/LL6, LKW, 44.29 gram >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278534257 >> >> Beautiful GIBEON, IVA Iron Specimen, 432g, A Super Deal! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280533830 >> >> METEORITE CANYON DIABLO Individual, 170 gram... >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278535428 >> >> (New) Martian Shergottite, NWA 4925, "Mars"... >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278531866 >> >> Superb CHICO, NM, L6 Impact Melt Breccia, 70g, This is a Prime >> Slice from this Meteorite >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280540354 >> >> Meteorite (New) NWA 4734, Lunar Specimen Display! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277536177 >> >> METEORITE A Beautiful Sikhote-Alin, IIAB Iron, 510g, This is a >> Great Deal for a slice this nice! >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280535281 >> >> If You Got The Cash...invest in this one! >> METEORITE Complete Slice of DAR AL GANI 400, Lunar, 33g >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280547533 >> Classic GOLD BASIN, Arizona, L4, 17.25 gram http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277236009 (New) Martian Shergottite, NWA 4925, "Mars" http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278531866 and sooooooo many others to check out! >> >> >> Best Wishes and Thanks >> >> Michael Cottingham >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com Tue Dec 2 11:46:27 2008 From: joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com (JoshuaTreeMuseum) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 11:46:27 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay Issues Message-ID: <174A125DB0DA44628E83AF51DD24FAA6@ET> Hi Brian, McKinney, Listoids: eBay, like rock & roll, will never die. It's the greatest platform for buying and selling meteorites the world has ever seen. Everything else too. Before eBay, where could the Average Joe go to buy his stones? After eBay buys Craigslist, (it already owns all the European Craigslist sites and is a major owner of Cl) it will become the final vestige of the free enterprise system, (along with Wal-Mart.) eBay has always had bugs, like when it sputters when you're listing and you have to redo the auction. I use eBay heavily daily and I haven't seen the slowdown others are talking about. Maybe it's increased usage for the holiday season overloading and bottlenecking the bandwith? eBay has been sort of screwing the sellers lately, but they'll come around and realize who it is that's giving them all that money! Just my plug nickel's worth! Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth & Space Museum Lakeville, IN From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Tue Dec 2 12:36:27 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 09:36:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] NASA Finishes Listening for Phoenix Mars Lander Message-ID: <200812021736.JAA22405@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/release.php?ArticleID=1964 NASA Finishes Listening for Phoenix Mars Lander Jet Propulsion Laboratory December 01, 2008 PASADENA, Calif. -- After nearly a month of daily checks to determine whether Martian NASA's Phoenix Mars Lander would be able to communicate again, the agency has stopped using its Mars orbiters to hail the lander and listen for its beep. As expected, reduced daily sunshine eventually left the solar-powered Phoenix craft without enough energy to keep its batteries charged. The final communication from Phoenix remains a brief signal received via NASA's Mars Odyssey orbiter on Nov. 2. The Phoenix lander operated for two overtime months after achieving its science goals during its original three-month mission. It landed on a Martian arctic plain on May 25. "The variability of the Martian weather was a contributing factor to our loss of communications, and we were hoping that another variation in weather might give us an opportunity to contact the lander again," said Phoenix Mission Manager Chris Lewicki of NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. The end of efforts to listen for Phoenix with Odyssey and NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter had been planned for the start of solar conjunction, when communications between Earth and Mars-orbiting spacecraft are minimized for a few weeks. That period, when the sun is close to the line between Earth and Mars, has begun and will last until mid-December. The last attempt to listen for a signal from Phoenix was when Odyssey passed overhead at 3:49 p.m. PST Saturday, Nov. 29 (4:26 p.m. local Mars solar time on the 182nd Martian day, or sol, since Phoenix landed). Nov. 29 was selected weeks ago as the final date for relay monitoring of Phoenix because it provided several weeks to the chance to confirm the fate of the lander, and it coincided with the beginning of solar conjunction operations for the orbiters. When they come out of the conjunction period, weather on far-northern Mars will be far colder, and the declining sunshine will have ruled out any chance of hearing from Phoenix. The Phoenix mission is led by Peter Smith of the University of Arizona, Tucson, with project management at JPL and development partnership at Lockheed Martin, Denver. International contributions come from the Canadian Space Agency; the University of Neuchatel, Switzerland; the universities of Copenhagen and Aarhus in Denmark; the Max Planck Institute in Germany; the Finnish Meteorological Institute; and Imperial College, London. The California Institute of Technology in Pasadena manages JPL for NASA. Media contact: Guy Webster 818-354-6278 Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. Guy.Webster at jpl.nasa.gov 2008-223 From STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com Tue Dec 2 13:20:41 2008 From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com (STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 13:20:41 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 3151 Brachinite Greg's thin section Message-ID: Hi Dirk and List, I am not up to speed on the latest pairings or the going price for each. I respect a quality thin section and this NWA 3151 Brachinite thin section just that. Even if it is terrestrial basalt, a good thin section is a joy and believe me, even a Lunar thin is a disappointment if prepared poorly. (I have a few). Most people do not have the contacts to get a fine thin section prepared regardless of how much material they may have. My passion is high magnification meteorite micrographs. I like to think it is more art than science since I am working with magnification far greater than what would be used in classification determinations. Some times the structures I see are breath taking and not at all visible in standard methods. My high magnifications require great thin sections. My next Meteorite Times article is on this slide so I don't want to get in the way of Meteorite Times viewings by sharing all the shots. MT will be posted in just a few days but in the mean time, if any one wants one I will send one full size 8mp image as an attachment, The image is taken at a magnification of approximately 400X with a field of view of 0.25 mm. Very cool structure in this image. Hopefully it will make you want to see the rest. (especially the shots by Bernd Pauli. Tom Phillips In a message dated 12/1/2008 5:38:20 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, drtanuki at yahoo.com writes: Hello Tom and List, I would suggest that you check out the fantastic NWA 5471 brachinite that Martin and Stefan are selling for a VERY REASONABLE price; more than 2 grams of the material instead of a thin section (you can make your own thin sections- several). Thank you Martin and Stefan for your very generous price for such a rare classification. Dirk Ross...Tokyo http://www.meteoritesjapan.com http://www.insekijapan.com --- On Tue, 12/2/08, STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com wrote: > From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 9:23 AM > Hi list members, For those who are interested in thin > sections. Greg has > been kind enough to (previously) lend me the NWA 3151 > Brachinite that he has > for sale. My micrograph article in Meteorite Times > December is on this thin > section. > > I felt obliged to say it is a wonderful sample prepared > splendidly! I > worked with it up to a magnification of 760X with great > results. If you are > thinking of adding a thin to your collection, I would > recommend this one and check > out the article. Bernd Pauli has provided me with three > excellent wide > field cross polarized light micrographs that are also > included. > > Tom Phillips > > In a message dated 12/1/2008 4:36:02 P.M. Mountain > Standard Time, > gmhupe at htn.net writes: > Dear List Members, > > It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA > 4223, the third > member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to > get to this point > of first public offering so you know the science has been > done! It has a TKW > of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed > through eBay's site, > so you can find all of the available material and > "Official" classification > of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: > > http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed > these, most at > reduced prices for the holidays: > NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) > NWA 1879 Mesosiderite > NWA 2932 Mesosiderite > NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lot > NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot > NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section > NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot > Unclassified 2kg Lot > Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) > Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) > Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) > Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g > Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) > > Thank you for checking out what I have to offer, I > appreciate it! > > Best regards, > Greg > > ==================== > Greg Hupe > The Hupe Collection > NaturesVault (eBay) > gmhupe at htn.net > www.LunarRock.com > IMCA 3163 > ==================== > Click here for my current eBay auctions: > http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > **************Life should be easier. So should your > homepage. Try the NEW > AOL.com. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list **************Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try the NEW AOL.com. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002) From Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr Tue Dec 2 13:39:01 2008 From: Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr (Zelimir Gabelica) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 19:39:01 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] status of NWA brachinites In-Reply-To: References: <5.0.2.1.2.20081202142351.02a6a008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20081202184028.02b04ec0@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Dear Ted, Many thanks for the link. The paper by Rumble et al. (you included) is very instructive and (if I understood well), although not conclusive regarding the BRA parent body (unique or not), at least it throws much more light on the other properties that are different (but not necessarily oxygen isotopic data), for at least the 4 brachinites cited (NWA 4872, 4874, 4882 and 4969), concluding that they are (possibly ? probably?) not paired. On the other hand, pairing of NWA 5199 and 3151 was suggested (Met. Bull. database). As for NWA 595, it also seems to be a unique and different meteorite (do I conclude correctly by saying that it might even not be a brachinite since it is related, at least taking into account the 17O data, to Zag(b) and NWA 4042 (respectively "Acungr" and "BRA" (Met. Bull), although data for the latter might have been updated since ?) My question is here very similar to the conclusion Steve Arnold #1 sent realier today to the list as post. At least I am aware that the BRA-type meteorites evoqued here are still puzzling and not evident to identify unambigously. I also read with great attention the dozen or so other papers you mentioned in the link, related to other classifications and all of them are indeed very informative, even if sometimes not fully conclusive (which is what we so often must conclude from scientific research). Again, as for Steve Arnold, my questions here basically originate from a collector's point of view, meaning that we are also concerned with meteorite accurate types and their belonging (or not) to group(let)s. In other words, with their as accurate as possible classification. This does not mean that we don' appreciate the important science and research that is behind, without which not any classification could be proposed. Thanks again, All the best to all, Zelimir A 08:09 02/12/2008 -0700, Ted Bunch a ?crit : >Dear Zelimir please see below for at least one answer. > >Ted Bunch > > >On 12/2/08 7:20 AM, "Zelimir Gabelica" wrote: > > > Hi Martin, > > > > I fully agree. > > > > To be complete, here is what I have in my archives: > > > > ..."NWA 4969 (BRA, Algeria, tkw = 1 at 180 g) from Marcin, is paired with NWA > > 4882 (Algeria, from Hup?'s, BRA, tkw = 2@ 3096 g), but apparently not with > > NWA 3151 (BRA, Hup?'s, tkw = 1 at 1500 grams), nor with NWXA 5191 (1 at 26.5 g) > > > > With the new NWA 5471 from Heir's, this indeed makes 4 brachinites from > > the "NWA" vast strewnfield. > > > > However, in Met. Bull. database, we find the following brachinites from > > "NWA", this better completing the picture: > > > > NWA 595 (Cottingham, Morocco (?), 1 at 196 g) > > NWA 3151 (Hup?'s, NWA (Morocco ?), 1 at 1500 g) > > NWA 4872 (Aaronson, Algeria, 1 at 3000 g) > > NWA 4874 (Aaronson, Algeria, 1 at 28 g) (can it be paired with NWA 4872 above > > ???) NO, please go to > http://www4.nau.edu/meteorite/index.html, > click on BRACHINITES and see for yourself. > > > > NWA 4876 (anonymous, NWA ( Morocco ?), 1 at 130 g > > NWA 4882 (G. Hup?, Algeria, 2 at 3096 g) > > NWA 4969 (M. Cimala, NWA (Morocco ?), 1 at 180 g > > NWA 5191 (anonymous, found in Morocco desert, 1 at 26.5, said to be paired > > with NWA 3151, thus suggesting this latter was also found in Morocco > > > > NWA 5471 (C. Heir's, Morocco (??), 1 (??)@538 g, paired with ???? (not yet > > in Met. Bull.) > > ---------- > > Total: not copunting pairings, we find 9 different meteorite names (NWA > > numbers), probably 10 separate pieces, totalling 8694,5 grams > > > > Question: How far are these data (Met Bulll database + NWA 5471) correct > > and complete ? > > > > Who can complete, possibly remove the ???'s and add comments about > > pairings, so that we all can update our archives regarding NWA brachinites? > > > > Bernd? Greg ? Marcin ? Martin ? or Jeff ? > > > > Thanks and best wishes, > > > > Zelimir Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From bigpineartifacts at yahoo.com Tue Dec 2 13:40:11 2008 From: bigpineartifacts at yahoo.com (mckinney trammell) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 10:40:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay Issues In-Reply-To: <174A125DB0DA44628E83AF51DD24FAA6@ET> Message-ID: <772809.26360.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> they are screwing the customer+ themselves out fo existance with hi fees=bottom line. yea, the betamax, vhs, pacer and commodore c-64 were all great in their times. --- On Tue, 12/2/08, JoshuaTreeMuseum wrote: > From: JoshuaTreeMuseum > Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay Issues > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 11:46 AM > Hi Brian, McKinney, Listoids: > > eBay, like rock & roll, will never die. It's the > greatest platform for buying and selling meteorites the > world has ever seen. Everything else too. Before eBay, > where could the Average Joe go to buy his stones? After > eBay buys Craigslist, (it already owns all the European > Craigslist sites and is a major owner of Cl) it will become > the final vestige of the free enterprise system, (along with > Wal-Mart.) eBay has always had bugs, like when it sputters > when you're listing and you have to redo the auction. I > use eBay heavily daily and I haven't seen the slowdown > others are talking about. Maybe it's increased usage for > the holiday season overloading and bottlenecking the > bandwith? eBay has been sort of screwing the sellers > lately, but they'll come around and realize who it is > that's giving them all that money! Just my plug > nickel's worth! > > Phil Whitmer > Joshua Tree Earth & Space Museum > Lakeville, IN > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From cynapse at charter.net Tue Dec 2 13:43:01 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 13:43:01 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay Issues In-Reply-To: <772809.26360.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <174A125DB0DA44628E83AF51DD24FAA6@ET> <772809.26360.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Dec 2008 10:40:11 -0800 (PST), you wrote: >they are screwing the customer+ themselves out fo existance with hi fees=bottom line. yea, the betamax, vhs, pacer and commodore c-64 were all great in their times. > > You know what Betamax, VHS, the Pacer and the Commodore 64 all had? Viable competition. From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Tue Dec 2 13:58:03 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 10:58:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] A New Compositional Class of Comets: from Fire, Ice, or Beyond? Message-ID: <200812021858.KAA26143@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.lowell.edu/media/releases.php?release=20081202 FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE December 2, 2008 A New Compositional Class of Comets: from Fire, Ice, or Beyond? Lowell Observatory Astronomer Confirms New Class of Comets Flagstaff, Ariz. -- Comet 96P/Machholz 1 shows extremely anomalous compositional characteristics helping pinpoint its origin to one of three intriguing scenarios. David Schleicher, Lowell Observatory planetary astronomer, measured abundances of five molecular species in the comae of 150 comets and discovered that one comet, 96P/Machholz 1, has an extremely unusual chemistry. The exact cause of this chemical anomaly remains unknown, but each of three possible explanations will yield important but differing new constraints on the formation or evolution of comets. The study is published in the November issue of the Astronomical Journal. The discovery of comet Machholz 1's extremely anomalous composition reveals the existence of a new class of comets. Astronomers identified two other classes in the 1990s. While Machholz 1 also has strongly depleted C2 and C3 carbon species, what makes it anomalous is that the molecule cyanogen, CN, is extremely depleted. In Machholz 1 CN is missing by about a factor of 72 from the average of other comets, i.e., only a little above one percent of normal. "This depletion of CN is much more than ever seen for any previously studied comet, and only one other comet has even exhibited a CN depletion," said Schleicher. One possible explanation is that Machholz 1 did not originate in our Solar System, but instead escaped from another star. In this scenario, the other star's proto-planetary disk might have had a lower abundance of carbon, resulting in all carbon-bearing compounds having lower abundances. "A large fraction of comets in our own Solar System have escaped into interstellar space, so we expect that many comets formed around other stars would also have escaped," said Schleicher. "Some of these will have crossed paths with the sun, and Machholz 1 could be an interstellar interloper." Another possible explanation for Machholz 1's anomalous composition is that it formed even further from the sun in a colder or more extreme environment than another other comet we have studied thus far. If this was the case, then the scarcity of such objects is likely associated with the significant difficulty of explaining how such comets moved into the inner solar system where they can then be discovered and observed. A third possibility is that Machholz 1 originated as a carbon-chain depleted comet but that its chemistry was subsequently altered by extreme heat. While no other comet has exhibited changes in chemistry due to subsequent heating by the sun, Machholz 1 has the distinction of having an orbit that now takes it to well inside Mercury's orbit every five years. (Other comets get even closer to the sun, but not as often). "Since its orbit is unusual, we must be suspicious that repeated high temperature cooking might be the cause for its unusual composition," said Schleicher. "However, the only other comet to show depletion in the abundance of CN did not reach such high temperatures. This implies that CN depletion does not require the chemical reactions associated with extreme heat." Although comet 96P/Machholz 1 was first sighted in 1986 and orbits the sun with a period of slightly over five years, compositional measurements only took place during the comet's recent 2007 apparition. Lowell Observatory's program of compositional studies, currently headed by Schleicher, includes measurements of over 150 comets obtained during the past 33 years. This research is unique because it compares and contrasts Machholz 1 against this large database of 150 comets. In the early 1990s, Lowell Observatory's long-term program first identified the existence of two compositional classes of comets. One class, containing the majority of observed comets, has a composition called "typical." Most members of this typical class have long resided in the Oort Cloud at the very fringes of our Solar System but are believed to have originally formed amidst the giant planets, particularly between Saturn, Uranus, and Neptune. Other members of this compositional class arrived from the Kuiper Belt, located just beyond Neptune. The second compositional class of comets has varying depletions in two of the five chemical species measured. Since both depleted molecules, C2 and C3, are wholly composed of carbon atoms, this class was named "carbon-chain depleted." Moreover, nearly all comets in this second class have orbits consistent with their having arrived from the Kuiper Belt. For this and other reasons, the cause of the depletion is believed to be associated with the conditions that existed when the comets formed, perhaps within an outer, colder region of the Kuiper Belt. Comets are widely thought to be the most pristine objects available for detailed study remaining from the epoch of Solar System formation. As such, comets can be used as probes of the proto-planetary material that was incorporated into our Solar System. Differences in the current chemical composition among comets can indicate either differences in primordial conditions or evolutionary effects. Although the location of origin cannot be definitively determined for any single comet, Machholz 1's short orbital period means that astronomers can search for additional carbon-bearing molecular species during future apparitions. "If additional carbon-bearing species are also strongly depleted, then the case for its origin outside of our Solar System would be strengthened," said Schleicher. The next opportunity for observations will be in 2012. This research is supported by NASA's Planetary Astronomy and Planetary Atmospheres Programs. The study is published in the November issue of the Astronomical Journal. FOR MORE INFORMATION Scientific contact: David Schleicher (dgs at lowell.edu) (928) 233-3228 See a pdf of the report, Lowell Observatory Comet 96/P Machholz 1 Background About Lowell Observatory Lowell Observatory is a private, non-profit research institution founded in 1894 by Percival Lowell. The Observatory has been the site of many important findings including the discovery of the large recessional velocities (redshift) of galaxies by Vesto Slipher in 1912-1914 (a result that led ultimately to the realization the universe is expanding), and the discovery of Pluto by Clyde Tombaugh in 1930. Today, Lowell's 20 astronomers use ground-based telescopes around the world, telescopes in space, and NASA planetary spacecraft to conduct research in diverse areas of astronomy and planetary science. The Observatory welcomes more than 75,000 visitors each year to its Mars Hill campus in Flagstaff, Arizona for a variety of tours, telescope viewing, and special programs. Lowell Observatory currently has four research telescopes at its Anderson Mesa dark sky site east of Flagstaff, and is building a 4-meter class research telescope, the Discovery Channel Telescope, in partnership with Discovery Communications. CONTACT Steele Wotkyns steele at lowell.edu (928) 233-3232 end From mpg444 at yahoo.com Tue Dec 2 14:36:13 2008 From: mpg444 at yahoo.com (Mike Groetz) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 11:36:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Meteorite Composition? Message-ID: <740214.89311.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com> The Statten Island news paper included this comment within their article: "While it's not yet known what kind of meteorite this one was, the fragments appear to be made of iron." Has anyone heard yet from the universities as to a preliminary composition? Mike From gmhupe at htn.net Tue Dec 2 15:24:39 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 15:24:39 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies Message-ID: <183C4D72B2454E76B820E74C39CA7229@Gregor> Dear List Members, I was just cruising around eBay for about five minutes and my Internet Explorer popped up a message reading: "To help protect your security, Internet Explorer blocked this site from downloading files to your computer. Click here for options..." This pretty much confirms what I and others have said at the beginning of this thread, eBay IS downloading Spyware and Cookies on our computers. Looks like eBay wants to become Big Brother as well as a monopoly!! Be sure to run your Spyware and other software programs to rid your computers of their junk! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault From bigpineartifacts at yahoo.com Tue Dec 2 15:36:55 2008 From: bigpineartifacts at yahoo.com (mckinney trammell) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 12:36:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies In-Reply-To: <183C4D72B2454E76B820E74C39CA7229@Gregor> Message-ID: <283646.54661.qm@web53201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> wow. www.safernetworking.com for spybot S&D free downloads. just ran it, though AFTER ebay use and "no immed." threats found"? --- On Tue, 12/2/08, Greg Hupe wrote: > From: Greg Hupe > Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 3:24 PM > Dear List Members, > > I was just cruising around eBay for about five minutes and > my Internet Explorer popped up a message reading: > "To help protect your security, Internet Explorer > blocked this site from downloading files to your computer. > Click here for options..." > > This pretty much confirms what I and others have said at > the beginning of this thread, eBay IS downloading Spyware > and Cookies on our computers. Looks like eBay wants to > become Big Brother as well as a monopoly!! > > Be sure to run your Spyware and other software programs to > rid your computers of their junk! > > Best regards, > Greg > > ==================== > Greg Hupe > The Hupe Collection > NaturesVault (eBay) > gmhupe at htn.net > www.LunarRock.com > IMCA 3163 > ==================== > Click here for my current eBay auctions: > http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Tue Dec 2 15:39:10 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 13:39:10 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Meteorite Composition? References: <740214.89311.qm@web33005.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <94F4B412F8884B66B14FB2806B8FA512@bellatrix> The initial assessment from Hildebrand's group at the University of Calgary is an ordinary chondrite, type 5 or 6. Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Groetz" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 12:36 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Meteorite Composition? > The Statten Island news paper included this comment within their > article: > > "While it's not yet known what kind of meteorite this one was, the > fragments appear to be made of iron." > > Has anyone heard yet from the universities as to a preliminary > composition? > > Mike From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Tue Dec 2 15:50:00 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 13:50:00 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies References: <283646.54661.qm@web53201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: There is no mechanism on a properly configured browser for a website to download software to your computer without your active consent. If you are using Internet Explorer (why would you?) it is possible to override the default setting and allow websites to quietly load ActiveX applications. But if you have your browser configured that way, eBay should be the least of your worries! Of course eBay uses cookies. Nearly every site does, and in the case of eBay they are essential to proper operation. If you are paranoid, you can always tell your browser to treat any eBay cookie as "session only", meaning they'll get automatically deleted when you shut down. Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "mckinney trammell" To: ; "Greg Hupe" Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 1:36 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies > wow. www.safernetworking.com for spybot S&D free downloads. just ran it, > though AFTER ebay use and "no immed." threats found"? > > > --- On Tue, 12/2/08, Greg Hupe wrote: > >> From: Greg Hupe >> Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 3:24 PM >> Dear List Members, >> >> I was just cruising around eBay for about five minutes and >> my Internet Explorer popped up a message reading: >> "To help protect your security, Internet Explorer >> blocked this site from downloading files to your computer. >> Click here for options..." >> >> This pretty much confirms what I and others have said at >> the beginning of this thread, eBay IS downloading Spyware >> and Cookies on our computers. Looks like eBay wants to >> become Big Brother as well as a monopoly!! >> >> Be sure to run your Spyware and other software programs to >> rid your computers of their junk! >> >> Best regards, >> Greg From m42protosun at aol.com Tue Dec 2 16:17:12 2008 From: m42protosun at aol.com (m42protosun at aol.com) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 16:17:12 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] no pairings of the sikote-alin meteorite In-Reply-To: <741595.71233.qm@web57803.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <741595.71233.qm@web57803.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CB22DA7A399885-CB4-90D@WEBMAIL-DZ04.sysops.aol.com> Hello Steve, hello list my scientific researches point out that there could be a pairing between the Sikhote-Alin and the Veevers. Both have a lot of paired characteristics in petrology and chemistry. Apparently are both fragments of a mutual parent body. This body was destroyed in cyclopean collision which split even the core. The low Ir content shows that both meteorites are fragments of an outer area of the Ni-Fe core. The main commonalities are Name: Ir [ppm] Group kind Ni(%) Veever: 0,0280 IIAB Ogg 5,80 Sikhote-Alin: 0,0300 IIAB Ogg 5,90 Regards Uwe -----Urspr?ngliche Mitteilung----- Von: steve arnold An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Verschickt: Di., 2. Dez. 2008, 15:44 Thema: [meteorite-list] no pairings of the sikote-alin meteorite Good morning list.It just has to be a mess with all these nwa pairings with these brachinite's.Well a good thing for me.I do not have any brach's in my collection,only sikote-alin's here.So no pairings will ever be a hassle for this greatest of falls.I have to take this back.I do have a piece of eagle's nest,a small fragment,but still small.But the sikote-alin meteorite is by far the best of all the non rusting irons.I do have one small question.I have a few pieces that shows lite bubbling.What would tend to cause that? 0A Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ________________________________________________________________________ AOL eMail auf Ihrem Handy! Ab sofort k?nnen Sie auch unterwegs Ihre AOL email abrufen. Registrieren Sie sich jetzt kostenlos. From cynapse at charter.net Tue Dec 2 17:26:02 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 17:26:02 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies In-Reply-To: References: <283646.54661.qm@web53201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Dec 2008 13:50:00 -0700, you wrote: >There is no mechanism on a properly configured browser for a website to >download software to your computer without your active consent. There is not an OS or browser avaiable that does not have security holes. Not only that, but there are multiple other applications that can be used to infect your system. Some known, but the ones you have to worry about are the ones that aren't known yet. You have a false sense of security. News from today: http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/240255/apple-recommends-security-software-for-mac-owners.html from a week back: http://goodgearguide.com.au/article/268492 from a month back: http://www.net-security.org/secworld.php?id=6715 others: http://blogs.zdnet.com/security/?p=1733 Jpegs? Not always safe. http://www.secureworks.com/research/threats/jpegvirus/ Video? Not always safe. http://ask-leo.com/can_i_get_a_virus_or_spyware_from_a_free_video_download.html Just because YOU can't imagine a way to get a virus/trojan/spyware into your computer doesn't mean that someone else can't imagine a way to get a virus/trojan/spyware into your computer. From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Tue Dec 2 17:50:30 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 15:50:30 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies References: <283646.54661.qm@web53201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Serious security holes are increasingly rare, and increasingly being fixed before exploits appear. They don't represent a very big threat for people who keep their systems up-to-date and exercise a bit of common sense. In the context of this discussion, I am doubtful in the extreme that eBay is exploiting an unknown security hole to download software to their users' computers. Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darren Garrison" To: Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 3:26 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies > On Tue, 2 Dec 2008 13:50:00 -0700, you wrote: > >>There is no mechanism on a properly configured browser for a website to >>download software to your computer without your active consent. > > There is not an OS or browser avaiable that does not have security holes. > Not > only that, but there are multiple other applications that can be used to > infect > your system. Some known, but the ones you have to worry about are the > ones that > aren't known yet. You have a false sense of security. > > News from today: > > http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/240255/apple-recommends-security-software-for-mac-owners.html > > from a week back: > > http://goodgearguide.com.au/article/268492 > > from a month back: > > http://www.net-security.org/secworld.php?id=6715 > > others: > > http://blogs.zdnet.com/security/?p=1733 > > Jpegs? Not always safe. > > http://www.secureworks.com/research/threats/jpegvirus/ > > Video? Not always safe. > > http://ask-leo.com/can_i_get_a_virus_or_spyware_from_a_free_video_download.html > > Just because YOU can't imagine a way to get a virus/trojan/spyware into > your > computer doesn't mean that someone else can't imagine a way to get a > virus/trojan/spyware into your computer. From bobadebt at ec.rr.com Tue Dec 2 19:23:14 2008 From: bobadebt at ec.rr.com (David & Kitt Deyarmin) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 19:23:14 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Art, Please contact me Message-ID: I don't know how to contact Art and I have a question for him so I hope he sees this From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Tue Dec 2 19:37:50 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 17:37:50 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies References: <283646.54661.qm@web53201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1A643EEC378A490791B67BA45804E785@bellatrix> Tagasaurus is simple malware. It has no way to install itself on a properly configured system. You need to download and run something carrying it. In this respect it is no different from most other malware. Doubleclick and Mediaplex do not download executable code to your computer. All they do is set tracking cookies that are used to analyze your traffic patterns. They are harmless, but you may nevertheless consider them a violation of privacy. If so, it is trivial in any browser to either block those cookies, or convert them to session cookies. There is a big difference between setting a cookie and downloading some kind of monitoring software! If eBay were actually doing the latter, it would be all over the news. Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "harlan trammell" To: ; Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 5:16 PM Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies hitbox, tagasaurus, doubleclick, mediaplex, etc. ALL with AUTOMATICALLY UPLOAD themselves w/o your consent. they will reside in your unit until you discover+delete them. From raremeteorites at yahoo.com Tue Dec 2 20:33:38 2008 From: raremeteorites at yahoo.com (Adam Hupe) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 17:33:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Ebay Name Update Message-ID: <286158.99356.qm@web30701.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear List Members, Just a quick note to let collectors know I have a new eBay name. The old name raremeteorites has been changed to raremeteorites! with an explanation mark (!) at the end. I had to change it due to eBay's policy about having the same name as your email address. Those of you who monitor my auctions, please update your bookmark. I will be loading up some great inventory in the upcoming weeks as I unpack it. Hopefully the link below will work. If not, I will try another one. Click below to see some great auctions: http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/raremeteorites!_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZ Thank you for looking and if you are bidding, the best of luck. Best Regards, Adam From fuzzfoot at comcast.net Tue Dec 2 20:36:12 2008 From: fuzzfoot at comcast.net (Mike%20Bandli) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 01:36:12 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [meteorite-list] Riker Storage Case? Need Help In-Reply-To: <1A643EEC378A490791B67BA45804E785@bellatrix> Message-ID: <180751795.1322471228268172795.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> If anyone is aware of a storage or transport case specifically designed to hold or organize lots of Riker-style mounts, please email me off-list. Thank you! Mike Bandli From tett at rogers.com Tue Dec 2 22:24:51 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 22:24:51 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite (Not the Fall!) References: <741595.71233.qm@web57803.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <8CB22DA7A399885-CB4-90D@WEBMAIL-DZ04.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <8D3B52FCD97D43CDB5D57B0E4ECAE554@tett1> List, Not too much has been mentioned about the new Canadian iron to be found as most of the press has been given to the new fall in Lloydminster Sask.. Instead of driving from Edmonton two hours east to Saskatchewan you can drive about the same west to Whitecourt Alberta and see a newly discovered crater with lots of iron meteorites. It is now protected to help preserve the small crater which is too bad for meteorite hunters. Hopefully some science will be gained at the cost of keeping us out from gobbling up some nice irons. Apparently there are lots of Sikhote like irons to be found. Friends from the University of Western Ontario were out to Whitecourt last month and retrieved lots of material. A very exciting find because the crater is so very young and in great shape. An exciting time for Canadian meteorite enthusiasts. Here is more info: http://easweb.eas.ualberta.ca/page/108 Cheers! Mike Tettenborn One anxious Canadian meteorite enthusiast waiting for his piece of Lloydminster From grf2 at verizon.net Tue Dec 2 23:19:24 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 23:19:24 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] no pairings of the sikote-alin meteorite References: <741595.71233.qm@web57803.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <8CB22DA7A399885-CB4-90D@WEBMAIL-DZ04.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Thanks Uwe, parent body reference is always an interesting aside if not the very essence of serious collectors. Jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 4:17 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] no pairings of the sikote-alin meteorite Hello Steve, hello list my scientific researches point out that there could be a pairing between the Sikhote-Alin and the Veevers. Both have a lot of paired characteristics in petrology and chemistry. Apparently are both fragments of a mutual parent body. This body was destroyed in cyclopean collision which split even the core. The low Ir content shows that both meteorites are fragments of an outer area of the Ni-Fe core. The main commonalities are Name: Ir [ppm] Group kind Ni(%) Veever: 0,0280 IIAB Ogg 5,80 Sikhote-Alin: 0,0300 IIAB Ogg 5,90 Regards Uwe -----Urspr?ngliche Mitteilung----- Von: steve arnold An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Verschickt: Di., 2. Dez. 2008, 15:44 Thema: [meteorite-list] no pairings of the sikote-alin meteorite Good morning list.It just has to be a mess with all these nwa pairings with these brachinite's.Well a good thing for me.I do not have any brach's in my collection,only sikote-alin's here.So no pairings will ever be a hassle for this greatest of falls.I have to take this back.I do have a piece of eagle's nest,a small fragment,but still small.But the sikote-alin meteorite is by far the best of all the non rusting irons.I do have one small question.I have a few pieces that shows lite bubbling.What would tend to cause that? 0A Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ________________________________________________________________________ AOL eMail auf Ihrem Handy! Ab sofort k?nnen Sie auch unterwegs Ihre AOL email abrufen. Registrieren Sie sich jetzt kostenlos. ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael at spacerocksinc.com Wed Dec 3 00:18:28 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 21:18:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 3, 2008 Message-ID: <2349758.1839731228281508982.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://rocksfromspace.org/December_3_2008.html From cynapse at charter.net Wed Dec 3 01:56:18 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2008 01:56:18 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite video (probably) In-Reply-To: <2349758.1839731228281508982.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> References: <2349758.1839731228281508982.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: This site seems to have video showing the new Canadian meteorite find. I can't get it to play in Firefox 3, it plays the damn commercial with the meerkats and the Rube Goldberg device over and over, but never the meteorite video. But you can try your luck on the link. http://www.edmontonsun.com/News/Alberta/2008/11/28/7571236.html Looked for the video on Youtube, but all I found was an insane guy. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VClt5fGXFlo From Carsten.Giessler at t-online.de Wed Dec 3 06:34:28 2008 From: Carsten.Giessler at t-online.de (Carsten Giessler) Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2008 12:34:28 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Capot Rey Big Brecciated Slice Message-ID: <49366EC4.1080004@t-online.de> Hello List, i have a nice 31.3g. slice of Capot Rey for sale. It has been cut from the IMB stone, and shows a beautiful breccia. Pics are here: http://www.gi-po.de/ebayfolder/sofort25.11/capimb/1.jpg http://www.gi-po.de/ebayfolder/sofort25.11/capimb/2.jpg http://www.gi-po.de/ebayfolder/sofort25.11/capimb/3.jpg http://www.gi-po.de/ebayfolder/sofort25.11/capimb/4.jpg If anyone is interested please contact me off-list. Thanks for viewing, Carsten From grf2 at verizon.net Wed Dec 3 09:24:39 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2008 09:24:39 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite video (probably) References: <2349758.1839731228281508982.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <2F16DE3B8E354C89AE1CFD64636DB975@ASUS> you're right. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darren Garrison" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2008 1:56 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite video (probably) > This site seems to have video showing the new Canadian meteorite find. I > can't > get it to play in Firefox 3, it plays the damn commercial with the > meerkats and > the Rube Goldberg device over and over, but never the meteorite video. > But you > can try your luck on the link. > > http://www.edmontonsun.com/News/Alberta/2008/11/28/7571236.html > > Looked for the video on Youtube, but all I found was an insane guy. > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VClt5fGXFlo > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From bristolia at yahoo.com Wed Dec 3 10:26:01 2008 From: bristolia at yahoo.com (Paul) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 07:26:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] =?utf-8?q?Location_of_Australian_Opal_Miner?= =?utf-8?b?4oCZcyDigJxtZWdhIG1ldGVvcml0ZSBjcmF0ZXLigJ0=?= Message-ID: <204253.13333.qm@web36204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In ?Opal miner stumbles on mega meteorite crater - With Picture?, Jason Utas wrote: ?http://www.theage.com.au/news/technology/biztech/opal-miner-stumbles-on-mega-meteorite-crater/2008/11/22/1226770814042.html ? Text of article deleted. For those people interested in Google Earth the location of this suspected carter is 30 degrees, 47.8 minutes, 8.94 seconds S., 143 degrees, 8 minutes, 43.05 seconds E. or -30.7858166667, 143.145291159 I have a kmz file that I can email interested parties. another article about this crater is: ?Opal miner fossicks up a mega meteorite crater? at: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/national/opal-miner-fossicks-up-a-mega-meteorite-crater/2008/11/22/1227375050742.html Some more articles about the Canadian meteorite crater. Meteorite hits on Earth: There may be a recount: Meteorite craters might not be as rare as we think. A University of Alberta researcher has found a tool that could reveal possibly hundreds of undiscovered craters across Canada and around the world. http://www.physorg.com/news146841660.html Unveiling hidden craters http://www.sciencenews.org/view/generic/id/39004/title/Unveiling_hidden_craters How Many Meteorites Have Landed In Western Canada? Prospects For The Missing Holocene Impact Record Science Daily, Dec. 1, 2008 http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/11/081126091541.htm More Meteorites May Hit Earth Than Supposed: New Tool Gives A Recount, Nov. 25, 2008 http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/11/081125141600.htm Yours, Paul H. From cynapse at charter.net Wed Dec 3 11:45:06 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2008 11:45:06 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] The aliens are coming! In-Reply-To: <204253.13333.qm@web36204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <204253.13333.qm@web36204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Note the 2012 date, which all of the Mayan fin de si?cle nuts are going to go bannanas (uh, bannanaser) about. http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/081202-odd-comet.html Odd Comet Possibly from Another Star System By Jeanna Bryner Senior Writer posted: 02 December 2008 03:39 pm ET The bizarre chemical make-up of a comet suggests the blob of ice is an interloper, possibly flung into our solar system from beyond, astronomers now say, adding that the wacky comet is forcing them to create a new category for such objects. The comet, called Machholz 1, was discovered in 1986 by Donald Machholz of Loma Prieta, Calif. Since then, the icy denizen has made a few appearances, including one in 2007. "A large fraction of comets in our own solar system have escaped into interstellar space, so we expect that many comets formed around other stars would also have escaped," said David Schleicher, a planetary astronomer at Lowell Observatory in Arizona. "Some of these will have crossed paths with the sun, and Machholz 1 could be an interstellar interloper." The oddball, described in the November issue of the Astronomical Journal, could shed light on the formation and evolution of comets. These blobs of dust and frozen gases may be the oldest, most primitive bodies in the solar system. In fact, they hold the earliest record of material from the nebula that formed the sun and planets. Head measurements Schleicher measured the amounts of certain carbon and other compounds in the coma or head of Machholz 1 in 2007. He compared the composition with information from 150 other comets, finding that Machholz 1 had an odd make-up. Particularly, the comet contains much less of a carbon-nitrogen molecule called cyanogen, by a factor of about 72, compared with the average found in other comets. The comet also contained much less of two molecules called C2 and C3 (which have two and three atoms of carbon in their structures, respectively) than the average comet. Schleicher puts forth three scenarios that could be responsible for the odd chemistry, although no one explanation stands out as right on. "I'm not real thrilled with any of the three [scenarios]," Schleicher told SPACE.com. One possible explanation is that Machholz 1 did not originate in the solar system, but instead escaped from another star's gravity. In this scenario, the other star's proto-planetary disk (the disk of debris from which planets are thought to form) might have had a lower abundance of carbon, resulting in all carbon-bearing compounds having lower abundances. Several comets previously in our solar system have gotten the boot when their orbits came into contact with that of Jupiter, whose gravity kicked them out. Another possible explanation for Machholz 1's anomalous composition is that it formed inside the solar system but even farther from the sun in a colder or more extreme environment than other comets. A third possibility is that Machholz 1 originated as a so-called carbon-chain depleted comet, but that this chemistry was subsequently altered by extreme heat and so cyanogen was also depleted. While no other comet has exhibited changes in chemistry due to subsequent heating by the sun, Machholz 1's orbit takes the comet to well inside Mercury's orbit every five years. (Other comets get even closer to the sun, but not as often). "Since its orbit is unusual, we must be suspicious that repeated high temperature cooking might be the cause for its unusual composition," Schleicher said. However, he added, the only other comet, called Yanaka, to show less cyanogen than is typical never reached such high temperatures. "This implies that [cyanogen] depletion does not require the chemical reactions associated with extreme heat," Schleicher said. Class of its own The results place Machholz 1 into a new class of comets. Until now, astronomers have clumped comets into one of two classes based on their chemical compositions. Most comets, considered members of the "typical" class, have long resided in the Oort Cloud at the fringes of our solar system but are thought to have originally formed amidst the giant planets, particularly between Saturn, Uranus and Neptune. Other members of this class arrived from the Kuiper Belt, a region of icy objects beyond Neptune (but closer in than the Oort Cloud.) The second class includes comets with varying depletions of certain carbon molecules, including the C2 and C3 molecules. Nearly all of these comets (called carbon-chain depleted comets) have orbits that suggest they arrived from the Kuiper Belt. For this and other reasons, scientists think the carbon depletion is associated with conditions that existed when the comets formed, perhaps within an outer, colder region of the Kuiper Belt. The new class of comets, which would include Machholz 1 and possibly Yanaka, would be characterized by low levels of at least three carbon compounds ? C2, C3 and cyanogen. And as of now, these comets would be considered of unknown origin, Schleicher said. The comet, now bound in an orbit around the sun, is expected to come into view again in 2012, at which time Schleicher expects astronomers will point other instruments toward it to measure even more carbon-bearing molecules. This research was supported by NASA's Planetary Astronomy and Planetary Atmospheres Programs. http://www.iop.org/EJ/abstract/1538-3881/136/5/2204/ From meteoriteshow at free.fr Wed Dec 3 13:47:19 2008 From: meteoriteshow at free.fr (meteoriteshow at free.fr) Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2008 19:47:19 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Message-ID: <1228330039.4936d43799a1f@imp.free.fr> Dear All, As some of you may remember my ebay auctions end every saturday, but as some may have forgotten, i send this short note as a reminder... You can follow the link and have a look at the goodies that are available this week: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZmeteoriteshow Here is the list of the meteorites that you can find: 1- Al Haggounia 001 PRIM. AUB. - 7.7g Partslice 2- DAG 586 H5 - 126.0g MAIN MASS!!!! 3- HaH244 L5-6 - 26.1g full slice 4- NWA OC - FUSION CRUST - 39.3g indiv 5- NWA XXX - 0.3g Partslice - HOWARDITE 6- NWA XXX - 0.4g Partslice - HOWARDITE 7- SAH 03501 H4 - 69.3g endcut 8- ZAG H3-6 - 13.5g frag. - WITNESSED FALL! ALL THE BEST AND THANKS FOR LOOKING!!! Kind regards Frederic Beroud www.meteoriteshow.com IMCA #2491 From meteoriteshow at free.fr Wed Dec 3 14:04:14 2008 From: meteoriteshow at free.fr (meteoriteshow at free.fr) Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2008 20:04:14 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - ebay Auctions ending on Saturday Message-ID: <1228331054.4936d82e58029@imp.free.fr> Dear fellow listees, The title of my previous post was not complete and I hope that it didn't stop you to read the content. Just to make sure, here is the link again to my ebay auctions ending on Saturday: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZmeteoriteshow Thanks a sorry for this "double AD" which was not on purpose. Cheers Frederic Beroud www.meteoriteshow.com IMCA #2491 From geoking at notkin.net Wed Dec 3 17:18:18 2008 From: geoking at notkin.net (Notkin) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 15:18:18 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Geology.com Monthly Meteorite Column - December Message-ID: Dear Listees: The December episode of my monthly science column "Meteorwritings" is live on Geology.com: http://geology.com and click on the Imilac photo -- or -- http://geology.com/meteorites/value-of-meteorites.shtml December's feature is a guide to buying and collecting meteorites, aimed primarily at the novice. However, we took a set of a brand new, original photographs for the column, and I'd particularly like to invite you to view the 1.3 kg Sikhote-Alin with natural hole. Has to be one of the best I've ever seen. As always, comments are gratefully received. As the primary purpose of this column is to introduce meteorites and meteorite collecting to a general audience, I'd also welcome suggestions for future column topics that might appeal to a geologically-minded readership. The January column will be about impactites, so we've already got that one covered. Thank you for reading and best wishes from Tucson, Geoff N. www.aerolite.org www.campometeorites.com From mikewren at gilanet.com Wed Dec 3 18:27:54 2008 From: mikewren at gilanet.com (michael cottingham) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 16:27:54 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: AUCTIONS ENDING IN A FEW HOURS>>>>EBAY STORE SALE TOO! HIGHLIGHTS! References: <041C91D6-04DB-48C6-9488-B59748805AAB@gilanet.com> Message-ID: <6964F762-72A9-4CDB-8EFE-77768B413152@gilanet.com> > > > >> Hello, > > Worth A Look! >> >>> >>> Store Link For All: >>> >>> http://stores.ebay.com/voyage-botanica-natural-history >>> >>> >>> >>> Special Highlights: >>> >>> METEORITE Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 20.48g >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280442107 >>> >>> METEORITE NWA 2621, L4, Really Nice, 206 gram CS >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280441048 >>> >>> Very Rare Brachinite, NWA 3151, 0.348 gram, nice specimen! >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280427033 >>> >>> Awesome"Hammer Stone" WORDEN, Michigan, .358g >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280422643 >>> >>> BRENHAM, Siderite From Kansas, 14.72 gram, Check this one out! >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280427026 >>> >>> Very Beautiful FUKANG, Pallasite 18.03 gram, LAST ONE I HAVE! >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280427010 >>> >>> Rare Ungrouped OC3, NWA 4294, 3.74 gram >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280424590 >>> >>> Superb Campo Del Cielo Complete Slice, 582g, A Really Nice Slice! >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280422649 >>> >>> Beautiful L3, SAHARA 02500, 65.63 gram, My last slice to offer! >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280422640 >>> >>> Super Rare GEORGETOWN, Australia, 12.89 gram, Down to my last! >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278532483 >>> >>> Beautiful Flight Oriented Gao-Guenie, H5, 16g >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278533724 >>> >>> Ungrouped Ataxite, DRONINO, Russia, 850g, nice endcut! >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277463181 >>> >>> (NEW) NWA 4851, L6 With Shock Lines, 38 Gram, A real beauty! >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278531242 >>> >>> Very Rare and Beautiful, NWA 801, CR2, 6.00g, Check This One Out! >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277236027 >>> >>> A very Rare EL3 From Africa, NWA 2965, 216g... >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277236018 >>> >>> RARE, SILVERTON, Texas, H4, LTKW, 0.61 gram, I only have a couple... >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277236002 >>> >>> Meteorite (NEW), NWA 4953, L/LL6, LKW, 44.29 gram >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278534257 >>> >>> METEORITE CANYON DIABLO Individual, 170 gram... >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278535428 >>> >>> (New) Martian Shergottite, NWA 4925, "Mars"... >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278531866 >>> >>> Meteorite (New) NWA 4734, Lunar Specimen Display! >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277536177 >>> >>> If You Got The Cash...invest in this one! >>> METEORITE Complete Slice of DAR AL GANI 400, Lunar, 33g >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200280547533 > >>> Classic GOLD BASIN, Arizona, L4, 17.25 gram > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200277236009 > > (New) Martian Shergottite, NWA 4925, "Mars" > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200278531866 > > > > and sooooooo many others to check out! >>> >>> >>> Best Wishes and Thanks >>> >>> Michael Cottingham >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From bristolia at yahoo.com Wed Dec 3 23:25:39 2008 From: bristolia at yahoo.com (Paul) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 20:25:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] IAG Planetary Geomorphology Featured Images Message-ID: <71794.2777.qm@web36208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Past Featured Images, Arranged by Place and by Topic http://www.psi.edu/pgwg/images/bytopic.html Past Featured Images, Image index http://www.psi.edu/pgwg/images/index.html Some Examples: Inverted Paleochannels on Earth and Mars http://www.psi.edu/pgwg/images/may08image.html Unconsolidated Gravels on Asteroid Itokawa http://www.psi.edu/pgwg/images/nov07image.html Deltaic sediments on Mars http://www.psi.edu/pgwg/images/oct08image.html high resolution image of Mars delta ttp://www.psi.edu/pgwg/images/jezerodelta.jpg Yours, Paul H. From michael at spacerocksinc.com Thu Dec 4 06:21:42 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 03:21:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 4, 2008 Message-ID: <14886733.1981661228389702783.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_4_2008.html From Carsten.Giessler at t-online.de Thu Dec 4 06:35:43 2008 From: Carsten.Giessler at t-online.de (Carsten Giessler) Date: Thu, 04 Dec 2008 12:35:43 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture Message-ID: <4937C08F.20401@t-online.de> Hello Tom, this one looks incredible, very beautiful! Thanks for showing the pics! Many greetings Carsten From freequarks at gmail.com Thu Dec 4 08:34:13 2008 From: freequarks at gmail.com (Dark Matter) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 06:34:13 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Geology.com Monthly Meteorite Column - December In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <822da19a0812040534m16e45fc1ia40bd1d2d29e63d0@mail.gmail.com> Bravo Geoff! Very well done. I appreciate your condensed and to the point presentation of meteorite collecting in a nutshell. I have a presentation on meteorites at the National Science Teachers Association's national conference in New Orleans this coming spring. I'll be covering more about meteorites than collecting them, but when I've done such things in the past, collecting seems to be a primary interest of those who attend a session about meteorites. I intend to steer the attendees to your geology.com meteorite collecting article. Regarding future topics, I often intersect the path of professional geologists when it comes to two main topics One is whether something is a meteorite or not (almost always a no-brainer-not, of course), and the second is in their desire to know where a meteorite comes from in space, and how a particular space rock can be paired with its parent body in space. Oh, nice Harrison slice. Where'd you get it? (;- ) Best, Martin On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 3:18 PM, Notkin wrote: > Dear Listees: > > > The December episode of my monthly science column "Meteorwritings" is live > on Geology.com: > > http://geology.com and click on the Imilac photo > > -- or -- > > http://geology.com/meteorites/value-of-meteorites.shtml > > > December's feature is a guide to buying and collecting meteorites, aimed > primarily at the novice. However, we took a set of a brand new, original > photographs for the column, and I'd particularly like to invite you to view > the 1.3 kg Sikhote-Alin with natural hole. Has to be one of the best I've > ever seen. > > As always, comments are gratefully received. As the primary purpose of this > column is to introduce meteorites and meteorite collecting to a general > audience, I'd also welcome suggestions for future column topics that might > appeal to a geologically-minded readership. The January column will be about > impactites, so we've already got that one covered. > > > Thank you for reading and best wishes from Tucson, > > Geoff N. > > www.aerolite.org > www.campometeorites.com > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From darryl at dof3.com Thu Dec 4 08:41:09 2008 From: darryl at dof3.com (Darryl Pitt) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 08:41:09 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture In-Reply-To: <4937C08F.20401@t-online.de> References: <4937C08F.20401@t-online.de> Message-ID: <9D2994F4-48CC-4F47-9896-A14EAAC3EFC4@dof3.com> Yes, nothing like a fresh zenolith to get the heart a twitter..... WoW. On Dec 4, 2008, at 6:35 AM, Carsten Giessler wrote: > Hello Tom, > > this one looks incredible, very beautiful! > Thanks for showing the pics! > > Many greetings > > Carsten > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From cynapse at charter.net Thu Dec 4 11:44:05 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Thu, 04 Dec 2008 11:44:05 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Scratch that 250 gram "main mass" In-Reply-To: <71794.2777.qm@web36208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <71794.2777.qm@web36208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: There's a (lousy) photo on the page. How do you get drool stains off a keyboard? http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20081204/meteorite_update_081204/20081204?hub=SciTech Prairie resident finds big chunk of meteorite Updated Thu. Dec. 4 2008 11:04 AM ET CTV.ca News Staff People are calling it the "Big Kahuna" -- a 13-kilogram meteorite that landed in Buzzard Coulee, Sask. two weeks ago. Amateur meteorite hunter Les Johnson says it's "blind luck" that he found the Big Kahuna about five kilometres from the pond where University of Calgary professor Alan Hildebrand and graduate student Ellen Milley first found 10 such space rock fragments near Lloydminster, Alta. on November 27. At the time, the university researchers reported that they believed more fragments were strewn across a 20-square-kilometre area near the Battle River. That's where Johnson got his cue on where to look for the fallen meteorites, which fell to Earth during the meteor event that was seen across several Prairie provinces on November 20. "Just blind luck really," Johnson told CTV Edmonton. "I was out searching for several days and we heard Dr. Hildebrand and his team had found some things further north, so I thought we'd better come out on this side of the river and have a look." The Big Kahuna, Johnson said, "has got some heft to it." At present, dozens of meteorite fragments have been recovered since November 20. Robert Haag, an Arizona meteorite collector, promised $10,000 to the first person who found a kilogram-sized fragment. Canada's largest meteorite shower took in Bruderheim, Alta., when more than 700 fragments were recovered in 1960. With a report from CTV Edmonton and files from The Canadian Press From epgrondine at yahoo.com Thu Dec 4 11:56:36 2008 From: epgrondine at yahoo.com (E.P. Grondine) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 08:56:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Iron impactors? Message-ID: <150603.5028.qm@web36902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi all - Let's look at the list: Sikote Aliin Whitecourt Brenham (yeah, pallasite, I know) Campo de Cielo Barringer Crater Odessa Now through my stroke damaged brain I seem to recall that irons compose a small percentage of meteorites, I am wondering, was an iron parent body disrupted, leading to large iron impacts? E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas From meteoriteplaya at gmail.com Thu Dec 4 12:02:38 2008 From: meteoriteplaya at gmail.com (Mike Jensen) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 10:02:38 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Scratch that 250 gram "main mass" In-Reply-To: References: <71794.2777.qm@web36208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6f9da8300812040902p71d7f55dha155c60e19262b53@mail.gmail.com> Hi Darren and list Here is a video news story with somewhat better view of the "big kahuna" http://watch.ctv.ca/news/latest/more-meteorites/#clip117132 If you keep watching other related clips will be shown as well. Mike -- Mike Jensen Meteorites 16730 E Ada PL Aurora, CO 80017-3137 USA 720-949-6220 IMCA 4264 website: www.jensenmeteorites.com On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 9:44 AM, Darren Garrison wrote: > There's a (lousy) photo on the page. > > How do you get drool stains off a keyboard? > > http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20081204/meteorite_update_081204/20081204?hub=SciTech > > Prairie resident finds big chunk of meteorite > > Updated Thu. Dec. 4 2008 11:04 AM ET > > CTV.ca News Staff > > People are calling it the "Big Kahuna" -- a 13-kilogram meteorite that landed in > Buzzard Coulee, Sask. two weeks ago. > > Amateur meteorite hunter Les Johnson says it's "blind luck" that he found the > Big Kahuna about five kilometres from the pond where University of Calgary > professor Alan Hildebrand and graduate student Ellen Milley first found 10 such > space rock fragments near Lloydminster, Alta. on November 27. > > At the time, the university researchers reported that they believed more > fragments were strewn across a 20-square-kilometre area near the Battle River. > > That's where Johnson got his cue on where to look for the fallen meteorites, > which fell to Earth during the meteor event that was seen across several Prairie > provinces on November 20. > > "Just blind luck really," Johnson told CTV Edmonton. > > "I was out searching for several days and we heard Dr. Hildebrand and his team > had found some things further north, so I thought we'd better come out on this > side of the river and have a look." > > The Big Kahuna, Johnson said, "has got some heft to it." > > At present, dozens of meteorite fragments have been recovered since November 20. > > Robert Haag, an Arizona meteorite collector, promised $10,000 to the first > person who found a kilogram-sized fragment. > > Canada's largest meteorite shower took in Bruderheim, Alta., when more than 700 > fragments were recovered in 1960. > > With a report from CTV Edmonton and files from The Canadian Press > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Thu Dec 4 12:44:17 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 09:44:17 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Next NASA Mars Mission Rescheduled for 2011 (MSL) Message-ID: <200812041744.JAA23985@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2008/dec/HQ_08-319_MSL_2011.html Dwayne Brown Headquarters, Washington 202-358-1726 dwayne.c.brown at nasa.gov Guy Webster Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. 818-354-6278 guy.webster at jpl.nasa.gov Dec. 04, 2008 RELEASE : 08-319 Next NASA Mars Mission Rescheduled for 2011 WASHINGTON -- NASA's Mars Science Laboratory will launch two years later than previously planned, in the fall of 2011. The mission will send a next-generation rover with unprecedented research tools to study the early environmental history of Mars. A launch date of October 2009 no longer is feasible because of testing and hardware challenges that must be addressed to ensure mission success. The window for a 2009 launch ends in late October. The relative positions of Earth and Mars are favorable for flights to Mars only a few weeks every two years. The next launch opportunity after 2009 is in 2011. "We will not lessen our standards for testing the mission's complex flight systems, so we are choosing the more responsible option of changing the launch date," said Doug McCuistion, director of the Mars Exploration Program at NASA Headquarters in Washington. "Up to this point, efforts have focused on launching next year, both to begin the exciting science and because the delay will increase taxpayers' investment in the mission. However, we've reached the point where we can not condense the schedule further without compromising vital testing." The Mars Science Laboratory team recently completed an assessment of the progress it has made in the past three months. As a result of the team's findings, the launch date was changed. "Despite exhaustive work in multiple shifts by a dedicated team, the progress in recent weeks has not come fast enough on solving technical challenges and pulling hardware together," said Charles Elachi, director of NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, Calif. "The right and smart course now for a successful mission is to launch in 2011." The advanced rover is one of the most technologically challenging interplanetary missions ever designed. It will use new technologies to adjust its flight while descending through the Martian atmosphere, and to set the rover on the surface by lowering it on a tether from a hovering descent stage. Advanced research instruments make up a science payload 10 times the mass of instruments on NASA's Spirit and Opportunity Mars rovers. The Mars Science Laboratory is engineered to drive longer distances over rougher terrain than previous rovers. It will employ a new surface propulsion system. Rigorous testing of components and systems is essential to develop such a complex mission and prepare it for launch. Tests during the middle phases of development resulted in decisions to re-engineer key parts of the spacecraft. "Costs and schedules are taken very seriously on any science mission," said Ed Weiler, associate administrator for NASA's Science Mission Directorate at NASA Headquarters. "However, when it's all said and done, the passing grade is mission success." The mission will explore a Mars site where images taken by NASA's orbiting spacecraft indicate there were wet conditions in the past. Four candidate landing sites are under consideration. The rover will check for evidence of whether ancient Mars environments had conditions favorable for supporting microbial life and preserving evidence of that life if it existed there. NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory manages the Mars Science Laboratory project for the Science Mission Directorate. For more information about the Mars Science Laboratory, visit: http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl - end - From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Thu Dec 4 14:06:35 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 11:06:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Conference: Asteroid-Comet Hazard - 2009 Message-ID: <200812041906.LAA28140@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.ipa.nw.ru/conference/ach2009/ International conference Asteroid-Comet Hazard - 2009 September 21-25, 2009 St. Petersburg, Russia First announcement About conference The Russian Academy of Sciences, the Russian Foundation for Basic Research, Saint Petersburg Scientific Center of RAS, the Institute of Applied Astronomy of RAS invite you to participate in the International scientific conference ?Asteroid-Comet Hazard-2009? which will be held 21-25 September 2009 in St. Petersburg. The purposes of the conference are to provide a common forum for experts of diverse background and disciplines to come and exchange information and ideas, to recommend subsequent development of research, to attract public attention to severe hazard due to asteroids and comets approaching the Earth and necessity of more active international cooperation of the research directed to protection of civilization from this hazard. Topics to be discussed It is supposed to discuss the next topics: 1. Study of small bodies of the Solar system (physics, dynamics, origin and evolution of asteroids, comets, meteoroids). 2. Asteroid-comet hazard (origin and dynamic evolution of objects approaching the Earth, observations, physical properties, cataloguing, data bases, estimation of collision probability with the Earth and other bodies). 3. Collisions of cosmic bodies with the Earth (study of the traces of past catastrophes, modeling of collisions and their consequences, the threshold for global catastrophe). 4. Counteraction (discovering hazardous cosmic objects, methods and means of acting upon near-Earth objects, organization of passive and active counteracting the asteroid and comet impacts, the technologies to address the study of asteroids and comets in near-Earth space, missions to hazardous bodies). 5. International-legal aspects of counteracting the impact hazard. Collaboration of different countries in solving the problem. Dealing with mass-media. Program committee Finkelstein ?.?. (Chairman) Institute of Applied Astronomy of RAS, Russia Shor V.A. (Vice-chairman) Institute of Applied Astronomy of RAS, Russia Medvedev Yu.D. (Scientific secretary) Institute of Applied Astronomy of RAS, Russia Adushkin V.V. Geospheres Dynamics Institute of RAS, Russia Akim E.L. Keldysh Institute of Applied Mathematics of RAS, Russia Emelyanov V.A. TSNIIMASH, Federal Space Agency, Russia Fortov V.?. Institute for High Energy Densities of RAS, Russia Harris A. Space Science Institute, Boulder, CO, USA Lupishko D.F. Institute of Astronomy of Karazin Kharkov University, Ukraine Marov M.Ya. Keldysh Institute of Applied Mathematics of RAS, Russia Marsden B. Minor Planet Center, USA Milani A. University of Piza, Italy Muinonen K. Helsinki University, Finland Pittich E. Slovak Academy of Sciences, Slovakia Pol' V.G. Lavochkin Scientific-Production Association, Russia Rickman H. University of Uppsala, Sweden Rykhlova L.V. Astronomical Institute of RAS, Russia Shustov B.M. Astronomical Institute of RAS, Russia Simonenko V.A. Russian Federal Nuclear Center - E.I. Zababakhin Institute of Technical Physics, Russia Sukhanov K.G. Lavochkin Scientific-Production Association, Russia Yatskiv Ya.S. Main Astronomical Observatory of National Academy of Sciences of Ukraine, Ukraine Yeomans D. NASA Near Earth Object Program Office, USA Zajtsev A.V. Planetary Defense Center, Russia Local organizing committee Medvedev Yu.D. - Chairman Chernetenko Yu.?. - Vice-chairman Shuygina N.V. - Secretary Bondarenko Yu.S. Lysenkov E.A. Sal'nikov A.I. Valyaev V.I. Zabotin A.S. Phone: (812) 275-10-15 (Nadezhda V. Shuygina) FAX: (812) 275-11-19 E-mail address: mail (Please, in all email correspondence, use in the Subject field, 'ACH-2009') Format of the Conference Languages of the conference are English and Russian. Abstracts of papers, in case they are written in Russian, should have detailed summary in English. Contributed paper can be submitted for oral presentation or as poster. Depending upon the number of papers offered, it is hoped to provide 30 minutes for invited papers and 15 minutes for contributed ones, including discussion. For oral presentation a multimedia projector will be in your disposition. Area up to 0.6 square meter will be provided for poster (9 pages of A4 format). Submitted papers are reviewed by the Program Committee and selected on the basis of their suitability for inclusion in the program. The Committee reserves the right to reject paper or to change form of its presentation. Papers will not be accepted for reading "in absentia". It is supposed that Proceedings of the Conference will be published soon after the end of the Conference. Abstracts of papers must be submitted by May 15, 2009 in electronic form. Registration fee The registration fee is 3000 Rubles (approximately 120 USD or 85 EURO) for participants and 1500 Rubles for accompanying persons. It should be paid in cash while registration. Registration fee does not include travel expenses, accommodation and other expenses of the participant. Accommodation Participants of the conference will be accommodated in the hotels of St. Petersburg. Detailed information about prices in the hotels will appear in the second announcement. Cultural program The conference will be hosted by the Institute of Applied Astronomy. Building of the Institute is situated close to historical center of St. Petersburg. St. Petersburg is one of the most beautiful cities of the world, which celebrated three-hundredth anniversary. Numerous architectural ensembles of the city and its suburbs, bridges and embankments of Neva river and canals form inimitable in its beauty appearance of the city. World-wide known museums, first of all, Hermitage and Russian museum, possess unique collections of works of art and world masterpieces. There are dozens theatres in St. Petersburg, including Mariinsky theatre of opera and ballet. Participants of the conference will have opportunity to attend museums and theatres, to have excursions to palace ensembles in St. Petersburg suburbs. Important dates 25 October 2008 First announcement 1 March 2009 Registration 10 March 2009 Second announcement 15 May 2009 Submission of abstracts 15 June 2009 Third announcement. Program of the Conference. 21-25 September 2009 The Conference ACH-2009 Registration We ask to inform us about your intention to participate in the conference. Please fill in on-line form at http://www.ipa.nw.ru/conference/ach2009/profile/ (preferable way) or send the following registration form to the LOC: ahazard at ipa.nw.ru before 1 March, 2009: Family name First name Second name Scientific degree Country Affiliation Affiliation (short form) Position Postal address Phone FAX E-mail address Title of paper Type of presentation (oral/poster) We are looking forward to seeing all of you here in St. Petersburg. From mexicodoug at aim.com Thu Dec 4 14:37:42 2008 From: mexicodoug at aim.com (mexicodoug at aim.com) Date: Thu, 04 Dec 2008 14:37:42 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Meteorite Sandpaper *Super Deal* Message-ID: <8CB245EE8F27983-E60-513@WEBMAIL-DZ02.sysops.aol.com> Dear List, In the spirit of getting to a mirror finish for 2008: 1 set: $ 6.99 US domestic postage paid !!! 2 sets: $11.99 US domestic postage paid !!! 3 sets: $15.99 US domestic postage paid !!! 4 sets: $19.49 US domestic postage paid !!! Paypal to my email address. Each set contains: one 100 grit 9"x11" sheet one 220 grit 9"x11" sheet one 400 grit 9"x11" sheet one 600 grit 9"x11" sheet one 800 grit 9"x11" sheet one 1200 grit 9"x11" sheet They are European-made carbide (wet/dry) great quality sand paper for the collector who loves caring for meteorites and giving them your own shine so bright, to make any Nakhla dog salivate. I will ship these from the USA. International ask me for a postage quote (probably $2-$3 per set). Perfect to create a variety of nice finishes -Stony meteorites -Mesosiderites -(even) Iron meteorites Professional results Mirror-finished chondrites and achondrites slices. Preparation for the surface to be etched. Not difficult or time consuming for one piece. Great at home for modest to moderate needs. Clean material for a nickel test without wasting too much metal. Great in the field to window a specimen. Why buy, dirty a flat lap? better to pay as you go first. Save dirtying a saw on appropriately shaped pieces with slice or end cut potential :) Can cut to fit small power sanders if you are out of elbow grease. Useful to polish gravel dings in the paint of your meteorite-hunting Ferrari. The offer can't be beat. Best wishes and Great Health, Doug From geoking at notkin.net Thu Dec 4 15:16:21 2008 From: geoking at notkin.net (Notkin) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 13:16:21 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] [AD] Super Sikhote-Alins, eBay "Meteorite" mag, etc. Message-ID: <42F84E59-5D9F-46BE-BEF8-4AF7D9C1BC9A@notkin.net> Dear Listees: Greetings and many thanks to those of you who kindly commented on this month's "Meteorwritings" column. A few items of interest: I recently acquired a collection of super excellent Sikhote-Alin individuals. These are among the best I've ever seen, and I've put them together on one special page. Several have small natural holes and all have fabulous sculptural shapes. Definitely worth a look: http://www.aerolite.org/sikhote-alin-meteorites.htm We've also redesigned our entire sale catalogue and added many new pieces, including some Glenn Huss specimens with original collection numbers and matching AML labels, moldavites, Libyan Desert Glass, a couple of small Brenhams, and some oriented Tazas: http://www.aerolite.org/meteorites-for-sale.htm All new additions can be viewed on one page here: http://www.aerolite.org/new.htm On the eBay front, I have super rare copies of "Meteorite" and "Voyage" magazines ending tonight: "Meteorite": http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160301286251 "Voyage": http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170282651870 The August 2004 issue of "M" includes my all-time favorite published story, "Lingua Franconia," about my first visit to the Franconia strewnfield in the company of the late, great Jim Kriegh. On that one amazing weekend I met meteorite hunters Sonny Clary, Ruben Garcia, and Mike Miller for the first time. And we've all had quite a few adventures together since then : ) The "Voyage" issue includes a Rob Elliott article about hunting at Holbrook. Ending on Sunday is a whole batch of stuff including a lovely brecciated part slice of Dar al Gani 956: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170282631693 A cute crusted Allende: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170282364822 A cool collector's set of six different iron meteorites: Sikhote-Alin, Henbury, Gibeon, Taza, Mundrabilla and Campo del Cielo http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170283612602 And Bensour, Juancheng, Gao, some nice NWA 869 individuals, etc. All items up for auction can be seen here: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQfgtpZ1QQfrppZ25QQsassZaerolitemeteorites Instant recap with photos live and direct from Jedi webmaster Paul Harris at Meteorite.com: http://www.meteorite.com/meteorite-dealers/dealer-listings/aerolite.htm As always, all my auctions are NO RESERVE. Thank you for looking and if you have any questions you can now call Aerolite toll-free at: 888 SKY ROXX Regards to all from sunny Tucson, Geoff N. www.aerolite.org www.campometeorites.com From p.marmet at sunrise.ch Thu Dec 4 15:41:55 2008 From: p.marmet at sunrise.ch (Peter Marmet) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 21:41:55 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - NWA 3081 (CK5/6), NWA 4734 (stunning Lunar) Message-ID: <871799a20812041241q158850at8038a693354c68e9@mail.gmail.com> Hello All, On ebay I have a big (3.8 g) slice of NWA 3081, a rare CK5/6 (only 653 g outside Antarctica!). BTW: If interested, I also have a great - professionally made - thin section (USD 100.00) for sale. On ebay I also have two great thin slices of NWA 4734, the stunning shergottite-like LUNAR, for a very nice price. Please click here for NWA 3081 and NWA 4734: http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/pema9_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZ Thank you, Peter, IMCA 2747 http://www.marmet-meteorites.com/ From parkforestmet at hotmail.com Thu Dec 4 16:35:15 2008 From: parkforestmet at hotmail.com (bill kies) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 15:35:15 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorites, Elements and The Periodic Table Message-ID: I understand that many mineral constituents of meteorites are regarded as still unrepresented among native terrestrial products. Are there any elements that are unique to meteorites? _________________________________________________________________ Send e-mail faster without improving your typing skills. http://windowslive.com/Explore/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_speed_122008 From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Thu Dec 4 17:34:27 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 14:34:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] MRO HiRISE Images - November 26, 2008 Message-ID: <200812042234.OAA06056@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> MARS RECONNAISSANCE ORBITER HIRISE IMAGES November 26, 2008 o Yardangs in South Amazonis http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_010334_1760 o Volcanic Fissure Vent in Elysium Planitia http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_010269_1900 o Aeolian Features, Large and Small http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_010221_1420 o Complex Terrain East of Holden Crater http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_010197_1540 o Hydraotes Chaos http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_009709_1810 o Meander in Valley Network http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_009706_2125 o Student Image of the Week: Kasei Valles http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_006005_2050 All of the HiRISE images are archived here: http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/ Information about the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter is online at http://www.nasa.gov/mro. The mission is managed by NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, a division of the California Institute of Technology, for the NASA Science Mission Directorate, Washington, D.C. Lockheed Martin Space Systems, of Denver, is the prime contractor and built the spacecraft. HiRISE is operated by the University of Arizona. Ball Aerospace and Technologies Corp., of Boulder, Colo., built the HiRISE instrument. From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Thu Dec 4 17:38:49 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 14:38:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Return of the Leonids Message-ID: <200812042238.OAA07452@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2008/04dec_leonids2009.htm Return of the Leonids NASA Science News 12.04.2008 Dec. 4, 2008: Astronomers from Caltech and NASA say a strong shower of Leonid meteors is coming in 2009. Their prediction follows an outburst on Nov. 17, 2008, that broke several years of "Leonid quiet" and heralds even more intense activity next November. "On Nov. 17, 2009, we expect the Leonids to produce upwards of 500 meteors per hour," says Bill Cooke of the NASA Marshall Space Flight Center. "That's a very strong display." Forecasters define a meteor storm as 1000 or more meteors per hour. That would make the 2009 Leonids "a half-storm," says Jeremie Vaubaillon of Caltech, who successfully predicted a related outburst just a few weeks ago. On Nov. 17, 2008, Earth passed through a stream of debris from comet 55P/Tempel-Tuttle. The gritty, dusty debris stream was laid down by the Leonids' parent comet more than five hundred years ago in 1466. Almost no one expected the old stream to produce a very strong shower, but it did. Observers in Asia and Europe counted as many as 100 meteors per hour. Vaubaillon predicted the crossing with one-hour precision. "I have a computer program that calculates the orbits of Leonid debris streams," he explains. "It does a good job anticipating encounters even with very old streams like this one." The Nov. 17, 2008 outburst proved that the 1466 stream is rich in meteor-producing debris, setting the stage for an even better display in 2009. On Nov. 17, 2009, Earth will pass through the 1466 stream again, but this time closer to the center. Based on the number of meteors observed in 2008, Vaubaillon can estimate the strength of the coming display: five hundred or more Leonids per hour during a few-hour peak centered on 21:43 UT. "Our own independent model of the debris stream agrees," says Cooke. "We predict a sub-storm level outburst on Nov. 17, 2009, peaking sometime between 21:34 and 21:44 UT." The timing favors observers in Asia, although Cooke won't rule out a nice show over North America when darkness falls hours after the peak. "I hope so," he says. "It's a long way to Mongolia." Many readers will remember the great Leonid showers of 1998-2002. The best years (1999 and 2001) produced storms of up to 3000 Leonids per hour. The 2009 display won't be so intense. Instead, if predictions are correct, next year's shower could resemble the 1998 Leonids, a "half-storm"-level event caused by a stream dating from 1333. That old stream turned out to be rich in nugget-sized debris that produced an abundance of fireballs. Many observers consider the 1998 Leonids to be the best they've ever seen. Could 2009 be the same? Vaubaillon expects a similar number of meteors but fewer fireballs. If the models are correct, the 1466 stream in Earth???s path contains plenty of dust but not so many nuggets, thus reducing the fireball count. On the bright side, the Moon will be new next Nov. 17th so nothing will stand in the way of the shower reaching its full potential. Mark your calendar and stay tuned for updates from Science at NASA. From fuzzfoot at comcast.net Thu Dec 4 19:02:01 2008 From: fuzzfoot at comcast.net (Mike Bandli) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 00:02:01 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Beautiful Meteorite Auctions In-Reply-To: <8CB245EE8F27983-E60-513@WEBMAIL-DZ02.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <1662508162.1699001228435321055.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/astroartifacts Well, it is time to raise a little extra cash for upcoming Tucson expenses. I have nine fantastic meteorites ending this weekend. There is something for all types of collections and most are still at bargain prices. Please take a look if you have time: http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/astroartifacts Cheers, Mike Bandli From epgrondine at yahoo.com Thu Dec 4 19:02:20 2008 From: epgrondine at yahoo.com (E.P. Grondine) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 16:02:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Aliens coming Message-ID: <278508.34060.qm@web36907.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi - If you think that this is going to be used by the 2012 con men, wait until you see what they do with Comet Schwasmann Wachmann 3's return in 2011. E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Thu Dec 4 19:26:40 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 16:26:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] MRO Finds Martian Rock Record With 10 Beats to the Bar Message-ID: <200812050026.QAA12669@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.cfm?release=2008-227 NASA Orbiter Finds Martian Rock Record With 10 Beats to the Bar Jet Propulsion Laboratory December 04, 2008 PASADENA, Calif. -- Climate cycles persisting for millions of years on ancient Mars left a record of rhythmic patterns in thick stacks of sedimentary rock layers, revealed in three-dimensional detail by a telescopic camera on NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter. Researchers using the High Resolution Imaging Science Experiment camera report the first measurement of a periodic signal in the rocks of Mars. This pushes climate-cycle fingerprints much earlier in Mars' history than more recent rhythms seen in Martian ice layers. It also may rekindle debates about some patterns of rock layering on Earth. Layers of similar thickness repeat dozens to hundreds of times in rocks exposed inside four craters in the Arabia Terra region of Mars. In one of the craters, Becquerel, bundles of a 10-layer pattern repeat at least 10 times, which could correspond to a known 10-to-one pattern of changes in the tilt of the planet's rotation axis. "Each layer has weathered into a stair step in the topography where material that's more resistant to erosion lies on top of material that's less resistant to erosion," said Kevin Lewis of the California Institute of Technology, Pasadena, who is the lead author of a report on the periodic layering published in the Dec. 5 edition of the journal Science. Some periodic change in the environment appears to have affected how resistant the rock-forming sediments became, perhaps from changes in what size of sand or silt particles were deposited by the wind, or from how the particles were cemented together after deposition. Some of the individual layers are less than three feet thick. The camera, called HiRISE for short, took pairs of images of each site from slightly different angles in orbit, providing the stereo information necessary for determining each layer's thickness. "It's easy to be fooled without knowing the topography and measuring the layers in three dimensions," said Alfred McEwen of the University of Arizona, Tucson, principal investigator for the camera and a co-author of the new report. "With the stereo information, it is clear there's a repeating pattern to these layers." Geologists commonly find "rhythms," or repeating patterns, in sedimentary layers on Earth. Determining the source of the rhythms can be difficult. Some result from annual or tidal cycles, or from episodic flooding that may not be periodic at all, but the role of longer-term astronomical cycles has been debated. One step in showing that astronomical cycles can leave their mark in sediments came from finding repeating five-layer sets in some terrestrial bedrock, matching a known five-to-one ratio of two cyclical variations in Earth's orbit. Lewis and colleagues found something similar on Mars: "Our findings suggest that cycles of climate change led to the patterns we see recorded in the Mars rock layers today, possibly as a result of similar variations in Mars' orbit," he said. "Mars has a 10-to-one ratio in cycles of how its tilt changes -- smaller wobbles within larger packages. Sure enough, we see a 10-to-one ratio in one of these layered deposits. It's like trying to identify a song -- it's easier if there are multiple instruments playing different parts, rather than just a single rhythm." In addition to having rhythm of 10 beats to the bar instead of Earth's five-beat pattern, Mars has characteristics that make it a good laboratory for studying how astronomical cycles affect climate. The tilt of Mars' axis varies much more than the axis of Earth, because Earth's relatively large moon provides a stabilizing effect. And, at least for most of its history, Mars has lacked the oceans and thick atmosphere that, on Earth, modulate the effects of orbital variations and add their own cyclical patterns. The 10-beat pattern of Mars' wobble lasts about 1.2 million years. If the 10-layer bundles in Becquerel crater are indeed signatures of that cycle, the 10 or more bundles stacked on each other record about 12 million years when environmental conditions affecting sedimentation were generally steady except for effects of the changing tilt. NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, a division of Caltech, manages the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter for NASA's Science Mission Directorate, Washington. Lockheed Martin Space Systems, Denver, is the prime contractor for the project and built the spacecraft. The HiRISE camera was built by Ball Aerospace and Technologies Corp., Boulder, and is operated by the University of Arizona. For more about the mission, visit: http://www.nasa.gov/mro . Media contacts: Guy Webster 818-354-6278 Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. guy.webster at jpl.nasa.gov Dwayne Brown 202-358-1726 NASA Headquarters, Washington dwayne.c.brown at nasa.gov 2008-227 From m42protosun at aol.com Thu Dec 4 20:00:26 2008 From: m42protosun at aol.com (m42protosun at aol.com) Date: Thu, 04 Dec 2008 20:00:26 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorites, Elements and The Periodic Table In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8CB248BFEBF5EC1-12B8-1EA@WEBMAIL-DY22.sysops.aol.com> Hi list and Bill, all matter of our solar system is produced from stars of the 1st and 2nd generation. Elements higher than Fe (iron) were produced by spallation. Therfore in the beginning (4,6 Byrs ago) the cloud from which our solar sysem was built up was homogenous, comtaining all elements of the PS as we know it tuday. Even the elements Pu+Np, Tc, Pm were abundant. Lot of radioactive isotopes of the elements were abundant, like 26Al. Depending of their short half-life the are today absent. But the stable daughter elemental isotopes are abundant. In CAIs of meteorites is an excess of 26Mg. Thats it. Uwe -----Urspr?ngliche Mitteilung----- Von: bill kies An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Verschickt: Do., 4. Dez. 2008, 22:35 Thema: [meteorite-list] Meteorites, Elements and The Periodic Table I understand that many mineral constituents of meteorites are regarded as still unrepresented among native terrestrial products. Are there any elements that are unique to meteorites? _________________________________________________________________ Send e-mail faster without improving your typing skills. http://windowslive.com/Explore/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_speed_122008 ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ________________________________________________________________________ AOL eMail auf Ihrem Hand y! Ab sofort k?nnen Sie auch unterwegs Ihre AOL email abrufen. Registrieren Sie sich jetzt kostenlos. From tommy2005 at hvc.rr.com Thu Dec 4 21:12:34 2008 From: tommy2005 at hvc.rr.com (Tom Randall (KB2SMS)) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 21:12:34 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] eBay's Spyware and Cookies Message-ID: <36E71A7E-1E8B-45D1-B6F1-D14AC247DC8E@hvc.rr.com> I am SO glad I ditched windows 10 years ago..... I.E. is a POS. Use firefox. Congrats to the new Canadian fall! --- http://home.hvc.rr.com/kb2sms/index.html From tett at rogers.com Thu Dec 4 21:36:29 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 21:36:29 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorites are not the only valuable we collect. Meteorite Mag. References: <36E71A7E-1E8B-45D1-B6F1-D14AC247DC8E@hvc.rr.com> Message-ID: Wow, a back issue of Meteorite Mag from 2004 just went on eBay for over $80! I have about 30 issues dating back to 1999. Perhaps I should start keeping them in ricker mounts! Cheers, Mike Tettenborn From Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr Fri Dec 5 02:14:35 2008 From: Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr (Zelimir Gabelica) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 08:14:35 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorites, Elements and The Periodic Table In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20081205081357.024252a0@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> No.... Zelimir A 15:35 04/12/2008 -0600, bill kies a ?crit : >I understand that many mineral constituents of meteorites are regarded as >still unrepresented among native terrestrial products. Are there any >elements that are unique to meteorites? >_________________________________________________________________ >Send e-mail faster without improving your typing skills. >http://windowslive.com/Explore/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_speed_122008 >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From mexicodoug at aim.com Fri Dec 5 04:43:14 2008 From: mexicodoug at aim.com (mexicodoug at aim.com) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 04:43:14 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor Brightens Night Sky (Denver 2008.12.04) Message-ID: <8CB24D5071F98DC-14B8-715@webmail-db15.sysops.aol.com> Looks like a listmember is getting some nice press... and that someone is throwing a lot of space rocks at the earth lately ... http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/18208878/detail.html Meteor Brightens Night Sky Fireball Spotted Across Front Range POSTED: 9:44 pm MST December 4, 2008 UPDATED: 11:02 pm MST December 4, 2008 DENVER -- Reports are coming in from all around Colorado about a bright object in the sky on Thursday night. Chris Peterson, astronomer at Cloudbait Observatory in Guffey, Colo., said he is receiving credible reports of the object pointing to a spectacular meteor display. The celestial spectacle occurred at around 8:43 p.m. Peterson said is happened about 60 to 70 degrees above the horizon, going from a west to east direction. By the trajectory and perceived proximity, Peterson estimated the meteor landed in the eastern part of the state. Denver and Aurora emergency crews were sent on several wild goose chases of the impact of the meteor. The reports ranged from Monaco Parkway and Hampden Avenue in Denver, all the way to 32nd Avenue and Airport Way in Aurora, to east of Denver International Airport. Eyewitness reports have come trickling in from as far away as Fairplay in Park County, to Estes Park, to Aspen Park in rural Jefferson County. Denver International Airport spokesman Jeff Green said air traffic controllers have reported heavy meteor activity the past few nights. Also Green confirmed it was not an aircraft in distress that was streaking across the sky. If you saw a meteor in the Thursday night sky, report it to the All Sky Network and the Cloudbait Observatory. From majbaermann at web.de Fri Dec 5 05:02:00 2008 From: majbaermann at web.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Matthias_B=E4rmann?=) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 11:02:00 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor Brightens Night Sky (Denver 2008.12.04) References: <8CB24D5071F98DC-14B8-715@webmail-db15.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <70EDE8EC6EB74AA2B35249ABF6741728@thinkcentre> This was Santa Anne in her glowing rednosed-reindeer-driven, ecologically absolutely uncritical flying drop-top, infatigably anxious to provide all her clients with heavenly objects in accurate SST (Santa Standard Time). Matthias ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 10:43 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor Brightens Night Sky (Denver 2008.12.04) > Looks like a listmember is getting some nice press... and that someone is > throwing a lot of space rocks at the earth lately ... > > http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/18208878/detail.html > > Meteor Brightens Night Sky > Fireball Spotted Across Front Range > > POSTED: 9:44 pm MST December 4, 2008 > UPDATED: 11:02 pm MST December 4, 2008 > > > DENVER -- Reports are coming in from all around Colorado about a bright > object in the sky on Thursday night. > > Chris Peterson, astronomer at Cloudbait Observatory in Guffey, Colo., said > he is receiving credible reports of the object pointing to a spectacular > meteor display. > > The celestial spectacle occurred at around 8:43 p.m. Peterson said is > happened about 60 to 70 degrees above the horizon, going from a west to > east direction. By the trajectory and perceived proximity, Peterson > estimated the meteor landed in the eastern part of the state. > > Denver and Aurora emergency crews were sent on several wild goose chases > of the impact of the meteor. The reports ranged from Monaco Parkway and > Hampden Avenue in Denver, all the way to 32nd Avenue and Airport Way in > Aurora, to east of Denver International Airport. > > Eyewitness reports have come trickling in from as far away as Fairplay in > Park County, to Estes Park, to Aspen Park in rural Jefferson County. > > Denver International Airport spokesman Jeff Green said air traffic > controllers have reported heavy meteor activity the past few nights. Also > Green confirmed it was not an aircraft in distress that was streaking > across the sky. > > If you saw a meteor in the Thursday night sky, report it to the All Sky > Network and the Cloudbait Observatory. > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael at spacerocksinc.com Fri Dec 5 06:39:58 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 03:39:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 5, 2008 Message-ID: <5373237.2102891228477198342.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_5_2008.html From meteoriteplaya at gmail.com Fri Dec 5 11:00:46 2008 From: meteoriteplaya at gmail.com (Mike Jensen) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 09:00:46 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] More on new Canadian meteorite Message-ID: <6f9da8300812050800y5c430a58ydb55ca00442ef8ab@mail.gmail.com> Hi All Here is a excellent narrative about the recovery of the original stones, the 13 kg stone, and a couple of new ones. http://skyriver.ca/astro/bruce/meteorite.htm Make sure you go all the way to the bottom of the page. -- Mike -- Mike Jensen Meteorites 16730 E Ada PL Aurora, CO 80017-3137 USA 720-949-6220 IMCA 4264 website: www.jensenmeteorites.com From grf2 at verizon.net Fri Dec 5 11:20:28 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 11:20:28 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 5, 2008 References: <5373237.2102891228477198342.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <13041C5BF06346EC90BA06844C2E93F5@ASUS> absolute chondrule city. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Johnson" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 6:39 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 5, 2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_5_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From sdunklee72520 at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 11:25:00 2008 From: sdunklee72520 at yahoo.com (Steve Dunklee) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 08:25:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 5, 2008 In-Reply-To: <13041C5BF06346EC90BA06844C2E93F5@ASUS> Message-ID: <276422.21077.qm@web33205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> The pic looks like a great background or screen saver! Have a great day Steve --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Jerry Flaherty wrote: > From: Jerry Flaherty > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 5, 2008 > To: "Michael Johnson" , "Meteorite List" > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:20 AM > absolute chondrule city. > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael > Johnson" > To: "Meteorite List" > > Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 6:39 AM > Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the > Day - December 5, 2008 > > > > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_5_2008.html > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoriteplaya at gmail.com Fri Dec 5 12:03:30 2008 From: meteoriteplaya at gmail.com (Mike Jensen) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 10:03:30 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: <6f9da8300812050903n7695df52h2adcbdfd9d6a9e47@mail.gmail.com> Hi All I am posting this for McCartney Taylor who has no access to the internet right now. He and Sonny have been hunting for pieces of the new Canadian fall. He said that about 90% of the strewnfield is impossible to hunt as Alan Hildebrand has secured it for his teams to hunt. McCartney also mentioned that people from all around the area are hunting on private property without permission. Most of that might be over as some light snow has fallen making searching quite difficult. The good news is they were able to get permission to hunt on some private property and have found a few smaller pieces. They would like to offer them up to Canadian residents only as they would need permission to export them out of the country. So if you live in Canada and would like to purchase one they have three pieces weighing 10-25 grams. The selling price is $50 per gram. They will be leaving within 12 hours so if you are interested in buying one please email McCartney ASAP so he can ship them before he leaves the country. He will have access to the internet later tonight so please email him your request. mccartney at blackbearddata.com Mike Mike Jensen Meteorites 16730 E Ada PL Aurora, CO 80017-3137 USA 720-949-6220 IMCA 4264 website: www.jensenmeteorites.com From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 12:05:13 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 09:05:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <6f9da8300812050903n7695df52h2adcbdfd9d6a9e47@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <614071.80420.qm@web110210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> $50.00 gram? Wow Bargain time. This is a huge fall. Michael Farmer --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Mike Jensen wrote: > From: Mike Jensen > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: "Meteorite Mailing List" > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:03 AM > Hi All > I am posting this for McCartney Taylor who has no access to > the > internet right now. He and Sonny have been hunting for > pieces of the > new Canadian fall. He said that about 90% of the > strewnfield is > impossible to hunt as Alan Hildebrand has secured it for > his teams to > hunt. > McCartney also mentioned that people from all around the > area are > hunting on private property without permission. Most of > that might be > over as some light snow has fallen making searching quite > difficult. > The good news is they were able to get permission to hunt > on some > private property and have found a few smaller pieces. They > would like > to offer them up to Canadian residents only as they would > need > permission to export them out of the country. So if you > live in Canada > and would like to purchase one they have three pieces > weighing 10-25 > grams. The selling price is $50 per gram. They will be > leaving within > 12 hours so if you are interested in buying one please > email McCartney > ASAP so he can ship them before he leaves the country. > He will have access to the internet later tonight so please > email him > your request. > > mccartney at blackbearddata.com > > > Mike > > > Mike Jensen Meteorites > 16730 E Ada PL > Aurora, CO 80017-3137 > USA > 720-949-6220 > IMCA 4264 > website: www.jensenmeteorites.com > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From gmhupe at htn.net Fri Dec 5 12:14:26 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 12:14:26 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale References: <6f9da8300812050903n7695df52h2adcbdfd9d6a9e47@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3DCA765D282C4569BFE3AAE9BDBA0F8B@Gregor> Hello Mike, Mike and List, Doesn't the Canadian government have first right of refusal on any meteorite sales/purchases? I thought I read from one of our Canadian List members that only after the Canadian government, museum or such, has opted not to purchase a meteorite, then the "land owner" has the right to sell the meteorite(s). I'd like to hear from our Canadian friends to see if there is a clear definanition of the Canadian law regarding this. Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Jensen" To: "Meteorite Mailing List" Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 12:03 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > Hi All > I am posting this for McCartney Taylor who has no access to the > internet right now. He and Sonny have been hunting for pieces of the > new Canadian fall. He said that about 90% of the strewnfield is > impossible to hunt as Alan Hildebrand has secured it for his teams to > hunt. > McCartney also mentioned that people from all around the area are > hunting on private property without permission. Most of that might be > over as some light snow has fallen making searching quite difficult. > The good news is they were able to get permission to hunt on some > private property and have found a few smaller pieces. They would like > to offer them up to Canadian residents only as they would need > permission to export them out of the country. So if you live in Canada > and would like to purchase one they have three pieces weighing 10-25 > grams. The selling price is $50 per gram. They will be leaving within > 12 hours so if you are interested in buying one please email McCartney > ASAP so he can ship them before he leaves the country. > He will have access to the internet later tonight so please email him > your request. > > mccartney at blackbearddata.com > > > Mike > > > Mike Jensen Meteorites > 16730 E Ada PL > Aurora, CO 80017-3137 > USA > 720-949-6220 > IMCA 4264 > website: www.jensenmeteorites.com > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 12:18:33 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 09:18:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <3DCA765D282C4569BFE3AAE9BDBA0F8B@Gregor> Message-ID: <968640.3416.qm@web110212.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> No, they have that right before issuing the permit, not to buy everything. so, should they still want the meteorite, they can make an offer before issuing the permit. Mike --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Greg Hupe wrote: > From: Greg Hupe > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: "Mike Jensen" , meteoriteguy at yahoo.com > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:14 AM > Hello Mike, Mike and List, > > Doesn't the Canadian government have first right of > refusal on any meteorite sales/purchases? I thought I read > from one of our Canadian List members that only after the > Canadian government, museum or such, has opted not to > purchase a meteorite, then the "land owner" has > the right to sell the meteorite(s). > > I'd like to hear from our Canadian friends to see if > there is a clear definanition of the Canadian law regarding > this. > > Best regards, > Greg > > ==================== > Greg Hupe > The Hupe Collection > NaturesVault (eBay) > gmhupe at htn.net > www.LunarRock.com > IMCA 3163 > ==================== > Click here for my current eBay auctions: > http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Jensen" > > To: "Meteorite Mailing List" > > Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 12:03 PM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for > sale > > > > Hi All > > I am posting this for McCartney Taylor who has no > access to the > > internet right now. He and Sonny have been hunting for > pieces of the > > new Canadian fall. He said that about 90% of the > strewnfield is > > impossible to hunt as Alan Hildebrand has secured it > for his teams to > > hunt. > > McCartney also mentioned that people from all around > the area are > > hunting on private property without permission. Most > of that might be > > over as some light snow has fallen making searching > quite difficult. > > The good news is they were able to get permission to > hunt on some > > private property and have found a few smaller pieces. > They would like > > to offer them up to Canadian residents only as they > would need > > permission to export them out of the country. So if > you live in Canada > > and would like to purchase one they have three pieces > weighing 10-25 > > grams. The selling price is $50 per gram. They will be > leaving within > > 12 hours so if you are interested in buying one please > email McCartney > > ASAP so he can ship them before he leaves the country. > > He will have access to the internet later tonight so > please email him > > your request. > > > > mccartney at blackbearddata.com > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > Mike Jensen Meteorites > > 16730 E Ada PL > > Aurora, CO 80017-3137 > > USA > > 720-949-6220 > > IMCA 4264 > > website: www.jensenmeteorites.com > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From MeteorHntr at aol.com Fri Dec 5 12:58:37 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 12:58:37 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: Greg, As I understand, the Canadian law was put in place to give Canadian Scientists first shot at ALL the grant money on research for any newly found meteorites in Canada. If any meteorite is allowed outside the Canadian borders, it would allow some other scientist or institution in another country to get that grant money. In some cases that grant money could total in the tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of dollars. I am not sure what Canadian Meteorite Researchers earn each year, but their salaries can't be cheap for their employers. So, as long as the physical rock stayed in Canada, then no harm can be done to the Canadian scientists. Years ago, I purchased a new Canadian Meteorite when I drove to Canada. I gave it to a Canadian collector to hold for me when I returned to the states to figure out what I wanted to do with it. I then sold the ownership of the rock to another American meteorite dealer, even though the rock always remained, and to this day it still remains in Canada. I would imagine, if this meteorite is indeed an ordinary chondrite, there will be little research money given to study it. So the scientists probably will not be interested in buying much of it, since there will be little to no return on their investment. If there is 100,000 grams eventually found, they probably will not want to pay over $10/g, or spend $1,000,000 if their grant money they will earn would be less than $1,000,000. The reason why the Canadians were willing to pay the one guy $650,000 for his 650g Tagish Lake, is because they could make so much MORE profit off the grant money to study that one. So if any finds from the Marsden Meteorite are submitted for an export permit, all the institutions in Canada will get to stall for 6 months to eventually end up saying that they don't want to buy any of them, providing that in the next 6 months they get more than enough donated to them for free, or if someone else wants to sell them some at below market values. I think the real question to be asked is HOW do they determine what the "fair market value" of the meteorites are? If Sonny and McCartney can find a buyer for $50 a gram, does that then force the government to now pay $50/g IF any others are found and the finders choose to request the export permit, and a Canadian institution would to buy them first? If Sonny or McCartney do not sell all of their finds at their asking price of $50/g, maybe they could put one of their finds up on Ebay, with the stipulation that the rock will NOT be shipped out of Canada, then Canadian bidders could help establish the retail value. Of course, a foreign buyer could bid and own it, even though they would not take actual physical possession of it. As I said before, IF the Canadian government is more than willing to pay a true fair market value on all found meteorites, then this is wonderful. It will encourage many people to go out and find meteorites in Canada knowing there is a reward waiting for their finds Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com In a message dated 12/5/2008 11:15:11 A.M. Central Standard Time, gmhupe at htn.net writes: Hello Mike, Mike and List, Doesn't the Canadian government have first right of refusal on any meteorite sales/purchases? I thought I read from one of our Canadian List members that only after the Canadian government, museum or such, has opted not to purchase a meteorite, then the "land owner" has the right to sell the meteorite(s). I'd like to hear from our Canadian friends to see if there is a clear definanition of the Canadian law regarding this. Best regards, Greg **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 13:10:12 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 10:10:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <179398.99397.qm@web110215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> This meteorite will end up with a retail value of ~$10 gram or so, give or take a few $ and perhaps $25 gram for small stones. There will be a huge amount of this meteorite found, the videos show every local schoolkid walking around with meteorites, and the real hunting hasnt even started yet. The snow is about to fall, putting the meteorite in deep freeze. Most of us hunters are talking and planning major hunts for springtime when the thaw comes. I forsee at least a few hundred kilos of stones being found. Canada will allow export of stones, that wont be a problem for a common chondrite, since the government will have plenty of material. Kudos to Sonny and McCartney, but the price will not be set be a single sale. Michael Farmer --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: gmhupe at htn.net, meteoriteplaya at gmail.com, meteoriteguy at yahoo.com > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:58 AM > Greg, > > As I understand, the Canadian law was put in place to give > Canadian > Scientists first shot at ALL the grant money on research > for any newly found > meteorites in Canada. > > If any meteorite is allowed outside the Canadian borders, > it would allow > some other scientist or institution in another country to > get that grant money. > In some cases that grant money could total in the tens of > thousands or > hundreds of thousands of dollars. > > I am not sure what Canadian Meteorite Researchers earn > each year, but their > salaries can't be cheap for their employers. > > So, as long as the physical rock stayed in Canada, then no > harm can be done > to the Canadian scientists. > > Years ago, I purchased a new Canadian Meteorite when I > drove to Canada. I > gave it to a Canadian collector to hold for me when I > returned to the states > to figure out what I wanted to do with it. I then sold > the ownership of the > rock to another American meteorite dealer, even though the > rock always > remained, and to this day it still remains in Canada. > > I would imagine, if this meteorite is indeed an ordinary > chondrite, there > will be little research money given to study it. So the > scientists probably > will not be interested in buying much of it, since there > will be little to no > return on their investment. > > If there is 100,000 grams eventually found, they probably > will not want to > pay over $10/g, or spend $1,000,000 if their grant money > they will earn would > be less than $1,000,000. > > The reason why the Canadians were willing to pay the one > guy $650,000 for > his 650g Tagish Lake, is because they could make so much > MORE profit off the > grant money to study that one. > > So if any finds from the Marsden Meteorite are submitted > for an export > permit, all the institutions in Canada will get to stall > for 6 months to > eventually end up saying that they don't want to buy > any of them, providing that in > the next 6 months they get more than enough donated to > them for free, or if > someone else wants to sell them some at below market > values. > > I think the real question to be asked is HOW do they > determine what the > "fair market value" of the meteorites are? > > If Sonny and McCartney can find a buyer for $50 a gram, > does that then force > the government to now pay $50/g IF any others are found > and the finders > choose to request the export permit, and a Canadian > institution would to buy them > first? If Sonny or McCartney do not sell all of their > finds at their > asking price of $50/g, maybe they could put one of their > finds up on Ebay, with > the stipulation that the rock will NOT be shipped out of > Canada, then Canadian > bidders could help establish the retail value. Of course, > a foreign buyer > could bid and own it, even though they would not take > actual physical > possession of it. > > As I said before, IF the Canadian government is more than > willing to pay a > true fair market value on all found meteorites, then this > is wonderful. It > will encourage many people to go out and find meteorites in > Canada knowing > there is a reward waiting for their finds > > Steve Arnold #1 > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > > > > > > In a message dated 12/5/2008 11:15:11 A.M. Central > Standard Time, > gmhupe at htn.net writes: > Hello Mike, Mike and List, > > Doesn't the Canadian government have first right of > refusal on any meteorite > sales/purchases? I thought I read from one of our Canadian > List members that > only after the Canadian government, museum or such, has > opted not to > purchase a meteorite, then the "land owner" has > the right to sell the > meteorite(s). > > I'd like to hear from our Canadian friends to see if > there is a clear > definanition of the Canadian law regarding this. > > Best regards, > Greg > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, > email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 13:15:15 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 10:15:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <179398.99397.qm@web110215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <647337.19914.qm@web45616.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I agree 100% on this. $50 per gram is too high, the Carancas for example was $100 per gram at first, now it can be had for under $20 per gram. I have read several places that it is only valued at $1 - $10 per gram. I will wait a bit myself. Greg --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Michael Farmer wrote: > From: Michael Farmer > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: gmhupe at htn.net, meteoriteplaya at gmail.com, MeteorHntr at aol.com > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 1:10 PM > This meteorite will end up with a retail value of ~$10 gram > or so, give or take a few $ and perhaps $25 gram for small > stones. There will be a huge amount of this meteorite found, > the videos show every local schoolkid walking around with > meteorites, and the real hunting hasnt even started yet. The > snow is about to fall, putting the meteorite in deep freeze. > Most of us hunters are talking and planning major hunts for > springtime when the thaw comes. > I forsee at least a few hundred kilos of stones being > found. > Canada will allow export of stones, that wont be a problem > for a common chondrite, since the government will have > plenty of material. > Kudos to Sonny and McCartney, but the price will not be set > be a single sale. > Michael Farmer > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com > wrote: > > > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian > Meteorite for sale > > To: gmhupe at htn.net, meteoriteplaya at gmail.com, > meteoriteguy at yahoo.com > > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:58 AM > > Greg, > > > > As I understand, the Canadian law was put in place to > give > > Canadian > > Scientists first shot at ALL the grant money on > research > > for any newly found > > meteorites in Canada. > > > > If any meteorite is allowed outside the Canadian > borders, > > it would allow > > some other scientist or institution in another > country to > > get that grant money. > > In some cases that grant money could total in the > tens of > > thousands or > > hundreds of thousands of dollars. > > > > I am not sure what Canadian Meteorite Researchers > earn > > each year, but their > > salaries can't be cheap for their employers. > > > > So, as long as the physical rock stayed in Canada, > then no > > harm can be done > > to the Canadian scientists. > > > > Years ago, I purchased a new Canadian Meteorite when > I > > drove to Canada. I > > gave it to a Canadian collector to hold for me when I > > returned to the states > > to figure out what I wanted to do with it. I then > sold > > the ownership of the > > rock to another American meteorite dealer, even > though the > > rock always > > remained, and to this day it still remains in Canada. > > > > I would imagine, if this meteorite is indeed an > ordinary > > chondrite, there > > will be little research money given to study it. So > the > > scientists probably > > will not be interested in buying much of it, since > there > > will be little to no > > return on their investment. > > > > If there is 100,000 grams eventually found, they > probably > > will not want to > > pay over $10/g, or spend $1,000,000 if their grant > money > > they will earn would > > be less than $1,000,000. > > > > The reason why the Canadians were willing to pay the > one > > guy $650,000 for > > his 650g Tagish Lake, is because they could make so > much > > MORE profit off the > > grant money to study that one. > > > > So if any finds from the Marsden Meteorite are > submitted > > for an export > > permit, all the institutions in Canada will get to > stall > > for 6 months to > > eventually end up saying that they don't want to > buy > > any of them, providing that in > > the next 6 months they get more than enough donated > to > > them for free, or if > > someone else wants to sell them some at below market > > values. > > > > I think the real question to be asked is HOW do they > > determine what the > > "fair market value" of the meteorites are? > > > > If Sonny and McCartney can find a buyer for $50 a > gram, > > does that then force > > the government to now pay $50/g IF any others are > found > > and the finders > > choose to request the export permit, and a Canadian > > institution would to buy them > > first? If Sonny or McCartney do not sell all of > their > > finds at their > > asking price of $50/g, maybe they could put one of > their > > finds up on Ebay, with > > the stipulation that the rock will NOT be shipped out > of > > Canada, then Canadian > > bidders could help establish the retail value. Of > course, > > a foreign buyer > > could bid and own it, even though they would not take > > actual physical > > possession of it. > > > > As I said before, IF the Canadian government is more > than > > willing to pay a > > true fair market value on all found meteorites, then > this > > is wonderful. It > > will encourage many people to go out and find > meteorites in > > Canada knowing > > there is a reward waiting for their finds > > > > Steve Arnold #1 > > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 12/5/2008 11:15:11 A.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > gmhupe at htn.net writes: > > Hello Mike, Mike and List, > > > > Doesn't the Canadian government have first right > of > > refusal on any meteorite > > sales/purchases? I thought I read from one of our > Canadian > > List members that > > only after the Canadian government, museum or such, > has > > opted not to > > purchase a meteorite, then the "land owner" > has > > the right to sell the > > meteorite(s). > > > > I'd like to hear from our Canadian friends to see > if > > there is a clear > > definanition of the Canadian law regarding this. > > > > Best regards, > > Greg > > > > **************Make your life easier with all your > friends, > > email, and > > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > > > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From info at mcomemeteorite.it Fri Dec 5 13:19:00 2008 From: info at mcomemeteorite.it (M come Meteorite Meteorites) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:19:00 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: <49397094.389.7a75.456401517@webmaildh6.aruba.it> $50/gr. for a big fall? Time some months and the price go under...I waiting matteo ----- Original Message ----- Da : "Mike Jensen" A : "Meteorite Mailing List" Oggetto : Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Data : Fri, 5 Dec 2008 10:03:30 -0700 > Hi All > I am posting this for McCartney Taylor who has no access > to the internet right now. He and Sonny have been hunting > for pieces of the new Canadian fall. He said that about > 90% of the strewnfield is impossible to hunt as Alan > Hildebrand has secured it for his teams to hunt. > McCartney also mentioned that people from all around the > area are hunting on private property without permission. > Most of that might be over as some light snow has fallen > making searching quite difficult. The good news is they > were able to get permission to hunt on some private > property and have found a few smaller pieces. They would > like to offer them up to Canadian residents only as they > would need permission to export them out of the country. > So if you live in Canada and would like to purchase one > they have three pieces weighing 10-25 grams. The selling > price is $50 per gram. They will be leaving within 12 > hours so if you are interested in buying one please email > McCartney ASAP so he can ship them before he leaves the > country. He will have access to the internet later tonight > so please email him your request. > > mccartney at blackbearddata.com > > > Mike > > > Mike Jensen Meteorites > 16730 E Ada PL > Aurora, CO 80017-3137 > USA > 720-949-6220 > IMCA 4264 > website: www.jensenmeteorites.com > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite Meteoriti info at mcomemeteorite.it http://www.mcomemeteorite.it http://www.mcomemeteorite.info Mindat Gallery http://www.mindat.org/gallery-5018.html From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 13:22:07 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 10:22:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <647337.19914.qm@web45616.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <940211.99222.qm@web110203.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> This is where pricing becomes difficult. Carancas was an extraordinary event. Very little material found, half of what was found was dust. $100 gram was a fair price, as I sold out at that price in hours. The 13 kilo piece of the Canadian fall weighs as much as nearly all of the Carancas found. Some pieces sell cheap now because people in Peru and Bolivia held too long, waiting for more money, while I and others filled up all buyers and museums, now there is not the demand because everyone already has it. Canada is a widespread fall, apparently everyone and their brother up there has found stones, so they will start trickling out. The videos make this fall a must have. I am not trying to set a price, just mulling over the last decade of falls and the price outcomes and this is where I see it ending up. Depends of course on export etc, but Canadian government will not spend millions of this chondrite. Tagish was a different creature, rarest meteorite almost that ever fell. We will see, it will take months to get export permits, time for TKW etc to firm up and tell us more. mike --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Greg Catterton wrote: > From: Greg Catterton > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 11:15 AM > I agree 100% on this. $50 per gram is too high, the Carancas > for example was $100 per gram at first, now it can be had > for under $20 per gram. > I have read several places that it is only valued at $1 - > $10 per gram. I will wait a bit myself. > > Greg > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Michael Farmer > wrote: > > > From: Michael Farmer > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian > Meteorite for sale > > To: gmhupe at htn.net, meteoriteplaya at gmail.com, > MeteorHntr at aol.com > > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 1:10 PM > > This meteorite will end up with a retail value of ~$10 > gram > > or so, give or take a few $ and perhaps $25 gram for > small > > stones. There will be a huge amount of this meteorite > found, > > the videos show every local schoolkid walking around > with > > meteorites, and the real hunting hasnt even started > yet. The > > snow is about to fall, putting the meteorite in deep > freeze. > > Most of us hunters are talking and planning major > hunts for > > springtime when the thaw comes. > > I forsee at least a few hundred kilos of stones being > > found. > > Canada will allow export of stones, that wont be a > problem > > for a common chondrite, since the government will have > > plenty of material. > > Kudos to Sonny and McCartney, but the price will not > be set > > be a single sale. > > Michael Farmer > > > > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com > > wrote: > > > > > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > > > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian > > Meteorite for sale > > > To: gmhupe at htn.net, meteoriteplaya at gmail.com, > > meteoriteguy at yahoo.com > > > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:58 AM > > > Greg, > > > > > > As I understand, the Canadian law was put in > place to > > give > > > Canadian > > > Scientists first shot at ALL the grant money on > > research > > > for any newly found > > > meteorites in Canada. > > > > > > If any meteorite is allowed outside the Canadian > > borders, > > > it would allow > > > some other scientist or institution in another > > country to > > > get that grant money. > > > In some cases that grant money could total in > the > > tens of > > > thousands or > > > hundreds of thousands of dollars. > > > > > > I am not sure what Canadian Meteorite Researchers > > > earn > > > each year, but their > > > salaries can't be cheap for their employers. > > > > > > > So, as long as the physical rock stayed in > Canada, > > then no > > > harm can be done > > > to the Canadian scientists. > > > > > > Years ago, I purchased a new Canadian Meteorite > when > > I > > > drove to Canada. I > > > gave it to a Canadian collector to hold for me > when I > > > returned to the states > > > to figure out what I wanted to do with it. I > then > > sold > > > the ownership of the > > > rock to another American meteorite dealer, even > > though the > > > rock always > > > remained, and to this day it still remains in > Canada. > > > > > > I would imagine, if this meteorite is indeed an > > ordinary > > > chondrite, there > > > will be little research money given to study it. > So > > the > > > scientists probably > > > will not be interested in buying much of it, > since > > there > > > will be little to no > > > return on their investment. > > > > > > If there is 100,000 grams eventually found, they > > probably > > > will not want to > > > pay over $10/g, or spend $1,000,000 if their > grant > > money > > > they will earn would > > > be less than $1,000,000. > > > > > > The reason why the Canadians were willing to pay > the > > one > > > guy $650,000 for > > > his 650g Tagish Lake, is because they could make > so > > much > > > MORE profit off the > > > grant money to study that one. > > > > > > So if any finds from the Marsden Meteorite are > > submitted > > > for an export > > > permit, all the institutions in Canada will get > to > > stall > > > for 6 months to > > > eventually end up saying that they don't > want to > > buy > > > any of them, providing that in > > > the next 6 months they get more than enough > donated > > to > > > them for free, or if > > > someone else wants to sell them some at below > market > > > values. > > > > > > I think the real question to be asked is HOW do > they > > > determine what the > > > "fair market value" of the meteorites > are? > > > > > > If Sonny and McCartney can find a buyer for $50 > a > > gram, > > > does that then force > > > the government to now pay $50/g IF any others > are > > found > > > and the finders > > > choose to request the export permit, and a > Canadian > > > institution would to buy them > > > first? If Sonny or McCartney do not sell all > of > > their > > > finds at their > > > asking price of $50/g, maybe they could put one > of > > their > > > finds up on Ebay, with > > > the stipulation that the rock will NOT be shipped > out > > of > > > Canada, then Canadian > > > bidders could help establish the retail value. > Of > > course, > > > a foreign buyer > > > could bid and own it, even though they would not > take > > > actual physical > > > possession of it. > > > > > > As I said before, IF the Canadian government is > more > > than > > > willing to pay a > > > true fair market value on all found meteorites, > then > > this > > > is wonderful. It > > > will encourage many people to go out and find > > meteorites in > > > Canada knowing > > > there is a reward waiting for their finds > > > > > > Steve Arnold #1 > > > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 12/5/2008 11:15:11 A.M. > Central > > > Standard Time, > > > gmhupe at htn.net writes: > > > Hello Mike, Mike and List, > > > > > > Doesn't the Canadian government have first > right > > of > > > refusal on any meteorite > > > sales/purchases? I thought I read from one of > our > > Canadian > > > List members that > > > only after the Canadian government, museum or > such, > > has > > > opted not to > > > purchase a meteorite, then the "land > owner" > > has > > > the right to sell the > > > meteorite(s). > > > > > > I'd like to hear from our Canadian friends > to see > > if > > > there is a clear > > > definanition of the Canadian law regarding this. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > Greg > > > > > > **************Make your life easier with all your > > friends, > > > email, and > > > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > > > > > > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > > > ______________________________________________ > > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From gmhupe at htn.net Fri Dec 5 13:45:53 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 13:45:53 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite References: <940211.99222.qm@web110203.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hello All, I hope all who are finding material from the new Canadian meteorite fall are sending their GPS coordinates to the investigating scientists so they can compile the data into their databases to get the best possible length and width of the strewnfield. Not only that, it is a great opportunity for scientists, hunters and collectors to work together! Congratulations to Sonny, McCartney and all who have already found some of this new chondrite!! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Farmer" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 1:22 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > This is where pricing becomes difficult. Carancas was an extraordinary > event. Very little material found, half of what was found was dust. $100 > gram was a fair price, as I sold out at that price in hours. > The 13 kilo piece of the Canadian fall weighs as much as nearly all of the > Carancas found. Some pieces sell cheap now because people in Peru and > Bolivia held too long, waiting for more money, while I and others filled > up all buyers and museums, now there is not the demand because everyone > already has it. > > Canada is a widespread fall, apparently everyone and their brother up > there has found stones, so they will start trickling out. The videos make > this fall a must have. I am not trying to set a price, just mulling over > the last decade of falls and the price outcomes and this is where I see it > ending up. Depends of course on export etc, but Canadian government will > not spend millions of this chondrite. Tagish was a different creature, > rarest meteorite almost that ever fell. > We will see, it will take months to get export permits, time for TKW etc > to firm up and tell us more. > mike > > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Greg Catterton wrote: > >> From: Greg Catterton >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 11:15 AM >> I agree 100% on this. $50 per gram is too high, the Carancas >> for example was $100 per gram at first, now it can be had >> for under $20 per gram. >> I have read several places that it is only valued at $1 - >> $10 per gram. I will wait a bit myself. >> >> Greg >> >> >> --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Michael Farmer >> wrote: >> >> > From: Michael Farmer >> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian >> Meteorite for sale >> > To: gmhupe at htn.net, meteoriteplaya at gmail.com, >> MeteorHntr at aol.com >> > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 1:10 PM >> > This meteorite will end up with a retail value of ~$10 >> gram >> > or so, give or take a few $ and perhaps $25 gram for >> small >> > stones. There will be a huge amount of this meteorite >> found, >> > the videos show every local schoolkid walking around >> with >> > meteorites, and the real hunting hasnt even started >> yet. The >> > snow is about to fall, putting the meteorite in deep >> freeze. >> > Most of us hunters are talking and planning major >> hunts for >> > springtime when the thaw comes. >> > I forsee at least a few hundred kilos of stones being >> > found. >> > Canada will allow export of stones, that wont be a >> problem >> > for a common chondrite, since the government will have >> > plenty of material. >> > Kudos to Sonny and McCartney, but the price will not >> be set >> > be a single sale. >> > Michael Farmer >> > >> > >> > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com >> > wrote: >> > >> > > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com >> >> > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian >> > Meteorite for sale >> > > To: gmhupe at htn.net, meteoriteplaya at gmail.com, >> > meteoriteguy at yahoo.com >> > > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:58 AM >> > > Greg, >> > > >> > > As I understand, the Canadian law was put in >> place to >> > give >> > > Canadian >> > > Scientists first shot at ALL the grant money on >> > research >> > > for any newly found >> > > meteorites in Canada. >> > > >> > > If any meteorite is allowed outside the Canadian >> > borders, >> > > it would allow >> > > some other scientist or institution in another >> > country to >> > > get that grant money. >> > > In some cases that grant money could total in >> the >> > tens of >> > > thousands or >> > > hundreds of thousands of dollars. >> > > >> > > I am not sure what Canadian Meteorite Researchers >> >> > earn >> > > each year, but their >> > > salaries can't be cheap for their employers. >> >> > > >> > > So, as long as the physical rock stayed in >> Canada, >> > then no >> > > harm can be done >> > > to the Canadian scientists. >> > > >> > > Years ago, I purchased a new Canadian Meteorite >> when >> > I >> > > drove to Canada. I >> > > gave it to a Canadian collector to hold for me >> when I >> > > returned to the states >> > > to figure out what I wanted to do with it. I >> then >> > sold >> > > the ownership of the >> > > rock to another American meteorite dealer, even >> > though the >> > > rock always >> > > remained, and to this day it still remains in >> Canada. >> > > >> > > I would imagine, if this meteorite is indeed an >> > ordinary >> > > chondrite, there >> > > will be little research money given to study it. >> So >> > the >> > > scientists probably >> > > will not be interested in buying much of it, >> since >> > there >> > > will be little to no >> > > return on their investment. >> > > >> > > If there is 100,000 grams eventually found, they >> > probably >> > > will not want to >> > > pay over $10/g, or spend $1,000,000 if their >> grant >> > money >> > > they will earn would >> > > be less than $1,000,000. >> > > >> > > The reason why the Canadians were willing to pay >> the >> > one >> > > guy $650,000 for >> > > his 650g Tagish Lake, is because they could make >> so >> > much >> > > MORE profit off the >> > > grant money to study that one. >> > > >> > > So if any finds from the Marsden Meteorite are >> > submitted >> > > for an export >> > > permit, all the institutions in Canada will get >> to >> > stall >> > > for 6 months to >> > > eventually end up saying that they don't >> want to >> > buy >> > > any of them, providing that in >> > > the next 6 months they get more than enough >> donated >> > to >> > > them for free, or if >> > > someone else wants to sell them some at below >> market >> > > values. >> > > >> > > I think the real question to be asked is HOW do >> they >> > > determine what the >> > > "fair market value" of the meteorites >> are? >> > > >> > > If Sonny and McCartney can find a buyer for $50 >> a >> > gram, >> > > does that then force >> > > the government to now pay $50/g IF any others >> are >> > found >> > > and the finders >> > > choose to request the export permit, and a >> Canadian >> > > institution would to buy them >> > > first? If Sonny or McCartney do not sell all >> of >> > their >> > > finds at their >> > > asking price of $50/g, maybe they could put one >> of >> > their >> > > finds up on Ebay, with >> > > the stipulation that the rock will NOT be shipped >> out >> > of >> > > Canada, then Canadian >> > > bidders could help establish the retail value. >> Of >> > course, >> > > a foreign buyer >> > > could bid and own it, even though they would not >> take >> > > actual physical >> > > possession of it. >> > > >> > > As I said before, IF the Canadian government is >> more >> > than >> > > willing to pay a >> > > true fair market value on all found meteorites, >> then >> > this >> > > is wonderful. It >> > > will encourage many people to go out and find >> > meteorites in >> > > Canada knowing >> > > there is a reward waiting for their finds >> > > >> > > Steve Arnold #1 >> > > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > In a message dated 12/5/2008 11:15:11 A.M. >> Central >> > > Standard Time, >> > > gmhupe at htn.net writes: >> > > Hello Mike, Mike and List, >> > > >> > > Doesn't the Canadian government have first >> right >> > of >> > > refusal on any meteorite >> > > sales/purchases? I thought I read from one of >> our >> > Canadian >> > > List members that >> > > only after the Canadian government, museum or >> such, >> > has >> > > opted not to >> > > purchase a meteorite, then the "land >> owner" >> > has >> > > the right to sell the >> > > meteorite(s). >> > > >> > > I'd like to hear from our Canadian friends >> to see >> > if >> > > there is a clear >> > > definanition of the Canadian law regarding this. >> > > >> > > Best regards, >> > > Greg >> > > >> > > **************Make your life easier with all your >> > friends, >> > > email, and >> > > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >> > > >> > >> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) >> > > ______________________________________________ >> > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> > > Meteorite-list mailing list >> > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > > >> > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > ______________________________________________ >> > http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> > Meteorite-list mailing list >> > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From MeteorHntr at aol.com Fri Dec 5 14:08:20 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 14:08:20 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite Message-ID: Greg and All, I agree Greg, and likewise I hope the Canadian Government Researchers are making their GPS coordinates of all their finds available to private hunters so that the private hunters can compile data into their GPS units to be able to get all the meteorites recovered from within the strewnfield. I totally agree with Greg, this is a great opportunity for scientists, hunters and collectors to work together. In fact, if the government employees would publicly state how much they would be willing to buy, and at what price they will pay, agreeing to let the rest go through the export permit process without challenge would be a great help too. If local land owners and hunters would know what the values would be, then better decisions could be made for everyone involved. Quotes in the newspapers that there "could be millions of dollars of meteorites on the ground" and that a head sized rock "could be worth $50,000" or that a "1 kilo rock is worth $10,000" is all nice, but it is so vague as to what the real values are that I am sure the locals are a bit confused right now. Letting the locals cash in on the finds will only help more Canadians in future falls get excited about going out and hunting too. It will turn out bad if all the locals think that if 500,000 g are found that they can automatically expect to get $5,000,000 (or more) out of it, then the government ends up only buying a kilo's worth and then no one else is interested in paying anything 6 months from now because a new fall (or 2 or 3) will have diverted everyone's attention elsewhere. Letting all the kilos of Tagish Lake fall to the bottom of the lake when the thaw came was an embarrassment for all the people claiming they were "acting in the best interest of science by not sharing the information." Here is their chance to redeem themselves, while the world is watching. If there is indeed thousands of stones, weighing hundreds of kilos total, there is no way a single college professor/researcher will be able to hunt the entire strewnfield... even if he took a 10 year sabbatical to keep hunting. But with cooperation with the private hunters, there is a chance that many if not most could be found in a short period of time, maybe in a year or two. We will see what happens... Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com In a message dated 12/5/2008 12:46:39 P.M. Central Standard Time, gmhupe at htn.net writes: Hello All, I hope all who are finding material from the new Canadian meteorite fall are sending their GPS coordinates to the investigating scientists so they can compile the data into their databases to get the best possible length and width of the strewnfield. Not only that, it is a great opportunity for scientists, hunters and collectors to work together! Congratulations to Sonny, McCartney and all who have already found some of this new chondrite!! Best regards, Greg **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Fri Dec 5 14:43:25 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 11:43:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Mars Odyssey THEMIS Images: December 1-5, 2008 Message-ID: <200812051943.LAA07245@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> MARS ODYSSEY THEMIS IMAGES December 1-5, 2008 o Polar Dunes (Released 01 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081201a o More Polar Dunes (Released 02 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081202a o Dunes (Released 03 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081203a o Terra Sabaea (Released 04 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081204a o More Terra Sabaea (Released 05 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081205a All of the THEMIS images are archived here: http://themis.asu.edu/latest.html NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory manages the 2001 Mars Odyssey mission for NASA's Office of Space Science, Washington, D.C. The Thermal Emission Imaging System (THEMIS) was developed by Arizona State University, Tempe, in co.oration with Raytheon Santa Barbara Remote Sensing. The THEMIS investigation is led by Dr. Philip Christensen at Arizona State University. Lockheed Martin Astronautics, Denver, is the prime contractor for the Odyssey project, and developed and built the orbiter. Mission operations are conducted jointly from Lockheed Martin and from JPL, a division of the California Institute of Technology in Pasadena. From Impactika at aol.com Fri Dec 5 14:49:22 2008 From: Impactika at aol.com (Impactika at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 14:49:22 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor Brightens Night Sky (Denver 2008.12.04) Message-ID: Thank you very much Matthias and Doug. In fact it was much too cold to be out last night. About the time that meteor was seen, the temperature was 7 degrees Farenheit, about minus 15 centigrades. So I didn't even see it. But thank you for your very funny post. Anne M. Black _http://www.impactika.com/_ (http://www.impactika.com/) _IMPACTIKA at aol.com_ (mailto:IMPACTIKA at aol.com) Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. _http://www.imca.cc/_ (http://www.imca.cc/) In a message dated 12/5/2008 3:02:21 AM Mountain Standard Time, majbaermann at web.de writes: This was Santa Anne in her glowing rednosed-reindeer-driven, ecologically absolutely uncritical flying drop-top, infatigably anxious to provide all her clients with heavenly objects in accurate SST (Santa Standard Time). Matthias ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 10:43 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor Brightens Night Sky (Denver 2008.12.04) > Looks like a listmember is getting some nice press... and that someone is > throwing a lot of space rocks at the earth lately ... > > http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/18208878/detail.html > > Meteor Brightens Night Sky > Fireball Spotted Across Front Range > > POSTED: 9:44 pm MST December 4, 2008 > UPDATED: 11:02 pm MST December 4, 2008 > > > DENVER -- Reports are coming in from all around Colorado about a bright > object in the sky on Thursday night. > > Chris Peterson, astronomer at Cloudbait Observatory in Guffey, Colo., said > he is receiving credible reports of the object pointing to a spectacular > meteor display. > > The celestial spectacle occurred at around 8:43 p.m. Peterson said is > happened about 60 to 70 degrees above the horizon, going from a west to > east direction. By the trajectory and perceived proximity, Peterson > estimated the meteor landed in the eastern part of the state. > > Denver and Aurora emergency crews were sent on several wild goose chases > of the impact of the meteor. The reports ranged from Monaco Parkway and > Hampden Avenue in Denver, all the way to 32nd Avenue and Airport Way in > Aurora, to east of Denver International Airport. > > Eyewitness reports have come trickling in from as far away as Fairplay in > Park County, to Estes Park, to Aspen Park in rural Jefferson County. > > Denver International Airport spokesman Jeff Green said air traffic > controllers have reported heavy meteor activity the past few nights. Also > Green confirmed it was not an aircraft in distress that was streaking > across the sky. > > If you saw a meteor in the Thursday night sky, report it to the All Sky > Network and the Cloudbait Observatory. > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 16:20:56 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 13:20:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Reminder, Bonhams sale, last day to bid. Message-ID: <698729.32358.qm@web110213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Just a reminder to everyone, the Bonhams Natural History Auction this Sunday, Dec 7 in LA, has a very nice selection of meteorites, many rarities, Martian and Lunar pieces. I have many pieces consigned to this auction, only one, the 500 gram Esquel has reserve, the others sell where they end. Get in there and bid. All bids must be in at least 24 hours ahead which really means today. You can also set up for phone bidding, but I think that also must be done like right now! I was going to attend, but today cancelled my plans. My wife and I have been very ill since returning from the Middle East, so in order to get ready for Japan and clean up 23 days of mail and other stuff which piles up when on month-long expeditions, I had to cancel my plans to attend in person. www.bonhams.com click on Natural History and you will see the auction, simply type in "meteorite" in search and you will see all of them. Michael Farmer From grf2 at verizon.net Fri Dec 5 17:34:32 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 17:34:32 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale References: <940211.99222.qm@web110203.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2CD11A10FA524D6BB8CC18F152ED5ECF@ASUS> Sounds sensible to me. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Farmer" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 1:22 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > This is where pricing becomes difficult. Carancas was an extraordinary > event. Very little material found, half of what was found was dust. $100 > gram was a fair price, as I sold out at that price in hours. > The 13 kilo piece of the Canadian fall weighs as much as nearly all of the > Carancas found. Some pieces sell cheap now because people in Peru and > Bolivia held too long, waiting for more money, while I and others filled > up all buyers and museums, now there is not the demand because everyone > already has it. > > Canada is a widespread fall, apparently everyone and their brother up > there has found stones, so they will start trickling out. The videos make > this fall a must have. I am not trying to set a price, just mulling over > the last decade of falls and the price outcomes and this is where I see it > ending up. Depends of course on export etc, but Canadian government will > not spend millions of this chondrite. Tagish was a different creature, > rarest meteorite almost that ever fell. > We will see, it will take months to get export permits, time for TKW etc > to firm up and tell us more. > mike > > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Greg Catterton wrote: > >> From: Greg Catterton >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 11:15 AM >> I agree 100% on this. $50 per gram is too high, the Carancas >> for example was $100 per gram at first, now it can be had >> for under $20 per gram. >> I have read several places that it is only valued at $1 - >> $10 per gram. I will wait a bit myself. >> >> Greg >> >> >> --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Michael Farmer >> wrote: >> >> > From: Michael Farmer >> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian >> Meteorite for sale >> > To: gmhupe at htn.net, meteoriteplaya at gmail.com, >> MeteorHntr at aol.com >> > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 1:10 PM >> > This meteorite will end up with a retail value of ~$10 >> gram >> > or so, give or take a few $ and perhaps $25 gram for >> small >> > stones. There will be a huge amount of this meteorite >> found, >> > the videos show every local schoolkid walking around >> with >> > meteorites, and the real hunting hasnt even started >> yet. The >> > snow is about to fall, putting the meteorite in deep >> freeze. >> > Most of us hunters are talking and planning major >> hunts for >> > springtime when the thaw comes. >> > I forsee at least a few hundred kilos of stones being >> > found. >> > Canada will allow export of stones, that wont be a >> problem >> > for a common chondrite, since the government will have >> > plenty of material. >> > Kudos to Sonny and McCartney, but the price will not >> be set >> > be a single sale. >> > Michael Farmer >> > >> > >> > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com >> > wrote: >> > >> > > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com >> >> > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian >> > Meteorite for sale >> > > To: gmhupe at htn.net, meteoriteplaya at gmail.com, >> > meteoriteguy at yahoo.com >> > > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:58 AM >> > > Greg, >> > > >> > > As I understand, the Canadian law was put in >> place to >> > give >> > > Canadian >> > > Scientists first shot at ALL the grant money on >> > research >> > > for any newly found >> > > meteorites in Canada. >> > > >> > > If any meteorite is allowed outside the Canadian >> > borders, >> > > it would allow >> > > some other scientist or institution in another >> > country to >> > > get that grant money. >> > > In some cases that grant money could total in >> the >> > tens of >> > > thousands or >> > > hundreds of thousands of dollars. >> > > >> > > I am not sure what Canadian Meteorite Researchers >> >> > earn >> > > each year, but their >> > > salaries can't be cheap for their employers. >> >> > > >> > > So, as long as the physical rock stayed in >> Canada, >> > then no >> > > harm can be done >> > > to the Canadian scientists. >> > > >> > > Years ago, I purchased a new Canadian Meteorite >> when >> > I >> > > drove to Canada. I >> > > gave it to a Canadian collector to hold for me >> when I >> > > returned to the states >> > > to figure out what I wanted to do with it. I >> then >> > sold >> > > the ownership of the >> > > rock to another American meteorite dealer, even >> > though the >> > > rock always >> > > remained, and to this day it still remains in >> Canada. >> > > >> > > I would imagine, if this meteorite is indeed an >> > ordinary >> > > chondrite, there >> > > will be little research money given to study it. >> So >> > the >> > > scientists probably >> > > will not be interested in buying much of it, >> since >> > there >> > > will be little to no >> > > return on their investment. >> > > >> > > If there is 100,000 grams eventually found, they >> > probably >> > > will not want to >> > > pay over $10/g, or spend $1,000,000 if their >> grant >> > money >> > > they will earn would >> > > be less than $1,000,000. >> > > >> > > The reason why the Canadians were willing to pay >> the >> > one >> > > guy $650,000 for >> > > his 650g Tagish Lake, is because they could make >> so >> > much >> > > MORE profit off the >> > > grant money to study that one. >> > > >> > > So if any finds from the Marsden Meteorite are >> > submitted >> > > for an export >> > > permit, all the institutions in Canada will get >> to >> > stall >> > > for 6 months to >> > > eventually end up saying that they don't >> want to >> > buy >> > > any of them, providing that in >> > > the next 6 months they get more than enough >> donated >> > to >> > > them for free, or if >> > > someone else wants to sell them some at below >> market >> > > values. >> > > >> > > I think the real question to be asked is HOW do >> they >> > > determine what the >> > > "fair market value" of the meteorites >> are? >> > > >> > > If Sonny and McCartney can find a buyer for $50 >> a >> > gram, >> > > does that then force >> > > the government to now pay $50/g IF any others >> are >> > found >> > > and the finders >> > > choose to request the export permit, and a >> Canadian >> > > institution would to buy them >> > > first? If Sonny or McCartney do not sell all >> of >> > their >> > > finds at their >> > > asking price of $50/g, maybe they could put one >> of >> > their >> > > finds up on Ebay, with >> > > the stipulation that the rock will NOT be shipped >> out >> > of >> > > Canada, then Canadian >> > > bidders could help establish the retail value. >> Of >> > course, >> > > a foreign buyer >> > > could bid and own it, even though they would not >> take >> > > actual physical >> > > possession of it. >> > > >> > > As I said before, IF the Canadian government is >> more >> > than >> > > willing to pay a >> > > true fair market value on all found meteorites, >> then >> > this >> > > is wonderful. It >> > > will encourage many people to go out and find >> > meteorites in >> > > Canada knowing >> > > there is a reward waiting for their finds >> > > >> > > Steve Arnold #1 >> > > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > In a message dated 12/5/2008 11:15:11 A.M. >> Central >> > > Standard Time, >> > > gmhupe at htn.net writes: >> > > Hello Mike, Mike and List, >> > > >> > > Doesn't the Canadian government have first >> right >> > of >> > > refusal on any meteorite >> > > sales/purchases? I thought I read from one of >> our >> > Canadian >> > > List members that >> > > only after the Canadian government, museum or >> such, >> > has >> > > opted not to >> > > purchase a meteorite, then the "land >> owner" >> > has >> > > the right to sell the >> > > meteorite(s). >> > > >> > > I'd like to hear from our Canadian friends >> to see >> > if >> > > there is a clear >> > > definanition of the Canadian law regarding this. >> > > >> > > Best regards, >> > > Greg >> > > >> > > **************Make your life easier with all your >> > friends, >> > > email, and >> > > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >> > > >> > >> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) >> > > ______________________________________________ >> > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> > > Meteorite-list mailing list >> > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > > >> > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > ______________________________________________ >> > http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> > Meteorite-list mailing list >> > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Fri Dec 5 17:40:40 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 15:40:40 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor Brightens Night Sky (Denver 2008.12.04) References: <8CB24D5071F98DC-14B8-715@webmail-db15.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <1977AA0A398844EE960362A932FE5D0B@bellatrix> Unfortunately, a snow storm was just clearing out of the area at the time, and all the cameras that might have caught this were still clouded out. But over 60 people have filed reports, from Utah, across Colorado, and into Nebraska. So I can estimate the path. The meteor was fairly slow, not too steep, and seems to have fragmented into two or three pieces. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a new strewn field out in eastern Colorado. I've put a map of the approximate ground path at http://www.cloudbait.com/science/fireball20081204.html Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 2:43 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor Brightens Night Sky (Denver 2008.12.04) > Looks like a listmember is getting some nice press... and that someone is > throwing a lot of space rocks at the earth lately ... > > http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/18208878/detail.html > > Meteor Brightens Night Sky > Fireball Spotted Across Front Range From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 17:47:08 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 14:47:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor Brightens Night Sky (Denver 2008.12.04) In-Reply-To: <1977AA0A398844EE960362A932FE5D0B@bellatrix> Message-ID: <936339.94054.qm@web110203.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Man,when it rains, it pours! Why cant one of these fall over Tucson or Phoenix, always sunny, easy hunting, totally recoverable! In the last year, how many nice fireballs over Colo and the Northwest, none recovered! Hopefully some farmer finds a large black rock in his barn today. Michael Farmer --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Chris Peterson wrote: > From: Chris Peterson > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteor Brightens Night Sky (Denver 2008.12.04) > To: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 3:40 PM > Unfortunately, a snow storm was just clearing out of the > area at the time, and all the cameras that might have caught > this were still clouded out. But over 60 people have filed > reports, from Utah, across Colorado, and into Nebraska. So I > can estimate the path. The meteor was fairly slow, not too > steep, and seems to have fragmented into two or three > pieces. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a new > strewn field out in eastern Colorado. I've put a map of > the approximate ground path at > http://www.cloudbait.com/science/fireball20081204.html > > Chris > > ***************************************** > Chris L Peterson > Cloudbait Observatory > http://www.cloudbait.com > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: > > To: > Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 2:43 AM > Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor Brightens Night Sky > (Denver 2008.12.04) > > > > Looks like a listmember is getting some nice press... > and that someone is throwing a lot of space rocks at the > earth lately ... > > > > > http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/18208878/detail.html > > > > Meteor Brightens Night Sky > > Fireball Spotted Across Front Range > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 17:51:33 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 14:51:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <940211.99222.qm@web110203.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <245270.5901.qm@web45616.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I see this as being true about the total weight available and thats why I think that the $50 per gram is way too much to pay for this fall. In a few months it will be able to be purchased for a much lower cost. Yes, I do think that the amount of video will add to the price some, but not much more then the typical new falls bring in. I think the price range given for this fall of between $1 - $10 per gram will be correct as more material becomes available. Its not like there is not alot available as Mike said about the Carancas fall... That said, I am looking for a sample of this, but wont pay $50 per gram for it. I for one am looking forward to the hunters trips and will wait until then to make my purchase unless someone offers me a sample at a more reasonable price. --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Michael Farmer wrote: > From: Michael Farmer > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, star_wars_collector at yahoo.com > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 1:22 PM > This is where pricing becomes difficult. Carancas was an > extraordinary event. Very little material found, half of > what was found was dust. $100 gram was a fair price, as I > sold out at that price in hours. > The 13 kilo piece of the Canadian fall weighs as much as > nearly all of the Carancas found. Some pieces sell cheap > now because people in Peru and Bolivia held too long, > waiting for more money, while I and others filled up all > buyers and museums, now there is not the demand because > everyone already has it. > > Canada is a widespread fall, apparently everyone and their > brother up there has found stones, so they will start > trickling out. The videos make this fall a must have. I am > not trying to set a price, just mulling over the last decade > of falls and the price outcomes and this is where I see it > ending up. Depends of course on export etc, but Canadian > government will not spend millions of this chondrite. Tagish > was a different creature, rarest meteorite almost that ever > fell. > We will see, it will take months to get export permits, > time for TKW etc to firm up and tell us more. > mike > > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Greg Catterton > wrote: > > > From: Greg Catterton > > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian > Meteorite for sale > > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 11:15 AM > > I agree 100% on this. $50 per gram is too high, the > Carancas > > for example was $100 per gram at first, now it can be > had > > for under $20 per gram. > > I have read several places that it is only valued at > $1 - > > $10 per gram. I will wait a bit myself. > > > > Greg > > > > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Michael Farmer > > wrote: > > > > > From: Michael Farmer > > > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian > > Meteorite for sale > > > To: gmhupe at htn.net, meteoriteplaya at gmail.com, > > MeteorHntr at aol.com > > > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 1:10 PM > > > This meteorite will end up with a retail value of > ~$10 > > gram > > > or so, give or take a few $ and perhaps $25 gram > for > > small > > > stones. There will be a huge amount of this > meteorite > > found, > > > the videos show every local schoolkid walking > around > > with > > > meteorites, and the real hunting hasnt even > started > > yet. The > > > snow is about to fall, putting the meteorite in > deep > > freeze. > > > Most of us hunters are talking and planning major > > hunts for > > > springtime when the thaw comes. > > > I forsee at least a few hundred kilos of stones > being > > > found. > > > Canada will allow export of stones, that wont be > a > > problem > > > for a common chondrite, since the government will > have > > > plenty of material. > > > Kudos to Sonny and McCartney, but the price will > not > > be set > > > be a single sale. > > > Michael Farmer > > > > > > > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com > > > wrote: > > > > > > > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > > > > > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New > Canadian > > > Meteorite for sale > > > > To: gmhupe at htn.net, > meteoriteplaya at gmail.com, > > > meteoriteguy at yahoo.com > > > > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:58 AM > > > > Greg, > > > > > > > > As I understand, the Canadian law was put > in > > place to > > > give > > > > Canadian > > > > Scientists first shot at ALL the grant money > on > > > research > > > > for any newly found > > > > meteorites in Canada. > > > > > > > > If any meteorite is allowed outside the > Canadian > > > borders, > > > > it would allow > > > > some other scientist or institution in > another > > > country to > > > > get that grant money. > > > > In some cases that grant money could total > in > > the > > > tens of > > > > thousands or > > > > hundreds of thousands of dollars. > > > > > > > > I am not sure what Canadian Meteorite > Researchers > > > > > earn > > > > each year, but their > > > > salaries can't be cheap for their > employers. > > > > > > > > > > So, as long as the physical rock stayed in > > Canada, > > > then no > > > > harm can be done > > > > to the Canadian scientists. > > > > > > > > Years ago, I purchased a new Canadian > Meteorite > > when > > > I > > > > drove to Canada. I > > > > gave it to a Canadian collector to hold for > me > > when I > > > > returned to the states > > > > to figure out what I wanted to do with it. > I > > then > > > sold > > > > the ownership of the > > > > rock to another American meteorite dealer, > even > > > though the > > > > rock always > > > > remained, and to this day it still remains > in > > Canada. > > > > > > > > I would imagine, if this meteorite is indeed > an > > > ordinary > > > > chondrite, there > > > > will be little research money given to study > it. > > So > > > the > > > > scientists probably > > > > will not be interested in buying much of it, > > since > > > there > > > > will be little to no > > > > return on their investment. > > > > > > > > If there is 100,000 grams eventually found, > they > > > probably > > > > will not want to > > > > pay over $10/g, or spend $1,000,000 if > their > > grant > > > money > > > > they will earn would > > > > be less than $1,000,000. > > > > > > > > The reason why the Canadians were willing to > pay > > the > > > one > > > > guy $650,000 for > > > > his 650g Tagish Lake, is because they could > make > > so > > > much > > > > MORE profit off the > > > > grant money to study that one. > > > > > > > > So if any finds from the Marsden Meteorite > are > > > submitted > > > > for an export > > > > permit, all the institutions in Canada will > get > > to > > > stall > > > > for 6 months to > > > > eventually end up saying that they > don't > > want to > > > buy > > > > any of them, providing that in > > > > the next 6 months they get more than enough > > donated > > > to > > > > them for free, or if > > > > someone else wants to sell them some at > below > > market > > > > values. > > > > > > > > I think the real question to be asked is HOW > do > > they > > > > determine what the > > > > "fair market value" of the > meteorites > > are? > > > > > > > > If Sonny and McCartney can find a buyer for > $50 > > a > > > gram, > > > > does that then force > > > > the government to now pay $50/g IF any > others > > are > > > found > > > > and the finders > > > > choose to request the export permit, and a > > Canadian > > > > institution would to buy them > > > > first? If Sonny or McCartney do not sell > all > > of > > > their > > > > finds at their > > > > asking price of $50/g, maybe they could put > one > > of > > > their > > > > finds up on Ebay, with > > > > the stipulation that the rock will NOT be > shipped > > out > > > of > > > > Canada, then Canadian > > > > bidders could help establish the retail > value. > > Of > > > course, > > > > a foreign buyer > > > > could bid and own it, even though they would > not > > take > > > > actual physical > > > > possession of it. > > > > > > > > As I said before, IF the Canadian government > is > > more > > > than > > > > willing to pay a > > > > true fair market value on all found > meteorites, > > then > > > this > > > > is wonderful. It > > > > will encourage many people to go out and > find > > > meteorites in > > > > Canada knowing > > > > there is a reward waiting for their finds > > > > > > > > Steve Arnold #1 > > > > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 12/5/2008 11:15:11 A.M. > > Central > > > > Standard Time, > > > > gmhupe at htn.net writes: > > > > Hello Mike, Mike and List, > > > > > > > > Doesn't the Canadian government have > first > > right > > > of > > > > refusal on any meteorite > > > > sales/purchases? I thought I read from one > of > > our > > > Canadian > > > > List members that > > > > only after the Canadian government, museum > or > > such, > > > has > > > > opted not to > > > > purchase a meteorite, then the "land > > owner" > > > has > > > > the right to sell the > > > > meteorite(s). > > > > > > > > I'd like to hear from our Canadian > friends > > to see > > > if > > > > there is a clear > > > > definanition of the Canadian law regarding > this. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > Greg > > > > > > > > **************Make your life easier with all > your > > > friends, > > > > email, and > > > > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > > > > > > > > > > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > > > > > ______________________________________________ > > > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > > > > > > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > ______________________________________________ > > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Fri Dec 5 17:56:15 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 05 Dec 2008 22:56:15 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Re-2: Meteor Brightens Night Sky (Denver 2008.12.04) Message-ID: > Man,when it rains, it pours! Wasn't there a song: "It never rains in *California* ?! ;-) > always sunny, easy hunting, totally recoverable! .. like the Tucson irons :-) > Hopefully some farmer finds a large black rock in his barn today. There's at least one *Farmer* out there :-)) Sorry, couldn't resist! Best, Bernd To: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com clp at alumni.caltech.edu From deanbessey at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 18:20:10 2008 From: deanbessey at yahoo.com (dean bessey) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 15:20:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Not a meteorite sale In-Reply-To: <245270.5901.qm@web45616.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <470374.93195.qm@web56102.mail.re3.yahoo.com> I was a bit excited when I first cut this as it looks like a nice howardite but it is in fact not a meteorite. One of the nicer reference items for your NWA meteor wrong collection. http://www.meteoriteshop.com/metsale/meteorwrong.html If anybody wants a nice conglomerate rock from NWA price is $8.95 including shipping anywhere in the world Sincerely DEAN BESSEY http://www.meteoriteshop.com/metsale/meteorwrong.html http://www.meteoriteshop.com From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Fri Dec 5 18:58:12 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 05 Dec 2008 23:58:12 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Not a meteorite sale Message-ID: Our New Zealander wrote: "I was a bit excited when I first cut this as it looks like a nice howardite but it is in fact not a meteorite. One of the nicer reference items for your NWA meteor wrong collection." http://www.meteoriteshop.com/metsale/meteorwrong.html Holy smokes! This must be one of the best meteor-wrongs I've ever seen !!! Best, Bernd To: deanbessey at yahoo.com meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com From romanj at sympatico.ca Fri Dec 5 19:21:34 2008 From: romanj at sympatico.ca (Roman) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 19:21:34 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale References: <6f9da8300812050903n7695df52h2adcbdfd9d6a9e47@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <026401c95738$98838130$6600a8c0@compaqsdg7ojf0> Good Guys, Great hunting skills, but no Canadian should pay that price! Cheers, Roman Jirasek ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Jensen" To: "Meteorite Mailing List" Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 12:03 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > Hi All > I am posting this for McCartney Taylor who has no access to the > internet right now. He and Sonny have been hunting for pieces of the > new Canadian fall. He said that about 90% of the strewnfield is > impossible to hunt as Alan Hildebrand has secured it for his teams to > hunt. > McCartney also mentioned that people from all around the area are > hunting on private property without permission. Most of that might be > over as some light snow has fallen making searching quite difficult. > The good news is they were able to get permission to hunt on some > private property and have found a few smaller pieces. They would like > to offer them up to Canadian residents only as they would need > permission to export them out of the country. So if you live in Canada > and would like to purchase one they have three pieces weighing 10-25 > grams. The selling price is $50 per gram. They will be leaving within > 12 hours so if you are interested in buying one please email McCartney > ASAP so he can ship them before he leaves the country. > He will have access to the internet later tonight so please email him > your request. > > mccartney at blackbearddata.com > > > Mike > > > Mike Jensen Meteorites > 16730 E Ada PL > Aurora, CO 80017-3137 > USA > 720-949-6220 > IMCA 4264 > website: www.jensenmeteorites.com > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From cynapse at charter.net Fri Dec 5 19:32:19 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:32:19 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Not a meteorite sale In-Reply-To: <470374.93195.qm@web56102.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <245270.5901.qm@web45616.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <470374.93195.qm@web56102.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Dec 2008 15:20:10 -0800 (PST), you wrote: >I was a bit excited when I first cut this as it looks like a nice howardite but it is in fact not a meteorite. One of the nicer reference items for your NWA meteor wrong collection. >http://www.meteoriteshop.com/metsale/meteorwrong.html >If anybody wants a nice conglomerate rock from NWA price is $8.95 including shipping anywhere in the world >Sincerely WOW, that's a hard site to read! Dean, trust me on this-- black text on a white background. From cynapse at charter.net Fri Dec 5 19:44:10 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:44:10 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] More on new Canadian meteorite In-Reply-To: <6f9da8300812050800y5c430a58ydb55ca00442ef8ab@mail.gmail.com> References: <6f9da8300812050800y5c430a58ydb55ca00442ef8ab@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Anyone got an idea on the type for the meteorite yet? From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Fri Dec 5 20:14:19 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 02:14:19 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <026401c95738$98838130$6600a8c0@compaqsdg7ojf0> References: <6f9da8300812050903n7695df52h2adcbdfd9d6a9e47@mail.gmail.com> <026401c95738$98838130$6600a8c0@compaqsdg7ojf0> Message-ID: <006c01c9573f$f787fb50$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Humm, Villalbeto, Moss, La Mancha/La Pice, Carancas, Cali, Zunhua, Hosur..... to me there seems to be an evident trend, that new falls get much higher paid, than all the years before. 4 of the world-record prices for new falls happened the recent few years. Exceptions are the nevertheless marvellous falls from North-Africa. So 50$ appears not so unusual to me. Who offers first, makes the pace. Whether this price is more justified or less justified won't depend on the tkw which will be recovered, it will depend on how much material will be allowed to be exported. Two main price factors exist for a meteorite. Type of course, but the same important: availability. Pattern for new falls: 1) First expensive - few offerers, collectors worried to miss out... 2) Falling prices, more providers, more material 3) Raising prices, often up to a level higher to the first offers, cause the stuff has gone. Speed, with which that happens, depends on how much material is set free and on how many sellers get involved. In worst case, step 2 won't take place. But that's nothing new, all know that. So you can hope with the new fall, that large quantities will be exported or/and that Heence&Koons get some in, so that it ends offered by many collectors and on ebay too, and if you're lucky, you will catch it at 5$ or 10$. But you can be not so lucky, in waiting, waiting....and only smaller quantities will hit the market, and after a while you will have to pay more than 50$, cause most could have been gone. Best! Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Roman Gesendet: Samstag, 6. Dezember 2008 01:22 An: Mike Jensen Cc: metlist Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Good Guys, Great hunting skills, but no Canadian should pay that price! Cheers, Roman Jirasek ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Jensen" To: "Meteorite Mailing List" Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 12:03 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > Hi All > I am posting this for McCartney Taylor who has no access to the > internet right now. He and Sonny have been hunting for pieces of the > new Canadian fall. He said that about 90% of the strewnfield is > impossible to hunt as Alan Hildebrand has secured it for his teams to > hunt. > McCartney also mentioned that people from all around the area are > hunting on private property without permission. Most of that might be > over as some light snow has fallen making searching quite difficult. > The good news is they were able to get permission to hunt on some > private property and have found a few smaller pieces. They would like > to offer them up to Canadian residents only as they would need > permission to export them out of the country. So if you live in Canada > and would like to purchase one they have three pieces weighing 10-25 > grams. The selling price is $50 per gram. They will be leaving within > 12 hours so if you are interested in buying one please email McCartney > ASAP so he can ship them before he leaves the country. > He will have access to the internet later tonight so please email him > your request. > > mccartney at blackbearddata.com > > > Mike > > > Mike Jensen Meteorites > 16730 E Ada PL > Aurora, CO 80017-3137 > USA > 720-949-6220 > IMCA 4264 > website: www.jensenmeteorites.com > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From gsac at gmx.net Fri Dec 5 20:22:20 2008 From: gsac at gmx.net (Alexander Seidel) Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 02:22:20 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] More on new Canadian meteorite In-Reply-To: References: <6f9da8300812050800y5c430a58ydb55ca00442ef8ab@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20081206012220.193030@gmx.net> > Anyone got an idea on the type for the meteorite yet? A reliable answer to this will probably influence a final price, besides the fact alone that it is a fresh Canadian fall with a remarkable TKW. I mean, even if it were narrowed down to being nothing but just an ordinary chondrite, it would make quite a difference if it were an LL3.x or, let?s say, another mainstream H5 or L6, right? Well, someone will have cut one or more specimens in the meantime, and the very first question - whether it is an ordinary chondrite or not - should be resolved by now, without much more in-depth analysis. Any news here? Alex Berlin/Germany From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 21:05:38 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 18:05:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <006c01c9573f$f787fb50$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Message-ID: <939478.36431.qm@web110205.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Martin, there are huge differences with these high-priced falls. No one could question Puerto Lapice, it sold out in minutes even at astronomical prices. less than 600 grams recovered, deserves every penny of the high price. Cali, 10 stones, 7 smashed houses, Colombia's first recovered fall, less than 500 grams TKW, H/L4, again, the market ate that one up, there is not a speck for sale as far as I know. Deserved the high price. Carancas, world-news making meteorite, little survived, Peru's first recovered fall, crater maker, what is not to like? Market absorbed it all, some straggler pieces dropped the price, but more due to market tapped out and world economic collapse than being overpriced. Moss, What more is there to say? The first CO3 fall in 60 years, NORWAY fall, all of 3.5 kilos recovered, 40% of which is in OSLO museum. That one deserved every penny it got, and how much Moss do you see out there these days? Zunhua, China house smasher, one stone, and when I started selling, there was just crumbs available. Later some large pieces were taken out of hiding, so price I think has come down a bit on that one. But not due to massive weight or anything. Hosur, I dint think it should be more than a few $$$$ gram, large fall, massive pieces, and from India, already making it problematic. I do not own any. Canada, this is different, we already know that hundreds of stones have been recovered, with a TKW likely already over 50 kilograms. The fireball videos suggest hundreds of kilos will be found, it is also a H type, so not rare. This will not sustain $50.00 gram, and should not. This one will stabilize at a low-mid price. I can't wait to get/find one, but I will wait for the winter freeze to end before I go up there! Martin, you see, I can easily make an argument for all of the recent falls and their high prices. This can not be made of the new Canadian fall, at least not at this time. Should something happen and not much more found or allowed out of Canada, well, then the sky is the limit. Michael Farmer --- On Fri, 12/5/08, Martin Altmann wrote: > From: Martin Altmann > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 6:14 PM > Humm, > > Villalbeto, Moss, La Mancha/La Pice, Carancas, Cali, > Zunhua, Hosur..... > > to me there seems to be an evident trend, that new falls > get much higher > paid, than all the years before. 4 of the world-record > prices for new falls > happened the recent few years. > > Exceptions are the nevertheless marvellous falls from > North-Africa. > > So 50$ appears not so unusual to me. > > Who offers first, makes the pace. > Whether this price is more justified or less justified > won't depend on the > tkw which will be recovered, it will depend on how much > material will be > allowed to be exported. Two main price factors exist for a > meteorite. Type > of course, but the same important: availability. > > Pattern for new falls: > 1) First expensive - few offerers, collectors worried to > miss out... > 2) Falling prices, more providers, more material > 3) Raising prices, often up to a level higher to the first > offers, cause the > stuff has gone. > > Speed, with which that happens, depends on how much > material is set free and > on how many sellers get involved. > > In worst case, step 2 won't take place. > > But that's nothing new, all know that. > > So you can hope with the new fall, that large quantities > will be exported > or/and that Heence&Koons get some in, so that it ends > offered by many > collectors and on ebay too, > and if you're lucky, you will catch it at 5$ or 10$. > > But you can be not so lucky, in waiting, waiting....and > only smaller > quantities will hit the market, and after a while you will > have to pay more > than 50$, cause most could have been gone. > > Best! > Martin > > > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im > Auftrag von Roman > Gesendet: Samstag, 6. Dezember 2008 01:22 > An: Mike Jensen > Cc: metlist > Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for > sale > > Good Guys, Great hunting skills, but no Canadian should pay > that price! > Cheers, > > Roman Jirasek > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mike Jensen" > > To: "Meteorite Mailing List" > > Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 12:03 PM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for > sale > > > > Hi All > > I am posting this for McCartney Taylor who has no > access to the > > internet right now. He and Sonny have been hunting for > pieces of the > > new Canadian fall. He said that about 90% of the > strewnfield is > > impossible to hunt as Alan Hildebrand has secured it > for his teams to > > hunt. > > McCartney also mentioned that people from all around > the area are > > hunting on private property without permission. Most > of that might be > > over as some light snow has fallen making searching > quite difficult. > > The good news is they were able to get permission to > hunt on some > > private property and have found a few smaller pieces. > They would like > > to offer them up to Canadian residents only as they > would need > > permission to export them out of the country. So if > you live in Canada > > and would like to purchase one they have three pieces > weighing 10-25 > > grams. The selling price is $50 per gram. They will be > leaving within > > 12 hours so if you are interested in buying one please > email McCartney > > ASAP so he can ship them before he leaves the country. > > He will have access to the internet later tonight so > please email him > > your request. > > > > mccartney at blackbearddata.com > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > Mike Jensen Meteorites > > 16730 E Ada PL > > Aurora, CO 80017-3137 > > USA > > 720-949-6220 > > IMCA 4264 > > website: www.jensenmeteorites.com > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From MeteorHntr at aol.com Fri Dec 5 21:32:03 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 21:32:03 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: All, I agree that this probably will sell for much lower in the future...well at least I hope Supply and Demand will allow the prices to come down later because a lot of it to comes on the market. But we should keep something else in mind here: I don't know how much TKW Sonny and McCartney personally found on their trip, but it is entirely possible that they simply don't want to sell much if any. Maybe they are thinking "Hey, if someone wants these bad enough, we will let them go." If no one wants them bad enough, they might just be happy to retain the ownership for the long haul. If they hold on, and later tons hit the market, maybe they will drop their asking price. If later the values go up, then maybe they will raise their prices. Just because they are asking a certain prices doesn't really mean that is what it is worth it to the rest of the world, maybe that is just what it is worth to them? Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorite.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Fri Dec 5 21:36:50 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 18:36:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <784320.46098.qm@web110204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I am not sure the discussion really centers on their asking price of $50.00 gram. It sort of morphed from Canadian Government buying price to retail price, to initial price etc. Someone suggested a piece be sold on eBay to set the price. Well, that was done with Cali and Puerto Lapice, and the price was very high. But eBay will never set a price. Show me 50 Sikhote-Alin auctions and I will show you 50 different gram prices for Sikhote-Alin. My part in this is simply to sort of separate why some recent falls set record prices, and others seem to be down to earth, and where the Canada fall will likely end up. I sure do hope there is a lot, I want to find some and sell some and buy some, and the more material, the better for all. Canada can be happy, there will be room for both scientists and collectors to get their fill. Michael Farmer --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 7:32 PM > All, > > I agree that this probably will sell for much lower in the > future...well at > least I hope Supply and Demand will allow the prices to > come down later > because a lot of it to comes on the market. > > But we should keep something else in mind here: I don't > know how much TKW > Sonny and McCartney personally found on their trip, but it > is entirely possible > that they simply don't want to sell much if any. Maybe > they are thinking > "Hey, if someone wants these bad enough, we will let > them go." If no one wants > them bad enough, they might just be happy to retain the > ownership for the > long haul. > > If they hold on, and later tons hit the market, maybe they > will drop their > asking price. If later the values go up, then maybe they > will raise their > prices. > > Just because they are asking a certain prices doesn't > really mean that is > what it is worth it to the rest of the world, maybe that > is just what it is > worth to them? > > Steve Arnold #1 > www.SteveArnoldMeteorite.com > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, > email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mccartney at blackbearddata.com Sat Dec 6 00:02:25 2008 From: mccartney at blackbearddata.com (McCartney Taylor) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 23:02:25 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] McCartney's News from the Canadian Fall Message-ID: The hunting is over, 5-10 cm of snow is predicted tonight. More fell last night. Searching is all but impossible at this point. The weather has been abnormally snow free up till this week. We have had the luck of securing 5% of the strewnfield. We also had the luck of a really great landowner at that. We've had to forfeit a sizable portion of our finds to this land owner, who fully deserves it for his co-operation with us. In fact, he deputized us to police his property and kick off the plethora of trespassers that was rampant after the news aired locally. The stone looks like an H6, but I'm not qualified to make a call on that. I do know that we're seeing alot of secondary crust, so perhaps this thing blew high? Sonny spotted some veining in some of his stones. I've managed to mainly find fully crusted individuals. I want everyone to know, my luggage was lost coming into Canada. So I searched in -22 Celsius with the clothes on my back that I wore on the plane. If you think you are a meteorite hunter, you will know when you crawl on your hands and knees looking for pee sized meteorites in -22C. You'll either cut it, or go home. Me...I'm still here. The fall looks big. But after today, the material coming out is going to stop. Most of the material we saw recovered was stolen. It will be claimed 'roadway'. I even heard of some falling on crown lands 10 km away! Interviews done indicate 15 'pops' when the fireball blew. It was a hell of a show, I hear. One person recalled his tin roof sounding like it was hit by hail stones. My best guess on TKW is about 35kg of which 30kg is in the hands of the Mitchell family/Dr Hildebrand. The Mitchell have expressed no interest in selling. The few locals who have offered material for sell are asking so much I can't touch it. Its that bad. Today we were interviewed by Canadian Broadcasting. Sonny did well in expressing space enthusiasm, while I did a short stint on the science and ballistics of the fall. Then we took the camera guy hunting. To my stunned eyes, we stumbled on a meteorite while walking 20m forward to find a shoot spot. That was caught on film. (68grams) Then within 20m we found a tiny 2nd one. Frilling amazing. They made a wrap because they were freezing and left. What totally killed me, was when I went back to hunting, I noticed the camera guy had STEPPED on another meteorite, about 25g. LOL! Funny funny. best -mt From michael at spacerocksinc.com Sat Dec 6 00:07:19 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 21:07:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Pictue of the Day - December 6, 2008 Message-ID: <30707243.2190461228540039709.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_6_2008.html From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Sat Dec 6 00:44:52 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 21:44:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] McCartney's News from the Canadian Fall In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <463500.72455.qm@web110204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Man, I wish I was there, but with just returning from a 23 day expedition to the other side of the planet and going to Japan Monday, I had no chance to make it. You say pieces are claimed 10 km away, that should be no problem, that is 6 miles, a normal strewnfield is that large, and of course, could be triple that for a truly huge fall, which this has the earmarks of. I envy you guys today though, not the cold part, but the finding of new fall stones, that gets my heart racing! Mike --- On Fri, 12/5/08, McCartney Taylor wrote: > From: McCartney Taylor > Subject: [meteorite-list] McCartney's News from the Canadian Fall > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:02 PM > The hunting is over, 5-10 cm of snow is predicted tonight. > More fell last night. Searching is all but impossible at > this point. The weather has been abnormally snow free up > till this week. > > We have had the luck of securing 5% of the strewnfield. We > also had the luck of a really great landowner at that. > We've had to forfeit a sizable portion of our finds to > this land owner, who fully deserves it for his co-operation > with us. In fact, he deputized us to police his property > and kick off the plethora of trespassers that was rampant > after the news aired locally. > > The stone looks like an H6, but I'm not qualified to > make a call on that. I do know that we're seeing alot > of secondary crust, so perhaps this thing blew high? Sonny > spotted some veining in some of his stones. I've > managed to mainly find fully crusted individuals. > > I want everyone to know, my luggage was lost coming into > Canada. So I searched in -22 Celsius with the clothes on my > back that I wore on the plane. If you think you are a > meteorite hunter, you will know when you crawl on your hands > and knees looking for pee sized meteorites in -22C. > You'll either cut it, or go home. Me...I'm still > here. > > The fall looks big. But after today, the material coming > out is going to stop. Most of the material we saw recovered > was stolen. It will be claimed 'roadway'. I even > heard of some falling on crown lands 10 km away! > > Interviews done indicate 15 'pops' when the > fireball blew. It was a hell of a show, I hear. One person > recalled his tin roof sounding like it was hit by hail > stones. > > My best guess on TKW is about 35kg of which 30kg is in the > hands of the Mitchell family/Dr Hildebrand. The Mitchell > have expressed no interest in selling. The few locals who > have offered material for sell are asking so much I > can't touch it. Its that bad. > > Today we were interviewed by Canadian Broadcasting. Sonny > did well in expressing space enthusiasm, while I did a short > stint on the science and ballistics of the fall. Then we > took the camera guy hunting. To my stunned eyes, we > stumbled on a meteorite while walking 20m forward to find a > shoot spot. That was caught on film. (68grams) Then within > 20m we found a tiny 2nd one. Frilling amazing. They made a > wrap because they were freezing and left. What totally > killed me, was when I went back to hunting, I noticed the > camera guy had STEPPED on another meteorite, about 25g. > LOL! Funny funny. > > best > -mt > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From yellowengine at earthlink.net Sat Dec 6 00:53:48 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 23:53:48 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] McCartney's News from the Canadian Fall Message-ID: <7392929.1228542828905.JavaMail.root@elwamui-muscovy.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Great news! Too bad Canada doesn't have free export laws like we have here in the U.S. So.. when do we get to see some photos? It's the next best thing to being there, without the cold. Have a warm evening, Ryan From mccartney at blackbearddata.com Sat Dec 6 00:54:07 2008 From: mccartney at blackbearddata.com (McCartney Taylor) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 23:54:07 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Claimed find on Crown Land in Canada Message-ID: <6293120f483f4a2fb68af223d89ac3a2@ucv1.vhostdns.com> Its total BS. The nearest crown land is sideways 10km. Not along the axis, simply the nearest crown land where someone who stole a rock off Ian Mitchell ranch could claim it and keep it. Mike you didn't believe the Cali, Columbia finds that were hundreds of km away in FARC territory either?... Most claim it hit a roadway. Its going to be a chronic claim from here on. The 13kg mass was originally claimed to be a roadway find, until Dr. Hilebrand browbeat the finder to give it back to Alister Mitchell who's land it was stolen from. That confrontation occurred at our hotel a few days before we got there. Just to clarify. -mt -------- Original Message -------- > From: Michael Farmer > Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 11:45 PM > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, mccartney at blackbearddata.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] McCartney's News from the Canadian Fall > > Man, I wish I was there, but with just returning from a 23 day expedition to the other side of the planet and going to Japan Monday, I had no chance to make it. > You say pieces are claimed 10 km away, that should be no problem, that is 6 miles, a normal strewnfield is that large, and of course, could be triple that for a truly huge fall, which this has the earmarks of. I envy you guys today though, not the cold part, but the finding of new fall stones, that gets my heart racing! > Mike > > > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, McCartney Taylor wrote: > > > From: McCartney Taylor > > Subject: [meteorite-list] McCartney's News from the Canadian Fall > > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:02 PM > > The hunting is over, 5-10 cm of snow is predicted tonight. > > More fell last night. Searching is all but impossible at > > this point. The weather has been abnormally snow free up > > till this week. > > > > We have had the luck of securing 5% of the strewnfield. We > > also had the luck of a really great landowner at that. > > We've had to forfeit a sizable portion of our finds to > > this land owner, who fully deserves it for his co-operation > > with us. In fact, he deputized us to police his property > > and kick off the plethora of trespassers that was rampant > > after the news aired locally. > > > > The stone looks like an H6, but I'm not qualified to > > make a call on that. I do know that we're seeing alot > > of secondary crust, so perhaps this thing blew high? Sonny > > spotted some veining in some of his stones. I've > > managed to mainly find fully crusted individuals. > > > > I want everyone to know, my luggage was lost coming into > > Canada. So I searched in -22 Celsius with the clothes on my > > back that I wore on the plane. If you think you are a > > meteorite hunter, you will know when you crawl on your hands > > and knees looking for pee sized meteorites in -22C. > > You'll either cut it, or go home. Me...I'm still > > here. > > > > The fall looks big. But after today, the material coming > > out is going to stop. Most of the material we saw recovered > > was stolen. It will be claimed 'roadway'. I even > > heard of some falling on crown lands 10 km away! > > > > Interviews done indicate 15 'pops' when the > > fireball blew. It was a hell of a show, I hear. One person > > recalled his tin roof sounding like it was hit by hail > > stones. > > > > My best guess on TKW is about 35kg of which 30kg is in the > > hands of the Mitchell family/Dr Hildebrand. The Mitchell > > have expressed no interest in selling. The few locals who > > have offered material for sell are asking so much I > > can't touch it. Its that bad. > > > > Today we were interviewed by Canadian Broadcasting. Sonny > > did well in expressing space enthusiasm, while I did a short > > stint on the science and ballistics of the fall. Then we > > took the camera guy hunting. To my stunned eyes, we > > stumbled on a meteorite while walking 20m forward to find a > > shoot spot. That was caught on film. (68grams) Then within > > 20m we found a tiny 2nd one. Frilling amazing. They made a > > wrap because they were freezing and left. What totally > > killed me, was when I went back to hunting, I noticed the > > camera guy had STEPPED on another meteorite, about 25g. > > LOL! Funny funny. > > > > best > > -mt > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Sat Dec 6 01:10:01 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 22:10:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Claimed find on Crown Land in Canada Message-ID: <512829.91445.qm@web110202.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I am not there so I have no idea of the strewnfield. 1o kilometers Is not the same as hundreds. All the bs makes it a perfectly normal fall though. Wait till you get anal-probed at the airport tomorrow. Dotnt be surprised if they have a trap waiting for you. Mike Sent from my iPhone Michael On Dec 5, 2008, at 10:54 PM, "McCartney Taylor" wrote: Its total BS. The nearest crown land is sideways 10km. Not along the axis, simply the nearest crown land where someone who stole a rock off Ian Mitchell ranch could claim it and keep it. Mike you didn't believe the Cali, Columbia finds that were hundreds of km away in FARC territory either?... Most claim it hit a roadway. Its going to be a chronic claim from here on. The 13kg mass was originally claimed to be a roadway find, until Dr. Hilebrand browbeat the finder to give it back to Alister Mitchell who's land it was stolen from. That confrontation occurred at our hotel a few days before we got there. Just to clarify. -mt -------- Original Message -------- From: Michael Farmer Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 11:45 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, mccartney at blackbearddata.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] McCartney's News from the Canadian Fall Man, I wish I was there, but with just returning from a 23 day expedition to the other side of the planet and going to Japan Monday, I had no chance to make it. You say pieces are claimed 10 km away, that should be no problem, that is 6 miles, a normal strewnfield is that large, and of course, could be triple that for a truly huge fall, which this has the earmarks of. I envy you guys today though, not the cold part, but the finding of new fall stones, that gets my heart racing! Mike --- On Fri, 12/5/08, McCartney Taylor wrote: From: McCartney Taylor Subject: [meteorite-list] McCartney's News from the Canadian Fall To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 10:02 PM The hunting is over, 5-10 cm of snow is predicted tonight. More fell last night. Searching is all but impossible at this point. The weather has been abnormally snow free up till this week. We have had the luck of securing 5% of the strewnfield. We also had the luck of a really great landowner at that. We've had to forfeit a sizable portion of our finds to this land owner, who fully deserves it for his co-operation with us. In fact, he deputized us to police his property and kick off the plethora of trespassers that was rampant after the news aired locally. The stone looks like an H6, but I'm not qualified to make a call on that. I do know that we're seeing alot of secondary crust, so perhaps this thing blew high? Sonny spotted some veining in some of his stones. I've managed to mainly find fully crusted individuals. I want everyone to know, my luggage was lost coming into Canada. So I searched in -22 Celsius with the clothes on my back that I wore on the plane. If you think you are a meteorite hunter, you will know when you crawl on your hands and knees looking for pee sized meteorites in -22C. You'll either cut it, or go home. Me...I'm still here. The fall looks big. But after today, the material coming out is going to stop. Most of the material we saw recovered was stolen. It will be claimed 'roadway'. I even heard of some falling on crown lands 10 km away! Interviews done indicate 15 'pops' when the fireball blew. It was a hell of a show, I hear. One person recalled his tin roof sounding like it was hit by hail stones. My best guess on TKW is about 35kg of which 30kg is in the hands of the Mitchell family/Dr Hildebrand. The Mitchell have expressed no interest in selling. The few locals who have offered material for sell are asking so much I can't touch it. Its that bad. Today we were interviewed by Canadian Broadcasting. Sonny did well in expressing space enthusiasm, while I did a short stint on the science and ballistics of the fall. Then we took the camera guy hunting. To my stunned eyes, we stumbled on a meteorite while walking 20m forward to find a shoot spot. That was caught on film. (68grams) Then within 20m we found a tiny 2nd one. Frilling amazing. They made a wrap because they were freezing and left. What totally killed me, was when I went back to hunting, I noticed the camera guy had STEPPED on another meteorite, about 25g. LOL! Funny funny. best -mt ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From dmerchan at rochester.rr.com Sat Dec 6 02:58:02 2008 From: dmerchan at rochester.rr.com (Don Merchant) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 02:58:02 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale References: <784320.46098.qm@web110204.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002101c95778$5daf9590$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant> I wanted to add my 2 cents to this......well actually my $50.00 to this post for the new Canadian Meteorite for Sale. One of the must categories I like to a collect in my collection are Recent or New Witnessed Falls, even if their not Hammers. A Meteorite being New /Recent/Witnessed and sharing the World Major News Stories carries a more desire for me to want a part of that history!! So with that said if anyone comes across a 1 gm or 2 gm piece or can relay this email to a reputable source willing to sell this meteorite to me for $50 a gm for 1 to 2 grams, have them please contact me ASAP. I will make an official request for this meteorite here and now. My feeling is that this offer will not be accepted anytime soon. Why? Because when something new comes along it seems the price is usually put higher then it should be at first regardless of it's composition. Yes you will get buyers willing at any cost to have a piece and there's nothing wrong with sellers/dealers making a few bucks for the work/efforts involved, I understand and accept this. But... to control the price the true power is in the Buyers. If the Buyers don't buy at that set price then eventually it is lowered until Buyers will buy. There really is truth in the power of numbers, meaning if all us collectors stick together and do not buy, the price will eventually come down. A dealer can say well heck with it I'll keep it in my collection but...sooner then later that dealer will have a big collection and no revenue which will eventually lead to a real IMPACT financially that the dealer wants no part of, especially in his/her collection! So I'm not gonna save face here.. lol I am a collector with a love for this hobby and weakness for this hobby. I figure if I can get this meteorite for $50 a gm now, I would be saving money instead of my passion for meteorites corrupting my common sense to hold off until prices drop. I always seem to allow my self to get lured in like a B-ass because I'm weak, I need it, I want it, I can't wait lol! I know many of you out there feel my PAIN!! So.....I have $100 set aside for a 2 gm. piece for the first legit seller to contact me for the exchange! I will keep all of you posted on this offer and how long it takes! By the way I meant no offence in this email to ANY Collector, Seller or Dealer in any way shape or form, I can only say just get that 2 gm. piece to me NOW!! lol Sincerely Don Merchant IMCA #0960 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Farmer" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 9:36 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale >I am not sure the discussion really centers on their asking price of $50.00 >gram. It sort of morphed from Canadian Government buying price to retail >price, to initial price etc. Someone suggested a piece be sold on eBay to >set the price. Well, that was done with Cali and Puerto Lapice, and the >price was very high. But eBay will never set a price. Show me 50 >Sikhote-Alin auctions and I will show you 50 different gram prices for >Sikhote-Alin. > My part in this is simply to sort of separate why some recent falls set > record prices, and others seem to be down to earth, and where the Canada > fall will likely end up. I sure do hope there is a lot, I want to find > some and sell some and buy some, and the more material, the better for > all. Canada can be happy, there will be room for both scientists and > collectors to get their fill. > > Michael Farmer > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: > >> From: MeteorHntr at aol.com >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 7:32 PM >> All, >> >> I agree that this probably will sell for much lower in the >> future...well at >> least I hope Supply and Demand will allow the prices to >> come down later >> because a lot of it to comes on the market. >> >> But we should keep something else in mind here: I don't >> know how much TKW >> Sonny and McCartney personally found on their trip, but it >> is entirely possible >> that they simply don't want to sell much if any. Maybe >> they are thinking >> "Hey, if someone wants these bad enough, we will let >> them go." If no one wants >> them bad enough, they might just be happy to retain the >> ownership for the >> long haul. >> >> If they hold on, and later tons hit the market, maybe they >> will drop their >> asking price. If later the values go up, then maybe they >> will raise their >> prices. >> >> Just because they are asking a certain prices doesn't >> really mean that is >> what it is worth it to the rest of the world, maybe that >> is just what it is >> worth to them? >> >> Steve Arnold #1 >> www.SteveArnoldMeteorite.com >> >> **************Make your life easier with all your friends, >> email, and >> favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From entropydave at ntlworld.com Sat Dec 6 05:06:50 2008 From: entropydave at ntlworld.com (Dave Harris) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 10:06:50 -0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Portales Valley slice -ebay AD Message-ID: Hi folks, the last few hours for the 29g full slice of PV... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&item=270310190635 thanks dave IMCA #0092 Sec.BIMS. www.bimsociety.org From psc2410xi at yahoo.com Sat Dec 6 08:10:51 2008 From: psc2410xi at yahoo.com (Don Rawlings) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 05:10:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <002101c95778$5daf9590$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant> Message-ID: <972537.11401.qm@web59316.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Unfortunately, a 2 gram piece for $100- today will probably sell on ebay for $10- next August. That is my prediction. Don Rawlings --- On Sat, 12/6/08, Don Merchant wrote: > From: Don Merchant > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com, meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, MeteorHntr at aol.com > Cc: "Don Merchant" > Date: Saturday, December 6, 2008, 2:58 AM > I wanted to add my 2 cents to this......well actually my > $50.00 to this post for the new Canadian Meteorite for Sale. > One of the must categories I like to a collect in my > collection are Recent or New Witnessed Falls, even if their > not Hammers. A Meteorite being New /Recent/Witnessed and > sharing the World Major News Stories carries a more desire > for me to want a part of that history!! So with that said if > anyone comes across a 1 gm or 2 gm piece or can relay this > email to a reputable source willing to sell this meteorite > to me for $50 a gm for 1 to 2 grams, have them please > contact me ASAP. I will make an official request for this > meteorite here and now. My feeling is that this offer will > not be accepted anytime soon. Why? Because when something > new comes along it seems the price is usually put higher > then it should be at first regardless of it's > composition. Yes you will get buyers willing at any cost to > have a piece and there's nothing wrong with > sellers/dealers making a few bucks for the work/efforts > involved, I understand and accept this. But... to control > the price the true power is in the Buyers. If the Buyers > don't buy at that set price then eventually it is > lowered until Buyers will buy. There really is truth in the > power of numbers, meaning if all us collectors stick > together and do not buy, the price will eventually come > down. A dealer can say well heck with it I'll keep it in > my collection but...sooner then later that dealer will have > a big collection and no revenue which will eventually lead > to a real IMPACT financially that the dealer wants no part > of, especially in his/her collection! So I'm not gonna > save face here.. lol I am a collector with a love for this > hobby and weakness for this hobby. I figure if I can get > this meteorite for $50 a gm now, I would be saving money > instead of my passion for meteorites corrupting my common > sense to hold off until prices drop. I always seem to allow > my self to get lured in like a B-ass because I'm weak, I > need it, I want it, I can't wait lol! I know many of you > out there feel my PAIN!! So.....I have $100 set aside for a > 2 gm. piece for the first legit seller to contact me for the > exchange! I will keep all of you posted on this offer and > how long it takes! By the way I meant no offence in this > email to ANY Collector, Seller or Dealer in any way shape or > form, I can only say just get that 2 gm. piece to me NOW!! > lol > Sincerely > Don Merchant > IMCA #0960 > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael > Farmer" > To: ; > > Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 9:36 PM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for > sale > > > > I am not sure the discussion really centers on their > asking price of $50.00 gram. It sort of morphed from > Canadian Government buying price to retail price, to initial > price etc. Someone suggested a piece be sold on eBay to set > the price. Well, that was done with Cali and Puerto Lapice, > and the price was very high. But eBay will never set a > price. Show me 50 Sikhote-Alin auctions and I will show you > 50 different gram prices for Sikhote-Alin. > > My part in this is simply to sort of separate why some > recent falls set record prices, and others seem to be down > to earth, and where the Canada fall will likely end up. I > sure do hope there is a lot, I want to find some and sell > some and buy some, and the more material, the better for > all. Canada can be happy, there will be room for both > scientists and collectors to get their fill. > > > > Michael Farmer > > > > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com > wrote: > > > >> From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > > >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian > Meteorite for sale > >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 7:32 PM > >> All, > >> > >> I agree that this probably will sell for much > lower in the > >> future...well at > >> least I hope Supply and Demand will allow the > prices to > >> come down later > >> because a lot of it to comes on the market. > >> > >> But we should keep something else in mind here: I > don't > >> know how much TKW > >> Sonny and McCartney personally found on their > trip, but it > >> is entirely possible > >> that they simply don't want to sell much if > any. Maybe > >> they are thinking > >> "Hey, if someone wants these bad enough, we > will let > >> them go." If no one wants > >> them bad enough, they might just be happy to > retain the > >> ownership for the > >> long haul. > >> > >> If they hold on, and later tons hit the market, > maybe they > >> will drop their > >> asking price. If later the values go up, then > maybe they > >> will raise their > >> prices. > >> > >> Just because they are asking a certain prices > doesn't > >> really mean that is > >> what it is worth it to the rest of the world, > maybe that > >> is just what it is > >> worth to them? > >> > >> Steve Arnold #1 > >> www.SteveArnoldMeteorite.com > >> > >> **************Make your life easier with all your > friends, > >> email, and > >> favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > >> > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > >> ______________________________________________ > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mccartney at blackbearddata.com Sat Dec 6 10:25:15 2008 From: mccartney at blackbearddata.com (McCartney Taylor) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 09:25:15 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait Message-ID: For the Americans and other non-Canadians emailing me, you all need to wait. We've got a Canadian colleague applying for customs paperwork next week. This will hold our material in Canada for several months as the Canadian Institutions will have an option to buy our material. Worst case should be 6 months. IMCA 2760 -mt From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Sat Dec 6 10:29:36 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 07:29:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] new canadian fall Message-ID: <779015.43813.qm@web57804.mail.re3.yahoo.com> I just want to give a nice plug to mac and sonny for doing such a great job giving us these news updates of this fall.But sure as we are all human,I know how people sometimes work,I bet there will some surfacing in tucson,2009.Just wait and see.Again way to go the 2 diligent meteorite hunters for giving these great updates. Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From gldfinder at yahoo.com Sat Dec 6 11:03:48 2008 From: gldfinder at yahoo.com (Larry Sloan) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 08:03:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Denver Meteor Fireball Message-ID: <95019.13056.qm@web39205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi List Thanks to Denny Asher who pointed me to this spectacular news story. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rH-NTr4cc04 Here I am at Portalas headed south for the winter instead of home in Colorado. Larry Sloan From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Sat Dec 6 11:14:26 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 09:14:26 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Denver Meteor Fireball References: <95019.13056.qm@web39205.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: While the video is spectacular, this wasn't a meteor. It was a reentering Soyuz rocket body on January 4, 2007. Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Sloan" To: Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 9:03 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Denver Meteor Fireball > Hi List > Thanks to Denny Asher who pointed me to this spectacular news story. > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rH-NTr4cc04 > > Here I am at Portalas headed south for the winter instead of home in > Colorado. > Larry Sloan From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Sat Dec 6 11:26:02 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 09:26:02 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Another huge Colorado fireball- and I mean huge Message-ID: <176961636CB444D6AD3DAD310AF1CFF5@bellatrix> Sorry to disturb Mike Farmer, who's probably still in the wrong place, but I recorded my brightest ever fireball early this morning. I estimate it was magnitude -18, at least 100 times brighter than the full Moon. It exploded near Colorado Springs. I don't have much information yet, but the raw information and video is at http://www.cloudbait.com/meteor/data.php?recnum=24710 . It was a dark night; all the sky lighting and horizon silhouettes are caused by the meteor exploding. Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com From jkg2 at cox.net Sat Dec 6 11:32:17 2008 From: jkg2 at cox.net (John Gwilliam) Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 09:32:17 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] -- SPAM -- Re: Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20081206163226.LWYI11567.fed1rmmtao104.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> My observation concerning new falls IPO is simple - there are some folks that the new material and they want it now. They are willing to pay the higher price. Those who wait usually...and I emphasize "usually" will get it at a much lower price. The two keys are timing and some good luck. John At 07:32 PM 12/5/2008, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: >All, > >I agree that this probably will sell for much lower in the future...well at >least I hope Supply and Demand will allow the prices to come down later >because a lot of it to comes on the market. > >But we should keep something else in mind here: I don't know how much TKW >Sonny and McCartney personally found on their trip, but it is >entirely possible >that they simply don't want to sell much if any. Maybe they are thinking >"Hey, if someone wants these bad enough, we will let them >go." If no one wants >them bad enough, they might just be happy to retain the ownership for the >long haul. > >If they hold on, and later tons hit the market, maybe they will drop their >asking price. If later the values go up, then maybe they will raise their >prices. > >Just because they are asking a certain prices doesn't really mean that is >what it is worth it to the rest of the world, maybe that is just what it is >worth to them? > >Steve Arnold #1 >www.SteveArnoldMeteorite.com > >**************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and >favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >(http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list John Gwilliam Too many people were born on third base and go through life thinking they hit a triple. From cynapse at charter.net Sat Dec 6 11:57:17 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 11:57:17 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Buzzard Coulee? Please let that be the name! In-Reply-To: <8CB24D5071F98DC-14B8-715@webmail-db15.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CB24D5071F98DC-14B8-715@webmail-db15.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: http://www.canada.com/saskatoonstarphoenix/news/third_page/story.html?id=d566c1a9-e9b6-4941-86b4-d3996a3e0620 Some great columns are best left unwritten Les MacPherson The StarPhoenix Saturday, December 06, 2008 Some of my favourite newspaper columns are the ones I didn't write. Consider, for example, the column I recently didn't write about the great meteorite, the disintegrated remains of which spectacularly fell to Earth the other week near Lloydminster. Scientists and treasure hunters by the hundreds promptly descended on the remote scene in hopes of finding fragments. By triangulating independent observations of the fireball, they reportedly had narrowed down the search area to about 10 square miles. Even so, I doubted they'd find so much as a particle. Ten square miles is a vast area to search for bits of blackened rock. In an area that size, you'd be lucky to find your way back to the car. It didn't help the fields would mostly be covered in stubble, pasture and bush and strewn with innumerable stones that are not meteorites. If you shanked a $5 golf ball into this stuff, you wouldn't bother to look for it. This, to me, is familiar territory. I have spent long hours combing exactly this kind of terrain for partridge or prairie chicken I've shot. In that case, the search area is just a few square yards and, still, a downed bird is exceedingly difficult to find. You have to almost step on it before you can see the thing. Finding fragments of a meteorite would be much more difficult, I thought. They'd be buried in the dirt like spent bullets, concealed under shrubbery and scattered among countless, look-alike stones blackened, not by a meteoric fusion crust, but by prairie dirt. You might as well try and pick fly specks out of pepper. My intention was to write a column expressing condolences for the meteorite hunters who were wasting their time. I would compare them to the dreamers who since the 1960s have fruitlessly scanned the airwaves for signals from space aliens. It's a bit sad to think of them waiting by the phone for 40 years. If they ever do get the call, they should let it ring a few times before answering so the aliens won't think they were waiting by the phone. I also meant to invoke in my column the equally fruitless search for life on Mars, still unconfirmed after dozens of unmanned spacecraft have flown by, orbited or landed on the inhospitable planet. Undismayed by the succession of dry holes, space agencies are planning further missions to seek out life on Mars. These would be the same kind of people who would scour the Earth to find an errant golf ball, no matter how long it takes. You have to admire their perseverance, so long as you're not playing behind them. My meteorite column would also make mention of the inauspicious omens. The area where it landed, for instance, is known as Buzzard Coulee. No successful project has ever been associated with a buzzard. I only hoped no searchers would get lost and find out why it's called Buzzard Coulee. I was just sitting down to chronicle the futility at Buzzard Coulee when all hell broke loose in Ottawa. Now preoccupied by a keystone coalition trying to hijack a government that Canadians just elected, I dropped the supercilious meteorite column in favour of indignant political commentary. Thus was I spared the profound embarrassment of predicting in print on the very day the first fragments were found that no fragment would ever be found. The first piece reportedly was discovered by a student with a team from the University of Calgary, who saw it embedded in pond ice. Pure luck, I thought at first. Even a blind hog occasionally finds an acorn. Except it wasn't luck. Searchers have since gathered more than 70 pieces, ranging in size from pea gravel to chunks as big as a soccer ball. What I haven't heard yet is of anyone who was searching and hasn't found a piece. That said, you have to wonder how many undistinguished field stones will be displayed on fireplace mantles as fragments of the famous Buzzard Coulee meteorite. Astronomers say it probably originated in the rocky asteroid belt between the orbits of Jupiter and Mars. Likely the 10-ton space rock was pulled out of orbit by Jupiter's gravity and then sent on a new trajectory that eventually intersected with Buzzard Coulee. What I'd like to know now is why no one saw it coming. lmacpherson at sp.canwest.com From yellowengine at earthlink.net Sat Dec 6 12:34:18 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 11:34:18 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait Message-ID: <16461351.1228584858999.JavaMail.root@mswamui-andean.atl.sa.earthlink.net> I think the next time the U.S. has another significant fall (..like Park Forest), American collectors and instituntions should have first dibs on the material. You know, a good 3-6 month head start over non-Americans. I still don't have a nice piece for my collection, and I was in Park Forest for 2-3 days! I'll bet there are plently of other collectors who will agree with me on this one. Ryan "For the Americans and other non-Canadians emailing me, you all need to wait. We've got a Canadian colleague applying for customs paperwork next week. This will hold our material in Canada for several months as the Canadian Institutions will have an option to buy our material. Worst case should be 6 months. IMCA 2760 -mt" From yellowengine at earthlink.net Sat Dec 6 13:00:45 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 12:00:45 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait Message-ID: <13753184.1228586445932.JavaMail.root@mswamui-andean.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Also, I just want to make notice that I did not, and have not contacted McCartney or Sonny in regards to acquiring a piece of this new fall. Laws are laws people, whether you agree with them or not. Ryan From MeteorHntr at aol.com Sat Dec 6 13:02:57 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 13:02:57 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait Message-ID: Ryan, I'm not sure I understand your logic here. If you wished American Institutions would care enough to pay a fair retail price to the legal owners of new meteorites, then I think we would all agree with you. But America has the principles of freedom and property rights that go strongly against confiscation laws. I think the ACLU would even consider stepping in if such a law would be proposed. When I find anything that I think a museum or a research collection would like, either to purchase or to trade for, I eagerly approach them at the start. But most take so long to reply, or don't reply at all. Some do, but express that they are not interested. And then occasionally some do reply wanting to make a trade. But unlike in Canada, here in the States a very tiny percentage of institutions will pay cash for anything. And due to some of the red tape that is involved with some places, I would LOVE it if the transaction could happen in less than 6 months time. I think hoping for any bureaucracy to do anything in as little as 3 months is a bit overoptimistic. And I am not sure how if US institutions would have had first dibs on buying any and all of the Park Forest specimens found would have helped YOU get a Park Forest specimen for your collection? In fact, during your 2-3 days in Park Forest IF you had found something, and the government confiscated it from you, and paid you $1/g or $5/g or $20/g or whatever they determined was fair, my guess is that you probably would not like the idea so much. Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com In a message dated 12/6/2008 11:34:33 A.M. Central Standard Time, yellowengine at earthlink.net writes: I think the next time the U.S. has another significant fall (..like Park Forest), American collectors and instituntions should have first dibs on the material. You know, a good 3-6 month head start over non-Americans. I still don't have a nice piece for my collection, and I was in Park Forest for 2-3 days! I'll bet there are plently of other collectors who will agree with me on this one. Ryan **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From MeteorHntr at aol.com Sat Dec 6 13:07:06 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 13:07:06 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait Message-ID: Ryan, There is no law in Canada that you can't contact McCartney or Sonny. In fact, you are free to buy whatever you want from them. The export laws only affect exporting of the specimens. No one has suggested that you can't own one of the rocks McCartney or Sonny found. You just can't take it (or ship it) over the border without first getting an export permit. Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com In a message dated 12/6/2008 12:01:12 P.M. Central Standard Time, yellowengine at earthlink.net writes: Also, I just want to make notice that I did not, and have not contacted McCartney or Sonny in regards to acquiring a piece of this new fall. Laws are laws people, whether you agree with them or not. Ryan **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From yellowengine at earthlink.net Sat Dec 6 13:23:25 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 12:23:25 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait Message-ID: <19189932.1228587805415.JavaMail.root@mswamui-andean.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Yes, and that will take 3-6 months, so why even bother contacting them now? At this time next year pieces will be able to be obtained at a more realistic price, so you'll be better off waiting anyhow. And do you really think I beleive that none of it will get smuggled across that border into the U.S.? Like McCartney said... "you all need to wait." "Ryan, There is no law in Canada that you can't contact McCartney or Sonny. In fact, you are free to buy whatever you want from them. The export laws only affect exporting of the specimens. No one has suggested that you can't own one of the rocks McCartney or Sonny found. You just can't take it (or ship it) over the border without first getting an export permit. Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com" From yellowengine at earthlink.net Sat Dec 6 13:40:06 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 12:40:06 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait Message-ID: <3818352.1228588807064.JavaMail.root@mswamui-andean.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Perhaps I should have left out the word "Institutions". My intent was to discuss the acquisition by private collectors only, being that Institutions clearly have an unequal advantage when it comes to acquiring fresh falls. More so in Canada as opposed to the U.S., however. But when the government steps in and confiscates, thats just communistic. -----Original Message----- >From: MeteorHntr at aol.com >Sent: Dec 6, 2008 12:02 PM >To: yellowengine at earthlink.net, meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, mccartney at blackbearddata.com >Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait > >Ryan, > >I'm not sure I understand your logic here. > >If you wished American Institutions would care enough to pay a fair retail >price to the legal owners of new meteorites, then I think we would all agree >with you. > >But America has the principles of freedom and property rights that go >strongly against confiscation laws. I think the ACLU would even consider stepping >in if such a law would be proposed. > >When I find anything that I think a museum or a research collection would >like, either to purchase or to trade for, I eagerly approach them at the start. > But most take so long to reply, or don't reply at all. Some do, but >express that they are not interested. And then occasionally some do reply wanting >to make a trade. But unlike in Canada, here in the States a very tiny >percentage of institutions will pay cash for anything. > >And due to some of the red tape that is involved with some places, I would >LOVE it if the transaction could happen in less than 6 months time. I think >hoping for any bureaucracy to do anything in as little as 3 months is a bit >overoptimistic. > >And I am not sure how if US institutions would have had first dibs on buying >any and all of the Park Forest specimens found would have helped YOU get a >Park Forest specimen for your collection? > >In fact, during your 2-3 days in Park Forest IF you had found something, and >the government confiscated it from you, and paid you $1/g or $5/g or $20/g >or whatever they determined was fair, my guess is that you probably would not >like the idea so much. > >Steve Arnold #1 >www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > >In a message dated 12/6/2008 11:34:33 A.M. Central Standard Time, >yellowengine at earthlink.net writes: >I think the next time the U.S. has another significant fall (..like Park >Forest), American collectors and instituntions should have first dibs on the >material. You know, a good 3-6 month head start over non-Americans. I still >don't have a nice piece for my collection, and I was in Park Forest for 2-3 days! > >I'll bet there are plently of other collectors who will agree with me on >this one. > >Ryan > >**************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and >favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >(http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From cynapse at charter.net Sat Dec 6 14:05:34 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 14:05:34 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait In-Reply-To: <13753184.1228586445932.JavaMail.root@mswamui-andean.atl.sa.earthlink.net> References: <13753184.1228586445932.JavaMail.root@mswamui-andean.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 6 Dec 2008 12:00:45 -0600 (GMT-06:00), you wrote: >Laws are laws people, whether you agree with them or not. Laws? Canada currently has no government. Its every man for himself! From romanj at sympatico.ca Sat Dec 6 14:12:02 2008 From: romanj at sympatico.ca (Roman) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 14:12:02 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait References: <13753184.1228586445932.JavaMail.root@mswamui-andean.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <037d01c957d6$85889b30$6600a8c0@compaqsdg7ojf0> That cracked me up pretty good! Roman > Laws? Canada currently has no government. Its every man for himself! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darren Garrison" To: Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 2:05 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait > On Sat, 6 Dec 2008 12:00:45 -0600 (GMT-06:00), you wrote: > >>Laws are laws people, whether you agree with them or not. > > Laws? Canada currently has no government. Its every man for himself! > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Sat Dec 6 16:50:27 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 13:50:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Oh great market sages, enlighten me! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <528720.98724.qm@web58405.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi Folks! I have an opportunity to buy some meteorites from a fellow collector who is looking to free up some cash for Christmas. He has offered me some interesting pieces, and some of them are rare types. My knowledge of market prices on some of these pieces is lacking, so I am appealing to the group to give me some advice on these pieces. Are they a good buy with the intention to keep? (not to resell) 1) NWA 3151 brachinite, .214g "micro slice" for $38 2) NWA 3135 ureilite, 1.1g chunk with crust on one edge for $35 3) NWA 482 lunar, 28mg for $38 4) NWA 998 martian, 32mg piece for $50 I'm mainly interested in the first 3. I already have a 998 specimen, so I will probably pass on that one. Provenance is very good. #3 and #4 are from the Hupe collection, and I think the first 2 are as well, but I'll have to check on that. Thanks! MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From MeteorHntr at aol.com Fri Dec 5 13:34:46 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 13:34:46 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: In a message dated 12/5/2008 12:16:00 P.M. Central Standard Time, star_wars_collector at yahoo.com writes: I agree 100% on this. $50 per gram is too high, the Carancas for example was $100 per gram at first, now it can be had for under $20 per gram. I have read several places that it is only valued at $1 - $10 per gram. I will wait a bit myself. Greg Greg and All, I tend to agree that the price MIGHT drop to $10/g, especially if there is a high degree of rusting on the specimens found later next year. However, there is a chance the Canadians might offer to buy all or most of the ones already found. If the land owners can get a tax credit on $50/g to donate them, everyone up there might be happy to donate them, and at a 50% tax rate, that is the same as getting $25/g cash in hand to the overtaxed Canadians. It sounds like most of the land owners are very wealthy, so money may not mean anything to them. They might donate them all and not even care about a tax break or cash values at all. If only a few kilos make it to the market place, then we could see the value be higher than $10/g. If we seen hundreds of rusty kilos coming onto the market, then we could see the prices end up way below $10/g. In any case, we probably will have to wait for the 6 months to pass to see what is not purchased by the Canadian Government. One thing is sure, if ALL the masses were put on a restricted Canadian only collector market, a few hundred kilos would probably sell for $0.10 a gram or even less. A smart thing might be to buy one specimen from Sonny and McCartney NOW at $50/g and then buy more later at $10/g and if the price goes down to under $1/g then buy so much more that you will have cost averaged your first purchase at $50/g down to a reasonable level. Of course, if you are one of those people that get a rush at owning the newest most famous meteorite that everyone is talking about around the water cooler, then how can you put a value on that??? :-) And also, realize that if you do buy a meteorite from Sonny and McCartney now, you are investing into field recovery. I seriously doubt they will make a profit on this trip even if they sold what little they found at $100/g, but if they can come close to breaking even, maybe next time they will again be able to afford to get on the scene early and find more. And at the very least, we should congratulate them on getting to the scene and making an effort. Good job guys, and congratulations! Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Sat Dec 6 17:47:19 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 14:47:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <305460.26244.qm@web110213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Steve, I am sorry, but your comment than they wont make profit at $50 or even $100 gram made me almost fall out of my chair! Lets see, a kilo at $50 gram = $50,000. Lets say half goes to the landowner, $25000.00 Plane ticket to Edmonton/Calgary/Saskatoon, all three less than $1000 if I want to go today. Rental car for a week, $500.00 Hotels and food for a week, another $800.00. Time, say $2500.00 other expenses, say another $1000 Still leaves over $18000.00 free. Please, what you are saying about values can be true, but lets not get retarded here. At that price some real money will be made for a week in the field. I should know, I have enough international hunts, and this one would be about the cheapest one out there. They deserve it, no question there, just dont try and say no profit will be made, that is a joke I have to call you on. International FALL chases I have done so I think I know about trip expedition expenses. Kendrapara, India Thuathe, Lesotho x 2 Bensour, Morocco Bilanga, Burkina Faso X 2 Berduc, Argentina Cali, colombia x 5 Carancas, Peru Ourique, Portugal Villabeto de la Pena, Spain Puerto Lapice, Spain Moss, Norway Tagish Lake, Canada --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com, meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 11:34 AM > In a message dated 12/5/2008 12:16:00 P.M. Central Standard > Time, > star_wars_collector at yahoo.com writes: > I agree 100% on this. $50 per gram is too high, the > Carancas for example was > $100 per gram at first, now it can be had for under $20 > per gram. > I have read several places that it is only valued at $1 - > $10 per gram. I > will wait a bit myself. > > Greg > > > Greg and All, > > I tend to agree that the price MIGHT drop to $10/g, > especially if there is a > high degree of rusting on the specimens found later next > year. > > However, there is a chance the Canadians might offer to > buy all or most of > the ones already found. > > If the land owners can get a tax credit on $50/g to donate > them, everyone up > there might be happy to donate them, and at a 50% tax > rate, that is the same > as getting $25/g cash in hand to the overtaxed Canadians. > > It sounds like most of the land owners are very wealthy, > so money may not > mean anything to them. They might donate them all and not > even care about a > tax break or cash values at all. > > If only a few kilos make it to the market place, then we > could see the value > be higher than $10/g. > > If we seen hundreds of rusty kilos coming onto the market, > then we could see > the prices end up way below $10/g. > > In any case, we probably will have to wait for the 6 months > to pass to see > what is not purchased by the Canadian Government. > > One thing is sure, if ALL the masses were put on a > restricted Canadian only > collector market, a few hundred kilos would probably sell > for $0.10 a gram or > even less. > > A smart thing might be to buy one specimen from Sonny and > McCartney NOW at > $50/g and then buy more later at $10/g and if the price > goes down to under > $1/g then buy so much more that you will have cost averaged > your first purchase > at $50/g down to a reasonable level. > > Of course, if you are one of those people that get a rush > at owning the > newest most famous meteorite that everyone is talking > about around the water > cooler, then how can you put a value on that??? > > :-) > > And also, realize that if you do buy a meteorite from > Sonny and McCartney > now, you are investing into field recovery. I seriously > doubt they will make a > profit on this trip even if they sold what little they > found at $100/g, but > if they can come close to breaking even, maybe next time > they will again be > able to afford to get on the scene early and find more. > > And at the very least, we should congratulate them on > getting to the scene > and making an effort. > > Good job guys, and congratulations! > > Steve Arnold #1 > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, > email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Sat Dec 6 17:56:10 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 14:56:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <368666.67545.qm@web45601.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> In my opinion, from the info I have seen I would be willing to pay more then $10 per gram for fresh material, however I do think $50 is simply too much for what looks to be an ordinary chondrite. I am hopefull that the material will not rust too bad during all this snow, and Im sure plenty of it will be available in Tucson as was metioned by someone else. That said, I would also like to buy a 2 gram or so piece of fresh material, but really would prefer not to pay much more then $20-$25 per gram... to me it would be worth that price, regardless of classification... my little girl keeps asking when I am getting one... This fall like the Carancas really got her interested in meteorites (this one even more) due to the media attention and wide availablitly of video footage. If anyone gets ahold of some and wants to sell or trade for a small sample, please let me know. Greg --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com, meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 1:34 PM > In a message dated 12/5/2008 12:16:00 P.M. Central Standard > Time, > star_wars_collector at yahoo.com writes: > I agree 100% on this. $50 per gram is too high, the > Carancas for example was > $100 per gram at first, now it can be had for under $20 > per gram. > I have read several places that it is only valued at $1 - > $10 per gram. I > will wait a bit myself. > > Greg > > > Greg and All, > > I tend to agree that the price MIGHT drop to $10/g, > especially if there is a > high degree of rusting on the specimens found later next > year. > > However, there is a chance the Canadians might offer to > buy all or most of > the ones already found. > > If the land owners can get a tax credit on $50/g to donate > them, everyone up > there might be happy to donate them, and at a 50% tax > rate, that is the same > as getting $25/g cash in hand to the overtaxed Canadians. > > It sounds like most of the land owners are very wealthy, > so money may not > mean anything to them. They might donate them all and not > even care about a > tax break or cash values at all. > > If only a few kilos make it to the market place, then we > could see the value > be higher than $10/g. > > If we seen hundreds of rusty kilos coming onto the market, > then we could see > the prices end up way below $10/g. > > In any case, we probably will have to wait for the 6 months > to pass to see > what is not purchased by the Canadian Government. > > One thing is sure, if ALL the masses were put on a > restricted Canadian only > collector market, a few hundred kilos would probably sell > for $0.10 a gram or > even less. > > A smart thing might be to buy one specimen from Sonny and > McCartney NOW at > $50/g and then buy more later at $10/g and if the price > goes down to under > $1/g then buy so much more that you will have cost averaged > your first purchase > at $50/g down to a reasonable level. > > Of course, if you are one of those people that get a rush > at owning the > newest most famous meteorite that everyone is talking > about around the water > cooler, then how can you put a value on that??? > > :-) > > And also, realize that if you do buy a meteorite from > Sonny and McCartney > now, you are investing into field recovery. I seriously > doubt they will make a > profit on this trip even if they sold what little they > found at $100/g, but > if they can come close to breaking even, maybe next time > they will again be > able to afford to get on the scene early and find more. > > And at the very least, we should congratulate them on > getting to the scene > and making an effort. > > Good job guys, and congratulations! > > Steve Arnold #1 > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, > email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From MeteorHntr at aol.com Sat Dec 6 17:59:27 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 17:59:27 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: In a message dated 12/6/2008 4:47:37 P.M. Central Standard Time, meteoriteguy at yahoo.com writes: Steve, I am sorry, but your comment than they wont make profit at $50 or even $100 gram made me almost fall out of my chair! Lets see, a kilo at $50 gram = $50,000. Lets say half goes to the landowner, $25000.00 I'm sorry Mike, I was not aware they found a kilo's worth and that they got to keep a full half of what they found. I assumed they only had a few (or maybe several) specimens that the two of them were splitting between themselves and selling. However, at $50/g they might only sell 100 grams worth anyway, and at that rate, they would only have $5,000 cash to split BEFORE expenses. While that might not make them too much profit cash wise, it might let them keep some souvenirs for their private collections as mementos of the adventure. Not all dealers/hunters put 100% of what they find into retail inventory. Some do like to hold some things back. Maybe the question should be asked of McCartney and Sonny as to what their logic is for pricing their pieces where they did? Steve **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Sat Dec 6 18:00:42 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 15:00:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <368666.67545.qm@web45601.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <252297.33905.qm@web110213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I highly doubt it will be in Tucson, if it is then it is illegal, and I would not touch it. India doesnt scare me much, but Canada sent people to Tokyo two years back to look for fossils. They don't play games. I doubt the meteorite will oxidize much, at these temps, there is no more liquid water so they should be perfectly preserved for the most part. Michael Farmer --- On Sat, 12/6/08, Greg Catterton wrote: > From: Greg Catterton > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Saturday, December 6, 2008, 3:56 PM > In my opinion, from the info I have seen I would be willing > to pay more then $10 per gram for fresh material, however I > do think $50 is simply too much for what looks to be an > ordinary chondrite. > I am hopefull that the material will not rust too bad > during all this snow, and Im sure plenty of it will be > available in Tucson as was metioned by someone else. > That said, I would also like to buy a 2 gram or so piece of > fresh material, but really would prefer not to pay much more > then $20-$25 per gram... to me it would be worth that price, > regardless of classification... my little girl keeps asking > when I am getting one... This fall like the Carancas really > got her interested in meteorites (this one even more) due to > the media attention and wide availablitly of video footage. > If anyone gets ahold of some and wants to sell or trade for > a small sample, please let me know. > > > Greg > > > > > --- On Fri, 12/5/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com > wrote: > > > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian > Meteorite for sale > > To: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com, > meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 1:34 PM > > In a message dated 12/5/2008 12:16:00 P.M. Central > Standard > > Time, > > star_wars_collector at yahoo.com writes: > > I agree 100% on this. $50 per gram is too high, the > > Carancas for example was > > $100 per gram at first, now it can be had for under > $20 > > per gram. > > I have read several places that it is only valued at > $1 - > > $10 per gram. I > > will wait a bit myself. > > > > Greg > > > > > > Greg and All, > > > > I tend to agree that the price MIGHT drop to $10/g, > > especially if there is a > > high degree of rusting on the specimens found later > next > > year. > > > > However, there is a chance the Canadians might offer > to > > buy all or most of > > the ones already found. > > > > If the land owners can get a tax credit on $50/g to > donate > > them, everyone up > > there might be happy to donate them, and at a 50% tax > > rate, that is the same > > as getting $25/g cash in hand to the overtaxed > Canadians. > > > > It sounds like most of the land owners are very > wealthy, > > so money may not > > mean anything to them. They might donate them all > and not > > even care about a > > tax break or cash values at all. > > > > If only a few kilos make it to the market place, then > we > > could see the value > > be higher than $10/g. > > > > If we seen hundreds of rusty kilos coming onto the > market, > > then we could see > > the prices end up way below $10/g. > > > > In any case, we probably will have to wait for the 6 > months > > to pass to see > > what is not purchased by the Canadian Government. > > > > One thing is sure, if ALL the masses were put on a > > restricted Canadian only > > collector market, a few hundred kilos would probably > sell > > for $0.10 a gram or > > even less. > > > > A smart thing might be to buy one specimen from Sonny > and > > McCartney NOW at > > $50/g and then buy more later at $10/g and if the > price > > goes down to under > > $1/g then buy so much more that you will have cost > averaged > > your first purchase > > at $50/g down to a reasonable level. > > > > Of course, if you are one of those people that get a > rush > > at owning the > > newest most famous meteorite that everyone is talking > > about around the water > > cooler, then how can you put a value on that??? > > > > :-) > > > > And also, realize that if you do buy a meteorite from > > Sonny and McCartney > > now, you are investing into field recovery. I > seriously > > doubt they will make a > > profit on this trip even if they sold what little > they > > found at $100/g, but > > if they can come close to breaking even, maybe next > time > > they will again be > > able to afford to get on the scene early and find > more. > > > > And at the very least, we should congratulate them on > > getting to the scene > > and making an effort. > > > > Good job guys, and congratulations! > > > > Steve Arnold #1 > > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > > > **************Make your life easier with all your > friends, > > email, and > > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > > > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From MeteorHntr at aol.com Sat Dec 6 18:30:43 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 18:30:43 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: In a message dated 12/6/2008 5:01:12 P.M. Central Standard Time, meteoriteguy at yahoo.com writes: I highly doubt it will be in Tucson, if it is then it is illegal, and I would not touch it. India doesnt scare me much, but Canada sent people to Tokyo two years back to look for fossils. They don't play games. I doubt the meteorite will oxidize much, at these temps, there is no more liquid water so they should be perfectly preserved for the most part. Michael Farmer *********** All, Richard Herd, from the Canadian National Collection has been known in years past for going around to all of the meteorite dealer's rooms in Tucson looking for illegally exported Canadian Meteorites. I don't think he has ever found any, and if he did, I am not sure what legal recourse could be taken. But I doubt he would be taking the time to look if there wasn't something they could do if he got lucky. If there is anything for sale in Tucson, it will probably be under the tightest of secrecy, and I doubt any dealer would offer a C.O.A. specimen ID card with them, thus the provenance would be lost, and you might as well be buying a Juanchenge. Now, you might find some local Canadians finders, who might find it worthwhile to smuggle specimens over the border who might show up in Tucson, eh? Some deals out of the trunk of a rental car might go down in the parking lots, since someone not in the business, without a reputation to risk, might want to dump some cheap for some fast cash. But don't expect any in Michael Blood's auction. Again, with no documentation, and no export permits, I doubt many collectors will want to pay even 20% of a legit retail value. If they are going to be selling for $10/g later, MAYBE someone would pay $2/g for illegal booty, but I doubt it. Why? Unless one has a morbid desire to "stick it" to the Canadians, there would be little satisfaction since one couldn't tell anyone about it. OK, on second thought, there might be a few people who would want to "stick it to the Canadians" so maybe $3/g might be possible in the back alley's of the wild west of Tucson... :-) However, we are maybe more likely to see the new Canadian rocks being sold as some totally other fall. What if all of a sudden we see (North North American) NNA 001 and NNA 002 specimens submitted for classification with vague find coordinates??? I think the Nomenclature Committee is on record as saying they are NOT in the business to police the various nation's meteorite laws. It will be interesting if the Canadians would have more clout in making a case than the Algerian or Libyan's have been able to in getting that policy changed. I think the legal export papers, showing legal title, will add a substantial value to the rocks if and when they are allowed to come out. Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From MeteorHntr at aol.com Sat Dec 6 18:37:41 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 18:37:41 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Speaking of illegal Meteorites... Message-ID: Hey Guys, All this talk about meteorites not being able to come out of Canada has me thinking... Argentina is known to come down hard on illegal fossil dealers at Tucson recently. Is there going to be a shortage of Campos this year at Tucson since the new laws came into effect in Argentina? If so, are we going to see a huge spike in their values? I don't know how much Campo material has moved each year for the last decade or so, but it has to be a very large amount. A strong Supply has kept the prices relatively low in the near past, but if all that is all of a sudden cut off, wow... Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From MeteorHntr at aol.com Sat Dec 6 18:47:42 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 18:47:42 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: In a message dated 12/6/2008 5:31:12 P.M. Central Standard Time, MeteorHntr at aol.com writes: I doubt the meteorite will oxidize much, at these temps, there is no more liquid water so they should be perfectly preserved for the most part. Michael Farmer ***************** Good Point Mike, Then again, if there is a lot of snow, and the ground gets real soggy when it melts off, rust could set in fairly quick. Especially if these would be H chondrites. Also, if there are strong rains in the spring that help melt off the snow, it could submerge some of these guys in water for some time. I know it only took one rainfall at Park Forest and rust was already appearing on some of the specimens almost immediately. Does anyone know how many feet of snow they get up there each winter? Do they get much rain in the spring? You know, one downfall is that if it takes waiting until May for the snow to all melt, then there would be the 6 month wait on those finds before they could get export permits, it could this time next year before any of these hit the market. The good thing, is that in a full year's time, we should have a much better idea on what a fair market value would be. So people don't have to worry too much about risking paying too much when they hit the market. Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Sat Dec 6 19:10:47 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 16:10:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Speaking of illegal Meteorites... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <7944.77395.qm@web45605.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I am thinking that there will be a increase in Campo prices due to the new laws. Another illegal meteorite, Berduc... It is widely available for sale on places like Ebay and a few dealers also offer it online. Not too long ago someone from the Metlist offered it in a rather discrete fashion - if anyone tried to save the video clip like I did, you know what Im talking about - it was also offered at the Bonhams auction. I honestly think that the legal status doesnt matter to most private collectors, it only really effects the dealers who would aquire it to sell it. Myself, as mainly a collector feel that nobody would come kicking in my door for owning a sample of this new canadian fall, Berduc or any other meteorite that is not aloowed to be exported... there are too many bigger issues to deal with. --- On Sat, 12/6/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > Subject: [meteorite-list] Speaking of illegal Meteorites... > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Saturday, December 6, 2008, 6:37 PM > Hey Guys, > > All this talk about meteorites not being able to come out > of Canada has me > thinking... > > Argentina is known to come down hard on illegal fossil > dealers at Tucson > recently. > > Is there going to be a shortage of Campos this year at > Tucson since the new > laws came into effect in Argentina? > > If so, are we going to see a huge spike in their values? > > I don't know how much Campo material has moved each > year for the last decade > or so, but it has to be a very large amount. A strong > Supply has kept the > prices relatively low in the near past, but if all that is > all of a sudden cut > off, wow... > > Steve Arnold #1 > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, > email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From MeteorHntr at aol.com Sat Dec 6 19:24:46 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 19:24:46 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Speaking of illegal Meteorites... Message-ID: In a message dated 12/6/2008 6:11:07 P.M. Central Standard Time, star_wars_collector at yahoo.com writes: I honestly think that the legal status doesnt matter to most private collectors, it only really effects the dealers who would aquire it to sell it. I agree, many private collectors might not care, but I think some do. Of course when it comes to legality, and value, if the laws genuinely slow the flow to market of the quantity of a specimen, one can expect the retail prices will reflect that. Steve Arnold www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From rob_mccafferty at yahoo.com Sat Dec 6 20:17:35 2008 From: rob_mccafferty at yahoo.com (Rob McCafferty) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 17:17:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <695032.9981.qm@web55202.mail.re4.yahoo.com> --- On Sat, 12/6/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: > I highly doubt it will be in Tucson, if it is then it is > illegal, and I > would not touch it. India doesnt scare me much, but Canada > sent people to Tokyo > two years back to look for fossils. They don't play > games. > Michael Farmer > And yet, here we find ourselves discussing the availability of this new material. Several times I've joked about our "pirate" status and my fears of being hunted down by Boba Fett. If we are really expecting this stuff to appear illegally, and people to buy it, maybe I was wrong to joke. I worry that the tone of this discussion does not do our interests any favours. I'm going to shut up now. I accuse no-one and anything else I say may be classifed as pontification. From MoritzKarl at t-online.de Sat Dec 6 20:23:25 2008 From: MoritzKarl at t-online.de (MoritzKarl at t-online.de) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 02:23:25 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: ebay auctions ending in 18 hours Message-ID: <1L98Mn-06WDtQ0@fwd02.aul.t-online.de> Dear List, I have 21 ebay auctions ending on ebay. There are many goodies for sale. These include the following: Krasnojarsk Renazzo Barbotan Cape York Chateau-Renard Cumberland Falls Dar al Gani 400 - huge slice Mauerkirchen Monument Draw Nogoya Ohaba Orvinio Orgueil and many more... Take a look if you like here: http://stores.ebay.com/mosmeteorites or here http://www.m3t3orites.com/ebay.php Thank you for looking and Good Luck in case you are bidding. Please note that I will not be able to mail any of the items out until December 12th as I am leaving town tomorrow morning for five days. Thank you for understanding. Kind Regards Moritz Karl visit mo's meteorites at http://www.m3t3orites.com From info at meteorites.com.au Sun Dec 7 02:18:46 2008 From: info at meteorites.com.au (Jeff Kuyken) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 18:18:46 +1100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> Steve and Mike both touched on an interesting point here that I was pondering myself the last couple of days. The material found now will be different to the material found weeks, months and years down the track. I didn't realise how much a fall can vary until "Amgala" (Oum Dreyga). I purchased a 15g individual from Mike Farmer from his very first batch of about 1kg. I believe these were about the first stones picked up. I paid about $10/g and it was worth every cent. I have several other Oum Dreyga specimens from numerous sources and NONE come even close to the first 15g which looks like soot would rub off on your hands. In fact no other recent fall I have appears as fresh as this stone. Two other recent falls that come immediately to mind with vast differences in weathering are Park Forest and Moss. So maybe $50/g is high but maybe it's also not so bad considering what the other stones 'might' be like down the track. You can also speculate all you like but there are so many factors which will dictate the price of a fall. And I don't think you can really compare one with another. Comparing this Canadian fall with Carancas is probably not a good measure at all. They are two totally different falls with two totally different stories. The most important thing to remember about the 'value' of a meteorite (or anything for that matter) is that it is only worth what someone is willing to pay. Cheers, Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 5:34 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > Greg and All, > > I tend to agree that the price MIGHT drop to $10/g, especially if there > is a > high degree of rusting on the specimens found later next year. > > However, there is a chance the Canadians might offer to buy all or most > of > the ones already found. > > If the land owners can get a tax credit on $50/g to donate them, everyone > up > there might be happy to donate them, and at a 50% tax rate, that is the > same > as getting $25/g cash in hand to the overtaxed Canadians. > > It sounds like most of the land owners are very wealthy, so money may not > mean anything to them. They might donate them all and not even care > about a > tax break or cash values at all. > > If only a few kilos make it to the market place, then we could see the > value > be higher than $10/g. > > If we seen hundreds of rusty kilos coming onto the market, then we could > see > the prices end up way below $10/g. > > In any case, we probably will have to wait for the 6 months to pass to > see > what is not purchased by the Canadian Government. > > One thing is sure, if ALL the masses were put on a restricted Canadian > only > collector market, a few hundred kilos would probably sell for $0.10 a > gram or > even less. > > A smart thing might be to buy one specimen from Sonny and McCartney NOW > at > $50/g and then buy more later at $10/g and if the price goes down to > under > $1/g then buy so much more that you will have cost averaged your first > purchase > at $50/g down to a reasonable level. > > Of course, if you are one of those people that get a rush at owning the > newest most famous meteorite that everyone is talking about around the > water > cooler, then how can you put a value on that??? > > :-) > > And also, realize that if you do buy a meteorite from Sonny and McCartney > now, you are investing into field recovery. I seriously doubt they will > make a > profit on this trip even if they sold what little they found at $100/g, > but > if they can come close to breaking even, maybe next time they will again > be > able to afford to get on the scene early and find more. > > And at the very least, we should congratulate them on getting to the > scene > and making an effort. > > Good job guys, and congratulations! > > Steve Arnold #1 > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From meteoritekid at gmail.com Sun Dec 7 03:34:34 2008 From: meteoritekid at gmail.com (Jason Utas) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 00:34:34 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> Message-ID: <93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com> Hello Jeff, All, The comparison to Carancas was provided as a contrast simply because it is such an unusual and different meteorite, and yet the asking price for these new Canadian stones is roughly what Carancas is going for right now. It's a large, ordinary, equilibrated chondrite fall, the likes of which we see almost once a year with some regularity (e.g. Thuathe, Amgala, Park Forest, Kilabo, Bensour, Chergach, Bassikounou, Berduc, etc.). And the asking price is more than Park Forest, which was a spectacular urban fall, and of which less material was found. The asking price for Park Forest currently runs between $20-30/g, from what I can find. A dealer or two have it listed at $40/g, but...not average. The price at the time was...$20-30/g. It started high, and, because of great demand for the urban fall, it stayed high. All of the other falls are ~$1.20/g (see the beautifully fresh 1.7kg Chergach that just passed on ebay, from ET, as well as a brace of stones I personally bought in the 120g range from an American dealer) to the asking price of $5-10/g for pieces of the other falls (see ebay - meteoritica, Hupe - both have Chergach currently listed on ebay, and there's quite a bit of Bensour around if you want to compare that), not that they sell quickly at those prices. After all, if you look at what's listed, well, those are the pieces that have yet to sell. The only comparable meteorite I can find is the Argentinean fall of Berduc, which, though I can't name any names (it was a while ago), was listed between $10 and $30/g. Restricted export, few suppliers, fresh fall, etc. The initial determining of the asking price of a fall is essentially arbitrary The hunters could set it at $5/g or $10/g if they only wanted to cover personal costs (and make a little on the side). Or they could try to set it at $1000/g to make a profit. The only thing keeping them from charging that much is the knowledge that, at some point, they wouldn't turn a profit because their asking price would be too high for anyone to buy. A dealer looking to turn as high a profit as possible would ask as high a price as he could, while still selling all of his material. Why wouldn't they? Do you really feel indignant enough at the dealers' asking five or ten times the price for comparable falls to not buy a stone from them? Personally, I do, and I won't. I think they're taking advantage of us folks who love them, but who have jobs and obligations - people who love them enough that we would go on such trips that we could, but who can't because of our responsibilities. But let's have some fun. Lets assume these fellows come back with a mere 500g. Just over a pound of space, between the two of them. And let's assume a high trip/cost estimate: Given that next-day flights to Edmonton from where I live were ~$130, and let's say they both stay there for a week at $80/night + food, a car....it works out to about a thousand dollars for the trip, each. $2,000 combined cost. If that's right, they would break even at $4/g. Each $1/g over $4/g would give them $500. If they're asking $50/g, they would make...$46x500. That's a profit of $23,000. And if my estimate was off and they each flew first-class, rented Hummers, and spent $50/day on food, they'll only make $20,000 off of 500g. ...Do you think they got more than a pound of material from the trip? I would assume so. A kilogram between the two of them would give them almost $50,000. Not bad for a quick flight up to Edmonton and a week's fun. I'll wait for the thaw. Anyone else who has spring break free (dates available), drop me a line and I'll see what kind of a trip we can arrange. What I can promise is that if I do find enough on that trip to warrant selling some, I'll have it at a reasonable price. Regards, Jason On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 11:18 PM, Jeff Kuyken wrote: > Steve and Mike both touched on an interesting point here that I was > pondering myself the last couple of days. The material found now will be > different to the material found weeks, months and years down the track. I > didn't realise how much a fall can vary until "Amgala" (Oum Dreyga). I > purchased a 15g individual from Mike Farmer from his very first batch of > about 1kg. I believe these were about the first stones picked up. I paid > about $10/g and it was worth every cent. I have several other Oum Dreyga > specimens from numerous sources and NONE come even close to the first 15g > which looks like soot would rub off on your hands. In fact no other recent > fall I have appears as fresh as this stone. Two other recent falls that come > immediately to mind with vast differences in weathering are Park Forest and > Moss. > > So maybe $50/g is high but maybe it's also not so bad considering what the > other stones 'might' be like down the track. You can also speculate all you > like but there are so many factors which will dictate the price of a fall. > And I don't think you can really compare one with another. Comparing this > Canadian fall with Carancas is probably not a good measure at all. They are > two totally different falls with two totally different stories. > > The most important thing to remember about the 'value' of a meteorite (or > anything for that matter) is that it is only worth what someone is willing > to pay. > > Cheers, > > Jeff > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: > To: ; > Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 5:34 AM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > > >> Greg and All, >> >> I tend to agree that the price MIGHT drop to $10/g, especially if there >> is a >> high degree of rusting on the specimens found later next year. >> >> However, there is a chance the Canadians might offer to buy all or most >> of >> the ones already found. >> >> If the land owners can get a tax credit on $50/g to donate them, everyone >> up >> there might be happy to donate them, and at a 50% tax rate, that is the >> same >> as getting $25/g cash in hand to the overtaxed Canadians. >> >> It sounds like most of the land owners are very wealthy, so money may not >> mean anything to them. They might donate them all and not even care >> about a >> tax break or cash values at all. >> >> If only a few kilos make it to the market place, then we could see the >> value >> be higher than $10/g. >> >> If we seen hundreds of rusty kilos coming onto the market, then we could >> see >> the prices end up way below $10/g. >> >> In any case, we probably will have to wait for the 6 months to pass to >> see >> what is not purchased by the Canadian Government. >> >> One thing is sure, if ALL the masses were put on a restricted Canadian >> only >> collector market, a few hundred kilos would probably sell for $0.10 a >> gram or >> even less. >> >> A smart thing might be to buy one specimen from Sonny and McCartney NOW >> at >> $50/g and then buy more later at $10/g and if the price goes down to >> under >> $1/g then buy so much more that you will have cost averaged your first >> purchase >> at $50/g down to a reasonable level. >> >> Of course, if you are one of those people that get a rush at owning the >> newest most famous meteorite that everyone is talking about around the >> water >> cooler, then how can you put a value on that??? >> >> :-) >> >> And also, realize that if you do buy a meteorite from Sonny and McCartney >> now, you are investing into field recovery. I seriously doubt they will >> make a >> profit on this trip even if they sold what little they found at $100/g, >> but >> if they can come close to breaking even, maybe next time they will again >> be >> able to afford to get on the scene early and find more. >> >> And at the very least, we should congratulate them on getting to the >> scene >> and making an effort. >> >> Good job guys, and congratulations! >> >> Steve Arnold #1 >> www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com >> >> **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and >> favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >> >> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From rockhoundm at abaconet.com.ar Sun Dec 7 04:49:59 2008 From: rockhoundm at abaconet.com.ar (Eduardo.) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 06:49:59 -0300 Subject: [meteorite-list] Speaking of illegal Meteorites... In-Reply-To: <7944.77395.qm@web45605.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Argentina is getting harder in meteorites too. Look at this news from 2 days ago (sorry, spanish only): http://www.unoentrerios.com.ar/noticias/nota.php?id=1841 Two Uruguayans were caugth trying to smuggler meteorites from Argentina to Uruguay. They look like Campos. I heard there is an investigation right now the selling of illegal meteorites on-line (Campo del Cielo, Berduc and Santa Lucia), including web pages and auctions. Justice here is slow, very slow, it may take years, but their files don't dissapear. Don't be surprised if we have investigators next Tucson looking for the ones being sold there. By the way, here is an article (also in spanish), made by a lawyer, about the law. page 1 http://www.astroentrerios.com.ar/site/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=160&Itemid=70 page 2 http://www.astroentrerios.com.ar/site/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=160&Itemid=70&limit=1&limitstart=1 page 3 http://www.astroentrerios.com.ar/site/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=160&Itemid=70&limit=1&limitstart=2 Eduardo -----Original Message----- From: Greg Catterton To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 16:10:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Speaking of illegal Meteorites... > I am thinking that there will be a increase in Campo prices due to the > new laws. > > Another illegal meteorite, Berduc... It is widely available for sale on > places like Ebay and a few dealers also offer it online. > Not too long ago someone from the Metlist offered it in a rather > discrete fashion - if anyone tried to save the video clip like I did, > you know what Im talking about - it was also offered at the Bonhams > auction. > > I honestly think that the legal status doesnt matter to most private > collectors, it only really effects the dealers who would aquire it to > sell it. > Myself, as mainly a collector feel that nobody would come kicking in my > door for owning a sample of this new canadian fall, Berduc or any other > meteorite that is not aloowed to be exported... there are too many > bigger issues to deal with. > > > > --- On Sat, 12/6/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: > > > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > > Subject: [meteorite-list] Speaking of illegal Meteorites... > > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Saturday, December 6, 2008, 6:37 PM > > Hey Guys, > > > > All this talk about meteorites not being able to come out > > of Canada has me > > thinking... > > > > Argentina is known to come down hard on illegal fossil > > dealers at Tucson > > recently. > > > > Is there going to be a shortage of Campos this year at > > Tucson since the new > > laws came into effect in Argentina? > > > > If so, are we going to see a huge spike in their values? > > > > I don't know how much Campo material has moved each > > year for the last decade > > or so, but it has to be a very large amount. A strong > > Supply has kept the > > prices relatively low in the near past, but if all that is > > all of a sudden cut > > off, wow... > > > > Steve Arnold #1 > > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, > > email, and > > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > > > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom > 00000010) > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael at spacerocksinc.com Sun Dec 7 06:38:26 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 03:38:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 7, 2008 Message-ID: <29421592.2233561228649906961.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_7_2008.html From almitt at kconline.com Sun Dec 7 07:29:02 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 07:29:02 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <252297.33905.qm@web110213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <252297.33905.qm@web110213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <416B6A17EB864439A3A9DBD1D31CD068@StarmanPC> Greetings List, Interesting topics. Mike is right on about the Canadians. They don't play games. The former curator of the Canadian Collection was scanning ebay meteorite auctions for many years for Canadian Cultural Property including meteorites. The only way I was able to figure this out was a friend offer me some diamonds he had purchased to sell on ebay for him. They were Canadian. I received an inquiry as to where I had obtained my diamonds from Canada from the Canadian Mounted Police!! I let David know they were wondering (I had no doubt what so ever that David had purchased these legally). After David told the police they were purchased from one of the largest diamond companies and families in Canada, they backed way off but left a negative opinion in my mind that you can't purchase Canadian items without having to justify resaling them later. We later then found out about the meteorite snoop. It also fit in that he use to visit Tucson and Denver. I thought to build up their collection, but also to check for Canadian material. All my best to all. --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Farmer" To: ; Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 6:00 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale >I highly doubt it will be in Tucson, if it is then it is illegal, and I >would not touch it. India doesnt scare me much, but Canada sent people to >Tokyo two years back to look for fossils. They don't play games. > Michael Farmer From darryl at dof3.com Sun Dec 7 10:38:59 2008 From: darryl at dof3.com (Darryl Pitt) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 10:38:59 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> <93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> Folks, If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times: meteorites as a collectible do not attract more serious collectors because there are too many aberrations of valuation--such that the aberrations have become the norm. Several serious collectors who have been intrigued with meteorites have shared with me that they've opted not to climb in because of their belief in an "immature" and "unsophisticated" marketplace. Their words. In my humble opinion, the quality of the fireball video associated with the Canadian event makes it worth far more than the low-end numbers being bandied about. Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell for a couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain this doesn't occur. All best / d ===================== On Dec 7, 2008, at 3:34 AM, Jason Utas wrote: > Hello Jeff, All, > > The comparison to Carancas was provided as a contrast simply because > it is such an unusual and different meteorite, and yet the asking > price for these new Canadian stones is roughly what Carancas is going > for right now. It's a large, ordinary, equilibrated chondrite fall, > the likes of which we see almost once a year with some regularity > (e.g. Thuathe, Amgala, Park Forest, Kilabo, Bensour, Chergach, > Bassikounou, Berduc, etc.). > > And the asking price is more than Park Forest, which was a spectacular > urban fall, and of which less material was found. The asking price > for Park Forest currently runs between $20-30/g, from what I can find. > A dealer or two have it listed at $40/g, but...not average. The > price at the time was...$20-30/g. It started high, and, because of > great demand for the urban fall, it stayed high. > > All of the other falls are ~$1.20/g (see the beautifully fresh 1.7kg > Chergach that just passed on ebay, from ET, as well as a brace of > stones I personally bought in the 120g range from an American dealer) > to the asking price of $5-10/g for pieces of the other falls (see ebay > - meteoritica, Hupe - both have Chergach currently listed on ebay, and > there's quite a bit of Bensour around if you want to compare that), > not that they sell quickly at those prices. After all, if you look at > what's listed, well, those are the pieces that have yet to sell. > > The only comparable meteorite I can find is the Argentinean fall of > Berduc, which, though I can't name any names (it was a while ago), was > listed between $10 and $30/g. Restricted export, few suppliers, fresh > fall, etc. > > The initial determining of the asking price of a fall is essentially > arbitrary The hunters could set it at $5/g or $10/g if they only > wanted to cover personal costs (and make a little on the side). Or > they could try to set it at $1000/g to make a profit. The only thing > keeping them from charging that much is the knowledge that, at some > point, they wouldn't turn a profit because their asking price would be > too high for anyone to buy. > A dealer looking to turn as high a profit as possible would ask as > high a price as he could, while still selling all of his material. > > Why wouldn't they? Do you really feel indignant enough at the > dealers' asking five or ten times the price for comparable falls to > not buy a stone from them? Personally, I do, and I won't. I think > they're taking advantage of us folks who love them, but who have jobs > and obligations - people who love them enough that we would go on such > trips that we could, but who can't because of our responsibilities. > > But let's have some fun. > > Lets assume these fellows come back with a mere 500g. Just over a > pound of space, between the two of them. > And let's assume a high trip/cost estimate: > Given that next-day flights to Edmonton from where I live were ~$130, > and let's say they both stay there for a week at $80/night + food, a > car....it works out to about a thousand dollars for the trip, each. > $2,000 combined cost. > > If that's right, they would break even at $4/g. Each $1/g over $4/g > would give them $500. > If they're asking $50/g, they would make...$46x500. > > That's a profit of $23,000. > > And if my estimate was off and they each flew first-class, rented > Hummers, and spent $50/day on food, they'll only make $20,000 off of > 500g. > > ...Do you think they got more than a pound of material from the trip? > I would assume so. > A kilogram between the two of them would give them almost $50,000. > Not bad for a quick flight up to Edmonton and a week's fun. > > I'll wait for the thaw. Anyone else who has spring break free (dates > available), drop me a line and I'll see what kind of a trip we can > arrange. What I can promise is that if I do find enough on that trip > to warrant selling some, I'll have it at a reasonable price. > > Regards, > Jason > > > > On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 11:18 PM, Jeff Kuyken > wrote: >> Steve and Mike both touched on an interesting point here that I was >> pondering myself the last couple of days. The material found now >> will be >> different to the material found weeks, months and years down the >> track. I >> didn't realise how much a fall can vary until "Amgala" (Oum >> Dreyga). I >> purchased a 15g individual from Mike Farmer from his very first >> batch of >> about 1kg. I believe these were about the first stones picked up. I >> paid >> about $10/g and it was worth every cent. I have several other Oum >> Dreyga >> specimens from numerous sources and NONE come even close to the >> first 15g >> which looks like soot would rub off on your hands. In fact no other >> recent >> fall I have appears as fresh as this stone. Two other recent falls >> that come >> immediately to mind with vast differences in weathering are Park >> Forest and >> Moss. >> >> So maybe $50/g is high but maybe it's also not so bad considering >> what the >> other stones 'might' be like down the track. You can also speculate >> all you >> like but there are so many factors which will dictate the price of >> a fall. >> And I don't think you can really compare one with another. >> Comparing this >> Canadian fall with Carancas is probably not a good measure at all. >> They are >> two totally different falls with two totally different stories. >> >> The most important thing to remember about the 'value' of a >> meteorite (or >> anything for that matter) is that it is only worth what someone is >> willing >> to pay. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Jeff >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: >> To: ; > > >> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 5:34 AM >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale >> >> >>> Greg and All, >>> >>> I tend to agree that the price MIGHT drop to $10/g, especially if >>> there >>> is a >>> high degree of rusting on the specimens found later next year. >>> >>> However, there is a chance the Canadians might offer to buy all >>> or most >>> of >>> the ones already found. >>> >>> If the land owners can get a tax credit on $50/g to donate them, >>> everyone >>> up >>> there might be happy to donate them, and at a 50% tax rate, that >>> is the >>> same >>> as getting $25/g cash in hand to the overtaxed Canadians. >>> >>> It sounds like most of the land owners are very wealthy, so money >>> may not >>> mean anything to them. They might donate them all and not even >>> care >>> about a >>> tax break or cash values at all. >>> >>> If only a few kilos make it to the market place, then we could >>> see the >>> value >>> be higher than $10/g. >>> >>> If we seen hundreds of rusty kilos coming onto the market, then >>> we could >>> see >>> the prices end up way below $10/g. >>> >>> In any case, we probably will have to wait for the 6 months to >>> pass to >>> see >>> what is not purchased by the Canadian Government. >>> >>> One thing is sure, if ALL the masses were put on a restricted >>> Canadian >>> only >>> collector market, a few hundred kilos would probably sell for >>> $0.10 a >>> gram or >>> even less. >>> >>> A smart thing might be to buy one specimen from Sonny and >>> McCartney NOW >>> at >>> $50/g and then buy more later at $10/g and if the price goes down to >>> under >>> $1/g then buy so much more that you will have cost averaged your >>> first >>> purchase >>> at $50/g down to a reasonable level. >>> >>> Of course, if you are one of those people that get a rush at >>> owning the >>> newest most famous meteorite that everyone is talking about >>> around the >>> water >>> cooler, then how can you put a value on that??? >>> >>> :-) >>> >>> And also, realize that if you do buy a meteorite from Sonny and >>> McCartney >>> now, you are investing into field recovery. I seriously doubt >>> they will >>> make a >>> profit on this trip even if they sold what little they found at >>> $100/g, >>> but >>> if they can come close to breaking even, maybe next time they >>> will again >>> be >>> able to afford to get on the scene early and find more. >>> >>> And at the very least, we should congratulate them on getting to >>> the >>> scene >>> and making an effort. >>> >>> Good job guys, and congratulations! >>> >>> Steve Arnold #1 >>> www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com >>> >>> **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, >>> and >>> favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >>> >>> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010 >>> ) >>> ______________________________________________ >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>> >>> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoritekid at gmail.com Sun Dec 7 11:02:29 2008 From: meteoritekid at gmail.com (Jason Utas) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 08:02:29 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> <93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com> <44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> Message-ID: <93aaac890812070802o77b7e335n3de3c8f6e456348e@mail.gmail.com> Darryl, Low-end numbers? Even Park Forest which was witnessed, caught on numerous videos, and fell in a densely populated urban environment - in what may well be a majority of cases, hitting man-made objects, was selling for $30/g or so at the time of the fall - a price which has stayed roughly the same, if it hasn't come down a few dollars per gram since then. How much Park Forest was recovered? According to this report, roughly 30kg. http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Aug04/ParkForest.html More of this fall has been recovered in the past week than from the entire fall of Park Forest. It hasn't hit anything interesting, as far as we know. It's an ordinary chondrite - even Park Forest had some pretty brecciation/melt. I've heard of nothing of the sort from this fall. It was caught on video, granted, and that does make it special in one way...why you think that should boost the value of it to twice the value of the undoubtedly more interesting Park Forest, also caught on video (and five or ten times the price of other comparable falls), I honestly...I'm at a lack for words. "Low-end numbers being bandied about?" On the one hand, you seem to criticize the high price being asked by these sellers, and on the other, you say the current market rates for other falls are "low-end numbers?" I don't understand. $5-10/g for these new falls is far overpriced, as best I can tell. At least with Chergach and Bassikounou, suppliers were contacting list-members directly and offering stones at $2/g initially - less for larger stones. You seem to be saying that's too cheap. Why? If the sellers are content, and I don't think the buyers are complaining, well, I can't see any reason for you to say such a thing. If both parties are happy, I honestly don't see how you can say such a thing. Look at the numbers from my last email. A mere $10/g would provide the hunters each with $5,000, assuming they only came back with 250g each. It's classic marketing technique to tell potential buyers that they got precious little out of the fall, as they said they did. If people think there's less, they'll want to buy more. There's a reason they're not telling anyone how much they got, after all. I wonder why...and I wonder if they ever will tell us how much they found/were allowed to keep.... After all, unless they're just using that as a marketing ploy, they really have no reason not to tell us. Jason On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 7:38 AM, Darryl Pitt wrote: > > > Folks, > > If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times: meteorites as a > collectible do not attract more serious collectors because there are too > many aberrations of valuation--such that the aberrations have become the > norm. Several serious collectors who have been intrigued with meteorites > have shared with me that they've opted not to climb in because of their > belief in an "immature" and "unsophisticated" marketplace. Their words. > > In my humble opinion, the quality of the fireball video associated with the > Canadian event makes it worth far more than the low-end numbers being > bandied about. > > Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell for a > couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain this > doesn't occur. > > All best / d > > > ===================== > > > On Dec 7, 2008, at 3:34 AM, Jason Utas wrote: > >> Hello Jeff, All, >> >> The comparison to Carancas was provided as a contrast simply because >> it is such an unusual and different meteorite, and yet the asking >> price for these new Canadian stones is roughly what Carancas is going >> for right now. It's a large, ordinary, equilibrated chondrite fall, >> the likes of which we see almost once a year with some regularity >> (e.g. Thuathe, Amgala, Park Forest, Kilabo, Bensour, Chergach, >> Bassikounou, Berduc, etc.). >> >> And the asking price is more than Park Forest, which was a spectacular >> urban fall, and of which less material was found. The asking price >> for Park Forest currently runs between $20-30/g, from what I can find. >> A dealer or two have it listed at $40/g, but...not average. The >> price at the time was...$20-30/g. It started high, and, because of >> great demand for the urban fall, it stayed high. >> >> All of the other falls are ~$1.20/g (see the beautifully fresh 1.7kg >> Chergach that just passed on ebay, from ET, as well as a brace of >> stones I personally bought in the 120g range from an American dealer) >> to the asking price of $5-10/g for pieces of the other falls (see ebay >> - meteoritica, Hupe - both have Chergach currently listed on ebay, and >> there's quite a bit of Bensour around if you want to compare that), >> not that they sell quickly at those prices. After all, if you look at >> what's listed, well, those are the pieces that have yet to sell. >> >> The only comparable meteorite I can find is the Argentinean fall of >> Berduc, which, though I can't name any names (it was a while ago), was >> listed between $10 and $30/g. Restricted export, few suppliers, fresh >> fall, etc. >> >> The initial determining of the asking price of a fall is essentially >> arbitrary The hunters could set it at $5/g or $10/g if they only >> wanted to cover personal costs (and make a little on the side). Or >> they could try to set it at $1000/g to make a profit. The only thing >> keeping them from charging that much is the knowledge that, at some >> point, they wouldn't turn a profit because their asking price would be >> too high for anyone to buy. >> A dealer looking to turn as high a profit as possible would ask as >> high a price as he could, while still selling all of his material. >> >> Why wouldn't they? Do you really feel indignant enough at the >> dealers' asking five or ten times the price for comparable falls to >> not buy a stone from them? Personally, I do, and I won't. I think >> they're taking advantage of us folks who love them, but who have jobs >> and obligations - people who love them enough that we would go on such >> trips that we could, but who can't because of our responsibilities. >> >> But let's have some fun. >> >> Lets assume these fellows come back with a mere 500g. Just over a >> pound of space, between the two of them. >> And let's assume a high trip/cost estimate: >> Given that next-day flights to Edmonton from where I live were ~$130, >> and let's say they both stay there for a week at $80/night + food, a >> car....it works out to about a thousand dollars for the trip, each. >> $2,000 combined cost. >> >> If that's right, they would break even at $4/g. Each $1/g over $4/g >> would give them $500. >> If they're asking $50/g, they would make...$46x500. >> >> That's a profit of $23,000. >> >> And if my estimate was off and they each flew first-class, rented >> Hummers, and spent $50/day on food, they'll only make $20,000 off of >> 500g. >> >> ...Do you think they got more than a pound of material from the trip? >> I would assume so. >> A kilogram between the two of them would give them almost $50,000. >> Not bad for a quick flight up to Edmonton and a week's fun. >> >> I'll wait for the thaw. Anyone else who has spring break free (dates >> available), drop me a line and I'll see what kind of a trip we can >> arrange. What I can promise is that if I do find enough on that trip >> to warrant selling some, I'll have it at a reasonable price. >> >> Regards, >> Jason >> >> >> >> On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 11:18 PM, Jeff Kuyken >> wrote: >>> >>> Steve and Mike both touched on an interesting point here that I was >>> pondering myself the last couple of days. The material found now will be >>> different to the material found weeks, months and years down the track. I >>> didn't realise how much a fall can vary until "Amgala" (Oum Dreyga). I >>> purchased a 15g individual from Mike Farmer from his very first batch of >>> about 1kg. I believe these were about the first stones picked up. I paid >>> about $10/g and it was worth every cent. I have several other Oum Dreyga >>> specimens from numerous sources and NONE come even close to the first 15g >>> which looks like soot would rub off on your hands. In fact no other >>> recent >>> fall I have appears as fresh as this stone. Two other recent falls that >>> come >>> immediately to mind with vast differences in weathering are Park Forest >>> and >>> Moss. >>> >>> So maybe $50/g is high but maybe it's also not so bad considering what >>> the >>> other stones 'might' be like down the track. You can also speculate all >>> you >>> like but there are so many factors which will dictate the price of a >>> fall. >>> And I don't think you can really compare one with another. Comparing this >>> Canadian fall with Carancas is probably not a good measure at all. They >>> are >>> two totally different falls with two totally different stories. >>> >>> The most important thing to remember about the 'value' of a meteorite (or >>> anything for that matter) is that it is only worth what someone is >>> willing >>> to pay. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Jeff >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: >>> To: ; >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 5:34 AM >>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale >>> >>> >>>> Greg and All, >>>> >>>> I tend to agree that the price MIGHT drop to $10/g, especially if there >>>> is a >>>> high degree of rusting on the specimens found later next year. >>>> >>>> However, there is a chance the Canadians might offer to buy all or most >>>> of >>>> the ones already found. >>>> >>>> If the land owners can get a tax credit on $50/g to donate them, >>>> everyone >>>> up >>>> there might be happy to donate them, and at a 50% tax rate, that is the >>>> same >>>> as getting $25/g cash in hand to the overtaxed Canadians. >>>> >>>> It sounds like most of the land owners are very wealthy, so money may >>>> not >>>> mean anything to them. They might donate them all and not even care >>>> about a >>>> tax break or cash values at all. >>>> >>>> If only a few kilos make it to the market place, then we could see the >>>> value >>>> be higher than $10/g. >>>> >>>> If we seen hundreds of rusty kilos coming onto the market, then we >>>> could >>>> see >>>> the prices end up way below $10/g. >>>> >>>> In any case, we probably will have to wait for the 6 months to pass to >>>> see >>>> what is not purchased by the Canadian Government. >>>> >>>> One thing is sure, if ALL the masses were put on a restricted Canadian >>>> only >>>> collector market, a few hundred kilos would probably sell for $0.10 a >>>> gram or >>>> even less. >>>> >>>> A smart thing might be to buy one specimen from Sonny and McCartney NOW >>>> at >>>> $50/g and then buy more later at $10/g and if the price goes down to >>>> under >>>> $1/g then buy so much more that you will have cost averaged your first >>>> purchase >>>> at $50/g down to a reasonable level. >>>> >>>> Of course, if you are one of those people that get a rush at owning the >>>> newest most famous meteorite that everyone is talking about around the >>>> water >>>> cooler, then how can you put a value on that??? >>>> >>>> :-) >>>> >>>> And also, realize that if you do buy a meteorite from Sonny and >>>> McCartney >>>> now, you are investing into field recovery. I seriously doubt they >>>> will >>>> make a >>>> profit on this trip even if they sold what little they found at $100/g, >>>> but >>>> if they can come close to breaking even, maybe next time they will >>>> again >>>> be >>>> able to afford to get on the scene early and find more. >>>> >>>> And at the very least, we should congratulate them on getting to the >>>> scene >>>> and making an effort. >>>> >>>> Good job guys, and congratulations! >>>> >>>> Steve Arnold #1 >>>> www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com >>>> >>>> **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and >>>> favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >>>> >>>> >>>> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) >>>> ______________________________________________ >>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>>> >>>> >>> >>> ______________________________________________ >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From cynapse at charter.net Sun Dec 7 11:05:56 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 11:05:56 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> <93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com> <44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> Message-ID: <8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com> On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 10:38:59 -0500, you wrote: >with meteorites have shared with me that they've opted not to climb in >because of their belief in an "immature" and "unsophisticated" >marketplace. Their words. >Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell for >a couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain >this doesn't occur. Myself, I'd rather see meteorite collecting as a fun (immature, unsuphisticated) hobby that anyone interested can afford to join (even if just for small pieces) than as a way for rich snobs to become richer. I say that those "serious collectors" who you talked to can go screw themselves. From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Sun Dec 7 11:17:55 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 08:17:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Offer for new Canadian fall In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <158047.86337.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> I offer five thousand QUATLOOS per gram for Buzzard Coulee. And yes, I have an export permit from Triskelion for the quatloos. ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From cynapse at charter.net Sun Dec 7 11:25:56 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 11:25:56 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Offer for new Canadian fall In-Reply-To: <158047.86337.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <158047.86337.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 08:17:55 -0800 (PST), you wrote: > >I offer five thousand QUATLOOS per gram for Buzzard Coulee. Okay, without googling-- Spock's Brain? From MeteorHntr at aol.com Sun Dec 7 11:29:34 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 11:29:34 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: All, Maybe the two guys are just "publicly" asking $50 a gram, so that the Canadian Government will have to pony up the $50/g to buy what they want from them (and or to buy from the other land owners) but in reality they are NOT expecting to sell any to the rocks for ANY price at this time? Maybe after they get their export permits, then they will reconsider what the market will allow at that time? Or maybe with some negotiation, they might be able to be talked down to $5/g? Not always is the asking price the actual end sales price. It is their business, so they can run it any way they like. But we should understand that undoubtedly there is more here than meets the eye. Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From MeteorHntr at aol.com Sun Dec 7 11:31:30 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 11:31:30 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: Is this in Canadian dollars or US dollars? Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From MeteorHntr at aol.com Sun Dec 7 11:40:47 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 11:40:47 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: In a message dated 12/7/2008 10:30:14 A.M. Central Standard Time, MeteorHntr at aol.com writes: Maybe the two guys are just "publicly" asking $50 a gram, so that the Canadian Government will have to pony up the $50/g to buy what they want from them All, You know, on further thought, IF the Canadian Government would be happy to pay Sonny and McCartney ($50 x 1,000g = ) $50,000 for their finds, who are we to say that they shouldn't? I am sure the Canadian Government can afford to pay $50,000. Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Sun Dec 7 12:02:13 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 18:02:13 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <416B6A17EB864439A3A9DBD1D31CD068@StarmanPC> References: <252297.33905.qm@web110213.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <416B6A17EB864439A3A9DBD1D31CD068@StarmanPC> Message-ID: <007a01c9588d$8d60e3a0$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Hi Al & all, well that is a minor problem. Letting aside, that any new fall is lacking any cultural properties, as long as it doesn't slay a famous composer, painter or author (poetry slam) and if we accept, that Canadians see themselves as legitimate heirs of extraterrestrial ancestors, when were meteorites put into the national cultural heritage list of Canada? I'm not sure, read somewhere in 1977. So only a few meteorites are afflicted. With all others it would be quite difficult for the Canadians to present evidence in case, that they were exported illegally. And Canada is still a State of Law (Argentina pro forma too), so not the accused has to prove his innocence, but the accuser has to evidence that he is guilty. But in general. Nobody is happy with that legal situation, that meteoritical Ren & Stimpy Show, I guess, least of all the Canadians themselves. And I really hope, that the new fall now will take the fears, the aggressiveness in the debate and will lead to a more meaning- and fruitful handling of meteorites in future there. It might be the problem, that "the officials" can't see the difference between meteorites and fossils, minerals, resources and artefacts, which they want to protect. A diamond, a dino is lying millions of years in the rocks, an artefact and something like the crater with the irons rests for thousands of years there. So there is no hurry, they can stay in the ground also for some generations more and it's o.k. to plant the banner there and to say "preserved for eternity, hands off". Not so - a fresh meteorite fall. There it is the top priority to rescue the stones from the harsh environment in the most prisitine condition. A single rain fall, a frost can already gravely damage the material, each week of searching without success let the isotope clock tick. Flight dynamics, fragmentation, strewnfield... interesting points, but in dubio pro meteoritem with a new fall. That was also the methodical mistake with Tagish Lake, where the Canadian Geological Survey - one can't say it else - destroyed valuable cultural heritage of Canada. But errors are made for learning from them. Now the scientists are faster. To recover new falls you need knowledge and you need manpower, the more people are searching the better! Restrictive property laws and protectionism do constrict the possibility of recovering new falls. Especially in countries, where "the officials" don't have enough experience with meteorites. See Africa, see Peru... I can't understand why the authorities still ignore the very positive experiences made with the cooperation of "official" and "private" initiatives in the recovering and documentation of almost all European falls of our decade? My home fall, Neuschwanstein. The DLR gave to everyone, who wanted to hunt, the exact data of the possible strewnfield, which they had precalculated. Only because of this, the 3 stones could have been recovered. They never would have been found and would be meanwhile destroyed under the harsh alpine conditions, if the officials wouldn't have used the help of private hunters and searchers. Think back to Villalbeto. Only a fraction of the masses would be housed nowadays in the Spanish museums and universities, if they would have tried to hunt them by theit own. No LaPice at all would exist, if not a private person did all the field work in calculating a possible strewnfield, interviewing eyewitnesses, evaluating observations, in cooperation with the "officials" and in hunting so long, until the first stone was found. Moss... would we have more than the stone which hit the tree..... And so on. Or please note the wonderful documentation and catalogue Buhl/Baermann made about the Chergach fall in the so necessary timely manner. We are all collectors and we know how disappointing and laborious it is even with the falls of our times to research in the archives to find only here a lousy photo, there a small newspaper article. An university in Mali would not have been able to do a similar professional work. Look into Buhl's Santa Victoria documentation. Now he tried to make the same with the Indian fall, but was gravely impeded by the officials there to do so, an effect of that hysterical debate of the recent years. Another aspect is, what we don't have to forget, that to forbid by law the owner of a stone to do with the stone what he likes to do, is legally seen a very severe intrusion in his personal laws, and certainly for a State of Law always the worst solution. Side effect of the Canadian situation - maybe they wouldn't have priced it now at 50$/g, if Canadian meteorites wouldn't be so expensive in general. Why are they so expensive? Is their a higher demand on the domestic Canadian market? Does the material own a higher intrinsic value because it felt in Canada instead in USA? No. Canadian meteorites are so expensive, because their availability is restricted. If the regulations would be as liberal as in USA, Canadian meteorites wouldn't cost more than American meteorites. So if the "officials" want to take advantage of their pre-emption to purchase a meteorite and if they have to "heal" the severe restriction of the personal laws of the owner in compensating him paying a fair market value, they have to pay more than without that law. That all was concerning now new falls. Much worse are restrictive laws regarding finds, whenever a searcher, finder, owner is not rewarded for his finds, either by the state or by being allowed to market it by his own. I gave the example Libya already. In 5 years the hunters were active, 1084 meteorites were found. In the following 7 years, when they stayed home, only 45 meteorites were recovered. Take Egypt. A desert country. It has less meteorites than small humid Germany and is one of the few desert countries, which completely is taken out from the great hot desert rush. Australia - the better Canada - A fine place to hunt. Please set the 7 (seven) finds of the recent 10 years made in Australia against the numerous desert finds the US-American amateur hunters made in USA in this decade. So my point is, to come to a more rational debate. Protectionism was an attempt, that science and the nations keep and obtain more meteorites. All hard data demonstrate, that the effect was obverse. The countries with restrictions dramatically suffered - much much less meteorites were found and landed in the institutions as in the times where no restrictions took place or in comparable countries without protectionism. So obviously protectionism is improper for the intended goals and brought opposite results. And should be history now. Amen Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von al mitterling Gesendet: Sonntag, 7. Dezember 2008 13:29 An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Cc: Michael Farmer Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Greetings List, Interesting topics. Mike is right on about the Canadians. They don't play games. The former curator of the Canadian Collection was scanning ebay meteorite auctions for many years for Canadian Cultural Property including meteorites. The only way I was able to figure this out was a friend offer me some diamonds he had purchased to sell on ebay for him. They were Canadian. I received an inquiry as to where I had obtained my diamonds from Canada from the Canadian Mounted Police!! I let David know they were wondering (I had no doubt what so ever that David had purchased these legally). After David told the police they were purchased from one of the largest diamond companies and families in Canada, they backed way off but left a negative opinion in my mind that you can't purchase Canadian items without having to justify resaling them later. We later then found out about the meteorite snoop. It also fit in that he use to visit Tucson and Denver. I thought to build up their collection, but also to check for Canadian material. All my best to all. --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Farmer" To: ; Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 6:00 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale >I highly doubt it will be in Tucson, if it is then it is illegal, and I >would not touch it. India doesnt scare me much, but Canada sent people to >Tokyo two years back to look for fossils. They don't play games. > Michael Farmer ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From darryl at dof3.com Sun Dec 7 12:26:48 2008 From: darryl at dof3.com (Darryl Pitt) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:26:48 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <93aaac890812070802o77b7e335n3de3c8f6e456348e@mail.gmail.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> <93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com> <44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> <93aaac890812070802o77b7e335n3de3c8f6e456348e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8AEC260D-E7F6-486F-B4D6-FCF939359569@dof3.com> Jason, Small detail....I never mentioned Park Forest. And speaking of being "at a loss for words," I don't quite know how to respond to your unbridled attack on "my" point of view regarding the same(?!) As it regards the Chergach and Bassikounou examples, I sincerely believe that irrespective of how inexpensive initial suppliers sell material, that it is incumbent on us to consider the implications of our pricing in the marketplace. I take a longer view of such anomalies. Just because I was offered Chergach at $0.50/g doesn't mean that it's responsible for me to widely offer it for $1.50/g even though it represents a 200% profit to me. Whether we can quantify the effect or not, beyond cheap meteorites have an effect on the rest of the marketplace. They create their own "gravity." That's all I'm trying to say. All best / Darryl On Dec 7, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Jason Utas wrote: > Darryl, > Low-end numbers? Even Park Forest which was witnessed, caught on > numerous videos, and fell in a densely populated urban environment - > in what may well be a majority of cases, hitting man-made objects, was > selling for $30/g or so at the time of the fall - a price which has > stayed roughly the same, if it hasn't come down a few dollars per gram > since then. > How much Park Forest was recovered? According to this report, > roughly 30kg. > > http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Aug04/ParkForest.html > > More of this fall has been recovered in the past week than from the > entire fall of Park Forest. > It hasn't hit anything interesting, as far as we know. > It's an ordinary chondrite - even Park Forest had some pretty > brecciation/melt. I've heard of nothing of the sort from this fall. > It was caught on video, granted, and that does make it special in one > way...why you think that should boost the value of it to twice the > value of the undoubtedly more interesting Park Forest, also caught on > video (and five or ten times the price of other comparable falls), I > honestly...I'm at a lack for words. > > "Low-end numbers being bandied about?" > > On the one hand, you seem to criticize the high price being asked by > these sellers, and on the other, you say the current market rates for > other falls are "low-end numbers?" > > I don't understand. $5-10/g for these new falls is far overpriced, as > best I can tell. At least with Chergach and Bassikounou, suppliers > were contacting list-members directly and offering stones at $2/g > initially - less for larger stones. > > You seem to be saying that's too cheap. Why? If the sellers are > content, and I don't think the buyers are complaining, well, I can't > see any reason for you to say such a thing. If both parties are > happy, I honestly don't see how you can say such a thing. > > Look at the numbers from my last email. A mere $10/g would provide > the hunters each with $5,000, assuming they only came back with 250g > each. > > It's classic marketing technique to tell potential buyers that they > got precious little out of the fall, as they said they did. > If people think there's less, they'll want to buy more. There's a > reason they're not telling anyone how much they got, after all. I > wonder why...and I wonder if they ever will tell us how much they > found/were allowed to keep.... After all, unless they're just using > that as a marketing ploy, they really have no reason not to tell us. > > Jason > > On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 7:38 AM, Darryl Pitt wrote: >> >> >> Folks, >> >> If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times: meteorites as a >> collectible do not attract more serious collectors because there >> are too >> many aberrations of valuation--such that the aberrations have >> become the >> norm. Several serious collectors who have been intrigued with >> meteorites >> have shared with me that they've opted not to climb in because of >> their >> belief in an "immature" and "unsophisticated" marketplace. Their >> words. >> >> In my humble opinion, the quality of the fireball video associated >> with the >> Canadian event makes it worth far more than the low-end numbers being >> bandied about. >> >> Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell >> for a >> couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain this >> doesn't occur. >> >> All best / d >> >> >> ===================== >> From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Sun Dec 7 12:27:03 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 09:27:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Moss meteorite and Norway's "attempt" to claim theft. In-Reply-To: <007a01c9588d$8d60e3a0$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Message-ID: <664273.2012.qm@web110210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> This whole discussion brings back memories of out Moss CO3 hunt and subsequent recovery of the Morten Bilet/Michael Farmer stone, ~900 grams out of 3.6 kilos total recovered. Many of us meteorite hunters from both USA and European countries, Poland, Sweden, Norway, Germany, UK, Canada etc were all hunting there and in the news. I got a call from the people at the Norway National university in Oslo who curate meteorites. They came on the bus to lecture me about destroying science by collecting meteorites for private purposes. They then said that Norwegian law allowed for any finder to own a metorite, but they did not like that at all. They then promptly ended the meeting saying that they had to catch a bus back to Oslo, despite the fact that the hotel was exactly in the center of the strewnfield. They had no desire to actually search! Days later, Morten and I found nearly a third of this rare meteorite in a parking lot, many of the pieces already destroyed by cars running over them and heavy equipment smashing them to dust. I have photos of the gray dust marks that days before had been large fragments of the Moss meteorite. Without us, Moss would consist of barely 1.5 kilogram in the three pieces (toilet hitter, tree cutter, and roof smasher). A later newspaper articles was titled "STOP, Meteorite THIEVES" funny, it is hard to steal what is legal to find and own. Then we can take Puerto Lapice, our team recovered over 30 stones, nearly 1/3 of the total known weight of that rare Eucrite, and Spain went crazy, calling us thieves although Spain has no law preventing meteorites from leaving Spain. We went 4 MONTHS later, after 99% of the strewnfield had been completely plowed over and destroyed. Had we not done that, those stones would have been lost as well. Science and private hunters work well together when we try, and trying to block on the other only leads to fewer recoveries and loss of science and material for all. I think this Canadian fall will go well, I havent read much that shows otherwise. Michael Farmer From darryl at dof3.com Sun Dec 7 12:27:44 2008 From: darryl at dof3.com (Darryl Pitt) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:27:44 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> <93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com> <44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> <8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com> Message-ID: <0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com> Darren, I hear you, but it's not about the rich snobs, it's about economic forces brought to the table which will result in a more stable marketplace and increasing valuations---and that's good for all of us. Wouldn't it be great if there were market factors which limited the kinds of aberrations which have stung us all at one time or another? I'm all for fun! ;-) On Dec 7, 2008, at 11:05 AM, Darren Garrison wrote: > On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 10:38:59 -0500, you wrote: > >> with meteorites have shared with me that they've opted not to climb >> in >> because of their belief in an "immature" and "unsophisticated" >> marketplace. Their words. > > > >> Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell >> for >> a couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain >> this doesn't occur. > > Myself, I'd rather see meteorite collecting as a fun (immature, > unsuphisticated) > hobby that anyone interested can afford to join (even if just for > small pieces) > than as a way for rich snobs to become richer. I say that those > "serious > collectors" who you talked to can go screw themselves. > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Sun Dec 7 12:40:49 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 18:40:49 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Moss meteorite and Norway's "attempt" to claimtheft. In-Reply-To: <664273.2012.qm@web110210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <007a01c9588d$8d60e3a0$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> <664273.2012.qm@web110210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <007e01c95892$f21ebce0$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Hmja, possibly a deficiency of their university schooling. Half a lesson in the series of lectures or the workshop in meteoritics about the history of this subject, And then they would have known, that it always was so the last 300 years, that there were the farmers and the Farmers picking up the stones to sell or to donate them to the scientists and the collectors. In my opinion also in natural science a short glimpse onto the cultural context is important. Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Michael Farmer Gesendet: Sonntag, 7. Dezember 2008 18:27 An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com; Martin Altmann Betreff: [meteorite-list] Moss meteorite and Norway's "attempt" to claimtheft. This whole discussion brings back memories of out Moss CO3 hunt and subsequent recovery of the Morten Bilet/Michael Farmer stone, ~900 grams out of 3.6 kilos total recovered. Many of us meteorite hunters from both USA and European countries, Poland, Sweden, Norway, Germany, UK, Canada etc were all hunting there and in the news. I got a call from the people at the Norway National university in Oslo who curate meteorites. They came on the bus to lecture me about destroying science by collecting meteorites for private purposes. They then said that Norwegian law allowed for any finder to own a metorite, but they did not like that at all. They then promptly ended the meeting saying that they had to catch a bus back to Oslo, despite the fact that the hotel was exactly in the center of the strewnfield. They had no desire to actually search! Days later, Morten and I found nearly a third of this rare meteorite in a parking lot, many of the pieces already destroyed by cars running over them and heavy equipment smashing them to dust. I have photos of the gray dust marks that days before had been large fragments of the Moss meteorite. Without us, Moss would consist of barely 1.5 kilogram in the three pieces (toilet hitter, tree cutter, and roof smasher). A later newspaper articles was titled "STOP, Meteorite THIEVES" funny, it is hard to steal what is legal to find and own. Then we can take Puerto Lapice, our team recovered over 30 stones, nearly 1/3 of the total known weight of that rare Eucrite, and Spain went crazy, calling us thieves although Spain has no law preventing meteorites from leaving Spain. We went 4 MONTHS later, after 99% of the strewnfield had been completely plowed over and destroyed. Had we not done that, those stones would have been lost as well. Science and private hunters work well together when we try, and trying to block on the other only leads to fewer recoveries and loss of science and material for all. I think this Canadian fall will go well, I havent read much that shows otherwise. Michael Farmer ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From dave at fallingrocks.com Sun Dec 7 12:43:46 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:43:46 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <93aaac890812070802o77b7e335n3de3c8f6e456348e@mail.gmail.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> <93aaac890812070802o77b7e335n3de3c8f6e456348e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3AC8FDACCA61497DB7293D64F1F53747@meteorroom> Jason, Darryl & All, Darryl is right. This "industry" is famous for pricing/value issues. Many dealers (not all, of course...just many) have brought new material to the market, sold it for a premium to make their profit, then dumped the remaining material once the market has been satisfied as if this were the retail clothing business (will provide an explanation here if it's needed) on countless occasions. It's hard to imaging that this might inspire confidence in a serious collector. The "low-end numbers" part of Darryl's email is secondary to this, and it's not clear which numbers he's referring to within the framework of this discussion, anyway. Government intervention -- such as is present in Canada -- has a way of adding to the chaos around specimen value (and generating some tragedies along the way, a la Tagish Lake), too. It's great that Sonny and McCartney were hunting this fall early, and hopefully as this continues to happen the message about the importance of recovering material and the need for a strong incentive to make that possible gets out. International laws regarding meteorite recovery and export have virtually all been established as a bolt-on package to other legislation around artifacts, etc, and for the most part these decisions have been made by officials who have probably never even seen a meteorite (let alone developed an understanding of the field and related relevant issues). Back to values and suppliers contacting collectors directly in the North African falls: this is illustrative of the near absence of a conventional distribution channel, and there is risk that comes with acquiring material in that manner. The internet has made it possible for just about anyone to be a dealer and these challenges will likely continue to fester until an international organization truly establishes some standards in this arena around verifiable provenance, prioritizing meteorite recovery over politics, proper curation, collection transfer protocol and the like. Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Jason Utas Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 11:02 AM To: Meteorite-list Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Darryl, Low-end numbers? Even Park Forest which was witnessed, caught on numerous videos, and fell in a densely populated urban environment - in what may well be a majority of cases, hitting man-made objects, was selling for $30/g or so at the time of the fall - a price which has stayed roughly the same, if it hasn't come down a few dollars per gram since then. How much Park Forest was recovered? According to this report, roughly 30kg. http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Aug04/ParkForest.html More of this fall has been recovered in the past week than from the entire fall of Park Forest. It hasn't hit anything interesting, as far as we know. It's an ordinary chondrite - even Park Forest had some pretty brecciation/melt. I've heard of nothing of the sort from this fall. It was caught on video, granted, and that does make it special in one way...why you think that should boost the value of it to twice the value of the undoubtedly more interesting Park Forest, also caught on video (and five or ten times the price of other comparable falls), I honestly...I'm at a lack for words. "Low-end numbers being bandied about?" On the one hand, you seem to criticize the high price being asked by these sellers, and on the other, you say the current market rates for other falls are "low-end numbers?" I don't understand. $5-10/g for these new falls is far overpriced, as best I can tell. At least with Chergach and Bassikounou, suppliers were contacting list-members directly and offering stones at $2/g initially - less for larger stones. You seem to be saying that's too cheap. Why? If the sellers are content, and I don't think the buyers are complaining, well, I can't see any reason for you to say such a thing. If both parties are happy, I honestly don't see how you can say such a thing. Look at the numbers from my last email. A mere $10/g would provide the hunters each with $5,000, assuming they only came back with 250g each. It's classic marketing technique to tell potential buyers that they got precious little out of the fall, as they said they did. If people think there's less, they'll want to buy more. There's a reason they're not telling anyone how much they got, after all. I wonder why...and I wonder if they ever will tell us how much they found/were allowed to keep.... After all, unless they're just using that as a marketing ploy, they really have no reason not to tell us. Jason On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 7:38 AM, Darryl Pitt wrote: > > > Folks, > > If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times: meteorites as a > collectible do not attract more serious collectors because there are > too many aberrations of valuation--such that the aberrations have > become the norm. Several serious collectors who have been intrigued > with meteorites have shared with me that they've opted not to climb in > because of their belief in an "immature" and "unsophisticated" marketplace. Their words. > > In my humble opinion, the quality of the fireball video associated > with the Canadian event makes it worth far more than the low-end > numbers being bandied about. > > Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell for > a couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain > this doesn't occur. > > All best / d > > > ===================== > > > On Dec 7, 2008, at 3:34 AM, Jason Utas wrote: > >> Hello Jeff, All, >> >> The comparison to Carancas was provided as a contrast simply because >> it is such an unusual and different meteorite, and yet the asking >> price for these new Canadian stones is roughly what Carancas is going >> for right now. It's a large, ordinary, equilibrated chondrite fall, >> the likes of which we see almost once a year with some regularity >> (e.g. Thuathe, Amgala, Park Forest, Kilabo, Bensour, Chergach, >> Bassikounou, Berduc, etc.). >> >> And the asking price is more than Park Forest, which was a >> spectacular urban fall, and of which less material was found. The >> asking price for Park Forest currently runs between $20-30/g, from what I can find. >> A dealer or two have it listed at $40/g, but...not average. The >> price at the time was...$20-30/g. It started high, and, because of >> great demand for the urban fall, it stayed high. >> >> All of the other falls are ~$1.20/g (see the beautifully fresh 1.7kg >> Chergach that just passed on ebay, from ET, as well as a brace of >> stones I personally bought in the 120g range from an American dealer) >> to the asking price of $5-10/g for pieces of the other falls (see >> ebay >> - meteoritica, Hupe - both have Chergach currently listed on ebay, >> and there's quite a bit of Bensour around if you want to compare >> that), not that they sell quickly at those prices. After all, if you >> look at what's listed, well, those are the pieces that have yet to sell. >> >> The only comparable meteorite I can find is the Argentinean fall of >> Berduc, which, though I can't name any names (it was a while ago), >> was listed between $10 and $30/g. Restricted export, few suppliers, >> fresh fall, etc. >> >> The initial determining of the asking price of a fall is essentially >> arbitrary The hunters could set it at $5/g or $10/g if they only >> wanted to cover personal costs (and make a little on the side). Or >> they could try to set it at $1000/g to make a profit. The only thing >> keeping them from charging that much is the knowledge that, at some >> point, they wouldn't turn a profit because their asking price would >> be too high for anyone to buy. >> A dealer looking to turn as high a profit as possible would ask as >> high a price as he could, while still selling all of his material. >> >> Why wouldn't they? Do you really feel indignant enough at the >> dealers' asking five or ten times the price for comparable falls to >> not buy a stone from them? Personally, I do, and I won't. I think >> they're taking advantage of us folks who love them, but who have jobs >> and obligations - people who love them enough that we would go on >> such trips that we could, but who can't because of our responsibilities. >> >> But let's have some fun. >> >> Lets assume these fellows come back with a mere 500g. Just over a >> pound of space, between the two of them. >> And let's assume a high trip/cost estimate: >> Given that next-day flights to Edmonton from where I live were ~$130, >> and let's say they both stay there for a week at $80/night + food, a >> car....it works out to about a thousand dollars for the trip, each. >> $2,000 combined cost. >> >> If that's right, they would break even at $4/g. Each $1/g over $4/g >> would give them $500. >> If they're asking $50/g, they would make...$46x500. >> >> That's a profit of $23,000. >> >> And if my estimate was off and they each flew first-class, rented >> Hummers, and spent $50/day on food, they'll only make $20,000 off of >> 500g. >> >> ...Do you think they got more than a pound of material from the trip? >> I would assume so. >> A kilogram between the two of them would give them almost $50,000. >> Not bad for a quick flight up to Edmonton and a week's fun. >> >> I'll wait for the thaw. Anyone else who has spring break free (dates >> available), drop me a line and I'll see what kind of a trip we can >> arrange. What I can promise is that if I do find enough on that trip >> to warrant selling some, I'll have it at a reasonable price. >> >> Regards, >> Jason >> >> >> >> On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 11:18 PM, Jeff Kuyken >> wrote: >>> >>> Steve and Mike both touched on an interesting point here that I was >>> pondering myself the last couple of days. The material found now >>> will be different to the material found weeks, months and years down >>> the track. I didn't realise how much a fall can vary until "Amgala" >>> (Oum Dreyga). I purchased a 15g individual from Mike Farmer from his >>> very first batch of about 1kg. I believe these were about the first >>> stones picked up. I paid about $10/g and it was worth every cent. I >>> have several other Oum Dreyga specimens from numerous sources and >>> NONE come even close to the first 15g which looks like soot would >>> rub off on your hands. In fact no other recent fall I have appears >>> as fresh as this stone. Two other recent falls that come immediately >>> to mind with vast differences in weathering are Park Forest and >>> Moss. >>> >>> So maybe $50/g is high but maybe it's also not so bad considering >>> what the other stones 'might' be like down the track. You can also >>> speculate all you like but there are so many factors which will >>> dictate the price of a fall. >>> And I don't think you can really compare one with another. Comparing >>> this Canadian fall with Carancas is probably not a good measure at >>> all. They are two totally different falls with two totally different >>> stories. >>> >>> The most important thing to remember about the 'value' of a >>> meteorite (or anything for that matter) is that it is only worth >>> what someone is willing to pay. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Jeff >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: >>> To: ; >>> >>> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 5:34 AM >>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale >>> >>> >>>> Greg and All, >>>> >>>> I tend to agree that the price MIGHT drop to $10/g, especially if >>>> there is a high degree of rusting on the specimens found later >>>> next year. >>>> >>>> However, there is a chance the Canadians might offer to buy all or >>>> most of the ones already found. >>>> >>>> If the land owners can get a tax credit on $50/g to donate them, >>>> everyone up there might be happy to donate them, and at a 50% tax >>>> rate, that is the same as getting $25/g cash in hand to the >>>> overtaxed Canadians. >>>> >>>> It sounds like most of the land owners are very wealthy, so money >>>> may not mean anything to them. They might donate them all and not >>>> even care about a tax break or cash values at all. >>>> >>>> If only a few kilos make it to the market place, then we could see >>>> the value be higher than $10/g. >>>> >>>> If we seen hundreds of rusty kilos coming onto the market, then we >>>> could see the prices end up way below $10/g. >>>> >>>> In any case, we probably will have to wait for the 6 months to >>>> pass to see what is not purchased by the Canadian Government. >>>> >>>> One thing is sure, if ALL the masses were put on a restricted >>>> Canadian only collector market, a few hundred kilos would probably >>>> sell for $0.10 a gram or even less. >>>> >>>> A smart thing might be to buy one specimen from Sonny and McCartney >>>> NOW at $50/g and then buy more later at $10/g and if the price goes >>>> down to under $1/g then buy so much more that you will have cost >>>> averaged your first purchase at $50/g down to a reasonable level. >>>> >>>> Of course, if you are one of those people that get a rush at >>>> owning the newest most famous meteorite that everyone is talking >>>> about around the water cooler, then how can you put a value on >>>> that??? >>>> >>>> :-) >>>> >>>> And also, realize that if you do buy a meteorite from Sonny and >>>> McCartney now, you are investing into field recovery. I seriously >>>> doubt they will make a profit on this trip even if they sold what >>>> little they found at $100/g, but if they can come close to breaking >>>> even, maybe next time they will again be able to afford to get on >>>> the scene early and find more. >>>> >>>> And at the very least, we should congratulate them on getting to >>>> the scene and making an effort. >>>> >>>> Good job guys, and congratulations! >>>> >>>> Steve Arnold #1 >>>> www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com >>>> >>>> **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, >>>> and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >>>> >>>> >>>> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntao >>>> lcom00000010) ______________________________________________ >>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>>> >>>> >>> >>> ______________________________________________ >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From dave at fallingrocks.com Sun Dec 7 12:45:16 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:45:16 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <8AEC260D-E7F6-486F-B4D6-FCF939359569@dof3.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><93aaac890812070802o77b7e335n3de3c8f6e456348e@mail.gmail.com> <8AEC260D-E7F6-486F-B4D6-FCF939359569@dof3.com> Message-ID: <8B625AFAB6604F42B379E98505CF59E9@meteorroom> B-I-N-G-O. Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Darryl Pitt Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 12:27 PM To: Jason Utas Cc: Meteorite-list Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Jason, Small detail....I never mentioned Park Forest. And speaking of being "at a loss for words," I don't quite know how to respond to your unbridled attack on "my" point of view regarding the same(?!) As it regards the Chergach and Bassikounou examples, I sincerely believe that irrespective of how inexpensive initial suppliers sell material, that it is incumbent on us to consider the implications of our pricing in the marketplace. I take a longer view of such anomalies. Just because I was offered Chergach at $0.50/g doesn't mean that it's responsible for me to widely offer it for $1.50/g even though it represents a 200% profit to me. Whether we can quantify the effect or not, beyond cheap meteorites have an effect on the rest of the marketplace. They create their own "gravity." That's all I'm trying to say. All best / Darryl On Dec 7, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Jason Utas wrote: > Darryl, > Low-end numbers? Even Park Forest which was witnessed, caught on > numerous videos, and fell in a densely populated urban environment - > in what may well be a majority of cases, hitting man-made objects, was > selling for $30/g or so at the time of the fall - a price which has > stayed roughly the same, if it hasn't come down a few dollars per gram > since then. > How much Park Forest was recovered? According to this report, roughly > 30kg. > > http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Aug04/ParkForest.html > > More of this fall has been recovered in the past week than from the > entire fall of Park Forest. > It hasn't hit anything interesting, as far as we know. > It's an ordinary chondrite - even Park Forest had some pretty > brecciation/melt. I've heard of nothing of the sort from this fall. > It was caught on video, granted, and that does make it special in one > way...why you think that should boost the value of it to twice the > value of the undoubtedly more interesting Park Forest, also caught on > video (and five or ten times the price of other comparable falls), I > honestly...I'm at a lack for words. > > "Low-end numbers being bandied about?" > > On the one hand, you seem to criticize the high price being asked by > these sellers, and on the other, you say the current market rates for > other falls are "low-end numbers?" > > I don't understand. $5-10/g for these new falls is far overpriced, as > best I can tell. At least with Chergach and Bassikounou, suppliers > were contacting list-members directly and offering stones at $2/g > initially - less for larger stones. > > You seem to be saying that's too cheap. Why? If the sellers are > content, and I don't think the buyers are complaining, well, I can't > see any reason for you to say such a thing. If both parties are > happy, I honestly don't see how you can say such a thing. > > Look at the numbers from my last email. A mere $10/g would provide > the hunters each with $5,000, assuming they only came back with 250g > each. > > It's classic marketing technique to tell potential buyers that they > got precious little out of the fall, as they said they did. > If people think there's less, they'll want to buy more. There's a > reason they're not telling anyone how much they got, after all. I > wonder why...and I wonder if they ever will tell us how much they > found/were allowed to keep.... After all, unless they're just using > that as a marketing ploy, they really have no reason not to tell us. > > Jason > > On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 7:38 AM, Darryl Pitt wrote: >> >> >> Folks, >> >> If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times: meteorites as a >> collectible do not attract more serious collectors because there are >> too many aberrations of valuation--such that the aberrations have >> become the norm. Several serious collectors who have been intrigued >> with meteorites have shared with me that they've opted not to climb >> in because of their belief in an "immature" and "unsophisticated" >> marketplace. Their words. >> >> In my humble opinion, the quality of the fireball video associated >> with the Canadian event makes it worth far more than the low-end >> numbers being bandied about. >> >> Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell >> for a couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make >> certain this doesn't occur. >> >> All best / d >> >> >> ===================== >> ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From dave at fallingrocks.com Sun Dec 7 12:57:16 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:57:16 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com> <0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com> Message-ID: <782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom> Darren & All, Back to ridiculous class warfare...nice. This is a serious business, and classless quips won't serve the debate well here. We have recovered more and more material over time because the incentive (i.e. money, which, by definition, rich people happen to have) to do so has increased in advance of the recoveries themselves. There is plenty of material for those who want to have fun in an "immature, unsuphisticated" (sic) arena, and that's great. The desire (i.e. how much money one is willing to pay) for a lot of this material (not all, of course), however, does not generate the kind of incentive to motivate top-flight meteorite hunters to get on planes, risk their own capital and time and energy (and necks, in some cases) to find epic meteorites. Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Darryl Pitt Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 12:28 PM To: cynapse at charter.net Cc: Meteorite-list Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Darren, I hear you, but it's not about the rich snobs, it's about economic forces brought to the table which will result in a more stable marketplace and increasing valuations---and that's good for all of us. Wouldn't it be great if there were market factors which limited the kinds of aberrations which have stung us all at one time or another? I'm all for fun! ;-) On Dec 7, 2008, at 11:05 AM, Darren Garrison wrote: > On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 10:38:59 -0500, you wrote: > >> with meteorites have shared with me that they've opted not to climb >> in because of their belief in an "immature" and "unsophisticated" >> marketplace. Their words. > > > >> Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell >> for a couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make >> certain this doesn't occur. > > Myself, I'd rather see meteorite collecting as a fun (immature, > unsuphisticated) > hobby that anyone interested can afford to join (even if just for > small pieces) than as a way for rich snobs to become richer. I say > that those "serious collectors" who you talked to can go screw > themselves. > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Sun Dec 7 13:01:09 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 19:01:09 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com> <0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com> Message-ID: <007f01c95895$c925d140$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Meteorites and "Market"? I have always my difficulties. A collectors market? Hmm 71 million$ for a Warhol here, 40 milions for a van Gogh there, 2.5 million for a Macke here, 120 millions for a Klimt there... And the stuff we collect is rarer than these... (In principle it is bizarre to discuss, whether a Bassikonou or a Mali should cost 50 cents, 1$, 3$ or 1000$.... or a Moon 1000$ or 10,000,000 isn't it?) Imagine, if only a single of these collectors buying such collectibles will discover meteorites as a field of collecting. Eeeek! Once such a sum spend like for such a painting - and booooom - there is no meteorite market anymore, because there are no meteorites left :-) Any estimates, which annual volumes in total are moved in the meteorite market? Ebay-fanatics - has one of you ever noted how many $$$ are actually sold (sold not offered) in meteorites there per week? Would be interesting. Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Darryl Pitt Gesendet: Sonntag, 7. Dezember 2008 18:28 An: cynapse at charter.net Cc: Meteorite-list Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Darren, I hear you, but it's not about the rich snobs, it's about economic forces brought to the table which will result in a more stable marketplace and increasing valuations---and that's good for all of us. Wouldn't it be great if there were market factors which limited the kinds of aberrations which have stung us all at one time or another? I'm all for fun! ;-) From cynapse at charter.net Sun Dec 7 13:09:49 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 13:09:49 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> <93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com> <44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> <8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com> <0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com> Message-ID: <704oj49cu4a62cea104jov1etfo0jdm181@4ax.com> On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:27:44 -0500, you wrote: >I hear you, but it's not about the rich snobs, it's about economic >forces brought to the table which will result in a more stable >marketplace and increasing valuations---and that's good for all of >us. Wouldn't it be great if there were market factors which limited >the kinds of aberrations which have stung us all at one time or another? If there is something that I want, I buy it to keep, not for some future resale value. So if I pay, say, $50 a gram for something now, and a year from now, it is selling for $5 a gram, that just means that I can now buy 10 times as much. And if it falls to 50 cents a gram, I can buy 10 times as much again. Here's the thing about my hobbies-- I don't expect to ever get back the money that I put into them. As a computer hobbiest, I spent $40 per megabyte for the first memory expansions I added to my PC ($160 for 4 MB). Last week, I spent one penny per megabyte ($20 for 4096 MB). I not only am used to falling prices on things (thus destruction of cash value of investments)-- I want it. From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Sun Dec 7 13:09:55 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 10:09:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction? Message-ID: <436726.30791.qm@web110210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Anyone here bidding on anything live? I am curious to know where the meteorites are at, if they have sold. mike From cynapse at charter.net Sun Dec 7 13:12:11 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 13:12:11 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com> <0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com> <782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom> Message-ID: <6d4oj49uomrukqh8m0dda83m0np2hmc9gd@4ax.com> On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:57:16 -0500, you wrote: >Darren & All, >Back to ridiculous class warfare...nice. This is a serious business Here's the thing-- for you, it is a business. For me, it isn't. From darryl at dof3.com Sun Dec 7 13:17:36 2008 From: darryl at dof3.com (Darryl Pitt) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 13:17:36 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <642878.43899.qm@web45112.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <642878.43899.qm@web45112.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9D892F69-50AC-49BD-8BD8-6730C98FD0A0@dof3.com> Hi Carl, Yes-yes, of course this is about rarity, but the valuation of meteorites frequently has so much to do with circumstances of the fall and recovery, and that's where it's not quite the same as other collectibles. There are dozens and dozens of really colorful examples which underscore this dynamic. The notion of rarity is not intrinsic to scientific importance. A-L-L-E-N-D-E. And to use your example, if Carancas occurred in Africa is it worth more or less? Canada or Montana? Detroit or Corsica? And if in Corsica, what about if it occurred in Bastia or instead fell on a nude beach in front of a crowd? In short, if you accept there are a host of variables determining valuations, the "added value" of a bolide video makes that meteorite worth more. And then it only seems to follow---everything else being the same--that a spectacular video would render a higher valuation for the material than a mediocre video. With this in mind, even if there are 100 kg of material of the Canadian event, it's my opinion that it's worth more than $10/g. Thanks for your thoughtful note and I hope meteorite collecting provides you with a great source of enjoyment. All best / Darryl On Dec 7, 2008, at 11:19 AM, Carl Esparza wrote: > Darryl, > With all due respect, As you know I am new at this and I tend to > hear the same sort of things from friends about meteorite > collecting. But as a life long art and antique dealer i see it a > little different. Yes, meteorites have the curb appeal and all of > the hype but the main thing that should be driving the value is > rarity. Yes, a fireball is a rarity but not really ( maybe?) . Lets > face it we have all seen incredible fireballs. I think , since > recent studies have shown that most material that passes though our > atmosphere does not show crust and therefore is missed so, we miss a > lot of rare material. Now if we ever discover an unusual material > that fell that would be something and rare. The way I see our > scientists study habits is primarily pigeonholing the material. If > it ain't covered with the black stuff they just toss it aside. Even > though they know damn well about the recent studies which had real > rocks attached to the cone of a rocket's re-entry and it's results. > They also know much more about the types of rocks and their > layering textures on other planets and yet still not one find with > layering. Darryl, to me that is what is wrong with this hobby. No > direction. There should be way more scientists willing to look at > more than just the obvious and not assume it to be earthen because > it has layers or no fusion crust. > But back to the point . Rarity is what creates value and falls like > Carancas truly are rare events. It not only crated a crater but it > did it with a very friable material and it's cosmochemestry is being > described as inexplicable. Having said that. I have yet to read one > single scientific paper on the subject. These so called scientists > in this field totally dropped the ball on this extraordinary > information. And so the value plummets on material that truly is > rare and desireable as such. > Thanks again Carl > Carl Esparza > meteoritemax > IMCA 5829 > > > --- On Sun, 12/7/08, Darryl Pitt wrote: > From: Darryl Pitt > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > To: "Jason Utas" > Cc: "Meteorite-list" > Date: Sunday, December 7, 2008, 8:38 AM > > Folks, > > If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times: meteorites as a > collectible do not attract more serious collectors because there are > too many > aberrations of valuation--such that the aberrations have become the > norm. > Several serious collectors who have been intrigued with meteorites > have shared > with me that they've opted not to climb in because of their belief > in an > "immature" and "unsophisticated" marketplace. Their words. > > In my humble opinion, the quality of the fireball video associated > with the > Canadian event makes it worth far more than the low-end numbers > being bandied > about. > > Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell > for a couple > of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain this doesn't > occur. > > All best / d > > > ===================== > > > On Dec 7, 2008, at 3:34 AM, Jason Utas wrote: > > > Hello Jeff, All, > > > > The comparison to Carancas was provided as a contrast simply because > > it is such an unusual and different meteorite, and yet the asking > > price for these new Canadian stones is roughly what Carancas is > going > > for right now. It's a large, ordinary, equilibrated chondrite fall, > > the likes of which we see almost once a year with some regularity > > (e.g. Thuathe, Amgala, Park Forest, Kilabo, Bensour, Chergach, > > Bassikounou, Berduc, etc.). > > > > And the asking price is more than Park Forest, which was a > spectacular > > urban fall, and of which less material was found. The asking price > > for Park Forest currently runs between $20-30/g, from what I can > find. > > A dealer or two have it listed at $40/g, but...not average. The > > price at the time was...$20-30/g. It started high, and, because of > > great demand for the urban fall, it stayed high. > > > > All of the other falls are ~$1.20/g (see the beautifully fresh 1.7kg > > Chergach that just passed on ebay, from ET, as well as a brace of > > stones I personally bought in the 120g range from an American > dealer) > > to the asking price of $5-10/g for pieces of the other falls (see > ebay > > - meteoritica, Hupe - both have Chergach currently listed on ebay, > and > > there's quite a bit of Bensour around if you want to compare that), > > not that they sell quickly at those prices. After all, if you > look at > > what's listed, well, those are the pieces that have yet to sell. > > > > The only comparable meteorite I can find is the Argentinean fall of > > Berduc, which, though I can't name any names (it was a while ago), > was > > listed between $10 and $30/g. Restricted export, few suppliers, > fresh > > fall, etc. > > > > The initial determining of the asking price of a fall is essentially > > arbitrary The hunters could set it at $5/g or $10/g if they only > > wanted to cover personal costs (and make a little on the side). Or > > they could try to set it at $1000/g to make a profit. The only > thing > > keeping them from charging that much is the knowledge that, at some > > point, they wouldn't turn a profit because their asking price > would be > > too high for anyone to buy. > > A dealer looking to turn as high a profit as possible would ask as > > high a price as he could, while still selling all of his material. > > > > Why wouldn't they? Do you really feel indignant enough at the > > dealers' asking five or ten times the price for comparable falls to > > not buy a stone from them? Personally, I do, and I won't. I think > > they're taking advantage of us folks who love them, but who have > jobs > > and obligations - people who love them enough that we would go on > such > > trips that we could, but who can't because of our responsibilities. > > > > But let's have some fun. > > > > Lets assume these fellows come back with a mere 500g. Just over a > > pound of space, between the two of them. > > And let's assume a high trip/cost estimate: > > Given that next-day flights to Edmonton from where I live were ~ > $130, > > and let's say they both stay there for a week at $80/night + food, a > > car....it works out to about a thousand dollars for the trip, each. > > $2,000 combined cost. > > > > If that's right, they would break even at $4/g. Each $1/g over $4/g > > would give them $500. > > If they're asking $50/g, they would make...$46x500. > > > > That's a profit of $23,000. > > > > And if my estimate was off and they each flew first-class, rented > > Hummers, and spent $50/day on food, they'll only make $20,000 off of > > 500g. > > > > ...Do you think they got more than a pound of material from the > trip? > > I would assume so. > > A kilogram between the two of them would give them almost $50,000. > > Not bad for a quick flight up to Edmonton and a week's fun. > > > > I'll wait for the thaw. Anyone else who has spring break free > (dates > > available), drop me a line and I'll see what kind of a trip we can > > arrange. What I can promise is that if I do find enough on that > trip > > to warrant selling some, I'll have it at a reasonable price. > > > > Regards, > > Jason > > > > > > > > On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 11:18 PM, Jeff Kuyken > wrote: > >> Steve and Mike both touched on an interesting point here that I was > >> pondering myself the last couple of days. The material found now > will > be > >> different to the material found weeks, months and years down the > track. I > >> didn't realise how much a fall can vary until "Amgala" > (Oum Dreyga). I > >> purchased a 15g individual from Mike Farmer from his very first > batch > of > >> about 1kg. I believe these were about the first stones picked up. I > paid > >> about $10/g and it was worth every cent. I have several other Oum > Dreyga > >> specimens from numerous sources and NONE come even close to the > first > 15g > >> which looks like soot would rub off on your hands. In fact no other > recent > >> fall I have appears as fresh as this stone. Two other recent falls > that come > >> immediately to mind with vast differences in weathering are Park > Forest and > >> Moss. > >> > >> So maybe $50/g is high but maybe it's also not so bad considering > what the > >> other stones 'might' be like down the track. You can also > speculate all you > >> like but there are so many factors which will dictate the price > of a > fall. > >> And I don't think you can really compare one with another. > Comparing this > >> Canadian fall with Carancas is probably not a good measure at all. > They are > >> two totally different falls with two totally different stories. > >> > >> The most important thing to remember about the 'value' of a > meteorite (or > >> anything for that matter) is that it is only worth what someone is > willing > >> to pay. > >> > >> Cheers, > >> > >> Jeff > >> > >> > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- From: > >> To: ; > > >> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 5:34 AM > >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale > >> > >> > >>> Greg and All, > >>> > >>> I tend to agree that the price MIGHT drop to $10/g, especially if > there > >>> is a > >>> high degree of rusting on the specimens found later next year. > >>> > >>> However, there is a chance the Canadians might offer to buy all > or most > >>> of > >>> the ones already found. > >>> > >>> If the land owners can get a tax credit on $50/g to donate them, > everyone > >>> up > >>> there might be happy to donate them, and at a 50% tax rate, that > is the > >>> same > >>> as getting $25/g cash in hand to the overtaxed Canadians. > >>> > >>> It sounds like most of the land owners are very wealthy, so money > may not > >>> mean anything to them. They might donate them all and not even > care > >>> about a > >>> tax break or cash values at all. > >>> > >>> If only a few kilos make it to the market place, then we could > see the > >>> value > >>> be higher than $10/g. > >>> > >>> If we seen hundreds of rusty kilos coming onto the market, then > we could > >>> see > >>> the prices end up way below $10/g. > >>> > >>> In any case, we probably will have to wait for the 6 months to > pass to > >>> see > >>> what is not purchased by the Canadian Government. > >>> > >>> One thing is sure, if ALL the masses were put on a restricted > Canadian > >>> only > >>> collector market, a few hundred kilos would probably sell for > $0.10 a > >>> gram or > >>> even less. > >>> > >>> A smart thing might be to buy one specimen from Sonny and > McCartney NOW > >>> at > >>> $50/g and then buy more later at $10/g and if the price goes down > to > >>> under > >>> $1/g then buy so much more that you will have cost averaged your > first > >>> purchase > >>> at $50/g down to a reasonable level. > >>> > >>> Of course, if you are one of those people that get a rush at > owning the > >>> newest most famous meteorite that everyone is talking about > around the > >>> water > >>> cooler, then how can you put a value on that??? > >>> > >>> :-) > >>> > >>> And also, realize that if you do buy a meteorite from Sonny and > McCartney > >>> now, you are investing into field recovery. I seriously doubt > they will > >>> make a > >>> profit on this trip even if they sold what little they found at > $100/g, > >>> but > >>> if they can come close to breaking even, maybe next time they > will again > >>> be > >>> able to afford to get on the scene early and find more. > >>> > >>> And at the very least, we should congratulate them on getting to > the > >>> scene > >>> and making an effort. > >>> > >>> Good job guys, and congratulations! > >>> > >>> Steve Arnold #1 > >>> www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > >>> > >>> **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, > and > >>> favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > >>> > >>> > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010 > ) > >>> ______________________________________________ > >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >>> Meteorite-list mailing list > >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >>> > >>> > >> > >> ______________________________________________ > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >> > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From searchingforfun at sbcglobal.net Sun Dec 7 15:34:06 2008 From: searchingforfun at sbcglobal.net (Brian Cox) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:34:06 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD SALE Estherville Meteorite on ebay for Sale 31.0 grams very nice membrane box included.. ends Today Sunday December 7. 2008 18:33:41 Pacific time Message-ID: <004101c958ab$27514820$4001a8c0@BRIANSCOMPUTER> Hello list members, I hope everyone is having a Great weekend! I have a very nice Estherville with beautiful metal and a matrix of olivine that ends Today Sunday Dec-07-08 20:50:45 PST Pacific time. I've knocked the starting price down several times. It comes with a great looking clear membrane display box and I'm paying for the shipping by USPS Priority mail anywhere in the US. Normal shipping rates apply outside the US. Shortcut to: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=280290626570&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=018 I'm putting up more meteorites on ebay over the next few days. Thanks for looking. Brian Cox searchingforfun on ebay IMCA # 6387 From dave at fallingrocks.com Sun Dec 7 14:17:43 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 14:17:43 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <6d4oj49uomrukqh8m0dda83m0np2hmc9gd@4ax.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com><0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com><782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom> <6d4oj49uomrukqh8m0dda83m0np2hmc9gd@4ax.com> Message-ID: Darren, It is not a business for me; I am simply a collector. That said, whether you like it or not, it is a business in the aggregate. My point about class warfare -- apart from it being a weak platform entirely -- is that if one wants to engage in it one should perhaps at least consider having some (class, that is). You wrote: "Here's the thing about my hobbies-- I don't expect to ever get back the money that I put into them...I not only am used to falling prices on things (thus destruction of cash value of investments)-- I want it." It would be hard to use logic to respond to that thinking... Within the rapidly advancing world of technological R&D, it is obvious that this dynamic will exist; that said, I'm not sure why anyone would wish for it in places where it needn't be. If you only expect to lose money as you spend it, the aforementioned class envy will no doubt persist. Just because others may have used different -- one might say more prudent -- thinking in engaging in this arena, it doesn't mean...oh, never mind... Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Darren Garrison Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 1:12 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:57:16 -0500, you wrote: >Darren & All, >Back to ridiculous class warfare...nice. This is a serious business Here's the thing-- for you, it is a business. For me, it isn't. ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From dave at fallingrocks.com Sun Dec 7 14:21:11 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 14:21:11 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <007f01c95895$c925d140$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com><0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com> <007f01c95895$c925d140$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Message-ID: <0B7797476ECA45CF9807214ABF865EA0@meteorroom> Martin, I can't find it at the moment, but someone sent me what seemed to be a quality analysis of eBay meteorite volume fairly recently which indicated that the annual market was about $2,000,000 USD. The figure was extrapolated from a fairly narrow window (either a week or a month). Best, Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Martin Altmann Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 1:01 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Meteorites and "Market"? I have always my difficulties. A collectors market? Hmm 71 million$ for a Warhol here, 40 milions for a van Gogh there, 2.5 million for a Macke here, 120 millions for a Klimt there... And the stuff we collect is rarer than these... (In principle it is bizarre to discuss, whether a Bassikonou or a Mali should cost 50 cents, 1$, 3$ or 1000$.... or a Moon 1000$ or 10,000,000 isn't it?) Imagine, if only a single of these collectors buying such collectibles will discover meteorites as a field of collecting. Eeeek! Once such a sum spend like for such a painting - and booooom - there is no meteorite market anymore, because there are no meteorites left :-) Any estimates, which annual volumes in total are moved in the meteorite market? Ebay-fanatics - has one of you ever noted how many $$$ are actually sold (sold not offered) in meteorites there per week? Would be interesting. Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Darryl Pitt Gesendet: Sonntag, 7. Dezember 2008 18:28 An: cynapse at charter.net Cc: Meteorite-list Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Darren, I hear you, but it's not about the rich snobs, it's about economic forces brought to the table which will result in a more stable marketplace and increasing valuations---and that's good for all of us. Wouldn't it be great if there were market factors which limited the kinds of aberrations which have stung us all at one time or another? I'm all for fun! ;-) ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From cynapse at charter.net Sun Dec 7 14:26:27 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 14:26:27 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com> <0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com> <782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:57:16 -0500, you wrote: >This is a serious business... One last point on this-- of course a "business" will legitamately want to make as much money for product or service X as they can for it-- but it is entirely a different matter to expect customers of said business to want the business to charge more, which is what Darryl said and I was replying to-- quote: "Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell for a couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain this doesn't occur." Meaning-- we should try to keep the prices of these high, even if they could sell for less. With the implication that this is to attract "serious collectors", which seems to mean rich people collecting for future profits. Now, while (to illustrate with some other buyable product) it is well and good for Best Buy to want $1000 for a flat-screen TV if they can get it. But it isn't reasonable to expect the customer to want Best Buy to charge $1000 for that flat-screen when it COULD sell for $100. If what it costs to sell it at a profit is $1000, then fine. But if it could be sold for $100, why on Earth would the customer be expected to get behind selling it for $1000 just because $100 is "too cheap"? My position as a consumer is to attempt to pay the lowest reasonable cost for any item. I'd think that the main expense for hunters isn't the travel costs, but the cost of buying the meteorites from the land owner, who always expect it to be a "get rich quick" situation. If the land owners expect (and get) a price that requires hunters to resell it at around $50 a gram, then that's what the hunters will have to charge. But if the land owners didn't expect as much money, then the resellers wouldn't have to charge as much money. It is a feedback loop. From cynapse at charter.net Sun Dec 7 14:31:33 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 14:31:33 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] : Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com><0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com><782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom> <6d4oj49uomrukqh8m0dda83m0np2hmc9gd@4ax.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 14:17:43 -0500, you wrote: >having some (class, that is). You wrote: "Here's the thing about my >hobbies-- I don't expect to ever get back the money that I put into them...I >not only am used to falling prices on things (thus destruction of cash value >of investments)-- I want it." It would be hard to use logic to respond to >that thinking... Why? What is illogical about that thinking? When you see something that you like, do you think "gee, that's cool-- I'd like to have that-- but I wonder how much money I can get back for it at some point in the future if I decided to sell it?" The value of hobbies is the pursuit of the hobby, not the theoretical future depreciated value of the subject of the hobby. HELL YES I want price collapses on the things that interest me! See, I think of money as a necessary evil to be used to buy things that I want, not an object of worship in and of itself. I'm not a Republican. (wait, I didn't say that) From darryl at dof3.com Sun Dec 7 14:58:49 2008 From: darryl at dof3.com (Darryl Pitt) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 14:58:49 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com> <0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com> <782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom> Message-ID: <229E9866-D9C6-4102-8E40-FE4EC8F54413@dof3.com> Hi Again, Darren... Gotta jump in for a minute before taking off.... Two very different thoughts were thrown together and the result is a bit confusing. I was not suggesting to keep prices high. Oh my golly, no. I am only attempting to suggest that a longer view should be taken and that it would be nice if an effort were made to reduce the number of pricing anomalies. By the way, most wealthy collectors I know do not buy common specimens. The involvement of such collectors simply provides increased stability by driving overall demand which enhances the value of all of our collections---not a bad thing. It's going to be a long, long time before any of us have to worry about an inability to be able to snag cheap meteorites. All best and wishing everyone a nice Sunday! Darryl On Dec 7, 2008, at 2:26 PM, Darren Garrison wrote: > On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:57:16 -0500, you wrote: > >> This is a serious business... > > One last point on this-- of course a "business" will legitamately > want to make > as much money for product or service X as they can for it-- but it > is entirely a > different matter to expect customers of said business to want the > business to > charge more, which is what Darryl said and I was replying to-- > > quote: > > "Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell > for > a couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain > this doesn't occur." > > Meaning-- we should try to keep the prices of these high, even if > they could > sell for less. With the implication that this is to attract "serious > collectors", which seems to mean rich people collecting for future > profits. > > Now, while (to illustrate with some other buyable product) it is > well and good > for Best Buy to want $1000 for a flat-screen TV if they can get it. > But it > isn't reasonable to expect the customer to want Best Buy to charge > $1000 for > that flat-screen when it COULD sell for $100. If what it costs to > sell it at a > profit is $1000, then fine. But if it could be sold for $100, why > on Earth > would the customer be expected to get behind selling it for $1000 > just because > $100 is "too cheap"? My position as a consumer is to attempt to pay > the lowest > reasonable cost for any item. > > I'd think that the main expense for hunters isn't the travel costs, > but the cost > of buying the meteorites from the land owner, who always expect it > to be a "get > rich quick" situation. If the land owners expect (and get) a price > that > requires hunters to resell it at around $50 a gram, then that's what > the hunters > will have to charge. But if the land owners didn't expect as much > money, then > the resellers wouldn't have to charge as much money. It is a > feedback loop. > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From dave at fallingrocks.com Sun Dec 7 15:09:31 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 15:09:31 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com><0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com><782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom> Message-ID: <1A07E86766A640C289C5B5310ADB6C3C@meteorroom> Darren/All, >From the perspective of the customer, Darren, I'd agree with a lot of what you've said below. Your example has more to do with market efficiencies and the removal of unnecessary costs from a channel, though, and I don't think this is what Darryl was driving towards. Meteorites are different from flat screen TVs. For all intents and purposes, "everyone" knows what a flat screen TV is and that they come at a fairly predictable price. Very, very few know much about meteorites (it's easy to forget that from the vantage point of this list), and even those predisposed (say, astronomy buffs) to be interested in acquiring them tend to not realize this is possible. As we continue expanding our reach into space; as extremely effective marketers such as Darryl get the word out to more and more across the globe; as science continues to unveil more fascinations locked up within meteorites; as the global population grows and the internet bandwidth continues making that growing world smaller; as all of these things happen, more and more human beings will be interested in acquiring meteorites and it will drive specimen values up (to where they "should" be, given an efficient marketplace distributing them, which we don't yet have) and -- the best part -- more and more people will be inspired by the "electric" feeling (as Norton put it well) one gets in holding a rock in your hand older than the one you're standing one. It seems inevitable, excepting other possible short-term reserves such as the Sahara holding back this progression as weathered finds hit the market for a while, that the pace of collector growth will far outstrip the supply of meteorites over the long haul. You also wrote: "Why? What is illogical about that thinking [THAT IT'S A GOOD THING TO SEE THE VALUE OF THINGS FALL AFTER ONE PURCHASES THEM]? When you see something that you like, do you think "gee, that's cool-- I'd like to have that-- but I wonder how much money I can get back for it at some point in the future if I decided to sell it?" The value of hobbies is the pursuit of the hobby, not the theoretical future depreciated value of the subject of the hobby. HELL YES I want price collapses on the things that interest me! See, I think of money as a necessary evil to be used to buy things that I want, not an object of worship in and of itself. I'm not a Republican." It goes without saying that you are not a Republican, but I'm not either. We've come to think in North America that the necessities of life fall off of trees and the advancement of civilization is some foregone conclusion. This is unfortunately not true. Money isn't a necessary evil; it is a vehicle which makes trading more efficient than it was in the days of barter. It also motivates people to take all sorts of risks in search of the meteorites you seem to enjoy yourself. The staggering facts associated with meteorites at least provide some wonderful perspective to those of us willing to contemplate it, and I think I'll go spend some time with a few now... Best regards, Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Darren Garrison Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 2:26 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:57:16 -0500, you wrote: >This is a serious business... One last point on this-- of course a "business" will legitamately want to make as much money for product or service X as they can for it-- but it is entirely a different matter to expect customers of said business to want the business to charge more, which is what Darryl said and I was replying to-- quote: "Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell for a couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain this doesn't occur." Meaning-- we should try to keep the prices of these high, even if they could sell for less. With the implication that this is to attract "serious collectors", which seems to mean rich people collecting for future profits. Now, while (to illustrate with some other buyable product) it is well and good for Best Buy to want $1000 for a flat-screen TV if they can get it. But it isn't reasonable to expect the customer to want Best Buy to charge $1000 for that flat-screen when it COULD sell for $100. If what it costs to sell it at a profit is $1000, then fine. But if it could be sold for $100, why on Earth would the customer be expected to get behind selling it for $1000 just because $100 is "too cheap"? My position as a consumer is to attempt to pay the lowest reasonable cost for any item. I'd think that the main expense for hunters isn't the travel costs, but the cost of buying the meteorites from the land owner, who always expect it to be a "get rich quick" situation. If the land owners expect (and get) a price that requires hunters to resell it at around $50 a gram, then that's what the hunters will have to charge. But if the land owners didn't expect as much money, then the resellers wouldn't have to charge as much money. It is a feedback loop. ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From cynapse at charter.net Sun Dec 7 15:21:37 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 15:21:37 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <1A07E86766A640C289C5B5310ADB6C3C@meteorroom> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com><0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com><782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom> <1A07E86766A640C289C5B5310ADB6C3C@meteorroom> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 15:09:31 -0500, you wrote: >We've come to think in North America that the necessities of life fall off >of trees and the advancement of civilization is some foregone conclusion. >This is unfortunately not true. Money isn't a necessary evil; it is a >vehicle which makes trading more efficient than it was in the days of >barter. You're obviously a fan of some science fiction, with the Star Trek references. My favorite possible (if possible) future societies in SF are post-scarcity, post-singularity ones. So, it may be (is) just a fantasy, but it is exactly the type of world I strive towards and wish to live in. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_scarcity http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=post+scarcity+society&btnG=Google+Search&aq=3&oq=post+scarcity http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_singularity From mexicodoug at aim.com Sun Dec 7 15:22:39 2008 From: mexicodoug at aim.com (mexicodoug at aim.com) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 15:22:39 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] : Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com><0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com><782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom><6d4oj49uomrukqh8m0dda83m0np2hmc9gd@4ax.com> Message-ID: <8CB26C0AF1F105E-17D4-666@WEBMAIL-MA18.sysops.aol.com> Time out on the HBO Meteorite channel, Hi all, This present discussion reminds me of a chapter which settled everything completely in 1941. "The Little Prince" (1941) has an excellent treatise on matters of consequence, the roll of 'government' lording over space rocks, adults and businessmen vs. the rest of us and common sense, and who owns space rocks, and the roll of the collector: http://home.pacific.net.hk/~rebylee/text/prince/13.html Happy Holidays, tongue frozen to cheek. Doug Republicano (Republic of Mexico, where everyone is entitled to their opinion even if no one listens) Chapter 13 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- The fourth planet belonged to a businessman. This man was so much occupied that he did not even raise his head at the little prince's arrival. "Good morning," the little prince said to him. "Your cigarette has gone out." "Three and two make five. Five and seven make twelve. Twelve and three make fifteen. Good morning. FIfteen and seven make twenty-two. Twenty-two and six make twenty-eight. I haven't time to light it again. Twenty-six and five make thirty-one. Phew ! Then that makes five-hundred-and-one-million, six-hundred-twenty-two-thousand, seven-hundred-thirty-one." "Five hundred million what?" asked the little prince. "Eh? Are you still there? Five-hundred-and-one million-- I can't stop... I have so much to do! I am concerned with matters of consequence. I don't amuse myself with balderdash. Two and five make seven..." [picture] "Five-hundred-and-one million what?" repeated the little prince, who never in his life had let go of a question once he had asked it. The businessman raised his head. "During the fifty-four years that I have inhabited this planet, I have been disturbed only three times. The first time was twenty-two years ago, when some giddy goose fell from goodness knows where. He made the most frightful noise that resounded all ov er the place, and I made four mistakes in my addition. The second time, eleven years ago, I was disturbed by an attack of rheumatism. I don't get enough exercise. I have no time for loafing. The third time-- well, this is it! I was saying, then, five -hundred-and-one millions--" "Millions of what?" The businessman suddenly realized that there was no hope of being left in peace until he answered this question. "Millions of those little objects," he said, "which one sometimes sees in the sky." "Flies?" "Oh, no. Little glittering objects." "Bees?" "Oh, no. Little golden objects that set lazy men to idle dreaming. As for me, I am concerned with matters of consequence. There is no time for idle dreaming in my life." "Ah! You mean the stars?" "Yes, that's it. The stars." "And what do you do with five-hundred millions of stars?" "Five-hundred-and-one million, six-hundred-twenty-two thousand, seven-hundred-thirty-one. I am concerned with matters of consequence: I am accurate." "And what do you do with these stars?" "What do I do with them?" "Yes." "Nothing. I own them." "You own the stars?" "Yes." "But I have already seen a king who--" "Kings do not own, they reign over. It is a very different matter." "And what good does it do you to own the stars?" "It does me the good of making me rich." "And what good does it do you to be rich?" "It makes it possible for me to buy more stars, if any are ever discovered." "This man," the little prince said to himself, "reasons a little like my poor tippler..." Nevertheless, he still had some more questions. "How is it possible for one to own the stars?" "To whom do they belong?" the businessman retorted, peevishly. "I don't know. To nobody." "Then they belong to me, because I was the first person to think of it." "Is that all that is necessary?" "Certainly. When you find a diamond that belongs to nobody, it is yours. When you discover an island that belongs to nobody, it is yours. When you get an idea before any one else, you take out a patent on it: it is yours. So with me: I own the stars, because nobody else before me ever thought of owning them." "Yes, that is true," said the little prince. "And what do you do with them?" "I administer them," replied the businessman. "I count them and recount them. It is difficult. But I am a man who is naturally interested in matters of consequence." The little prince was still not satisfied. "If I owned a silk scarf," he said, "I could put it around my neck and take it away with me. If I owned a flower, I could pluck that flower and take it away with me. But you cannot pluck the stars from heaven..." "No. But I can put them in the bank." "Whatever does that mean?" "That means that I write the number of my stars on a little paper. And then I put this paper in a drawer and lock it with a key." "And that is all?" "That is enough," said the businessman. "It is entertaining," thought the little prince. "It is rather poetic. But it is of no great consequence." On matters of consequence, the little prince had ideas which were very different from those of the grown-ups. "I myself own a flower," he continued his conversation with the businessman, "which I water every day. I own three volcanoes, which I clean out every week (for I also clean out the one that is extinct; one never knows). It is of some use to my volcanoes , and it is of some use to my flower, that I own them. But you are of no use to the stars..." The businessman opened his mouth, but he found nothing to say in answer. And the little prince went away. "The grown-ups are certainly altogether extraordinary," he said simply, talking to himself as he continued on his journey. Happy Holidays Doug -----Original Message----- From: Darren Garrison To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 2:31 pm Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] : Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 14:17:43 -0500, you wrote: >having some (class, that is). You wrote: "Here's the thing about my >hobbies-- I don't expect to ever get back the money that I put into them...I >not only am used to falling prices on things (thus destruction of cash value >of investments)-- I want it." It would be hard to use logic to respond to >that thinking... Why? What is illogical about that thinking? When you see something that you like, do you think "gee, that's cool-- I'd like to have that-- but I wonder how much money I can get back for it at some point in the future if I decided to sell it?" The value of hobbies is the pursuit of the hobby, not the theoretical future depreciated value of the subject of the hobby. HELL YES I want price collapses on the things that interest me! See, I think of money as a necessary evil to be used to buy things that I want, not an object of worship in and of itself. I'm not a Republican. (wait, I didn't say that) ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Sun Dec 7 15:39:10 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:39:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams auction bomb Message-ID: <371726.42456.qm@web110215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Looks like the meteorites in the auction did pretty poorly overall. My stuff was just about given away. A piece of Udei Station, fall, silicated iron, sold for $2.00 gram! I was going to bid in person, but cancelled the trip due to illness. Man, this sucks. Michael Farmer From dave at fallingrocks.com Sun Dec 7 15:59:40 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 15:59:40 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><8usnj4l95ri1hom8ei9piacnmivot9plqj@4ax.com><0417DF28-A44E-41D8-9387-1F7A152D4FB4@dof3.com><782BB2DE1C224AB6B2EB25C869628539@meteorroom><1A07E86766A640C289C5B5310ADB6C3C@meteorroom> Message-ID: <6ABDA1F5CD114506B96AC3CD60565144@meteorroom> Going to sign off after this one, Darren, as it's now way off topic. I'm not a science fiction fan at all, really, and wouldn't know without first being told what I've written that came from the annals of Star Trek. I think it's great that you're striving for that, as we're all well served in striving for something. Best wishes in your pursuit... Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Darren Garrison Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 3:22 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 15:09:31 -0500, you wrote: >We've come to think in North America that the necessities of life fall >off of trees and the advancement of civilization is some foregone conclusion. >This is unfortunately not true. Money isn't a necessary evil; it is a >vehicle which makes trading more efficient than it was in the days of >barter. You're obviously a fan of some science fiction, with the Star Trek references. My favorite possible (if possible) future societies in SF are post-scarcity, post-singularity ones. So, it may be (is) just a fantasy, but it is exactly the type of world I strive towards and wish to live in. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_scarcity http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=post+scarcity+society&btnG=Google+Searc h&aq=3&oq=post+scarcity http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_singularity ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From gmhupe at htn.net Sun Dec 7 16:11:52 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 16:11:52 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD Message-ID: <4830C09A71CA46C5B4112571141D7303@Gregor> Dear List Members, Last week I announced a new Olivine Diogenite, NWA 4223, that I had loaded all of the specimens on eBay. The last remaining 13 specimens will end tomorrow (Monday, December 8th). I also have some nice meteorites at great prices ending on Wednesday, most started at just 99 cents. Here is my original email: It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA 4223, the third member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to get to this point of first public offering so you know the science has been done! It has a TKW of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed through eBay's site, so you can find all of the available material and "Official" classification of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed these, most at reduced prices for the holidays: NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) NWA 1879 Mesosiderite NWA 2932 Mesosiderite NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lots NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot Unclassified 2kg Lots Berduc Newspaper Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) Muonionalusta Complete Slice 262g (started at just 99 cents) ...and several other started at just 99 cents! Good Luck winning , and "Thank You" for bidding! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault From psc2410xi at yahoo.com Sun Dec 7 16:29:23 2008 From: psc2410xi at yahoo.com (Don Rawlings) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 13:29:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams auction bomb In-Reply-To: <371726.42456.qm@web110215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <978293.6590.qm@web59314.mail.re1.yahoo.com> But, but,,,,,,, I thought dealers were asking too low prices? That is what I read earlier on this list. I guess collectors should take not who argues for high prices and who argues for realistic prices. Note to self..... reread earlier posts today and take notes. Don Rawlings --- On Sun, 12/7/08, Michael Farmer wrote: > From: Michael Farmer > Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams auction bomb > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Sunday, December 7, 2008, 3:39 PM > Looks like the meteorites in the auction did pretty poorly > overall. > My stuff was just about given away. A piece of Udei > Station, fall, silicated iron, sold for $2.00 gram! I was > going to bid in person, but cancelled the trip due to > illness. > > Man, this sucks. > Michael Farmer > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From wahlperry at aol.com Sun Dec 7 17:14:01 2008 From: wahlperry at aol.com (wahlperry at aol.com) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 17:14:01 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: <8CB26D03E1FDFFF-15E0-D52@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com> Hi All, I would have responded earlier but our Internet connection was not the best. We just flew in from Canada today. What is a fair price per gram? I would say it is up to the individuals that took the time and effort to get out in the field to do the recovery work. I knew before leaving home that if we were lucky enough to find any material that we would have to leave it in Canada and go through the proper channels to obtain this legally. Most of the area where the fall took place has been locked up with NO TRESPASSING signs posted. We were fortunate enough to negotiate a deal with the owners of some private property. We have been told the chances of any material leaving Canada with a permit is almost impossible. How nice would it be to have a new Canadian meteorite from a witnessed fall with proper documentation? This is my first time to pick up a meteorite as fresh as this. You can almost rub off the fusion crust and the interior is bright white. I will have a picture showing the interior of the meteorite posted within the next couple of days. So lets keep our fingers crossed to have these meteorites in the U.S.A within 6 months to a year. I was thinking about playing a joke on Mccartney and placing a meteorite in his backpack to see if he could make it through customs and once we made it into the U.S.A telling McCartney "Hey half of the meteorite is mine!" Just teasing. Thanks, Sonny From meteoritekid at gmail.com Sun Dec 7 17:57:43 2008 From: meteoritekid at gmail.com (Jason Utas) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 14:57:43 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <8AEC260D-E7F6-486F-B4D6-FCF939359569@dof3.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> <93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com> <44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> <93aaac890812070802o77b7e335n3de3c8f6e456348e@mail.gmail.com> <8AEC260D-E7F6-486F-B4D6-FCF939359569@dof3.com> Message-ID: <93aaac890812071457i56165f5ev76ee01115802bbce@mail.gmail.com> Darryl, Darren, All, You referred to the low prices mentioned in my email when I had included Park Forest. If you didn't mention Park Forest, you didn't refer to my email in its entirety, and didn't clarify. How was I supposed to know you were only responding to half of my message? > As it regards the Chergach and Bassikounou examples, I sincerely believe > that irrespective of how inexpensive initial suppliers sell material, that > it is incumbent on us to consider the implications of our pricing in the > marketplace. So we should place some sort of value on meteorites above what the finders ask for them because....well, I can see why you as a dealer would say this -- but from a collectors point of view, your statement makes no sense whatsoever. Or from a logical standpoint. Why should rocks have some inherent monetary value? It makes no sense whatsoever. That said, if you, as a dealer/supplier decide that they should have some arbitrary value, and price what you sell accordingly...well, the final decision rests in my hands, as the buyer. You can ask for whatever you think they're worth, but unless the collectors on the other side agree with you, it doesn't matter. Dealers only have the ability to suggest prices. It's the collectors/buyers who actually set them. > I take a longer view of such anomalies. Just because I was offered Chergach > at $0.50/g doesn't mean that it's responsible for me to widely offer it for > $1.50/g even though it represents a 200% profit to me. Responsible? I'd say your fellow collectors would be happy, and content with the fact that they could afford specimens twice as large at the same cost as the ones they just bought. In fact, anyone reading this thread should now know that if they bought any from you, the reason they don't own a specimen twice as large is because you thought it would be irresponsible to only take a 200% mark-up. I'd be pissed-off, big time. >Whether we can > quantify the effect or not, beyond cheap meteorites have an effect on the > rest of the marketplace. They create their own "gravity." That's all I'm > trying to say. Oh, I never said it wouldn't have an effect on the rest of the market. Though now that you're bringing that up, you seem to be saying that having lower prices would be a bad thing. Considering that most people in the meteorite-world are collectors, and not dealers, well, you're in a minority. By all means, you're entitled to your view, but you are in a minority. As to whether or not it's worth, say, $10/g or more...you're entitled to your opinion as a dealer, and I'm sure that if you get your hands on some, you'll charge what you like. As said, I, as a potential buyer, will simply refrain from buying any and voice my opinion that way...as I'm sure others will as well. I've heard reports that the tkw could be well over 200kg or more; if, after a mere week of amateur hunting in sub-zero temperatures and restricted access, 40+kg were recovered...how much of any fall is ever collected in the first week? Maybe 10%? Maybe 20? - Sorry for the lateish reply, but I was at the Bonhams Auction. Jason On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 9:26 AM, Darryl Pitt wrote: > > > Jason, > > Small detail....I never mentioned Park Forest. And speaking of being "at a > loss for words," I don't quite know how to respond to your unbridled attack > on "my" point of view regarding the same(?!) > > As it regards the Chergach and Bassikounou examples, I sincerely believe > that irrespective of how inexpensive initial suppliers sell material, that > it is incumbent on us to consider the implications of our pricing in the > marketplace. > > I take a longer view of such anomalies. Just because I was offered Chergach > at $0.50/g doesn't mean that it's responsible for me to widely offer it for > $1.50/g even though it represents a 200% profit to me. Whether we can > quantify the effect or not, beyond cheap meteorites have an effect on the > rest of the marketplace. They create their own "gravity." That's all I'm > trying to say. > > All best / Darryl > > > > > On Dec 7, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Jason Utas wrote: > >> Darryl, >> Low-end numbers? Even Park Forest which was witnessed, caught on >> numerous videos, and fell in a densely populated urban environment - >> in what may well be a majority of cases, hitting man-made objects, was >> selling for $30/g or so at the time of the fall - a price which has >> stayed roughly the same, if it hasn't come down a few dollars per gram >> since then. >> How much Park Forest was recovered? According to this report, roughly >> 30kg. >> >> http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Aug04/ParkForest.html >> >> More of this fall has been recovered in the past week than from the >> entire fall of Park Forest. >> It hasn't hit anything interesting, as far as we know. >> It's an ordinary chondrite - even Park Forest had some pretty >> brecciation/melt. I've heard of nothing of the sort from this fall. >> It was caught on video, granted, and that does make it special in one >> way...why you think that should boost the value of it to twice the >> value of the undoubtedly more interesting Park Forest, also caught on >> video (and five or ten times the price of other comparable falls), I >> honestly...I'm at a lack for words. >> >> "Low-end numbers being bandied about?" >> >> On the one hand, you seem to criticize the high price being asked by >> these sellers, and on the other, you say the current market rates for >> other falls are "low-end numbers?" >> >> I don't understand. $5-10/g for these new falls is far overpriced, as >> best I can tell. At least with Chergach and Bassikounou, suppliers >> were contacting list-members directly and offering stones at $2/g >> initially - less for larger stones. >> >> You seem to be saying that's too cheap. Why? If the sellers are >> content, and I don't think the buyers are complaining, well, I can't >> see any reason for you to say such a thing. If both parties are >> happy, I honestly don't see how you can say such a thing. >> >> Look at the numbers from my last email. A mere $10/g would provide >> the hunters each with $5,000, assuming they only came back with 250g >> each. >> >> It's classic marketing technique to tell potential buyers that they >> got precious little out of the fall, as they said they did. >> If people think there's less, they'll want to buy more. There's a >> reason they're not telling anyone how much they got, after all. I >> wonder why...and I wonder if they ever will tell us how much they >> found/were allowed to keep.... After all, unless they're just using >> that as a marketing ploy, they really have no reason not to tell us. >> >> Jason >> >> On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 7:38 AM, Darryl Pitt wrote: >>> >>> >>> Folks, >>> >>> If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times: meteorites as a >>> collectible do not attract more serious collectors because there are too >>> many aberrations of valuation--such that the aberrations have become the >>> norm. Several serious collectors who have been intrigued with meteorites >>> have shared with me that they've opted not to climb in because of their >>> belief in an "immature" and "unsophisticated" marketplace. Their words. >>> >>> In my humble opinion, the quality of the fireball video associated with >>> the >>> Canadian event makes it worth far more than the low-end numbers being >>> bandied about. >>> >>> Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell for a >>> couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain this >>> doesn't occur. >>> >>> All best / d >>> >>> >>> ===================== >>> > From meteoritekid at gmail.com Sun Dec 7 18:11:14 2008 From: meteoritekid at gmail.com (Jason Utas) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 15:11:14 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <8CB26D03E1FDFFF-15E0-D52@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CB26D03E1FDFFF-15E0-D52@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <93aaac890812071511w6b5db876jc9147a77913d6491@mail.gmail.com> Hola, I've heard that you fellows fetched over a kilogram. $50/g isn't a bad price for you to set, considering that you both probably spent less than $1,500 all told for the trip, each. I mean, it's not like you had to deal with any dangers or risk. You left when you knew meteorites had been found, and travelled to a safe, civilized location. I suppose there might have been a risk in not being allowed to search private land, but, honestly...that's not stopped any hunters I know on this list. Anyway, it sounds like nice material. Like every other fresh fall from the past...well, since forever. As to your stating that you "would say it is up to the individuals that took the time and effort to get out in the field to do the recovery work," well, fine. I just wonder why the hunters who went to Kilabo, Bensour, Thuathe, Chergach, Bassikounou, and even Park Forest, charged substantially less than you are supposedly asking for this fall. As your friend, fellow hunter, and prospective customer, I'd like to know why. Because it looks like you're set to make $25,000 off of this, along with McCartney (another $25,000). Why do I, and other meteorite collectors, owe you that? Regards, Jason On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 2:14 PM, wrote: > Hi All, > > I would have responded earlier but our Internet connection was not the > best. We just flew in from Canada today. What is a fair price per gram? I > would say it is up to the individuals that took the time and effort to get > out in the field to do the recovery work. I knew before leaving home that if > we were lucky enough to find any material that we would have to leave it in > Canada and go through the proper channels to obtain this legally. Most of > the area where the fall took place has been locked up with NO TRESPASSING > signs posted. We were fortunate enough to negotiate a deal with the owners > of some private property. We have been told the chances of any material > leaving Canada with a permit is almost impossible. How nice would it be to > have a new Canadian meteorite from a witnessed fall with proper > documentation? This is my first time to pick up a meteorite as fresh as > this. You can almost rub off the fusion crust and the interior is bright > white. I will have a picture showing the interior of the meteorite posted > within the next couple of days. So lets keep our fingers crossed to have > these meteorites in the U.S.A within 6 months to a year. I was thinking > about playing a joke on Mccartney and placing a meteorite in his backpack to > see if he could make it through customs and once we made it into the U.S.A > telling McCartney "Hey half of the meteorite is mine!" Just teasing. > > > Thanks, > Sonny > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From jgrossman at usgs.gov Sun Dec 7 18:19:25 2008 From: jgrossman at usgs.gov (Jeff Grossman) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 18:19:25 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD In-Reply-To: <4830C09A71CA46C5B4112571141D7303@Gregor> References: <4830C09A71CA46C5B4112571141D7303@Gregor> Message-ID: <493C59FD.8010905@usgs.gov> I guess I have to keep saying it, but there ain't no such thing as an "official" classification. NWA 4223 was classified as an "olivine-bearing diogenite" by Connolly et al. (2007: MB92), citing data submitted by Tony Irving and colleagues (who may or may not have classified it exactly the same way when they submitted it to the NomCom). This classification does not imply endorsement by any officials. It only means that the classification was deemed to be reasonable. jeff Greg Hupe wrote: > Dear List Members, > > Last week I announced a new Olivine Diogenite, NWA 4223, that I had > loaded all of the specimens on eBay. The last remaining 13 specimens > will end tomorrow (Monday, December 8th). I also have some nice > meteorites at great prices ending on Wednesday, most started at just > 99 cents. > > Here is my original email: > It is my pleasure to announce a NEW Olivine Diogenite, NWA 4223, the > third > member of this exclusive group. It took me three years to get to this > point > of first public offering so you know the science has been done! It has > a TKW > of just 329 grams and is very course-grained. I managed through eBay's > site, > so you can find all of the available material and "Official" > classification > of NWA 4223 with the "Buy it Now" feature here: > http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > In addition to these rare specimens, I have also listed these, most at > reduced prices for the holidays: > NWA 1878 Mesosiderite (Fantastic etch!) > NWA 1879 Mesosiderite > NWA 2932 Mesosiderite > NWA 869 L4-6 1kg Lots > NWA 3118 CV3 100g Lot > NWA 3151 Brachinite Thin Section > NWA 4528 H5 500g Lot > Unclassified 2kg Lots > Berduc Newspaper > Chergach Individual 92.1g (99% crusted) > Chergach Individual 64.1g (100% crusted) > Gao Individual 154g (from Haag Collection) > Glorieta Pallasite Individual 13.7g > Muonionalusta End Cut 76.9g (starts at just 99 cents) > Muonionalusta Complete Slice 262g (started at just 99 cents) > ...and several other started at just 99 cents! > > Good Luck winning , and "Thank You" for bidding! > > Best regards, > Greg > > ==================== > Greg Hupe > The Hupe Collection > NaturesVault (eBay) > gmhupe at htn.net > www.LunarRock.com > IMCA 3163 > ==================== > Click here for my current eBay auctions: > http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Dr. Jeffrey N. Grossman phone: (703) 648-6184 US Geological Survey fax: (703) 648-6383 954 National Center Reston, VA 20192, USA From wahlperry at aol.com Sun Dec 7 18:41:10 2008 From: wahlperry at aol.com (wahlperry at aol.com) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 18:41:10 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <93aaac890812071511w6b5db876jc9147a77913d6491@mail.gmail.com> References: <8CB26D03E1FDFFF-15E0-D52@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com> <93aaac890812071511w6b5db876jc9147a77913d6491@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8CB26DC6AB528AF-15E0-109B@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com> Geez Jason, You must be on restriction or something! Sonny -----Original Message----- From: Jason Utas To: Meteorite-list Sent: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 3:11 pm Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale Hola, I've heard that you fellows fetched over a kilogram. $50/g isn't a bad price for you to set, considering that you both probably spent less than $1,500 all told for the trip, each. I mean, it's not like you had to deal with any dangers or risk. You left when you knew meteorites had been found, and travelled to a safe, civilized location. I suppose there might have been a risk in not being allowed to search private land, but, honestly...that's not stopped any hunters I know on this list. Anyway, it sounds like nice material. Like every other fresh fall from the past...well, since forever. As to your stating that you "would say it is up to the individuals that took the time and effort to get out in the field to do the recovery work," well, fine. I just wonder why the hunters who went to Kilabo, Bensour, Thuathe, Chergach, Bassikounou, and even Park Forest, charged substantially less than you are supposedly asking for this fall. As your friend, fellow hunter, and prospective customer, I'd like to know why. Because it looks like you're set to make $25,000 off of this, along with McCartney (another $25,000). Why do I, and other meteorite collectors, owe you that? Regards, Jason On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 2:14 PM, wrote: > Hi All, > > I would have responded earlier but our Internet connection was not the > best. We just flew in from Canada today. What is a fair price per gram? I > would say it is up to the individuals that took the time and effort to get > out in the field to do the recovery work. I knew before leaving home that if > we were lucky enough to find any material that we would have to leave it in > Canada and go through the proper channels to obtain this legally. Most of > the area where the fall took place has been locked up with NO TRESPASSING > signs posted. We were fortunate enough to negotiate a deal with the owners > of some private property. We have been told the chances of any material > leaving Canada with a permit is almost impossible. How nice would it be to > have a new Canadian meteorite from a witnessed fall with proper > documentation? This is my first time to pick up a meteorite as fresh as > this. You can almost rub off the fusion crust and the interior is bright > white. I will have a picture showing the interior of the meteorite posted > within the next couple of days. So lets keep our fingers crossed to have > these meteorites in the U.S.A within 6 months to a year. I was thinking > about playing a joke on Mccartney and placing a meteorite in his backpack to > see if he could make it through customs and once we made it into the U.S.A > telling McCartney "Hey half of the meteorite is mine!" Just teasing. > > > Thanks, > Sonny > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoritekid at gmail.com Sun Dec 7 18:51:35 2008 From: meteoritekid at gmail.com (Jason Utas) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 15:51:35 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <8CB26DC6AB528AF-15E0-109B@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CB26D03E1FDFFF-15E0-D52@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com> <93aaac890812071511w6b5db876jc9147a77913d6491@mail.gmail.com> <8CB26DC6AB528AF-15E0-109B@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <93aaac890812071551q716f2d2dh97ba852ff640eeb7@mail.gmail.com> ...And what's that supposed to mean? On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 3:41 PM, wrote: > Geez Jason, > > You must be on restriction or something! > > Sonny > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jason Utas > To: Meteorite-list > Sent: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 3:11 pm > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale > > > > > > > Hola, > I've heard that you fellows fetched over a kilogram. > $50/g isn't a bad price for you to set, considering that you both > probably spent less than $1,500 all told for the trip, each. > I mean, it's not like you had to deal with any dangers or risk. You > left when you knew meteorites had been found, and travelled to a safe, > civilized location. I suppose there might have been a risk in not > being allowed to search private land, but, honestly...that's not > stopped any hunters I know on this list. > Anyway, it sounds like nice material. Like every other fresh fall > from the past...well, since forever. > As to your stating that you "would say it is up to the individuals > that took the time and effort to get out in the field to do the > recovery work," well, fine. I just wonder why the hunters who went to > Kilabo, Bensour, Thuathe, Chergach, Bassikounou, and even Park Forest, > charged substantially less than you are supposedly asking for this > fall. > As your friend, fellow hunter, and prospective customer, I'd like to > know why. Because it looks like you're set to make $25,000 off of > this, along with McCartney (another $25,000). Why do I, and other > meteorite collectors, owe you that? > Regards, > Jason > > On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 2:14 PM, wrote: >> >> Hi All, >> >> I would have responded earlier but our Internet connection was not > > the >> >> best. We just flew in from Canada today. What is a fair price per > > gram? I >> >> would say it is up to the individuals that took the time and effort > > to get >> >> out in the field to do the recovery work. I knew before leaving home > > that if >> >> we were lucky enough to find any material that we would have to leave > > it in >> >> Canada and go through the proper channels to obtain this legally. > > Most of >> >> the area where the fall took place has been locked up with NO > > TRESPASSING >> >> signs posted. We were fortunate enough to negotiate a deal with the > > owners >> >> of some private property. We have been told the chances of any > > material >> >> leaving Canada with a permit is almost impossible. How nice would it > > be to >> >> have a new Canadian meteorite from a witnessed fall with proper >> documentation? This is my first time to pick up a meteorite as fresh > > as >> >> this. You can almost rub off the fusion crust and the interior is > > bright >> >> white. I will have a picture showing the interior of the meteorite > > posted >> >> within the next couple of days. So lets keep our fingers crossed to > > have >> >> these meteorites in the U.S.A within 6 months to a year. I was > > thinking >> >> about playing a joke on Mccartney and placing a meteorite in his > > backpack to >> >> see if he could make it through customs and once we made it into the > > U.S.A >> >> telling McCartney "Hey half of the meteorite is mine!" Just teasing. >> >> >> Thanks, >> Sonny >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > > From yellowengine at earthlink.net Sun Dec 7 18:54:29 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 17:54:29 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale Message-ID: <19084620.1228694069826.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net> OK, I understand that everyone is welcome to discuss freely on this list, but for the love of god people.. enough is enough. We won't see anything (legal) from this fall here in the U.S. for a good 6 months, atleast. When (and if) those guys get permits to export the material they found, I am sure they are quite capable of photographing, cataloging, and determining fair prices for their loot based off of the expenses they incured as a result of the trip, pysical labor.. plus room for profit (well deserved). Ryan -----Original Message----- From: Jason Utas To: Meteorite-list Sent: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 3:11 pm Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale Hola, I've heard that you fellows fetched over a kilogram. $50/g isn't a bad price for you to set, considering that you both probably spent less than $1,500 all told for the trip, each. I mean, it's not like you had to deal with any dangers or risk. You left when you knew meteorites had been found, and travelled to a safe, civilized location. I suppose there might have been a risk in not being allowed to search private land, but, honestly...that's not stopped any hunters I know on this list. Anyway, it sounds like nice material. Like every other fresh fall from the past...well, since forever. As to your stating that you "would say it is up to the individuals that took the time and effort to get out in the field to do the recovery work," well, fine. I just wonder why the hunters who went to Kilabo, Bensour, Thuathe, Chergach, Bassikounou, and even Park Forest, charged substantially less than you are supposedly asking for this fall. As your friend, fellow hunter, and prospective customer, I'd like to know why. Because it looks like you're set to make $25,000 off of this, along with McCartney (another $25,000). Why do I, and other meteorite collectors, owe you that? Regards, Jason On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 2:14 PM, wrote: > Hi All, > > I would have responded earlier but our Internet connection was not the > best. We just flew in from Canada today. What is a fair price per gram? I > would say it is up to the individuals that took the time and effort to get > out in the field to do the recovery work. I knew before leaving home that if > we were lucky enough to find any material that we would have to leave it in > Canada and go through the proper channels to obtain this legally. Most of > the area where the fall took place has been locked up with NO TRESPASSING > signs posted. We were fortunate enough to negotiate a deal with the owners > of some private property. We have been told the chances of any material > leaving Canada with a permit is almost impossible. How nice would it be to > have a new Canadian meteorite from a witnessed fall with proper > documentation? This is my first time to pick up a meteorite as fresh as > this. You can almost rub off the fusion crust and the interior is bright > white. I will have a picture showing the interior of the meteorite posted > within the next couple of days. So lets keep our fingers crossed to have > these meteorites in the U.S.A within 6 months to a year. I was thinking > about playing a joke on Mccartney and placing a meteorite in his backpack to > see if he could make it through customs and once we made it into the U.S.A > telling McCartney "Hey half of the meteorite is mine!" Just teasing. > > > Thanks, > Sonny > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Sun Dec 7 19:04:47 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 01:04:47 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <93aaac890812071457i56165f5ev76ee01115802bbce@mail.gmail.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC><93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com><44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com><93aaac890812070802o77b7e335n3de3c8f6e456348e@mail.gmail.com><8AEC260D-E7F6-486F-B4D6-FCF939359569@dof3.com> <93aaac890812071457i56165f5ev76ee01115802bbce@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <00a601c958c8$96206a20$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> I had a dream, Jason. Meteorites were free for everyone! ...but nobody was going to look for them anymore.... I'm only not sure yet, whether it was a good dream or a nightmare. -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Jason Utas Gesendet: Sonntag, 7. Dezember 2008 23:58 An: Meteorite-list Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale Darryl, Darren, All, You referred to the low prices mentioned in my email when I had included Park Forest. If you didn't mention Park Forest, you didn't refer to my email in its entirety, and didn't clarify. How was I supposed to know you were only responding to half of my message? > As it regards the Chergach and Bassikounou examples, I sincerely believe > that irrespective of how inexpensive initial suppliers sell material, that > it is incumbent on us to consider the implications of our pricing in the > marketplace. So we should place some sort of value on meteorites above what the finders ask for them because....well, I can see why you as a dealer would say this -- but from a collectors point of view, your statement makes no sense whatsoever. Or from a logical standpoint. Why should rocks have some inherent monetary value? It makes no sense whatsoever. That said, if you, as a dealer/supplier decide that they should have some arbitrary value, and price what you sell accordingly...well, the final decision rests in my hands, as the buyer. You can ask for whatever you think they're worth, but unless the collectors on the other side agree with you, it doesn't matter. Dealers only have the ability to suggest prices. It's the collectors/buyers who actually set them. > I take a longer view of such anomalies. Just because I was offered Chergach > at $0.50/g doesn't mean that it's responsible for me to widely offer it for > $1.50/g even though it represents a 200% profit to me. Responsible? I'd say your fellow collectors would be happy, and content with the fact that they could afford specimens twice as large at the same cost as the ones they just bought. In fact, anyone reading this thread should now know that if they bought any from you, the reason they don't own a specimen twice as large is because you thought it would be irresponsible to only take a 200% mark-up. I'd be pissed-off, big time. >Whether we can > quantify the effect or not, beyond cheap meteorites have an effect on the > rest of the marketplace. They create their own "gravity." That's all I'm > trying to say. Oh, I never said it wouldn't have an effect on the rest of the market. Though now that you're bringing that up, you seem to be saying that having lower prices would be a bad thing. Considering that most people in the meteorite-world are collectors, and not dealers, well, you're in a minority. By all means, you're entitled to your view, but you are in a minority. As to whether or not it's worth, say, $10/g or more...you're entitled to your opinion as a dealer, and I'm sure that if you get your hands on some, you'll charge what you like. As said, I, as a potential buyer, will simply refrain from buying any and voice my opinion that way...as I'm sure others will as well. I've heard reports that the tkw could be well over 200kg or more; if, after a mere week of amateur hunting in sub-zero temperatures and restricted access, 40+kg were recovered...how much of any fall is ever collected in the first week? Maybe 10%? Maybe 20? - Sorry for the lateish reply, but I was at the Bonhams Auction. Jason From raremeteorites at yahoo.com Sun Dec 7 19:05:28 2008 From: raremeteorites at yahoo.com (Adam Hupe) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 16:05:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD In-Reply-To: <493C59FD.8010905@usgs.gov> Message-ID: <612748.85372.qm@web30703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear List, I guess the terms "approved" and listed in the "Meteoritical Bulletin" might be more accurate. For collecting purposes, buyers consider approved stones to be official. This peer-reviewed system is certainly better than self-pairing or not having the stones studied at all. Best Regards, Adam From darryl at dof3.com Sun Dec 7 19:08:28 2008 From: darryl at dof3.com (Darryl Pitt) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 19:08:28 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <93aaac890812071457i56165f5ev76ee01115802bbce@mail.gmail.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> <93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com> <44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> <93aaac890812070802o77b7e335n3de3c8f6e456348e@mail.gmail.com> <8AEC260D-E7F6-486F-B4D6-FCF939359569@dof3.com> <93aaac890812071457i56165f5ev76ee01115802bbce@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6B36D55A-9F85-4A76-99F9-0FE9713F58EC@dof3.com> Yeah Jason, I didn't refer to your email in its entirely---a tall order given the length of such rants. Nor was I wasn't responding to "your message" as there were other contributors to the thread, and my statement kind of stood on its own as a general review of the currents in valuation. Jeez. For the record, Mike Farmer's report of Udei Station having sold for just $2/gram at Bonhams today..... ...that's right. My consignment. Competitively priced. Collectors are not hurt by a shake-out of the outliers---those mega- low and mega-high anomalies--I actually believe we would all ultimately benefit. Sincerely / Darryl On Dec 7, 2008, at 5:57 PM, Jason Utas wrote: > Darryl, Darren, All, > > You referred to the low prices mentioned in my email when I had > included Park Forest. If you didn't mention Park Forest, you didn't > refer to my email in its entirety, and didn't clarify. How was I > supposed to know you were only responding to half of my message? > >> As it regards the Chergach and Bassikounou examples, I sincerely >> believe >> that irrespective of how inexpensive initial suppliers sell >> material, that >> it is incumbent on us to consider the implications of our pricing >> in the >> marketplace. > > So we should place some sort of value on meteorites above what the > finders ask for them because....well, I can see why you as a dealer > would say this -- but from a collectors point of view, your statement > makes no sense whatsoever. Or from a logical standpoint. Why should > rocks have some inherent monetary value? It makes no sense > whatsoever. > That said, if you, as a dealer/supplier decide that they should have > some arbitrary value, and price what you sell accordingly...well, the > final decision rests in my hands, as the buyer. You can ask for > whatever you think they're worth, but unless the collectors on the > other side agree with you, it doesn't matter. Dealers only have the > ability to suggest prices. It's the collectors/buyers who actually > set them. > >> I take a longer view of such anomalies. Just because I was offered >> Chergach >> at $0.50/g doesn't mean that it's responsible for me to widely >> offer it for >> $1.50/g even though it represents a 200% profit to me. > > Responsible? I'd say your fellow collectors would be happy, and > content with the fact that they could afford specimens twice as large > at the same cost as the ones they just bought. > > In fact, anyone reading this thread should now know that if they > bought any from you, the reason they don't own a specimen twice as > large is because you thought it would be irresponsible to only take a > 200% mark-up. > > I'd be pissed-off, big time. > >> Whether we can >> quantify the effect or not, beyond cheap meteorites have an effect >> on the >> rest of the marketplace. They create their own "gravity." That's >> all I'm >> trying to say. > > Oh, I never said it wouldn't have an effect on the rest of the market. > Though now that you're bringing that up, you seem to be saying that > having lower prices would be a bad thing. Considering that most > people in the meteorite-world are collectors, and not dealers, well, > you're in a minority. By all means, you're entitled to your view, but > you are in a minority. > > As to whether or not it's worth, say, $10/g or more...you're entitled > to your opinion as a dealer, and I'm sure that if you get your hands > on some, you'll charge what you like. As said, I, as a potential > buyer, will simply refrain from buying any and voice my opinion that > way...as I'm sure others will as well. I've heard reports that the > tkw could be well over 200kg or more; if, after a mere week of amateur > hunting in sub-zero temperatures and restricted access, 40+kg were > recovered...how much of any fall is ever collected in the first week? > Maybe 10%? Maybe 20? > > - Sorry for the lateish reply, but I was at the Bonhams Auction. > > Jason > > On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 9:26 AM, Darryl Pitt wrote: >> >> >> Jason, >> >> Small detail....I never mentioned Park Forest. And speaking of >> being "at a >> loss for words," I don't quite know how to respond to your >> unbridled attack >> on "my" point of view regarding the same(?!) >> >> As it regards the Chergach and Bassikounou examples, I sincerely >> believe >> that irrespective of how inexpensive initial suppliers sell >> material, that >> it is incumbent on us to consider the implications of our pricing >> in the >> marketplace. >> >> I take a longer view of such anomalies. Just because I was offered >> Chergach >> at $0.50/g doesn't mean that it's responsible for me to widely >> offer it for >> $1.50/g even though it represents a 200% profit to me. Whether we >> can >> quantify the effect or not, beyond cheap meteorites have an effect >> on the >> rest of the marketplace. They create their own "gravity." That's >> all I'm >> trying to say. >> >> All best / Darryl >> >> >> >> >> On Dec 7, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Jason Utas wrote: >> >>> Darryl, >>> Low-end numbers? Even Park Forest which was witnessed, caught on >>> numerous videos, and fell in a densely populated urban environment - >>> in what may well be a majority of cases, hitting man-made objects, >>> was >>> selling for $30/g or so at the time of the fall - a price which has >>> stayed roughly the same, if it hasn't come down a few dollars per >>> gram >>> since then. >>> How much Park Forest was recovered? According to this report, >>> roughly >>> 30kg. >>> >>> http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Aug04/ParkForest.html >>> >>> More of this fall has been recovered in the past week than from the >>> entire fall of Park Forest. >>> It hasn't hit anything interesting, as far as we know. >>> It's an ordinary chondrite - even Park Forest had some pretty >>> brecciation/melt. I've heard of nothing of the sort from this fall. >>> It was caught on video, granted, and that does make it special in >>> one >>> way...why you think that should boost the value of it to twice the >>> value of the undoubtedly more interesting Park Forest, also caught >>> on >>> video (and five or ten times the price of other comparable falls), I >>> honestly...I'm at a lack for words. >>> >>> "Low-end numbers being bandied about?" >>> >>> On the one hand, you seem to criticize the high price being asked by >>> these sellers, and on the other, you say the current market rates >>> for >>> other falls are "low-end numbers?" >>> >>> I don't understand. $5-10/g for these new falls is far >>> overpriced, as >>> best I can tell. At least with Chergach and Bassikounou, suppliers >>> were contacting list-members directly and offering stones at $2/g >>> initially - less for larger stones. >>> >>> You seem to be saying that's too cheap. Why? If the sellers are >>> content, and I don't think the buyers are complaining, well, I can't >>> see any reason for you to say such a thing. If both parties are >>> happy, I honestly don't see how you can say such a thing. >>> >>> Look at the numbers from my last email. A mere $10/g would provide >>> the hunters each with $5,000, assuming they only came back with 250g >>> each. >>> >>> It's classic marketing technique to tell potential buyers that they >>> got precious little out of the fall, as they said they did. >>> If people think there's less, they'll want to buy more. There's a >>> reason they're not telling anyone how much they got, after all. I >>> wonder why...and I wonder if they ever will tell us how much they >>> found/were allowed to keep.... After all, unless they're just using >>> that as a marketing ploy, they really have no reason not to tell us. >>> >>> Jason >>> >>> On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 7:38 AM, Darryl Pitt wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> Folks, >>>> >>>> If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times: meteorites >>>> as a >>>> collectible do not attract more serious collectors because there >>>> are too >>>> many aberrations of valuation--such that the aberrations have >>>> become the >>>> norm. Several serious collectors who have been intrigued with >>>> meteorites >>>> have shared with me that they've opted not to climb in because of >>>> their >>>> belief in an "immature" and "unsophisticated" marketplace. Their >>>> words. >>>> >>>> In my humble opinion, the quality of the fireball video >>>> associated with >>>> the >>>> Canadian event makes it worth far more than the low-end numbers >>>> being >>>> bandied about. >>>> >>>> Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever >>>> sell for a >>>> couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain >>>> this >>>> doesn't occur. >>>> >>>> All best / d >>>> >>>> >>>> ===================== >>>> >> > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoritekid at gmail.com Sun Dec 7 19:17:18 2008 From: meteoritekid at gmail.com (Jason Utas) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 16:17:18 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results Message-ID: <93aaac890812071617n7c59b075v9873f350772a5868@mail.gmail.com> Hello All, I read through the legal print in the front of the catalog, and it looks like it's ok to post the results publicly. 1086 - 315g Gibeon Sphere - $475 1087 - 140g Gibeon Egg - $190 1088 - 490g Gibeon Slice - $375 1089 - 321g Gibeon Slice - Pass 1090 - 2 Gibeon Slices (281 + 262g) - $325 1091 - Gibeon Part-Slice $475 1092 - 552g Gibeon Slice - $400 1093 - 2.6kg Gibeon Cut Block - $1,700 1094 - 7,150g Gibeon Slice - $3.250 - Pass 1095 - 1,361g Muonionalusta End - $500 1096 - 136g Chinga Slice - $120 1097 - 494g Seymchan Slice - $425 1098 - 121g Udei Station End - $200 (!) 1099 - 276g New NWA Iron (silicated) slice - $600 1100 - "7lb" Sikhote Shrapnel - listed as "oriented" - $1,500 1101 - 1,304g Sikhote Individual - $2,900 (!) 1102 - 8kg Corroded Sikhote (*no* remaining fusion crust) - $6,500 - Pass 1103 - 334g Fukang Part-Slice (shattered crystals) - $3,750 1104 - 520g Esquel Part-Slice - $12,000 1105 - Pair of Campo Ends (206g and 430g, one silicated) - ~$400 - Pass (Passed at $400 for 600g of Campo....right)\ 1106 - 1,886g Campo Indiv (nice) - $300 1107 - 3,146g Canyon Diablo (fairly nondescript) - $1,300 1108 - 42.5lb Campo (good shape, no glypts - corroded) - missed price 1109 - 1,220 lb butt-ugly Campo - $19,000 1110 - 127 lb Canyon Diablo - Special Note This iron looks great in the auction photo. It's not. The back of it was...ruined somehow. It looks like the owner sandblasted the back down to a quasi-3D widmanstatten surface, and then coated it in some sort of plastic/sealant that tinged it all (only the backside, but the entire backside) a nasty light-green hue, and gave it a smooth, shiny, plastic-ey look and feel. I don't know what the hell s/he did to it, but we decided ahead of time that we didn't want it, no matter the cost. That said - $18,000 1111 - 385g Slice of NWA 1941 L6 (the "blue" one Michael Farmer's been selling) - $950 (!) 1112 - 34mm diameter NWA XXX Sphere (no weight given, listed as NWA 869, but not NWA 869) - $350 1113 - 1,994g NWA XXX Sphere (4in diameter, again listed as NWA 869, but a different meteorite) - $1,800 1114 - 2.0g Murchison frag, no crust - $400 (!) 1115 - Arroyo Malo 75.1g - $500 (slightly less than $50/g) 1116 - Arroyo Malo 202.5g - $850 (again, somewhat less than $50/g) 1117 - Libyan Glass Pair (183g light + 77g dark) - missed the number, at least $400 1118 - 1,451g Libyan Glass (numerous large chips) - $1,400 1119 - Collection of Six Lunar and Martian Meteorites - 0.05g to 0.054g in weight - $1,800 (...I estimate its value, based on the specimens, their weights, and current market prices, at no more than $300) 1120 - Set of Five Medals w/ Meteorites (Campo/869/482/2995/2986) - $275 1121 - 1.85g DaG 476 Slice - $950 1122 - 2.718g NWA 4880 Sherg. Indiv. (broken) - $4,500 (!) 1123 - 5.85g of LA002 - $9,000 (!) 1124 - 90.5g Shergottite Indiv - Special Note This stone had a chip not pictured - just above and to the left of what would be visible in the photographs posted in the auction.It was a fresh chip - looked as though a curious nomad had knocked the corner (unfortunately the leading edge) off of it. Go figure. My only question regarding the stone was that the edge of the chip was painted black. It was definitely some sort of paint; not only was it less glossy and darker in colour than the rest of the stone, but...it rubbed off. The only possible explanation we could come up with was that it had been put on the stone so as to hide the edge of the chip in the auction photograph. It is visible in the photograph just to the left of the top of the stone as a thin edge of grey of a different hue (slightly) than the rest of the stone, running about half-way down that top-left side. It looks like a result of the lighting in the photo, but it's definitely not that... Very odd. - $30,000 - Pass 1125 - 1.3308g Dhofar 1428 Slice (Feldspathic IMB) - $1,600 1126 - 1.0064g DaG 400 Part-Slice (Anorthositic Breccia) - $1,400 So...nothing -too- surprising. The low end was the Udei, at $1.67/g, and the high-end, well - a good few things. The bidders who went over market tended not to be meteorite enthusiasts; I heard a phone-bidder assuring her client that the $950 purchase of the $385g slice of NWA 1941 (L6) was a "very good deal." Granted, it was a nice slice, but if you take the 20% commission and 8% tax into account for it (and all other items), well...that Sikhote was nothing special, and it cost the buyer close to $4/g... It looked like the buyers generally went with what looked flashier or more interesting. The Murchison was listed as a piece of a comet, and the NWA 1941 was listed as the "Blue Galaxy Meteorite" - something like that. The better the listing made things sound, the more they fetched. Something like Udei, which looked particularly bad in their case, which, in all fairness, didn't have adequate lighting for such a specimen, attracted little-to-no attention from...anyone. Regards, Jason From meteoritekid at gmail.com Sun Dec 7 19:29:18 2008 From: meteoritekid at gmail.com (Jason Utas) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 16:29:18 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <6B36D55A-9F85-4A76-99F9-0FE9713F58EC@dof3.com> References: <907F937D1D8A4B4CA3651D01AA9C11A5@JeffPC> <93aaac890812070034k44cd6a42r24ca1d521628dd31@mail.gmail.com> <44DF8989-38A8-4849-98CE-DCD16EAF5E45@dof3.com> <93aaac890812070802o77b7e335n3de3c8f6e456348e@mail.gmail.com> <8AEC260D-E7F6-486F-B4D6-FCF939359569@dof3.com> <93aaac890812071457i56165f5ev76ee01115802bbce@mail.gmail.com> <6B36D55A-9F85-4A76-99F9-0FE9713F58EC@dof3.com> Message-ID: <93aaac890812071629j24577be4m2d646f2b0a318b8d@mail.gmail.com> Darryl, Rants? At least I give you the courtesy of addressing everything you say. When one decides to...skip....parts of a message he (or she) is attempting to refute, it simply gives the impression that there are things they would prefer not to have to (or can't) debate, probably because it wouldn't support their claims. As far as I'm concerned, if you can't deal with a single page of text, it's your problem, not mine. With regards to your statement, no, not really. You referred to "low-end numbers being bandied about," without acknowledging my high estimate for Park Forest. Which would have rendered your entire message a moot point, had you taken it into account. You were referring directly to my post. Hardly "standing alone." You might also note that your message was a direct reply to me, as well as to the meteorite-list. I know; I was there. The estimate was $500-700, but it wouldn't fetch an initial price of....I forget the price at which it was initially started. The auctioneer let it down to $200. Then $190. The final price was $200 - a mere $1.67/g. Jason On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 4:08 PM, Darryl Pitt wrote: > > > Yeah Jason, I didn't refer to your email in its entirely---a tall order > given the length of such rants. Nor was I wasn't responding to "your > message" as there were other contributors to the thread, and my statement > kind of stood on its own as a general review of the currents in valuation. > Jeez. > > For the record, Mike Farmer's report of Udei Station having sold for just > $2/gram at Bonhams today..... > > ...that's right. My consignment. Competitively priced. > > Collectors are not hurt by a shake-out of the outliers---those mega-low and > mega-high anomalies--I actually believe we would all ultimately benefit. > > > Sincerely / Darryl > > > > > On Dec 7, 2008, at 5:57 PM, Jason Utas wrote: > >> Darryl, Darren, All, >> >> You referred to the low prices mentioned in my email when I had >> included Park Forest. If you didn't mention Park Forest, you didn't >> refer to my email in its entirety, and didn't clarify. How was I >> supposed to know you were only responding to half of my message? >> >>> As it regards the Chergach and Bassikounou examples, I sincerely believe >>> that irrespective of how inexpensive initial suppliers sell material, >>> that >>> it is incumbent on us to consider the implications of our pricing in the >>> marketplace. >> >> So we should place some sort of value on meteorites above what the >> finders ask for them because....well, I can see why you as a dealer >> would say this -- but from a collectors point of view, your statement >> makes no sense whatsoever. Or from a logical standpoint. Why should >> rocks have some inherent monetary value? It makes no sense >> whatsoever. >> That said, if you, as a dealer/supplier decide that they should have >> some arbitrary value, and price what you sell accordingly...well, the >> final decision rests in my hands, as the buyer. You can ask for >> whatever you think they're worth, but unless the collectors on the >> other side agree with you, it doesn't matter. Dealers only have the >> ability to suggest prices. It's the collectors/buyers who actually >> set them. >> >>> I take a longer view of such anomalies. Just because I was offered >>> Chergach >>> at $0.50/g doesn't mean that it's responsible for me to widely offer it >>> for >>> $1.50/g even though it represents a 200% profit to me. >> >> Responsible? I'd say your fellow collectors would be happy, and >> content with the fact that they could afford specimens twice as large >> at the same cost as the ones they just bought. >> >> In fact, anyone reading this thread should now know that if they >> bought any from you, the reason they don't own a specimen twice as >> large is because you thought it would be irresponsible to only take a >> 200% mark-up. >> >> I'd be pissed-off, big time. >> >>> Whether we can >>> quantify the effect or not, beyond cheap meteorites have an effect on the >>> rest of the marketplace. They create their own "gravity." That's all >>> I'm >>> trying to say. >> >> Oh, I never said it wouldn't have an effect on the rest of the market. >> Though now that you're bringing that up, you seem to be saying that >> having lower prices would be a bad thing. Considering that most >> people in the meteorite-world are collectors, and not dealers, well, >> you're in a minority. By all means, you're entitled to your view, but >> you are in a minority. >> >> As to whether or not it's worth, say, $10/g or more...you're entitled >> to your opinion as a dealer, and I'm sure that if you get your hands >> on some, you'll charge what you like. As said, I, as a potential >> buyer, will simply refrain from buying any and voice my opinion that >> way...as I'm sure others will as well. I've heard reports that the >> tkw could be well over 200kg or more; if, after a mere week of amateur >> hunting in sub-zero temperatures and restricted access, 40+kg were >> recovered...how much of any fall is ever collected in the first week? >> Maybe 10%? Maybe 20? >> >> - Sorry for the lateish reply, but I was at the Bonhams Auction. >> >> Jason >> >> On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 9:26 AM, Darryl Pitt wrote: >>> >>> >>> Jason, >>> >>> Small detail....I never mentioned Park Forest. And speaking of being >>> "at a >>> loss for words," I don't quite know how to respond to your unbridled >>> attack >>> on "my" point of view regarding the same(?!) >>> >>> As it regards the Chergach and Bassikounou examples, I sincerely believe >>> that irrespective of how inexpensive initial suppliers sell material, >>> that >>> it is incumbent on us to consider the implications of our pricing in the >>> marketplace. >>> >>> I take a longer view of such anomalies. Just because I was offered >>> Chergach >>> at $0.50/g doesn't mean that it's responsible for me to widely offer it >>> for >>> $1.50/g even though it represents a 200% profit to me. Whether we can >>> quantify the effect or not, beyond cheap meteorites have an effect on the >>> rest of the marketplace. They create their own "gravity." That's all >>> I'm >>> trying to say. >>> >>> All best / Darryl >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Dec 7, 2008, at 11:02 AM, Jason Utas wrote: >>> >>>> Darryl, >>>> Low-end numbers? Even Park Forest which was witnessed, caught on >>>> numerous videos, and fell in a densely populated urban environment - >>>> in what may well be a majority of cases, hitting man-made objects, was >>>> selling for $30/g or so at the time of the fall - a price which has >>>> stayed roughly the same, if it hasn't come down a few dollars per gram >>>> since then. >>>> How much Park Forest was recovered? According to this report, roughly >>>> 30kg. >>>> >>>> http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Aug04/ParkForest.html >>>> >>>> More of this fall has been recovered in the past week than from the >>>> entire fall of Park Forest. >>>> It hasn't hit anything interesting, as far as we know. >>>> It's an ordinary chondrite - even Park Forest had some pretty >>>> brecciation/melt. I've heard of nothing of the sort from this fall. >>>> It was caught on video, granted, and that does make it special in one >>>> way...why you think that should boost the value of it to twice the >>>> value of the undoubtedly more interesting Park Forest, also caught on >>>> video (and five or ten times the price of other comparable falls), I >>>> honestly...I'm at a lack for words. >>>> >>>> "Low-end numbers being bandied about?" >>>> >>>> On the one hand, you seem to criticize the high price being asked by >>>> these sellers, and on the other, you say the current market rates for >>>> other falls are "low-end numbers?" >>>> >>>> I don't understand. $5-10/g for these new falls is far overpriced, as >>>> best I can tell. At least with Chergach and Bassikounou, suppliers >>>> were contacting list-members directly and offering stones at $2/g >>>> initially - less for larger stones. >>>> >>>> You seem to be saying that's too cheap. Why? If the sellers are >>>> content, and I don't think the buyers are complaining, well, I can't >>>> see any reason for you to say such a thing. If both parties are >>>> happy, I honestly don't see how you can say such a thing. >>>> >>>> Look at the numbers from my last email. A mere $10/g would provide >>>> the hunters each with $5,000, assuming they only came back with 250g >>>> each. >>>> >>>> It's classic marketing technique to tell potential buyers that they >>>> got precious little out of the fall, as they said they did. >>>> If people think there's less, they'll want to buy more. There's a >>>> reason they're not telling anyone how much they got, after all. I >>>> wonder why...and I wonder if they ever will tell us how much they >>>> found/were allowed to keep.... After all, unless they're just using >>>> that as a marketing ploy, they really have no reason not to tell us. >>>> >>>> Jason >>>> >>>> On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 7:38 AM, Darryl Pitt wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Folks, >>>>> >>>>> If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times: meteorites as a >>>>> collectible do not attract more serious collectors because there are >>>>> too >>>>> many aberrations of valuation--such that the aberrations have become >>>>> the >>>>> norm. Several serious collectors who have been intrigued with >>>>> meteorites >>>>> have shared with me that they've opted not to climb in because of their >>>>> belief in an "immature" and "unsophisticated" marketplace. Their >>>>> words. >>>>> >>>>> In my humble opinion, the quality of the fireball video associated with >>>>> the >>>>> Canadian event makes it worth far more than the low-end numbers being >>>>> bandied about. >>>>> >>>>> Everything else being the same, no witnessed fall should ever sell for >>>>> a >>>>> couple of bucks a gram, and we should all strive to make certain this >>>>> doesn't occur. >>>>> >>>>> All best / d >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ===================== >>>>> >>> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From jgrossman at usgs.gov Sun Dec 7 19:43:48 2008 From: jgrossman at usgs.gov (Jeff Grossman) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 19:43:48 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD In-Reply-To: <612748.85372.qm@web30703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <612748.85372.qm@web30703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <493C6DC4.2010108@usgs.gov> A meteorite in the Bulletin IS "officially approved," which means its name and status as a real meteorite are formally recognized by the Meteoritical Society. It also means the meteorite has been classified and that a type specimen exists. It also means the classification that was done seems reasonable and authoritative to the committee. However, there is no certification or sanctioning of the classification. In other words, the Meteoritical Society does not in any way certify that Irving's classification is the correct or best one. Approval only implies that he was qualified to classify it and that the classification looked reasonable. Jeff Adam Hupe wrote: > Dear List, > > I guess the terms "approved" and listed in the "Meteoritical Bulletin" might be more accurate. For collecting purposes, buyers consider approved stones to be official. This peer-reviewed system is certainly better than self-pairing or not having the stones studied at all. > > Best Regards, > > Adam > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > -- Dr. Jeffrey N. Grossman phone: (703) 648-6184 US Geological Survey fax: (703) 648-6383 954 National Center Reston, VA 20192, USA From gmhupe at htn.net Sun Dec 7 19:51:35 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 19:51:35 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD References: <612748.85372.qm@web30703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <493C6DC4.2010108@usgs.gov> Message-ID: Hello Jeff, Thank you for the clarification. If I read correctly, I should be stating "Officially Approved classification submitted in the Meteoritical Bulletin"? My main point was that the science was done on NWA 4223, and that it is an approved classification. So, if anyone is interested in a great meteorite, NWA 4223 may be the one! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Grossman" To: Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 7:43 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NEW Olivine Diogenite - NWA 4223 - AD >A meteorite in the Bulletin IS "officially approved," which means its name >and status as a real meteorite are formally recognized by the Meteoritical >Society. It also means the meteorite has been classified and that a type >specimen exists. It also means the classification that was done seems >reasonable and authoritative to the committee. However, there is no >certification or sanctioning of the classification. > > In other words, the Meteoritical Society does not in any way certify that > Irving's classification is the correct or best one. Approval only implies > that he was qualified to classify it and that the classification looked > reasonable. > > Jeff > > Adam Hupe wrote: >> Dear List, >> >> I guess the terms "approved" and listed in the "Meteoritical Bulletin" >> might be more accurate. For collecting purposes, buyers consider approved >> stones to be official. This peer-reviewed system is certainly better than >> self-pairing or not having the stones studied at all. >> >> Best Regards, >> >> Adam >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> > > > -- > Dr. Jeffrey N. Grossman phone: (703) 648-6184 > US Geological Survey fax: (703) 648-6383 > 954 National Center > Reston, VA 20192, USA > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From mail at mhmeteorites.com Sun Dec 7 19:49:59 2008 From: mail at mhmeteorites.com (mail at mhmeteorites.com) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 00:49:59 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results In-Reply-To: <93aaac890812071617n7c59b075v9873f350772a5868@mail.gmail.com> References: <93aaac890812071617n7c59b075v9873f350772a5868@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <529246338-1228697597-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-224959700-@bxe202.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> OMG - should have bid. Do these include the buyers premium? Matt Matt Morgan Mile High Meteorites http://www.mhmeteorites.com P.O. Box 151293 Lakewood, CO 80215 USA -----Original Message----- From: "Jason Utas" Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 16:17:18 To: Meteorite-list Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results Hello All, I read through the legal print in the front of the catalog, and it looks like it's ok to post the results publicly. 1086 - 315g Gibeon Sphere - $475 1087 - 140g Gibeon Egg - $190 1088 - 490g Gibeon Slice - $375 1089 - 321g Gibeon Slice - Pass 1090 - 2 Gibeon Slices (281 + 262g) - $325 1091 - Gibeon Part-Slice $475 1092 - 552g Gibeon Slice - $400 1093 - 2.6kg Gibeon Cut Block - $1,700 1094 - 7,150g Gibeon Slice - $3.250 - Pass 1095 - 1,361g Muonionalusta End - $500 1096 - 136g Chinga Slice - $120 1097 - 494g Seymchan Slice - $425 1098 - 121g Udei Station End - $200 (!) 1099 - 276g New NWA Iron (silicated) slice - $600 1100 - "7lb" Sikhote Shrapnel - listed as "oriented" - $1,500 1101 - 1,304g Sikhote Individual - $2,900 (!) 1102 - 8kg Corroded Sikhote (*no* remaining fusion crust) - $6,500 - Pass 1103 - 334g Fukang Part-Slice (shattered crystals) - $3,750 1104 - 520g Esquel Part-Slice - $12,000 1105 - Pair of Campo Ends (206g and 430g, one silicated) - ~$400 - Pass (Passed at $400 for 600g of Campo....right)\ 1106 - 1,886g Campo Indiv (nice) - $300 1107 - 3,146g Canyon Diablo (fairly nondescript) - $1,300 1108 - 42.5lb Campo (good shape, no glypts - corroded) - missed price 1109 - 1,220 lb butt-ugly Campo - $19,000 1110 - 127 lb Canyon Diablo - Special Note This iron looks great in the auction photo. It's not. The back of it was...ruined somehow. It looks like the owner sandblasted the back down to a quasi-3D widmanstatten surface, and then coated it in some sort of plastic/sealant that tinged it all (only the backside, but the entire backside) a nasty light-green hue, and gave it a smooth, shiny, plastic-ey look and feel. I don't know what the hell s/he did to it, but we decided ahead of time that we didn't want it, no matter the cost. That said - $18,000 1111 - 385g Slice of NWA 1941 L6 (the "blue" one Michael Farmer's been selling) - $950 (!) 1112 - 34mm diameter NWA XXX Sphere (no weight given, listed as NWA 869, but not NWA 869) - $350 1113 - 1,994g NWA XXX Sphere (4in diameter, again listed as NWA 869, but a different meteorite) - $1,800 1114 - 2.0g Murchison frag, no crust - $400 (!) 1115 - Arroyo Malo 75.1g - $500 (slightly less than $50/g) 1116 - Arroyo Malo 202.5g - $850 (again, somewhat less than $50/g) 1117 - Libyan Glass Pair (183g light + 77g dark) - missed the number, at least $400 1118 - 1,451g Libyan Glass (numerous large chips) - $1,400 1119 - Collection of Six Lunar and Martian Meteorites - 0.05g to 0.054g in weight - $1,800 (...I estimate its value, based on the specimens, their weights, and current market prices, at no more than $300) 1120 - Set of Five Medals w/ Meteorites (Campo/869/482/2995/2986) - $275 1121 - 1.85g DaG 476 Slice - $950 1122 - 2.718g NWA 4880 Sherg. Indiv. (broken) - $4,500 (!) 1123 - 5.85g of LA002 - $9,000 (!) 1124 - 90.5g Shergottite Indiv - Special Note This stone had a chip not pictured - just above and to the left of what would be visible in the photographs posted in the auction.It was a fresh chip - looked as though a curious nomad had knocked the corner (unfortunately the leading edge) off of it. Go figure. My only question regarding the stone was that the edge of the chip was painted black. It was definitely some sort of paint; not only was it less glossy and darker in colour than the rest of the stone, but...it rubbed off. The only possible explanation we could come up with was that it had been put on the stone so as to hide the edge of the chip in the auction photograph. It is visible in the photograph just to the left of the top of the stone as a thin edge of grey of a different hue (slightly) than the rest of the stone, running about half-way down that top-left side. It looks like a result of the lighting in the photo, but it's definitely not that... Very odd. - $30,000 - Pass 1125 - 1.3308g Dhofar 1428 Slice (Feldspathic IMB) - $1,600 1126 - 1.0064g DaG 400 Part-Slice (Anorthositic Breccia) - $1,400 So...nothing -too- surprising. The low end was the Udei, at $1.67/g, and the high-end, well - a good few things. The bidders who went over market tended not to be meteorite enthusiasts; I heard a phone-bidder assuring her client that the $950 purchase of the $385g slice of NWA 1941 (L6) was a "very good deal." Granted, it was a nice slice, but if you take the 20% commission and 8% tax into account for it (and all other items), well...that Sikhote was nothing special, and it cost the buyer close to $4/g... It looked like the buyers generally went with what looked flashier or more interesting. The Murchison was listed as a piece of a comet, and the NWA 1941 was listed as the "Blue Galaxy Meteorite" - something like that. The better the listing made things sound, the more they fetched. Something like Udei, which looked particularly bad in their case, which, in all fairness, didn't have adequate lighting for such a specimen, attracted little-to-no attention from...anyone. Regards, Jason ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Sun Dec 7 19:55:57 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 16:55:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results In-Reply-To: <529246338-1228697597-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-224959700-@bxe202.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Message-ID: <77494.18437.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Yes, however, the Esquel (mine) did not sell, it did not meet reserve. I am sick at these prices, I could have done better on ebay. I paid $2000.00 for the 2 kilo sphere, now with seller premium, I lost at least $200 and the time to mess with it. Mike --- On Sun, 12/7/08, mail at mhmeteorites.com wrote: > From: mail at mhmeteorites.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results > To: "Jason Utas" , "Meteorite-list" > Date: Sunday, December 7, 2008, 5:49 PM > OMG - should have bid. > Do these include the buyers premium? > Matt > Matt Morgan > Mile High Meteorites > http://www.mhmeteorites.com > P.O. Box 151293 > Lakewood, CO 80215 USA > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Jason Utas" > > Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 16:17:18 > To: > Meteorite-list > Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results > > > Hello All, > I read through the legal print in the front of the catalog, > and it > looks like it's ok to post the results publicly. > > 1086 - 315g Gibeon Sphere - $475 > 1087 - 140g Gibeon Egg - $190 > 1088 - 490g Gibeon Slice - $375 > 1089 - 321g Gibeon Slice - Pass > 1090 - 2 Gibeon Slices (281 + 262g) - $325 > 1091 - Gibeon Part-Slice $475 > 1092 - 552g Gibeon Slice - $400 > 1093 - 2.6kg Gibeon Cut Block - $1,700 > 1094 - 7,150g Gibeon Slice - $3.250 - Pass > 1095 - 1,361g Muonionalusta End - $500 > 1096 - 136g Chinga Slice - $120 > 1097 - 494g Seymchan Slice - $425 > 1098 - 121g Udei Station End - $200 (!) > 1099 - 276g New NWA Iron (silicated) slice - $600 > 1100 - "7lb" Sikhote Shrapnel - listed as > "oriented" - $1,500 > 1101 - 1,304g Sikhote Individual - $2,900 (!) > 1102 - 8kg Corroded Sikhote (*no* remaining fusion crust) - > $6,500 - Pass > 1103 - 334g Fukang Part-Slice (shattered crystals) - $3,750 > 1104 - 520g Esquel Part-Slice - $12,000 > 1105 - Pair of Campo Ends (206g and 430g, one silicated) - > ~$400 - > Pass (Passed at $400 for 600g of Campo....right)\ > 1106 - 1,886g Campo Indiv (nice) - $300 > 1107 - 3,146g Canyon Diablo (fairly nondescript) - $1,300 > 1108 - 42.5lb Campo (good shape, no glypts - corroded) - > missed price > 1109 - 1,220 lb butt-ugly Campo - $19,000 > 1110 - 127 lb Canyon Diablo - Special Note > This iron looks great in the auction photo. It's not. > The back of it > was...ruined somehow. It looks like the owner sandblasted > the back > down to a quasi-3D widmanstatten surface, and then coated > it in some > sort of plastic/sealant that tinged it all (only the > backside, but the > entire backside) a nasty light-green hue, and gave it a > smooth, shiny, > plastic-ey look and feel. I don't know what the hell > s/he did to it, > but we decided ahead of time that we didn't want it, no > matter the > cost. > That said - $18,000 > 1111 - 385g Slice of NWA 1941 L6 (the "blue" one > Michael Farmer's been > selling) - $950 (!) > 1112 - 34mm diameter NWA XXX Sphere (no weight given, > listed as NWA > 869, but not NWA 869) - $350 > 1113 - 1,994g NWA XXX Sphere (4in diameter, again listed as > NWA 869, > but a different meteorite) - $1,800 > 1114 - 2.0g Murchison frag, no crust - $400 (!) > 1115 - Arroyo Malo 75.1g - $500 (slightly less than $50/g) > 1116 - Arroyo Malo 202.5g - $850 (again, somewhat less than > $50/g) > 1117 - Libyan Glass Pair (183g light + 77g dark) - missed > the number, > at least $400 > 1118 - 1,451g Libyan Glass (numerous large chips) - $1,400 > 1119 - Collection of Six Lunar and Martian Meteorites - > 0.05g to > 0.054g in weight - $1,800 (...I estimate its value, based > on the > specimens, their weights, and current market prices, at no > more than > $300) > 1120 - Set of Five Medals w/ Meteorites > (Campo/869/482/2995/2986) - $275 > 1121 - 1.85g DaG 476 Slice - $950 > 1122 - 2.718g NWA 4880 Sherg. Indiv. (broken) - $4,500 (!) > 1123 - 5.85g of LA002 - $9,000 (!) > 1124 - 90.5g Shergottite Indiv - Special Note > This stone had a chip not pictured - just above and to the > left of > what would be visible in the photographs posted in the > auction.It was > a fresh chip - looked as though a curious nomad had knocked > the corner > (unfortunately the leading edge) off of it. Go figure. My > only > question regarding the stone was that the edge of the chip > was painted > black. It was definitely some sort of paint; not only was > it less > glossy and darker in colour than the rest of the stone, > but...it > rubbed off. The only possible explanation we could come up > with was > that it had been put on the stone so as to hide the edge of > the chip > in the auction photograph. It is visible in the photograph > just to > the left of the top of the stone as a thin edge of grey of > a different > hue (slightly) than the rest of the stone, running about > half-way down > that top-left side. It looks like a result of the lighting > in the > photo, but it's definitely not that... > Very odd. - $30,000 - Pass > 1125 - 1.3308g Dhofar 1428 Slice (Feldspathic IMB) - $1,600 > 1126 - 1.0064g DaG 400 Part-Slice (Anorthositic Breccia) - > $1,400 > > So...nothing -too- surprising. The low end was the Udei, > at $1.67/g, > and the high-end, well - a good few things. The bidders > who went over > market tended not to be meteorite enthusiasts; I heard a > phone-bidder > assuring her client that the $950 purchase of the $385g > slice of NWA > 1941 (L6) was a "very good deal." Granted, it > was a nice slice, but > if you take the 20% commission and 8% tax into account for > it (and all > other items), well...that Sikhote was nothing special, and > it cost the > buyer close to $4/g... > > It looked like the buyers generally went with what looked > flashier or > more interesting. The Murchison was listed as a piece of a > comet, and > the NWA 1941 was listed as the "Blue Galaxy > Meteorite" - something > like that. The better the listing made things sound, the > more they > fetched. Something like Udei, which looked particularly > bad in their > case, which, in all fairness, didn't have adequate > lighting for such a > specimen, attracted little-to-no attention from...anyone. > > Regards, > Jason > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From rockhoundm at abaconet.com.ar Sun Dec 7 19:44:34 2008 From: rockhoundm at abaconet.com.ar (Eduardo.) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 21:44:34 -0300 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 7, 2008 In-Reply-To: <29421592.2233561228649906961.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Michael You mention that the pictured Malotas might be the only complete individual, but actually the main mass of 4712g is an individual which is now in my collection. best regards Eduardo -----Original Message----- From: Michael Johnson To: Meteorite List Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 03:38:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 7, 2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_7_2008.html > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From epgrondine at yahoo.com Sun Dec 7 20:10:09 2008 From: epgrondine at yahoo.com (E.P. Grondine) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 17:10:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Market Prices Message-ID: <944551.66883.qm@web36907.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi all - For the last several years I hav had a different way of thinking about money. Let me try to explain. It appears that we've had a major impact megatsunami about 1 per 1000 years in the recent past. Given the current coastal population densities, the next one should kill about 60,000,000. Divide 60,000,000 by 1,000, and you end up with 6,000 per year. Divide 6,000 by 365 days, and you can take it down to hours and minutes if you like. Then add Tunguska class impactors at the rate of 1 per 100 years. Of course, if it hits someplace remote, say farmlands or mid ocean, then you only loose a few, close to 0. But if it hits a city, you loose 20,000,000. So what are the chances of a city being hit? how much of the Earth's surface is urban? Then divide, and add to the 6,000. Oh, and then there's climate collapse from a cometary dust veil. The population is 6,000,000,000, and how many die due to starvation? 100,000? 200,000? 1,000,000? 500,000,000? And what is the frequency of occurrence? Break it down to a yearly number and add to the two numbers above. And how many dead in a large land impact, and how often? At one point I tried to break it down to lives lost per year, then to per day, then to per hour. Your numbers may vary, but then what do I know? E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas PS - As far as meteorites go, discretionary spending is way down. (I just had an order for 2 copies of my new book "Amazing Stories" canceled.) Some friends report sales running about 10% of normal. In economic terms, a panic has occurred, and the velocity of the money supply has fallen way off. Obama is ready to hit the ground running January 20, and confidence should return, and fairly quickly, but many people have been hurt, and hurt bad. Then there's always the unforeseen to think about. A little sci-fi. There is no doubt that videos increase the market value of falls, as do major "brand" names. Right now we have electronic picture frames, perhaps someday we'll have electronic video display boxes. Here's to better days ahead, Ed From meteoritekid at gmail.com Sun Dec 7 20:26:48 2008 From: meteoritekid at gmail.com (Jason Utas) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 17:26:48 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results In-Reply-To: <529246338-1228697597-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-224959700-@bxe202.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> References: <93aaac890812071617n7c59b075v9873f350772a5868@mail.gmail.com> <529246338-1228697597-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-224959700-@bxe202.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Message-ID: <93aaac890812071726l2a244fa7oe948c0784762bdc6@mail.gmail.com> No, buyers' premium was 20% and California sales tax (without a resale number) is 8%. ...So add 28% Jason On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 4:49 PM, wrote: > OMG - should have bid. > Do these include the buyers premium? > Matt > Matt Morgan > Mile High Meteorites > http://www.mhmeteorites.com > P.O. Box 151293 > Lakewood, CO 80215 USA > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Jason Utas" > > Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 16:17:18 > To: Meteorite-list > Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results > > > Hello All, > I read through the legal print in the front of the catalog, and it > looks like it's ok to post the results publicly. > > 1086 - 315g Gibeon Sphere - $475 > 1087 - 140g Gibeon Egg - $190 > 1088 - 490g Gibeon Slice - $375 > 1089 - 321g Gibeon Slice - Pass > 1090 - 2 Gibeon Slices (281 + 262g) - $325 > 1091 - Gibeon Part-Slice $475 > 1092 - 552g Gibeon Slice - $400 > 1093 - 2.6kg Gibeon Cut Block - $1,700 > 1094 - 7,150g Gibeon Slice - $3.250 - Pass > 1095 - 1,361g Muonionalusta End - $500 > 1096 - 136g Chinga Slice - $120 > 1097 - 494g Seymchan Slice - $425 > 1098 - 121g Udei Station End - $200 (!) > 1099 - 276g New NWA Iron (silicated) slice - $600 > 1100 - "7lb" Sikhote Shrapnel - listed as "oriented" - $1,500 > 1101 - 1,304g Sikhote Individual - $2,900 (!) > 1102 - 8kg Corroded Sikhote (*no* remaining fusion crust) - $6,500 - Pass > 1103 - 334g Fukang Part-Slice (shattered crystals) - $3,750 > 1104 - 520g Esquel Part-Slice - $12,000 > 1105 - Pair of Campo Ends (206g and 430g, one silicated) - ~$400 - > Pass (Passed at $400 for 600g of Campo....right)\ > 1106 - 1,886g Campo Indiv (nice) - $300 > 1107 - 3,146g Canyon Diablo (fairly nondescript) - $1,300 > 1108 - 42.5lb Campo (good shape, no glypts - corroded) - missed price > 1109 - 1,220 lb butt-ugly Campo - $19,000 > 1110 - 127 lb Canyon Diablo - Special Note > This iron looks great in the auction photo. It's not. The back of it > was...ruined somehow. It looks like the owner sandblasted the back > down to a quasi-3D widmanstatten surface, and then coated it in some > sort of plastic/sealant that tinged it all (only the backside, but the > entire backside) a nasty light-green hue, and gave it a smooth, shiny, > plastic-ey look and feel. I don't know what the hell s/he did to it, > but we decided ahead of time that we didn't want it, no matter the > cost. > That said - $18,000 > 1111 - 385g Slice of NWA 1941 L6 (the "blue" one Michael Farmer's been > selling) - $950 (!) > 1112 - 34mm diameter NWA XXX Sphere (no weight given, listed as NWA > 869, but not NWA 869) - $350 > 1113 - 1,994g NWA XXX Sphere (4in diameter, again listed as NWA 869, > but a different meteorite) - $1,800 > 1114 - 2.0g Murchison frag, no crust - $400 (!) > 1115 - Arroyo Malo 75.1g - $500 (slightly less than $50/g) > 1116 - Arroyo Malo 202.5g - $850 (again, somewhat less than $50/g) > 1117 - Libyan Glass Pair (183g light + 77g dark) - missed the number, > at least $400 > 1118 - 1,451g Libyan Glass (numerous large chips) - $1,400 > 1119 - Collection of Six Lunar and Martian Meteorites - 0.05g to > 0.054g in weight - $1,800 (...I estimate its value, based on the > specimens, their weights, and current market prices, at no more than > $300) > 1120 - Set of Five Medals w/ Meteorites (Campo/869/482/2995/2986) - $275 > 1121 - 1.85g DaG 476 Slice - $950 > 1122 - 2.718g NWA 4880 Sherg. Indiv. (broken) - $4,500 (!) > 1123 - 5.85g of LA002 - $9,000 (!) > 1124 - 90.5g Shergottite Indiv - Special Note > This stone had a chip not pictured - just above and to the left of > what would be visible in the photographs posted in the auction.It was > a fresh chip - looked as though a curious nomad had knocked the corner > (unfortunately the leading edge) off of it. Go figure. My only > question regarding the stone was that the edge of the chip was painted > black. It was definitely some sort of paint; not only was it less > glossy and darker in colour than the rest of the stone, but...it > rubbed off. The only possible explanation we could come up with was > that it had been put on the stone so as to hide the edge of the chip > in the auction photograph. It is visible in the photograph just to > the left of the top of the stone as a thin edge of grey of a different > hue (slightly) than the rest of the stone, running about half-way down > that top-left side. It looks like a result of the lighting in the > photo, but it's definitely not that... > Very odd. - $30,000 - Pass > 1125 - 1.3308g Dhofar 1428 Slice (Feldspathic IMB) - $1,600 > 1126 - 1.0064g DaG 400 Part-Slice (Anorthositic Breccia) - $1,400 > > So...nothing -too- surprising. The low end was the Udei, at $1.67/g, > and the high-end, well - a good few things. The bidders who went over > market tended not to be meteorite enthusiasts; I heard a phone-bidder > assuring her client that the $950 purchase of the $385g slice of NWA > 1941 (L6) was a "very good deal." Granted, it was a nice slice, but > if you take the 20% commission and 8% tax into account for it (and all > other items), well...that Sikhote was nothing special, and it cost the > buyer close to $4/g... > > It looked like the buyers generally went with what looked flashier or > more interesting. The Murchison was listed as a piece of a comet, and > the NWA 1941 was listed as the "Blue Galaxy Meteorite" - something > like that. The better the listing made things sound, the more they > fetched. Something like Udei, which looked particularly bad in their > case, which, in all fairness, didn't have adequate lighting for such a > specimen, attracted little-to-no attention from...anyone. > > Regards, > Jason > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From dave at fallingrocks.com Sun Dec 7 20:30:29 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 20:30:29 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <93aaac890812071551q716f2d2dh97ba852ff640eeb7@mail.gmail.com> References: <8CB26D03E1FDFFF-15E0-D52@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com><93aaac890812071511w6b5db876jc9147a77913d6491@mail.gmail.com><8CB26DC6AB528AF-15E0-109B@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com> <93aaac890812071551q716f2d2dh97ba852ff640eeb7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <141D013711184C4AB2D35EEECA216EA0@meteorroom> Maybe that someone isn't getting it...wow. Sonny and McCartney, if the market is willing to pay you $50,000 for your recoveries, congrats on a job well done. Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Jason Utas Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 6:52 PM To: Meteorite-list Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale ...And what's that supposed to mean? On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 3:41 PM, wrote: > Geez Jason, > > You must be on restriction or something! > > Sonny > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jason Utas > To: Meteorite-list > Sent: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 3:11 pm > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale > > > > > > > Hola, > I've heard that you fellows fetched over a kilogram. > $50/g isn't a bad price for you to set, considering that you both > probably spent less than $1,500 all told for the trip, each. > I mean, it's not like you had to deal with any dangers or risk. You > left when you knew meteorites had been found, and travelled to a safe, > civilized location. I suppose there might have been a risk in not > being allowed to search private land, but, honestly...that's not > stopped any hunters I know on this list. > Anyway, it sounds like nice material. Like every other fresh fall > from the past...well, since forever. > As to your stating that you "would say it is up to the individuals > that took the time and effort to get out in the field to do the > recovery work," well, fine. I just wonder why the hunters who went to > Kilabo, Bensour, Thuathe, Chergach, Bassikounou, and even Park Forest, > charged substantially less than you are supposedly asking for this > fall. > As your friend, fellow hunter, and prospective customer, I'd like to > know why. Because it looks like you're set to make $25,000 off of > this, along with McCartney (another $25,000). Why do I, and other > meteorite collectors, owe you that? > Regards, > Jason > > On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 2:14 PM, wrote: >> >> Hi All, >> >> I would have responded earlier but our Internet connection was not > > the >> >> best. We just flew in from Canada today. What is a fair price per > > gram? I >> >> would say it is up to the individuals that took the time and effort > > to get >> >> out in the field to do the recovery work. I knew before leaving home > > that if >> >> we were lucky enough to find any material that we would have to leave > > it in >> >> Canada and go through the proper channels to obtain this legally. > > Most of >> >> the area where the fall took place has been locked up with NO > > TRESPASSING >> >> signs posted. We were fortunate enough to negotiate a deal with the > > owners >> >> of some private property. We have been told the chances of any > > material >> >> leaving Canada with a permit is almost impossible. How nice would it > > be to >> >> have a new Canadian meteorite from a witnessed fall with proper >> documentation? This is my first time to pick up a meteorite as fresh > > as >> >> this. You can almost rub off the fusion crust and the interior is > > bright >> >> white. I will have a picture showing the interior of the meteorite > > posted >> >> within the next couple of days. So lets keep our fingers crossed to > > have >> >> these meteorites in the U.S.A within 6 months to a year. I was > > thinking >> >> about playing a joke on Mccartney and placing a meteorite in his > > backpack to >> >> see if he could make it through customs and once we made it into the > > U.S.A >> >> telling McCartney "Hey half of the meteorite is mine!" Just teasing. >> >> >> Thanks, >> Sonny >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > > ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From dave at fallingrocks.com Sun Dec 7 20:47:19 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 20:47:19 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day -December 7, 2008 In-Reply-To: References: <29421592.2233561228649906961.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <92C341F797874928A64A230BA4123790@meteorroom> Eduardo & All, I sent that caption to Michael, so it is my doing. I'm glad to receive your reply, as this is exactly why I included that line with the image. The individual from whom I acquired the 328 gram piece also told me they thought it might be the largest intact individual, and I've been wondering whether that might be true or not. Anyway, if you have a photograph please send it along...would love to see the specimen! Best regards, Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Eduardo. Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 7:45 PM To: Michael Johnson; Meteorite List Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day -December 7, 2008 Hi Michael You mention that the pictured Malotas might be the only complete individual, but actually the main mass of 4712g is an individual which is now in my collection. best regards Eduardo -----Original Message----- From: Michael Johnson To: Meteorite List Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 03:38:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 7, 2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_7_2008.html > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mexicodoug at aim.com Sun Dec 7 21:58:45 2008 From: mexicodoug at aim.com (mexicodoug at aim.com) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 21:58:45 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results In-Reply-To: <77494.18437.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CB26F805515E5E-17D4-16B2@WEBMAIL-MA18.sysops.aol.com> Mike wrote: "I paid $2000.00 for the 2 kilo sphere, now with seller premium, I lost at least $200 and the time to mess with it." Let's see, didn't you lose $560.00 if the $2000 is a hard figure? Isn't there both a 20% premium on hammer for the buyer as well as a 20% of hammer commission? Please correct this if it is wrong, but it appears they 'earn' from both buyers and sellers. This is my understanding: seller gets $1,440 hammer price $1,800 sale price $2,160 with tax $2,333 don't even ask about shipping fees... So, unless Mike was cut a special deal on his sphere and didn't have to pay 20% seller-side commission of the hammer price, he lost $560 plus the shipping fees to get it to the auction plus the hassle. May more for cataloging and promotional fees. Of course, these fees are not applied equally to all sellers in the auction. If you happen to know who is administering the sale, they might give you a lower commision under the radar. I didn't say under the table - it's just an auction, not a moral venture. Thus Udei Station's seller should have received per gram: $ 1.32 sale price: $ 1.98 with tax: $ 2.14 The total markup of auction house on consigned goods at sellers risks of providing, before tax, btw, is an even 50% if I a correctly understanding the terms. Something to keep in mind when bellyaching about ebay and Blood's Auction. This auction company took gross profit off meteorites $14,708, assuming they charged everyone the 20% and didn't cut special deals for preferred sellers. 25% of their profit and the total auction sales in meteorites was the single LA002 Martian lot. All in all, the hammer came down on $ 36,769 The auction house technically grossed $ 14,708 But offered on the block (low end) $ 225,719 Total sold: 16.3% of offerings' value. WOW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Which should be compared to 22/40 lots sold (>half full?), the best piece of news from a lackluster auction which the optimists can use as a judge ... Martin, you're right - all looks hunky-dory! (Hey Martin's the only one that reads this, gotta get his attention) Happy Holidays, Doug Sr. Businessman dreaming about free meteorites and nightmares of hunters that pay for the pleasure -----Original Message----- From: Michael Farmer To: Jason Utas ; Meteorite-list ; mail at mhmeteorites.com Sent: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 7:55 pm Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results Yes, however, the Esquel (mine) did not sell, it did not meet reserve. I am sick at these prices, I could have done better on ebay. I paid $2000.00 for the 2 kilo sphere, now with seller premium, I lost at least $200 and the time to mess with it. Mike --- On Sun, 12/7/08, mail at mhmeteorites.com wrote: > From: mail at mhmeteorites.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results > To: "Jason Utas" , "Meteorite-list" > Date: Sunday, December 7, 2008, 5:49 PM > OMG - should have bid. > Do these include the buyers premium? > Matt > Matt Morgan > Mile High Meteorites > http://www.mhmeteorites.com > P.O. Box 151293 > Lakewood, CO 80215 USA > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Jason Utas" > > Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 16:17:18 > To: > Meteorite-list > Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Auction Results > > > Hello All, > I read through the legal print in the front of the catalog, > and it > looks like it's ok to post the results publicly. > > 1086 - 315g Gibeon Sphere - $475 > 1087 - 140g Gibeon Egg - $190 > 1088 - 490g Gibeon Slice - $375 > 1089 - 321g Gibeon Slice - Pass > 1090 - 2 Gibeon Slices (281 + 262g) - $325 > 1091 - Gibeon Part-Slice $475 > 1092 - 552g Gibeon Slice - $400 > 1093 - 2.6kg Gibeon Cut Block - $1,700 > 1094 - 7,150g Gibeon Slice - $3.250 - Pass > 1095 - 1,361g Muonionalusta End - $500 > 1096 - 136g Chinga Slice - $120 > 1097 - 494g Seymchan Slice - $425 > 1098 - 121g Udei Station End - $200 (!) > 1099 - 276g New NWA Iron (silicated) slice - $600 > 1100 - "7lb" Sikhote Shrapnel - listed as > "oriented" - $1,500 > 1101 - 1,304g Sikhote Individual - $2,900 (!) > 1102 - 8kg Corroded Sikhote (*no* remaining fusion crust) - > $6,500 - Pass > 1103 - 334g Fukang Part-Slice (shattered crystals) - $3,750 > 1104 - 520g Esquel Part-Slice - $12,000 > 1105 - Pair of Campo Ends (206g and 430g, one silicated) - > ~$400 - > Pass (Passed at $400 for 600g of Campo....right)\ > 1106 - 1,886g Campo Indiv (nice) - $300 > 1107 - 3,146g Canyon Diablo (fairly nondescript) - $1,300 > 1108 - 42.5lb Campo (good shape, no glypts - corroded) - > missed price > 1109 - 1,220 lb butt-ugly Campo - $19,000 > 1110 - 127 lb Canyon Diablo - Special Note > This iron looks great in the auction photo. It's not. > The back of it > was...ruined somehow. It looks like the owner sandblasted > the back > down to a quasi-3D widmanstatten surface, and then coated > it in some > sort of plastic/sealant that tinged it all (only the > backside, but the > entire backside) a nasty light-green hue, and gave it a > smooth, shiny, > plastic-ey look and feel. I don't know what the hell > s/he did to it, > but we decided ahead of time that we didn't want it, no > matter the > cost. > That said - $18,000 > 1111 - 385g Slice of NWA 1941 L6 (the "blue" one > Michael Farmer's been > selling) - $950 (!) > 1112 - 34mm diameter NWA XXX Sphere (no weight given, > listed as NWA > 869, but not NWA 869) - $350 > 1113 - 1,994g NWA XXX Sphere (4in diameter, again listed as > NWA 869, > but a different meteorite) - $1,800 > 1114 - 2.0g Murchison frag, no crust - $400 (!) > 1115 - Arroyo Malo 75.1g - $500 (slightly less than $50/g) > 1116 - Arroyo Malo 202.5g - $850 (again, somewhat less than > $50/g) > 1117 - Libyan Glass Pair (183g light + 77g dark) - missed > the number, > at least $400 > 1118 - 1,451g Libyan Glass (numerous large chips) - $1,400 > 1119 - Collection of Six Lunar and Martian Meteorites - > 0.05g to > 0.054g in weight - $1,800 (...I estimate its value, based > on the > specimens, their weights, and current market prices, at no > more than > $300) > 1120 - Set of Five Medals w/ Meteorites > (Campo/869/482/2995/2986) - $275 > 1121 - 1.85g DaG 476 Slice - $950 > 1122 - 2.718g NWA 4880 Sherg. Indiv. (broken) - $4,500 (!) > 1123 - 5.85g of LA002 - $9,000 (!) > 1124 - 90.5g Shergottite Indiv - Special Note > This stone had a chip not pictured - just above and to the > left of > what would be visible in the photographs posted in the > auction.It was > a fresh chip - looked as though a curious nomad had knocked > the corner > (unfortunately the leading edge) off of it. Go figure. My > only > question regarding the stone was that the edge of the chip > was painted > black. It was definitely some sort of paint; not only was > it less > glossy and darker in colour than the rest of the stone, > but...it > rubbed off. The only possible explanation we could come up > with was > that it had been put on the stone so as to hide the edge of > the chip > in the auction photograph. It is visible in the photograph > just to > the left of the top of the stone as a thin edge of grey of > a different > hue (slightly) than the rest of the stone, running about > half-way down > that top-left side. It looks like a result of the lighting > in the > photo, but it's definitely not that... > Very odd. - $30,000 - Pass > 1125 - 1.3308g Dhofar 1428 Slice (Feldspathic IMB) - $1,600 > 1126 - 1.0064g DaG 400 Part-Slice (Anorthositic Breccia) - > $1,400 > > So...nothing -too- surprising. The low end was the Udei, > at $1.67/g, > and the high-end, well - a good few things. The bidders > who went over > market tended not to be meteorite enthusiasts; I heard a > phone-bidder > assuring her client that the $950 purchase of the $385g > slice of NWA > 1941 (L6) was a "very good deal." Granted, it > was a nice slice, but > if you take the 20% commission and 8% tax into account for > it (and all > other items), well...that Sikhote was nothing special, and > it cost the > buyer close to $4/g... > > It looked like the buyers generally went with what looked > flashier or > more interesting. The Murchison was listed as a piece of a > comet, and > the NWA 1941 was listed as the "Blue Galaxy > Meteorite" - something > like that. The better the listing made things sound, the > more they > fetched. Something like Udei, which looked particularly > bad in their > case, which, in all fairness, didn't have adequate > lighting for such a > specimen, attracted little-to-no attention from...anyone. > > Regards, > Jason > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From paul at meteorite.com Sun Dec 7 22:31:17 2008 From: paul at meteorite.com (Paul Harris) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 19:31:17 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] December Issue of Meteorite-Times Now Up Message-ID: <493C9505.3030106@meteorite.com> Dear List, The December issue of Meteorite-Times is now up. http://www.meteorite-times.com/ A huge thank you to all the writers and people who contributed this year. Meteorite-Times only happens because of you. Thank you all, Paul and Jim From rsvp321 at hotmail.com Sun Dec 7 22:41:58 2008 From: rsvp321 at hotmail.com (Pete Pete) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 22:41:58 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale In-Reply-To: <141D013711184C4AB2D35EEECA216EA0@meteorroom> References: <8CB26D03E1FDFFF-15E0-D52@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com><93aaac890812071511w6b5db876jc9147a77913d6491@mail.gmail.com><8CB26DC6AB528AF-15E0-109B@webmail-me11.sysops.aol.com> <93aaac890812071551q716f2d2dh97ba852ff640eeb7@mail.gmail.com> <141D013711184C4AB2D35EEECA216EA0@meteorroom> Message-ID: Hi, all, I may have missed it in a past post, but has the new Canadian meteorite been given a fall name yet? Cheers, Pete > From: dave at fallingrocks.com > To: meteoritekid at gmail.com; meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 20:30:29 -0500 > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale > > Maybe that someone isn't getting it...wow. Sonny and McCartney, if the > market is willing to pay you $50,000 for your recoveries, congrats on a job > well done. > Dave > www.fallingrocks.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Jason Utas > Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 6:52 PM > To: Meteorite-list > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale > > ...And what's that supposed to mean? > > > On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 3:41 PM, wrote: >> Geez Jason, >> >> You must be on restriction or something! >> >> Sonny >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Jason Utas >> To: Meteorite-list >> Sent: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 3:11 pm >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite for sale >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Hola, >> I've heard that you fellows fetched over a kilogram. >> $50/g isn't a bad price for you to set, considering that you both >> probably spent less than $1,500 all told for the trip, each. >> I mean, it's not like you had to deal with any dangers or risk. You >> left when you knew meteorites had been found, and travelled to a safe, >> civilized location. I suppose there might have been a risk in not >> being allowed to search private land, but, honestly...that's not >> stopped any hunters I know on this list. >> Anyway, it sounds like nice material. Like every other fresh fall >> from the past...well, since forever. >> As to your stating that you "would say it is up to the individuals >> that took the time and effort to get out in the field to do the >> recovery work," well, fine. I just wonder why the hunters who went to >> Kilabo, Bensour, Thuathe, Chergach, Bassikounou, and even Park Forest, >> charged substantially less than you are supposedly asking for this >> fall. >> As your friend, fellow hunter, and prospective customer, I'd like to >> know why. Because it looks like you're set to make $25,000 off of >> this, along with McCartney (another $25,000). Why do I, and other >> meteorite collectors, owe you that? >> Regards, >> Jason >> >> On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 2:14 PM, wrote: >>> >>> Hi All, >>> >>> I would have responded earlier but our Internet connection was not >> >> the >>> >>> best. We just flew in from Canada today. What is a fair price per >> >> gram? I >>> >>> would say it is up to the individuals that took the time and effort >> >> to get >>> >>> out in the field to do the recovery work. I knew before leaving home >> >> that if >>> >>> we were lucky enough to find any material that we would have to leave >> >> it in >>> >>> Canada and go through the proper channels to obtain this legally. >> >> Most of >>> >>> the area where the fall took place has been locked up with NO >> >> TRESPASSING >>> >>> signs posted. We were fortunate enough to negotiate a deal with the >> >> owners >>> >>> of some private property. We have been told the chances of any >> >> material >>> >>> leaving Canada with a permit is almost impossible. How nice would it >> >> be to >>> >>> have a new Canadian meteorite from a witnessed fall with proper >>> documentation? This is my first time to pick up a meteorite as fresh >> >> as >>> >>> this. You can almost rub off the fusion crust and the interior is >> >> bright >>> >>> white. I will have a picture showing the interior of the meteorite >> >> posted >>> >>> within the next couple of days. So lets keep our fingers crossed to >> >> have >>> >>> these meteorites in the U.S.A within 6 months to a year. I was >> >> thinking >>> >>> about playing a joke on Mccartney and placing a meteorite in his >> >> backpack to >>> >>> see if he could make it through customs and once we made it into the >> >> U.S.A >>> >>> telling McCartney "Hey half of the meteorite is mine!" Just teasing. >>> >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Sonny >>> ______________________________________________ >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> >> >> >> >> > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list _________________________________________________________________ From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Sun Dec 7 22:45:24 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 20:45:24 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Update on Colorado fireball Message-ID: I've posted more information about the Dec 6 fireball at http://www.cloudbait.com/science/fireball20081206.html in case anybody wants to start looking for pieces. Not the best ground to search, but better than the side of Pikes Peak, which was my first estimate. Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com From mccartney at blackbearddata.com Sun Dec 7 23:54:23 2008 From: mccartney at blackbearddata.com (McCartney Taylor) Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 22:54:23 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Pictures from the Lone Rock Strewnfield Message-ID: I was diligent in getting photos of stones in situ. The trick is to snap the picture before the cold snaps the battery dead. -20C does nasty things to battery chemistry. Note fusion crust looks 'wrong' with a light coating of ice that might be half sublimated. Also note, that only after 9 days on the ground, oxidation is already visible on some specimens. Spring stones should be noticeably different than winter stones. Lets hope this works... http://www.flickr.com/photos/20227815 at N06/sets/72157610818541399/ From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Mon Dec 8 06:07:30 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 03:07:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Pictures from the Lone Rock Strewnfield In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <481882.59480.qm@web110216.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Nice photos, far cry from most of the hot place hunting I have done, although I went two times to Tagish Lake in winter. Congrats guys, you did it while other people talked. Mike --- On Sun, 12/7/08, McCartney Taylor wrote: > From: McCartney Taylor > Subject: [meteorite-list] Pictures from the Lone Rock Strewnfield > To: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Sunday, December 7, 2008, 9:54 PM > I was diligent in getting photos of stones in situ. The > trick is to snap the picture before the cold snaps the > battery dead. -20C does nasty things to battery chemistry. > > Note fusion crust looks 'wrong' with a light > coating of ice that might be half sublimated. Also note, > that only after 9 days on the ground, oxidation is already > visible on some specimens. Spring stones should be > noticeably different than winter stones. > > Lets hope this works... > http://www.flickr.com/photos/20227815 at N06/sets/72157610818541399/ > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael at spacerocksinc.com Mon Dec 8 06:41:59 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 03:41:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 8, 2008 Message-ID: <9841598.2280531228736519431.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_8_2008.html From azizhabibi at yahoo.com Mon Dec 8 08:59:01 2008 From: azizhabibi at yahoo.com (habibi abdelaziz) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 05:59:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] ad , rumuruties and some new stuffs Message-ID: <266903.26237.qm@web62005.mail.re1.yahoo.com> hello there and happy holidays i have for sale some rumuruti 's , _ the?NEW?R 3.0 THIS NEW TYPE _?also the rumuruti breccia,this fantastic R WITH INCLUSION INSIDE. ?and some other stuffs please email for photo and price. TO. aziz_habibi at hotmail.com or azizhabibi at yahoo.com ? habibi aziz www.palmserfoud.com www.palmotel.com box 70 erfoud 52200 morroco phone. 21235576145 fax.21235576170 From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Mon Dec 8 10:26:21 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 07:26:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] No wonder Bonhams was a bust In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <102323.8014.qm@web58401.mail.re3.yahoo.com> "No, buyers' premium was 20% and California sales tax (without a resale number) is 8%. ...So add 28%" Jason ---- There you have your answer, in part. Add 28% means subtract 50% of the potential bidders, including me. I watched that auction, and was scared away from bidding by the man in a black ski-mask and a Bonham's jacket on. Call me naive, but tacking on an extra 30% after the gavel (almost) is highway robbery. And I thought eBay fees were ridiculous. I guess I'll never bid on a Bonham's auction. No offense to Mike or any of the other sellers who got hosed, but you couldn't put a gun to my head and make me give my stuff away like that and then pay through the wazoo to do it. No thanks. Better luck next time, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From mstreman53 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 8 12:14:05 2008 From: mstreman53 at yahoo.com (Mr EMan) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 09:14:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Trinitite --Correction--UPDATE Message-ID: <590069.97023.qm@web55202.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Dear Mike just when you think you have the book ready to publish and you know all there is to know someone changes a chapter... So let me revisit what we thought we knew about trinitie formation I got this blurb today from Geology at about.com but the link to the WSMR Military website isn't there yet again. Since the new theory was published in 2005 I stand partially corrected about the origin of trinitite--there is a fallback theory paper! "The trinitite appears to have formed as sand was sucked up into the nuclear fireball and fell back in a rain of molten glass, according to a new theory(link to http://www.wsmr.army.mil/wsmr.asp?pg=y&page=591). It was always assumed that trinitite formed on the ground under the fireball's direct glare, but science thrives by revisiting assumptions in the search for truer explanations. " from Geology at about.com Newsletter All references to the "new theory " have been removed from the White Sands Missile Range web site and aren't on the Los Alamos Labs public site. So I don't know if the "new theory" has been withdrawn. The rayed star pattern of deposition, the lack of any trinitie more than 1200 ft from GZ and the fact that the trinitite deposits were generally concentric with GZ--e.g. not scattered down wind, makes me think that any fall back theory will need to go a long way to explain this away. In the interest of fairness and previous discussion I thought I'd share this snippet pending locating the text of the theory. Elton From clwaldeniii at comcast.net Mon Dec 8 12:16:35 2008 From: clwaldeniii at comcast.net (Chauncey Walden) Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 10:16:35 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Update on Colorado fireball Message-ID: <493D5673.7030702@comcast.net> From that altitude and with the prevailing winds aloft, that should put it on the ground in the middle of the Fort Carson Reservation. Maybe we can get then to trail some magnets from the tanks;-) From arn1200 at Comcast.net Mon Dec 8 13:14:26 2008 From: arn1200 at Comcast.net (Ken Regelman) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 12:14:26 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad Message-ID: <00da01c95960$ceac7170$0802a8c0@ARN> Dear Friends A Black Christmas has befallen this house hold . I am retired and money is not that available anymore . While coming home last Friday my car Died The engine Must to be replaced before it will move again . I Must sell meteorites to pay for the fix . Anything you see on my website is for sale at reduced cost . I also have many vary rare meteorites I will soon put on the list or you can call or email me . I need to raise at least $3000 to pay for the fix . I have two beautiful mesosiderites of NWA2924 One 1080 g and one 726 g both museum quality !!! I have my website NWA2853g Howardite the main mass 860g at $5 a gram would be $4300 I am sorry I am still in shell shock !!!! Kenneth Regelman arn1200 at Comcast.net http://www.meteorites4sale.net/ WA0FAA From meteoritefinder at gmail.com Mon Dec 8 14:24:50 2008 From: meteoritefinder at gmail.com (Mike Miller) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 12:24:50 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Update on Colorado fireball In-Reply-To: <493D5673.7030702@comcast.net> References: <493D5673.7030702@comcast.net> Message-ID: <468bf6050812081124n42f0ecackcc57c5b63f367d63@mail.gmail.com> When you say "Fort Carson Reservation" Is that a military base or an Indian reservation? On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 10:16 AM, Chauncey Walden wrote: > From that altitude and with the prevailing winds aloft, that should put it > on the ground in the middle of the Fort Carson Reservation. Maybe we can get > then to trail some magnets from the tanks;-) > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr. Kingman Az 86401 www.meteoritefinder.com 928-753-6825 From MeteorHntr at aol.com Mon Dec 8 14:33:39 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 14:33:39 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Impact Melt Breccia Message-ID: Hey List, Does anyone have a comprehensive list on all of the: H Impact Melt Breccias L Impact Melt Breccias LL Impact Melt Breccias Other Impact Melt Breccias Thanks, Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From cynapse at charter.net Mon Dec 8 14:41:36 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 14:41:36 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Update on Colorado fireball In-Reply-To: <468bf6050812081124n42f0ecackcc57c5b63f367d63@mail.gmail.com> References: <493D5673.7030702@comcast.net> <468bf6050812081124n42f0ecackcc57c5b63f367d63@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Dec 2008 12:24:50 -0700, you wrote: >When you say "Fort Carson Reservation" Is that a military base or an >Indian reservation? In my (granted, limited) experience, few Indians have tanks. From yellowengine at earthlink.net Mon Dec 8 14:50:38 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 13:50:38 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Collection Pieces Message-ID: <27132117.1228765839114.JavaMail.root@elwamui-cypress.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Good Afternoon, I have a few pieces from my collection that I would like to sell. Very little to zero profit on these. Photos upon request: Bremham (Pal) - 195g "palm size" full slice (thin). $780 Gibeon - 460g etched full slice. $575 Millbillillie - 212g complete stone, "a grade". $2,120 I will cover domestic postage, and I do accept Paypal for those who prefer to go that route instead. Cheers, Ryan Pawelski From Impactika at aol.com Mon Dec 8 15:34:00 2008 From: Impactika at aol.com (Impactika at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 15:34:00 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Update on Colorado fireball Message-ID: Hello Mike and List, Fort Carson is a large and active military base, a lot of training there before deployment in Iraq. I doubt they would welcome visitors. But you could try just west of the base along 115, mostly ranch land I believe. Also a major winter storm is expected here today. It is gray cold and light drizzle in Denver right now, it could already be snowing there. Sorry, I don't mean to be discouraging, but those are the facts. Anne M. Black http://www.impactika.com/ IMPACTIKA at aol.com Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. http://www.imca.cc/ In a message dated 12/8/2008 12:25:03 PM Mountain Standard Time, meteoritefinder at gmail.com writes: When you say "Fort Carson Reservation" Is that a military base or an Indian reservation? On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 10:16 AM, Chauncey Walden wrote: > From that altitude and with the prevailing winds aloft, that should put it > on the ground in the middle of the Fort Carson Reservation. Maybe we can get > then to trail some magnets from the tanks;-) > > ______________________________________________ -- Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr. Kingman Az 86401 www.meteoritefinder.com 928-753-6825 ______________________________________________ **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From mail at mhmeteorites.com Mon Dec 8 15:39:33 2008 From: mail at mhmeteorites.com (mail at mhmeteorites.com) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 20:39:33 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Update on Colorado fireball Message-ID: <1626851286-1228768971-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-100975348-@bxe202.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> I had the privilege to map the geology of the north part of the Ft Carson base in 2002-2003. The area is very rugged, much like Glorieta, and is full of rocks. Not the best hunting grounds. I remember driving down one of the base roads in a remote area, and was ambushed by several men that were dressed like terrorists (masks, black clothing and machine guns). They thought I was part of the exercise. I explained who I was and we all had a laugh, but I nearly soiled myself! The area north of the base is extremely rugged with a few thousand feet in elevation changes, very remote (don't get lost) and full of mountain lions. I am not trying to scare you away, but this is no walk in the park. Matt ------Original Message------ From: Impactika at aol.com Sender: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com To: Mike Miller To: clwaldeniii at comcast.net Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Dec 8, 2008 1:34 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Update on Colorado fireball Hello Mike and List, Fort Carson is a large and active military base, a lot of training there before deployment in Iraq. I doubt they would welcome visitors. But you could try just west of the base along 115, mostly ranch land I believe. Also a major winter storm is expected here today. It is gray cold and light drizzle in Denver right now, it could already be snowing there. Sorry, I don't mean to be discouraging, but those are the facts. Anne M. Black http://www.impactika.com/ IMPACTIKA at aol.com Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. http://www.imca.cc/ In a message dated 12/8/2008 12:25:03 PM Mountain Standard Time, meteoritefinder at gmail.com writes: When you say "Fort Carson Reservation" Is that a military base or an Indian reservation? On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 10:16 AM, Chauncey Walden wrote: > From that altitude and with the prevailing winds aloft, that should put it > on the ground in the middle of the Fort Carson Reservation. Maybe we can get > then to trail some magnets from the tanks;-) > > ______________________________________________ -- Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr. Kingman Az 86401 www.meteoritefinder.com 928-753-6825 ______________________________________________ **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Matt Morgan Mile High Meteorites http://www.mhmeteorites.com P.O. Box 151293 Lakewood, CO 80215 USA From mail at mhmeteorites.com Mon Dec 8 16:05:24 2008 From: mail at mhmeteorites.com (mail at mhmeteorites.com) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 13:05:24 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD-Zagami and Bassikounou Message-ID: <20081208130524.08j2dp0bkkkgkcoc@webmail.mhmeteorites.com> I have two pieces that I am looking to move to make room for some new inventory. Looking for offers on 9.4 g crusted slice of Zagami. A very sweet piece Also, looking for offers on a 1,019 g Bassikounou (could make some killer big slices). Pictures are here: http://mhmeteorites.com/museum_gallery.html Any other questions just ask. Also, I am never insulted by offers. Try me. Matt Morgan From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Mon Dec 8 16:50:24 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 13:50:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor Explodes Over Colorado Message-ID: <200812082150.NAA27292@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> Space Weather News for Dec. 6, 2008 http://spaceweather.com COLORADO FIREBALL: Last night, a fireball one hundred times brighter than the full Moon lit up the sky near Colorado Springs, Colorado. Astronomer Chris Peterson photographed the event using an all-sky video camera dedicated to meteor studies. "In seven years of operation, this is the brightest fireball I've ever recorded. I estimate the terminal explosion at magnitude -18." Meteors this bright are called superbolides; they are caused by small (meter-class) asteroids and are likely to pepper the ground with meteorites when they explode. Visit http://spaceweather.com to watch the fireball video and contribute sighting reports that could help pinpoint any meteoritic debris. From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Mon Dec 8 16:51:57 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 13:51:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorites Could Have Thickened Primordial Soup Message-ID: <200812082151.NAA27936@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.sciencenews.org/view/generic/id/39124/title/Meteorites_could Meteorites could have thickened primordial soup High temperatures and pressures of impacts can create complex organic chemicals, tests show By Sid Perkins Science News December 8, 2008 In recent geological ages, large extraterrestrial bodies colliding with Earth have been associated with worldwide extinctions, but new experiments show that massive impacts that occurred early in our planet's history could have created the raw materials for life. The hellish temperatures and pressures generated when an extraterrestrial object strikes Earth at speeds of several kilometers per second are enough to shatter and vaporize rock (SN: 6/15/02, p. 378). Yet part of such an immense burst of energy can trigger chemical reactions that generate complex organic substances from basic inorganic ingredients, says Takeshi Kakegawa, a geochemist at Tohoku University in Sendai, Japan. He and his colleagues conducted lab experiments intended to simulate a common meteorite striking one of Earth's early oceans. The team reports its findings online December 7 in Nature Geoscience. First, the researchers filled tiny, thick-walled canisters of stainless steel with various mixtures of carbon, iron and nickel - common constituents of meteorites - and water, ammonia and nitrogen, significant components of the ancient ocean and atmosphere. Then, the team fired the canisters at a solid target. The shock of impact briefly subjected the enclosed materials to temperatures approaching 4,700?? Celsius and pressures about 60,000 times that of the atmosphere at sea level. These temperature and pressures are similar to those that would be caused by a large meteorite slamming into Earth at about 2 kilometers per second, says Kakegawa. After each test, Kakegawa and his team cleaned off the outside of the canister, drilled a hole in it, and then extracted and analyzed the contents. In two of the team's five tests, impacts created fatty acids like those found in cell membranes, and also generated a variety of amines, the ingredients for amino acids, Kakegawa says. In one test, the impact generated substantial amounts of glycine, the smallest of the 20 amino acids commonly found in proteins. None of the organic chemicals generated by the impacts was a contaminant from any poor handling, Kakegawa proposes. That's because all of the carbon in those resulting substances was the carbon-13 isotope, the same rare form that he and his colleagues used for the original mixture. Scientists estimate that around 4 billion billion (1018) metric tons of meteorites fell to Earth between 4.4 billion and 3.8 billion years ago. Even though meteorites only contain, on average, about 0.1 percent carbon, oceanic impacts during this era could have generated at least one hundred billion (1011) metric tons of organic substances, the researchers estimate. Although these chemicals couldn't have survived the conditions at ground zero of the impact, they probably could have formed in the more-tolerable temperatures present in the plumes of steam and vaporized rock that spewed skyward in the aftermath. The team's new analyses "are a nice piece of work," says George Cody, a geoscientist at the Carnegie Institution for Science in Washington, D.C. A number of previous studies have hinted that the building blocks of life could have been generated by lightning in Earth's ancient atmosphere (SN: 6/3/00, p. 363) or at deep-sea hydrothermal vents (SN: 9/9/00, p. 175; SN: 2/2/08, p. 67). Having multiple sources of such raw materials "makes determining the origin of life that much more difficult," Cody adds. However, he notes, "the more we learn, the more we see how early Earth was rich with organic compounds." From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Mon Dec 8 16:53:54 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 13:53:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] HiRISE Camera Captures High-Resolution 3D Images of Mars Message-ID: <200812082153.NAA28811@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> FROM: Lori Stiles (520-626-4402; lstiles at u.arizona.edu) HiRISE Camera Captures High-Resolution 3D Images of Mars December 8, 2008 The High Resolution Science Imaging Experiment, or HiRISE, team based at The University of Arizona today released 362 three-dimensional images of Mars taken by the HiRISE camera on NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter. Other Mars-orbiting cameras have taken 3D views of Mars, but the HiRISE camera - the most powerful camera ever to orbit another planet - can resolve features as small as one meter, or 40 inches, across. "It's really remarkable to see Martian rocks and features on the scale of a person in 3D," said Alfred McEwen of UA's Lunar and Planetary Laboratory, HiRISE principal investigator. "The level of detail is just much, much greater than anything previously seen from orbit." The 3D images, or anaglyphs, can be viewed on the HiRISE Web site (http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/anaglyph) with inexpensive color filter glasses commonly used for viewing 3D images and movies. The HiRISE Web site links to information on where to purchase and how to make 3D red-cyan filter glasses. Without 3D glasses, the Mars images appear out of register. (In Tucson, UA's Flandrau Science Center, 1601 E. University Blvd., and Starizona, 5757 N. Oracle Road, sell red-cyan filter glasses for $2 each.) Seen in HiRISE 3D, Mars becomes a collection of deep panoramic views that leap out from the computer screen. "You'd swear you could touch the terrain," HiRISE operations manager Eric Eliason said. Striking stereo views include: * Sixty-meter tall, or 200-foot-tall fractured mounds, probably composed of solidified lava, on the southern edge of Elysium Planitia. The fractured surface suggests that lava pushed the surface into domes, uplifting some sides along the same fracture higher than others. * Spectacular layers exposed on the floor about 2-and-a-half miles, or 4 kilometers, below the rim of Candor Chasma, which is a large canyon in the Valles Marineris system. The canyon may once have been filled to its rim by sedimentary layers of sand and dust-sized particles, but these have since eroded, leaving patterns of elongated hills and layered terrain that has been turned and folded in many angles and directions. * Groups of gullies at different elevations along the wall of an unnamed crater in Terra Cimmeria. The anaglyph image provides three-dimensional perspective on the depth of the gullies and the amount of material deposited below the gullies. Geological evidence suggests that the gullies may have formed by subsurface water, rather than by snow or ice melting on the surface. Other dramatic anaglyphs show a huge jumbled mass of rock that includes megabreccia at a central peak in Ritchey crater, ejecta-formed channels and mudflows at Hale crater, tightly folded rock layers lining the floor of Tithonium Chasm, "spiders" created by carbon dioxide venting through south polar layered deposits, and Martian glacier flows. Eliason and the team at HiROC, the High Resolution Imaging Operations Center on the UA campus, began processing stereo images in October. They automated some of the software used in processing HiRISE images so two images of a stereo pair could be fed into the software "pipeline" and correlated automatically. "The real advance here is making this process semi-automated so we can really crank through all these huge images," McEwen said. Producing anaglyphs from stereo pairs is otherwise a tedious, time-consuming effort. The HiRISE camera has so far taken 950 stereo image pairs. The camera features a half-meter, or 20-inch, diameter primary mirror and a focal plane mechanism that can acquire up to a 3.6 megapixel image in about 11 seconds. The anaglyphs are among 1,642 observations containing 3.6 terabytes of data and 148,000 image products that HiRISE released today to the Planetary Data System, or the PDS, the NASA mission data archive. Since HiRISE began the science phase of its mission in November 2006, the HiRISE team has released a total 867,430 image products, or 30.2 terabytes of data. That is by far the greatest volume of data a space experiment has delivered to the PDS, and well more than twice the data volume some HiRISE team members expected to get during the primary science phase. The HIRISE camera was designed to take images at high-convergence angles so researchers can calculate the thickness of surface features to within about 10 inches, or 25 centimeters. High-convergence angles used to get quantitative measurements aren't always best for making anaglyphs, McEwen said. In addition, if the two stereo images on two different orbits were taken far enough apart in time, the illumination or air opacity may have changed, or frost or dust devils may have appeared in one of the images, so paired images don't always match that well, he added. "Nevertheless, many of these stereo anaglyphs are very interesting and useful to us in understanding the topography," McEwen said. "There's a lot of science to be done by just looking at these directly and understanding what's up and what's down," he added. "Anaglyphs can definitely change how we interpret things, and help us focus on how to proceed when it comes to prioritizing some science tasks." Binocular vision gives humans wearing 3D color glasses the ability to see anaglyphs in three dimensions the same way they see in three dimensions through a View-Master viewer or a Victorian-era stereoscope. The same scene is viewed in two pictures taken from slightly different angles. Each eye has its own slightly different view, which the brain fuses together into a single picture with depth. With the colored glasses, the red filter for the left eye sees only red in the picture, the cyan filter for the right eye sees only blue-green in the picture, and the brain correlates the images. The glasses work for viewing stereo pictures in print or on TV, movie and computer screens. The Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter is managed by the Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif., for NASA's Science Mission Directorate, Washington. Lockheed Martin Space Systems of Denver built the spacecraft. The UA operates the HiRISE camera, built by Ball Aerospace and Technologies Corp. of Boulder, Colo. SCIENCE CONTACTS: Alfred McEwen (520-621-4573; mcewen at pirl.lpl.arizona.edu) Eric Eliason (520-626-0764; eeliason at pirl.lpl.arizona.edu) WEB LINKS: HiRISE: http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu MRO: http://www.nasa.gov/mro From cmb62 at columbus.rr.com Mon Dec 8 18:06:28 2008 From: cmb62 at columbus.rr.com (Charley) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 18:06:28 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 8, 2008 References: Message-ID: <8F33D08A922A42F7B8F0FF02E875148A@HAL> Hi Michael & List, WOW! Very nice! I would love to find one of these under MY Christmas tree! Thanks for sharing Michael (as always). Best regards, Charley "Well, squids don't work. Hey! Let's try elephants !" Hannibal > Message: 5 > Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 03:41:59 -0800 (PST) > From: Michael Johnson > Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - > December 8, 2008 > To: Meteorite List > Message-ID: > <9841598.2280531228736519431.JavaMail.root at mbs4.homesteadmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_8_2008.html From wahlperry at aol.com Mon Dec 8 18:12:28 2008 From: wahlperry at aol.com (wahlperry at aol.com) Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 18:12:28 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Picture of new Canadian meteorite / Interior Message-ID: <8CB27A19331C185-6B0-F52@webmail-dd02.sysops.aol.com> Hi, I have posted a couple of pictures of the interior of the new Canadian meteorite . I have the original photo that is in a very large format. If any Universities would like the larger format contact me off list and I will send it to you. The photo on my web page has been reduced significantly. Thanks, Sonny http://www.nevadameteorites.com/id35.htm From grf2 at verizon.net Mon Dec 8 18:26:25 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 18:26:25 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Picture of new Canadian meteorite / Interior References: <8CB27A19331C185-6B0-F52@webmail-dd02.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <9A42718CF6D84B0C9BF4685AA0CFAEEC@ASUS> Sure looks like an H. Jerry F ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, December 08, 2008 6:12 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Picture of new Canadian meteorite / Interior > Hi, > > I have posted a couple of pictures of the interior of the new Canadian > meteorite . I have the original photo that is in a very large format. > If any Universities would like the larger format contact me off list > and I will send it to you. The photo on my web page has been reduced > significantly. > > Thanks, > Sonny > > > > > http://www.nevadameteorites.com/id35.htm > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From grf2 at verizon.net Mon Dec 8 18:32:54 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 18:32:54 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] HiRISE Camera Captures High-Resolution 3D Images of Mars References: <200812082153.NAA28811@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <46A8EB4786E246CFABC9F122F077829D@ASUS> These images are truly spectacular. My $11 3D glasses just proved their worth. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Baalke" To: "Meteorite Mailing List" Sent: Monday, December 08, 2008 4:53 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] HiRISE Camera Captures High-Resolution 3D Images of Mars > > > FROM: Lori Stiles (520-626-4402; lstiles at u.arizona.edu) > > HiRISE Camera Captures High-Resolution 3D Images of Mars > December 8, 2008 > > The High Resolution Science Imaging Experiment, or HiRISE, team based at > The > University of Arizona today released 362 three-dimensional images of Mars > taken > by the HiRISE camera on NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter. > > Other Mars-orbiting cameras have taken 3D views of Mars, but the HiRISE > camera > - the most powerful camera ever to orbit another planet - can resolve > features as small as one meter, or 40 inches, across. > > "It's really remarkable to see Martian rocks and features on the scale of > a > person in 3D," said Alfred McEwen of UA's Lunar and Planetary Laboratory, > HiRISE principal investigator. "The level of detail is just much, much > greater > than anything previously seen from orbit." > > The 3D images, or anaglyphs, can be viewed on the HiRISE Web site > (http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/anaglyph) with inexpensive color filter > glasses > commonly used for viewing 3D images and movies. The HiRISE Web site links > to > information on where to purchase and how to make 3D red-cyan filter > glasses. > Without 3D glasses, the Mars images appear out of register. > > (In Tucson, UA's Flandrau Science Center, 1601 E. University Blvd., and > Starizona, 5757 N. Oracle Road, sell red-cyan filter glasses for $2 each.) > > Seen in HiRISE 3D, Mars becomes a collection of deep panoramic views that > leap > out from the computer screen. > > "You'd swear you could touch the terrain," HiRISE operations manager Eric > Eliason said. > > Striking stereo views include: > > * Sixty-meter tall, or 200-foot-tall fractured mounds, probably composed > of > solidified lava, on the southern edge of Elysium Planitia. The fractured > surface suggests that lava pushed the surface into domes, uplifting some > sides > along the same fracture higher than others. > * Spectacular layers exposed on the floor about 2-and-a-half miles, or 4 > kilometers, below the rim of Candor Chasma, which is a large canyon in the > Valles Marineris system. The canyon may once have been filled to its rim > by > sedimentary layers of sand and dust-sized particles, but these have since > eroded, leaving patterns of elongated hills and layered terrain that has > been > turned and folded in many angles and directions. > * Groups of gullies at different elevations along the wall of an unnamed > crater > in Terra Cimmeria. The anaglyph image provides three-dimensional > perspective on > the depth of the gullies and the amount of material deposited below the > gullies. > Geological evidence suggests that the gullies may have formed by > subsurface > water, rather than by snow or ice melting on the surface. > > Other dramatic anaglyphs show a huge jumbled mass of rock that includes > megabreccia at a central peak in Ritchey crater, ejecta-formed channels > and > mudflows at Hale crater, tightly folded rock layers lining the floor of > Tithonium Chasm, "spiders" created by carbon dioxide venting through south > polar layered deposits, and Martian glacier flows. > > Eliason and the team at HiROC, the High Resolution Imaging Operations > Center on > the UA campus, began processing stereo images in October. They automated > some > of the software used in processing HiRISE images so two images of a stereo > pair > could be fed into the software "pipeline" and correlated automatically. > > "The real advance here is making this process semi-automated so we can > really > crank through all these huge images," McEwen said. Producing anaglyphs > from > stereo pairs is otherwise a tedious, time-consuming effort. > > The HiRISE camera has so far taken 950 stereo image pairs. The camera > features a > half-meter, or 20-inch, diameter primary mirror and a focal plane > mechanism that > can acquire up to a 3.6 megapixel image in about 11 seconds. > > The anaglyphs are among 1,642 observations containing 3.6 terabytes of > data and > 148,000 image products that HiRISE released today to the Planetary Data > System, > or the PDS, the NASA mission data archive. > > Since HiRISE began the science phase of its mission in November 2006, the > HiRISE > team has released a total 867,430 image products, or 30.2 terabytes of > data. > That is by far the greatest volume of data a space experiment has > delivered to > the PDS, and well more than twice the data volume some HiRISE team members > expected to get during the primary science phase. > > The HIRISE camera was designed to take images at high-convergence angles > so > researchers can calculate the thickness of surface features to within > about 10 > inches, or 25 centimeters. High-convergence angles used to get > quantitative > measurements aren't always best for making anaglyphs, McEwen said. > > In addition, if the two stereo images on two different orbits were taken > far > enough apart in time, the illumination or air opacity may have changed, or > frost or dust devils may have appeared in one of the images, so paired > images > don't always match that well, he added. > > "Nevertheless, many of these stereo anaglyphs are very interesting and > useful to > us in understanding the topography," McEwen said. > > "There's a lot of science to be done by just looking at these directly and > understanding what's up and what's down," he added. "Anaglyphs can > definitely > change how we interpret things, and help us focus on how to proceed when > it > comes to prioritizing some science tasks." > > Binocular vision gives humans wearing 3D color glasses the ability to see > anaglyphs in three dimensions the same way they see in three dimensions > through > a View-Master viewer or a Victorian-era stereoscope. The same scene is > viewed in > two pictures taken from slightly different angles. Each eye has its own > slightly > different view, which the brain fuses together into a single picture with > depth. > > With the colored glasses, the red filter for the left eye sees only red in > the > picture, the cyan filter for the right eye sees only blue-green in the > picture, > and the brain correlates the images. The glasses work for viewing stereo > pictures in print or on TV, movie and computer screens. > > The Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter is managed by the Jet Propulsion > Laboratory, > Pasadena, Calif., for NASA's Science Mission Directorate, Washington. > Lockheed > Martin Space Systems of Denver built the spacecraft. The UA operates the > HiRISE > camera, built by Ball Aerospace and Technologies Corp. of Boulder, Colo. > > SCIENCE CONTACTS: > Alfred McEwen (520-621-4573; mcewen at pirl.lpl.arizona.edu) > Eric Eliason (520-626-0764; eeliason at pirl.lpl.arizona.edu) > > WEB LINKS: > HiRISE: http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu > MRO: http://www.nasa.gov/mro > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Mon Dec 8 18:56:14 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 15:56:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD : A few of Roman's metal labels In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <916500.48549.qm@web58405.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi folks! I ordered a few too many display labels, so I want to pass these along to someone who can use them. These are the metal labels that Roman sells (meteorite-labels.com), and everyone knows what they look like, so I didn't take any pictures of them. These are brand new. Juvinas - unbent Gibeon - unbent Udei Station - bent UNWA - unclassified NWA label with blank to write in a classification number. (bent) How does $2.00 each shipped sound? Or all 4 for $7 shipped. (CONUS) (Overseas shipping will be extra) (*** PAYPAL ONLY ***) Regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com Mon Dec 8 19:18:10 2008 From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com (STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 19:18:10 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Polarizers way cheap! Big ones! Message-ID: Hi list, All my images involve polarizers in one way or an other and over the last couple years I have had many inquiries of where to get polarizers cheap. I haven't had a solution other than scrounge them at yard sales etc. I just found an eBay seller that has 82mm PL for $8.50. This is way cheap for these big ones. I bought a couple and they are quality made in Japan with total extinction. The eBay # is 170282710765 Normal retail on a polarizer this size is usually several times this price. They are linier polarizers and not circular polarizers which is perfect for meteorite Xpol application. Check out my Micro Vision article in the Jan 2007 Meteorite Times Cross titled Polarized Light Hand Sample Examination. The link is http://www.meteorite.com/meteorite-gallery/Micro_Visions.htm This will give you an idea of what polarizers can do in meteorite examination and you don't necessarily need a microscope. With two 82mm filters you could make a thin section viewing set. These are big enough for a standard microscope slide to fit inside the filter holder. I'm not selling any thing, I just thought some of you might like to know. Also, while you are at Meteorite Times, check out this months MV on NWA 3151 Brachinite. It has three killer shots from Bernd Pauli in wide field cross polarized light. Tom Phillips **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 8 21:03:35 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 18:03:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] 9 holiday freebies Message-ID: <843145.97146.qm@web57804.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi list.Being sick all day has made me think all about the people who are less fortunate than me.This is the first time in my life I have come down with the flu.Well I decided that I would have a surprise holiday freebie givaway.I have 9 specimens to givaway.Some are pretty nice.The thing is,you have to wait to see what you get till it comes to you.I get to play santa.Also this is a one last only givaway.Just chime in and please give me your address.Happy holidays all. Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From epgrondine at yahoo.com Mon Dec 8 21:34:32 2008 From: epgrondine at yahoo.com (E.P. Grondine) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 18:34:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Hey folks Message-ID: <324039.66276.qm@web36908.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi everyone - Every day when I go to www.spacer.com for space news, I see these adds for Moondust pens containing real SIMULATED Moon dust. If any of you people saved your lunar cuttings, then it would strike me that this is wide open for you. Good luck and Good hunting, E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas PS - Probably a few years from now someone will have little flat panels with the Peekskill fall video, with a piece of Peekskill mounted next to it. From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 8 22:38:58 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 19:38:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] thats all folks Message-ID: <160232.85770.qm@web57808.mail.re3.yahoo.com> All 9 are gone.It is amazing when I have a freebie session how many emails I get.I have 40 just on the first one.Happy holidays all.All of them will go out on thursday. Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From rsvp321 at hotmail.com Tue Dec 9 03:41:31 2008 From: rsvp321 at hotmail.com (Pete Pete) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 03:41:31 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] HiRISE Camera Captures High-Resolution 3D Images of Mars In-Reply-To: <46A8EB4786E246CFABC9F122F077829D@ASUS> References: <200812082153.NAA28811@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> <46A8EB4786E246CFABC9F122F077829D@ASUS> Message-ID: Billions and billions of craters! http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/anaglyph/singula.php?ID=PSP_001586_1565 http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/anaglyph/singula.php?ID=PSP_001586_1565 > Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 18:32:54 -0500 > From: grf2 at verizon.net > To: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov; meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] HiRISE Camera Captures High-Resolution 3D Images of Mars > > These images are truly spectacular. My $11 3D glasses just proved their > worth. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ron Baalke" > To: "Meteorite Mailing List" > Sent: Monday, December 08, 2008 4:53 PM > Subject: [meteorite-list] HiRISE Camera Captures High-Resolution 3D Images > of Mars > > >> >> >> FROM: Lori Stiles (520-626-4402; lstiles at u.arizona.edu) >> >> HiRISE Camera Captures High-Resolution 3D Images of Mars >> December 8, 2008 >> >> The High Resolution Science Imaging Experiment, or HiRISE, team based at >> The >> University of Arizona today released 362 three-dimensional images of Mars >> taken >> by the HiRISE camera on NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter. >> >> Other Mars-orbiting cameras have taken 3D views of Mars, but the HiRISE >> camera >> - the most powerful camera ever to orbit another planet - can resolve >> features as small as one meter, or 40 inches, across. >> >> "It's really remarkable to see Martian rocks and features on the scale of >> a >> person in 3D," said Alfred McEwen of UA's Lunar and Planetary Laboratory, >> HiRISE principal investigator. "The level of detail is just much, much >> greater >> than anything previously seen from orbit." >> >> The 3D images, or anaglyphs, can be viewed on the HiRISE Web site >> (http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/anaglyph) with inexpensive color filter >> glasses >> commonly used for viewing 3D images and movies. The HiRISE Web site links >> to >> information on where to purchase and how to make 3D red-cyan filter >> glasses. >> Without 3D glasses, the Mars images appear out of register. >> >> (In Tucson, UA's Flandrau Science Center, 1601 E. University Blvd., and >> Starizona, 5757 N. Oracle Road, sell red-cyan filter glasses for $2 each.) >> >> Seen in HiRISE 3D, Mars becomes a collection of deep panoramic views that >> leap >> out from the computer screen. >> >> "You'd swear you could touch the terrain," HiRISE operations manager Eric >> Eliason said. >> >> Striking stereo views include: >> >> * Sixty-meter tall, or 200-foot-tall fractured mounds, probably composed >> of >> solidified lava, on the southern edge of Elysium Planitia. The fractured >> surface suggests that lava pushed the surface into domes, uplifting some >> sides >> along the same fracture higher than others. >> * Spectacular layers exposed on the floor about 2-and-a-half miles, or 4 >> kilometers, below the rim of Candor Chasma, which is a large canyon in the >> Valles Marineris system. The canyon may once have been filled to its rim >> by >> sedimentary layers of sand and dust-sized particles, but these have since >> eroded, leaving patterns of elongated hills and layered terrain that has >> been >> turned and folded in many angles and directions. >> * Groups of gullies at different elevations along the wall of an unnamed >> crater >> in Terra Cimmeria. The anaglyph image provides three-dimensional >> perspective on >> the depth of the gullies and the amount of material deposited below the >> gullies. >> Geological evidence suggests that the gullies may have formed by >> subsurface >> water, rather than by snow or ice melting on the surface. >> >> Other dramatic anaglyphs show a huge jumbled mass of rock that includes >> megabreccia at a central peak in Ritchey crater, ejecta-formed channels >> and >> mudflows at Hale crater, tightly folded rock layers lining the floor of >> Tithonium Chasm, "spiders" created by carbon dioxide venting through south >> polar layered deposits, and Martian glacier flows. >> >> Eliason and the team at HiROC, the High Resolution Imaging Operations >> Center on >> the UA campus, began processing stereo images in October. They automated >> some >> of the software used in processing HiRISE images so two images of a stereo >> pair >> could be fed into the software "pipeline" and correlated automatically. >> >> "The real advance here is making this process semi-automated so we can >> really >> crank through all these huge images," McEwen said. Producing anaglyphs >> from >> stereo pairs is otherwise a tedious, time-consuming effort. >> >> The HiRISE camera has so far taken 950 stereo image pairs. The camera >> features a >> half-meter, or 20-inch, diameter primary mirror and a focal plane >> mechanism that >> can acquire up to a 3.6 megapixel image in about 11 seconds. >> >> The anaglyphs are among 1,642 observations containing 3.6 terabytes of >> data and >> 148,000 image products that HiRISE released today to the Planetary Data >> System, >> or the PDS, the NASA mission data archive. >> >> Since HiRISE began the science phase of its mission in November 2006, the >> HiRISE >> team has released a total 867,430 image products, or 30.2 terabytes of >> data. >> That is by far the greatest volume of data a space experiment has >> delivered to >> the PDS, and well more than twice the data volume some HiRISE team members >> expected to get during the primary science phase. >> >> The HIRISE camera was designed to take images at high-convergence angles >> so >> researchers can calculate the thickness of surface features to within >> about 10 >> inches, or 25 centimeters. High-convergence angles used to get >> quantitative >> measurements aren't always best for making anaglyphs, McEwen said. >> >> In addition, if the two stereo images on two different orbits were taken >> far >> enough apart in time, the illumination or air opacity may have changed, or >> frost or dust devils may have appeared in one of the images, so paired >> images >> don't always match that well, he added. >> >> "Nevertheless, many of these stereo anaglyphs are very interesting and >> useful to >> us in understanding the topography," McEwen said. >> >> "There's a lot of science to be done by just looking at these directly and >> understanding what's up and what's down," he added. "Anaglyphs can >> definitely >> change how we interpret things, and help us focus on how to proceed when >> it >> comes to prioritizing some science tasks." >> >> Binocular vision gives humans wearing 3D color glasses the ability to see >> anaglyphs in three dimensions the same way they see in three dimensions >> through >> a View-Master viewer or a Victorian-era stereoscope. The same scene is >> viewed in >> two pictures taken from slightly different angles. Each eye has its own >> slightly >> different view, which the brain fuses together into a single picture with >> depth. >> >> With the colored glasses, the red filter for the left eye sees only red in >> the >> picture, the cyan filter for the right eye sees only blue-green in the >> picture, >> and the brain correlates the images. The glasses work for viewing stereo >> pictures in print or on TV, movie and computer screens. >> >> The Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter is managed by the Jet Propulsion >> Laboratory, >> Pasadena, Calif., for NASA's Science Mission Directorate, Washington. >> Lockheed >> Martin Space Systems of Denver built the spacecraft. The UA operates the >> HiRISE >> camera, built by Ball Aerospace and Technologies Corp. of Boulder, Colo. >> >> SCIENCE CONTACTS: >> Alfred McEwen (520-621-4573; mcewen at pirl.lpl.arizona.edu) >> Eric Eliason (520-626-0764; eeliason at pirl.lpl.arizona.edu) >> >> WEB LINKS: >> HiRISE: http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu >> MRO: http://www.nasa.gov/mro >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list _________________________________________________________________ From michael at spacerocksinc.com Tue Dec 9 06:01:42 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 03:01:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 9, 2008 Message-ID: <24457198.2400731228820502965.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_9_2008.html From mlblood at cox.net Tue Dec 9 06:54:18 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Tue, 09 Dec 2008 03:54:18 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] No wonder Bonhams was a bust In-Reply-To: <102323.8014.qm@web58401.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Mike and all, So far there are no minimum bids on ANY of the entries in The 10th annual Tucson Meteorite Auction. Thanks to Anne Black, there are now about 50 items and I Think another source is providing an additional 20 or so items. So, even though listings are behind schedule, all photos should be Up within the next 24 hrs or so and absentee bids are encouraged. I have decided to drop absentee bidding fees to the lowest level Possible, so, if you can't make it to the Show you can still bid on The items. "No minimum" means NO minimum - there will not be Any pulling of an item "because of lack of interest" or "no heat." You never know what bid might win and it doesn't cost you anything To place absentee bids that do not win the bid. Check it all out here: http://michaelbloodmeteorites.com/AuctionTucson09.html Best wishes, Michael on 12/8/08 7:26 AM, Michael Gilmer at michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com wrote: > "No, buyers' premium was 20% and California sales tax (without a resale > number) is 8%. > ...So add 28%" > Jason > > ---- > > There you have your answer, in part. Add 28% means subtract 50% of > the potential bidders, including me. I watched that auction, and > was scared away from bidding by the man in a black ski-mask and a > Bonham's jacket on. Call me naive, but tacking on an extra 30% after > the gavel (almost) is highway robbery. And I thought eBay fees were > ridiculous. I guess I'll never bid on a Bonham's auction. No offense > to Mike or any of the other sellers who got hosed, but you couldn't put > a gun to my head and make me give my stuff away like that and then > pay through the wazoo to do it. No thanks. > > Better luck next time, > > MikeG > > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mark.ford at ssl.gb.com Tue Dec 9 07:43:16 2008 From: mark.ford at ssl.gb.com (Mark Ford) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 12:43:16 -0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Hey folks In-Reply-To: <324039.66276.qm@web36908.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <324039.66276.qm@web36908.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <29A9DB45B84970458190D7D39BD42C49468240@gamma.ssl.atw> >>PS - Probably a few years from now someone will have little flat panels with the Peekskill fall video, with a piece of >>Peekskill mounted next to it. Already done! I used a stripped down key ring LCD photo viewer loaded with impact pics - fits inside a Riker mount. Only problem is they eat power and need recharging every few days but you could use a mains adaptor of course. Best Mark -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of E.P. Grondine Sent: 09 December 2008 02:35 To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Hey folks Hi everyone - Every day when I go to www.spacer.com for space news, I see these adds for Moondust pens containing real SIMULATED Moon dust. If any of you people saved your lunar cuttings, then it would strike me that this is wide open for you. Good luck and Good hunting, E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas PS - Probably a few years from now someone will have little flat panels with the Peekskill fall video, with a piece of Peekskill mounted next to it. ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify us. Email info at ssl.gb.com. You should not copy or use this email or attachment(s) for any purpose nor disclose their contents to any other person. GENERAL STATEMENT: Southern Scientific Ltd's computer systems may be monitored and communications carried on them recorded, to secure the effective operation of the system and for other lawful purposes. Registered address Rectory Farm Rd, Sompting, Lancing, W Sussex BN15 0DP. Company No 1800317 From claudiu at tanaselia.ro Tue Dec 9 08:09:02 2008 From: claudiu at tanaselia.ro (Claudiu Tanaselia) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 15:09:02 +0200 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 9, 2008 In-Reply-To: <24457198.2400731228820502965.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> References: <24457198.2400731228820502965.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: Hello, Do you happen to know who has this piece of meteorite now? Thank you, Claudiu. On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 1:01 PM, Michael Johnson wrote: > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_9_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Tue Dec 9 12:18:46 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 09 Dec 2008 17:18:46 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 9, 2008 Message-ID: Hi Michael, Matt, and List, http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_9_2008.html MICHEL-LEVY M.C. (1988) A new component of the Mez?-Madaras breccia: A microchondrule- and carbon-bearing L-related chondrite (Meteoritics 23-1, 1988, 45-48): Introduction (excerpt): The Mez?-Madaras L3 chondrite breccia is well known for its numerous inclusions (xenoliths, clasts, lumps, .) . as well as for some highly unequilibrated mineral associations which have been discovered in it: merrihueite* and "ferric" silicates, cristobalite or trydimite, olivines and pyroxenes. These are present in the host also called "normal Mez?-Madaras", in which many glass-rich chondrules are found. Most of the inclusions are of L4-5 types, similar to the host so that Binn calls them "cognate xenoliths". Some other inclusions are black . [In] the black inclusion studied here . carbon is present, but the bulk analysis does not allow us to classify it with the major carbonaceous chondrite groups. * Formula: (K,Na)2(Fe,Mg)5Si12O30 Conclusion (excerpt): Among the various components of the Mez?-Madaras chondrite, a carbon-bearing material, different from the known classes of carbonaceous chondrites, is dispersed through the whole stone and has been found in a large lump. Best wishes, Bernd To: michael at spacerocksinc.com meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Tue Dec 9 13:55:34 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 10:55:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] (AD) SIKOTE-ALINS W/HOLES Message-ID: <503257.45008.qm@web57805.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi list.I have 2 small sikote-alin with holes.$75 will take them home.Pics upon request. Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From raremeteorites at yahoo.com Tue Dec 9 15:52:13 2008 From: raremeteorites at yahoo.com (Adam Hupe) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 12:52:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Copy - A Form of Flattery? Message-ID: <689312.56832.qm@web30708.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Talking about copying other peoples' hard work. Too bad this display was not built to aerospace standards and looks tacky in comparison to the piece we comissioned for NWA 5000. http://www.nyrockman.com/pages/nwa2656.htm Nobody ever accused the Langs having good taste or professional ethics. Best Regards, Adam From mccartney at blackbearddata.com Tue Dec 9 16:47:06 2008 From: mccartney at blackbearddata.com (McCartney Taylor) Date: Tue, 09 Dec 2008 15:47:06 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Non Canadians must wait! Message-ID: <1228859226.13616.9.camel@Game-machine> Sonny and I are still getting many emails asking for Lone Rock material from non Canadians. We did follow the laws on this one, we turned it all over to our Canadian handler. Paperwork is being submitted very soon. Please wait 3-6 months. From saharagems at yahoo.com Tue Dec 9 16:50:44 2008 From: saharagems at yahoo.com (Stalder Thomas) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 13:50:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Aluminium 1 cm scale cubes and Desert Glass Message-ID: <608931.79702.qm@web44913.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Dear List, I have some auctions running on Ebay ending coming Saturday. All still at 99 cents. Next to some very nice GEM quality LDG pieces (two rare ones with natural holes) I'm offering 3 handmade Aluminium scale cubes (Buy it now USD 38.-- / shipping worldwide for free). You may like to upgrade yours from plastic to aluminium. Please take a look if interested. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&item=220327169610 Thanks. Thomas at saharagems From scyphocrinites at yahoo.com Tue Dec 9 17:09:22 2008 From: scyphocrinites at yahoo.com (Malek Youssef) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 14:09:22 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad : Cut and polished Chnondrites Message-ID: <1282.93758.qm@web53311.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi List I have Handly cut and polished Chondrites available : http://www.geocities.com/fourmanmine30/mt.htm M.Youssef From yellowengine at earthlink.net Tue Dec 9 17:21:24 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 16:21:24 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] Canadian Material for Americans has to wait Message-ID: <13520720.1228861285053.JavaMail.root@elwamui-sweet.atl.sa.earthlink.net> McCartney and Sonny.. I am sorry to hear that some people either can't, or simply choose not to follow simple orders. And yes, they do have laws... Mr. Garrison. Ryan "Sonny and I are still getting many emails asking for Lone Rock material from non Canadians. We did follow the laws on this one, we turned it all over to our Canadian handler. Paperwork is being submitted very soon. Please wait 3-6 months." From tett at rogers.com Tue Dec 9 18:29:40 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 18:29:40 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Non Canadians must wait! References: <1228859226.13616.9.camel@Game-machine> Message-ID: <852E0DEC26CD43028848CE3065B53896@tett1> Proud to be Canadian! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWDXE9Pbjic And new stones available to bout! You can just smell them heh! Cheers, tett ----- Original Message ----- From: "McCartney Taylor" To: Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 4:47 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Non Canadians must wait! > Sonny and I are still getting many emails asking for Lone Rock material > from non Canadians. > > We did follow the laws on this one, we turned it all over to our > Canadian handler. Paperwork is being submitted very soon. > > Please wait 3-6 months. > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com Tue Dec 9 23:20:51 2008 From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com (STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 23:20:51 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Martin Horejsi's The Accretion Desk Souslovo, Russia Message-ID: Every one who has not checked out Martin's article in December Meteorite Times is missing out on a way cool article. I had never heard the term "Tool Box Meteorite". It that a Martin original??? Anyway, It's got it all, great photos, cool story and a wonderful meteorite. Thanks Martin! http://www.meteorite-times.com/meteorite_frame.htm Tom Phillips **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From illaenus at wp.pl Wed Dec 10 05:16:54 2008 From: illaenus at wp.pl (Tomasz Jakubowski) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 11:16:54 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD Berduc Message-ID: <493f9716552701.85357978@wp.pl> Hello! I hale nice Berduc for sale. Specimen have 108.8 grams, 90% fusion crust, oriented (flow lines, rollover lips). http://picasaweb.google.pl/illaenus/Berduc1088GOriented# I have more meteorites for sale on my Picassa web page. Please write to illaenus at gmail.com Kind Regards Tomasz Jakubowski IMCA #2321 -- Free Tibet ---------------------------------------------------- Co to by? za GOOOOOOOOOL! Cykn??e? tak? akcj?? Wrzu? foty na http://klik.wp.pl/?adr=http%3A%2F%2Fpikeo.pl&sid=578 From michael at spacerocksinc.com Wed Dec 10 06:54:43 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 03:54:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 10, 2008 Message-ID: <4757109.2524261228910083621.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_10_2008.html From meteoriteshow at free.fr Wed Dec 10 07:49:56 2008 From: meteoriteshow at free.fr (meteoriteshow at free.fr) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 13:49:56 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - ebay Auctions ending on Saturday Message-ID: <1228913396.493fbaf44afbb@imp.free.fr> Dear All, Christmas is coming soon and the best way to make sure that you will have at least on gift that you will really enjoy is to get it yourself!!! (LOL!) Then why not a meteorite???... This Saturday our current auctions will end and you can see the meteorites that are offered at: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZmeteoriteshow You will then see: 1- CHERGACH H5 - 45.7g frag. - WITNESSED FALL! http://cgi.ebay.fr/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&item=330291034013 2- HaH299 H6 - 2.2g endpiece, still at starting price... http://cgi.ebay.fr/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&item=330291034054 3- NWA XXX - 1.8g Partslice - HOWARDITE: I just got some first inofrmation about its classification, which confirmed to be a Howardite, and Jean-Alix Barrat who is doing it and has been working on many other howardites told me that it does not seem to be paired to any other howardite that he had the chance to analyse... Some further results are still pending but he should get them soon and then submit it to the Nom. Com. http://cgi.ebay.fr/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&item=330291034091 4- ORIENTED NWA OC - FUSION CRUST - 62.4g indiv (unclassified) http://cgi.ebay.fr/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&item=330291034156 5- SAH 02500 L3 - 520g fragment http://cgi.ebay.fr/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&item=330291034180 6- SAH 02501 EUC - 0.6g partslice, still at starting price... http://cgi.ebay.fr/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&item=330291034231 7- ZAG H3-6 - 12.4g frag. - WITNESSED FALL!, still at starting price... http://cgi.ebay.fr/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&item=330291034261 Thanks for looking and good luck!!! Kind regards Frederic Beroud www.meteoriteshow.com IMCA #2491 From mlblood at cox.net Wed Dec 10 08:05:29 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 05:05:29 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] L3 ad In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi all, A remarkable L3 meteorite came out of the Sahara recently. At Just under 2Kg TKW all but the 3 full slices below has gone into Institutions and private collections in Europe. See all photos at: http://cards.webshots.com/ecard/pickup/144799871kAsfjt NWA 5477 Sahara Morocco 2008 TKW: 1,960g Number of pieces: 2 Class: L3 Shock Stage: S4 Weathering Grade: W1 Fa mol%: 1.5-24.5 Fs mol%: 1.1-35.1 Type specimen: 22g At MNB Berlin. This is CHONDRAL CITY - it doesn't get any better than this. Nothing but chondrules! Nice, hard material - each are thinly and nicely parallel cut full slices with dark fusion crust all around the outside. This is one of those rare A+++++ quality specimens you will enjoy permanently, as it just Doesn't get any better than this. For list members, $15/g - PayPal preferred, but not required. First 3 to contact take them. (please list 1st, 2nd and 3rd choice - provide address for full quote (shipping is actual cost - Priority Mail in the US, Registered Outside the US). Anyone not able to get to the link to see these killer photos, let me know and I will email you attached jpgs. Absolutely killer stuff: 24.940g Full Slice, 74 x 43 x 2.9 mm = $374- 23.887g Full Slice, 74 x 40 x 2.8 mm = $358- 14.109g Full Slice, 68 x 46 x 2.5 mm = $211- See all photos at: http://cards.webshots.com/ecard/pickup/144799871kAsfjt Best wishes, Michael From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Wed Dec 10 08:15:55 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 05:15:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] (AD) NWA 4024 Message-ID: <501731.17748.qm@web57802.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi list.It seems other people like to place more than 1 ad per week,but I apoligize.I should of had this in my sa email.I have a 2.5 gram endcut of nwa 4024 for sale.tkw is only 500 grams and is classified as an winonaite.$125 will take it home.For further info please visit mike farmers website for full details. Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From grf2 at verizon.net Wed Dec 10 11:41:51 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 11:41:51 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Is this a fair price and reputable source for Trinitite? Message-ID: <21B6131D02FA40F5BE4500E3E928ED0B@ASUS> http://www.unitednuclear.com/trinititenew.htm Jerry Flaherty From freequarks at gmail.com Wed Dec 10 11:45:51 2008 From: freequarks at gmail.com (Dark Matter) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 09:45:51 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Martin Horejsi's The Accretion Desk Souslovo, Russia In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <822da19a0812100845y2eee5871r5e8994f777978061@mail.gmail.com> Hi Tom, Thanks for reading it. Normally I pass on recent finds for my collection, but the shape and story of Souslovo was too good to skip. I made up the term "Toolbox Meteorite" (not to be confused with NASA's Toolkit "Meteorite" that should be arriving any time now). I needed a name for meteorites that are used as tools, whether doorstops, paperweights, or wheelchocks prior to entering our collection. However, I have seen a few continue on as tools even after entered into a meteorite collection catalog, usually in the role of a doorstop. Tom, I wish I still lived close to you. I think you would have a blast scoping Souslovo with all its chondritic oddities. Best, Martin On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 9:20 PM, wrote: > Every one who has not checked out Martin's article in December Meteorite > Times is missing out on a way cool article. I had never heard the term "Tool > Box Meteorite". It that a Martin original??? > > Anyway, It's got it all, great photos, cool story and a wonderful > meteorite. Thanks Martin! > > http://www.meteorite-times.com/meteorite_frame.htm > > Tom Phillips > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From fuzzfoot at comcast.net Wed Dec 10 12:08:34 2008 From: fuzzfoot at comcast.net (Mike Bandli) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 17:08:34 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite In-Reply-To: <822da19a0812100845y2eee5871r5e8994f777978061@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1870496479.2562821228928914923.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Martin and All, I never considered the 'Toolbox' sub-genre of meteorites. Very well done and interesting! Though not a historical one, one of my favorite 'Toolbox' meteorites is Mike Jensen's Sikhote Alin beer bottle opener. I always search the bins in Tucson for one, but I think Mike Jensen holds the only one in existence. It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: "Excuse me, Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you." Best, Mike Bandli ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dark Matter" To: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 8:45:51 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Martin Horejsi's The Accretion Desk Souslovo, Russia Hi Tom, Thanks for reading it. Normally I pass on recent finds for my collection, but the shape and story of Souslovo was too good to skip. I made up the term "Toolbox Meteorite" (not to be confused with NASA's Toolkit "Meteorite" that should be arriving any time now). I needed a name for meteorites that are used as tools, whether doorstops, paperweights, or wheelchocks prior to entering our collection. However, I have seen a few continue on as tools even after entered into a meteorite collection catalog, usually in the role of a doorstop. Tom, I wish I still lived close to you. I think you would have a blast scoping Souslovo with all its chondritic oddities. Best, Martin On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 9:20 PM, wrote: > Every one who has not checked out Martin's article in December Meteorite > Times is missing out on a way cool article. I had never heard the term "Tool > Box Meteorite". It that a Martin original??? > > Anyway, It's got it all, great photos, cool story and a wonderful > meteorite. Thanks Martin! > > http://www.meteorite-times.com/meteorite_frame.htm > > Tom Phillips > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com Wed Dec 10 12:17:51 2008 From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com (STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 12:17:51 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Martin Horejsi's The Accretion Desk Souslovo, Russia Message-ID: OK meteorite fans, I have seen a list of "Hammer Stones" , how about "Toolbox meteorites"? I'll start with the easiest one, The Tucson Ring which was used as an anvil. Years from now I hope people remember it was Martin who came up with the term and knowing Martin, it won't be long before he has amassed a killer Toolbox meteorite collection. Also, yes Martin, I would have a blast with the Souslovo but your slice is to big for me to get on the polish equipment. Tom Phillips In a message dated 12/10/2008 9:46:26 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, freequarks at gmail.com writes: Hi Tom, Thanks for reading it. Normally I pass on recent finds for my collection, but the shape and story of Souslovo was too good to skip. I made up the term "Toolbox Meteorite" (not to be confused with NASA's Toolkit "Meteorite" that should be arriving any time now). I needed a name for meteorites that are used as tools, whether doorstops, paperweights, or wheelchocks prior to entering our collection. However, I have seen a few continue on as tools even after entered into a meteorite collection catalog, usually in the role of a doorstop. Tom, I wish I still lived close to you. I think you would have a blast scoping Souslovo with all its chondritic oddities. Best, Martin On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 9:20 PM, wrote: > Every one who has not checked out Martin's article in December Meteorite > Times is missing out on a way cool article. I had never heard the term "Tool > Box Meteorite". It that a Martin original??? > > Anyway, It's got it all, great photos, cool story and a wonderful > meteorite. Thanks Martin! > > http://www.meteorite-times.com/meteorite_frame.htm > > Tom Phillips > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From bolidechaser at yahoo.com Wed Dec 10 12:20:13 2008 From: bolidechaser at yahoo.com (Robert Verish) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 09:20:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Dear Santa - NWA 400 Message-ID: <34072.89519.qm@web51703.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Looking for a specimen of NWA 400 (yes, NWA Four Hundred - that's not a typo). Wondering if anyone has this in their collection and would be willing to sell some or make a trade. Any size or shape would do. Would need to know provenance, too, meaning - which collection, dealer, importer, or vendor was it obtained. No, just saying that it came from Santa won't suffice. ;-) Bob V . From pshugar at clearwire.net Wed Dec 10 13:15:49 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 12:15:49 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Is this a fair price and reputable source forTrinitite? References: <21B6131D02FA40F5BE4500E3E928ED0B@ASUS> Message-ID: <002301c95af3$5a5d8180$d0e11960@laptop> Althou the price is on the high side, (about 30% too high) you need to remember that they need to pay for that $50,000 mass spectrometer----heehee. Pete From Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr Wed Dec 10 14:21:20 2008 From: Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr (Zelimir Gabelica) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 20:21:20 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite In-Reply-To: <1870496479.2562821228928914923.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emery ville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <822da19a0812100845y2eee5871r5e8994f777978061@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20081210200944.02b1d568@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Mike, if you are anxious to open more Coors for your Miss-friends, I can show you a 196 g complete NWA Howardite as bottle-opener. So far unclassified, but a cut window certifies its most probable howardite satus, while the opposite crusted side shows some "knob" that could readily be used to extract bottle seals. I am ready to send a couple of pics if someone can host them on a web site. Zelimir A 17:08 10/12/2008 +0000, Mike Bandli a ?crit : >Martin and All, > >I never considered the 'Toolbox' sub-genre of meteorites. Very well done >and interesting! > >Though not a historical one, one of my favorite 'Toolbox' meteorites is >Mike Jensen's Sikhote Alin beer bottle opener. I always search the bins in >Tucson for one, but I think Mike Jensen holds the only one in existence. >It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: "Excuse me, >Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you." > >Best, > >Mike Bandli Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From freequarks at gmail.com Wed Dec 10 14:33:00 2008 From: freequarks at gmail.com (Dark Matter) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 12:33:00 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite In-Reply-To: <1870496479.2562821228928914923.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <822da19a0812100845y2eee5871r5e8994f777978061@mail.gmail.com> <1870496479.2562821228928914923.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <822da19a0812101133w4105bb32p582769a52beb7ead@mail.gmail.com> Hi Mike, I'd love to see a pic of Mike's beer bottle opener. Now you've got me curious. I have some SA individuals around here that are about the right size. I'm going to grab a six-pack and see if I can find an opener. I remember showing this meteorite ( http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/March/s-a2b.jpg ) to a friend at the Tucson Show and she said something like, "Oh, that would make a nice hook. It could go on your wall and you could hang your coat on it." I guess that would make it a toolbox meteorite as well (;- ) -Martin On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 10:08 AM, Mike Bandli wrote: > Martin and All, > > I never considered the 'Toolbox' sub-genre of meteorites. Very well done and interesting! > > Though not a historical one, one of my favorite 'Toolbox' meteorites is Mike Jensen's Sikhote Alin beer bottle opener. I always search the bins in Tucson for one, but I think Mike Jensen holds the only one in existence. It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: "Excuse me, Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you." > > Best, > > Mike Bandli > From fuzzfoot at comcast.net Wed Dec 10 14:56:58 2008 From: fuzzfoot at comcast.net (Mike Bandli) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 19:56:58 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite In-Reply-To: <822da19a0812101133w4105bb32p582769a52beb7ead@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <129254617.2595031228939018316.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Re: Mike Jensen's Bottle Opener It's gone from his site, but you can still see it via the Way Back Machine here (scroll all the way to the bottom of the page): http://web.archive.org/web/20070728160656/jensenmeteorites.com/Sikhote.htm Cheers, Mike Bandli ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dark Matter" To: "Mike Bandli" Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 11:33:00 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite Hi Mike, I'd love to see a pic of Mike's beer bottle opener. Now you've got me curious. I have some SA individuals around here that are about the right size. I'm going to grab a six-pack and see if I can find an opener. I remember showing this meteorite ( http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/March/s-a2b.jpg ) to a friend at the Tucson Show and she said something like, "Oh, that would make a nice hook. It could go on your wall and you could hang your coat on it." I guess that would make it a toolbox meteorite as well (;- ) -Martin On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 10:08 AM, Mike Bandli wrote: > Martin and All, > > I never considered the 'Toolbox' sub-genre of meteorites. Very well done and interesting! > > Though not a historical one, one of my favorite 'Toolbox' meteorites is Mike Jensen's Sikhote Alin beer bottle opener. I always search the bins in Tucson for one, but I think Mike Jensen holds the only one in existence. It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: "Excuse me, Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you." > > Best, > > Mike Bandli > From yellowengine at earthlink.net Wed Dec 10 15:15:34 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 14:15:34 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Collection Pieces - Photos Message-ID: <29972938.1228940135351.JavaMail.root@elwamui-muscovy.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Hello Again, I have received several requests for photos, so I decided to post them for everyone to view at leisure. http://outdoors.webshots.com/album/569165160RMTnOx If anyone needs additional photos or an answer to a question regarding these pieces, just let me know! Cheers, Ryan Pawelski -----Forwarded Message----- >From: RJP >Sent: Dec 8, 2008 1:50 PM >To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >Subject: AD: Collection Pieces > >Good Afternoon, > >I have a few pieces from my collection that I would like to sell. Very little to zero profit on these. > > >Photos upon request: > >Bremham (Pal) - 195g "palm size" full slice (thin). $780 > >Gibeon - 460g etched full slice. $575 > >Millbillillie - 212g complete stone, "a grade". $2,120 > > >I will cover domestic postage, and I do accept Paypal for those who prefer to go that route instead. > > >Cheers, > >Ryan Pawelski > > > > > > > From Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr Wed Dec 10 15:17:11 2008 From: Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr (Zelimir Gabelica) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 21:17:11 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite In-Reply-To: <149003279.2595661228939229800.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryv ille.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <5.0.2.1.2.20081210200944.02b1d568@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20081210211258.029e4d48@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Hi MIke, 2 pics just sent to Anne Black, who was the first to offer her web site. Keep tuned. best, Zelimir NB: bottle-opener not as nice as yours (S-A is the probably the "king" for "toolboxes") but still suggestive, even though the pic does show the "knob" under its best profile... A 20:00 10/12/2008 +0000, Mike Bandli a ?crit : >Hello Zelimir, > >Please send some photos! I would love to see! > >Best, > >Mike Bandli > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Zelimir Gabelica" >To: "Mike Bandli" , meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >Cc: "Zelimir Gabelica" >Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 11:21:20 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific >Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite > >Mike, if you are anxious to open more Coors for your Miss-friends, I can >show you a 196 g complete NWA Howardite as bottle-opener. So far >unclassified, but a cut window certifies its most probable howardite satus, >while the opposite crusted side shows some "knob" that could readily be >used to extract bottle seals. > >I am ready to send a couple of pics if someone can host them on a web site. > >Zelimir > > >A 17:08 10/12/2008 +0000, Mike Bandli a ??crit : > >Martin and All, > > > >I never considered the 'Toolbox' sub-genre of meteorites. Very well done > >and interesting! > > > >Though not a historical one, one of my favorite 'Toolbox' meteorites is > >Mike Jensen's Sikhote Alin beer bottle opener. I always search the bins in > >Tucson for one, but I think Mike Jensen holds the only one in existence. > >It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: "Excuse me, > >Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you." > > > >Best, > > > >Mike Bandli > >Prof. Zelimir Gabelica >Universit?? de Haute Alsace >ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, >3, Rue A. Werner, >F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France >Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 >Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From azizhabibi at yahoo.com Wed Dec 10 15:28:34 2008 From: azizhabibi at yahoo.com (habibi abdelaziz) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 12:28:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] photo of the new R3 Message-ID: <621299.54401.qm@web62005.mail.re1.yahoo.com> hi all ?i hope everyone is enjoying holidays? , we have holidays over here in nwa, well i was?amazed by the beauty of the slice that Micheal blood showed just now , this l3. and i want to show you this new R 3? ????its on hold? but give a look , just nice; enjoy. ? http://www.flickr.com/photos/azizhabibi/ all the best aziz habibi ? habibi aziz box 70 erfoud 52200 morroco phone. 21235576145 fax.21235576170 From almitt at kconline.com Wed Dec 10 15:39:04 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 15:39:04 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite In-Reply-To: <1870496479.2562821228928914923.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <1870496479.2562821228928914923.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <3DB772DAAB364A03BCCD470179005962@StarmanPC> Hi Mike and all, Couldn't let this one pass :-) The original beer bottle opening meteorite is owned by Blaine Reed (unless he sold it to Mike Jenson which I doubt). Think it is a Canyon Diablo (predates the Sikhote-Alin's arriving on the collectors market by many years). Blaine has opened a few thousand (or is that ten thousand) bottles of beer with that specimen. He's been offered a good bit of change many times over the value of his specimen but claims it's a pride thing or something like that. Best! --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Bandli" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 12:08 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite > Martin and All, > > I never considered the 'Toolbox' sub-genre of meteorites. Very well done > and interesting! > > Though not a historical one, one of my favorite 'Toolbox' meteorites is > Mike Jensen's Sikhote Alin beer bottle opener. I always search the bins in > Tucson for one, but I think Mike Jensen holds the only one in existence. > It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: "Excuse me, > Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you." > > Best, > > Mike Bandli From almitt at kconline.com Wed Dec 10 15:42:23 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 15:42:23 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Martin Horejsi's The Accretion Desk Souslovo, Russia In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8BDB24AB032446EF9DE228481291E72A@StarmanPC> Greetings all, The Beaver Meteorite was used to prop open a door at a local jail house for 40 some years. Cost for the specimen was finding another stone that cold be use to prop same door open which the buyer found in the form of a chunk of cement because rocks in the area were non-existent. Best! --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 12:17 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Martin Horejsi's The Accretion Desk Souslovo,Russia > OK meteorite fans, I have seen a list of "Hammer Stones" , how about > "Toolbox meteorites"? I'll start with the easiest one, The Tucson Ring > which was > used as an anvil. > > Years from now I hope people remember it was Martin who came up with the > term and knowing Martin, it won't be long before he has amassed a killer > Toolbox > meteorite collection. > > > Also, yes Martin, I would have a blast with the Souslovo but your slice > is > to big for me to get on the polish equipment. > > Tom Phillips > > In a message dated 12/10/2008 9:46:26 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, > freequarks at gmail.com writes: > Hi Tom, > > Thanks for reading it. Normally I pass on recent finds for my > collection, but the shape and story of Souslovo was too good to skip. > > I made up the term "Toolbox Meteorite" (not to be confused with NASA's > Toolkit "Meteorite" that should be arriving any time now). I needed a > name for meteorites that are used as tools, whether doorstops, > paperweights, or wheelchocks prior to entering our collection. > However, I have seen a few continue on as tools even after entered > into a meteorite collection catalog, usually in the role of a > doorstop. > > Tom, I wish I still lived close to you. I think you would have a blast > scoping Souslovo with all its chondritic oddities. > > Best, > > Martin > > > > On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 9:20 PM, wrote: >> Every one who has not checked out Martin's article in December >> Meteorite >> Times is missing out on a way cool article. I had never heard the term > "Tool >> Box Meteorite". It that a Martin original??? >> >> Anyway, It's got it all, great photos, cool story and a wonderful >> meteorite. Thanks Martin! >> >> http://www.meteorite-times.com/meteorite_frame.htm >> >> Tom Phillips >> >> **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and >> favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >> > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From fcressy at prodigy.net Wed Dec 10 15:54:20 2008 From: fcressy at prodigy.net (Frank Cressy) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 12:54:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite In-Reply-To: <129254617.2595031228939018316.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <181440.13843.qm@web80201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hello all, Nininger found several toolbox meteorites such as Arispe (anvil), Maimi ("deadman" on a fence), Toluca (hammer stones to make morters) etc. He hit the jackpot though when he searched the Plainview strewn field. He found a stone used to keep the chicken coop door closed, stones used as weights in a pork barrel, and used as a weight on a milk crock cover. The best Plainview tool, in my opinion, was a stone used to get a bull's attention. Of this, Nininger wrote, " he went to the cow shed and from a crossbeam he took a small fist-sized meteorite." The farmer said, "I've been keeping this around to take after my bull with...My bull has a pretty mean disposition but when he goes on a rampage I only need to hit him once with this, somewhere around the head, and he quites right down." Sounds like this was a very useful tool! LaPaz also notes a couple of meteorite tools. The 1,375-pound La Caile, France, meteorite was used by the people of the village for two centuries as a seat in front of their church. LaPaz mentions the Rafruti, Switzerland iron meteorite, which appears to be a seasonal tool. The finder used it as a footwarmer, apparently heating it nightly before putting in his bed. Of course, there's also Blackwell, used for years as a doorstop before being liberated. I believe Martin has a piece of this in his toolbox collection. Enjoy, Frank --- On Wed, 12/10/08, Mike Bandli wrote: From: Mike Bandli Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite To: "Dark Matter" Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Date: Wednesday, December 10, 2008, 11:56 AM Re: Mike Jensen's Bottle Opener It's gone from his site, but you can still see it via the Way Back Machine here (scroll all the way to the bottom of the page): http://web.archive.org/web/20070728160656/jensenmeteorites.com/Sikhote.htm Cheers, Mike Bandli ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dark Matter" To: "Mike Bandli" Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 11:33:00 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite Hi Mike, I'd love to see a pic of Mike's beer bottle opener. Now you've got me curious. I have some SA individuals around here that are about the right size. I'm going to grab a six-pack and see if I can find an opener. I remember showing this meteorite ( http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/March/s-a2b.jpg ) to a friend at the Tucson Show and she said something like, "Oh, that would make a nice hook. It could go on your wall and you could hang your coat on it." I guess that would make it a toolbox meteorite as well (;- ) -Martin On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 10:08 AM, Mike Bandli wrote: > Martin and All, > > I never considered the 'Toolbox' sub-genre of meteorites. Very well done and interesting! > > Though not a historical one, one of my favorite 'Toolbox' meteorites is Mike Jensen's Sikhote Alin beer bottle opener. I always search the bins in Tucson for one, but I think Mike Jensen holds the only one in existence. It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: "Excuse me, Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you." > > Best, > > Mike Bandli > ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Wed Dec 10 15:50:34 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 10 Dec 2008 20:50:34 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Souslovo, Beaver, Brenham, Plainview, etc. Message-ID: Hi All, AL wrote: "The Beaver Meteorite was used to prop open a door at a local jail house for 40 some years. Cost for the specimen was finding another stone that cold be use to prop same door open which the buyer found in the form of a chunk of cement because rocks in the area were non-existent." PECK ELLIS (1979) The Fate of a Kansas Meteorite Crater (Sky & Telescope, August 1979, pp. 126-128): The rich farmland of Kiowa County, Kansas, is devoid of normal stones, but lots of odd, heavy ones dotted it when homesteaders arrived there in the 1870's. Some of these strange looking rocks were used to hold down rain-barrel covers, to anchor dugout roofs, or to plug fence holes. The first person to recognize these as meteorites was Eliza Kimberly, who moved to a farm there in 1885 with her new husband, Frank. When she was a girl, her schoolteacher had shown her class a meteorite that had fallen at Estherville, Iowa. Best, Bernd From freequarks at gmail.com Wed Dec 10 16:03:49 2008 From: freequarks at gmail.com (Dark Matter) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 14:03:49 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite In-Reply-To: <181440.13843.qm@web80201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <129254617.2595031228939018316.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <181440.13843.qm@web80201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <822da19a0812101303h450e85f2k5152768231e7f9e5@mail.gmail.com> Bravo Frank! Your list and quotes are wonderful. I do indeed have Blackwell. It appeared in my November 2005 Accretion Desk article. Here is part of the text from its caption: "Blackwell fell in 1906, and only a single 2.38kg stone was recovered. Blackwell, in classic meteorite stereotyping served as a doorstop for more than quarter century before being elevated to its proper stature. Further adding to the US history of this slice is fact it passed through the famous J. M. DuPont Meteorite Collection on its way to me. Even more, I believe the painted specimen number gracing the thumbprinted edge of crust on this slice is from the American Museum of Natural History in New York City. I did not see Blackwell referenced in the AMNH meteorite collection catalog, but the one I was reading was the C. A. Reed 1935 edition. Then I realized that at the time of publication, the Blackwell meteorite was still back in Oklahoma holding open a door." And here is a link to its pic: http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/November/blackwell.jpg Thanks, Martin On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 1:54 PM, Frank Cressy wrote: > Hello all, > > Nininger found several toolbox meteorites such as Arispe (anvil), Maimi ("deadman" on a fence), Toluca (hammer stones to make morters) etc. > > He hit the jackpot though when he searched the Plainview strewn field. He found a stone used to keep the chicken coop door closed, stones used as weights in a pork barrel, and used as a weight on a milk crock cover. The best Plainview tool, in my opinion, was a stone used to get a bull's attention. Of this, Nininger wrote, " he went to the cow shed and from a crossbeam he took a small fist-sized meteorite." The farmer said, "I've been keeping this around to take after my bull with...My bull has a pretty mean disposition but when he goes on a rampage I only need to hit him once with this, somewhere around the head, and he quites right down." > > Sounds like this was a very useful tool! > > LaPaz also notes a couple of meteorite tools. The 1,375-pound La Caile, France, meteorite was used by the people of the village for two centuries as a seat in front of their church. LaPaz mentions the Rafruti, Switzerland iron meteorite, which appears to be a seasonal tool. The finder used it as a footwarmer, apparently heating it nightly before putting in his bed. > > Of course, there's also Blackwell, used for years as a doorstop before being liberated. I believe Martin has a piece of this in his toolbox collection. > > Enjoy, > > Frank > > --- On Wed, 12/10/08, Mike Bandli wrote: > > From: Mike Bandli > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite > To: "Dark Matter" > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Wednesday, December 10, 2008, 11:56 AM > > Re: Mike Jensen's Bottle Opener > > It's gone from his site, but you can still see it via the Way Back Machine > here (scroll all the way to the bottom of the page): > > http://web.archive.org/web/20070728160656/jensenmeteorites.com/Sikhote.htm > > Cheers, > > Mike Bandli > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dark Matter" > To: "Mike Bandli" > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 11:33:00 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite > > Hi Mike, > > I'd love to see a pic of Mike's beer bottle opener. Now you've got > me > curious. I have some SA individuals around here that are about the > right size. I'm going to grab a six-pack and see if I can find an > opener. > > I remember showing this meteorite ( > http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/March/s-a2b.jpg ) to a > friend at the Tucson Show and she said something like, "Oh, that would > make a nice hook. It could go on your wall and you could hang your > coat on it." I guess that would make it a toolbox meteorite as well > (;- ) > > -Martin > > On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 10:08 AM, Mike Bandli > wrote: >> Martin and All, >> >> I never considered the 'Toolbox' sub-genre of meteorites. Very > well done and interesting! >> >> Though not a historical one, one of my favorite 'Toolbox' > meteorites is Mike Jensen's Sikhote Alin beer bottle opener. I always search > the bins in Tucson for one, but I think Mike Jensen holds the only one in > existence. It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: > "Excuse me, Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for > you." >> >> Best, >> >> Mike Bandli >> > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From bobe5531 at comcast.net Wed Dec 10 16:06:36 2008 From: bobe5531 at comcast.net (Bob Evans) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 15:06:36 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig, Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas Message-ID: <000701c95b0b$30cd0440$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Well, After taking off several months of Dealing meteorites, I can stay away no longer. I have some very nice offerings available over the next few weeks. I was fortunate enough to purchase another small collection of meteorites with some very unique meteorites ( some I never heard of ). Most of these have Monnig and AML Cards accompanying the specimens. So you will not need to ask me where or who I got them from ( you will NOT get an answer ) I keep my methods of acquisitions and contacts confidential. Here is a partial list : Mckinney Texas La Lande N.M. Plainview Ness Co. Kansas Sandia Mountains N.M. Ladder Creek Adrian Texas Romero Texas Morland Kansas Noreatur Kansas Some of these meteorites have an appointment with my saw. I am offering these meteorites to a preferred list of collectors. If you are interested in any of these please email me letting me know which ones that you are interested in. I will be offering these to you first. A copy of each corresponding collection card will be included with each purchase. It will take me a couple of weeks to get the meteorites processed but I wanted to give you a heads up. I have also just received two new beautiful type 3 chondrites. I got a great deal on these and I will be selling them far less than $15 / gram They will be submitted for classification. Also be on the lookout for a large slice of Zagami and more that enough Juvinas to put a huge smile on your face. Both with impeccable provence ( that is the politically correct way to say it, right ?) BE From Impactika at aol.com Wed Dec 10 16:31:27 2008 From: Impactika at aol.com (Impactika at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 16:31:27 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Zelimir's Bottle Opener Message-ID: Hello, and here it is: http://www.impactika.com/zelimir.htm Enjoy. Anne M. Black http://www.impactika.com/ IMPACTIKA at aol.com Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. http://www.imca.cc/ **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From yellowengine at earthlink.net Wed Dec 10 16:43:29 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 15:43:29 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig, Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas Message-ID: <12717714.1228945409727.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net> "..Both with impeccable provence (that is the politically correct way to say it, right ?)" Nah. I think it just means that Southern France is absolutely perfect. Espeially in the spring time! From epgrondine at yahoo.com Wed Dec 10 17:09:12 2008 From: epgrondine at yahoo.com (E.P. Grondine) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 14:09:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Moon dust pens Message-ID: <545950.38888.qm@web36901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi everyone - Here's what I was talking about: http://www.spacedaily.com/moondustpen-competition.html real "simulated" Moon dust. Now if any of you saved your lunar cuttings, it looks like an opportunity for you. For that matter, spacer.com might make a good place to sell meteorites to an entirely new set of collectors Good Luck, and Good Hunting, E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Wed Dec 10 17:20:07 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 10 Dec 2008 22:20:07 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite - Toluca Message-ID: Frank wrote: "Nininger found several toolbox meteorites such as...Toluca ..." Meteorites of Xiquipilco, Mexico - by Dr. H.H. Nininger, Director, American Meteorite Museum, Winslow, Ariz., Photos by Nininger. Reprint from Earth Science Digest, November, 1952, Vol. 6, No. 3. Pages 19 to 30: Alzate Ramirez, writing in 1831, stated that from time immemorial the haciendas of Xiquipilco and vicinity had depended entirely on "native iron" found by the Xiquipilco Indians for all their tools and implements. Says Rarmirez, "About the year 1776 I went to Xiquipilco to see with my own eyes the famed native iron. I found two smiths established in the town who worked the native iron, and in my sight they forged it and worked it into the shape demanded of them." Best, Bernd From tina-john at cox.net Wed Dec 10 17:31:40 2008 From: tina-john at cox.net (tina-john at cox.net) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 17:31:40 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] (no subject) Message-ID: <20081210173140.P50H2.11479.imail@eastrmwml34> Hello, For some reason I began receiving list e mails again. Could you please remove from the list? Thanks, -- John C. Miller Tina-John at cox.net I.M.C.A. #2272 From mlblood at cox.net Wed Dec 10 17:40:30 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 14:40:30 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Is this a fair price and reputable source for Trinitite? In-Reply-To: <21B6131D02FA40F5BE4500E3E928ED0B@ASUS> Message-ID: Hi Jerry & all, That is a "fair" price, but not a particularly good price. ($10 to $12/g for 5 to 7 gram pieces, good quality) List member Michael Gilmer is offering a VERY good Price, but his pieces are only up to 2 or 3 grams - but MUCH Cheaper. ($3 to $5/g??? - contact him for quote at: ) That is a VERY good price - but Only small pieces (prices go up quickly with size). I have some large pieces (10 to 16g) @ $10/g. So, if you want small, Michael Gilmer is the best price by Far. If you want size, mine are the best I am aware of (doesn't Mean there aren't large ones at a better price somewhere). While If you want medium sized, they guy you mention is a fair price. It depends on the size you are after and the total you are willing To spend. (Personally, I like BIG - but that didn't work out so well With my belly....) Best wishes, Michael on 12/10/08 8:41 AM, Jerry Flaherty at grf2 at verizon.net wrote: > http://www.unitednuclear.com/trinititenew.htm > Jerry Flaherty > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From bobe5531 at comcast.net Wed Dec 10 18:06:23 2008 From: bobe5531 at comcast.net (bobe5531 at comcast.net) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 23:06:23 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Monnig, AML and other goodies Message-ID: <121020082306.1639.49404B6F0004714B000006672206824693CECCCACA0A0D010D@comcast.net> Ok, Provenance. Alright guys? stop with the jokes. My bad ! From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Wed Dec 10 18:12:28 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 10 Dec 2008 23:12:28 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite - Implements and Tools Message-ID: Hello Listees and Listoids, 1. According to Buchwald, most of the Burlington iron was forged into agricultural implements, and the remainder has been heated 2. Manlai iron: "A story about the Manlai meteorite reported that a long time ago, a smith of that area broke off a small piece, having recognized the meteorite as a piece of steel suitable for making various types of implements" (Namnandorj, 1980). 3. Netscha?vo: The largest preserved fragments weigh about 500 g, and the total known weight is only about 6.1 kg. The remainder was evidently forged into agricultural implements. The fragments often show hammered surfaces, proving these assumptions (Buchwald). Best from rainy, cold Southern Germany, Bernd From mark at meteorites.cc Wed Dec 10 18:31:26 2008 From: mark at meteorites.cc (Mark Crawford) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 23:31:26 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite In-Reply-To: <1870496479.2562821228928914923.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <1870496479.2562821228928914923.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <4940514E.9070504@meteorites.cc> You so need to get out more, Mike ;-) Mike Bandli wrote: > It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: "Excuse me, Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you." > -- Mark's Meteorite Pages: http://meteorites.cc From STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com Wed Dec 10 18:51:41 2008 From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com (STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 18:51:41 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite Clarification? Message-ID: It seems that for a meteorite to be a "Toolbox" it's utilitarian life must of been started prior to it being "discovered" as a meteorite. Any use after it is known is merely a novelty. I have a 12.5 Kg NWA sitting on a fern stand, it makes a great place to put my hat. I can't imagine Martin would want a slice of it for his new collection! Martin, It's your call! Tom In a message dated 12/10/2008 4:32:27 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, mark at meteorites.cc writes: You so need to get out more, Mike ;-) Mike Bandli wrote: > It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: "Excuse me, Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you." > -- Mark's Meteorite Pages: http://meteorites.cc ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From star-bits at tx.rr.com Wed Dec 10 19:03:48 2008 From: star-bits at tx.rr.com (star-bits at tx.rr.com) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 0:03:48 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite - Implements and Tools In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20081211000349.M3INC.235431.root@cdptpa-web22-z02> Also add Cranbourne to the list "Some stories tell of Aborigines dancing around the meteorite long before a settler, passing that way, attempted to tether his horse to what he thought was a stump protruding from the ground... The first mention of the meteorite resulted from the Melbourne Exhibition held in 1854. This occasion of the times featured a exhibit of hroseshoe made by a Melbourne farrier from quote "a specimen of iron from Western Port" Later investigations were to reveal that a small protion of the meteorite had been chiselled off the main mass to forge the horseshoe." Australian Gem and Treasure Hunter 1982 -- Eric Olson 610 W. Moore Rd Tucson AZ 85755 http://www.star-bits.com From dmerchan at rochester.rr.com Wed Dec 10 19:08:46 2008 From: dmerchan at rochester.rr.com (Don Merchant) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 19:08:46 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Moon dust pens References: <545950.38888.qm@web36901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000501c95b24$a309f9a0$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant> Neat Idea. If you read the last paragraph they are using a Simulated Man Made Material that resembles the Moon soil known as JSC-1A Lunar Regolith hmmmm I'll wait for the real thing! Sincerely Don Merchant IMCA #0960 ----- Original Message ----- From: "E.P. Grondine" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 5:09 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Moon dust pens > Hi everyone - > > Here's what I was talking about: > > http://www.spacedaily.com/moondustpen-competition.html > > real "simulated" Moon dust. Now if any of you saved your lunar cuttings, > it looks like an opportunity for you. > > For that matter, spacer.com might make a good place to sell meteorites to > an entirely new set of collectors > > Good Luck, and Good Hunting, > E.P. Grondine > Man and Impact in the Americas > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mary.kashuba at verizon.net Wed Dec 10 19:13:10 2008 From: mary.kashuba at verizon.net (Kashuba) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 16:13:10 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Souslovo In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <003901c95b25$40679ea0$c136dbe0$@kashuba@verizon.net> List, For anyone interested - I've taken a half dozen thin section pictures of Souslovo L4 and posted them here: http://johnkashuba.com/Pages/Meteorite%20Pages/Pictures/SouslovoL4.htm - John John Kashuba Ontario, California From midwest at meteorman.org Wed Dec 10 19:25:00 2008 From: midwest at meteorman.org (Timothy Heitz) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 18:25:00 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Souslovo References: <003901c95b25$40679ea0$c136dbe0$@kashuba@verizon.net> Message-ID: WOW, Great pictures, thanks for sharing Tim Heitz Midwest Meteorites - http://www.meteorman.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kashuba" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 6:13 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Souslovo List, For anyone interested - I've taken a half dozen thin section pictures of Souslovo L4 and posted them here: http://johnkashuba.com/Pages/Meteorite%20Pages/Pictures/SouslovoL4.htm - John John Kashuba Ontario, California ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From grf2 at verizon.net Wed Dec 10 19:21:37 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 19:21:37 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Is this a fair price and reputable source forTrinitite? References: <21B6131D02FA40F5BE4500E3E928ED0B@ASUS> <002301c95af3$5a5d8180$d0e11960@laptop> Message-ID: <77AE8BBFF92648D58229721900AD9FC6@ASUS> thanks Pete ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete Shugar" To: "Jerry Flaherty" ; Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 1:15 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Is this a fair price and reputable source forTrinitite? > Althou the price is on the high side, (about 30% too high) > you need to remember that they need to pay for that $50,000 > mass spectrometer----heehee. > Pete From raremeteorites at yahoo.com Wed Dec 10 19:52:06 2008 From: raremeteorites at yahoo.com (Adam Hupe) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 16:52:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Definitely Worth Checking Out! Message-ID: <580715.96909.qm@web30701.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear List Members, I would like bring to your attention some great items now listed on eBay. I put up some exceptional pieces this week, some so different or unique that they are definitely worth a look. My move to sunny and very friendly Laughlin was more expensive than anticipated so please help me to bring back some resemblance of a budget. Most items are started out at just 99 cents for those who have budgets of their own while other items are very reasonably priced. Click below to see some great auctions: http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/raremeteorites!_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZ MUST SEE - Two Types of Xenoliths in a Single Slice, Studied at NAU: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140288317033 Two Generous Sized Crusted Specimens of NWA 3160 Lunar Meteorite Started at Just 99 Cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140287825232 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140288318485 Nice Crusted Part Slice of NWA 3163 Lunar Meteorite Started at Just 99 Cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140288319013 Complete Amgala Individual With Unburnt Clast: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200286998152 LUNAR MAIN MASS - Dhofar 910, Legally obtained: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200287000792 COMPLETE SLICE - MARTIAN METEORITE- NWA 1195 - Largest and Only Complete Slice Left: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200287003490 Giant Olivine Diogenite Block Cut With Crust and Polished Surface: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200287004931 Largest Piece of NWA 2999 Angrite Left Started at Just 99 Cents, Fantastic Crust: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200287006824 And Many More Examples Worth Looking at Can Be Found at This Link: http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/raremeteorites!_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZ Thank you for looking and if you are bidding, good luck. Best Regards, ------------------------------------ Adam Hupe The Hupe Collection Team LunarRock IMCA 2185 raremeteorites at yahoo.com From almitt at kconline.com Wed Dec 10 20:10:00 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 20:10:00 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig, Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas In-Reply-To: <000701c95b0b$30cd0440$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> References: <000701c95b0b$30cd0440$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Message-ID: Bob, I believe it was successfully pointed out on the list that you misrepresented material, Plymouth, Indiana possibly being one, and there are a number of people who posted they had difficulties dealing with you and questionable dealings. I would think you would be ashamed to show up on this list and offer meteorites with pedigrees when your dealings are very much in question here. You can spout off like your some big dealer here but I'll go to the archives and bring up all the old information on you for others to read. My advise is to find some other hobby to misrepresent items in where people don't know you. --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Evans" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 4:06 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig,Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas > Well, > After taking off several months of Dealing meteorites, I can stay away no > longer. > I have some very nice offerings available over the next few weeks. > > I was fortunate enough to purchase another small collection of meteorites > with some very unique meteorites ( some I never heard of ). > Most of these have Monnig and AML Cards accompanying the specimens. So you > will not need to ask me where or who I got them from ( you will NOT get an > answer ) I keep my methods of acquisitions and contacts confidential. > > Here is a partial list : > > Mckinney Texas > La Lande N.M. > Plainview > Ness Co. Kansas > Sandia Mountains N.M. > Ladder Creek > Adrian Texas > Romero Texas > Morland Kansas > Noreatur Kansas > > Some of these meteorites have an appointment with my saw. > > I am offering these meteorites to a preferred list of collectors. > If you are interested in any of these please email me letting me know > which ones that you are interested in. I will be offering these to you > first. > A copy of each corresponding collection card will be included with each > purchase. > It will take me a couple of weeks to get the meteorites processed but I > wanted to give you a heads up. > > I have also just received two new beautiful type 3 chondrites. I got a > great deal on these and I will be selling them far less than $15 / gram > They will be submitted for classification. > Also be on the lookout for a large slice of Zagami and more that enough > Juvinas to put a huge smile on your face. Both with impeccable provence > ( that is the politically correct way to say it, right ?) > > BE > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From grf2 at verizon.net Wed Dec 10 21:16:19 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 21:16:19 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Souslovo References: <003901c95b25$40679ea0$c136dbe0$@kashuba@verizon.net> Message-ID: <38D5259063CB4362A30D5EC1377EE9A7@ASUS> John, always learn something from your beautiful posts ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kashuba" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 7:13 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Souslovo > List, > > For anyone interested - I've taken a half dozen thin section pictures of > Souslovo L4 and posted them here: > > http://johnkashuba.com/Pages/Meteorite%20Pages/Pictures/SouslovoL4.htm > > - John > > John Kashuba > Ontario, California > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mmurray at montrose.net Wed Dec 10 21:16:28 2008 From: mmurray at montrose.net (Michael Murray) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 19:16:28 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] automatically sorting the M-List emails Message-ID: Some folks are just plain touchy about receiving a lot of emails from the Met-List or other mail lists. If you're one of those good people, why don't you set up your MS Outlook or in the case of an Mac your Mail program to sort all the incoming Met-List postings into a folder other than your inbox. It doesn't matter then if you get 30 or 300 new emails in a day, you can quickly browse them, read the ones you want, and delete as many as you want all at the same time. I look through the posts and save the ones I want to save and do a "select all" and delete every thing else in the folder. In a few days, I do it all again. None of the emails from M-List members go into my inbox. They all go to the new folder that I named "Meteorite List" which by the way is on my computer's hard drive, not on the server. There really isn't a good reason for me to save older M- List emails because should I need to see one I can go to the archives and find it quick using the search function. Just one caution if you plan to set up your MS Outlook to do this, when you have it all set up to select incoming messages based on the "sent to", it will automatically sort all messages with that "sent to" in to your new folder. Just wanted to prepare you for that. You may want to study that a bit before going ahead with creating the new folder. I wouldn't want someone to go ahead with creating the new folder, hit the button only to see all of their previous sorting into other folders go away. In MS Outlook, if I want to save a Met-List post off by itself or in another folder, I doctor it so the automatic sorting doesn't see it then I move it to the new location. The Mail program on my Mac doesn't work like MS Outlook in this respect. As far as I can tell, it only moves incoming messages right into the new folder I set up. Hope that if you are simply bugged by a lot of incoming messages or want to keep your inbox clear for a business or other stuff that you look into this. Study it first though, as it may not be for everyone. If you decide to do this, just go to the help file and it will lead you through the set-up. All the Best, Mike From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Wed Dec 10 21:51:06 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 12:51:06 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] QMIG update Message-ID: Subject: QMIG update > Listoids > > Firstly a very merry Christmas and a happy new year to all listoids - may > all good things happen to you and yours > > Secondly - QMIG update by 2 !!! > > Thirdly - new find from smack bang in the middle of the Tenham strewnfield > seems to be a Tenham - damnit - see picture of cut face linked from news > page > > Lastly - Iz look like visiting in and near the Tenham strewnfield approx > xmas... many stones were a nusisance to the property owneres who moved > them !!! so I am hoping my guided tour will reveal some from where they > were moved to rather than where they should be !!! > > Whoah - forgot - better put in the link or Michael will get cranky at me > again - http://www.qmig.org or mirror at http://www.qmig.net > > Ciao > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 3682 (20081210) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > From freequarks at gmail.com Wed Dec 10 22:07:57 2008 From: freequarks at gmail.com (Dark Matter) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 20:07:57 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Souslovo In-Reply-To: <38D5259063CB4362A30D5EC1377EE9A7@ASUS> References: <38D5259063CB4362A30D5EC1377EE9A7@ASUS> Message-ID: <822da19a0812101907v7e8c4165t45d50421978730b9@mail.gmail.com> Wonderful Pics John. Thanks for sharing them with us. As I pointed out in the article, Souslovo is a very busy meteorite with macroscopic oddities everywhere one looks. Best, Martin On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 7:16 PM, Jerry Flaherty wrote: > John, always learn something from your beautiful posts > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kashuba" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 7:13 PM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Souslovo > > >> List, >> >> For anyone interested - I've taken a half dozen thin section pictures of >> Souslovo L4 and posted them here: >> >> http://johnkashuba.com/Pages/Meteorite%20Pages/Pictures/SouslovoL4.htm >> >> - John >> >> John Kashuba >> Ontario, California >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From freequarks at gmail.com Wed Dec 10 22:11:30 2008 From: freequarks at gmail.com (Dark Matter) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 20:11:30 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite Clarification? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <822da19a0812101911m78fd0becv6238acdbdfb99191@mail.gmail.com> Hi Tom, I think another caveat might be that the Toolbox meteorite needed to be used "as is" rather than pounded into a more desired shape. Just a thought that knocks the wind out of a thousand years of irons. If you cannot grow it, you must mine it. Unless, that is, you want to wait around for it to fall from the sky. Oh, and regarding the fern-based hat holder, I think I could find plenty of enjoyment having a hot desert dinner plate displayed here. Best, Martin On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 4:51 PM, wrote: > It seems that for a meteorite to be a "Toolbox" it's utilitarian life must > of been started prior to it being "discovered" as a meteorite. Any use after > it is known is merely a novelty. I have a 12.5 Kg NWA sitting on a fern > stand, it makes a great place to put my hat. I can't imagine Martin would want a > slice of it for his new collection! > > Martin, It's your call! > > Tom > > In a message dated 12/10/2008 4:32:27 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, > mark at meteorites.cc writes: > You so need to get out more, Mike ;-) > > Mike Bandli wrote: >> It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: "Excuse me, > Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you." >> > > -- > Mark's Meteorite Pages: http://meteorites.cc > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From yellowengine at earthlink.net Wed Dec 10 22:45:04 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 21:45:04 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Shipping Hassle Message-ID: <24490040.1228967105125.JavaMail.root@elwamui-chisos.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Ok.. so I get my shipping quote from Bonhams LA for last weekends auction, and I was a bit surprised by the shipping charges that they came up with. Has anyone else had difficulty negotiating with them? I am currently in the process of locating a reliable 3rd party agent, if anyone has a recommendation. Any input would be greatly appreciated! Best Wishes, Ryan Pawelski From mikewren at gilanet.com Wed Dec 10 22:48:52 2008 From: mikewren at gilanet.com (michael cottingham) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 20:48:52 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: THE BIG HOLIDAY SALE NOW STARTED! OVER $10, 000.00+ Starting out at 0.99 cents! Message-ID: <39A31447-6D8A-42CF-A3C4-6E50B994AE8B@gilanet.com> Hello All! I have listed my BIG, BIG HOLIDAY SALE up on good ole ebay! 37 Auctions with a value of over $10,000.00, started out at 0.99 cents. Over 100 New specimens in my ebay store too. Highlights will soon be made ready, I just thought I would give everyone the heads up for my best listing of the year! Good Luck. Go to: http://stores.ebay.com/voyage-botanica-natural-history Highlights soon.... Best Wishes and Thanks Michael Cottingham From markig at westnet.com Wed Dec 10 22:54:49 2008 From: markig at westnet.com (Mark Grossman) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 22:54:49 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Shipping Hassle References: <24490040.1228967105125.JavaMail.root@elwamui-chisos.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <007f01c95b44$36f8f980$6501a8c0@QED> I've heard about a lot difficulties about the price of shipping items purchased at auctions - any type of auctions. Best thing to do is to ask up front if possible. I was able to do this for an Australian auction where I bid over the Internet. The final cost of shipment was pretty close to what was quoted before the auction. I know this doesn't help your situation, but it's something for anyone to think about for future auctions. Best of luck in finding another shipping agent. Mark Grossman ----- Original Message ----- From: "RJP" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 10:45 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Shipping Hassle > Ok.. so I get my shipping quote from Bonhams LA for last weekends auction, and I was a bit surprised by the shipping charges that they came up with. Has anyone else had difficulty negotiating with them? I am currently in the process of locating a reliable 3rd party agent, if anyone has a recommendation. > > Any input would be greatly appreciated! > > Best Wishes, > > Ryan Pawelski > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Wed Dec 10 22:58:03 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 19:58:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Shipping Hassle In-Reply-To: <24490040.1228967105125.JavaMail.root@elwamui-chisos.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <720420.60551.qm@web45610.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> --- On Wed, 12/10/08, RJP wrote: > From: RJP > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Bonhams Shipping Hassle > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Wednesday, December 10, 2008, 10:45 PM > Ok.. so I get my shipping quote from Bonhams LA for last > weekends auction, and I was a bit surprised by the shipping > charges that they came up with. Has anyone else had > difficulty negotiating with them? I am currently in the > process of locating a reliable 3rd party agent, if anyone > has a recommendation. > > Any input would be greatly appreciated! > > Best Wishes, > > Ryan Pawelski > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoritekid at gmail.com Thu Dec 11 03:59:43 2008 From: meteoritekid at gmail.com (Jason Utas) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 00:59:43 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Contact Information - Michel Franco? Message-ID: <93aaac890812110059x48d6c811v86e508927997c156@mail.gmail.com> Hello All, I've been trying to contact Michel Franco, but have been unable to reach him at the following address: michel at caillou-noir.com - All emails have been returned to me. Does anyone else know how to contact him? Thanks, Jason From michael at spacerocksinc.com Thu Dec 11 06:05:57 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 03:05:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 11, 2008 Message-ID: <22430314.2637961228993557141.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_11_2008.html From grf2 at verizon.net Thu Dec 11 10:37:27 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 10:37:27 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 11, 2008 References: <22430314.2637961228993557141.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <94F8EDE5D5C04669A5A4E5F7A886676B@ASUS> It would never survive in my possession due to the drool factor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Johnson" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 6:05 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 11,2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_11_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Thu Dec 11 11:07:25 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 11 Dec 2008 16:07:25 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 11, 2008 Message-ID: "It would never survive in my possession due to the drool factor" .. and then this beautiful Gan Gan would be "gone, gone" :-( Bernd :-) http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_11_2008.html To: grf2 at verizon.net michael at spacerocksinc.com meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com From MeteorHntr at aol.com Thu Dec 11 13:57:34 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 13:57:34 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Souslovo, Beaver, Brenham, Plainview, etc. Message-ID: Brenham from the Hopewell Mounds in Ohio were found fashioned as buttons and ear rings. Axtell was used as a door stop for years, and had paint drips on the exteriour from at least one room painting. An Allende was used as a block to hold up a car in a mechanics garage I understand. ASU has a killer tool that was fashioned from a Toluca, made for harvesting some type of plant as I understand. Cape York was used to make arrow points. Bethune Co was used as a block in a cemented wall, I think. Somervell County was used in wall. Tucson Ring was used as an anvil. A Vaca Meurta was used as an anvil and another as a hammer rock to break up other Vaca specimens. Modern fashioned Meteorites are used as knives. There have to be a hundred more examples. Steve Arnold #1 www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Thu Dec 11 14:05:31 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 11 Dec 2008 19:05:31 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Souslovo, Beaver, Brenham, Plainview, etc. Message-ID: Steve Arnold #1 writes: "There have to be a hundred more examples!" Yep, don't forget Korra Korrabes (H3), the largest specimen of which (24 kg) was used in a garden wall until 2000 August. Bernd From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Thu Dec 11 14:20:50 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 11:20:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] the las palmas iron Message-ID: <181650.98870.qm@web57805.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi list.I just received my 174 gram LAS PALMAS iron from bob c.This is the new iron which is in classification even as we speak.Ted Bunch is doing the classing.When I was at bob's house,I saw alot of these irons.Very sculpted and very nice natural patina color.They are saying that this might be a new iron.Here are a few items that might suggest so.These irons were found 200 miles to the east of the campo strewn field,plus alto of these irons are highly oriented,where most campo's are not.Also these were found in a 100 square foot field.Making it very small.They were also found in a very dry location.They are guessing that the TKW might be just under 1000 kilo's.Not alto for an iron.When cleaned,like my piece,they are a beauty to behold and do not have the same characteristics as a campo.Bob has listed a few on eBay where alto more info can be seen.The natural ones with the light patina are very nice as well.You should get one before they are gone.Plus he is doing free shipping on these.Most are at very reasonable prices.Have a great day. Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From majbaermann at web.de Thu Dec 11 14:21:33 2008 From: majbaermann at web.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Matthias_B=E4rmann?=) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 20:21:33 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Souslovo, Beaver, Brenham, Plainview, etc. References: Message-ID: <87E9DFB7F95642A9A6A6D1B18C7DF6C5@thinkcentre> As far as I know the only early culture avoiding strictly to make use of meteoritical material was that of Australian aboriginies. Would be utmost interesting to find out, why. Does anyone here know more? I have a vague idea, but far from being sure. Matthias Baermann ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 7:57 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Souslovo, Beaver, Brenham, Plainview, etc. > > Brenham from the Hopewell Mounds in Ohio were found fashioned as buttons > and > ear rings. > > Axtell was used as a door stop for years, and had paint drips on the > exteriour from at least one room painting. > > An Allende was used as a block to hold up a car in a mechanics garage I > understand. > > ASU has a killer tool that was fashioned from a Toluca, made for > harvesting > some type of plant as I understand. > > Cape York was used to make arrow points. > > Bethune Co was used as a block in a cemented wall, I think. > > Somervell County was used in wall. > > Tucson Ring was used as an anvil. > > A Vaca Meurta was used as an anvil and another as a hammer rock to break > up > other Vaca specimens. > > Modern fashioned Meteorites are used as knives. > > There have to be a hundred more examples. > > Steve Arnold #1 > www.SteveArnoldMeteorites.com > > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mary.kashuba at verizon.net Thu Dec 11 14:07:40 2008 From: mary.kashuba at verizon.net (Kashuba) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 11:07:40 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 11, 2008 In-Reply-To: <22430314.2637961228993557141.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> References: <22430314.2637961228993557141.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <004c01c95bc3$bd678c00$3836a400$@kashuba@verizon.net> This looks like a nice demonstration of a troilite nodule - being weaker than metal - having been partially ablated during atmospheric passage. Very cool slice. - John Ontario, California -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Michael Johnson Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 3:06 AM To: Meteorite List Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 11, 2008 http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_11_2008.html ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Thu Dec 11 14:44:20 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 11 Dec 2008 19:44:20 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Souslovo, Beaver, Brenham, Plainview, etc. Message-ID: Hello Matthias and List, "As far as I know the only early culture avoiding strictly to make use of meteoritical material was that of Australian aborigines. Would be utmost interesting to find out, why. Does anyone here know more?" Ancestors of aborigines living near the Boxhole crater may have witnessed the Boxhole irons fall and they named this area "Sun walk fire devil rock." The word "devil" may be a hint that such objects were the works of devilish forces in their eyes and so they preferred to stay away from them !?!? Bernd From majbaermann at web.de Thu Dec 11 15:35:40 2008 From: majbaermann at web.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Matthias_B=E4rmann?=) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 21:35:40 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Souslovo, Beaver, Brenham, Plainview, etc. References: Message-ID: <6C7C7810571C434DA97DC149565CA3E3@thinkcentre> Hello Bernd & listoids, the same description - ""Chindu chinna waru chingi yaku" in aboriginal idiom - is told in regard to the Henbury crater field. And as far as I was told there could be doubts whether it's authentic. Nevertheless it seems probable that Aboriginies witnessed the Henbury fall, about 4.500 years ago (Boxhole is much older, ca. 54.000 years). In any case, it seems that the Henbury craters - and probably others too? - had the status of tabu for indigenous people. Perhaps caused by fear or simply respect. Another reason could be the concept of the songlines which seem to represent the reality as a whole. And as each single structure of the landscape was present in a certain passage of a song, it seems natural that the different tribes tried to preserve the landscape as well as the songs, unchanged as far as possible. My best, Matthias ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 8:44 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Souslovo, Beaver, Brenham, Plainview, etc. > Hello Matthias and List, > > "As far as I know the only early culture avoiding strictly to make use of > meteoritical material was that of Australian aborigines. Would be utmost > interesting to find out, why. Does anyone here know more?" > > Ancestors of aborigines living near the Boxhole crater may have witnessed > the Boxhole irons fall and they named this area "Sun walk fire devil > rock." > > The word "devil" may be a hint that such objects were the works of > devilish > forces in their eyes and so they preferred to stay away from them !?!? > > Bernd > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Thu Dec 11 15:36:42 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 06:36:42 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] QMIG proposal to sell Australia's most ferocious meteorite Message-ID: Listoids I am proposing to sell a limited edition of Australia's most ferocious meteorite with a provisional name to be sought of SCORPION BIGHT (likely H5) Camel Donga used to be my most favorite ferociously named meteorite but SCORPION BIGHT blows it away a la ferocity Perhaps other listoids could start a thread on other ferociously named meteorites please... Lord knows the list needs some light-hearted humour from time to time I am preparing a limited edition of 25 micros at US $60 each plus postage I am still wrestling with export approval and cannot sell outside Australia until this aspect is finalised I am seeking expressions of interest in that this will be the first and only sale of micros at or about 2 to 3 grams in a artworked coinslab although I may sell the main mass of 400 + grams less a type specimen requirement I'll most likely keep the half dozen or so frags that were recovered with the main mass Cheers http://www.qmig.org From geoking at notkin.net Thu Dec 11 15:39:15 2008 From: geoking at notkin.net (Notkin) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 13:39:15 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] the las palmas iron In-Reply-To: <181650.98870.qm@web57805.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <181650.98870.qm@web57805.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <455BA623-D92F-4C86-9FFA-2083E235F00E@notkin.net> Dear Steve and List: I am curious to know if there has been any recent news on the classification of Las Palmas. I heard quite a while ago that Ted might be working on it. It's a lovely iron and I have a few, and have been wondering for some time if Las Palmas is paired with Campo or a new find. Although the examples I have bear some resemblance to Campo del Cielo, the Las Palmas irons show better preservation, far more elaborate shapes, and display many small regmaglypts. I don't recall if Ted is on the List, but if you are, I'd be most interested in further info when it becomes available. Thanks and regards, Geoff N. www.aerolite.org www.campometeorites.com From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Thu Dec 11 19:26:18 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 16:26:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Mars Orbiter Completes Prime Mission (MRO) Message-ID: <200812120026.QAA08937@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> Dec. 11, 2008 Dwayne Brown Headquarters, Washington 202-358-1726 dwayne.c.brown at nasa.gov Guy Webster Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. 818-354-6278 guy.webster at jpl.nasa.gov RELEASE: 08-324 MARS ORBITER COMPLETES PRIME MISSION PASADENA, Calif. -- NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter has completed its primary, two-year science phase. The spacecraft has found signs of a complex Martian history of climate change that produced a diversity of past watery environments. The orbiter has returned 73 terabits of science data, more than all earlier Mars missions combined. The spacecraft will build on this record as it continues to examine Mars in unprecedented detail during its next two-year phase of science operations. Among the major findings during the primary science phase is the revelation that the action of water on and near the surface of Mars occurred for hundreds of millions of years. This activity was at least regional and possibly global in extent, though possibly intermittent. The spacecraft also observed that signatures of a variety of watery environments, some acidic, some alkaline, increase the possibility that there are places on Mars that could reveal evidence of past life, if it ever existed. Since moving into position 186 miles above Mars' surface in October 2006, the orbiter also has conducted 10,000 targeted observation sequences of high-priority areas. It has imaged nearly 40 percent of the planet at a resolution that can reveal house-sized objects in detail, 1 percent in enough detail to see desk-sized features. This survey has covered almost 60 percent of Mars in mineral mapping bands at stadium-size resolution. The orbiter also assembled nearly 700 daily global weather maps, dozens of atmospheric temperature profiles, and hundreds of radar profiles of the subsurface and the interior of the polar caps. "These observations are now at the level of detail necessary to test hypotheses about when and where water has changed Mars and where future missions will be most productive as they search for habitable regions on Mars," said Richard Zurek, Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter project scientist at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, Calif. Included in the observations are hundreds of stereo pairs used to make detailed topography maps and classic images in support of other Mars missions. One image showed the Mars rover Opportunity poised on the rim of Victoria Crater and another of NASA's Phoenix Mars Lander during its descent to the surface. Orbiter data prompted the Phoenix team to change the spacecraft's landing site, and are being used to select the landing location for NASA's Mars Science Laboratory, which is scheduled for launch in 2011. For five months of Phoenix operations on Mars that ended in November, the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter and NASA's Mars Odyssey orbiter shared the vital communications roles of relaying commands to the lander and data from Phoenix back to Earth. The Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter has found repetitive layering in Mars' permanent polar ice caps. The patterns suggest climate change cycles continuing to the present. They may record possible effects of cyclical changes in Mars' tilt and orbit on global sunlight patterns. Recent climate cycles are indicated by radar detection of subsurface icy deposits outside the polar regions, closer to the equator, where near-surface ice is not permanently stable. Other results reveal details of ancient streambeds, atmospheric hazes and motions of water, along with the ever-changing weather on Mars. Most observations from the orbiter will be discontinued for a few weeks while the sun is between Earth and Mars, which will disrupt communications. In December, the orbiter will begin a new phase, with science observations continuing as Mars makes another orbit around the sun, which takes approximately two Earth years. "This spacecraft truly exemplifies the best in capabilities to support science and other Martian spacecraft activities," said Michael Meyer, lead scientist for the Mars Exploration Program at NASA Headquarters in Washington. "MRO has exceeded its own goals and our expectations. We look forward to more discoveries as we continue to look at the Red Planet in spectacular detail." NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena manages the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter for NASA's Science Mission Directorate, Washington. Lockheed Martin Space Systems, Denver, is the prime contractor for the project and built the spacecraft. For more information about the mission, visit: http://www.nasa.gov/mro -end- From eric at meteoritewatch.com Thu Dec 11 19:56:54 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 16:56:54 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4941B6D6.70700@meteoritewatch.com> Hi All, List members and many meteorite friends have have asked me if I could help them build a website like mine. Usually I get asked how much I would charge for a complete meteorite website including web and image hosting. After building a number of meteorite websites for some of you guys it gave me an idea. Instead of charging normal prices well in excess of $300 to $500 for a complete e-commerce website and shopping cart system with all the bells and whistles, I wanted to find a way to build and host one for all meteorite people and Met List members less than $5 per month. Most people that inquired really wanted just a simple website that they can manage themselves and one that is easy to update, change pages, add photos etc. That seems to be the most people really want for their sites anyway. So I found something, and after some tinkering and figuring this is what I came up with. www.MeteoriteBlogs.com Let me know what you think and be sure to contact me if you have any questions. Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA P.S. If you like the idea please or if you have a suggestion, comment, or just plain want to yell at me I do want to hear back from you guys on this. Contact me Off-List or on list... doesn't matter, I'll answer any questions you have. From gmhupe at htn.net Thu Dec 11 20:17:27 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 20:17:27 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? References: <4941B6D6.70700@meteoritewatch.com> Message-ID: Hello Eric, While I am sure most List members appreciate your work and offer here, the last time someone hosted a meteorite blog, it bombed big time. People were impersonating others and talking a lot of trash. My advice would be to NOT start another meteorite blog. Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric Wichman" To: Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 7:56 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? > Hi All, > > List members and many meteorite friends have have asked me if I could help > them build a website like mine. Usually I get asked how much I would > charge for a complete meteorite website including web and image hosting. > After building a number of meteorite websites for some of you guys it gave > me an idea. > > Instead of charging normal prices well in excess of $300 to $500 for a > complete e-commerce website and shopping cart system with all the bells > and whistles, I wanted to find a way to build and host one for all > meteorite people and Met List members less than $5 per month. > > Most people that inquired really wanted just a simple website that they > can manage themselves and one that is easy to update, change pages, add > photos etc. That seems to be the most people really want for their sites > anyway. So I found something, and after some tinkering and figuring this > is what I came up with. > > www.MeteoriteBlogs.com > > Let me know what you think and be sure to contact me if you have any > questions. > > Regards, > Eric Wichman > Meteorites USA > > P.S. If you like the idea please or if you have a suggestion, comment, or > just plain want to yell at me I do want to hear back from you guys on > this. Contact me Off-List or on list... doesn't matter, I'll answer any > questions you have. > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From bobl at peaktopeak.com Thu Dec 11 21:07:53 2008 From: bobl at peaktopeak.com (Bob Loeffler) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 19:07:53 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? In-Reply-To: <4941B6D6.70700@meteoritewatch.com> Message-ID: <20081212020756.8E26F10560@mailwash5.pair.com> Hi Eric, You said the following in your e-mail: "I wanted to find a way to build and host one for all meteorite people and Met List members less than $5 per month." ... but it says $49 on the website. Typo? Regards, Bob -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Eric Wichman Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 5:57 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? Hi All, List members and many meteorite friends have have asked me if I could help them build a website like mine. Usually I get asked how much I would charge for a complete meteorite website including web and image hosting. After building a number of meteorite websites for some of you guys it gave me an idea. Instead of charging normal prices well in excess of $300 to $500 for a complete e-commerce website and shopping cart system with all the bells and whistles, I wanted to find a way to build and host one for all meteorite people and Met List members less than $5 per month. Most people that inquired really wanted just a simple website that they can manage themselves and one that is easy to update, change pages, add photos etc. That seems to be the most people really want for their sites anyway. So I found something, and after some tinkering and figuring this is what I came up with. www.MeteoriteBlogs.com Let me know what you think and be sure to contact me if you have any questions. Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA P.S. If you like the idea please or if you have a suggestion, comment, or just plain want to yell at me I do want to hear back from you guys on this. Contact me Off-List or on list... doesn't matter, I'll answer any questions you have. ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Thu Dec 11 23:43:59 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 20:43:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Asteroid Lamp In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <574123.2648.qm@web58402.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi Folks, I stumbled across this "asteroid lamp" that I thought might make an interesting way to light a display case. I have no idea what the price on it is. http://www.innermost.co.uk/products/products_lamps_asteroid.html Regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From michael at spacerocksinc.com Fri Dec 12 00:01:16 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 21:01:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 12, 2008 Message-ID: <7826599.2746471229058076429.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_12_2008.html From geeg48 at msn.com Fri Dec 12 00:52:22 2008 From: geeg48 at msn.com (GREG LINDH) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 22:52:22 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: THE BIG HOLIDAY SALE NOW STARTED! OVER $10, 000.00+ Starting out at 0.99 cents! References: <39A31447-6D8A-42CF-A3C4-6E50B994AE8B@gilanet.com> Message-ID: Hi Michael, My wife and I are retired and are living on our investments. Needless to say we've taken a huge torpedo in our finances this last year, so my meteorite buying is on an indefinite hold. But, I've got to tell you, you have got a drop dead, gorgeous collection, and your prices are for the most part, very reasonable. I've bought two meteorites from you in the past and love them both. I hope you stay in this business for a long time, if for no other reason than I just love to "window shop" your ads and drool. Regards, Greg Lindh ----- Original Message ----- From: "michael cottingham" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 8:48 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: THE BIG HOLIDAY SALE NOW STARTED! OVER $10,000.00+ Starting out at 0.99 cents! > Hello All! > > I have listed my BIG, BIG HOLIDAY SALE up on good ole ebay! 37 > Auctions with a value of over $10,000.00, started out at 0.99 cents. > Over 100 New specimens in my ebay store too. > > Highlights will soon be made ready, I just thought I would give > everyone the heads up for my best listing of the year! Good Luck. > > Go to: > > http://stores.ebay.com/voyage-botanica-natural-history > > > Highlights soon.... > > > Best Wishes and Thanks > > Michael Cottingham > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From eric at meteoritewatch.com Fri Dec 12 01:04:37 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 22:04:37 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? (Bob Loeffler) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4941FEF5.2060602@meteoritewatch.com> Bob, Not a typo at all... $5 per month is $60 per year. (12 months X $5mo = $60) I'm offering the blog site for $49 for the whole year including hosting. That come to about $4.08mo Eric ---------------------------- Hi Eric, You said the following in your e-mail: "I wanted to find a way to build and host one for all meteorite people and Met List members less than $5 per month." ... but it says $49 on the website. Typo? Regards, Bob From eric at meteoritewatch.com Fri Dec 12 01:06:37 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 22:06:37 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? (Greg Hupe) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4941FF6D.7040602@meteoritewatch.com> Greg, Thanks for the input. I appreciate that and it did cross my mind. People are gonna talk trash regardless. They talk trash on the Met-List too. All I'm offering are personal meteorite blog websites to members and meteorite people in general, not a central blog for everyone to gripe and complain. What they say on it is completely up to them. You or I could do the same on our websites if we wanted to but we don't because we respect other list members and meteorite people in general. I respect your advice, and opinion. Thanks, Eric ------------------------------------------- Hupe wrote: Hello Eric, While I am sure most List members appreciate your work and offer here, the last time someone hosted a meteorite blog, it bombed big time. People were impersonating others and talking a lot of trash. My advice would be to NOT start another meteorite blog. Best regards, Greg From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Fri Dec 12 03:17:38 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 18:17:38 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] sale of scorpion bight main mass by http://qmig.org Message-ID: <9C97377AF291485C92D518808C9BCE73@your0a700f0aaf> Listoids I'm slightly overwhelmed by the replies on my proposal to sell a limited edition numbered micro of Australia's most ferocious meteorite (and possibly the world's most ferocious meteorite)... I am still in the throes of a wrestling match to obtain export approval but hopefully there is light at the end of the tunnel... at least I can claim the moral high ground... I would still like a thread on the most ferocious named meteorites - one listoid has come up to bat with Dingo Pup Donga and says but he has lost my illusions to ever be able to get a micro of it. I'm damn sure that there are many other ferocious names out there - I'd love a thread on the names of ferocious meteorites without having to sit for hours reading each page of the blue book... over to youse I need to unwind and vent a bit about why I have to sell a few of my prized finds... Rewind the clock twenty years or so when a young Robert H**G visited Australia and rewarded our fair country by raping pillaging and looting and illegally exporting many Australian chondrites... Much of this of course has long ago been onsold and most listoids were never aware that this happened but indeed many advanced collectors hold specimens of dubious provenance but this is perhaps part and parcel of our hobby... He wasn't the first and certainly not the last to rape loot pillage and illegally export was he Blaine... And where do we stand today... to bring back much of our heritage we have to wait until these specimens are disposed from private collections and sold on the open market... The main masses by now are no more and all that are (mostly) available are slices thereof indeed if you look hard enough there are oodles of illegally exported Queensland chondrites for sale by tthe doyens of the meteorite community aren't there Mike (not Michael or Mike F) And it still happens today with Tenham any many more and I won't bore you with who else or what chondrites... But the majority of stolen chondrites reside largely with the rich and famous who simply must have with no thought of what is best for the collecting community or the musem and university community but that is a rant for another day... our hobby can only survive in a co-operative approach with the museum and university community otherwise we are doomed as collectors by the encroaching legislation which slowly overtakes us every day simply by acts of a few who simply must hop on the first plane to have something whether it is legal or not... And do we have an over-reaching professional association that has the best wishes of the collecting community at heart - perhaps not - unfortunately I feel that the alleged guardian of our community has a dealers first attitude and covers up for the sins of its members (who are mostly dealers) - perhaps it is why so many do not wish to register or join any professional organisation I'm happy to receive any flak for the above - its time someone shouted it out... but all is not well in our community... for me to have to sell my prized finds to raise the funds to recover stolen chondrites is an overt symptom tha all is not well in our little community And you may ask what does our government do - phuckall - it isnt cost effective or successful to pursue the crimes of long long ago Over to youse but I stand firm on what I have written Ta From Carsten.Giessler at t-online.de Fri Dec 12 04:37:34 2008 From: Carsten.Giessler at t-online.de (Carsten Giessler) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 10:37:34 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Ebay Auctions - Nice Stuff! Message-ID: <494230DE.2020109@t-online.de> Dear List, i have some auctions at ebay ending soon, there is nice stuff! For example there is a big brecciated Capot Rey slice, 31 grams, a 12g. slice of DAG 222, LL5-6 (seldom offered) 10.7g endpiece of NWA 5348 - CO3 endpiece with CRUST of NWA 5018, a rare Eucrite (unbrecciated! Basalt) some nice type 3's... and much more! It's worth to take a look here: http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/gipometeorites_W0QQLHQ5fAuctionZ1QQ_trksidZp3911Q2ec0Q2em301 Many thanks for viewing, Carsten Ps.: When you use the link above, ebay isn't showing the auctions with zero bids here. I don't know the reason for this, but i hope it works at your side and you can see all the offered items. From marcin at meteoryty.pl Fri Dec 12 07:26:36 2008 From: marcin at meteoryty.pl (Marcin Cimala - PolandMET) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 13:26:36 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] CD and SA medals References: <494230DE.2020109@t-online.de> Message-ID: <004a01c95c54$e036b620$0d00000a@polandmezrd5i9> Hi I like some of the Sikhote Alin and Canyon Diablo medals. Person who sell them (or owner of them) pls contact me. -----[ MARCIN CIMALA ]-----[ I.M.C.A.#3667 ]----- http://www.Meteoryty.pl marcin(at)meteoryty.pl http://www.PolandMET.com marcin(at)meteorite.pl http://www.Gao-Guenie.com GSM: +48 (793) kosmos --------[ Member of Polish Meteoritical Society ]-------- From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Fri Dec 12 09:43:36 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 06:43:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <8157.56049.qm@web58406.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi ladies and gentlemen (and friends watching at home!) - It's time to play America's favorite game - "REAL OR BOGUS?" http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320324463986 Today's offering comes from the intrepid world of eBay. Here we see something billed as real moon dust that was recovered from Neil Armstrong's camera magazine. So, I have to ask everyone who is playing - REAL OR BOGUS? (If I was a gambling man, I'd say BOGUS) Regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From fuzzfoot at comcast.net Fri Dec 12 10:15:37 2008 From: fuzzfoot at comcast.net (Mike Bandli) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 15:15:37 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? In-Reply-To: <1783001470.212241229094753804.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <1545035058.212771229094937835.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Hello Mike G, I can vouch for this item and tell you that it is the real deal. There have been several presentations made with swatches of BetaCloth or other materials stained with lunar dust. Florian has been the primary supplier of these presentations and it is all legit. You can read more about his presentations on the collectSPACE.com forums. I might note that stained hardware and artifacts are the only legal way to own lunar material from the Apollo missions. Owning several lunar meteorites, I could care less about buying 10 grains of Apollo lunar glass. BUT... what makes this artifact desirable (to me, anyway) is that it is an authentic artifact from Apollo 11 - the 'grail' of human exploration. Cheers, Mike Bandli ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Gilmer" To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 6:43:36 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? Hi ladies and gentlemen (and friends watching at home!) - It's time to play America's favorite game - "REAL OR BOGUS?" http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320324463986 Today's offering comes from the intrepid world of eBay. Here we see something billed as real moon dust that was recovered from Neil Armstrong's camera magazine. So, I have to ask everyone who is playing - REAL OR BOGUS? (If I was a gambling man, I'd say BOGUS) Regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From freequarks at gmail.com Fri Dec 12 11:39:21 2008 From: freequarks at gmail.com (Dark Matter) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 09:39:21 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? In-Reply-To: <1545035058.212771229094937835.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <1783001470.212241229094753804.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <1545035058.212771229094937835.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <822da19a0812120839h6fb1953fkcbee4f2b823fa7ad@mail.gmail.com> http://www.earthtothemoon.com/ap_11_lunar_dust.html -Martin On Fri, Dec 12, 2008 at 8:15 AM, Mike Bandli wrote: > Hello Mike G, > > I can vouch for this item and tell you that it is the real deal. There have been several presentations made with swatches of BetaCloth or other materials stained with lunar dust. Florian has been the primary supplier of these presentations and it is all legit. You can read more about his presentations on the collectSPACE.com forums. > > I might note that stained hardware and artifacts are the only legal way to own lunar material from the Apollo missions. > > Owning several lunar meteorites, I could care less about buying 10 grains of Apollo lunar glass. BUT... what makes this artifact desirable (to me, anyway) is that it is an authentic artifact from Apollo 11 - the 'grail' of human exploration. > > Cheers, > > Mike Bandli > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael Gilmer" > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 6:43:36 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific > Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? > > Hi ladies and gentlemen (and friends watching at home!) - > > It's time to play America's favorite game - "REAL OR BOGUS?" > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320324463986 > > Today's offering comes from the intrepid world of eBay. Here we see > something billed as real moon dust that was recovered from Neil > Armstrong's camera magazine. > > So, I have to ask everyone who is playing - REAL OR BOGUS? > > (If I was a gambling man, I'd say BOGUS) > > Regards and clear skies, > > MikeG > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From yellowengine at earthlink.net Fri Dec 12 12:54:09 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 11:54:09 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Moss Micro (thin slice) Message-ID: <24625274.1229104449927.JavaMail.root@elwamui-little.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Good Afternoon, Would anyone like a perfect (very thin) .6g slice of the Moss CO?.. I have an extra. Prices at $105 and I will cover USPS Priority postage with delivery confirmation. Paypal preferred. Not a bad deal, imo. Cheers, Ryan From mexicodoug at aim.com Fri Dec 12 12:55:23 2008 From: mexicodoug at aim.com (mexicodoug at aim.com) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 12:55:23 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? In-Reply-To: <1545035058.212771229094937835.JavaMail.root@sz0063a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <8CB2A99F0EDBC5F-134-3C8@FWM-M30.sysops.aol.com> Hello listees, In this time for reflection and renewal, it's hard to have any complaints ... hmmm but, I just read this eBay auction and Mike B's post answering MikeG and feel the need to talk about an human exploration hero greater than Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin, the two explorers as mentioned in the auction link. Like the Mighty Boosh, the opportunistic seller is hocking his barely perceptible particules while forgetting the third crew member that literally wrote the book on piloting base and contingency plans for the Apollo 11 command module around the Moon while Neil and Buzz checked out. Hats off to (another) Mike ! The man who safely brought these guys back from the Moon, and I am thinking the first person to orbit the Moon solo while he was at it - Is that an accomplishment?) - what an experience! Being meteorite folk it is hard to say being on the Moon's surface wouldn't have been more spectacular, but I think being completely out of touch in the command module especially tranquilly flying over the far side of the Moon alone for a day at only 113 miles altitude with a world's responsibility on his shoulders ... Then to make be the orbital pickup of the module, which seems to me the hardest part of the whole voyage. THREE (3) Cheers for our favorite Florida swamp boy, Major General Collins! and for being a superb team member bringing back the first 20 Kg of the Moon! Best wishes, Christmas and Holiday Greetings to all, Doug -----Original Message----- From: Mike Bandli To: michael w gilmer Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 10:15 am Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? Hello Mike G, I can vouch for this item and tell you that it is the real deal. There have been several presentations made with swatches of BetaCloth or other materials stained with lunar dust. Florian has been the primary supplier of these presentations and it is all legit. You can read more about his presentations on the collectSPACE.com forums. I might note that stained hardware and artifacts are the only legal way to own lunar material from the Apollo missions. Owning several lunar meteorites, I could care less about buying 10 grains of Apollo lunar glass. BUT... what makes this artifact desirable (to me, anyway) is that it is an authentic artifact from Apollo 11 - the 'grail' of human exploration. Cheers, Mike Bandli ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Gilmer" To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 6:43:36 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? Hi ladies and gentlemen (and friends watching at home!) - It's time to play America's favorite game - "REAL OR BOGUS?" http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320324463986 Today's offering comes from the intrepid world of eBay. Here we see something billed as real moon dust that was recovered from Neil Armstrong's camera magazine. So, I have to ask everyone who is playing - REAL OR BOGUS? (If I was a gambling man, I'd say BOGUS) Regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Fri Dec 12 13:37:32 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 10:37:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Mars Odyssey THEMIS Images: December 8-12, 2008 Message-ID: <200812121837.KAA07990@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> MARS ODYSSEY THEMIS IMAGES December 8-12, 2008 o Granicus Valles (Released 08 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081208a o Cerberus Fossae (Released 09 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081209a o Dark Slope Streaks (Released 10 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081210a o Terra Sabaea Channel (Released 11 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081211a o Polar Dunes (Released 12 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081212a All of the THEMIS images are archived here: http://themis.asu.edu/latest.html NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory manages the 2001 Mars Odyssey mission for NASA's Office of Space Science, Washington, D.C. The Thermal Emission Imaging System (THEMIS) was developed by Arizona State University, Tempe, in co.oration with Raytheon Santa Barbara Remote Sensing. The THEMIS investigation is led by Dr. Philip Christensen at Arizona State University. Lockheed Martin Astronautics, Denver, is the prime contractor for the Odyssey project, and developed and built the orbiter. Mission operations are conducted jointly from Lockheed Martin and from JPL, a division of the California Institute of Technology in Pasadena. From daistiho at hotmail.com Fri Dec 12 16:57:51 2008 From: daistiho at hotmail.com (tracy latimer) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 21:57:51 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Itqiy look-alikes Message-ID: A couple of years ago, I picked up a small slice of Itqiy and was promptly entranced by its oddball crystalline structure. Its classification is unique; nothing like it has ever been recovered. What meteorite(s) might be closest to it in composition/structure? Primitive achondrites? Enstatites? I've been going through the Meteoritical Bulletin database, but nothing strikes me as being similar, even meteorites like Saint-Severin, which is classified as an EH5. Any suggestions? Thanks, Tracy Latimer _________________________________________________________________ You live life online. So we put Windows on the web. http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/127032869/direct/01/ From yellowengine at earthlink.net Fri Dec 12 17:04:13 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 16:04:13 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD Moss Micro (thin slice) Message-ID: <29091418.1229119454175.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net> OK - Photo can now be found with my other pieces for sale: http://outdoors.webshots.com/album/569165160RMTnOx (thumbnails not working for some reason, just click) It is an absolutely perfect slice (1mm), but I don't need two.. so I'm passing along the savings. You will not find Moss at a lower price, anywhere. Pay by mail and I will take $5 off of the price. So.. $100 plus free USPS Priority Mail postage for this fine micromount. $105 through Paypal. Have a great weekend! Ryan -----Forwarded Message----- >From: RJP >Sent: Dec 12, 2008 11:54 AM >To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >Subject: AD: Moss Micro (thin slice) > >Good Afternoon, > >Would anyone like a perfect (very thin) .6g slice of the Moss CO?.. I have an extra. Prices at $105 and I will cover USPS Priority postage with delivery confirmation. Paypal preferred. Not a bad deal, imo. > >Cheers, > >Ryan From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Fri Dec 12 17:08:48 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 12 Dec 2008 22:08:48 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Itqiy look-alikes Message-ID: Tracy writes: "A couple of years ago, I picked up a small slice of Itqiy and was promptly entranced by its oddball crystalline structure. Its classification is unique; nothing like it has ever been recovered. What meteorite(s) might be closest to it in composition/structure? I'd say Zaklodzie is very close to it (but not identical) both in composition and structure "even meteorites like Saint-Severin, which is classified as an EH5." That's a typo like my Boxhole / Henbury typo yesterday! What you eanted to say is "Saint-Sauveur". Best wishes, Bernd From eric at meteoritewatch.com Fri Dec 12 16:57:47 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 13:57:47 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4942DE5B.4080808@meteoritewatch.com> Really!? Oops... Boy that was totally unexpected. Maybe I shouldn't have asked it as a question. I wasn't asking whether I should build a central meteorite blog for everyone to post lewd and libelous statements and trash talk. Many people want their own website, that's all I wanted to provide, and at a reasonable price. If people can't refrain from posting negative content and comments on a blog just to discredit some people or bad mouth others then you are right, the meteorite industry needs no blogs. Guess we're back to Static HTML based websites with no dynamic content, lazy pages, and cold hard text that never changes. Woohoo! Sounds exciting! Oh yeah, and it's about people who don't want to change. It's all about timing. My timing is obviously off on this one. The world is blogging and here's my prediction: Meteorite Blogs WILL be popping up in the near future. Nothing will be able to stop people from posting trash talk. People will do it regardless. (Press [Delete Comment]. Ban IP... Like Duh!) People will learn how powerful a marketing tool a blog really is. People will realize the search engines LOVE blogs. People will realize that blogs are websites too. lol Everyone will have a blog! Either way I'll admit that maybe this was a BAD IDEA or BAD TIMING! For now... :D lol oops... Thanks everyone for their input. I do appreciate it. It seems people don't want a blog. Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA From daistiho at hotmail.com Fri Dec 12 20:25:24 2008 From: daistiho at hotmail.com (tracy latimer) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 01:25:24 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] More ? about Itqiy, Zaklodzie Message-ID: I have now heard from at least 3 parties who say that Itqiy is closest in composition to Zaklodzie (and a couple of people who gently corrected my typewriter dyslexia, Saint-Sauveur rather than Saint-Severin!). The pictures I have been able to find of Zaklodzie, however, don't show the texture very well; to my uneducated eye, it looks more like a common H5 (heresy!). One of the things I find striking about Itqiy is the coarse grained crystals that look almost like commercially available black granite slab. Anyone who has access to both Itqiy and Zaklodzie slices, do they actually look similar in section? I have to do more research into the processes that produce 2 so dissimilar textures with almost the same chemical makeups... Tracy Latimer _________________________________________________________________ You live life online. So we put Windows on the web. http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/127032869/direct/01/ From geoking at notkin.net Fri Dec 12 20:26:50 2008 From: geoking at notkin.net (Notkin) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 18:26:50 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] [AD] eBay Sikhote with hole, rollover lip Taza, Neuvo Mercurio . . . Message-ID: Dear Listees: We have a number of intriguing meteorites currently on eBay, all closing this coming Sunday around 6 pm Pacific. Fans of oriented irons will want to check out this fabulous 10.3-gram Taza (NWA 859) with a 100% perfect rollover lip all the way around its trailing edge: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170285686475 Also of interest, a lovely Sikhote-Alin individual with natural hole: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160304001522 And a Nuevo Mercurio witnessed fall fusion crusted individual: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170285693025 As always. all of our meteorite auctions are NO RESERVE and other lots include Darwin Glass, a special slipcase edition of the "Oscar E. Monnig Meteorite Collection Catalog," and a very attractive complete slice of the Labenne Sahara 99034 chondrite (at just 99 cents!). All items up for auction can be seen here: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQfgtpZ1QQfrppZ25QQsassZaerolitemeteorites Instant recap with photos live and direct courtesy of Maestro Harris at Meteorite.com: http://www.meteorite.com/meteorite-dealers/dealer-listings/aerolite.htm Thanks for looking and all the best from The Baked Apple, Geoff N. www.aerolite.org www.campometeorites.com From hodgjt at yahoo.com Fri Dec 12 22:14:14 2008 From: hodgjt at yahoo.com (jeff hodges) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 19:14:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] New thin section photos Message-ID: <5467.90689.qm@web36706.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hello All, I have added LOTS of new thin section pictures to my Thin Section Gallery website. Too many to list. Anyone interested please follow the link below. Thanks and enjoy! Jeff Hodges http://www.meteoritethinsectiongallery.com/Alphaindex.html From mikewren at gilanet.com Fri Dec 12 22:40:47 2008 From: mikewren at gilanet.com (michael cottingham) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 20:40:47 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: BEST SALE OF THE YEAR-HIGHLIGHTS ADDED! Message-ID: HAPPY HOLIDAYS TO ALL! Well it is well underway: 37 Auctions listed at 0.99 cents, with a retail value of over $10,000.00 and a Store wide sale on over 200 meteorite specimens from 10% to 30% off! The sale should be starting at any moment! Go to: http://stores.ebay.com/voyage-botanica-natural-history They are some great meteorites listed and some great prices! Highlights: Beautiful Iron, Sweden, MUONIONALUSTA, 774g, One Of The Largest Inclusions ever! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286680831 Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 20.28g, One of my last auction specimens! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721166 Beautiful GIBEON, IVA Iron Specimen, 432g. A fantastic complete slice! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721158 Seldom Available GRUVER, Texas, H4, 3.84g, nice one! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448362 Nice H3 From Namibia, KORRA KORRABES, 19.88g, Seldom available these days http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448373 Pallasite From Australia-HUCKITTA, 9.98 gram, cool looking. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448385 Super Rare Fall BATH FURNACE, Kentucky, 1.28g, These are my last specimens! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448407 Loaded W/Inclusions ODESSA, IAB, 346 gram CS, Do Not Miss This One! Museum Grade Slice! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286691003 SEYMCHAN Meteorite with Beautiful Etching, 67 gram, Really Nice! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669080 BRENHAM, Siderite From Kansas, 15.65 gram, You got to see this part slice! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286679720 Rare GLORIETA MOUNTAIN, Full Slice, 274 gram!, A complete Slice- Holiday Special- You will not see this again! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669088 Rare NWA 2696, Howardite From Africa, 4.00g, A real nice part slice. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448428 Rare NWA 2932, Mesosiderite, Nice! 2.02 gram, Again, another nice part slice! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448460 A very Rare EL3 From Africa, NWA 2965, 200g, THE BLUE TYPE! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448472 RARE, SILVERTON, Texas, H4, LTKW, 0.54 gram, Only A Few Left! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286452520 CANYON DIABLO Individual, 342 gram, Avery nice individual! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286452529 Seldom Available TULIA (b), Texas, L6, 0.51g, Nice slice. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665036 Seldom Available BRISCOE, Texas, L5, 4.56g, real nice. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665042 Classic GOLD BASIN, Arizona, L4, 52.79 gram, excellent individual! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665055 (NEW) NWA 4851, L6 With Shock Lines, 80.20g, I love this meteorite-it is so cool! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665040 Rare NWA 2635, Metachondrite-Achondrite,1.33g, Very rare and I only have a few! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665063 Rare Ureilite From Africa, NWA 2634, 1.21g, I only have a few of these. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665068 (New) NWA 4734, Lunar Specimen Display! Good Deal! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669077 Very Rare and Beautiful, NWA 801, CR2, 4.20g, running low on this one too! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286679754 Ungrouped Ataxite, DRONINO, Russia, 109.62g, nice complete slice. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286680835 Super Rare GEORGETOWN, Australia, 17.28 gram, This IS my very last slice to auction out at 0.99 cents. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286711566 Amazing Lunar Highlands, NWA 5000, 0.184g, nice pieces! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721163 TULIA (a), Texas, H5, Complete Slice, 115.5g, Bigger than most Tulia Specimens for Sale! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721170 Extremely Rare NAVAJO, Arizona, IIAB Iron! Only piece I have. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721157 A Beautiful Sikhote-Alin, IIAB Iron, 244g, This is a GREAT COMPLETE SLICE! One of my last to offer! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286699668 JIDDAT AL HARASIS 003, Oman, L5, 3.63 gram, I only have a couple left. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286698869 (New) NWA 4881, Lunar Feldspathic Specimen, these are really nice and big! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669093 A Classic, OZONA, Texas, H6 Chondrite, 36.64g, This is a nice big slice! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286679745 (New) Martian Shergottite, NWA 4925, "Mars", these are nice too! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669097 Classic GOLD BASIN, Arizona, L4, 26.46 gram, must look at this slice! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286690992 An Early # NWA 103, L6 From Africa, 14.88g, you do not see this one too often! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286698860 (NEW), LA LUZ, New Mexico, H4, LTKW, 13.17g, running low and when these are gone that is it! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286691010 HERE ARE SOME SET PRICED AUCTIONS THAT ARE SWEET< SWEET DEALS! Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 64g, A sweet deal for someone! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287874445 Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 106g NICE! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287896502 MAIN MASS- NWA 2083, CO3, LTKW, 35.57g !!!!! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287895439 Loaded W/Inclusions ODESSA, IAB, 928 gram EC, DO NOT LET THIS ONE PASS YOU UP! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287885971 and many others!!! THANKS AND BEST WISHES MICHAEL COTTINGHAM From STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com Fri Dec 12 22:58:58 2008 From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com (STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 22:58:58 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] New thin section photos Message-ID: Absolutely beautiful! Every one should go to this site. We all need some relaxation, why not relax while looking at meteorite hidden beauty. Not only is Jeff skilled at the microscope, he is very generous with his institutional sized thin section collection. Most of the exotic material I have in my Micrograph Gallery is a result of Jeff's loans to me. This would be "off the chart" cool for any one to do but when you look at his work as see how fantastic it is, well, it should give you an idea of what a great guy he is and how dedicated to the art of meteorite microphotography he is. So take a look and drop him an email to say thanks! Tom Phillips In a message dated 12/12/2008 8:14:23 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, hodgjt at yahoo.com writes: Hello All, I have added LOTS of new thin section pictures to my Thin Section Gallery website. Too many to list. Anyone interested please follow the link below. Thanks and enjoy! Jeff Hodges http://www.meteoritethinsectiongallery.com/Alphaindex.html ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From cynapse at charter.net Fri Dec 12 23:26:16 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 20:26:16 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? In-Reply-To: <4941B6D6.70700@meteoritewatch.com> References: <4941B6D6.70700@meteoritewatch.com> Message-ID: Key entries from a meteorite blog: "i wuz crusin around today and Jupiter TOTALLY just shoved me out of his way, and i was like "what'd i ever do to you" and he was all like not even noticin me and I was all like "what's up with that"" ... "You know that bright light we be always crusin around? It looks like its gettin' brighter every day. And warmer, too, I'm startin' to heat up! OMGWTFBBQ!" ... "Now theres a blue light, and its gettin bigger to. Startin to look like a ball. LOL! Whut?" ... "Did i say i was gettin hot before? Brah, i didn't know what hot waz! That big blue ball kept getting bigger and I was all like "get out of my way" and it was all like "eff you" and i hit it (but not in a good way) and I was like ON FIRE and i fell down and now im in a hole and i cant move and this is really some messed up $hit" From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Sat Dec 13 01:13:16 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 22:13:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Sharp eyes in Tanzania? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <769494.98934.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> 10 meteorites have been found in Tanzania. 9 of them are witnessed falls. That's a pretty good batting average I think. Is there any other nation with a similar high ratio of falls to finds? Some other trivia about Tanzania's 10 meteorites : 1) Rupota is the only witnessed fall of the L4-6 petrologic type. (same type as NWA 869) 2) Peramiho is a witnessed fall eucrite. 3) The massive ungrouped iron Mbosi is in Tanzania. 4) Ivuna is a witnessed fall CI1 carbonaceous, one of only 9 known. 5) the rest of Tanzania's falls include : an EL6, an LL6, and 3 OC's. Not too bad for only 10 meteorites. :) Regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Sat Dec 13 01:16:19 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 22:16:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Make that 9 meteorites from Tanzania, not 10 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <853713.343.qm@web58406.mail.re3.yahoo.com> CORRECTION : Actually, there is only 9 meteorites from Tanzania, not 10 like I said in my original post! ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From radio_ranch at yahoo.com Sat Dec 13 03:33:50 2008 From: radio_ranch at yahoo.com (Pat Brown) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 00:33:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? In-Reply-To: <8CB2A99F0EDBC5F-134-3C8@FWM-M30.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <837897.65161.qm@web51312.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hello fellow listoids, Mexico Doug's post about Michael Collins praises a lesser known hero of the Apollo program. IMNSHO, Michael Collins is also the most gifted author among his Apollo brethern. In his books _Carrying the Fire_ and _Liftoff_ Michael captures some of the awe in a project with superlative after superlative. It should also be noted that Michael's solo orbit of the moon made him the lonliest person ever up to that time. When Michael was on the opposite side of the moon from Earth (the so called dark side), he was the farthest individual human from any other humans. Following the United States manned spaceflight program kindled my interest in the pure and applied sciences and was a major formative experience for myself and most of my peers. And to think that decades later we are now the proud owners (or perhaps stewards) of meteorites including material from the moon.......wow. All this makes me proud to be an American. Best Regards, Pat Scientific Lifestyle Meteorites Engineer by Vocation, Meteorite Hunter While on Vacation --- On Fri, 12/12/08, mexicodoug at aim.com wrote: > From: mexicodoug at aim.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? > To: fuzzfoot at comcast.net, michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 12, 2008, 9:55 AM > Hello listees, > > > In this time for reflection and renewal, it's hard to > have any complaints ... hmmm but, I just read this eBay > auction and Mike B's post answering MikeG and feel the > need to talk about an human exploration hero greater than > Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin, the two explorers as > mentioned in the auction link. > > Like the Mighty Boosh, the opportunistic seller is hocking > his barely perceptible particules while forgetting the third > crew member that literally wrote the book on piloting base > and contingency plans for the Apollo 11 command module > around the Moon while Neil and Buzz checked out. Hats off > to (another) Mike ! The man who safely brought these guys > back from the Moon, and I am thinking the first person to > orbit the Moon solo while he was at it - Is that an > accomplishment?) - what an experience! Being meteorite folk > it is hard to say being on the Moon's surface > wouldn't have been more spectacular, but I think being > completely out of touch in the command module especially > tranquilly flying over the far side of the Moon alone for a > day at only 113 miles altitude with a world's > responsibility on his shoulders ... Then to make be the > orbital pickup of the module, which seems to me the hardest > part of the whole voyage. > > THREE (3) Cheers for our favorite Florida swamp boy, Major > General Collins! and for being a superb team member bringing > back the first 20 Kg of the Moon! > > Best wishes, Christmas and Holiday Greetings to all, > Doug > > -----Original Message----- > From: Mike Bandli > To: michael w gilmer > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Sent: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 10:15 am > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? > > > > Hello Mike G, > > I can vouch for this item and tell you that it is the real > deal. There have been > several presentations made with swatches of BetaCloth or > other materials stained > with lunar dust. Florian has been the primary supplier of > these presentations > and it is all legit. You can read more about his > presentations on the > collectSPACE.com forums. > > I might note that stained hardware and artifacts are the > only legal way to own > lunar material from the Apollo missions. > > Owning several lunar meteorites, I could care less about > buying 10 grains of > Apollo lunar glass. BUT... what makes this artifact > desirable (to me, anyway) is > that it is an authentic artifact from Apollo 11 - the > 'grail' of human > exploration. > > Cheers, > > Mike Bandli > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael Gilmer" > > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 6:43:36 AM GMT -08:00 > US/Canada Pacific > Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? > > Hi ladies and gentlemen (and friends watching at home!) - > > It's time to play America's favorite game - > "REAL OR BOGUS?" > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320324463986 > > Today's offering comes from the intrepid world of eBay. > Here we see > something billed as real moon dust that was recovered from > Neil > Armstrong's camera magazine. > > So, I have to ask everyone who is playing - REAL OR BOGUS? > > (If I was a gambling man, I'd say BOGUS) > > Regards and clear skies, > > MikeG > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and > http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr Sat Dec 13 03:58:11 2008 From: Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr (Zelimir Gabelica) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 09:58:11 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] More ? about Itqiy, Zaklodzie In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20081213085120.02982ca0@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Hi Tracy, Being the lucky owner of slices if similar size (about 2x2 cm) of Itqiy and Zaklodzie, I can tell you (qualitatively) that their textures are definitely different. However we all know that a macroscopic texture is very seldom characteristic of a meteorite type (most of the ordinary chondrites are the best examples). For "odd" meteorite types, as I am not at all expert, just curious, I love to browse through the wonderful web site of David Weir: http://www.meteoritestudies.com/ David reports (among other features) that, although Itqiy was classified in Met. Bull as "EH7-an", "while similarities do exist between Itqiy and EH or EL chondrites, the many inconsistencies make a definitive assignment (to EH group) tenious..." Founded upon the recent report published by "Keil & Bischoff, 2008" (so cited), he also states that: "Itqiy is very similar to NWA 2656 (btw classified as "E-achon" in Met. Bull.) "with which it shares many textural and morphological characteristics"...and also: "that both may have formed on the same parent body, distinct from that associated with EH, EL, Shallowater and aubrites"... We all know that one should only rely on the officially published data in Met. Bull. database. However as, on one hand, Weir very often reports data from recent publications (that he obviously summarizes or to which he possibly sometimes just adds some (to me always pertinent) comemnts) and, on the other hand, such data are not (always) reported in the database that, as one can understand, are not easy to update continuously, I like to keep Weir's updatings in mind for my best understanding, hoping that the new publications will sooner or later be taken into account officially. This being, I don't have the paper of Keil and Bischoff on hand to better compare. Perhaps Bernd can help ? Regarding similarities between Zaklodzie (classified in Met. Bull. as "E achon-ung" but that recent studies by Keil (2007) and Keil & Bischoff (2008) rather classify as E imb chondrite) and Itqiy, I encourage you to read the very informative statements Weir reports regarding Zaklodzie. He concludes: "...despite the very close similarities between Zaklodzie and the ungrouped enstatite achondrite Itqiy, their chemical end mineral compositions, noble gas contents and terrestrial ages EXCLUDE an origin of both meteorites from a common parent body". I am just reporting here some published data and my poor expertise in that domain does not pretend to solve the question. As a scientist, I learned that we should be cautious with new data but that, on the other hand, there can also be always some (minor or major) thruth behind. Assembling and summarizing (with expertise) such data is, among many other merits, the deep interest of David Weir's statements. I hope this helps. My best, Zelimir A 01:25 13/12/2008 +0000, tracy latimer a ?crit : >I have now heard from at least 3 parties who say that Itqiy is closest in >composition to Zaklodzie (and a couple of people who gently corrected my >typewriter dyslexia, Saint-Sauveur rather than Saint-Severin!). The >pictures I have been able to find of Zaklodzie, however, don't show the >texture very well; to my uneducated eye, it looks more like a common H5 >(heresy!). One of the things I find striking about Itqiy is the coarse >grained crystals that look almost like commercially available black >granite slab. Anyone who has access to both Itqiy and Zaklodzie slices, >do they actually look similar in section? > >I have to do more research into the processes that produce 2 so dissimilar >textures with almost the same chemical makeups... > >Tracy Latimer >_________________________________________________________________ >You live life online. So we put Windows on the web. >http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/127032869/direct/01/ >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From psc2410xi at yahoo.com Sat Dec 13 05:37:54 2008 From: psc2410xi at yahoo.com (Don Rawlings) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 02:37:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? Message-ID: <442782.26118.qm@web59307.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Sounds like there is some real intelligent conversations going on there. LOL Don Rawlings --- On Fri, 12/12/08, Darren Garrison wrote: > From: Darren Garrison > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Friday, December 12, 2008, 11:26 PM > Key entries from a meteorite blog: > > "i wuz crusin around today and Jupiter TOTALLY just > shoved me out of his way, > and i was like "what'd i ever do to you" and > he was all like not even noticin me > and I was all like "what's up with > that"" > > ... > > > "You know that bright light we be always crusin > around? It looks like its > gettin' brighter every day. And warmer, too, I'm > startin' to heat up! > OMGWTFBBQ!" > > ... > > > "Now theres a blue light, and its gettin bigger to. > Startin to look like a > ball. LOL! Whut?" > > ... > > > "Did i say i was gettin hot before? Brah, i > didn't know what hot waz! That big > blue ball kept getting bigger and I was all like "get > out of my way" and it was > all like "eff you" and i hit it (but not in a > good way) and I was like ON FIRE > and i fell down and now im in a hole and i cant move and > this is really some > messed up $hit" > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From jgrossman at usgs.gov Sat Dec 13 07:55:51 2008 From: jgrossman at usgs.gov (Jeff Grossman) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 07:55:51 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Sharp eyes in Tanzania? In-Reply-To: <769494.98934.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <769494.98934.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4943B0D7.2000404@usgs.gov> 40 countries have had ONLY falls and no finds, with Pakistan, Bangladesh, and Ireland leading the way with 15, 8, and 6 falls, respectively, and no finds. Other countries that outperform Tanzania in fall/find ratio are Sudan (9/1), Turkey (11/1), India (126/9) and Indonesia (16/1). Sudan is the anomaly here, as arid countries almost all have very low fall/find ratios. jeff Michael Gilmer wrote: > 10 meteorites have been found in Tanzania. 9 of them are witnessed > falls. That's a pretty good batting average I think. Is there any > other nation with a similar high ratio of falls to finds? > > Some other trivia about Tanzania's 10 meteorites : > > 1) Rupota is the only witnessed fall of the L4-6 petrologic type. (same type as NWA 869) > > 2) Peramiho is a witnessed fall eucrite. > > 3) The massive ungrouped iron Mbosi is in Tanzania. > > 4) Ivuna is a witnessed fall CI1 carbonaceous, one of only 9 known. > > 5) the rest of Tanzania's falls include : an EL6, an LL6, and 3 OC's. > > Not too bad for only 10 meteorites. :) > > Regards and clear skies, > > MikeG > > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > -- Dr. Jeffrey N. Grossman phone: (703) 648-6184 US Geological Survey fax: (703) 648-6383 954 National Center Reston, VA 20192, USA From tett at rogers.com Sat Dec 13 08:54:27 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 08:54:27 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Name the new Canadian fall References: <769494.98934.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <4943B0D7.2000404@usgs.gov> Message-ID: Jeff and List, Wondering who has final authority in naming new meteorites? I know there are some general guidelines (nearest post office or town or landmark) but who has final say? Will the peopel from U of Calgary be allowed input? Can the met list opinion influence the final name? I am asking these questions in hopes of influencing the final name of the new Canadian fall. It has been rerefed to as Lone Rock (too John Waynish for a Canadian stone), Marsden (Not bad but no distinct Canadian sound), Lloydminster (Getting better) and Buzzard Coulee (Now we are talking!) Looking at the map there are some other cool names close by such as Unwin, Zumbro and Manitou Lake. Manitou being the Ojibwey name for the Great Spirit or spirits. Well, if it counts, my vote would be for Buzzard Coulee. Cheers, Mike Tettenborn, Owen Sound, Ontario From michael at spacerocksinc.com Sat Dec 13 09:11:06 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 06:11:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 13, 2008 Message-ID: <1108400.2853221229177466938.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_13_2008.html From jgrossman at usgs.gov Sat Dec 13 10:04:16 2008 From: jgrossman at usgs.gov (Jeff Grossman) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 10:04:16 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Name the new Canadian fall In-Reply-To: References: <769494.98934.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <4943B0D7.2000404@usgs.gov> Message-ID: <4943CEF0.7080408@usgs.gov> The final selection of a name rests with the Nomenclature Committee. They have guidelines about what characterizes a proper meteorite name (and contrary to popular belief, these do not say anything about post offices). However, there are no rules at all regarding who may propose a name for a new meteorite. Normally, the group that submits the initial characterization of the meteorite to the NomCom makes a suggestion about what the name should be. Surprisingly, there have been only a few cases where multiple suggestions have been made by different groups. A recent example was Carancas (vs. Desaguadero). I don't know how the committee would react to suggestions coming out of the community at large. I think they would probably give deference to the finder and/or initial-characterization team, unless a counter-suggestion was backed by a better reason than "too John Waynish" or "no distinct Canadian sound." But if I was doing the initial description of this meteorite, I would be thinking as you are. If I could pick from multiple names of nearby geographic features and some are boring and some are cool, I'd go for cool; if Buzzard Coulee was one of my choices, it would be a no-brainer (except that maybe folks from Saskatchewan would not want a name with the initials B.C.). Jeff tett wrote: > Jeff and List, > > Wondering who has final authority in naming new meteorites? I know > there are some general guidelines (nearest post office or town or > landmark) but who has final say? Will the peopel from U of Calgary be > allowed input? Can the met list opinion influence the final name? > > I am asking these questions in hopes of influencing the final name of > the new Canadian fall. It has been rerefed to as Lone Rock (too John > Waynish for a Canadian stone), Marsden (Not bad but no distinct > Canadian sound), Lloydminster (Getting better) and Buzzard Coulee (Now > we are talking!) > > Looking at the map there are some other cool names close by such as > Unwin, Zumbro and Manitou Lake. Manitou being the Ojibwey name for > the Great Spirit or spirits. > > Well, if it counts, my vote would be for Buzzard Coulee. > > Cheers, > > Mike Tettenborn, > Owen Sound, Ontario > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Dr. Jeffrey N. Grossman phone: (703) 648-6184 US Geological Survey fax: (703) 648-6383 954 National Center Reston, VA 20192, USA From tett at rogers.com Sat Dec 13 10:15:58 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 10:15:58 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Name the new Canadian fall In-Reply-To: <4943CEF0.7080408@usgs.gov> References: <769494.98934.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <4943B0D7.2000404@usgs.gov> <4943CEF0.7080408@usgs.gov> Message-ID: <4943D1AE.2050802@rogers.com> Thanks Jeff for the insightful response. I suppose it will be 6+ months until we know and at least I have sown the seed for cool. I still remember the sad time when Bilanga-Yanga was shortened to Bilanga. Cheers!, Mike Tettenborn Jeff Grossman wrote: > The final selection of a name rests with the Nomenclature Committee. > They have guidelines about what characterizes a proper meteorite name > (and contrary to popular belief, these do not say anything about post > offices). However, there are no rules at all regarding who may > propose a name for a new meteorite. > > Normally, the group that submits the initial characterization of the > meteorite to the NomCom makes a suggestion about what the name should > be. Surprisingly, there have been only a few cases where multiple > suggestions have been made by different groups. A recent example was > Carancas (vs. Desaguadero). I don't know how the committee would > react to suggestions coming out of the community at large. I think > they would probably give deference to the finder and/or > initial-characterization team, unless a counter-suggestion was backed > by a better reason than "too John Waynish" or "no distinct Canadian > sound." > But if I was doing the initial description of this meteorite, I would > be thinking as you are. If I could pick from multiple names of nearby > geographic features and some are boring and some are cool, I'd go for > cool; if Buzzard Coulee was one of my choices, it would be a > no-brainer (except that maybe folks from Saskatchewan would not want a > name with the initials B.C.). > > Jeff > > tett wrote: >> Jeff and List, >> >> Wondering who has final authority in naming new meteorites? I know >> there are some general guidelines (nearest post office or town or >> landmark) but who has final say? Will the peopel from U of Calgary >> be allowed input? Can the met list opinion influence the final name? >> >> I am asking these questions in hopes of influencing the final name of >> the new Canadian fall. It has been rerefed to as Lone Rock (too John >> Waynish for a Canadian stone), Marsden (Not bad but no distinct >> Canadian sound), Lloydminster (Getting better) and Buzzard Coulee >> (Now we are talking!) >> >> Looking at the map there are some other cool names close by such as >> Unwin, Zumbro and Manitou Lake. Manitou being the Ojibwey name for >> the Great Spirit or spirits. >> >> Well, if it counts, my vote would be for Buzzard Coulee. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Mike Tettenborn, >> Owen Sound, Ontario >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > > From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Sat Dec 13 10:29:10 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 07:29:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Name the new Canadian fall In-Reply-To: <4943CEF0.7080408@usgs.gov> Message-ID: <559488.94251.qm@web45601.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I have read several places, including a Nininger book that post offices were used to help determine the meteorite name. --- On Sat, 12/13/08, Jeff Grossman wrote: > From: Jeff Grossman > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Name the new Canadian fall > To: "tett" > Cc: "Meteorite-list" > Date: Saturday, December 13, 2008, 10:04 AM > The final selection of a name rests with the Nomenclature > Committee. They have guidelines about what characterizes a > proper meteorite name (and contrary to popular belief, these > do not say anything about post offices). However, there are > no rules at all regarding who may propose a name for a new > meteorite. > > Normally, the group that submits the initial > characterization of the meteorite to the NomCom makes a > suggestion about what the name should be. Surprisingly, > there have been only a few cases where multiple suggestions > have been made by different groups. A recent example was > Carancas (vs. Desaguadero). I don't know how the > committee would react to suggestions coming out of the > community at large. I think they would probably give > deference to the finder and/or initial-characterization > team, unless a counter-suggestion was backed by a better > reason than "too John Waynish" or "no > distinct Canadian sound." > But if I was doing the initial description of this > meteorite, I would be thinking as you are. If I could pick > from multiple names of nearby geographic features and some > are boring and some are cool, I'd go for cool; if > Buzzard Coulee was one of my choices, it would be a > no-brainer (except that maybe folks from Saskatchewan would > not want a name with the initials B.C.). > > Jeff > > tett wrote: > > Jeff and List, > > > > Wondering who has final authority in naming new > meteorites? I know there are some general guidelines > (nearest post office or town or landmark) but who has final > say? Will the peopel from U of Calgary be allowed input? > Can the met list opinion influence the final name? > > > > I am asking these questions in hopes of influencing > the final name of the new Canadian fall. It has been > rerefed to as Lone Rock (too John Waynish for a Canadian > stone), Marsden (Not bad but no distinct Canadian sound), > Lloydminster (Getting better) and Buzzard Coulee (Now we are > talking!) > > > > Looking at the map there are some other cool names > close by such as Unwin, Zumbro and Manitou Lake. Manitou > being the Ojibwey name for the Great Spirit or spirits. > > > > Well, if it counts, my vote would be for Buzzard > Coulee. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Mike Tettenborn, > > Owen Sound, Ontario > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > -- Dr. Jeffrey N. Grossman phone: (703) 648-6184 > US Geological Survey fax: (703) 648-6383 > 954 National Center > Reston, VA 20192, USA > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From asean-1 at xnet.ro Sat Dec 13 10:30:30 2008 From: asean-1 at xnet.ro (Razvan Andrei) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 17:30:30 +0200 Subject: [meteorite-list] New fall in Romania References: <769494.98934.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <4943B0D7.2000404@ usgs.gov><4943CEF0.7080408@usgs.gov > <4943D1AE.2050802@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1B4DE0229CDD4C20AAF80BDE0A03195B@asean1> Hi List I'm happy to announce a new fall in Romania. After a fireball seen in 3 counties and sonic booms, a stone of 6.2 kg was found in a little impact hole. I've seen the stone, my guess is that it is a L4 based on an XRF measurment of Fe and a close examination of the little broken surface. The true analysis will be performed in January next year. For the moment this is the only piece found and I dont think it will be available for the market. photos available at : http://www.flickr.com/photos/imca7652 Best regards, Andrei IMCA7652 _______________________________________________________________ Vodafone scaneaza automat toate mesajele impotriva virusilor folosind Trend Micro VirusWall. Vodafone automatically scans all messages for viruses using Trend Micro VirusWall. _______________________________________________________________ Nota: Este posibil ca produsul Trend Micro VirusWall sa nu detecteze toti virusii noi sau toate variantele lor. Va rugam sa luati in considerare ca exista un risc de fiecare data cind deschideti fisiere atasate si ca Vodafone Romania nu este responsabila pentru orice prejudiciu cauzat de decizia dvs. Disclaimer: It is possible that the Trend Micro VirusWall product may not be able to detect all new viruses and variants. Please be aware that there is a risk involved whenever opening e-mail attachments to your computer and that Vodafone Romania is not responsible for any damages caused by your decision to do so. From gmhupe at htn.net Sat Dec 13 10:34:30 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 10:34:30 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Name Game References: <769494.98934.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <4943B0D7.2000404@usgs.gov><4943CEF0.7080408@usgs.gov> <4943D1AE.2050802@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1C60F3FD4A2F430AB92C4669C1EA6B17@Gregor> Hello Mike and Jeff, This reminds me of when (Amgala) Oum Dreyga was brought to being. Our team (Moroccan hunters and us) received the first of the stones to be recovered and submitted the type sample for classification and "Amgala" as the name. As more stones were recovered, "Amgala" was the recognized/used name (amongst collectors and some scientists). As some time went by, more, larger material was found in Oum Dreyga (approximately SSW from Amgala) and in between from Amgala. Some months after we sent in the classification, another team from France submitted a type sample and asked for the name, "Oum Dreyga", from which the name was officially recognized and "Amgala" became a synonym of it. I personally think that the area from which the first material was collected should be the assigned name (most likely the stones started falling here), but perhaps the area from which the largest stones were recovered was preferred by the committee. A fun lesson in naming, none the less! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "tett" To: "Jeff Grossman" Cc: "Meteorite-list" Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 10:15 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Name the new Canadian fall > Thanks Jeff for the insightful response. > > I suppose it will be 6+ months until we know and at least I have sown the > seed for cool. > > I still remember the sad time when Bilanga-Yanga was shortened to Bilanga. > > Cheers!, > > Mike Tettenborn > > > Jeff Grossman wrote: >> The final selection of a name rests with the Nomenclature Committee. >> They have guidelines about what characterizes a proper meteorite name >> (and contrary to popular belief, these do not say anything about post >> offices). However, there are no rules at all regarding who may propose a >> name for a new meteorite. >> >> Normally, the group that submits the initial characterization of the >> meteorite to the NomCom makes a suggestion about what the name should be. >> Surprisingly, there have been only a few cases where multiple suggestions >> have been made by different groups. A recent example was Carancas (vs. >> Desaguadero). I don't know how the committee would react to suggestions >> coming out of the community at large. I think they would probably give >> deference to the finder and/or initial-characterization team, unless a >> counter-suggestion was backed by a better reason than "too John Waynish" >> or "no distinct Canadian sound." >> But if I was doing the initial description of this meteorite, I would be >> thinking as you are. If I could pick from multiple names of nearby >> geographic features and some are boring and some are cool, I'd go for >> cool; if Buzzard Coulee was one of my choices, it would be a no-brainer >> (except that maybe folks from Saskatchewan would not want a name with the >> initials B.C.). >> >> Jeff >> >> tett wrote: >>> Jeff and List, >>> >>> Wondering who has final authority in naming new meteorites? I know >>> there are some general guidelines (nearest post office or town or >>> landmark) but who has final say? Will the peopel from U of Calgary be >>> allowed input? Can the met list opinion influence the final name? >>> >>> I am asking these questions in hopes of influencing the final name of >>> the new Canadian fall. It has been rerefed to as Lone Rock (too John >>> Waynish for a Canadian stone), Marsden (Not bad but no distinct Canadian >>> sound), Lloydminster (Getting better) and Buzzard Coulee (Now we are >>> talking!) >>> >>> Looking at the map there are some other cool names close by such as >>> Unwin, Zumbro and Manitou Lake. Manitou being the Ojibwey name for the >>> Great Spirit or spirits. >>> >>> Well, if it counts, my vote would be for Buzzard Coulee. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Mike Tettenborn, >>> Owen Sound, Ontario >>> ______________________________________________ >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>> >> >> > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From grf2 at verizon.net Sat Dec 13 10:36:33 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 10:36:33 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 13, 2008 References: <1108400.2853221229177466938.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: Wow! that's a different look. no wonder such a unique classification ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Johnson" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 9:11 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 13,2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_13_2008.html > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Sat Dec 13 11:08:42 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 08:08:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] More Meteorite Geography Trivia In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <677957.68667.qm@web58402.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Some more meteorite-geography trivia : 1) Jamaica has one known meteorite, Lucky Hill, an iron IIIAB. What are the chances of a meteorite landing on a relatively-small island in the middle of a sea? This meteorite could have easily ended up on the bottom of the Caribbean, but instead it gets to spend it's days in a tropical beach paradise. (I hope it's stored with some dessicant!) 2) Iran has only 2 known meteorites - both of them witnessed falls! Naragh is an H6 hammer stone that penetrated the roof of a school on August 18, 1974. No casualties were reported. The other fall is Veramin, a mesosiderite, which fell around April 18, 1880. Veramin has been kept in Tehran's Golestan Palace since then. 3) Ireland has 6 recorded meteorites - all of them witnessed falls. (The Tanzanians have competition!) All of Ireland's meteorites have been OC's and one remains unclassified - Pettiswood. 4) Not to be left out, Northern Ireland (statisically seperatre from Ireland proper) has 2 known meteorites, both OC witnessed falls. 5) The United States has over 1519 approved meteorites! This US tally includes : 2 acapulcoites 5 aubrites 22 carbonaceous chondrites 2 diogenites 4 EL chondrites 11 eucrites more OC's than you can shake a magnetic cane at 4 howardites a boatload of irons 2 Martian meteorites (LA001/002 & Lafayette) 8 mesosiderites 18 pallasites 1 rumuruti chondrite 2 ureilites 2 winonaites :) ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From majbaermann at web.de Sat Dec 13 11:33:58 2008 From: majbaermann at web.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Matthias_B=E4rmann?=) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 17:33:58 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] New fall in Romania References: <769494.98934.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <4943B0D7.2000404@usgs.gov><4943CEF0.7080408@usgs.gov> <4943D1AE.2050802@rogers.com> <1B4DE0229CDD4C20AAF80BDE0A03195B@asean1> Message-ID: <06DF752800C04F17B7AF9D8ECE5F36AA@thinkcentre> Hello Andrei, congratulations to Romania: what a wonderful stone! In addition it's always great to have photographs of the meteorite in situ. When did the fall exactly happen? My best, Matthias Baermann ----- Original Message ----- From: "Razvan Andrei" To: Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 4:30 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] New fall in Romania > > Hi List > > I'm happy to announce a new fall in Romania. After a fireball seen in 3 > counties and sonic booms, a stone > of 6.2 kg was found in a little impact hole. I've seen the stone, my guess > is that it is a L4 based on an > XRF measurment of Fe and a close examination > of the little broken surface. The true analysis will be > performed in January next year. For the moment > this is the only piece found and I dont think it will be > available for the market. > > photos available at : > http://www.flickr.com/photos/imca7652 > > Best regards, > Andrei > IMCA7652 > > > _______________________________________________________________ > Vodafone scaneaza automat toate mesajele impotriva virusilor folosind > Trend Micro VirusWall. > Vodafone automatically scans all messages for viruses using Trend Micro > VirusWall. > _______________________________________________________________ > Nota: Este posibil ca produsul Trend Micro VirusWall sa nu detecteze toti > virusii noi sau toate variantele lor. Va rugam sa luati in considerare ca > exista un risc de fiecare data cind deschideti fisiere atasate si ca > Vodafone Romania nu este responsabila pentru orice prejudiciu cauzat de > decizia dvs. > Disclaimer: It is possible that the Trend Micro VirusWall product may not > be able to detect all new viruses and variants. Please be aware that there > is a risk involved whenever opening e-mail attachments to your computer > and that Vodafone Romania is not responsible for any damages caused by > your decision to do so. > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From fcressy at prodigy.net Sat Dec 13 11:45:24 2008 From: fcressy at prodigy.net (Frank Cressy) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 08:45:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Fw: Re: More Meteorite Geography Trivia Message-ID: <574209.74056.qm@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hello All, Michael wrote: > 1) Jamaica has one known meteorite, Lucky Hill, an > iron IIIAB. What are the chances of a meteorite landing on > a relatively small island in the middle of a sea? This > meteorite could have easily ended up on the bottom of > the Caribbean, but instead it gets to spend it's days > in a tropical beach paradise. I think Hawaii goes one better. Two meteorite falls, Honolulu (1825) and Palolo Valley (1949) both fell on Oahu, a small island in the much larger Pacific Ocean. Incidently both meteorites fell in the capitol of Honolulu only about five miles from one another. Cheers, Frank From Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr Sat Dec 13 12:00:34 2008 From: Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr (Zelimir Gabelica) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 18:00:34 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fw: Re: More Meteorite Geography Trivia In-Reply-To: <574209.74056.qm@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20081213175032.029e68b0@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Frank is perfectly right. Now, if you take into account the ratio between the weight (kg) and the island surface area, you can calculate the average number of meteorite kg thet fell per square km for 3 small islands (there could be more) Island surface (km2) Meteorite tkw kg/km2 (x 10-3) Oahu 1545 Honolulu + P. Valley 3.682 2.38 Mauritius 1866 Mauritius 0.222 0.189 Jamaica 11425 Lucky Hill 20.4+ 1.79+ Now taking 2 small countries (I did not go through all): Lesotho 30355 Thuathe 30+ 0.99 Swaziland 17363 Dwaleni 3.230 0.186 In all cases Oahu wins... Good going for other weird evaluations! Cheers Zelimir A 08:45 13/12/2008 -0800, Frank Cressy a ?crit : > Hello All, > > Michael wrote: > > > > 1) Jamaica has one known meteorite, Lucky Hill, an > > iron IIIAB. What are the chances of a meteorite landing on > > a relatively small island in the middle of a sea? This > > meteorite could have easily ended up on the bottom of > > the Caribbean, but instead it gets to spend it's days > > in a tropical beach paradise. > >I think Hawaii goes one better. Two meteorite falls, >Honolulu (1825) and Palolo Valley (1949) both fell on Oahu, >a small island in the much larger Pacific Ocean. Incidently >both meteorites fell in the capitol of Honolulu only about five miles from >one another. > >Cheers, > >Frank >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From cynapse at charter.net Sat Dec 13 03:10:28 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 00:10:28 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Interesting meteorite speculation In-Reply-To: <769494.98934.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <769494.98934.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4ar6k4to9ee3r2r7o0f5171cqtnk9nt7ej@4ax.com> Probably nothing to this. But if Carancas had hit a building containing flammable materials instead of wet soil, think it could have started a fire? http://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/newsdetail1.asp?storyID=149525 Big fire damages warehouse building 14/12/2008 4:16:20 A spectacular fire stopped traffic and drew crowds of onlookers in Auckland last night. The blaze broke out in a warehouse on the intersection of Ponsonby Road and McKelvie Street and eight appliances and two aerial appliances were used to quell it. Firefighters were dampening down hotspots but by 11.30 the fire was out. A man was inside the building at the time. He was taken out and treated for a minor cut to his arm. No nearby buildings were damaged, but the warehouse roof collapsed in the centre. The Fire Service is not saying yet whether it suspects the blaze was suspicious. Some people were convinced the fire was caused by what may have been a meteorite, which was seen from various parts of the upper North Island streaking across the sky just after 10 o'clock. Several callers claim the light in the sky was very bright, and it was described by some as a blinding flash. Others said it was trailing smoke. One man, Mike, says he saw the object crash with an exploding noise in the Ponsonby area, and reckons it could have started the fire. From Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr Sat Dec 13 12:12:10 2008 From: Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr (Zelimir Gabelica) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 18:12:10 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fw: Re: More Meteorite Geography Trivia In-Reply-To: <574209.74056.qm@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20081213181151.029e7300@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Frank is perfectly right. Now, if you take into account the ratio between the weight (kg) and the island surface area, you can calculate the average number of meteorite kg thet fell per square km for 3 small islands (there could be more) Island surface (km2) Meteorite tkw kg/km2 (x 10-3) Oahu 1545 Honolulu + P. Valley 3.682 2.38 Mauritius 1866 Mauritius 0.222 0.189 Jamaica 11425 Lucky Hill 20.4+ 1.79+ Now taking 2 small countries (I did not go through all): Lesotho 30355 Thuathe 30+ 0.99 Swaziland 17363 Dwaleni 3.230 0.186 In all cases Oahu wins... Good going for other weird evaluations! Cheers Zelimir A 08:45 13/12/2008 -0800, Frank Cressy a ?crit : > Hello All, > > Michael wrote: > > > > 1) Jamaica has one known meteorite, Lucky Hill, an > > iron IIIAB. What are the chances of a meteorite landing on > > a relatively small island in the middle of a sea? This > > meteorite could have easily ended up on the bottom of > > the Caribbean, but instead it gets to spend it's days > > in a tropical beach paradise. > >I think Hawaii goes one better. Two meteorite falls, >Honolulu (1825) and Palolo Valley (1949) both fell on Oahu, >a small island in the much larger Pacific Ocean. Incidently >both meteorites fell in the capitol of Honolulu only about five miles from >one another. > >Cheers, > >Frank >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Sat Dec 13 12:40:20 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 13 Dec 2008 17:40:20 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Itqiy and Zaklodzie Message-ID: Hi Tracy, Z?limir and List, Z?limir: "I can tell you (qualitatively) that their textures are definitely different." Tracy: "Itqiy and Zaklodzie slices, do they actually look similar in section?" No, they don't look similar at all! They have totally different grain sizes. Itqiy has a grain size that ranges from 0.5-1.7 mm in my specimen, whereas crystals in my tiny Zaklodzie slice have an average grain size of < 0.5 mm. Tracy: "Zaklodzie, however,...don't show the texture very well" Zaklodzie is very hard to photograph. I've tried but without satisfactory results. I've also put my two smallish slices of Zaklodzie and Itqiy under the microscope and have taken pictures of them both side by side. Moderate result but one can clearly see the difference in texture. While it was quite difficult to take pics of my Zaklodzie slice, it was relatively easy to take pics of my Zaklodzie thin section in XP (cross-polarized) light. Z?limir: "Itqiy is very similar to NWA 2656 (btw classified as "E-achon" in Met. Bull.)" Huh?! NWA 2656 is classified as an acapulcoite! My itsy-bitsy 0.29-gram slice of that acapulcoite is even harder to photograph than the Zaklodzie :-( Klaus Keil, Addi Bischoff (2008) NWA 2526: A partial melt residue of enstatite chondrite parentage (MAPS 43-7, 2008, pp. 1233-1240): Well, the meteorite Z?limir is referring to, that's NWA 2526 and in the last two sentences of the abstract you'll find this: "These similarities indicate that NWA 2526 and Itqiy may have formed on the same parent body. This body was different from the EH, EL, Shallowater and aubrite parent bodies, and NWA 2526 and Itqiy may represent samples from yet another, fifth enstatite meteorite parent body." Best, Bernd From p.marmet at sunrise.ch Sat Dec 13 13:06:02 2008 From: p.marmet at sunrise.ch (Peter Marmet) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 19:06:02 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Stunning Lunar: More pieces added! Message-ID: <871799a20812131006v58b263d6rd2a426696f040797@mail.gmail.com> Hello All, we just added a few more pieces of the stunning LUNAR NWA 4734...still at a real discount price! Please see here: http://www.marmet-meteorites.com/id44.html Thank you, Peter Peter Marmet Bern, Switzerland IMCA #2747 p.marmet at mysunrise.ch http://www.marmet-meteorites.com/ From bobl at peaktopeak.com Sat Dec 13 13:07:49 2008 From: bobl at peaktopeak.com (Bob Loeffler) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 11:07:49 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? (Bob Loeffler) In-Reply-To: <4941FEF5.2060602@meteoritewatch.com> Message-ID: <20081213180753.E486510608@mailwash5.pair.com> Hi Eric and list, Sorry about that. My bad math skills; not a typo. :-) Regards, Bob -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Eric Wichman Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 11:05 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD: How Bout A Meteorite Blog? (Bob Loeffler) Bob, Not a typo at all... $5 per month is $60 per year. (12 months X $5mo = $60) I'm offering the blog site for $49 for the whole year including hosting. That come to about $4.08mo Eric ---------------------------- Hi Eric, You said the following in your e-mail: "I wanted to find a way to build and host one for all meteorite people and Met List members less than $5 per month." ... but it says $49 on the website. Typo? Regards, Bob ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From sterling_k_webb at sbcglobal.net Sat Dec 13 13:11:40 2008 From: sterling_k_webb at sbcglobal.net (Sterling K. Webb) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 12:11:40 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] More Meteorite Geography Trivia References: <677957.68667.qm@web58402.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001e01c95d4e$4021d0c0$a62ae146@ATARIENGINE> Hi, List, Michael wrote: > What are the chances of a meteorite landing on > a relatively-small island in the middle of a sea? Well, the answer is that the chances of a meteorite landing anywhere are exactly the same as of it landing anywhere else. The "landing" of a meteorite is as purely random an event as any natural event can be. There is no causal connection between the path of the meteoroid and the geography of the Earth or indeed, anything about the Earth except that it got in the way of the meteoroid. If you were standing idly about in your front yard and a meteorite whizzed down and landed in front of your feet, you would jump and scream, "OMG! What are the odds of that?!" But the odds of that meteorite landing on the square meter you were standing on is unaffected by the fact that you were standing there. Likewise, any square meter you stand on, anywhere, is as likely to have a meteorite land on it as any other, whether that square meter of Earth is land or sea, for example. (Since nearly 70% of the Earth is water, 70% of all meteorites land there.) So, when you go out into your front yard tonight to wait for that meteorite to land at your feet, you can stand anywhere in the yard you want to! (Or sit in a yard chair, if you want; that doesn't affect the odds either.) Don't laugh! The meteorite that lands -- Plop! -- at someone's feet in the front yard has actually happened, and in relatively recent times. Check out the NOBLESVILLE (Indiana) fall. Sterling K. Webb ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Gilmer" To: Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 10:08 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] More Meteorite Geography Trivia Some more meteorite-geography trivia : 1) Jamaica has one known meteorite, Lucky Hill, an iron IIIAB. What are the chances of a meteorite landing on a relatively-small island in the middle of a sea? This meteorite could have easily ended up on the bottom of the Caribbean, but instead it gets to spend it's days in a tropical beach paradise. (I hope it's stored with some dessicant!) 2) Iran has only 2 known meteorites - both of them witnessed falls! Naragh is an H6 hammer stone that penetrated the roof of a school on August 18, 1974. No casualties were reported. The other fall is Veramin, a mesosiderite, which fell around April 18, 1880. Veramin has been kept in Tehran's Golestan Palace since then. 3) Ireland has 6 recorded meteorites - all of them witnessed falls. (The Tanzanians have competition!) All of Ireland's meteorites have been OC's and one remains unclassified - Pettiswood. 4) Not to be left out, Northern Ireland (statisically seperatre from Ireland proper) has 2 known meteorites, both OC witnessed falls. 5) The United States has over 1519 approved meteorites! This US tally includes : 2 acapulcoites 5 aubrites 22 carbonaceous chondrites 2 diogenites 4 EL chondrites 11 eucrites more OC's than you can shake a magnetic cane at 4 howardites a boatload of irons 2 Martian meteorites (LA001/002 & Lafayette) 8 mesosiderites 18 pallasites 1 rumuruti chondrite 2 ureilites 2 winonaites :) ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From debfred at att.net Sat Dec 13 13:16:12 2008 From: debfred at att.net (debfred at att.net) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 18:16:12 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fw: Re: More Meteorite Geography Trivia In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.2.20081213181151.029e7300@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> References: <574209.74056.qm@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <5.0.2.1.2.20081213181151.029e7300@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Message-ID: <121320081816.9402.4943FBEB000DEAD4000024BA22230680329B0A02D29B9B0EBF0B0A9D000D0A0B@att.net> Interesting topic. One of my favorite meteorites in my collection is Isla del Espititu Santo. This is a small TKW 869g L6 meteorite from a small island in the Sea of Cortez off the coast from La Paz, Mexico. Regards, Fred Olsen -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Zelimir Gabelica > > Frank is perfectly right. > > Now, if you take into account the ratio between the weight (kg) and the > island surface area, you can calculate the average number of meteorite kg > thet fell per square km for 3 small islands (there could be more) > > Island surface > (km2) Meteorite tkw kg/km2 (x 10-3) > > Oahu 1545 Honolulu + P. > Valley 3.682 2.38 > Mauritius 1866 Mauritius 0.222 > 0.189 > Jamaica 11425 Lucky > Hill 20.4+ 1.79+ > > Now taking 2 small countries (I did not go through all): > > Lesotho 30355 Thuathe 30+ > 0.99 > Swaziland 17363 Dwaleni 3.230 > 0.186 > > In all cases Oahu wins... > > Good going for other weird evaluations! > > Cheers > > Zelimir > > > A 08:45 13/12/2008 -0800, Frank Cressy a ?crit : > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > Michael wrote: > > > > > > > 1) Jamaica has one known meteorite, Lucky Hill, an > > > iron IIIAB. What are the chances of a meteorite landing on > > > a relatively small island in the middle of a sea? This > > > meteorite could have easily ended up on the bottom of > > > the Caribbean, but instead it gets to spend it's days > > > in a tropical beach paradise. > > > >I think Hawaii goes one better. Two meteorite falls, > >Honolulu (1825) and Palolo Valley (1949) both fell on Oahu, > >a small island in the much larger Pacific Ocean. Incidently > >both meteorites fell in the capitol of Honolulu only about five miles from > >one another. > > > >Cheers, > > > >Frank > >______________________________________________ > >http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >Meteorite-list mailing list > >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > Prof. Zelimir Gabelica > Universit? de Haute Alsace > ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, > 3, Rue A. Werner, > F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France > Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 > Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From bobe5531 at comcast.net Sat Dec 13 13:16:43 2008 From: bobe5531 at comcast.net (Bob Evans) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 12:16:43 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate Message-ID: <002501c95d4e$f495cca0$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Large Zagami slice with big patch of Crust. ( Way Below Market value ) Colorful L3 Chondrite L3 Conglomerate See them here: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZmaccers531 It will be atleast a week before I have any Monnig or AML meteorites to offer. Thanks, Bob From Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr Sat Dec 13 13:29:18 2008 From: Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr (Zelimir Gabelica) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 19:29:18 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Itqiy and Zaklodzie In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20081213191828.02abe008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Yes Bernd, you are perfectly right. Funny my misspelling the numbers. My fingers run too fast (actually my phone number starts with 2656...pfff!) Thanks for the reference. I just also received the PDF copy from David Weir and read the intro and the conclusions. Very interesting...the Itqiy-Zaklodzie-NWA 2526 continues. BTW, I have a pic of my Zaklodzie slice (14.1 g, 50x45x2 mm). Not the best quality but I'll sent it to you in a separate mail. If you feel it is informative for the list and if you can host it on your site, feel free to send the link. Thanks again for comments. Zelimir A 17:40 13/12/2008 +0000, bernd.pauli at paulinet.de a ?crit : >Hi Tracy, Z?limir and List, > >Z?limir: "I can tell you (qualitatively) that their textures are >definitely different." >Tracy: "Itqiy and Zaklodzie slices, do they actually look similar in section?" > >No, they don't look similar at all! They have totally different grain >sizes. Itqiy has >a grain size that ranges from 0.5-1.7 mm in my specimen, whereas crystals >in my >tiny Zaklodzie slice have an average grain size of < 0.5 mm. > >Tracy: "Zaklodzie, however,...don't show the texture very well" > >Zaklodzie is very hard to photograph. I've tried but without satisfactory >results. >I've also put my two smallish slices of Zaklodzie and Itqiy under the >microscope >and have taken pictures of them both side by side. Moderate result but one can >clearly see the difference in texture. > >While it was quite difficult to take pics of my Zaklodzie slice, it was >relatively >easy to take pics of my Zaklodzie thin section in XP (cross-polarized) light. > >Z?limir: "Itqiy is very similar to NWA 2656 (btw classified as "E-achon" >in Met. >Bull.)" > >Huh?! NWA 2656 is classified as an acapulcoite! My itsy-bitsy 0.29-gram >slice of that acapulcoite is even harder to photograph than the Zaklodzie :-( > >Klaus Keil, Addi Bischoff (2008) NWA 2526: A partial melt residue >of enstatite chondrite parentage (MAPS 43-7, 2008, pp. 1233-1240): > >Well, the meteorite Z?limir is referring to, that's NWA 2526 >and in the last two sentences of the abstract you'll find this: > >"These similarities indicate that NWA 2526 and Itqiy may have formed on >the same parent body. This body was different from the EH, EL, Shallowater >and aubrite parent bodies, and NWA 2526 and Itqiy may represent samples >from yet another, fifth enstatite meteorite parent body." > >Best, > >Bernd > > > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr Sat Dec 13 13:49:14 2008 From: Zelimir.Gabelica at uha.fr (Zelimir Gabelica) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 19:49:14 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] More Meteorite Geography Trivia In-Reply-To: <001e01c95d4e$4021d0c0$a62ae146@ATARIENGINE> References: <677957.68667.qm@web58402.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20081213193800.02adde60@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> I fully agree. Now a pure statistic evaluation tells you that if you are waiting in your front yard having a surface of 1 squere km, for a meteorite of 1 kg to fall, you'll have to wait (on the average) for...10 million years! (if my memory is right, I hesitate between 10 and 100 milloin but the message is the same). A funny related joke we use to tell our visitors in Ensisheim show: "If you are affraid a meteorite would fell on you, just don't worry! A bolid of about 125 kg fell right here 516 years ago, so you are statistically speaking, totally safe!" I know Sterling will contradict me and I will agree! A typical counter-example is the Weathersfield meteorite that fell in CT on almost the same place in 1971 and in 1982. Both were L6!... Keep smiling, Zelimir A 12:11 13/12/2008 -0600, Sterling K. Webb a ?crit : >Hi, List, > >Michael wrote: > > What are the chances of a meteorite landing on > > a relatively-small island in the middle of a sea? > >Well, the answer is that the chances of a meteorite landing >anywhere are exactly the same as of it landing anywhere else. >The "landing" of a meteorite is as purely random an event as >any natural event can be. There is no causal connection >between the path of the meteoroid and the geography of >the Earth or indeed, anything about the Earth except that >it got in the way of the meteoroid. > >If you were standing idly about in your front yard and a >meteorite whizzed down and landed in front of your feet, >you would jump and scream, "OMG! What are the odds >of that?!" But the odds of that meteorite landing on the >square meter you were standing on is unaffected by the fact >that you were standing there. Likewise, any square meter >you stand on, anywhere, is as likely to have a meteorite >land on it as any other, whether that square meter of Earth >is land or sea, for example. (Since nearly 70% of the Earth >is water, 70% of all meteorites land there.) > >So, when you go out into your front yard tonight to wait for >that meteorite to land at your feet, you can stand anywhere >in the yard you want to! (Or sit in a yard chair, if you want; >that doesn't affect the odds either.) Don't laugh! The meteorite >that lands -- Plop! -- at someone's feet in the front yard has >actually happened, and in relatively recent times. Check out >the NOBLESVILLE (Indiana) fall. > > >Sterling K. Webb >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Michael Gilmer" >To: >Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 10:08 AM >Subject: [meteorite-list] More Meteorite Geography Trivia > > >Some more meteorite-geography trivia : > >1) Jamaica has one known meteorite, Lucky Hill, an iron IIIAB. What are the >chances of a meteorite landing on a relatively-small island in the middle of >a sea? This meteorite could have easily ended up on the bottom of the >Caribbean, but instead it gets to spend it's days in a tropical beach >paradise. (I hope it's stored with some dessicant!) > >2) Iran has only 2 known meteorites - both of them witnessed falls! Naragh >is an H6 hammer stone that penetrated the roof of a school on August 18, >1974. No casualties were reported. The other fall is Veramin, a >mesosiderite, which fell around April 18, 1880. Veramin has been kept in >Tehran's Golestan Palace since then. > >3) Ireland has 6 recorded meteorites - all of them witnessed falls. (The >Tanzanians have competition!) All of Ireland's meteorites have been OC's and >one remains unclassified - Pettiswood. > >4) Not to be left out, Northern Ireland (statisically seperatre from Ireland >proper) has 2 known meteorites, both OC witnessed falls. > >5) The United States has over 1519 approved meteorites! > >This US tally includes : > >2 acapulcoites >5 aubrites >22 carbonaceous chondrites >2 diogenites >4 EL chondrites >11 eucrites >more OC's than you can shake a magnetic cane at >4 howardites >a boatload of irons >2 Martian meteorites (LA001/002 & Lafayette) >8 mesosiderites >18 pallasites >1 rumuruti chondrite >2 ureilites >2 winonaites > >:) > >......................................................... >Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) >Member of the Meteoritical Society. >Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. >Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com >MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale >.......................................................... > > > > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 From MoritzKarl at t-online.de Sat Dec 13 14:19:58 2008 From: MoritzKarl at t-online.de (MoritzKarl at t-online.de) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 20:19:58 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: ebay auctions ending in 1 day Message-ID: <1LBa1u-0681aa0@fwd01.aul.t-online.de> Dear List, I have 10 ebay auctions ending in about 24 hours. - Benguerir - 2.95 gram fragment - Carancas - 0.64 gram fragment - Chergach - 3.1 gram fragment - Chergach - 3.43 gram slice - Dar al Gani 400 - 1.32 gram partslice - Fukang - 2.88 gram partslice - Hoba - 6.08 gram iron partslice - Mundrabilla - 25.65 gram partslice with troilites - St?lldalen - 1.22 gram slice - Wairarapa Valley - 0.19 gram partslice You can see them here: http://stores.ebay.com/mos-meteorites or through my website http://www.m3t3orites.com/ebay.php Thank you for looking and good luck in case you are bidding. Thank you Kind Regards Moritz Karl http://www.m3t3orites.com From carloselguapo1 at hotmail.com Sat Dec 13 14:50:31 2008 From: carloselguapo1 at hotmail.com (Carl 's) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 11:50:31 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] More Meteorite Geography Trivia Message-ID: Sterling and others, Wouldn't a large meteoritoid that created a large strewnfield change the statistic versus a single stone landing? I flunked statistics in high school. Problems like this used to make my head hurt. Carl (Dense as a brick) Sterling wrote: >Well, the answer is that the chances of a meteorite landing >anywhere are exactly the same as of it landing anywhere else. >The "landing" of a meteorite is as purely random an event as >any natural event can be. There is no causal connection >between the path of the meteoroid and the geography of >the Earth or indeed, anything about the Earth except that >it got in the way of the meteoroid. _________________________________________________________________ Suspicious message? There?s an alert for that. http://windowslive.com/Explore/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_broad2_122008 From mary.kashuba at verizon.net Sat Dec 13 14:56:14 2008 From: mary.kashuba at verizon.net (Kashuba) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 11:56:14 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Itqiy and Zaklodzie In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.2.20081213191828.02abe008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> References: <5.0.2.1.2.20081213191828.02abe008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> Message-ID: <001401c95d5c$dae0a6a0$90a1f3e0$@kashuba@verizon.net> Tracy, Zelimir, Bernd and all, I put pictures of Itqiy and Zak?odzie slices side by side here: http://johnkashuba.com/Pages/Meteorite%20Pages/Pictures/Zaklodzie%20Itqiy.ht m Maybe this helps a little. Regards, - John -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Zelimir Gabelica Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 10:29 AM To: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de; Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Itqiy and Zaklodzie Yes Bernd, you are perfectly right. Funny my misspelling the numbers. My fingers run too fast (actually my phone number starts with 2656...pfff!) Thanks for the reference. I just also received the PDF copy from David Weir and read the intro and the conclusions. Very interesting...the Itqiy-Zaklodzie-NWA 2526 continues. BTW, I have a pic of my Zaklodzie slice (14.1 g, 50x45x2 mm). Not the best quality but I'll sent it to you in a separate mail. If you feel it is informative for the list and if you can host it on your site, feel free to send the link. Thanks again for comments. Zelimir A 17:40 13/12/2008 +0000, bernd.pauli at paulinet.de a ?crit : >Hi Tracy, Z?limir and List, > >Z?limir: "I can tell you (qualitatively) that their textures are >definitely different." >Tracy: "Itqiy and Zaklodzie slices, do they actually look similar in section?" > >No, they don't look similar at all! They have totally different grain >sizes. Itqiy has >a grain size that ranges from 0.5-1.7 mm in my specimen, whereas crystals >in my >tiny Zaklodzie slice have an average grain size of < 0.5 mm. > >Tracy: "Zaklodzie, however,...don't show the texture very well" > >Zaklodzie is very hard to photograph. I've tried but without satisfactory >results. >I've also put my two smallish slices of Zaklodzie and Itqiy under the >microscope >and have taken pictures of them both side by side. Moderate result but one can >clearly see the difference in texture. > >While it was quite difficult to take pics of my Zaklodzie slice, it was >relatively >easy to take pics of my Zaklodzie thin section in XP (cross-polarized) light. > >Z?limir: "Itqiy is very similar to NWA 2656 (btw classified as "E-achon" >in Met. >Bull.)" > >Huh?! NWA 2656 is classified as an acapulcoite! My itsy-bitsy 0.29-gram >slice of that acapulcoite is even harder to photograph than the Zaklodzie :-( > >Klaus Keil, Addi Bischoff (2008) NWA 2526: A partial melt residue >of enstatite chondrite parentage (MAPS 43-7, 2008, pp. 1233-1240): > >Well, the meteorite Z?limir is referring to, that's NWA 2526 >and in the last two sentences of the abstract you'll find this: > >"These similarities indicate that NWA 2526 and Itqiy may have formed on >the same parent body. This body was different from the EH, EL, Shallowater >and aubrite parent bodies, and NWA 2526 and Itqiy may represent samples >from yet another, fifth enstatite meteorite parent body." > >Best, > >Bernd > > > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From debfred at att.net Sat Dec 13 15:43:51 2008 From: debfred at att.net (debfred at att.net) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 20:43:51 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorites In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <121320082043.4707.49441E870002D2C10000126322243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF0B0A9D000D0A0B@att.net> List, There is another little known toolbox meteorite. Lorenzo, NB was used by the Brauer family as a door stop for over a decade. They knew it was a meteorite but it also had a nice size and shape to hold open an interior door. This information was passed to me by the finders son. Nininger tried to purchase both meteorites (Sidney and Lorenzo) Albert Brauer found while farming in NW Nebraska in the 1930's. Regards, Fred Olsen -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de > > Steve Arnold #1 writes: > > "There have to be a hundred more examples!" > > Yep, don't forget Korra Korrabes (H3), the largest specimen > of which (24 kg) was used in a garden wall until 2000 August. > > Bernd > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From jwal2000 at swbell.net Sat Dec 13 16:51:42 2008 From: jwal2000 at swbell.net (Jerry A. Wallace) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 15:51:42 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] More Meteorite Geography Trivia In-Reply-To: <001e01c95d4e$4021d0c0$a62ae146@ATARIENGINE> References: <677957.68667.qm@web58402.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <001e01c95d4e$4021d0c0$a62ae146@ATARIENGINE> Message-ID: <49442E6E.8080502@swbell.net> Sterling wrote: > Well, the answer is that the chances of a meteorite landing > anywhere are exactly the same as of it landing anywhere else. > The "landing" of a meteorite is as purely random an event as > any natural event can be. There is no causal connection > between the path of the meteoroid and the geography of > the Earth or indeed, anything about the Earth except that > it got in the way of the meteoroid. Hi Sterling, List, I find it overwhelmingly necessary to take exception to your statement (above). It is a well known and established fact that the great majority of meteors and meteorites, given their druthers, aim for Texas. The ones that miss Texas can only be attributed to having poor marksmanship skills or exceedingly bad taste. Someone might point out that Northwest Africa seems to have an abnormally high clustering of meteorites. Well, those were just wimps looking for a soft landing. Didn't need that kind in Texas anyway. 'Nuf said. Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to all, Jerry Wallace ----------------------------------------------------- Sterling K. Webb wrote: > Hi, List, > > Michael wrote: > >> What are the chances of a meteorite landing on >> a relatively-small island in the middle of a sea? >> > > Well, the answer is that the chances of a meteorite landing > anywhere are exactly the same as of it landing anywhere else. > The "landing" of a meteorite is as purely random an event as > any natural event can be. There is no causal connection > between the path of the meteoroid and the geography of > the Earth or indeed, anything about the Earth except that > it got in the way of the meteoroid. > > If you were standing idly about in your front yard and a > meteorite whizzed down and landed in front of your feet, > you would jump and scream, "OMG! What are the odds > of that?!" But the odds of that meteorite landing on the > square meter you were standing on is unaffected by the fact > that you were standing there. Likewise, any square meter > you stand on, anywhere, is as likely to have a meteorite > land on it as any other, whether that square meter of Earth > is land or sea, for example. (Since nearly 70% of the Earth > is water, 70% of all meteorites land there.) > > So, when you go out into your front yard tonight to wait for > that meteorite to land at your feet, you can stand anywhere > in the yard you want to! (Or sit in a yard chair, if you want; > that doesn't affect the odds either.) Don't laugh! The meteorite > that lands -- Plop! -- at someone's feet in the front yard has > actually happened, and in relatively recent times. Check out > the NOBLESVILLE (Indiana) fall. > > > Sterling K. Webb > From grf2 at verizon.net Sat Dec 13 16:54:02 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 16:54:02 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] iridium flares? Message-ID: Are Iridium flares customarily visible in the daytime. What I saw this afternoon in the southwest was possibly an aircraft but because it varied in brightness so intensely and remained "motionless" for the 10 to 15 seconds I observed it, I thought Flare?! Jerry Flaherty From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Sat Dec 13 17:03:01 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 15:03:01 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] iridium flares? References: Message-ID: <98807221A0DC4D5A83390B278422D7DC@bellatrix> Flares brighter than mag -4 are readily visible in daylight (just like Venus is). It's a challenge to see them only because you need to be looking in the right place (usually without much in the way of reference) and you need your eyes to be properly focuses. But 10-15 seconds is too long for an Iridium flare, and even if it lasted that long, you'd see noticeable movement over that time. Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Flaherty" To: Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 2:54 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] iridium flares? > Are Iridium flares customarily visible in the daytime. What I saw this > afternoon in the southwest was possibly an aircraft but because it varied > in brightness so intensely and remained "motionless" for the 10 to 15 > seconds I observed it, I thought Flare?! > Jerry Flaherty From grf2 at verizon.net Sat Dec 13 17:14:37 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 17:14:37 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fw: Re: More Meteorite Geography Trivia References: <574209.74056.qm@web80204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4CD8DB17C71846D7ABCAAE336DE9C1FB@ASUS> The smatering of these "land" smacks dramatically points to the vast number of "lost at sea" falls. Jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Frank Cressy" To: "meteoritelist" Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 11:45 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Fw: Re: More Meteorite Geography Trivia > > > > > Hello All, > > Michael wrote: > > >> 1) Jamaica has one known meteorite, Lucky Hill, an >> iron IIIAB. What are the chances of a meteorite landing on >> a relatively small island in the middle of a sea? This >> meteorite could have easily ended up on the bottom of >> the Caribbean, but instead it gets to spend it's days >> in a tropical beach paradise. > > I think Hawaii goes one better. Two meteorite falls, > Honolulu (1825) and Palolo Valley (1949) both fell on Oahu, > a small island in the much larger Pacific Ocean. Incidently > both meteorites fell in the capitol of Honolulu only about five miles from > one another. > > Cheers, > > Frank > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From tett at rogers.com Sat Dec 13 17:16:23 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 17:16:23 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Name the new Canadian fall Buzzard Coulee Message-ID: <49443437.4030806@rogers.com> List, As Jeff pointed out the final decision on the new name is up to the Nomenclature Committee. That said, I have been advised that Buzzard Coulee is the desired new name and so I propose that we use that until the NomCom makes its final choice. "That's what Alan H. and the U of C crew are calling it. His grad student Ellen Milley who found the first piece and Ian Mitchell, whose land (cow pond) it was found on both prefer Buzzard Coulee because that's where it was found. Ian also notes that it is the oldest geographic name in the area." Cheers, Mike Tettenborn From grf2 at verizon.net Sat Dec 13 17:31:42 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 17:31:42 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Itqiy and Zaklodzie References: <5.0.2.1.2.20081213191828.02abe008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> <001401c95d5c$dae0a6a0$90a1f3e0$@kashuba@verizon.net> Message-ID: <43E7D8CD1CE84F3DB35FAFD827BA7A3B@ASUS> John, try to resend that. The link doesn't seem to work ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kashuba" To: Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 2:56 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Itqiy and Zaklodzie Tracy, Zelimir, Bernd and all, I put pictures of Itqiy and Zak?odzie slices side by side here: http://johnkashuba.com/Pages/Meteorite%20Pages/Pictures/Zaklodzie%20Itqiy.ht m Maybe this helps a little. Regards, - John -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Zelimir Gabelica Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 10:29 AM To: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de; Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Itqiy and Zaklodzie Yes Bernd, you are perfectly right. Funny my misspelling the numbers. My fingers run too fast (actually my phone number starts with 2656...pfff!) Thanks for the reference. I just also received the PDF copy from David Weir and read the intro and the conclusions. Very interesting...the Itqiy-Zaklodzie-NWA 2526 continues. BTW, I have a pic of my Zaklodzie slice (14.1 g, 50x45x2 mm). Not the best quality but I'll sent it to you in a separate mail. If you feel it is informative for the list and if you can host it on your site, feel free to send the link. Thanks again for comments. Zelimir A 17:40 13/12/2008 +0000, bernd.pauli at paulinet.de a ?crit : >Hi Tracy, Z?limir and List, > >Z?limir: "I can tell you (qualitatively) that their textures are >definitely different." >Tracy: "Itqiy and Zaklodzie slices, do they actually look similar in section?" > >No, they don't look similar at all! They have totally different grain >sizes. Itqiy has >a grain size that ranges from 0.5-1.7 mm in my specimen, whereas crystals >in my >tiny Zaklodzie slice have an average grain size of < 0.5 mm. > >Tracy: "Zaklodzie, however,...don't show the texture very well" > >Zaklodzie is very hard to photograph. I've tried but without satisfactory >results. >I've also put my two smallish slices of Zaklodzie and Itqiy under the >microscope >and have taken pictures of them both side by side. Moderate result but one can >clearly see the difference in texture. > >While it was quite difficult to take pics of my Zaklodzie slice, it was >relatively >easy to take pics of my Zaklodzie thin section in XP (cross-polarized) light. > >Z?limir: "Itqiy is very similar to NWA 2656 (btw classified as "E-achon" >in Met. >Bull.)" > >Huh?! NWA 2656 is classified as an acapulcoite! My itsy-bitsy 0.29-gram >slice of that acapulcoite is even harder to photograph than the Zaklodzie :-( > >Klaus Keil, Addi Bischoff (2008) NWA 2526: A partial melt residue >of enstatite chondrite parentage (MAPS 43-7, 2008, pp. 1233-1240): > >Well, the meteorite Z?limir is referring to, that's NWA 2526 >and in the last two sentences of the abstract you'll find this: > >"These similarities indicate that NWA 2526 and Itqiy may have formed on >the same parent body. This body was different from the EH, EL, Shallowater >and aubrite parent bodies, and NWA 2526 and Itqiy may represent samples >from yet another, fifth enstatite meteorite parent body." > >Best, > >Bernd > > > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From jeffkrosschell at comcast.net Sat Dec 13 17:37:42 2008 From: jeffkrosschell at comcast.net (Jeff Krosschell) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 14:37:42 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Over 60 auctions all starting at 99 cents Message-ID: <04EB7E7DE346412D91B6166A8F588A26@JeffVistaPC> Hello List, This week we updated our store with some new goodies and we have 62 auctions listed, all starting at .99 cents. This is our holiday listing so if you are familiar with these past listings and we have something you are hoping to add to your collection, this is the week! You will see that everything is a little bigger this week than in the past. http://stores.ebay.com/KALANI-OF-THE-HEAVENS_W0QQcolZ2QQdirZ1QQftidZ2QQtZkm Also, we have made one of the Ransburg slices available starting at .99 cents, definitely worth checking out. This is one of only two slices that will ever be made available! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120348768769&ih=002&categ ory=3239&ssPageName=STORE:PROMOBOX:NEWLIST#LIST Kind Regards and Happy Holidays, Jeff & Malia Krosschell Kalani of the Heavens From lebofsky at lpl.arizona.edu Sat Dec 13 17:55:39 2008 From: lebofsky at lpl.arizona.edu (lebofsky at lpl.arizona.edu) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 15:55:39 -0700 (MST) Subject: [meteorite-list] iridium flares? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <54613.71.226.60.25.1229208939.squirrel@timber.lpl.arizona.edu> Hi Jerry: If you go so to www.heavens-above.com and register for your location (they have a very extensive list), you can then click on the place where it shows irridium flares for the last 24 hours. It can also show daytime ones. Larry On Sat, December 13, 2008 2:54 pm, Jerry Flaherty wrote: > Are Iridium flares customarily visible in the daytime. What I saw this > afternoon in the southwest was possibly an aircraft but because it varied > in brightness so intensely and remained "motionless" for the 10 to 15 > seconds I observed it, I thought Flare?! Jerry Flaherty > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From romanj at sympatico.ca Sat Dec 13 18:11:38 2008 From: romanj at sympatico.ca (Roman) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 18:11:38 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Name the new Canadian fall Buzzard Coulee References: <49443437.4030806@rogers.com> Message-ID: Sorry Mike, Lone Rock is my preference. Especially since many collectors will be luck to get one lone rock of this fall. Cheers, Roman Jirasek ----- Original Message ----- From: "tett" To: Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 5:16 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Name the new Canadian fall Buzzard Coulee > > List, > > As Jeff pointed out the final decision on the new name is up to the > Nomenclature Committee. That said, I have been advised that Buzzard > Coulee is the desired new name and so I propose that we use that until > the NomCom makes its final choice. > > "That's what Alan H. and the U of C crew are calling it. His grad > student Ellen Milley who found the first piece and Ian Mitchell, whose > land (cow pond) it was found on both prefer Buzzard Coulee because > that's where it was found. Ian also notes that it is the oldest > geographic name in the area." > > Cheers, > > Mike Tettenborn > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mlblood at cox.net Sat Dec 13 18:39:09 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 15:39:09 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Question re DHO811 In-Reply-To: <49442E6E.8080502@swbell.net> Message-ID: Hi All, A while back I ordered a meteorite (small part slice) and got One marked " DHO811" on the side (black lettering on white Painted background). I contacted the seller and he assured me it was what I had Ordered and was accidentally labeled wrong and he had forgotten To remove it. He even sold me another piece. HOWEVER, I neglected to put it in a newly labeled baggy Or display box. It weighs 1.475g and I think it is a Lost City or perhaps A Claxton??? Whoever sold it to me, PLEASE contact me and remind Me what the hell it is. I cannot sell it, of course, if I do not know For sure what it is. Off list, please. Thanks, Michael Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From mlblood at cox.net Sat Dec 13 18:32:45 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 15:32:45 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] 2? In-Reply-To: <49442E6E.8080502@swbell.net> Message-ID: Is everyone getting duplicate posts or just me? Michael Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From mary.kashuba at verizon.net Sat Dec 13 20:20:35 2008 From: mary.kashuba at verizon.net (Kashuba) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 17:20:35 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Itqiy and Zaklodzie In-Reply-To: <43E7D8CD1CE84F3DB35FAFD827BA7A3B@ASUS> References: <5.0.2.1.2.20081213191828.02abe008@pop.univ-mulhouse.fr> <001401c95d5c$dae0a6a0$90a1f3e0$@kashuba@verizon.net> <43E7D8CD1CE84F3DB35FAFD827BA7A3B@ASUS> Message-ID: <006701c95d8a$2afd6790$80f836b0$@kashuba@verizon.net> Jerry, I resent it in Rich Text to avoid the broken link but it's not posting. HTML is verboten. So let's try this: http://tinyurl.com/6rkt8l Thanks for the note! - John -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Flaherty Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 2:32 PM To: Kashuba; Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Itqiy and Zaklodzie John, try to resend that. The link doesn't seem to work ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kashuba" To: Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 2:56 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Itqiy and Zaklodzie Tracy, Zelimir, Bernd and all, I put pictures of Itqiy and Zak?odzie slices side by side here: http://johnkashuba.com/Pages/Meteorite%20Pages/Pictures/Zaklodzie%20Itqiy.ht m Maybe this helps a little. Regards, - John -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Zelimir Gabelica Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 10:29 AM To: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de; Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Itqiy and Zaklodzie Yes Bernd, you are perfectly right. Funny my misspelling the numbers. My fingers run too fast (actually my phone number starts with 2656...pfff!) Thanks for the reference. I just also received the PDF copy from David Weir and read the intro and the conclusions. Very interesting...the Itqiy-Zaklodzie-NWA 2526 continues. BTW, I have a pic of my Zaklodzie slice (14.1 g, 50x45x2 mm). Not the best quality but I'll sent it to you in a separate mail. If you feel it is informative for the list and if you can host it on your site, feel free to send the link. Thanks again for comments. Zelimir A 17:40 13/12/2008 +0000, bernd.pauli at paulinet.de a ?crit : >Hi Tracy, Z?limir and List, > >Z?limir: "I can tell you (qualitatively) that their textures are >definitely different." >Tracy: "Itqiy and Zaklodzie slices, do they actually look similar in section?" > >No, they don't look similar at all! They have totally different grain >sizes. Itqiy has >a grain size that ranges from 0.5-1.7 mm in my specimen, whereas crystals >in my >tiny Zaklodzie slice have an average grain size of < 0.5 mm. > >Tracy: "Zaklodzie, however,...don't show the texture very well" > >Zaklodzie is very hard to photograph. I've tried but without satisfactory >results. >I've also put my two smallish slices of Zaklodzie and Itqiy under the >microscope >and have taken pictures of them both side by side. Moderate result but one can >clearly see the difference in texture. > >While it was quite difficult to take pics of my Zaklodzie slice, it was >relatively >easy to take pics of my Zaklodzie thin section in XP (cross-polarized) light. > >Z?limir: "Itqiy is very similar to NWA 2656 (btw classified as "E-achon" >in Met. >Bull.)" > >Huh?! NWA 2656 is classified as an acapulcoite! My itsy-bitsy 0.29-gram >slice of that acapulcoite is even harder to photograph than the Zaklodzie :-( > >Klaus Keil, Addi Bischoff (2008) NWA 2526: A partial melt residue >of enstatite chondrite parentage (MAPS 43-7, 2008, pp. 1233-1240): > >Well, the meteorite Z?limir is referring to, that's NWA 2526 >and in the last two sentences of the abstract you'll find this: > >"These similarities indicate that NWA 2526 and Itqiy may have formed on >the same parent body. This body was different from the EH, EL, Shallowater >and aubrite parent bodies, and NWA 2526 and Itqiy may represent samples >from yet another, fifth enstatite meteorite parent body." > >Best, > >Bernd > > > >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Prof. Zelimir Gabelica Universit? de Haute Alsace ENSCMu, Lab. GSEC, 3, Rue A. Werner, F-68093 Mulhouse Cedex, France Tel: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 94 Fax: +33 (0)3 89 33 68 15 ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From searchingforfun at sbcglobal.net Sat Dec 13 22:35:00 2008 From: searchingforfun at sbcglobal.net (Brian Cox) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 19:35:00 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD SALE Message-ID: <022401c95d9c$f958d680$4001a8c0@BRIANSCOMPUTER> Hi list members. I have a nice NWA 964 Meteorite that ends tonight at 19:08:30 PST. NWA 964 METEORITE CHONDRITE 15.3gm HUPE COA IMCA CRUST ONLY 179 GRAM TKW GET YOUR OWN SLICE BLACK FUSION CRUST Item number: 270314077911 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=270314077911&ssPageName= I'm hoping to get some more meteorites up for auction by Sunday evening. Thanks for looking and have a great night! Brian Cox searchingforfun on ebay IMCA#6387 From freequarks at gmail.com Sat Dec 13 21:38:53 2008 From: freequarks at gmail.com (Dark Matter) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 19:38:53 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Santa Physics...again for 2008 Message-ID: <822da19a0812131838u663be620icb3aaedc204cf939@mail.gmail.com> Hi All, It seems it has befallen upon me to hold the job of official Santa Physics story reposter. So, in the true spirit of the season, here it is yet again. And as usual, I have not checked the math. Enjoy. Martin Engineering Christmas: Some points of contention. There are approximately two billion children (persons under 18) in the world. However, since Santa does not visit children of Muslim, Hindu, Jewish or Buddhist religions, this reduces the workload for Christmas night to 15% of the total, or 378 million (according to the Population Reference Bureau). At an average (census) rate of 3.5 children per household, that comes to 108 million homes, presuming that there is at least one good child in each dwelling. Santa has about 31 hours of Christmas to work with thanks to the different time zones and the rotation of the earth, assuming he travels east to west which seems logical. This works out to 967.7 visits per second. This is to say that for each Christian household with a good child, Santa has about 1/1000th of a second to park the sleigh, hop out, jump down the chimney, fill the stockings, distribute the remaining presents under the tree, eat whatever snacks have been left for him, get back up the chimney, jump into the sleigh and get on to the next house. Assuming that each of these 108 million stops is evenly distributed around the earth (which of course, we know to be false, but will accept for the purpose of our calculations), we are now talking about 0.78 miles per household; a total trip of 75.5 million miles, not counting bathroom stops or other breaks. This requires that Santa's sleigh moves at 650 miles per second--3000 times the speed of sound. For purposes of comparison, the fastest man-made vehicle, the Ulysses space probe, moves at a poky 27.4 miles per second, and conventional reindeer can run at best 30 miles per hour. The payload of the sleigh adds another interesting element. Assuming that each child gets nothing more than a medium sized Lego set (two pounds), the sleigh is carrying over 500,000 tons, not counting Santa himself. On land a conventional reindeer can pull about 300 pounds. Even granting that the "flying" reindeer could pull ten times the normal amount, the job just cannot be done with eight or nine of them-- Santa would need 360,000 reindeer! This increases the payload, not counting the weight of the sleigh, another 54,000 tons or roughly seven times the weight of the Queen Elizabeth (the ship, not the monarch). 4.600,000 tons traveling at 650 miles per second creates enormous air resistance-- this would heat up the reindeer in the same fashion as spacecraft re-entering the earth's atmosphere (which may explain Rudolph's red nose). The lead pair of reindeer would absorb 14.3 quintillion joules of energy per second. In short, they would instantaneously vaporize exposing the reindeer behind them to the same friction and also creating deafening sonic booms in their wake. The entire reindeer team would vanish within 4.26 thousandths of a second, or right about the time Santa reached the fifth house on his trip. Not that it matters, however since Santa, as a result of accelerating from a dead stop to 650 miles per second in .001 seconds, would be subjected to centrifugal forces of 17,500 Gs. A 250 pound Santa (which seems ludicrously slim) would be pinned to the back of the sleigh by 4,315,015 pounds of force, instantly crushing his bones and organs and reducing him to a quivering red-hot blob of goo. And yet, he returns year after year. Therefore, the rules of physics obviously don't apply to Santa and his yearly mission. Speaking as an engineer, this guy must know something about relativity that we have yet to discover. HO, HO, HO. From mccartney at blackbearddata.com Sat Dec 13 21:57:02 2008 From: mccartney at blackbearddata.com (McCartney Taylor) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 20:57:02 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Meteorite Book Message-ID: Yes, I can confirm the rumors that I have a meteorite book coming out soon. Its actually a monograph which is different than a book. For those non native English speakers, a monograph is a book extremely focused on a subject matter. In this case, its focused on just the Santa Lucia Meteorite Fall that occurred in January, 2008. I was fortunate to be the only field researcher there after the fall. The monograph contains my field notes, color pictures, stories, research, new Argentine law issues, and other items related to just this fall. 65 pages. This will be the first in a series of monographs covering meteorite falls and fines I've researched. That will include Tanzania, Deport, the new Canadian, etc... I'll roll these out when I damn well feel like it. :0) I'll give the list a heads up when it comes available. -mt From epgrondine at yahoo.com Sat Dec 13 23:06:18 2008 From: epgrondine at yahoo.com (E.P. Grondine) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 20:06:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Buzzard Coullee Message-ID: <940326.3325.qm@web36902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi all - What else to do but look through the email, as I sit here digesting a fine steak dinner... And here I was hoping for Manitou Lake, which is far prettier sounding, if not a prettier place in fact. Let's see: "Spirit Lake" versus what sounds like "Buzzard's A**". But there's still hope, as I wonder were the center of this strewn field actually is? All of which led me to thinking. While the treaties were pretty specific, I wonder if they cover meteorites falling onto what at one time were the peoples' lands. Perhaps under the treaties some exceptions to Canadian meteorite ownership laws may exist similar to the casino, tobacco, gasoline, peyote, etc exceptions to US and state laws. What the hell, maybe its worth a shot. Here's my best wishes for the season for you, and I hope a more prosperous new year for all of us Good luck and good hunting, E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas Hoping that you have not lost your From sdunklee72520 at yahoo.com Sat Dec 13 23:16:12 2008 From: sdunklee72520 at yahoo.com (Steve Dunklee) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 20:16:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Santa Physics...again for 2008 In-Reply-To: <822da19a0812131838u663be620icb3aaedc204cf939@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <81639.12762.qm@web33206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Awe thats no fun Grinch! Have a merry christmas everyone! Steve --- On Sat, 12/13/08, Dark Matter wrote: > From: Dark Matter > Subject: [meteorite-list] Santa Physics...again for 2008 > To: "Meteorite List" > Date: Saturday, December 13, 2008, 8:38 PM > Hi All, > > It seems it has befallen upon me to hold the job of > official Santa > Physics story reposter. So, in the true spirit of the > season, here it > is yet again. > > And as usual, I have not checked the math. > > Enjoy. > > Martin > > > > > > > Engineering Christmas: Some points of contention. > > There are approximately two billion children (persons under > 18) in the > world. However, since Santa does not visit children of > Muslim, Hindu, > Jewish or Buddhist religions, this reduces the workload for > Christmas > night to 15% of the total, or 378 million (according to the > Population > Reference Bureau). At an average (census) rate of 3.5 > children per > household, that comes to 108 million homes, presuming that > there is at > least one good child in each dwelling. > > Santa has about 31 hours of Christmas to work with thanks > to the > different time zones and the rotation of the earth, > assuming he > travels east to west which seems logical. This works out to > 967.7 > visits per second. This is to say that for each Christian > household > with a good child, Santa has about 1/1000th of a second to > park the > sleigh, hop out, jump down the chimney, fill the stockings, > distribute > the remaining presents under the tree, eat whatever snacks > have been > left for him, get back up the chimney, jump into the sleigh > and get on > to the next house. Assuming that each of these 108 million > stops is > evenly distributed around the earth (which of course, we > know to be > false, but will accept for the purpose of our > calculations), we are > now talking about 0.78 miles per household; a total trip of > 75.5 > million miles, not counting bathroom stops or other breaks. > > This requires that Santa's sleigh moves at 650 miles > per second--3000 > times the speed of sound. For purposes of comparison, the > fastest > man-made vehicle, the Ulysses space probe, moves at a poky > 27.4 miles > per second, and conventional reindeer can run at best 30 > miles per > hour. > > The payload of the sleigh adds another interesting element. > Assuming > that each child gets nothing more than a medium sized Lego > set (two > pounds), the sleigh is carrying over 500,000 tons, not > counting Santa > himself. On land a conventional reindeer can pull about 300 > pounds. > Even granting that the "flying" reindeer could > pull ten times the > normal amount, the job just cannot be done with eight or > nine of > them-- Santa would need 360,000 reindeer! > > This increases the payload, not counting the weight of the > sleigh, > another 54,000 tons or roughly seven times the weight of > the Queen > Elizabeth (the ship, not the monarch). > > 4.600,000 tons traveling at 650 miles per second creates > enormous air > resistance-- this would heat up the reindeer in the same > fashion as > spacecraft re-entering the earth's atmosphere (which > may explain > Rudolph's red nose). The lead pair of reindeer would > absorb 14.3 > quintillion joules of energy per second. In short, they > would > instantaneously vaporize exposing the reindeer behind them > to the same > friction and also creating deafening sonic booms in their > wake. The > entire reindeer team would vanish within 4.26 thousandths > of a second, > or right about the time Santa reached the fifth house on > his trip. > > Not that it matters, however since Santa, as a result of > accelerating > from a dead stop to 650 miles per second in .001 seconds, > would be > subjected to centrifugal forces of 17,500 Gs. A 250 pound > Santa (which > seems ludicrously slim) would be pinned to the back of the > sleigh by > 4,315,015 pounds of force, instantly crushing his bones and > organs and > reducing him to a quivering red-hot blob of goo. And yet, > he returns > year after year. > > Therefore, the rules of physics obviously don't apply > to Santa and his > yearly mission. Speaking as an engineer, this guy must know > something > about relativity that we have yet to discover. > > HO, HO, HO. > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From sdunklee72520 at yahoo.com Sat Dec 13 23:29:28 2008 From: sdunklee72520 at yahoo.com (Steve Dunklee) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 20:29:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] iridium flares? In-Reply-To: <98807221A0DC4D5A83390B278422D7DC@bellatrix> Message-ID: <100379.78058.qm@web33203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> there have been several company's using weather balloons to send up cell phone repeaters. they travel up to 50 miles up . I suspect with it having no motion it is what you Saw. Steve From michael at spacerocksinc.com Sun Dec 14 05:37:57 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 02:37:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 14, 2008 Message-ID: <5572381.2900711229251077149.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_14_2008.html From almitt at kconline.com Sun Dec 14 10:16:27 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 10:16:27 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate In-Reply-To: <002501c95d4e$f495cca0$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> References: <002501c95d4e$f495cca0$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Message-ID: <8E6D633437BD4B7592BD4BD9C002A95F@StarmanPC> Greetings List Members, It seems that a certain member in bad standing that continues to want to advertise here who has cheated a number of unsuspecting members by both not returning money to them after promising to do so and also misrepresenting meteorite types as something rare when they are not. A number of these victims wrote to me to thank me for posting my first email message about him. Here are a few of the list archives indicating there are serious problems with this creep. You can also go here to see for your self a number of the problems that have been posted over the list for a number of years. http://www.google.com/custom?q=bob+evans&domains=six.pairlist.net&sitesearch=six.pairlist.net&sitesearch=&sa=Search+the+Archives I must warn the list of Bob Evans as well. I was supposed to receive a $125 refund from Bob over a month ago and I still have not received my money back, nor have I recieved a response from him after several email and phone call attempts. Well, I checked his Ebay history a few days ago and noticed that he had placed a $1500 bid on a meteorite not too long ago, yet he cannot afford to return my hard-earned money back to me? Never again! I warn everyone else not to do any business with Bob Evans. His unprofessionalism is a joke. Ryan Well, Bob Evans just called me after reading my email to the list and he was pissed-off as I had expected he would be.. nearly shouting at me through the phone line. It doesn't look like I wil be getting "a penny back" from him, so it looks like I'll have to use alternate routes to get my money back. Sorry to everyone else who has to read this, but his reaction to the situation is unacceptable. By the way Bob....I'm 22 years old, not 15 as you had asked me during our brief phone altercation this evening. See you in Tucson next year... I'm sure everyone will be giving you a warm welcome. Ryan Bob Evans its another Cosmicvisitors alias Brad Sampson...sent money no material, useless excuses aside the mailbox not go etc..... Mauro Daniel McCartney and List, Doesn`t a theft of goods totaling a sum of 4,000+$ constitute a Felony in Texas? http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061122154905AAnQ0ts Thank you McCartney for your post to the list. Sincerely, Dirk...Tokyo mccartney wrote: As a member of IMCA, I feel it my duty to warn other meteorite buffs to avoid entanglements from questionable persons. On June 24, 2006 I posted to the list as a courtesy that I had been the victim of a fraudulent trade with Bob Evans. This is the rest of the story... After a year of trying to resolve the issue, it took me many more months to conclude that he just wasn't going to respond. I sent emails, Ebay emails, registered letters and confirmed delivery letters, with no response from Mr. Evans. He had my piece and he wasn't going to finish the trade. I sued Bob Evans in Williamson County, Texas Court. It went to court on October 19, 2006. Small CLaims suit #060094. He apparently tried to avoid being served his lawsuit by the Will County Sheriff, but they served him successfully. He did not respond to the suit, nor did he show in court. He lost by default and now has a judgment of $4,800 against him. He now joins Mr. Casper in the hall of Shame. Its my character flaw to be an overyly trusting guy. I have traded with people from South Africa to West Texas, Poland to Alaska. Never had a problem. On the whole the average meteorite fan is a fair, wholesome, science loving, respectable person. I encourage all of you to trade with your peers on this list, but do a little homework on your partner first to weed out the Caspers and Bob Evans's. Last word, the meteorite community is a small sand box - Remember to play nice. -mt IMCA 2760 Yes, there was a lawsuit against Bob Evans brought by me. It was in > regards to a trade that was partially done, where I sent material and only > received a partial trade, then Evans went quiet. No contact for many > months. Eventually, I posted about it and received many replies that he > has done this before. His modus operandi is usually to go quiet and not > communicate. Which is what he's doing now. He did not show in court, I > received a default judgment by the judge. > Evans did not appeal and a judgment was issued. I spent the money to have > the judgment filed in Illinois and a lien filed against his house. At this > time he can not purchase or sell, or inherit real property until the > judgment is paid. It is collecting 8% interest at this time. > If I recall my contract law correctly, selling NWA junk as Zulu Queen > would be 'Misrepresentation' as well as Unjust Enrichment. Selling Zulu > Queen that he didn't know was NWA junk is simply 'Mutual > Misunderstanding'. Good luck in proving he had prior knowledge it was NWA > junk. > This is a small sandbox we play in. Play nice. McCartney Taylor Dear List, This is a public warning to Bob Evans to stop using the NWA 1110 and NWA 1877 designations and meteoritelab descriptions. I filed a blanket complaint claim with ebay and found out that it is considered fraudulent to use lab numbers that do not apply to your samples. It is also against the law to steal copyrighted descriptions. It took me weeks to explain to ebay what is involved with getting numbers assigned to NWA meteorites. I will start pulling the trigger soon on this kind of fraud starting with Bob Evans. If ebay gets too many complaints the meteorite subsection might be reconsidered (eliminated). That is why I am posting this message publicly to avoid continued contact with ebay. Here are two of the many fraudulent auctions Bob Evans is involved in: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562058&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562068&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW Consider this warning to edit your numbers and descriptions to reflect the truth or I will report this fraud to ebay when I return tomorrow. My attorney gave me the green light to start pursuing these cases and I will exercise my options. Wishing everybody else the best, Greetings List, I could go on and on and post dozens if not more posts on people having trouble with this thief but it would be counterproductive to our discussion here. I feel I have done my part to warn people of this creep and if you don't take the advise of this email and the emails of others who have, had trouble with this criminal then we'll await to see your post on the trouble you are having by thinking this is some kind of a joke. Best wishes to all! --AL Mitterling From bobe5531 at comcast.net Sun Dec 14 10:35:37 2008 From: bobe5531 at comcast.net (Bob Evans) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 09:35:37 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate References: <002501c95d4e$f495cca0$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> <8E6D633437BD4B7592BD4BD9C002A95F@StarmanPC> Message-ID: <000601c95e01$9d5c9b40$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Al, Never heard of Mauro Daniel. Sent money, no material ? Thats a joke. Look at my feedback. A clown like this doesnt even know who he dealt with Ryan is a little self centered brat who blew off a deal with me. McCartney and I had a deal go bad that we are to this day trying to reconcile. Misrepresent ? Never ! NWA 1110 - Adams efforts to comletely control certain areas of the market. As for you Al, You never bought a single item from me, have you? So if you have a problem with me I suggest that you take it up with me face to face and stop hiding behind that monitor you little P***Y ----- Original Message ----- From: "al mitterling" To: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 9:16 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate > Greetings List Members, > > It seems that a certain member in bad standing that continues to want to > advertise here who has cheated a number of unsuspecting members by both > not returning money to them after promising to do so and also > misrepresenting meteorite types as something rare when they are not. A > number of these victims wrote to me to thank me for posting my first email > message about him. > > Here are a few of the list archives indicating there are serious problems > with this creep. You can also go here to see for your self a number of the > problems that have been posted over the list for a number of years. > > http://www.google.com/custom?q=bob+evans&domains=six.pairlist.net&sitesearch=six.pairlist.net&sitesearch=&sa=Search+the+Archives > > I must warn the list of Bob Evans as well. I was supposed to receive a > $125 refund from Bob over a month ago and I still have not received my > money back, nor have I recieved a response from him after several email > and phone call attempts. Well, I checked his Ebay history a few days ago > and noticed that he had placed a $1500 bid on a meteorite not too long > ago, yet he cannot afford to return my hard-earned money back to me? Never > again! I warn everyone else not to do any business with Bob Evans. His > unprofessionalism is a joke. > > Ryan > > Well, Bob Evans just called me after reading my email to the list and he > was pissed-off as I had expected he would be.. nearly shouting at me > through the phone line. It doesn't look like I wil be getting "a penny > back" from him, so it looks like I'll have to use alternate routes to get > my money back. Sorry to everyone else who has to read this, but his > reaction to the situation is unacceptable. By the way Bob....I'm 22 years > old, not 15 as you had asked me during our brief phone altercation this > evening. See you in Tucson next year... I'm sure everyone will be giving > you a warm welcome. > > Ryan > > Bob Evans its another Cosmicvisitors alias Brad Sampson...sent money no > material, useless excuses aside the mailbox not go etc..... > > Mauro Daniel > > McCartney and List, > Doesn`t a theft of goods totaling a sum of 4,000+$ constitute a Felony in > Texas? > http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061122154905AAnQ0ts > Thank you McCartney for your post to the list. > Sincerely, Dirk...Tokyo > > mccartney wrote: > As a member of IMCA, I feel it my duty to warn other meteorite buffs to > avoid entanglements from questionable persons. > > On June 24, 2006 I posted to the list as a courtesy that I had been the > victim of a fraudulent trade with Bob Evans. This is the rest of the > story... > > After a year of trying to resolve the issue, it took me many more months > to conclude that he just wasn't going to respond. > > I sent emails, Ebay emails, registered letters and confirmed delivery > letters, with no response from Mr. Evans. He had my piece and he wasn't > going to finish the trade. > > I sued Bob Evans in Williamson County, Texas Court. It went to court on > October 19, 2006. Small CLaims suit #060094. He apparently tried to avoid > being served his lawsuit by the Will County Sheriff, but they served him > successfully. He did not respond to the suit, nor did he show in court. > > He lost by default and now has a judgment of $4,800 against him. He now > joins Mr. Casper in the hall of Shame. > > Its my character flaw to be an overyly trusting guy. I have traded with > people from South Africa to West Texas, Poland to Alaska. Never had a > problem. On the whole the average meteorite fan is a fair, wholesome, > science loving, respectable person. I encourage all of you to trade with > your peers on this list, but do a little homework on your partner first to > weed out the Caspers and Bob Evans's. > > Last word, the meteorite community is a small sand box - Remember to play > nice. > > -mt > IMCA 2760 > > Yes, there was a lawsuit against Bob Evans brought by me. It was in >> regards to a trade that was partially done, where I sent material and >> only > >> received a partial trade, then Evans went quiet. No contact for many >> months. Eventually, I posted about it and received many replies that he >> has done this before. His modus operandi is usually to go quiet and not >> communicate. Which is what he's doing now. He did not show in court, I >> received a default judgment by the judge. > >> Evans did not appeal and a judgment was issued. I spent the money to have >> the judgment filed in Illinois and a lien filed against his house. At >> this time he can not purchase or sell, or inherit real property until the >> judgment is paid. It is collecting 8% interest at this time. > >> If I recall my contract law correctly, selling NWA junk as Zulu Queen >> would be 'Misrepresentation' as well as Unjust Enrichment. Selling Zulu >> Queen that he didn't know was NWA junk is simply 'Mutual >> Misunderstanding'. Good luck in proving he had prior knowledge it was NWA >> junk. > >> This is a small sandbox we play in. Play nice. McCartney Taylor > > Dear List, > > This is a public warning to Bob Evans to stop using the NWA 1110 and NWA > 1877 designations and meteoritelab descriptions. I filed a blanket > complaint claim with ebay and found out that it is considered fraudulent > to > use lab numbers that do not apply to your samples. It is also against the > law to steal copyrighted descriptions. It took me weeks to explain to ebay > what is involved with getting numbers assigned to NWA meteorites. I will > start pulling the trigger soon on this kind of fraud starting with Bob > Evans. If ebay gets too many complaints the meteorite subsection might be > reconsidered (eliminated). That is why I am posting this message publicly > to avoid continued contact with ebay. Here are two of the many fraudulent > auctions Bob Evans is involved in: > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562058&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562068&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW > > Consider this warning to edit your numbers and descriptions to reflect the > truth or I will report this fraud to ebay when I return tomorrow. My > attorney gave me the green light to start pursuing these cases and I will > exercise my options. > > Wishing everybody else the best, > > Greetings List, > > I could go on and on and post dozens if not more posts on people having > trouble with this thief but it would be counterproductive to our > discussion here. I feel I have done my part to warn people of this creep > and if you don't take the advise of this email and the emails of others > who have, had trouble with this criminal then we'll await to see your post > on the trouble you are having by thinking this is some kind of a joke. > Best wishes to all! > > --AL Mitterling > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mstreman53 at yahoo.com Sun Dec 14 10:42:03 2008 From: mstreman53 at yahoo.com (Mr EMan) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 07:42:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] iridium flares? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <828639.76324.qm@web55206.mail.re4.yahoo.com> In the future go to create a free log-in if you do not already have one, enter your location ( by any of several means) then go to Iridium Flare Forecast. You may work back or forward for a few days to see in what direction and for what times a flare might be visible. This also works for satellites and the ISS including the ISS Toolbag--PLUS the Shuttle Orbiter when aloft. Yes flares are usually seen in afternoon and early morning when closer to the horizon; Anytime the solar panels form an angle of incidence that directs sunlight to your location. That is, flares occur continuously but we only observe them when we are at the right location for the light to come our way. Elton --- On Sat, 12/13/08, Jerry Flaherty wrote: > Are Iridium flares customarily visible in the daytime. What > I saw this afternoon in the southwest was possibly an > aircraft but because it varied in brightness so intensely > and remained "motionless" for the 10 to 15 seconds > I observed it, I thought Flare?! > Jerry Flaherty From dave at fallingrocks.com Sun Dec 14 10:54:25 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 10:54:25 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] ATTN: ART JONES AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate In-Reply-To: <000601c95e01$9d5c9b40$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> References: <002501c95d4e$f495cca0$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b><8E6D633437BD4B7592BD4BD9C002A95F@StarmanPC> <000601c95e01$9d5c9b40$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Message-ID: Art, What process is in place to remove this kind of garbage from the list? One can rent Groundhog Day for a much lighter story with the same effect, and I won't bother going through the well-placed and well-established broken list rules here again. I'm not referring to Al Mitterling, by the way... Thanks in advance, Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Bob Evans Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 10:36 AM To: al mitterling Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate Al, Never heard of Mauro Daniel. Sent money, no material ? Thats a joke. Look at my feedback. A clown like this doesnt even know who he dealt with Ryan is a little self centered brat who blew off a deal with me. McCartney and I had a deal go bad that we are to this day trying to reconcile. Misrepresent ? Never ! NWA 1110 - Adams efforts to comletely control certain areas of the market. As for you Al, You never bought a single item from me, have you? So if you have a problem with me I suggest that you take it up with me face to face and stop hiding behind that monitor you little P***Y ----- Original Message ----- From: "al mitterling" To: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 9:16 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate > Greetings List Members, > > It seems that a certain member in bad standing that continues to want to > advertise here who has cheated a number of unsuspecting members by both > not returning money to them after promising to do so and also > misrepresenting meteorite types as something rare when they are not. A > number of these victims wrote to me to thank me for posting my first email > message about him. > > Here are a few of the list archives indicating there are serious problems > with this creep. You can also go here to see for your self a number of the > problems that have been posted over the list for a number of years. > > http://www.google.com/custom?q=bob+evans&domains=six.pairlist.net&sitesearch =six.pairlist.net&sitesearch=&sa=Search+the+Archives > > I must warn the list of Bob Evans as well. I was supposed to receive a > $125 refund from Bob over a month ago and I still have not received my > money back, nor have I recieved a response from him after several email > and phone call attempts. Well, I checked his Ebay history a few days ago > and noticed that he had placed a $1500 bid on a meteorite not too long > ago, yet he cannot afford to return my hard-earned money back to me? Never > again! I warn everyone else not to do any business with Bob Evans. His > unprofessionalism is a joke. > > Ryan > > Well, Bob Evans just called me after reading my email to the list and he > was pissed-off as I had expected he would be.. nearly shouting at me > through the phone line. It doesn't look like I wil be getting "a penny > back" from him, so it looks like I'll have to use alternate routes to get > my money back. Sorry to everyone else who has to read this, but his > reaction to the situation is unacceptable. By the way Bob....I'm 22 years > old, not 15 as you had asked me during our brief phone altercation this > evening. See you in Tucson next year... I'm sure everyone will be giving > you a warm welcome. > > Ryan > > Bob Evans its another Cosmicvisitors alias Brad Sampson...sent money no > material, useless excuses aside the mailbox not go etc..... > > Mauro Daniel > > McCartney and List, > Doesn`t a theft of goods totaling a sum of 4,000+$ constitute a Felony in > Texas? > http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061122154905AAnQ0ts > Thank you McCartney for your post to the list. > Sincerely, Dirk...Tokyo > > mccartney wrote: > As a member of IMCA, I feel it my duty to warn other meteorite buffs to > avoid entanglements from questionable persons. > > On June 24, 2006 I posted to the list as a courtesy that I had been the > victim of a fraudulent trade with Bob Evans. This is the rest of the > story... > > After a year of trying to resolve the issue, it took me many more months > to conclude that he just wasn't going to respond. > > I sent emails, Ebay emails, registered letters and confirmed delivery > letters, with no response from Mr. Evans. He had my piece and he wasn't > going to finish the trade. > > I sued Bob Evans in Williamson County, Texas Court. It went to court on > October 19, 2006. Small CLaims suit #060094. He apparently tried to avoid > being served his lawsuit by the Will County Sheriff, but they served him > successfully. He did not respond to the suit, nor did he show in court. > > He lost by default and now has a judgment of $4,800 against him. He now > joins Mr. Casper in the hall of Shame. > > Its my character flaw to be an overyly trusting guy. I have traded with > people from South Africa to West Texas, Poland to Alaska. Never had a > problem. On the whole the average meteorite fan is a fair, wholesome, > science loving, respectable person. I encourage all of you to trade with > your peers on this list, but do a little homework on your partner first to > weed out the Caspers and Bob Evans's. > > Last word, the meteorite community is a small sand box - Remember to play > nice. > > -mt > IMCA 2760 > > Yes, there was a lawsuit against Bob Evans brought by me. It was in >> regards to a trade that was partially done, where I sent material and >> only > >> received a partial trade, then Evans went quiet. No contact for many >> months. Eventually, I posted about it and received many replies that he >> has done this before. His modus operandi is usually to go quiet and not >> communicate. Which is what he's doing now. He did not show in court, I >> received a default judgment by the judge. > >> Evans did not appeal and a judgment was issued. I spent the money to have >> the judgment filed in Illinois and a lien filed against his house. At >> this time he can not purchase or sell, or inherit real property until the >> judgment is paid. It is collecting 8% interest at this time. > >> If I recall my contract law correctly, selling NWA junk as Zulu Queen >> would be 'Misrepresentation' as well as Unjust Enrichment. Selling Zulu >> Queen that he didn't know was NWA junk is simply 'Mutual >> Misunderstanding'. Good luck in proving he had prior knowledge it was NWA >> junk. > >> This is a small sandbox we play in. Play nice. McCartney Taylor > > Dear List, > > This is a public warning to Bob Evans to stop using the NWA 1110 and NWA > 1877 designations and meteoritelab descriptions. I filed a blanket > complaint claim with ebay and found out that it is considered fraudulent > to > use lab numbers that do not apply to your samples. It is also against the > law to steal copyrighted descriptions. It took me weeks to explain to ebay > what is involved with getting numbers assigned to NWA meteorites. I will > start pulling the trigger soon on this kind of fraud starting with Bob > Evans. If ebay gets too many complaints the meteorite subsection might be > reconsidered (eliminated). That is why I am posting this message publicly > to avoid continued contact with ebay. Here are two of the many fraudulent > auctions Bob Evans is involved in: > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562058& rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562068& rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW > > Consider this warning to edit your numbers and descriptions to reflect the > truth or I will report this fraud to ebay when I return tomorrow. My > attorney gave me the green light to start pursuing these cases and I will > exercise my options. > > Wishing everybody else the best, > > Greetings List, > > I could go on and on and post dozens if not more posts on people having > trouble with this thief but it would be counterproductive to our > discussion here. I feel I have done my part to warn people of this creep > and if you don't take the advise of this email and the emails of others > who have, had trouble with this criminal then we'll await to see your post > on the trouble you are having by thinking this is some kind of a joke. > Best wishes to all! > > --AL Mitterling > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com Sun Dec 14 11:25:56 2008 From: joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com (JoshuaTreeMuseum) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 11:25:56 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! Message-ID: <6EBE53A8E79147C4BA995B51AA689089@ET> First off, kudos to Al Mitterling for pointing out the riffy, illegal business practices of Bob Evans. I'm surprised no one else has called out this onion in the daisy patch. Bob Evans has made thousands of dollars selling misrepresented meteorites to unsuspecting customers, notably Plymouth and Zulu Queen. I know because I was duped into buying a sample of his ersatz Plymouth. At the time, I had just gotten a job as collections curator of a small Earth and Space museum. I was very excited to see the Plymouth meteorite offered in an ad on the Meteorite List, as the town is just down the road from us and my uncle and I had spent considerable time researching and searching for the supposed lost main mass. (Turned out to be a wild goose chase). Since Bob seemed to be a list member in good standing I figured he could be trusted. If I had known enough to search the archives, I would have seen that he is a con man. To make a long story short, Bob's Plymouth was as phony as a 3 dollar bill. He told me it was etched before I bought it, (it wasn't). He promised he would return my money as he stated in the auction, (he didn't). I've asked him numerous times for my money back and got nothing but a run around. This guy is a con artist and I must admit he runs a good scam that has been very profitable for him. He's giving the industry a bad name and should be flamed every time he comes out of hiding and has the audacity to come back and post on the list. I would like to warn all newbies: Do not deal with this guy! If you do, you will regret it in the long run. Phil Whitmer From almitt at kconline.com Sun Dec 14 11:30:28 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 11:30:28 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! In-Reply-To: <6EBE53A8E79147C4BA995B51AA689089@ET> References: <6EBE53A8E79147C4BA995B51AA689089@ET> Message-ID: Greetings, Since bob has sent this to the list, I will reply. One item you have misrepresented is Plymouth, Indiana. The buyer of that has contacted you many times trying to get their money back and has never had any success and he has tried hard. This buyer contacted me to thank me for my post and tell me about his fruitless efforts with you. There have been questions about a great number of your other items and the pedigree. Some of which you said you purchased as an exchange from a university but they say they never had contact with you. Your criminal behavior is a problem for the whole collecting and selling meteorite community. If you could offer up proof where your items of question came from then it might give you some of your reputation back. However in your email you mention that you don't have to let anyone know where you get your items from. To me, that tells a lot about you. Serious problems like this need to be brought out in the open and people warned. I agree with Dave Gheesling, Art, please remove the trash from the list. --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" To: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 11:25 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! > First off, kudos to Al Mitterling for pointing out the riffy, illegal > business practices of Bob Evans. I'm surprised no one else has called > out this onion in the daisy patch. Bob Evans has made thousands of > dollars selling misrepresented meteorites to unsuspecting customers, > notably Plymouth and Zulu Queen. I know because I was duped into buying a > sample of his ersatz Plymouth. At the time, I had just gotten a job as > collections curator of a small Earth and Space museum. I was very excited > to see the Plymouth meteorite offered in an ad on the Meteorite List, as > the town is just down the road from us and my uncle and I had spent > considerable time researching and searching for the supposed lost main > mass. (Turned out to be a wild goose chase). Since Bob seemed to be a > list member in good standing I figured he could be trusted. If I had known > enough to search the archives, I would have seen that he is a con man. To > make a long story short, Bob's Plymouth was as phony as a 3 dollar bill. > He told me it was etched before I bought it, (it wasn't). He promised he > would return my money as he stated in the auction, (he didn't). I've > asked him numerous times for my money back and got nothing but a run > around. This guy is a con artist and I must admit he runs a good scam > that has been very profitable for him. He's giving the industry a bad > name and should be flamed every time he comes out of hiding and has the > audacity to come back and post on the list. I would like to warn all > newbies: Do not deal with this guy! If you do, you will regret it in the > long run. > Phil Whitmer > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From meteoritefinder at gmail.com Sun Dec 14 12:04:12 2008 From: meteoritefinder at gmail.com (Mike Miller) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 10:04:12 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! In-Reply-To: References: <6EBE53A8E79147C4BA995B51AA689089@ET> Message-ID: <468bf6050812140904s6ea60249m2004e10e38156911@mail.gmail.com> I know this community is not set up as a democracy, but I as a list member feel that I am condoning bad conduct if it is allowed to take place in my community without a very loud voice against it. In this case I think there has been enough brought to light on the subject to remove the offending person. If we do not then we are saying let his voice be heard, and by allowing it in our midst we say (by our actions or lack of it) that his voice speaks the truth. I don't even know if Bob is still on this list, but I feel he should not be allowed to post if he is still here. So I will cast that vote that I really don't have and say Art please remove this very questionable seller of maybes. On Sun, Dec 14, 2008 at 9:30 AM, al mitterling wrote: > Greetings, > > Since bob has sent this to the list, I will reply. One item you have > misrepresented is Plymouth, Indiana. The buyer of that has contacted you > many times trying to get their money back and has never had any success and > he has tried hard. This buyer contacted me to thank me for my post and tell > me about his fruitless efforts with you. There have been questions about a > great number of your other items and the pedigree. Some of which you said > you purchased as an exchange from a university but they say they never had > contact with you. > > Your criminal behavior is a problem for the whole collecting and selling > meteorite community. If you could offer up proof where your items of > question came from then it might give you some of your reputation back. > However in your email you mention that you don't have to let anyone know > where you get your items from. To me, that tells a lot about you. > Serious problems like this need to be brought out in the open and people > warned. > > I agree with Dave Gheesling, Art, please remove the trash from the list. > > --AL Mitterling > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" > > To: > Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 11:25 AM > Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! > > >> First off, kudos to Al Mitterling for pointing out the riffy, illegal >> business practices of Bob Evans. I'm surprised no one else has called out >> this onion in the daisy patch. Bob Evans has made thousands of dollars >> selling misrepresented meteorites to unsuspecting customers, notably >> Plymouth and Zulu Queen. I know because I was duped into buying a sample of >> his ersatz Plymouth. At the time, I had just gotten a job as collections >> curator of a small Earth and Space museum. I was very excited to see the >> Plymouth meteorite offered in an ad on the Meteorite List, as the town is >> just down the road from us and my uncle and I had spent considerable time >> researching and searching for the supposed lost main mass. (Turned out to be >> a wild goose chase). Since Bob seemed to be a list member in good standing >> I figured he could be trusted. If I had known enough to search the archives, >> I would have seen that he is a con man. To make a long story short, Bob's >> Plymouth was as phony as a 3 dollar bill. He told me it was etched before I >> bought it, (it wasn't). He promised he would return my money as he stated >> in the auction, (he didn't). I've asked him numerous times for my money >> back and got nothing but a run around. This guy is a con artist and I must >> admit he runs a good scam that has been very profitable for him. He's >> giving the industry a bad name and should be flamed every time he comes out >> of hiding and has the audacity to come back and post on the list. I would >> like to warn all newbies: Do not deal with this guy! If you do, you will >> regret it in the long run. >> Phil Whitmer >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr. Kingman Az 86401 www.meteoritefinder.com 928-753-6825 From almitt at kconline.com Sun Dec 14 11:26:05 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 11:26:05 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate In-Reply-To: <000601c95e01$9d5c9b40$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> References: <002501c95d4e$f495cca0$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b><8E6D633437BD4B7592BD4BD9C002A95F@StarmanPC> <000601c95e01$9d5c9b40$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Message-ID: Greetings, Since bob has sent this to the list, I will reply. One item you have misrepresented is Plymouth, Indiana. The buyer of that has contacted you many times trying to get their money back and has never had any success and he has tried hard. This buyer contacted me to thank me for my post and tell me about his fruitless efforts with you. There have been questions about a great number of your other items and the pedigree. Some of which you said you purchased as an exchange from a university but they say they never had contact with you. Your criminal behavior is a problem for the whole collecting and selling meteorite community. If you could offer up proof where your items of question came from then it might give you some of your reputation back. However in your email you mention that you don't have to let anyone know where you get your items from. To me, that tells a lot about you. Serious problems like this need to be brought out in the open and people warned. I agree with Dave Gheesling, Art, please remove the trash from the list. --AL Mitterling > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "al mitterling" > To: > Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 9:16 AM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate > > >> Greetings List Members, >> >> It seems that a certain member in bad standing that continues to want to >> advertise here who has cheated a number of unsuspecting members by both >> not returning money to them after promising to do so and also >> misrepresenting meteorite types as something rare when they are not. A >> number of these victims wrote to me to thank me for posting my first >> email message about him. >> >> Here are a few of the list archives indicating there are serious problems >> with this creep. You can also go here to see for your self a number of >> the problems that have been posted over the list for a number of years. >> >> http://www.google.com/custom?q=bob+evans&domains=six.pairlist.net&sitesearch=six.pairlist.net&sitesearch=&sa=Search+the+Archives >> >> I must warn the list of Bob Evans as well. I was supposed to receive a >> $125 refund from Bob over a month ago and I still have not received my >> money back, nor have I recieved a response from him after several email >> and phone call attempts. Well, I checked his Ebay history a few days ago >> and noticed that he had placed a $1500 bid on a meteorite not too long >> ago, yet he cannot afford to return my hard-earned money back to me? >> Never again! I warn everyone else not to do any business with Bob Evans. >> His unprofessionalism is a joke. >> >> Ryan >> >> Well, Bob Evans just called me after reading my email to the list and he >> was pissed-off as I had expected he would be.. nearly shouting at me >> through the phone line. It doesn't look like I wil be getting "a penny >> back" from him, so it looks like I'll have to use alternate routes to get >> my money back. Sorry to everyone else who has to read this, but his >> reaction to the situation is unacceptable. By the way Bob....I'm 22 years >> old, not 15 as you had asked me during our brief phone altercation this >> evening. See you in Tucson next year... I'm sure everyone will be giving >> you a warm welcome. >> >> Ryan >> >> Bob Evans its another Cosmicvisitors alias Brad Sampson...sent money no >> material, useless excuses aside the mailbox not go etc..... >> >> Mauro Daniel >> >> McCartney and List, >> Doesn`t a theft of goods totaling a sum of 4,000+$ constitute a Felony in >> Texas? >> http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061122154905AAnQ0ts >> Thank you McCartney for your post to the list. >> Sincerely, Dirk...Tokyo >> >> mccartney wrote: >> As a member of IMCA, I feel it my duty to warn other meteorite buffs to >> avoid entanglements from questionable persons. >> >> On June 24, 2006 I posted to the list as a courtesy that I had been the >> victim of a fraudulent trade with Bob Evans. This is the rest of the >> story... >> >> After a year of trying to resolve the issue, it took me many more months >> to conclude that he just wasn't going to respond. >> >> I sent emails, Ebay emails, registered letters and confirmed delivery >> letters, with no response from Mr. Evans. He had my piece and he wasn't >> going to finish the trade. >> >> I sued Bob Evans in Williamson County, Texas Court. It went to court on >> October 19, 2006. Small CLaims suit #060094. He apparently tried to avoid >> being served his lawsuit by the Will County Sheriff, but they served him >> successfully. He did not respond to the suit, nor did he show in court. >> >> He lost by default and now has a judgment of $4,800 against him. He now >> joins Mr. Casper in the hall of Shame. >> >> Its my character flaw to be an overyly trusting guy. I have traded with >> people from South Africa to West Texas, Poland to Alaska. Never had a >> problem. On the whole the average meteorite fan is a fair, wholesome, >> science loving, respectable person. I encourage all of you to trade with >> your peers on this list, but do a little homework on your partner first >> to weed out the Caspers and Bob Evans's. >> >> Last word, the meteorite community is a small sand box - Remember to play >> nice. >> >> -mt >> IMCA 2760 >> >> Yes, there was a lawsuit against Bob Evans brought by me. It was in >>> regards to a trade that was partially done, where I sent material and >>> only >> >>> received a partial trade, then Evans went quiet. No contact for many >>> months. Eventually, I posted about it and received many replies that he >>> has done this before. His modus operandi is usually to go quiet and not >>> communicate. Which is what he's doing now. He did not show in court, I >>> received a default judgment by the judge. >> >>> Evans did not appeal and a judgment was issued. I spent the money to >>> have the judgment filed in Illinois and a lien filed against his house. >>> At this time he can not purchase or sell, or inherit real property until >>> the judgment is paid. It is collecting 8% interest at this time. >> >>> If I recall my contract law correctly, selling NWA junk as Zulu Queen >>> would be 'Misrepresentation' as well as Unjust Enrichment. Selling Zulu >>> Queen that he didn't know was NWA junk is simply 'Mutual >>> Misunderstanding'. Good luck in proving he had prior knowledge it was >>> NWA junk. >> >>> This is a small sandbox we play in. Play nice. McCartney Taylor >> >> Dear List, >> >> This is a public warning to Bob Evans to stop using the NWA 1110 and NWA >> 1877 designations and meteoritelab descriptions. I filed a blanket >> complaint claim with ebay and found out that it is considered fraudulent >> to >> use lab numbers that do not apply to your samples. It is also against the >> law to steal copyrighted descriptions. It took me weeks to explain to >> ebay >> what is involved with getting numbers assigned to NWA meteorites. I will >> start pulling the trigger soon on this kind of fraud starting with Bob >> Evans. If ebay gets too many complaints the meteorite subsection might be >> reconsidered (eliminated). That is why I am posting this message publicly >> to avoid continued contact with ebay. Here are two of the many fraudulent >> auctions Bob Evans is involved in: >> >> >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562058&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW >> >> >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562068&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW >> >> Consider this warning to edit your numbers and descriptions to reflect >> the >> truth or I will report this fraud to ebay when I return tomorrow. My >> attorney gave me the green light to start pursuing these cases and I will >> exercise my options. >> >> Wishing everybody else the best, >> >> Greetings List, >> >> I could go on and on and post dozens if not more posts on people having >> trouble with this thief but it would be counterproductive to our >> discussion here. I feel I have done my part to warn people of this creep >> and if you don't take the advise of this email and the emails of others >> who have, had trouble with this criminal then we'll await to see your >> post on the trouble you are having by thinking this is some kind of a >> joke. Best wishes to all! >> >> --AL Mitterling >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From jkg2 at cox.net Sun Dec 14 12:32:00 2008 From: jkg2 at cox.net (John Gwilliam) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 10:32:00 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! In-Reply-To: <468bf6050812140904s6ea60249m2004e10e38156911@mail.gmail.co m> References: <6EBE53A8E79147C4BA995B51AA689089@ET> <468bf6050812140904s6ea60249m2004e10e38156911@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20081214173205.MVTM2948.fed1rmmtao101.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Everyone in the meteorite community is affected in a negative way by people like Bob. By not speaking up it can appear that his disreputable and illegal behavior is condoned by his peers. Yes, that's right, his peers. Until you stand up and openly condemn this unacceptable behavior, that is what you and I are. Best, John At 10:04 AM 12/14/2008, Mike Miller wrote: >I know this community is not set up as a democracy, but I as a list >member feel that I am condoning bad conduct if it is allowed to take >place in my community without a very loud voice against it. In this >case I think there has been enough brought to light on the subject to >remove the offending person. If we do not then we are saying let his >voice be heard, and by allowing it in our midst we say (by our actions >or lack of it) that his voice speaks the truth. I don't even know if >Bob is still on this list, but I feel he should not be allowed to post >if he is still here. So I will cast that vote that I really don't have >and say Art please remove this very questionable seller of maybes. > >On Sun, Dec 14, 2008 at 9:30 AM, al mitterling wrote: > > Greetings, > > > > Since bob has sent this to the list, I will reply. One item you have > > misrepresented is Plymouth, Indiana. The buyer of that has contacted you > > many times trying to get their money back and has never had any success and > > he has tried hard. This buyer contacted me to thank me for my > post and tell > > me about his fruitless efforts with you. There have been questions about a > > great number of your other items and the pedigree. Some of which you said > > you purchased as an exchange from a university but they say they never had > > contact with you. > > > > Your criminal behavior is a problem for the whole collecting and selling > > meteorite community. If you could offer up proof where your items of > > question came from then it might give you some of your reputation back. > > However in your email you mention that you don't have to let anyone know > > where you get your items from. To me, that tells a lot about you. > > Serious problems like this need to be brought out in the open and people > > warned. > > > > I agree with Dave Gheesling, Art, please remove the trash from the list. > > > > --AL Mitterling > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" > > > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 11:25 AM > > Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! > > > > > >> First off, kudos to Al Mitterling for pointing out the riffy, illegal > >> business practices of Bob Evans. I'm surprised no one else has > called out > >> this onion in the daisy patch. Bob Evans has made thousands of dollars > >> selling misrepresented meteorites to unsuspecting customers, notably > >> Plymouth and Zulu Queen. I know because I was duped into buying > a sample of > >> his ersatz Plymouth. At the time, I had just gotten a job as collections > >> curator of a small Earth and Space museum. I was very excited to see the > >> Plymouth meteorite offered in an ad on the Meteorite List, as the town is > >> just down the road from us and my uncle and I had spent considerable time > >> researching and searching for the supposed lost main mass. > (Turned out to be > >> a wild goose chase). Since Bob seemed to be a list member in > good standing > >> I figured he could be trusted. If I had known enough to search > the archives, > >> I would have seen that he is a con man. To make a long story short, Bob's > >> Plymouth was as phony as a 3 dollar bill. He told me it was > etched before I > >> bought it, (it wasn't). He promised he would return my money as he stated > >> in the auction, (he didn't). I've asked him numerous times for my money > >> back and got nothing but a run around. This guy is a con artist > and I must > >> admit he runs a good scam that has been very profitable for him. He's > >> giving the industry a bad name and should be flamed every time > he comes out > >> of hiding and has the audacity to come back and post on the list. I would > >> like to warn all newbies: Do not deal with this guy! If you do, you will > >> regret it in the long run. > >> Phil Whitmer > >> ______________________________________________ > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >> > >> > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > >-- >Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr. Kingman Az 86401 >www.meteoritefinder.com > 928-753-6825 >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list John Gwilliam Too many people were born on third base and go through life thinking they hit a triple. From griff6495 at msn.com Sun Dec 14 13:03:14 2008 From: griff6495 at msn.com (Floyd "Griff" Griffith) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 11:03:14 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate References: <002501c95d4e$f495cca0$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b><8E6D633437BD4B7592BD4BD9C002A95F@StarmanPC> <000601c95e01$9d5c9b40$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Message-ID: Open note to Bob Evens, Some time ago I purchased a piece of NWA 1950 from you. Then when it hit the fan for you, I emailed a request for authenticity from you. Actually I sent several emails. Not one response. How can someone buy with confidence from you if you are unwilling (or unable) to show authenticity of the items you sell. The lunar, NWA 1950 is now worthless to me or anyone. It is nothing more then a speck of dirt. Why would you think that anyone in this group would buy from you. You do not seem to even want to work it out. You revert to name calling. That always helps. Griff Floyd Griffith Parker, Colorado, USA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Evans" To: "al mitterling" Cc: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 8:35 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate > Al, > > Never heard of Mauro Daniel. Sent money, no material ? Thats a joke. Look > at my feedback. > A clown like this doesnt even know who he dealt with > > Ryan is a little self centered brat who blew off a deal with me. > McCartney and I had a deal go bad that we are to this day trying to > reconcile. > Misrepresent ? Never ! > NWA 1110 - Adams efforts to comletely control certain areas of the market. > > As for you Al, You never bought a single item from me, have you? > So if you have a problem with me I suggest that you take it up with me > face to face and stop hiding behind that monitor you little P***Y > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "al mitterling" > To: > Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 9:16 AM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate > > >> Greetings List Members, >> >> It seems that a certain member in bad standing that continues to want to >> advertise here who has cheated a number of unsuspecting members by both >> not returning money to them after promising to do so and also >> misrepresenting meteorite types as something rare when they are not. A >> number of these victims wrote to me to thank me for posting my first >> email message about him. >> >> Here are a few of the list archives indicating there are serious problems >> with this creep. You can also go here to see for your self a number of >> the problems that have been posted over the list for a number of years. >> >> http://www.google.com/custom?q=bob+evans&domains=six.pairlist.net&sitesearch=six.pairlist.net&sitesearch=&sa=Search+the+Archives >> >> I must warn the list of Bob Evans as well. I was supposed to receive a >> $125 refund from Bob over a month ago and I still have not received my >> money back, nor have I recieved a response from him after several email >> and phone call attempts. Well, I checked his Ebay history a few days ago >> and noticed that he had placed a $1500 bid on a meteorite not too long >> ago, yet he cannot afford to return my hard-earned money back to me? >> Never again! I warn everyone else not to do any business with Bob Evans. >> His unprofessionalism is a joke. >> >> Ryan >> >> Well, Bob Evans just called me after reading my email to the list and he >> was pissed-off as I had expected he would be.. nearly shouting at me >> through the phone line. It doesn't look like I wil be getting "a penny >> back" from him, so it looks like I'll have to use alternate routes to get >> my money back. Sorry to everyone else who has to read this, but his >> reaction to the situation is unacceptable. By the way Bob....I'm 22 years >> old, not 15 as you had asked me during our brief phone altercation this >> evening. See you in Tucson next year... I'm sure everyone will be giving >> you a warm welcome. >> >> Ryan >> >> Bob Evans its another Cosmicvisitors alias Brad Sampson...sent money no >> material, useless excuses aside the mailbox not go etc..... >> >> Mauro Daniel >> >> McCartney and List, >> Doesn`t a theft of goods totaling a sum of 4,000+$ constitute a Felony in >> Texas? >> http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061122154905AAnQ0ts >> Thank you McCartney for your post to the list. >> Sincerely, Dirk...Tokyo >> >> mccartney wrote: >> As a member of IMCA, I feel it my duty to warn other meteorite buffs to >> avoid entanglements from questionable persons. >> >> On June 24, 2006 I posted to the list as a courtesy that I had been the >> victim of a fraudulent trade with Bob Evans. This is the rest of the >> story... >> >> After a year of trying to resolve the issue, it took me many more months >> to conclude that he just wasn't going to respond. >> >> I sent emails, Ebay emails, registered letters and confirmed delivery >> letters, with no response from Mr. Evans. He had my piece and he wasn't >> going to finish the trade. >> >> I sued Bob Evans in Williamson County, Texas Court. It went to court on >> October 19, 2006. Small CLaims suit #060094. He apparently tried to avoid >> being served his lawsuit by the Will County Sheriff, but they served him >> successfully. He did not respond to the suit, nor did he show in court. >> >> He lost by default and now has a judgment of $4,800 against him. He now >> joins Mr. Casper in the hall of Shame. >> >> Its my character flaw to be an overyly trusting guy. I have traded with >> people from South Africa to West Texas, Poland to Alaska. Never had a >> problem. On the whole the average meteorite fan is a fair, wholesome, >> science loving, respectable person. I encourage all of you to trade with >> your peers on this list, but do a little homework on your partner first >> to weed out the Caspers and Bob Evans's. >> >> Last word, the meteorite community is a small sand box - Remember to play >> nice. >> >> -mt >> IMCA 2760 >> >> Yes, there was a lawsuit against Bob Evans brought by me. It was in >>> regards to a trade that was partially done, where I sent material and >>> only >> >>> received a partial trade, then Evans went quiet. No contact for many >>> months. Eventually, I posted about it and received many replies that he >>> has done this before. His modus operandi is usually to go quiet and not >>> communicate. Which is what he's doing now. He did not show in court, I >>> received a default judgment by the judge. >> >>> Evans did not appeal and a judgment was issued. I spent the money to >>> have the judgment filed in Illinois and a lien filed against his house. >>> At this time he can not purchase or sell, or inherit real property until >>> the judgment is paid. It is collecting 8% interest at this time. >> >>> If I recall my contract law correctly, selling NWA junk as Zulu Queen >>> would be 'Misrepresentation' as well as Unjust Enrichment. Selling Zulu >>> Queen that he didn't know was NWA junk is simply 'Mutual >>> Misunderstanding'. Good luck in proving he had prior knowledge it was >>> NWA junk. >> >>> This is a small sandbox we play in. Play nice. McCartney Taylor >> >> Dear List, >> >> This is a public warning to Bob Evans to stop using the NWA 1110 and NWA >> 1877 designations and meteoritelab descriptions. I filed a blanket >> complaint claim with ebay and found out that it is considered fraudulent >> to >> use lab numbers that do not apply to your samples. It is also against the >> law to steal copyrighted descriptions. It took me weeks to explain to >> ebay >> what is involved with getting numbers assigned to NWA meteorites. I will >> start pulling the trigger soon on this kind of fraud starting with Bob >> Evans. If ebay gets too many complaints the meteorite subsection might be >> reconsidered (eliminated). That is why I am posting this message publicly >> to avoid continued contact with ebay. Here are two of the many fraudulent >> auctions Bob Evans is involved in: >> >> >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562058&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW >> >> >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562068&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW >> >> Consider this warning to edit your numbers and descriptions to reflect >> the >> truth or I will report this fraud to ebay when I return tomorrow. My >> attorney gave me the green light to start pursuing these cases and I will >> exercise my options. >> >> Wishing everybody else the best, >> >> Greetings List, >> >> I could go on and on and post dozens if not more posts on people having >> trouble with this thief but it would be counterproductive to our >> discussion here. I feel I have done my part to warn people of this creep >> and if you don't take the advise of this email and the emails of others >> who have, had trouble with this criminal then we'll await to see your >> post on the trouble you are having by thinking this is some kind of a >> joke. Best wishes to all! >> >> --AL Mitterling >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From yellowengine at earthlink.net Sun Dec 14 13:11:34 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 12:11:34 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate Message-ID: <32300952.1229278294819.JavaMail.root@elwamui-mouette.atl.sa.earthlink.net> "Ryan is a little self centered brat who blew off a deal with me." Bob, I'm not even going to respond to that childish comment. The fact of the matter is, I never did get my money back from you. I know, $125 isn't that much to some people, but I had a part time firefighter postion at the time; not the highest paying job in the world. When you're in that kind of a position at 22 years old, every penny counts. Regards, Ryan Pawelski From raremeteorites at yahoo.com Sun Dec 14 13:28:36 2008 From: raremeteorites at yahoo.com (Adam Hupe) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 10:28:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! In-Reply-To: <20081214173205.MVTM2948.fed1rmmtao101.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Message-ID: <550205.17663.qm@web30702.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear List, Bob Evans made the following statement which is completely untrue: NWA 1110 - Adams efforts to comletely control certain areas of the market. My response: Bob took it upon himself to steal NWA numbers from honest dealers in order to promote untested and unproven material. Every piece that I have ever sold with an NWA number originating from The Hupe Collection has been examined by scientists so collectors and researchers know precisely what they are getting. I argue vehemently, as now do some scientists, when dealers use numbers that are not assigned to their stones. This is not only to protect my interests, it is to protect those who have invested in legitimate pieces. In most cases, I have been completely sold out of an item with an NWA number assignment and will continue to point out infractions. Collectors deserve to know what they are getting and that the pieces they purchased have been examined by qualified scientists. Another disturbing note: I have noticed lately that a number of so-called "reputable" dealers are using approved nomenclature for stones that have never been examined by a qualified research institution. They claim that the Moroccans are providing them with the NWA numbers. Any reputable dealer knows better than to let a Moroccan pass out NWA number assignments and there is no excuse for not having these pieces studied. Dealers using numbers not assigned to their stones only serve to destabilize the market and hurt collectors who have honest specimens with good provenance. On a positive note: Scientists are now quick to point out these indiscretions and this practice is deemed unacceptable. Many scientists are now members of the IMCA which has gone a long way in promoting proper ethics and establishing authenticity. Bob Evans, lacking any sense of a moral compass, is the kind of character that does a lot harm to this great avocation. Best Regards, Adam From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Sun Dec 14 13:28:18 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 19:28:18 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! In-Reply-To: References: <6EBE53A8E79147C4BA995B51AA689089@ET> Message-ID: <005f01c95e19$bcfc3b50$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> I agree too, The mentioned person has certainly not the level and the standards, which all other list-members do have and which we all do expect to have from each other. (I remember Stefan had an issue with him too, about an unpaid stone). And especially if I remember, that real fine people sometimes were banned in past for much more marginal reasons, I think it is necessary. Martin, Greetings to Terry! -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von al mitterling Gesendet: Sonntag, 14. Dezember 2008 17:30 An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! Greetings, Since bob has sent this to the list, I will reply. One item you have misrepresented is Plymouth, Indiana. The buyer of that has contacted you many times trying to get their money back and has never had any success and he has tried hard. This buyer contacted me to thank me for my post and tell me about his fruitless efforts with you. There have been questions about a great number of your other items and the pedigree. Some of which you said you purchased as an exchange from a university but they say they never had contact with you. Your criminal behavior is a problem for the whole collecting and selling meteorite community. If you could offer up proof where your items of question came from then it might give you some of your reputation back. However in your email you mention that you don't have to let anyone know where you get your items from. To me, that tells a lot about you. Serious problems like this need to be brought out in the open and people warned. I agree with Dave Gheesling, Art, please remove the trash from the list. --AL Mitterling From webbth1 at yahoo.com Sun Dec 14 13:46:05 2008 From: webbth1 at yahoo.com (Thomas Webb) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 10:46:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Non-paying List Members Message-ID: <172164.24156.qm@web36203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear List, There are other supposedly reputable list members who will not pay their debts. I have had first hand experience with two of them. My best, Thomas From darryl at dof3.com Sun Dec 14 13:53:43 2008 From: darryl at dof3.com (Darryl Pitt) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 13:53:43 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Helpful Message-ID: I do not know Bob Evans. I am grateful for the advisories posted on the list as I was about to make a purchase from Mr. Evans and have, without being judgmental, rethought the wisdom of the same. Sincerely / dp From riffraff at timewarp.de Sun Dec 14 13:55:18 2008 From: riffraff at timewarp.de (Norbert Classen) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 19:55:18 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! In-Reply-To: References: <6EBE53A8E79147C4BA995B51AA689089@ET> Message-ID: Hi Al, and All, Even if Bob Evan's tells you where he got his items from you can't bet that it's the truth. Several IMCA members got burned in their dealings with Bob Evans, and we had the doubtful pleasure to investigate quite a few of these cases on the IMCA Board of Directors. I still have a special email folder with hundreds of mails regarding this subject. Bob, you wrote: "Misrepresent ? Never !" Hmmm, how does it come that the alleged source of your Tilden, for example, says that he never had this meteorite, just to name one incidence? I know, you said that you didn't recall that correctly, like in several other cases. Hard to believe, if you ask me. If I have a look at my meteorites I can usually tell you where I got this or that sample, especially when it comes to the rare or special ones. You also wrote: "NWA 1110 - Adams efforts to comletely control certain areas of the market". Hmm, even if it would have been Adam's intent to "control certain areas of the market" this wouldn't give you the right to sell unclassified stuff as something that has a clearly defined TKW and classification. Stating possible pairings is one thing, selling something for something else is an entirely different affair. And it shows that you aren't taking things too seriously when it comes to proper labeling practices. I could go on for a while, but it's wasted time trying to convince you that you made even one single mistake. And that's always alarming, especially if the responses to legit questions are insulting and abusive. Caveat Emptor! Norbert Classen President IMCA Inc. -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von al mitterling Gesendet: Sonntag, 14. Dezember 2008 17:30 An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! Greetings, Since bob has sent this to the list, I will reply. One item you have misrepresented is Plymouth, Indiana. The buyer of that has contacted you many times trying to get their money back and has never had any success and he has tried hard. This buyer contacted me to thank me for my post and tell me about his fruitless efforts with you. There have been questions about a great number of your other items and the pedigree. Some of which you said you purchased as an exchange from a university but they say they never had contact with you. Your criminal behavior is a problem for the whole collecting and selling meteorite community. If you could offer up proof where your items of question came from then it might give you some of your reputation back. However in your email you mention that you don't have to let anyone know where you get your items from. To me, that tells a lot about you. Serious problems like this need to be brought out in the open and people warned. I agree with Dave Gheesling, Art, please remove the trash from the list. --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" To: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 11:25 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! > First off, kudos to Al Mitterling for pointing out the riffy, illegal > business practices of Bob Evans. I'm surprised no one else has called > out this onion in the daisy patch. Bob Evans has made thousands of > dollars selling misrepresented meteorites to unsuspecting customers, > notably Plymouth and Zulu Queen. I know because I was duped into buying a > sample of his ersatz Plymouth. At the time, I had just gotten a job as > collections curator of a small Earth and Space museum. I was very excited > to see the Plymouth meteorite offered in an ad on the Meteorite List, as > the town is just down the road from us and my uncle and I had spent > considerable time researching and searching for the supposed lost main > mass. (Turned out to be a wild goose chase). Since Bob seemed to be a > list member in good standing I figured he could be trusted. If I had known > enough to search the archives, I would have seen that he is a con man. To > make a long story short, Bob's Plymouth was as phony as a 3 dollar bill. > He told me it was etched before I bought it, (it wasn't). He promised he > would return my money as he stated in the auction, (he didn't). I've > asked him numerous times for my money back and got nothing but a run > around. This guy is a con artist and I must admit he runs a good scam > that has been very profitable for him. He's giving the industry a bad > name and should be flamed every time he comes out of hiding and has the > audacity to come back and post on the list. I would like to warn all > newbies: Do not deal with this guy! If you do, you will regret it in the > long run. > Phil Whitmer > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From schoner at mybluelight.com Sun Dec 14 14:29:51 2008 From: schoner at mybluelight.com (Steve Schoner) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 19:29:51 GMT Subject: [meteorite-list] Evans and Court Judgments. Message-ID: <20081214.122951.29987.0@webmail02.dca.untd.com> Hello all, After reading this, there might be some recourse. I am not a lawyer-- but in the case of a civil judgment, in some states one can put a lien on all or or any of his personal titled property. Try "fixing his wagon" by first putting a lien on his transportation. It won't affect him immediately, but if he tries to sell his vehicle... The lien will show up-- He can't transfer title till the lien is satisfied. And if so, all his claimants can just pile the liens on. Steve Schoner Message: 6 Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 10:16:27 -0500 From: "al mitterling" Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate To: Message-ID: <8E6D633437BD4B7592BD4BD9C002A95F at StarmanPC> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Greetings List Members, It seems that a certain member in bad standing that continues to want to advertise here who has cheated a number of unsuspecting members by both not returning money to them after promising to do so and also misrepresenting meteorite types as something rare when they are not. A number of these victims wrote to me to thank me for posting my first email message about him. Here are a few of the list archives indicating there are serious problems with this creep. You can also go here to see for your self a number of the problems that have been posted over the list for a number of years. http://www.google.com/custom?q=bob+evans&domains=six.pairlist.net&sitesearch=six.pairlist. net&sitesearch=&sa=Search+the+Archives I must warn the list of Bob Evans as well. I was supposed to receive a $125 refund from Bob over a month ago and I still have not received my money back, nor have I recieved a response from him after several email and phone call attempts. Well, I checked his Ebay history a few days ago and noticed that he had placed a $1500 bid on a meteorite not too long ago, yet he cannot afford to return my hard-earned money back to me? Never again! I warn everyone else not to do any business with Bob Evans. His unprofessionalism is a joke. Ryan Well, Bob Evans just called me after reading my email to the list and he was pissed-off as I had expected he would be.. nearly shouting at me through the phone line. It doesn't look like I wil be getting "a penny back" from him, so it looks like I'll have to use alternate routes to get my money back. Sorry to everyone else who has to read this, but his reaction to the situation is unacceptable. By the way Bob....I'm 22 years old, not 15 as you had asked me during our brief phone altercation this evening. See you in Tucson next year... I'm sure everyone will be giving you a warm welcome. Ryan Bob Evans its another Cosmicvisitors alias Brad Sampson...sent money no material, useless excuses aside the mailbox not go etc..... Mauro Daniel McCartney and List, Doesn`t a theft of goods totaling a sum of 4,000+$ constitute a Felony in Texas? http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061122154905AAnQ0ts Thank you McCartney for your post to the list. Sincerely, Dirk...Tokyo mccartney wrote: As a member of IMCA, I feel it my duty to warn other meteorite buffs to avoid entanglements from questionable persons. On June 24, 2006 I posted to the list as a courtesy that I had been the victim of a fraudulent trade with Bob Evans. This is the rest of the story... After a year of trying to resolve the issue, it took me many more months to conclude that he just wasn't going to respond. I sent emails, Ebay emails, registered letters and confirmed delivery letters, with no response from Mr. Evans. He had my piece and he wasn't going to finish the trade. I sued Bob Evans in Williamson County, Texas Court. It went to court on October 19, 2006. Small CLaims suit #060094. He apparently tried to avoid being served his lawsuit by the Will County Sheriff, but they served him successfully. He did not respond to the suit, nor did he show in court. He lost by default and now has a judgment of $4,800 against him. He now joins Mr. Casper in the hall of Shame. Its my character flaw to be an overyly trusting guy. I have traded with people from South Africa to West Texas, Poland to Alaska. Never had a problem. On the whole the average meteorite fan is a fair, wholesome, science loving, respectable person. I encourage all of you to trade with your peers on this list, but do a little homework on your partner first to weed out the Caspers and Bob Evans's. Last word, the meteorite community is a small sand box - Remember to play nice. -mt IMCA 2760 Yes, there was a lawsuit against Bob Evans brought by me. It was in > regards to a trade that was partially done, where I sent material and only > received a partial trade, then Evans went quiet. No contact for many > months. Eventually, I posted about it and received many replies that he > has done this before. His modus operandi is usually to go quiet and not > communicate. Which is what he's doing now. He did not show in court, I > received a default judgment by the judge. > Evans did not appeal and a judgment was issued. I spent the money to have > the judgment filed in Illinois and a lien filed against his house. At this > time he can not purchase or sell, or inherit real property until the > judgment is paid. It is collecting 8% interest at this time. > If I recall my contract law correctly, selling NWA junk as Zulu Queen > would be 'Misrepresentation' as well as Unjust Enrichment. Selling Zulu > Queen that he didn't know was NWA junk is simply 'Mutual > Misunderstanding'. Good luck in proving he had prior knowledge it was NWA > junk. > This is a small sandbox we play in. Play nice. McCartney Taylor Dear List, This is a public warning to Bob Evans to stop using the NWA 1110 and NWA 1877 designations and meteoritelab descriptions. I filed a blanket complaint claim with ebay and found out that it is considered fraudulent to use lab numbers that do not apply to your samples. It is also against the law to steal copyrighted descriptions. It took me weeks to explain to ebay what is involved with getting numbers assigned to NWA meteorites. I will start pulling the trigger soon on this kind of fraud starting with Bob Evans. If ebay gets too many complaints the meteorite subsection might be reconsidered (eliminated). That is why I am posting this message publicly to avoid continued contact with ebay. Here are two of the many fraudulent auctions Bob Evans is involved in: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562058&rd=1&ssPageNam e=WDVW http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562068&rd=1&ssPageNam e=WDVW Consider this warning to edit your numbers and descriptions to reflect the truth or I will report this fraud to ebay when I return tomorrow. My attorney gave me the green light to start pursuing these cases and I will exercise my options. Wishing everybody else the best, Greetings List, I could go on and on and post dozens if not more posts on people having trouble with this thief but it would be counterproductive to our discussion here. I feel I have done my part to warn people of this creep and if you don't take the advise of this email and the emails of others who have, had trouble with this criminal then we'll await to see your post on the trouble you are having by thinking this is some kind of a joke. Best wishes to all! --AL Mitterling ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 09:35:37 -0600 From: "Bob Evans" Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate To: "al mitterling" Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Message-ID: <000601c95e01$9d5c9b40$0201a8c0 at yourae066c3a9b> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Al, Never heard of Mauro Daniel. Sent money, no material ? Thats a joke. Look at my feedback. A clown like this doesnt even know who he dealt with Ryan is a little self centered brat who blew off a deal with me. McCartney and I had a deal go bad that we are to this day trying to reconcile. Misrepresent ? Never ! NWA 1110 - Adams efforts to comletely control certain areas of the market. As for you Al, You never bought a single item from me, have you? So if you have a problem with me I suggest that you take it up with me face to face and stop hiding behind that monitor you little P***Y ----- Original Message ----- From: "al mitterling" To: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 9:16 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate > Greetings List Members, > > It seems that a certain member in bad standing that continues to want to > advertise here who has cheated a number of unsuspecting members by both > not returning money to them after promising to do so and also > misrepresenting meteorite types as something rare when they are not. A > number of these victims wrote to me to thank me for posting my first email > message about him. > > Here are a few of the list archives indicating there are serious problems > with this creep. You can also go here to see for your self a number of the > problems that have been posted over the list for a number of years. > > http://www.google.com/custom?q=bob+evans&domains=six.pairlist.net&sitesearch=six.pair list.net&sitesearch=&sa=Search+the+Archives > > I must warn the list of Bob Evans as well. I was supposed to receive a > $125 refund from Bob over a month ago and I still have not received my > money back, nor have I recieved a response from him after several email > and phone call attempts. Well, I checked his Ebay history a few days ago > and noticed that he had placed a $1500 bid on a meteorite not too long > ago, yet he cannot afford to return my hard-earned money back to me? Never > again! I warn everyone else not to do any business with Bob Evans. His > unprofessionalism is a joke. > > Ryan > > Well, Bob Evans just called me after reading my email to the list and he > was pissed-off as I had expected he would be.. nearly shouting at me > through the phone line. It doesn't look like I wil be getting "a penny > back" from him, so it looks like I'll have to use alternate routes to get > my money back. Sorry to everyone else who has to read this, but his > reaction to the situation is unacceptable. By the way Bob....I'm 22 years > old, not 15 as you had asked me during our brief phone altercation this > evening. See you in Tucson next year... I'm sure everyone will be giving > you a warm welcome. > > Ryan > > Bob Evans its another Cosmicvisitors alias Brad Sampson...sent money no > material, useless excuses aside the mailbox not go etc..... > > Mauro Daniel > > McCartney and List, > Doesn`t a theft of goods totaling a sum of 4,000+$ constitute a Felony in > Texas? > http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061122154905AAnQ0ts > Thank you McCartney for your post to the list. > Sincerely, Dirk...Tokyo > > mccartney wrote: > As a member of IMCA, I feel it my duty to warn other meteorite buffs to > avoid entanglements from questionable persons. > > On June 24, 2006 I posted to the list as a courtesy that I had been the > victim of a fraudulent trade with Bob Evans. This is the rest of the > story... > > After a year of trying to resolve the issue, it took me many more months > to conclude that he just wasn't going to respond. > > I sent emails, Ebay emails, registered letters and confirmed delivery > letters, with no response from Mr. Evans. He had my piece and he wasn't > going to finish the trade. > > I sued Bob Evans in Williamson County, Texas Court. It went to court on > October 19, 2006. Small CLaims suit #060094. He apparently tried to avoid > being served his lawsuit by the Will County Sheriff, but they served him > successfully. He did not respond to the suit, nor did he show in court. > > He lost by default and now has a judgment of $4,800 against him. He now > joins Mr. Casper in the hall of Shame. > > Its my character flaw to be an overyly trusting guy. I have traded with > people from South Africa to West Texas, Poland to Alaska. Never had a > problem. On the whole the average meteorite fan is a fair, wholesome, > science loving, respectable person. I encourage all of you to trade with > your peers on this list, but do a little homework on your partner first to > weed out the Caspers and Bob Evans's. > > Last word, the meteorite community is a small sand box - Remember to play > nice. > > -mt > IMCA 2760 > > Yes, there was a lawsuit against Bob Evans brought by me. It was in >> regards to a trade that was partially done, where I sent material and >> only > >> received a partial trade, then Evans went quiet. No contact for many >> months. Eventually, I posted about it and received many replies that he >> has done this before. His modus operandi is usually to go quiet and not >> communicate. Which is what he's doing now. He did not show in court, I >> received a default judgment by the judge. > >> Evans did not appeal and a judgment was issued. I spent the money to have >> the judgment filed in Illinois and a lien filed against his house. At >> this time he can not purchase or sell, or inherit real property until the >> judgment is paid. It is collecting 8% interest at this time. > >> If I recall my contract law correctly, selling NWA junk as Zulu Queen >> would be 'Misrepresentation' as well as Unjust Enrichment. Selling Zulu >> Queen that he didn't know was NWA junk is simply 'Mutual >> Misunderstanding'. Good luck in proving he had prior knowledge it was NWA >> junk. > >> This is a small sandbox we play in. Play nice. McCartney Taylor > > Dear List, > > This is a public warning to Bob Evans to stop using the NWA 1110 and NWA > 1877 designations and meteoritelab descriptions. I filed a blanket > complaint claim with ebay and found out that it is considered fraudulent > to > use lab numbers that do not apply to your samples. It is also against the > law to steal copyrighted descriptions. It took me weeks to explain to ebay > what is involved with getting numbers assigned to NWA meteorites. I will > start pulling the trigger soon on this kind of fraud starting with Bob > Evans. If ebay gets too many complaints the meteorite subsection might be > reconsidered (eliminated). That is why I am posting this message publicly > to avoid continued contact with ebay. Here are two of the many fraudulent > auctions Bob Evans is involved in: > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562058&rd=1&ssPa geName=WDVW > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3239&item=2287562068&rd=1&ssPa geName=WDVW > > Consider this warning to edit your numbers and descriptions to reflect the > truth or I will report this fraud to ebay when I return tomorrow. My > attorney gave me the green light to start pursuing these cases and I will > exercise my options. > > Wishing everybody else the best, > > Greetings List, > > I could go on and on and post dozens if not more posts on people having > trouble with this thief but it would be counterproductive to our > discussion here. I feel I have done my part to warn people of this creep > and if you don't take the advise of this email and the emails of others > who have, had trouble with this criminal then we'll await to see your post > on the trouble you are having by thinking this is some kind of a joke. > Best wishes to all! > > --AL Mitterling > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ____________________________________________________________ Free information on becoming a Graphic Designer. Click Now! http://thirdpartyoffers.mybluelight.com/TGL2341/fc/PnY6rzHYgwIksLSy77EdGldySm6AEoIWLzKe8yAH6q4f0mUSGkOFO/ From ensoramanda at ntlworld.com Sun Dec 14 15:31:16 2008 From: ensoramanda at ntlworld.com (ensoramanda at ntlworld.com) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 20:31:16 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Meteorite Book In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20081214203116.JCITH.46341.root@web08-winn.ispmail.private.ntl.com> Great idea McCartney....look forward to that...will be good to focus on one particular fall and all thats involved for a change, rather than all the other more generalised books on meteoritics. Merry Christmas to all from a rather cold and damp UK Graham Ensor, UK ---- McCartney Taylor wrote: > Yes, I can confirm the rumors that I have a meteorite book coming out soon. > > Its actually a monograph which is different than a book. For those non native English speakers, a monograph is a book extremely focused on a subject matter. > > In this case, its focused on just the Santa Lucia Meteorite Fall that occurred in January, 2008. I was fortunate to be the only field researcher there after the fall. The monograph contains my field notes, color pictures, stories, research, new Argentine law issues, and other items related to just this fall. 65 pages. > > This will be the first in a series of monographs covering meteorite falls and fines I've researched. That will include Tanzania, Deport, the new Canadian, etc... I'll roll these out when I damn well feel like it. :0) > > I'll give the list a heads up when it comes available. > > -mt > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From deanbessey at yahoo.com Sun Dec 14 15:32:43 2008 From: deanbessey at yahoo.com (dean bessey) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 12:32:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Baliff to Repossess meteorites?? In-Reply-To: <172164.24156.qm@web36203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <332061.77272.qm@web56105.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Banks and lien holders of unpaid for items can hire a bailiff firm to repossess a car or other properties. Has anybody any ideas (A lawyer on the list maybe) have any experience or ideas about hiring a firm to repossess unpaid for meteorites? I am looking for info under USA law. I have a little problem with a customer and am in the process of getting a lawyer to sue the guy but would like to find a somewhat cheaper auction that going to court. Any advise would be appriciated Sincerely DEAN www.meteoriteshop.com From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Sun Dec 14 17:07:14 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:07:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Wanted : NWA 482 - playing the field In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <125777.5823.qm@web58404.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi folks! I am looking for a piece of NWA 482 with good provenance that weighs between 250mg and 500mg. Thin sliced with a lot of surface area is preferred. If you have something that fits the bill, contact me offlist and let me know what your best price for it is. :) Thanks! MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From m42protosun at aol.com Sun Dec 14 17:10:23 2008 From: m42protosun at aol.com (m42protosun at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:10:23 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! IMCAs are not automatically honest In-Reply-To: <550205.17663.qm@web30702.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CB2C4FE53F1765-228-C9F@webmail-dd17.sysops.aol.com> Lists and Adam, I do not agree with the last point. IMCA is not automatically a label of honesty in dealing with mets. Two IMCA members have sold me "Nantans" with an so-called expertise. I analized them in my own LAB, finding that the "Nantan" were ordinary Mecong River Iron. It took a long process until they payed me back but not the total amount because I hade "used" the shit. IMCA presidial told me that both dealers (a couple) had not handles in intension. Poor argument! Uwe -----Urspr?ngliche Mitteilung----- Von: Adam Hupe An: Adam Verschickt: So., 14. Dez. 2008, 19:28 Thema: Re: [meteorite-list] Caveat Emptor: Beware of Bob Evans! Dear List, Bob Evans made the following statement which is completely untrue: NWA 1110 - Adams efforts to comletely control certain areas of the market. My response: Bob took it upon himself to steal NWA numbers from honest dealers in order to promote untested and unproven material. Every piece that I have ever sold with an NWA number originating from The Hupe Collection has been examined by scientists so collectors and researchers know precisely what they are getting. I argue vehemently, as now do some scientists, when dealers use numbers that are not assigned to their stones. This is not only to protect my interests, it is to protect those who have invested in legitimate pieces. In most cases, I have been completely sold out of an item with an NWA number assignment and will continue to point out infractions. Collectors deserve to know what they are getting and that the pieces they purchased have been examined by qualified scientists. Another disturbing note: I have noticed lately that a number of so-called "reputable" dealers are using approved nomenclature for stones that have never been examined by a qualified research institution. They claim that the Moroccans are providing them with the NWA numbers. Any reputable dealer knows better than to let a Moroccan pass out NWA number assignments and there is no excuse for not having these pieces studied. Dealers using numbers not assigned to their stones only serve to destabilize the market and hurt collectors who have honest specimens with good provenance. On a positive note: Scientists are now quick to point out these indiscretions and this practice is deemed unacceptable. Many scientists are now members of the IMCA which has gone a long way in promoting proper ethics and establishing authenticity. Bob Evans, lacking any sense of a moral compass, is the kind of character that does a lot harm to this great avocation. Best Regards, Adam ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinf o/meteorite-list ________________________________________________________________________ AOL eMail auf Ihrem Handy! Ab sofort k?nnen Sie auch unterwegs Ihre AOL email abrufen. Registrieren Sie sich jetzt kostenlos. From illinoismeteorites at gmail.com Sun Dec 14 17:46:52 2008 From: illinoismeteorites at gmail.com (Joe Kerchner) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:46:52 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Non-paying List Members In-Reply-To: <172164.24156.qm@web36203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <172164.24156.qm@web36203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <14beaf810812141446y1e8472fdy2c66290358fcfb2c@mail.gmail.com> Thomas, I think that you should out them so others do not get ripped off by a non-payer. it will help most of us in the future. Joe Kerchner http://illinoismeteorites.com http://skyrockcafe.com On Sun, Dec 14, 2008 at 12:46 PM, Thomas Webb wrote: > > Dear List, > There are other supposedly reputable list members who will not pay their debts. I have had first hand experience with two of them. > My best, > Thomas > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Sun Dec 14 17:51:39 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 08:51:39 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Message-ID: Listoids Heaven forbid ! The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning the sale of "Mekong Iron" It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have been unhappy with IMCA... I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had "disagreements" with IMCA - I'm beginning to take the view that there is a bad odour to IMCA ( ? by dealers for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely aware of the excellent work done by many IMCA members At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a while From mlblood at cox.net Sun Dec 14 17:52:39 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:52:39 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Crusted Zagami, L3 Conglomerate In-Reply-To: <8E6D633437BD4B7592BD4BD9C002A95F@StarmanPC> Message-ID: on 12/14/08 7:16 AM, al mitterling at almitt at kconline.com wrote: > Ryan > > Bob Evans its another Cosmicvisitors alias Brad Sampson...sent money no > material, useless excuses aside the mailbox not go etc..... > > Mauro Daniel I am confused, Is someone saying Bob Evans IS an alias being used by Brad Sampson (or the other way round), or is it being said he is the same TYPE of person??? Also, who said it; "Ryan," Mauro Daniel or Al Mitterling? RSVP Thanks, Michael From bobe5531 at comcast.net Sun Dec 14 18:18:37 2008 From: bobe5531 at comcast.net (Bob Evans) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:18:37 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! References: Message-ID: <000a01c95e42$4b85c440$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Oh Thanks Bob, Believe it or not I have many happy customers who continue to make purchases. And now that my customer base is shrinking thanks to all the conjecture that is strewn about this forum, some of them will be getting some great deals on my auctions. IMCA is a joke. Some of the most respectable people in the business never have and never will be a member of the IMCA. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob WALKER" To: "Meteorite" Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 4:51 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! > Listoids > > Heaven forbid ! > > The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning the sale of "Mekong > Iron" > > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have been unhappy with > IMCA... > > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had "disagreements" with > IMCA - I'm beginning to take the view that there is a bad odour to IMCA > ( ? by dealers for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely aware of the > excellent work done by many IMCA members > > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a while > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From JPBrockets at aol.com Sun Dec 14 19:04:13 2008 From: JPBrockets at aol.com (JPBrockets at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 19:04:13 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad - NWA 237 and 869 Message-ID: Greetings List Members: Offered on eBay are a slice of NWA 237 and some NWA 869 pieces. For those interested please take a look. Thanks! http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/jpbrockets_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZQQ_ sopZ14 Juris jpbrockets at aol.com **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From grf2 at verizon.net Sun Dec 14 19:44:16 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 19:44:16 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 14, 2008 References: <5572381.2900711229251077149.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <368C082BB2DC48A3AE675D4CA26DA373@ASUS> OH MY! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Johnson" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 5:37 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 14,2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_14_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From grf2 at verizon.net Sun Dec 14 19:49:20 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 19:49:20 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Santa Physics...again for 2008 References: <822da19a0812131838u663be620icb3aaedc204cf939@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4C3B72AACC344BEFB3D6045824AD3414@ASUS> SEE, like I said "C" is NOT the limiting speed of the universe ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dark Matter" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 9:38 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Santa Physics...again for 2008 > Hi All, > > It seems it has befallen upon me to hold the job of official Santa > Physics story reposter. So, in the true spirit of the season, here it > is yet again. > > And as usual, I have not checked the math. > > Enjoy. > > Martin > > > > > > > Engineering Christmas: Some points of contention. > > There are approximately two billion children (persons under 18) in the > world. However, since Santa does not visit children of Muslim, Hindu, > Jewish or Buddhist religions, this reduces the workload for Christmas > night to 15% of the total, or 378 million (according to the Population > Reference Bureau). At an average (census) rate of 3.5 children per > household, that comes to 108 million homes, presuming that there is at > least one good child in each dwelling. > > Santa has about 31 hours of Christmas to work with thanks to the > different time zones and the rotation of the earth, assuming he > travels east to west which seems logical. This works out to 967.7 > visits per second. This is to say that for each Christian household > with a good child, Santa has about 1/1000th of a second to park the > sleigh, hop out, jump down the chimney, fill the stockings, distribute > the remaining presents under the tree, eat whatever snacks have been > left for him, get back up the chimney, jump into the sleigh and get on > to the next house. Assuming that each of these 108 million stops is > evenly distributed around the earth (which of course, we know to be > false, but will accept for the purpose of our calculations), we are > now talking about 0.78 miles per household; a total trip of 75.5 > million miles, not counting bathroom stops or other breaks. > > This requires that Santa's sleigh moves at 650 miles per second--3000 > times the speed of sound. For purposes of comparison, the fastest > man-made vehicle, the Ulysses space probe, moves at a poky 27.4 miles > per second, and conventional reindeer can run at best 30 miles per > hour. > > The payload of the sleigh adds another interesting element. Assuming > that each child gets nothing more than a medium sized Lego set (two > pounds), the sleigh is carrying over 500,000 tons, not counting Santa > himself. On land a conventional reindeer can pull about 300 pounds. > Even granting that the "flying" reindeer could pull ten times the > normal amount, the job just cannot be done with eight or nine of > them-- Santa would need 360,000 reindeer! > > This increases the payload, not counting the weight of the sleigh, > another 54,000 tons or roughly seven times the weight of the Queen > Elizabeth (the ship, not the monarch). > > 4.600,000 tons traveling at 650 miles per second creates enormous air > resistance-- this would heat up the reindeer in the same fashion as > spacecraft re-entering the earth's atmosphere (which may explain > Rudolph's red nose). The lead pair of reindeer would absorb 14.3 > quintillion joules of energy per second. In short, they would > instantaneously vaporize exposing the reindeer behind them to the same > friction and also creating deafening sonic booms in their wake. The > entire reindeer team would vanish within 4.26 thousandths of a second, > or right about the time Santa reached the fifth house on his trip. > > Not that it matters, however since Santa, as a result of accelerating > from a dead stop to 650 miles per second in .001 seconds, would be > subjected to centrifugal forces of 17,500 Gs. A 250 pound Santa (which > seems ludicrously slim) would be pinned to the back of the sleigh by > 4,315,015 pounds of force, instantly crushing his bones and organs and > reducing him to a quivering red-hot blob of goo. And yet, he returns > year after year. > > Therefore, the rules of physics obviously don't apply to Santa and his > yearly mission. Speaking as an engineer, this guy must know something > about relativity that we have yet to discover. > > HO, HO, HO. > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mexicodoug at aim.com Sun Dec 14 20:38:10 2008 From: mexicodoug at aim.com (mexicodoug at aim.com) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 20:38:10 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Baliff to Repossess meteorites?? In-Reply-To: <332061.77272.qm@web56105.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CB2C6CEBD8B571-10B8-2A75@WEBMAIL-MZ14.sysops.aol.com> Hi Dean, You are comparing unsecured credit with secured credit. Forget it. For secured credit, you need a title/clearly written contract to relate it to. So in the future, you could only note that high-risk sales need to be governed by contract, not implicit understandings. An object that isn't title-able, and in the absence of a specific written contract, under latin law, anyway, belongs to he who has possession. You can sue for fraud or money owed to you, but you really can't sue to get the object back. Law recognizes when you've been stolen from and the damages are calculated in money, not merchandise which has been transferred in a related by independent transaction. So if you have an unsecured debt for anything, including meteorites you have sold to someone without contract, you are stuck with the legal system to file a case and prove what you say is due to you through a sentence from a case in front of a competent judge. (And even with a contract it is the same, just much cleaner and quicker if they fight back). The only idea I could think of would be transferring you debt to a collection agent and recovering what you can (say, 20 cents on the dollar). You could, for example, find a tough-guy collector in the same town and sell the rights to him in a one-page contract with all supporting info you have sworn to, and you doing due diligence that there is20no complicity. Then they take it from there, after paying you the agreed upon fraction of the total debt. Short of getting involved with a mafia, collections are just about there. To mess with someone?s credit rating, the easiest way to make life miserable for non-payes, for example, you will need the court sentence in your favor. Don't expect miracles, it?s just like sending out stamps on approval in the old days which you probably know the drill well. What was your protection there? SSDD. Best wishes and Good Luck, Doug -----Original Message----- From: dean bessey To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 3:32 pm Subject: [meteorite-list] Baliff to Repossess meteorites?? Banks and lien holders of unpaid for items can hire a bailiff firm to repossess a car or other properties. Has anybody any ideas (A lawyer on the list maybe) have any experience or ideas about hiring a firm to repossess unpaid for meteorites? I am looking for info under USA law. I have a little problem with a customer and am in the process of getting a lawyer to sue the guy but would like to find a somewhat cheaper auction that going to court. Any advise would be appriciated Sincerely DEAN www.meteoriteshop.com ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From midwest at meteorman.org Mon Dec 15 00:25:13 2008 From: midwest at meteorman.org (Timothy Heitz) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 23:25:13 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite destroys NZ warehouse in fire, witnesses say References: <172164.24156.qm@web36203.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <14beaf810812141446y1e8472fdy2c66290358fcfb2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9D318C1D6DE64D218B7F4ED1A649EA49@den> Hi List, Meteorite destroys NZ warehouse in fire, witnesses say http://www.examiner.com/x-504-Space-News-Examiner~y2008m12d14-Meteorite-destroys-NZ-warehouse-in-fire-witnesses-say Tim Heitz From info at mcomemeteorite.it Mon Dec 15 00:46:56 2008 From: info at mcomemeteorite.it (M come Meteorite Meteorites) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 06:46:56 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Message-ID: <4945ef50.1fd.1f0e.1380395220@webmaildh3.aruba.it> I have buy only one time from Bob Evans and all its go ok with no problems. For IMCA I agree with the words Some of the most > respectable people in the business never have and never > will be a member of the IMCA. this is right, many meteorite dealers is not IMCA member and they sale with no problems and its honestly. What I have say to a IMCA member time ago: a Logo - IMCA logo - not confirm if you are honestly or a good dealer. I am a ex IMCA member and I am kick off from this why I I had battle with Farmer, but for me is not a problem, I not cry if I not have a IMCA logo. Matteo ----- Original Message ----- Da : "Bob Evans" A : "Bob WALKER" Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Oggetto : Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Data : Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:18:37 -0600 > Oh Thanks Bob, > > Believe it or not I have many happy customers who continue > to make purchases. And now that my customer base is > shrinking thanks to all the conjecture that is strewn > about this forum, some of them will be getting some great > deals on my auctions. IMCA is a joke. Some of the most > respectable people in the business never have and never > will be a member of the IMCA. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bob WALKER" > To: "Meteorite" > Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 4:51 PM > Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining > armour ! > > > > Listoids > > > > Heaven forbid ! > > > > The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning > > the sale of "Mekong Iron" > > > > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have been > > unhappy with IMCA... > > > > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had > > "disagreements" with IMCA - I'm beginning to take the > > view that there is a bad odour to IMCA ( ? by dealers > > for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely aware of the > excellent work done by many IMCA members > > > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a while > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite Meteoriti info at mcomemeteorite.it http://www.mcomemeteorite.it http://www.mcomemeteorite.info Mindat Gallery http://www.mindat.org/gallery-5018.html From michael at spacerocksinc.com Mon Dec 15 05:18:43 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 02:18:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 15, 2008 Message-ID: <11855754.2949231229336323111.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_15_2008.html From bobe5531 at comcast.net Mon Dec 15 06:57:32 2008 From: bobe5531 at comcast.net (Bob Evans) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 05:57:32 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! References: <4945ef50.1fd.1f0e.1380395220@webmaildh3.aruba.it> Message-ID: <000f01c95eac$50c6ee10$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Thank you Matteo, There are many others that agree with you that just choose not to speak up here on list. ----- Original Message ----- From: "M come Meteorite Meteorites" To: Cc: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 11:46 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! >I have buy only one time from Bob Evans and all its go ok > with no problems. For IMCA I agree with the words > > Some of the most >> respectable people in the business never have and never >> will be a member of the IMCA. > > > this is right, many meteorite dealers is not IMCA member and > they sale with no problems and its honestly. What I have say > to a IMCA member time ago: a Logo - IMCA logo - not confirm > if you are honestly or a good dealer. I am a ex IMCA member > and I am kick off from this why I I had battle with Farmer, > but for me is not a problem, I not cry if I not have a IMCA > logo. > > Matteo > > ----- Original Message ----- > Da : "Bob Evans" > A : "Bob WALKER" > Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Oggetto : Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining > armour ! > Data : Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:18:37 -0600 > >> Oh Thanks Bob, >> >> Believe it or not I have many happy customers who continue >> to make purchases. And now that my customer base is >> shrinking thanks to all the conjecture that is strewn >> about this forum, some of them will be getting some great >> deals on my auctions. IMCA is a joke. Some of the most >> respectable people in the business never have and never >> will be a member of the IMCA. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Bob WALKER" >> To: "Meteorite" >> Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 4:51 PM >> Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining >> armour ! >> >> >> > Listoids >> > >> > Heaven forbid ! >> > >> > The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning >> > the sale of "Mekong Iron" >> > >> > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have been >> > unhappy with IMCA... >> > >> > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had >> > "disagreements" with IMCA - I'm beginning to take the >> > view that there is a bad odour to IMCA ( ? by dealers >> > for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely aware of the >> excellent work done by many IMCA members > >> > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a while >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ______________________________________________ >> > http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> > Meteorite-list mailing list >> > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > M come Meteorite Meteoriti > info at mcomemeteorite.it > http://www.mcomemeteorite.it > http://www.mcomemeteorite.info > Mindat Gallery > http://www.mindat.org/gallery-5018.html From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Mon Dec 15 08:40:29 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 14:40:29 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! In-Reply-To: <000f01c95eac$50c6ee10$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> References: <4945ef50.1fd.1f0e.1380395220@webmaildh3.aruba.it> <000f01c95eac$50c6ee10$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Message-ID: <006d01c95eba$b25431c0$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> A knight in a rusty armour is better than a rogue in a golden robe. IMCA-labels reduce the probability especially for the beginners to fall for such sellers like the Minors, de Russes, Lindforses, Evanses, floridacoasters of the world and the Far-East-fakes-sellers... remarkably. Good day. Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Bob Evans Gesendet: Montag, 15. Dezember 2008 12:58 An: M come Meteorite Meteorites Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Thank you Matteo, There are many others that agree with you that just choose not to speak up here on list. ----- Original Message ----- From: "M come Meteorite Meteorites" To: Cc: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 11:46 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! >I have buy only one time from Bob Evans and all its go ok > with no problems. For IMCA I agree with the words > > Some of the most >> respectable people in the business never have and never >> will be a member of the IMCA. > > > this is right, many meteorite dealers is not IMCA member and > they sale with no problems and its honestly. What I have say > to a IMCA member time ago: a Logo - IMCA logo - not confirm > if you are honestly or a good dealer. I am a ex IMCA member > and I am kick off from this why I I had battle with Farmer, > but for me is not a problem, I not cry if I not have a IMCA > logo. > > Matteo > > ----- Original Message ----- > Da : "Bob Evans" > A : "Bob WALKER" > Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Oggetto : Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining > armour ! > Data : Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:18:37 -0600 > >> Oh Thanks Bob, >> >> Believe it or not I have many happy customers who continue >> to make purchases. And now that my customer base is >> shrinking thanks to all the conjecture that is strewn >> about this forum, some of them will be getting some great >> deals on my auctions. IMCA is a joke. Some of the most >> respectable people in the business never have and never >> will be a member of the IMCA. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Bob WALKER" >> To: "Meteorite" >> Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 4:51 PM >> Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining >> armour ! >> >> >> > Listoids >> > >> > Heaven forbid ! >> > >> > The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning >> > the sale of "Mekong Iron" >> > >> > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have been >> > unhappy with IMCA... >> > >> > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had >> > "disagreements" with IMCA - I'm beginning to take the >> > view that there is a bad odour to IMCA ( ? by dealers >> > for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely aware of the >> excellent work done by many IMCA members > >> > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a while >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ______________________________________________ >> > http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> > Meteorite-list mailing list >> > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > M come Meteorite Meteoriti > info at mcomemeteorite.it > http://www.mcomemeteorite.it > http://www.mcomemeteorite.info > Mindat Gallery > http://www.mindat.org/gallery-5018.html ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mstreman53 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 09:04:18 2008 From: mstreman53 at yahoo.com (Mr EMan) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 06:04:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Aussie Meteorite Rant...was sale of scorpion bight main mass by http://qmig.org Message-ID: <872587.54125.qm@web55208.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Bob, standing firm or not-- you are talking out your rear. Everything you've ranted about is based on falsehoods and the fake facts you or your countryman invented. I've had a decent respect for you Bob, but this fairy-tale is an insult. The description of Haag "raping and pillaging" is a over the top. It is an attempt to revise history by creating a set of "false facts" underpinned in hyperbole. Contrary to your claims it isn't the truth you are trying to share. For the record and admittedly from memory, let me recount the circumstances of what ignited Australia's meteorite export law. Haag did not go to Australia looking for a "lunar meteorite". He wasn't at the Millillibillie looking for chondrites to pillage. He was collecting Millillibillie when an unusual rock was brought into the collecting station. Were it not for Haag it would still be out there on an ant hill, unrecognized. Milli is a eucrite, Calcalong was a lunar so where are all these chondrites you are complaining that he raped and pillaged? When Calcalong Creek was recognized as lunar, an Australian Academic went ranting and raving and when he couldn't extort Haag to give him the entire meteorite, he went whining and crying to Parliament to get it back. He couldn't but they threw him a bone so he would shut up. You had politicians that saw an angle and exploited it. They were able to keep the Aboriginals repressed yet again but forcing them to sell their finds to the state at state set prices. If meteorites were such an important cultural heritage then why didn't the academics go looking for meteorites themselves? Why did they go uncollected? Why has Australian meteorite science been stagnant for the last 20 ears? Haag offered half of the Calcalong Creek lunar in a spirit of cooperating and the Australian academic (who's name escapes me) told Haag to pack sand. Until that time there were no laws regarding meteorite export and Haag was paying the Aboriginals to collect them on their own land. Using the same criteria, you are a rapist raping the Australian "Herritage" yourself, prostituting yourself for profit. Sounds like your main rant is that you didn't think of the raping and pillaging first. Just using your own hyperbole to illustrate a point. I understand you claim to be venting, but venting is no excuse for spreading facts that you know aren't true. Lay off the exaggerations, stick to the science and leave politics to scorpions. Good luck in getting your export permits. Elton --- On Fri, 12/12/08, Bob WALKER wrote: > I need to unwind and vent a bit about why I have to sell a > few of my prized finds... > > Rewind the clock twenty years or so when a young Robert > H**G visited Australia and rewarded our fair country by > raping pillaging and looting and illegally exporting many > Australian chondrites... From gmhupe at htn.net Mon Dec 15 09:51:16 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 09:51:16 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! References: <4945ef50.1fd.1f0e.1380395220@webmaildh3.aruba.it><000f01c95eac$50c6ee10$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> <006d01c95eba$b25431c0$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Message-ID: <3D678C1E7374483D80B9648FCBB80F84@Gregor> Hello Martin and List, Martin wrote, "IMCA-labels reduce the probability especially for the beginners to fall for such sellers like the Minors, de Russes, Lindforses, Evanses, floridacoasters of the world and the Far-East-fakes-sellers... remarkably." Please clarify who you refer to by "floridacoasters". I presume you refer to Stan and not one of the several Florida meteorite collectors/dealers like myself. Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Altmann" To: Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 8:40 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! A knight in a rusty armour is better than a rogue in a golden robe. IMCA-labels reduce the probability especially for the beginners to fall for such sellers like the Minors, de Russes, Lindforses, Evanses, floridacoasters of the world and the Far-East-fakes-sellers... remarkably. Good day. Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Bob Evans Gesendet: Montag, 15. Dezember 2008 12:58 An: M come Meteorite Meteorites Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Thank you Matteo, There are many others that agree with you that just choose not to speak up here on list. ----- Original Message ----- From: "M come Meteorite Meteorites" To: Cc: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 11:46 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! >I have buy only one time from Bob Evans and all its go ok > with no problems. For IMCA I agree with the words > > Some of the most >> respectable people in the business never have and never >> will be a member of the IMCA. > > > this is right, many meteorite dealers is not IMCA member and > they sale with no problems and its honestly. What I have say > to a IMCA member time ago: a Logo - IMCA logo - not confirm > if you are honestly or a good dealer. I am a ex IMCA member > and I am kick off from this why I I had battle with Farmer, > but for me is not a problem, I not cry if I not have a IMCA > logo. > > Matteo > > ----- Original Message ----- > Da : "Bob Evans" > A : "Bob WALKER" > Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Oggetto : Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining > armour ! > Data : Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:18:37 -0600 > >> Oh Thanks Bob, >> >> Believe it or not I have many happy customers who continue >> to make purchases. And now that my customer base is >> shrinking thanks to all the conjecture that is strewn >> about this forum, some of them will be getting some great >> deals on my auctions. IMCA is a joke. Some of the most >> respectable people in the business never have and never >> will be a member of the IMCA. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Bob WALKER" >> To: "Meteorite" >> Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 4:51 PM >> Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining >> armour ! >> >> >> > Listoids >> > >> > Heaven forbid ! >> > >> > The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning >> > the sale of "Mekong Iron" >> > >> > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have been >> > unhappy with IMCA... >> > >> > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had >> > "disagreements" with IMCA - I'm beginning to take the >> > view that there is a bad odour to IMCA ( ? by dealers >> > for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely aware of the >> excellent work done by many IMCA members > >> > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a while >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ______________________________________________ >> > http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> > Meteorite-list mailing list >> > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > M come Meteorite Meteoriti > info at mcomemeteorite.it > http://www.mcomemeteorite.it > http://www.mcomemeteorite.info > Mindat Gallery > http://www.mindat.org/gallery-5018.html ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Mon Dec 15 09:57:12 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 15:57:12 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Aussie Meteorite Rant...was sale of scorpionbight main mass by http://qmig.org In-Reply-To: <872587.54125.qm@web55208.mail.re4.yahoo.com> References: <872587.54125.qm@web55208.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <006f01c95ec5$6d23c9c0$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Yes, Elton the protective laws in Australia yielded a disastrous effect for Australian meteorite research. The find rates completely broke down to a level lower than in the 19th century. Australia has more than 600 meteorites, but in the recent 10 years only 7 new meteorites were found. Remember the observed fireball from last autumn, it was a meteorite dropper for sure. Nobody was trying to hunt it down - in Europe and USA that would never happen. I can't imagine, that these effects were the intentions of the Australian meteorite researchers. Additionally the funds for purchases of the collections seem to be lousy. All in all, after all these wonderful years, it seems, that Australian meteorite research has come to an end. And that is a pity. I'm wondering, why Bevan et al. let this disastrous evolution happen. There must happen something, else world-class meteorite research in Australia will be a closed chapter in the history of science. I'm glad to live in a more open-minded and reasonable country, Unfortunately we haven't the deserts of Australia here. Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Mr EMan Gesendet: Montag, 15. Dezember 2008 15:04 An: Meteorite; Bob WALKER Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Aussie Meteorite Rant...was sale of scorpionbight main mass by http://qmig.org Bob, standing firm or not-- you are talking out your rear. Everything you've ranted about is based on falsehoods and the fake facts you or your countryman invented. I've had a decent respect for you Bob, but this fairy-tale is an insult. The description of Haag "raping and pillaging" is a over the top. It is an attempt to revise history by creating a set of "false facts" underpinned in hyperbole. Contrary to your claims it isn't the truth you are trying to share. For the record and admittedly from memory, let me recount the circumstances of what ignited Australia's meteorite export law. Haag did not go to Australia looking for a "lunar meteorite". He wasn't at the Millillibillie looking for chondrites to pillage. He was collecting Millillibillie when an unusual rock was brought into the collecting station. Were it not for Haag it would still be out there on an ant hill, unrecognized. Milli is a eucrite, Calcalong was a lunar so where are all these chondrites you are complaining that he raped and pillaged? When Calcalong Creek was recognized as lunar, an Australian Academic went ranting and raving and when he couldn't extort Haag to give him the entire meteorite, he went whining and crying to Parliament to get it back. He couldn't but they threw him a bone so he would shut up. You had politicians that saw an angle and exploited it. They were able to keep the Aboriginals repressed yet again but forcing them to sell their finds to the state at state set prices. If meteorites were such an important cultural heritage then why didn't the academics go looking for meteorites themselves? Why did they go uncollected? Why has Australian meteorite science been stagnant for the last 20 ears? Haag offered half of the Calcalong Creek lunar in a spirit of cooperating and the Australian academic (who's name escapes me) told Haag to pack sand. Until that time there were no laws regarding meteorite export and Haag was paying the Aboriginals to collect them on their own land. Using the same criteria, you are a rapist raping the Australian "Herritage" yourself, prostituting yourself for profit. Sounds like your main rant is that you didn't think of the raping and pillaging first. Just using your own hyperbole to illustrate a point. I understand you claim to be venting, but venting is no excuse for spreading facts that you know aren't true. Lay off the exaggerations, stick to the science and leave politics to scorpions. Good luck in getting your export permits. Elton From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Mon Dec 15 10:04:29 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 16:04:29 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! In-Reply-To: <3D678C1E7374483D80B9648FCBB80F84@Gregor> References: <4945ef50.1fd.1f0e.1380395220@webmaildh3.aruba.it><000f01c95eac$50c6ee10$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> <006d01c95eba$b25431c0$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> <3D678C1E7374483D80B9648FCBB80F84@Gregor> Message-ID: <007001c95ec6$6f22d8a0$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Ooops, of course I don't mean inhabitants of coastal Florida :-) It was that incident, when on ebay several auctions were held by a seller, whose ID was "floridacoaster" or so, who sold forged Dhofar-lunaites, not only with an invented legend, but with falsified certificates of the Institute of Planetology in Muenster, and the finder of that Dhofar number told too, that other than the story, the seller told, he never was selling material to him. Unfortunately a list member - although warned - distributed some of that material - in his freebies actions. Best! Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: Greg Hupe [mailto:gmhupe at htn.net] Gesendet: Montag, 15. Dezember 2008 15:51 An: Martin Altmann Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Hello Martin and List, Martin wrote, "IMCA-labels reduce the probability especially for the beginners to fall for such sellers like the Minors, de Russes, Lindforses, Evanses, floridacoasters of the world and the Far-East-fakes-sellers... remarkably." Please clarify who you refer to by "floridacoasters". I presume you refer to Stan and not one of the several Florida meteorite collectors/dealers like myself. Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Altmann" To: Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 8:40 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! A knight in a rusty armour is better than a rogue in a golden robe. IMCA-labels reduce the probability especially for the beginners to fall for such sellers like the Minors, de Russes, Lindforses, Evanses, floridacoasters of the world and the Far-East-fakes-sellers... remarkably. Good day. Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Bob Evans Gesendet: Montag, 15. Dezember 2008 12:58 An: M come Meteorite Meteorites Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Thank you Matteo, There are many others that agree with you that just choose not to speak up here on list. ----- Original Message ----- From: "M come Meteorite Meteorites" To: Cc: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 11:46 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! >I have buy only one time from Bob Evans and all its go ok > with no problems. For IMCA I agree with the words > > Some of the most >> respectable people in the business never have and never >> will be a member of the IMCA. > > > this is right, many meteorite dealers is not IMCA member and > they sale with no problems and its honestly. What I have say > to a IMCA member time ago: a Logo - IMCA logo - not confirm > if you are honestly or a good dealer. I am a ex IMCA member > and I am kick off from this why I I had battle with Farmer, > but for me is not a problem, I not cry if I not have a IMCA > logo. > > Matteo > > ----- Original Message ----- > Da : "Bob Evans" > A : "Bob WALKER" > Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Oggetto : Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining > armour ! > Data : Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:18:37 -0600 > >> Oh Thanks Bob, >> >> Believe it or not I have many happy customers who continue >> to make purchases. And now that my customer base is >> shrinking thanks to all the conjecture that is strewn >> about this forum, some of them will be getting some great >> deals on my auctions. IMCA is a joke. Some of the most >> respectable people in the business never have and never >> will be a member of the IMCA. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Bob WALKER" >> To: "Meteorite" >> Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 4:51 PM >> Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining >> armour ! >> >> >> > Listoids >> > >> > Heaven forbid ! >> > >> > The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning >> > the sale of "Mekong Iron" >> > >> > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have been >> > unhappy with IMCA... >> > >> > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had >> > "disagreements" with IMCA - I'm beginning to take the >> > view that there is a bad odour to IMCA ( ? by dealers >> > for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely aware of the >> excellent work done by many IMCA members > >> > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a while >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ______________________________________________ >> > http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> > Meteorite-list mailing list >> > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > M come Meteorite Meteoriti > info at mcomemeteorite.it > http://www.mcomemeteorite.it > http://www.mcomemeteorite.info > Mindat Gallery > http://www.mindat.org/gallery-5018.html ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From gmhupe at htn.net Mon Dec 15 10:14:16 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 10:14:16 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! References: <4945ef50.1fd.1f0e.1380395220@webmaildh3.aruba.it><000f01c95eac$50c6ee10$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b><006d01c95eba$b25431 c0$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2><3D678C1E7374483D80B9648FCBB80F84@Gregor> <007001c95ec6$6f22d8a0$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Message-ID: <5D7777CDA1704565917A427F5B29CC0A@Gregor> Hi Martin, Thanks for the clarification. I somewhat remember that incident where someone was selling fakes, and the other rip-off artist, who actually is on the coast. Best regards, Greg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Altmann" To: Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 10:04 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Ooops, of course I don't mean inhabitants of coastal Florida :-) It was that incident, when on ebay several auctions were held by a seller, whose ID was "floridacoaster" or so, who sold forged Dhofar-lunaites, not only with an invented legend, but with falsified certificates of the Institute of Planetology in Muenster, and the finder of that Dhofar number told too, that other than the story, the seller told, he never was selling material to him. Unfortunately a list member - although warned - distributed some of that material - in his freebies actions. Best! Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: Greg Hupe [mailto:gmhupe at htn.net] Gesendet: Montag, 15. Dezember 2008 15:51 An: Martin Altmann Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Hello Martin and List, Martin wrote, "IMCA-labels reduce the probability especially for the beginners to fall for such sellers like the Minors, de Russes, Lindforses, Evanses, floridacoasters of the world and the Far-East-fakes-sellers... remarkably." Please clarify who you refer to by "floridacoasters". I presume you refer to Stan and not one of the several Florida meteorite collectors/dealers like myself. Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Altmann" To: Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 8:40 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! A knight in a rusty armour is better than a rogue in a golden robe. IMCA-labels reduce the probability especially for the beginners to fall for such sellers like the Minors, de Russes, Lindforses, Evanses, floridacoasters of the world and the Far-East-fakes-sellers... remarkably. Good day. Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Bob Evans Gesendet: Montag, 15. Dezember 2008 12:58 An: M come Meteorite Meteorites Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Thank you Matteo, There are many others that agree with you that just choose not to speak up here on list. ----- Original Message ----- From: "M come Meteorite Meteorites" To: Cc: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 11:46 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! >I have buy only one time from Bob Evans and all its go ok > with no problems. For IMCA I agree with the words > > Some of the most >> respectable people in the business never have and never >> will be a member of the IMCA. > > > this is right, many meteorite dealers is not IMCA member and > they sale with no problems and its honestly. What I have say > to a IMCA member time ago: a Logo - IMCA logo - not confirm > if you are honestly or a good dealer. I am a ex IMCA member > and I am kick off from this why I I had battle with Farmer, > but for me is not a problem, I not cry if I not have a IMCA > logo. > > Matteo > > ----- Original Message ----- > Da : "Bob Evans" > A : "Bob WALKER" > Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Oggetto : Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining > armour ! > Data : Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:18:37 -0600 > >> Oh Thanks Bob, >> >> Believe it or not I have many happy customers who continue >> to make purchases. And now that my customer base is >> shrinking thanks to all the conjecture that is strewn >> about this forum, some of them will be getting some great >> deals on my auctions. IMCA is a joke. Some of the most >> respectable people in the business never have and never >> will be a member of the IMCA. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Bob WALKER" >> To: "Meteorite" >> Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 4:51 PM >> Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining >> armour ! >> >> >> > Listoids >> > >> > Heaven forbid ! >> > >> > The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning >> > the sale of "Mekong Iron" >> > >> > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have been >> > unhappy with IMCA... >> > >> > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had >> > "disagreements" with IMCA - I'm beginning to take the >> > view that there is a bad odour to IMCA ( ? by dealers >> > for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely aware of the >> excellent work done by many IMCA members > >> > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a while >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ______________________________________________ >> > http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> > Meteorite-list mailing list >> > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > M come Meteorite Meteoriti > info at mcomemeteorite.it > http://www.mcomemeteorite.it > http://www.mcomemeteorite.info > Mindat Gallery > http://www.mindat.org/gallery-5018.html ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 10:26:59 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 07:26:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <943764.33412.qm@web58402.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi List, I never thought I would agree with any of these views that are critical of the IMCA, but I must admit (unfortunately) that I have seen some things that gives me pause about ever wanting to join again. I was rejected on my first time around for being "too new" on the scene. A few months later, a beginner I started out in the hobby (introduced and schooled) was accepted the first time after being on the scene for a fraction of the time I have. I have seen IMCA members use incorrect or misleading terminology to describe/sell specimens. I have seen IMCA members butcher and disrespect meteorites in the name of making a buck. (hideous resin-encased kindergarten junk) I have had IMCA members be rude to me - uncalled for at that. On the plus side (for the IMCA) - Some of the nicest people I have met on the meteorite scene are IMCA members. 2 of my "meteorite mentors" are IMCA members - I greatly value their friendship and expertise. I have gotten some GREAT deals from IMCA members. I have learned MUCH from talking with IMCA members. So, in the end, I have to say my opinion of the IMCA is conflicted. On the one hand, I feel a personal loyalty to some members who have become valued friends of mine. On the other hand, I think the IMCA is inconsistent and NEEDS TO CLEAN HOUSE. Until this house-cleaning takes place, I am not joining (even if they'd have me). Regards and clear skies, MikeG ------------------------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 08:51:39 +1000 From: "Bob WALKER" Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! To: "Meteorite" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Listoids Heaven forbid ! The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning the sale of "Mekong Iron" It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have been unhappy with IMCA... I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had "disagreements" with IMCA - I'm beginning to take the view that there is a bad odour to IMCA ( ? by dealers for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely aware of the excellent work done by many IMCA members At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a while ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From info at mcomemeteorite.it Mon Dec 15 10:28:05 2008 From: info at mcomemeteorite.it (M come Meteorite Meteorites) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 16:28:05 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Message-ID: <49467785.69.f8d.1641732268@webmaildh2.aruba.it> I seen De Russe and Co. its the same on internet sale theyr fakes, IMCA or not IMCA. They are not vanished forever. Matteo ----- Original Message ----- Da : "Martin Altmann" A : Oggetto : Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! Data : Mon, 15 Dec 2008 14:40:29 +0100 > A knight in a rusty armour is better than a rogue in a > golden robe. > > IMCA-labels reduce the probability especially for the > beginners to fall for such sellers like the Minors, de > Russes, Lindforses, Evanses, floridacoasters of the world > and the Far-East-fakes-sellers... remarkably. > > Good day. > Martin > > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im > Auftrag von Bob Evans > Gesendet: Montag, 15. Dezember 2008 12:58 > An: M come Meteorite Meteorites > Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining > armour ! > > Thank you Matteo, > > There are many others that agree with you that just choose > not to speak up here on list. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "M come Meteorite Meteorites" > To: > Cc: > Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 11:46 PM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining > armour ! > > > >I have buy only one time from Bob Evans and all its go ok > > with no problems. For IMCA I agree with the words > > > > Some of the most > >> respectable people in the business never have and > never >> will be a member of the IMCA. > > > > > > this is right, many meteorite dealers is not IMCA member > > and they sale with no problems and its honestly. What I > > have say to a IMCA member time ago: a Logo - IMCA logo - > > not confirm if you are honestly or a good dealer. I am a > > ex IMCA member and I am kick off from this why I I had > > battle with Farmer, but for me is not a problem, I not > > cry if I not have a IMCA logo. > > > > Matteo > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > Da : "Bob Evans" > > A : "Bob WALKER" > > Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Oggetto : Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in > > shining armour ! > > Data : Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:18:37 -0600 > > > >> Oh Thanks Bob, > >> > >> Believe it or not I have many happy customers who > continue >> to make purchases. And now that my customer > base is >> shrinking thanks to all the conjecture that is > strewn >> about this forum, some of them will be getting > some great >> deals on my auctions. IMCA is a joke. Some > of the most >> respectable people in the business never > have and never >> will be a member of the IMCA. > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "Bob WALKER" > >> To: "Meteorite" > >> Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 4:51 PM > >> Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining > >> armour ! > >> > >> > >> > Listoids > >> > > >> > Heaven forbid ! > >> > > >> > The alleged guardian of our sacred community > condoning >> > the sale of "Mekong Iron" > >> > > >> > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have > been >> > unhappy with IMCA... > >> > > >> > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had > >> > "disagreements" with IMCA - I'm beginning to take > the >> > view that there is a bad odour to IMCA ( ? by > dealers >> > for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely aware > of the >> excellent work done by many IMCA members > > >> > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a > while >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ______________________________________________ > >> > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> > Meteorite-list mailing list > >> > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > >> ______________________________________________ > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > M come Meteorite Meteoriti > > info at mcomemeteorite.it > > http://www.mcomemeteorite.it > > http://www.mcomemeteorite.info > > Mindat Gallery > > http://www.mindat.org/gallery-5018.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite Meteoriti info at mcomemeteorite.it http://www.mcomemeteorite.it http://www.mcomemeteorite.info Mindat Gallery http://www.mindat.org/gallery-5018.html From darryl at dof3.com Mon Dec 15 10:38:13 2008 From: darryl at dof3.com (Darryl Pitt) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 10:38:13 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA? In-Reply-To: <943764.33412.qm@web58402.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <943764.33412.qm@web58402.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <7C57832D-FB55-4429-9095-BDC45CE68A16@dof3.com> I think what the IMCA aspires to be is outstanding, and I wish the organization good fortune as it strives to do an better job in promoting an agenda which is of benefit to us all. On Dec 15, 2008, at 10:26 AM, Michael Gilmer wrote: > Hi List, > > I never thought I would agree with any of these views that are > critical > of the IMCA, but I must admit (unfortunately) that I have seen some > things that gives me pause about ever wanting to join again. > > I was rejected on my first time around for being "too new" on the > scene. > > A few months later, a beginner I started out in the hobby (introduced > and schooled) was accepted the first time after being on the scene for > a fraction of the time I have. > > I have seen IMCA members use incorrect or misleading terminology to > describe/sell specimens. > > I have seen IMCA members butcher and disrespect meteorites in the name > of making a buck. (hideous resin-encased kindergarten junk) > > I have had IMCA members be rude to me - uncalled for at that. > > On the plus side (for the IMCA) - > > Some of the nicest people I have met on the meteorite scene are IMCA > members. > > 2 of my "meteorite mentors" are IMCA members - I greatly value their > friendship and expertise. > > I have gotten some GREAT deals from IMCA members. > > I have learned MUCH from talking with IMCA members. > > So, in the end, I have to say my opinion of the IMCA is conflicted. > On the one hand, I feel a personal loyalty to some members who have > become valued friends of mine. On the other hand, I think the IMCA > is inconsistent and NEEDS TO CLEAN HOUSE. Until this house-cleaning > takes place, I am not joining (even if they'd have me). > > Regards and clear skies, > > MikeG > > ------------------------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 08:51:39 +1000 > From: "Bob WALKER" > Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! > To: "Meteorite" > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Listoids > > Heaven forbid ! > > The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning the sale of > "Mekong > Iron" > > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have been unhappy with > IMCA... > > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had "disagreements" with > IMCA - I'm beginning to take the view that there is a bad odour to > IMCA ( ? > by dealers for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely aware of the > excellent > work done by many IMCA members > > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a while > > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From geohiggins at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 10:40:24 2008 From: geohiggins at yahoo.com (John higgins) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 07:40:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] LOOKING FOR IMCA SPONSORSHIP! PLEASE SUPPORT THE CAUSE FOR A HONEST METEORITE COMMUNITY! Message-ID: <218544.83806.qm@web63205.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Hello, I want to join the IMCA. this whole thing about Evans, Casper, Matteo, etc... is important, and I believe its for reasons like these that the IMCA was established, to identify and extract the black cancers from among us honest members of the meteorite community. Also it is important to do everything possible to distance yourself, using all the available methods, to make a distinction from the good and the bad. The IMCA is and will be the first and foremost tool that collectors use to make a educated meteorite purchase. And I want to be a part of it, now more than ever. I ask for two sponsors to officially recommend my induction into IMCA Thank You, Have a great day! John Higgins From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 11:05:34 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 08:05:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA? In-Reply-To: <7C57832D-FB55-4429-9095-BDC45CE68A16@dof3.com> Message-ID: <587181.67469.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi Darryl, I'm glad you wrote this back so quick, because I was mulling over what I had said, and I think I may have come across wrong. I am not trying to bash the IMCA. I fully support their mission to police the meteorite marketplace and to put some measure of consistency into the handling and dealing of meteorites. And for the most part, I think the IMCA succeeds with flying colors in this respect. But, no group is perfect, and the IMCA can come across as inconsistent at times to people from outside the group. I am not privy to the IMCA's internal workings, so what I am saying must be taken with a grain of salt - since I am merely putting forth a single opinion as someone from outside the group. I am curious whether other people from outside the IMCA may feel the same way - a couple of comments I have read on the list in the last week have led me to believe that others might be seeing the same things I am. I'll also say I have never been burned on a deal by an IMCA member. In fact, (knock on wood), I have never been burned on a deal for meteorites by anyone (yet). I have been trading online since 1999, so I have good fraud radar - years of buying and collecting antique telescopes has taught me this. (there is a lot of fraud and misrepresentation in the the antique scope market). I have bought specimens from nearly every major member of this list over the last 12-16 months. The majority of these people are IMCA members - and their cordial nature and genuine desire to help newcomers is what gave me a positive impression of the meteorite field/hobby. But now that I have been a part of this hobby long enough to see some things, I am learning that our watchdogs also need some occasional watching. The IMCA is a large international collective - it has members from all walks of life and corners of the world. Like any such group, there is going to be some variation in how things are implemented from one member to the next. I have a great deal of respect for the IMCA and the majority of it's members, but my respect is not blind and I have seen a few things over the course of my time in the hobby that has tempered this respect with a measure of perspective. While I would consider it an honor to be a member of the same group as some of the highly-respected IMCA personalities, I think there are a few things going on that make me reluctant. Currently, I am greatly enjoying this hobby as a collector and kitchen-table dealer. I am also learning many new things about planetary science, space science, chemistry, geology, and meteoritics. I feel rewarded and stimulated by my participation in the world of meteorites - and I see no reason right now to change that participation by aligning myself with a particular group. Best regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... --- On Mon, 12/15/08, Darryl Pitt wrote: > From: Darryl Pitt > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA? > To: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Monday, December 15, 2008, 9:38 AM > I think what the IMCA aspires to be is outstanding, and I > wish the > organization good fortune as it strives to do an better job > in > promoting an agenda which is of benefit to us all. > > > > On Dec 15, 2008, at 10:26 AM, Michael Gilmer wrote: > > > Hi List, > > > > I never thought I would agree with any of these views > that are > > critical > > of the IMCA, but I must admit (unfortunately) that I > have seen some > > things that gives me pause about ever wanting to join > again. > > > > I was rejected on my first time around for being > "too new" on the > > scene. > > > > A few months later, a beginner I started out in the > hobby (introduced > > and schooled) was accepted the first time after being > on the scene for > > a fraction of the time I have. > > > > I have seen IMCA members use incorrect or misleading > terminology to > > describe/sell specimens. > > > > I have seen IMCA members butcher and disrespect > meteorites in the name > > of making a buck. (hideous resin-encased kindergarten > junk) > > > > I have had IMCA members be rude to me - uncalled for > at that. > > > > On the plus side (for the IMCA) - > > > > Some of the nicest people I have met on the meteorite > scene are IMCA > > members. > > > > 2 of my "meteorite mentors" are IMCA members > - I greatly value their > > friendship and expertise. > > > > I have gotten some GREAT deals from IMCA members. > > > > I have learned MUCH from talking with IMCA members. > > > > So, in the end, I have to say my opinion of the IMCA > is conflicted. > > On the one hand, I feel a personal loyalty to some > members who have > > become valued friends of mine. On the other hand, I > think the IMCA > > is inconsistent and NEEDS TO CLEAN HOUSE. Until this > house-cleaning > > takes place, I am not joining (even if they'd have > me). > > > > Regards and clear skies, > > > > MikeG > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > > > > Message: 7 > > Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 08:51:39 +1000 > > From: "Bob WALKER" > > > Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining > armour ! > > To: "Meteorite" > > > Message-ID: > > > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; > charset="iso-8859-1"; > > reply-type=original > > > > Listoids > > > > Heaven forbid ! > > > > The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning > the sale of > > "Mekong > > Iron" > > > > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have > been unhappy with > > IMCA... > > > > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had > "disagreements" with > > IMCA - I'm beginning to take the view that there > is a bad odour to > > IMCA ( ? > > by dealers for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely > aware of the > > excellent > > work done by many IMCA members > > > > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a > while > > > > > > > ......................................................... > > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and > http://www.glassthrower.com > > MySpace - > http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > > > .......................................................... > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From almitt at kconline.com Mon Dec 15 11:35:03 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 11:35:03 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Aussie Meteorite Rant...was sale of scorpionbight main mass by http://qmig.org In-Reply-To: <872587.54125.qm@web55208.mail.re4.yahoo.com> References: <872587.54125.qm@web55208.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <50ACCC12F157485EA7F856E4E78B8BD1@StarmanPC> Hi Elton and all, I also talked to Bob Haag about the lunar find and your account is the same one that Haag told me. Besides offering part of Calcalong Creek back to the Australians, he also donated some of it for NASA for scientific research. That was back before their was any meteorite export laws. As Martin said, few meteorites are now coming to light because of all this. I agree that rather than sit behind a keyboard and complain, why not go out and spend lots of your time, gas, money and knowledge and hunt for more specimens to be turned over to the Australian Institutes? Robert Haag has always been very enthusiastic about hunting for specimens, the science behind them and making money which is no crime. The complaintiff tried to make me feel guilty and sell some of my Australian specimens to him at a reduced rate because I shouldn't have had them without verifying where I got them from. There have been exchanges of material to other institutions from Australia so trade for some of that material are possible. I carry the export permits (or copies of them) with me in the case of any questions. One should get their facts straight before posting to this list. In the end, both hunters, collectors and researchers should work toward a common good to bring about more information on the mysteries, histories that meteorites hold. --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mr EMan" Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 9:04 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Aussie Meteorite Rant...was sale of scorpionbight main mass by http://qmig.org > Bob, standing firm or not-- you are talking out your rear. Everything > you've ranted about is based on falsehoods and the fake facts you or your > countryman invented. I've had a decent respect for you Bob, but this > fairy-tale is an insult. The description of Haag "raping and pillaging" is > a over the top. It is an attempt to revise history by creating a set of > "false facts" underpinned in hyperbole. Contrary to your claims it isn't > the truth you are trying to share. > > For the record and admittedly from memory, let me recount the > circumstances of what ignited Australia's meteorite export law. Haag did > not go to Australia looking for a "lunar meteorite". He wasn't at the > Millillibillie looking for chondrites to pillage. He was collecting > Millillibillie when an unusual rock was brought into the collecting > station. Were it not for Haag it would still be out there on an ant hill, > unrecognized. Milli is a eucrite, Calcalong was a lunar so where are all > these chondrites you are complaining that he raped and pillaged? > > When Calcalong Creek was recognized as lunar, an Australian Academic went > ranting and raving and when he couldn't extort Haag to give him the entire > meteorite, he went whining and crying to Parliament to get it back. He > couldn't but they threw him a bone so he would shut up. > > You had politicians that saw an angle and exploited it. They were able to > keep the Aboriginals repressed yet again but forcing them to sell their > finds to the state at state set prices. If meteorites were such an > important cultural heritage then why didn't the academics go looking for > meteorites themselves? Why did they go uncollected? Why has Australian > meteorite science been stagnant for the last 20 ears? Haag offered half > of the Calcalong Creek lunar in a spirit of cooperating and the Australian > academic (who's name escapes me) told Haag to pack sand. > > Until that time there were no laws regarding meteorite export and Haag was > paying the Aboriginals to collect them on their own land. Using the same > criteria, you are a rapist raping the Australian "Herritage" yourself, > prostituting yourself for profit. Sounds like your main rant is that you > didn't think of the raping and pillaging first. Just using your own > hyperbole to illustrate a point. > > I understand you claim to be venting, but venting is no excuse for > spreading facts that you know aren't true. Lay off the exaggerations, > stick to the science and leave politics to scorpions. Good luck in > getting your export permits. > > Elton From darryl at dof3.com Mon Dec 15 11:34:38 2008 From: darryl at dof3.com (Darryl Pitt) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 11:34:38 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA? In-Reply-To: <587181.67469.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <587181.67469.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Michael. Every facet of your note is appreciated, and your observations and desires are both sober and reasonable. With warm regards...and clear skies / d, On Dec 15, 2008, at 11:05 AM, Michael Gilmer wrote: > Hi Darryl, > > I'm glad you wrote this back so quick, because I was mulling over what > I had said, and I think I may have come across wrong. I am not > trying to bash the IMCA. I fully support their mission to police the > meteorite marketplace and to put some measure of consistency into > the handling and dealing of meteorites. And for the most part, I > think > the IMCA succeeds with flying colors in this respect. But, no > group is perfect, and the IMCA can come across as inconsistent at > times to people from outside the group. I am not privy to the > IMCA's internal workings, so what I am saying must be taken with a > grain of salt - since I am merely putting forth a single opinion as > someone from outside the group. I am curious whether other people > from outside the IMCA may feel the same way - a couple of comments I > have read on the list in the last week have led me to believe that > others might be seeing the same things I am. > > I'll also say I have never been burned on a deal by an IMCA member. > In fact, (knock on wood), I have never been burned on a deal for > meteorites by anyone (yet). I have been trading online since 1999, so > I have good fraud radar - years of buying and collecting antique > telescopes has taught me this. (there is a lot of fraud and > misrepresentation in the the antique scope market). I have bought > specimens from nearly every major member of this list over the last > 12-16 months. The majority of these people are IMCA members - and > their cordial nature and genuine desire to help newcomers is what > gave me a positive impression of the meteorite field/hobby. But now > that I have been a part of this hobby long enough to see some things, > I am learning that our watchdogs also need some occasional watching. > The IMCA is a large international collective - it has members from > all walks of life and corners of the world. Like any such group, > there is going to be some variation in how things are implemented from > one member to the next. > > I have a great deal of respect for the IMCA and the majority of it's > members, but my respect is not blind and I have seen a few things > over the course of my time in the hobby that has tempered this respect > with a measure of perspective. While I would consider it an honor > to be a member of the same group as some of the highly-respected > IMCA personalities, I think there are a few things going on that > make me reluctant. Currently, I am greatly enjoying this hobby as > a collector and kitchen-table dealer. I am also learning many new > things about planetary science, space science, chemistry, geology, > and meteoritics. I feel rewarded and stimulated by my participation > in the world of meteorites - and I see no reason right now to change > that participation by aligning myself with a particular group. > > Best regards and clear skies, > > MikeG > > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > --- On Mon, 12/15/08, Darryl Pitt wrote: > >> From: Darryl Pitt >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA? >> To: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com >> Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> Date: Monday, December 15, 2008, 9:38 AM >> I think what the IMCA aspires to be is outstanding, and I >> wish the >> organization good fortune as it strives to do an better job >> in >> promoting an agenda which is of benefit to us all. >> >> >> >> On Dec 15, 2008, at 10:26 AM, Michael Gilmer wrote: >> >>> Hi List, >>> >>> I never thought I would agree with any of these views >> that are >>> critical >>> of the IMCA, but I must admit (unfortunately) that I >> have seen some >>> things that gives me pause about ever wanting to join >> again. >>> >>> I was rejected on my first time around for being >> "too new" on the >>> scene. >>> >>> A few months later, a beginner I started out in the >> hobby (introduced >>> and schooled) was accepted the first time after being >> on the scene for >>> a fraction of the time I have. >>> >>> I have seen IMCA members use incorrect or misleading >> terminology to >>> describe/sell specimens. >>> >>> I have seen IMCA members butcher and disrespect >> meteorites in the name >>> of making a buck. (hideous resin-encased kindergarten >> junk) >>> >>> I have had IMCA members be rude to me - uncalled for >> at that. >>> >>> On the plus side (for the IMCA) - >>> >>> Some of the nicest people I have met on the meteorite >> scene are IMCA >>> members. >>> >>> 2 of my "meteorite mentors" are IMCA members >> - I greatly value their >>> friendship and expertise. >>> >>> I have gotten some GREAT deals from IMCA members. >>> >>> I have learned MUCH from talking with IMCA members. >>> >>> So, in the end, I have to say my opinion of the IMCA >> is conflicted. >>> On the one hand, I feel a personal loyalty to some >> members who have >>> become valued friends of mine. On the other hand, I >> think the IMCA >>> is inconsistent and NEEDS TO CLEAN HOUSE. Until this >> house-cleaning >>> takes place, I am not joining (even if they'd have >> me). >>> >>> Regards and clear skies, >>> >>> MikeG >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 7 >>> Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 08:51:39 +1000 >>> From: "Bob WALKER" >> >>> Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining >> armour ! >>> To: "Meteorite" >> >>> Message-ID: >> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; >> charset="iso-8859-1"; >>> reply-type=original >>> >>> Listoids >>> >>> Heaven forbid ! >>> >>> The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning >> the sale of >>> "Mekong >>> Iron" >>> >>> It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have >> been unhappy with >>> IMCA... >>> >>> I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had >> "disagreements" with >>> IMCA - I'm beginning to take the view that there >> is a bad odour to >>> IMCA ( ? >>> by dealers for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely >> aware of the >>> excellent >>> work done by many IMCA members >>> >>> At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a >> while >>> >>> >>> >> ......................................................... >>> Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) >>> Member of the Meteoritical Society. >>> Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. >>> Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and >> http://www.glassthrower.com >>> MySpace - >> http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale >>> >> .......................................................... >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ______________________________________________ >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>> >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 12:06:43 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 09:06:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA? In-Reply-To: <587181.67469.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <228726.83615.qm@web45615.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> When I first got into meteorites, one of the first things I did was join the IMCA. I would agree that they are not perfect but I ask, can you think of anything that is? I joined becouse of what they stand for and think what they are trying to do is a great thing an I am happy to be a member of a group that strives to do good and also gives something back to the community. While I do see it as more of a "dealers club" then anything else, I have enjoyed being a part of it and have only good to say about my time with them. Just my 2 cents on the subject. Greg Catterton www.wanderingstarmeteorites.com --- On Mon, 12/15/08, Michael Gilmer wrote: > From: Michael Gilmer > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA? > To: "Darryl Pitt" > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Monday, December 15, 2008, 11:05 AM > Hi Darryl, > > I'm glad you wrote this back so quick, because I was > mulling over what > I had said, and I think I may have come across wrong. I am > not > trying to bash the IMCA. I fully support their mission to > police the > meteorite marketplace and to put some measure of > consistency into > the handling and dealing of meteorites. And for the most > part, I think > the IMCA succeeds with flying colors in this respect. But, > no > group is perfect, and the IMCA can come across as > inconsistent at > times to people from outside the group. I am not privy to > the > IMCA's internal workings, so what I am saying must be > taken with a > grain of salt - since I am merely putting forth a single > opinion as > someone from outside the group. I am curious whether other > people > from outside the IMCA may feel the same way - a couple of > comments I > have read on the list in the last week have led me to > believe that > others might be seeing the same things I am. > > I'll also say I have never been burned on a deal by an > IMCA member. > In fact, (knock on wood), I have never been burned on a > deal for > meteorites by anyone (yet). I have been trading online > since 1999, so > I have good fraud radar - years of buying and collecting > antique > telescopes has taught me this. (there is a lot of fraud and > misrepresentation in the the antique scope market). I have > bought > specimens from nearly every major member of this list over > the last > 12-16 months. The majority of these people are IMCA > members - and > their cordial nature and genuine desire to help newcomers > is what > gave me a positive impression of the meteorite field/hobby. > But now > that I have been a part of this hobby long enough to see > some things, > I am learning that our watchdogs also need some occasional > watching. > The IMCA is a large international collective - it has > members from > all walks of life and corners of the world. Like any such > group, > there is going to be some variation in how things are > implemented from > one member to the next. > > I have a great deal of respect for the IMCA and the > majority of it's > members, but my respect is not blind and I have seen a few > things > over the course of my time in the hobby that has tempered > this respect > with a measure of perspective. While I would consider it > an honor > to be a member of the same group as some of the > highly-respected > IMCA personalities, I think there are a few things going on > that > make me reluctant. Currently, I am greatly enjoying this > hobby as > a collector and kitchen-table dealer. I am also learning > many new > things about planetary science, space science, chemistry, > geology, > and meteoritics. I feel rewarded and stimulated by my > participation > in the world of meteorites - and I see no reason right now > to change > that participation by aligning myself with a particular > group. > > Best regards and clear skies, > > MikeG > > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and > http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > --- On Mon, 12/15/08, Darryl Pitt > wrote: > > > From: Darryl Pitt > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA? > > To: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com > > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Monday, December 15, 2008, 9:38 AM > > I think what the IMCA aspires to be is outstanding, > and I > > wish the > > organization good fortune as it strives to do an > better job > > in > > promoting an agenda which is of benefit to us all. > > > > > > > > On Dec 15, 2008, at 10:26 AM, Michael Gilmer wrote: > > > > > Hi List, > > > > > > I never thought I would agree with any of these > views > > that are > > > critical > > > of the IMCA, but I must admit (unfortunately) > that I > > have seen some > > > things that gives me pause about ever wanting to > join > > again. > > > > > > I was rejected on my first time around for being > > "too new" on the > > > scene. > > > > > > A few months later, a beginner I started out in > the > > hobby (introduced > > > and schooled) was accepted the first time after > being > > on the scene for > > > a fraction of the time I have. > > > > > > I have seen IMCA members use incorrect or > misleading > > terminology to > > > describe/sell specimens. > > > > > > I have seen IMCA members butcher and disrespect > > meteorites in the name > > > of making a buck. (hideous resin-encased > kindergarten > > junk) > > > > > > I have had IMCA members be rude to me - uncalled > for > > at that. > > > > > > On the plus side (for the IMCA) - > > > > > > Some of the nicest people I have met on the > meteorite > > scene are IMCA > > > members. > > > > > > 2 of my "meteorite mentors" are IMCA > members > > - I greatly value their > > > friendship and expertise. > > > > > > I have gotten some GREAT deals from IMCA members. > > > > > > I have learned MUCH from talking with IMCA > members. > > > > > > So, in the end, I have to say my opinion of the > IMCA > > is conflicted. > > > On the one hand, I feel a personal loyalty to > some > > members who have > > > become valued friends of mine. On the other > hand, I > > think the IMCA > > > is inconsistent and NEEDS TO CLEAN HOUSE. Until > this > > house-cleaning > > > takes place, I am not joining (even if they'd > have > > me). > > > > > > Regards and clear skies, > > > > > > MikeG > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > Message: 7 > > > Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 08:51:39 +1000 > > > From: "Bob WALKER" > > > > > Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in > shining > > armour ! > > > To: "Meteorite" > > > > > Message-ID: > > > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; > > charset="iso-8859-1"; > > > reply-type=original > > > > > > Listoids > > > > > > Heaven forbid ! > > > > > > The alleged guardian of our sacred community > condoning > > the sale of > > > "Mekong > > > Iron" > > > > > > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids > have > > been unhappy with > > > IMCA... > > > > > > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have > had > > "disagreements" with > > > IMCA - I'm beginning to take the view that > there > > is a bad odour to > > > IMCA ( ? > > > by dealers for dealers ?) - tho I'm still > acutely > > aware of the > > > excellent > > > work done by many IMCA members > > > > > > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for > a > > while > > > > > > > > > > > > ......................................................... > > > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > > > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > > > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > > > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and > > http://www.glassthrower.com > > > MySpace - > > http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > > > > > > .......................................................... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mexicodoug at aim.com Mon Dec 15 12:10:47 2008 From: mexicodoug at aim.com (mexicodoug at aim.com) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 12:10:47 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA? In-Reply-To: <587181.67469.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CB2CEF352FC913-C38-672@webmail-md11.sysops.aol.com> You Elois and we Morlocks can peaceably co-exist provided individuals from either group don't market themselves as having a privileged position among collectors to provide meteorites. Those traits, ethics, are individual characteristics. Everyone has their own reasons for wanting to join (or not) the IMCA organization and it is a very personal and private decision in everyone's own world and experiences. No one ever should be made to feel it necessary to explain why they choose not to. I have dealt in a very small way, with MikeG and found him to be a conscientious and outstanding collector. That's all I have to say! Happy Holidays, Doug -----Original Message----- From: Michael Gilmer To: Darryl Pitt Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 11:05 am Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA? Hi Darryl, I'm glad you wrote this back so quick, because I was mulling over what I had said, and I think I may have come across wrong. I am not trying to bash the IMCA. I fully support their mission to police the meteorite marketplace and to put some measure of consistency into the handling and dealing of meteorites. And for the most part, I think the IMCA succeeds with flying colors in this respect. But, no group is perfect, and the IMCA can come across as inconsistent at times to people from outside the group. I am not privy to the IMCA's internal workings, so what I am saying must be taken with a grain of salt - since I am merely putting forth a single opinion as someone from outside the group. I am curious whether other people from outside the IMCA may feel the same way - a couple of comments I have read on the list in the last week have led me to believe that others might be seeing the same things I am. I'll also say I have never been burned on a deal by an IMCA member. In fact, (knock on wood), I have never been burned on a deal for meteorites by anyone (yet). I have been trading online since 1999, so I have good fraud radar - years of buying and collecting antique telescopes has taught me this. (there is a lot of fraud and misrepresentation in the the antique scope market). I have bought specimens from nearly every major member of this list over the last 12-16 months. The majority of these people are IMCA members - and their cordial nature and genuine desire to help newcomers is what gave me a positive impression of the meteorite field/hobby. But now that I have been a part of this hobby long enough to see some things, I am learning that our watchdogs also need some occasional watching. The IMCA is a large international collective - it has members from all walks of life and corners of the world. Like any such group, there is going to be some variation in how things are implemented from one member to the next. I have a great deal of respect for the IMCA and the majority of it's members, but my respect is not blind and I have seen a few things over the course of my time in the hobby that has tempered this respect with a measure of perspective. While I would consider it an honor to be a member of the same group as some of the highly-respected IMCA personalities, I think there are a few things going on that make me reluctant. Currently, I am greatly enjoying this hobby as a collector and kitchen-table dealer. I am also learning many new things about planetary science, space science, chemistry, geology, and meteoritics. I feel rewarded and stimulated by my participation in the world of meteorites - and I see no reason right now to change that participation by aligning myself with a particular group. Best regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... --- On Mon, 12/15/08, Darryl Pitt wrote: > From: Darryl Pitt > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA? > To: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Monday, December 15, 2008, 9:38 AM > I think what the IMCA aspires to be is outstanding, and I > wish the > organization good fortune as it strives to do an better job > in > promoting an agenda which is of benefit to us all. > > > > On Dec 15, 2008, at 10:26 AM, Michael Gilmer wrote: > > > Hi List, > > > > I never thought I would agree with any of these views > that are > > critical > > of the IMCA, but I must admit (unfortunately) that I > have seen some > > things that gives me pause about ever wanting to join > again. > > > > I was rejected on my first time around for being > "too new" on the > > scene. > > > > A few months later, a beginner I started out in the > hobby (introduced > > and schooled) was accepted the first time after being > on the scene for > > a fraction of the time I have. > > > > I have seen IMCA members use incorrect or misleading > terminology to > > describe/sell specimens. > > > > I have seen IMCA members butcher and disrespect > meteorites in the name > > of making a buck. (hideous resin-encased kindergarten > junk) > > > > I have had IMCA members be rude to me - uncalled for > at that. > > > > On the plus side (for the IMCA) - > > > > Some of the nicest people I have met on the meteorite > scene are IMCA > > members. > > > > 2 of my "meteorite mentors" are IMCA members > - I greatly value their > > friendship and expertise. > > > > I have gotten some GREAT deals from IMCA members. > > > > I have learned MUCH from talking with IMCA members. > > > > So, in the end, I have to say my opinion of the IMCA > is conflicted. > > On the one hand, I feel a personal loyalty to some > members who have > > become valued friends of mine. On the other hand, I > think the IMCA > > is inconsistent and NEEDS TO CLEAN HOUSE. Until this > house-cleaning > > takes place, I am not joining (even if they'd have > me). > > > > Regards and clear skies, > > > > MikeG > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > > > > Message: 7 > > Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 08:51:39 +1000 > > From: "Bob WALKER" > > > Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining > armour ! > > To: "Meteorite" > > > Message-ID: > > > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; > charset="iso-8859-1"; > > reply-type=original > > > > Listoids > > > > Heaven forbid ! > > > > The alleged guardian of our sacred community condoning > the sale of > > "Mekong > > Iron" > > > > It isn't the first or last time that Listoids have > been unhappy with > > IMCA... > > > > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had > "disagreements" with > > IMCA - I'm beginning to take the view that there > is a bad odour to > > IMCA ( ? > > by dealers for dealers ?) - tho I'm still acutely > aware of the > > excellent > > work done by many IMCA members > > > > At least it will take the heat off Bob EVANS for a > while > > > > > > > ......................................................... > > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and > http://www.glassthrower.com > > MySpace - > http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > > > .......................................................... > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Mon Dec 15 12:19:05 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 18:19:05 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Aussie Meteorite Rant...was sale ofscorpionbight main mass by http://qmig.org In-Reply-To: <50ACCC12F157485EA7F856E4E78B8BD1@StarmanPC> References: <872587.54125.qm@web55208.mail.re4.yahoo.com> <50ACCC12F157485EA7F856E4E78B8BD1@StarmanPC> Message-ID: <001701c95ed9$3f0d7310$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Hi Al, yes it is a dramatic regress in Australia. Science there really suffers from the restrictive laws. 7 meteorites in 10 years there. Look at the picture of the day, what a fine stone Moni found. She alone as an occasional weekend hunter in their home deserts has found more new meteorites than all the expeditions of a whole decade on a whole continent, carried out by institutes and universities in Australia! If I check the Bulletin database, there are listed fort he same time 278 (!) new falls and finds in USA, where the regulations are more liberal. And they are classified, hence from each find a deposit and a type specimen are now in the institutions. I don't know, I'm a layman with no degree in mineralogy or planetology and I'm not the most intelligent one - but these figures are so simply to understand and it is really not difficult to find them out - so I ask, why nobody of the Australians is the same worried like me and why there are still attempts by some scientists to restrict the meteorite scene in other countries in the same way. Obviously they aren't list members...... Strange. Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von al mitterling Gesendet: Montag, 15. Dezember 2008 17:35 An: Mr EMan; Meteorite Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Aussie Meteorite Rant...was sale ofscorpionbight main mass by http://qmig.org Hi Elton and all, As Martin said, few meteorites are now coming to light because of all this. From bigpineartifacts at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 12:29:03 2008 From: bigpineartifacts at yahoo.com (mckinney trammell) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 09:29:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] millbillillie on ebay $1 no reserve Message-ID: <762250.97938.qm@web53202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> if you need this meteorite cheap, here is a nice 5 g piece + micros: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZpaleoasis From grf2 at verizon.net Mon Dec 15 12:10:41 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 12:10:41 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fw: New Issue: Wee Rocky Droplets in Comet Dust Message-ID: <41EA2BDFA5CC46708640D87751C6CE91@ASUS> ----- Original Message ----- From: "PSRD" To: Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 8:43 PM Subject: New Issue: Wee Rocky Droplets in Comet Dust > Announcement from Planetary Science Research Discoveries [PSRD] > > New article online: Wee Rocky Droplets in Comet Dust > > --Tiny flash-melted objects in dust collected from comet Wild 2 were > transported from the inner Solar System to the outer reaches where comets > formed. > --------- > We invite you to: > READ: First summary paragraph for a quick overview > PRINT: pdf version > VIEW: short slide summary > --------- > FULL ARTICLE at: > http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Dec08/cometDust.html > --------- > > PSRD is an educational web site supported by NASA's SMD Cosmochemistry > Program and the Hawaii Space Grant Consortium to share the latest research > on meteorites, planets, moons, and other solar system bodies. > > You are subscribed to our free mailing list. > We never send attachments. > For more information please see > http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/PSRDsubscribe.html > > --------- > Jeff Taylor and Linda Martel > Hawaii Institute of Geophysics and Planetology, > University of Hawaii > psrd at higp.hawaii.edu > voice (808) 956-3899 > fax (808) 956-6322 > http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu From geoking at notkin.net Mon Dec 15 13:18:56 2008 From: geoking at notkin.net (Notkin) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 11:18:56 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F4AF238-0183-4CAD-B7C8-D7B648BE6020@notkin.net> Bob Walker posted: > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had "disagreements" > with IMCA - I'm beginning to take the view that there is a bad odour > to IMCA Dear Bob: It always upsets me when I hear someone grumbling about the IMCA, but thankfully that's a rare occurrence. No organization is perfect, but the IMCA is a wonderful example of what hardworking people can accomplish when they try to make their community a better place. It's easy to sit behind a keyboard and point fingers. It's a lot harder to actually get up and do something positive. Look at the current list of IMCA officers -- Dr. Larry Lebofsky, Anne Black, Peter Marmet, Jeff Kuyken, Andrzej Pilski, Martin Altmann, Sergey Vasiliev, Maria Haas, Norbert Classen. These people are not amateurs! They are some of the most respected names in our field and they give up enormous amounts of their personal time for no financial compensation in order to help steer the IMCA. The IMCA has established a set of ethical standards that members must adhere to and that's an excellent step forward as there have been quite a few out-and-out crooks selling in our field over the past decade. An IMCA logo on your website or eBay page tells prospective buyers that you are known by your peers to be a reputable seller. I have a suggestion for you: If you want to know what really goes on in the IMCA why not volunteer? They can for sure use the help and you will have the opportunity to discover for yourself how these good people are helping to improve the meteorite collecting world. Geoff N. www.aerolite.org IMCA #4242 From m42protosun at aol.com Mon Dec 15 13:48:46 2008 From: m42protosun at aol.com (m42protosun at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 13:48:46 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Thank you for the I.M.C.A. discussion Message-ID: <8CB2CFCE4EFC06E-1684-2CE@mblk-d15.sysops.aol.com> Hello lists, thank you for the very wide discussion, which I could stimulate. It are the greenhorns, the newcomer who purchase the most metwrongs. But never an IMCA member should sell this shit. He should carry out the code of ethics. We all do mistakes but if someone do a mistake as an IMCA member selling unintended a metwrong to newcomers (and all other) he should iimmediately correct the deal if the customer can prove the assertion of wrongness. It is dishonorable to start an act of defensiveness and to bombard the new collector with allegations that he is not a professional person and has to stop talking. I did not know whether the IMCA has in the past suspended dishonorable member, but I think it is time to start. Otherwise this association will lost reputation. Uwe, who had bought from 2 IMCA member Mekong iron as Nantan. ________________________________________________________________________ AOL eMail auf Ihrem Handy! Ab sofort k?nnen Sie auch unterwegs Ihre AOL email abrufen. Registrieren Sie sich jetzt kostenlos. From gsac at gmx.net Mon Dec 15 14:00:41 2008 From: gsac at gmx.net (Alexander Seidel) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 20:00:41 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! In-Reply-To: <3F4AF238-0183-4CAD-B7C8-D7B648BE6020@notkin.net> References: <3F4AF238-0183-4CAD-B7C8-D7B648BE6020@notkin.net> Message-ID: <20081215190041.12640@gmx.net> Well spoken, Geoff - I fully agree to what you reasoned in a very gentlemanly manner... Alex Berlin/Germany IMCA # 0042 -------- Original-Nachricht -------- > Datum: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 11:18:56 -0700 > Von: Notkin > An: Meteorite List > Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! > Bob Walker posted: > > > I'd like to hear from other Listoids who have had "disagreements" > > with IMCA - I'm beginning to take the view that there is a bad odour > > to IMCA > > > Dear Bob: > > It always upsets me when I hear someone grumbling about the IMCA, but > thankfully that's a rare occurrence. > > No organization is perfect, but the IMCA is a wonderful example of > what hardworking people can accomplish when they try to make their > community a better place. It's easy to sit behind a keyboard and point > fingers. It's a lot harder to actually get up and do something positive. > > Look at the current list of IMCA officers -- Dr. Larry Lebofsky, Anne > Black, Peter Marmet, Jeff Kuyken, Andrzej Pilski, Martin Altmann, > Sergey Vasiliev, Maria Haas, Norbert Classen. These people are not > amateurs! They are some of the most respected names in our field and > they give up enormous amounts of their personal time for no financial > compensation in order to help steer the IMCA. The IMCA has established > a set of ethical standards that members must adhere to and that's an > excellent step forward as there have been quite a few out-and-out > crooks selling in our field over the past decade. An IMCA logo on your > website or eBay page tells prospective buyers that you are known by > your peers to be a reputable seller. > > I have a suggestion for you: If you want to know what really goes on > in the IMCA why not volunteer? They can for sure use the help and you > will have the opportunity to discover for yourself how these good > people are helping to improve the meteorite collecting world. > > > Geoff N. > > www.aerolite.org > IMCA #4242 > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 14:10:13 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 11:10:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] odds and ends Message-ID: <483006.32868.qm@web57802.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Good afternoon all.This will be my last post on the list until tucson.I have some big projects going on so it will take me away from the list for a few weeks.A few years ago I was told I was no longer a member of the IMCA,because of my behaviour.I protested at first,but as time went on I accepted it and moved on.I tried for reinstatement,but was denied.Well I just reapplied.I will wait and see what happens.I would really like to be a member again.I think it is very important to be a member to a group that you are heavily involved with.For me it is collecting.Also after seeing all the negative adds about bob evans,I have to keep my 2 cents out of it.He and I have had a few differences,but it has all been settled.We both agreed from now on we would have a professional friendship towards each other and put all past endeavors behind us and look forward to the future.I also have a 202 gram unclassified stone meteorite that needs a good home.It is an endcut and has lots of metal.IT IS ALSO A FREEBIE!Also who is coming to tucson in 2009.I will be there feb 5th to feb 8th.I really look forward to seeing everyone and meeting newbies.Chime in for the freebie.Have a great day all. Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From mikewren at gilanet.com Mon Dec 15 14:38:27 2008 From: mikewren at gilanet.com (michael cottingham) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 12:38:27 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: BEST SALE OF THE YEAR ENDS WED/10th, More Highlights... Store wide Sale till Wed-night! References: Message-ID: > > HAPPY HOLIDAYS TO ALL! > > Well it is well underway: > > 37 Auctions listed at 0.99 cents, with a retail value of over > $10,000.00 > > and a Store wide sale on over 200 meteorite specimens from 10% to > 30% off! > > Go to: > > http://stores.ebay.com/voyage-botanica-natural-history > > > They are some great meteorites listed and some great prices! > > > Highlights: > > Beautiful Iron, Sweden, MUONIONALUSTA, 774g, One Of The Largest > Inclusions ever! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286680831 > > Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 20.28g, One of my last auction > specimens! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721166 > > Beautiful GIBEON, IVA Iron Specimen, 432g. A fantastic complete slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721158 > > Seldom Available GRUVER, Texas, H4, 3.84g, nice one! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448362 > > Nice H3 From Namibia, KORRA KORRABES, 19.88g, Seldom available these > days > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448373 > > Pallasite From Australia-HUCKITTA, 9.98 gram, cool looking. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448385 > > Super Rare Fall BATH FURNACE, Kentucky, 1.28g, These are my last > specimens! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448407 > > Loaded W/Inclusions ODESSA, IAB, 346 gram CS, Do Not Miss This One! > Museum Grade Slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286691003 > > SEYMCHAN Meteorite with Beautiful Etching, 67 gram, Really Nice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669080 > > BRENHAM, Siderite From Kansas, 15.65 gram, You got to see this part > slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286679720 > > Rare GLORIETA MOUNTAIN, Full Slice, 274 gram!, A complete Slice- > Holiday Special- You will not see this again! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669088 > > Rare NWA 2696, Howardite From Africa, 4.00g, A real nice part slice. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448428 > > Rare NWA 2932, Mesosiderite, Nice! 2.02 gram, Again, another nice > part slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448460 > > A very Rare EL3 From Africa, NWA 2965, 200g, THE BLUE TYPE! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448472 > > RARE, SILVERTON, Texas, H4, LTKW, 0.54 gram, Only A Few Left! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286452520 > > CANYON DIABLO Individual, 342 gram, Avery nice individual! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286452529 > > Seldom Available TULIA (b), Texas, L6, 0.51g, Nice slice. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665036 > > Seldom Available BRISCOE, Texas, L5, 4.56g, real nice. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665042 > > Classic GOLD BASIN, Arizona, L4, 52.79 gram, excellent individual! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665055 > > (NEW) NWA 4851, L6 With Shock Lines, 80.20g, I love this meteorite- > it is so cool! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665040 > > Rare NWA 2635, Metachondrite-Achondrite,1.33g, Very rare and I only > have a few! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665063 > > Rare Ureilite From Africa, NWA 2634, 1.21g, I only have a few of > these. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665068 > > (New) NWA 4734, Lunar Specimen Display! Good Deal! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669077 > > Very Rare and Beautiful, NWA 801, CR2, 4.20g, running low on this > one too! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286679754 > > Ungrouped Ataxite, DRONINO, Russia, 109.62g, nice complete slice. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286680835 > > Super Rare GEORGETOWN, Australia, 17.28 gram, This IS my very last > slice to auction out at 0.99 cents. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286711566 > > Amazing Lunar Highlands, NWA 5000, 0.184g, nice pieces! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721163 > > TULIA (a), Texas, H5, Complete Slice, 115.5g, Bigger than most Tulia > Specimens for Sale! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721170 > > Extremely Rare NAVAJO, Arizona, IIAB Iron! Only piece I have. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721157 > > A Beautiful Sikhote-Alin, IIAB Iron, 244g, This is a GREAT COMPLETE > SLICE! One of my last to offer! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286699668 > > JIDDAT AL HARASIS 003, Oman, L5, 3.63 gram, I only have a couple left. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286698869 > > (New) NWA 4881, Lunar Feldspathic Specimen, these are really nice > and big! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669093 > > A Classic, OZONA, Texas, H6 Chondrite, 36.64g, This is a nice big > slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286679745 > > (New) Martian Shergottite, NWA 4925, "Mars", these are nice too! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669097 > > Classic GOLD BASIN, Arizona, L4, 26.46 gram, must look at this slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286690992 > > An Early # NWA 103, L6 From Africa, 14.88g, you do not see this one > too often! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286698860 > > (NEW), LA LUZ, New Mexico, H4, LTKW, 13.17g, running low and when > these are gone that is it! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286691010 > > HERE ARE SOME SET PRICED AUCTIONS THAT ARE SWEET< SWEET DEALS! > > Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 64g, A sweet deal for someone! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287874445 > > Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 106g NICE! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287896502 > > MAIN MASS- NWA 2083, CO3, LTKW, 35.57g !!!!! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287895439 > > Loaded W/Inclusions ODESSA, IAB, 928 gram EC, DO NOT LET THIS ONE > PASS YOU UP! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287885971 > > > THANKS AND BEST WISHES > > MICHAEL COTTINGHAM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Mon Dec 15 15:11:23 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 12:11:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] NASA's Swift Looks to Comets for a Cool View Message-ID: <200812152011.MAA02945@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/swift/bursts/cool_comet.html NASA's Swift Looks to Comets for a Cool View 12.03.08 NASA's Swift Gamma-ray Explorer satellite rocketed into space in 2004 on a mission to study some of the highest-energy events in the universe. The spacecraft has detected more than 380 gamma-ray bursts, fleeting flares that likely signal the birth of a black hole in the distant universe. In that time, Swift also has observed 80 exploding stars and studied six comets. Comets? ... Comets are "dirty snowballs" made of frozen gases mixed with dust. X-rays come from superhot plasmas. What do cold comets have in common with exploding stars or the birth of black holes? "It was a big surprise in 1996 when the NASA-European ROSAT mission showed that comet Hyakutake was emitting X-rays," says Dennis Bodewits, a NASA Postdoctural Fellow at the Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, Md. "After that discovery, astronomers searched through ROSAT archives. It turns out that most comets emit X-rays when they come within about three times Earth's distance from the sun." Bodewits is working with the Swift team at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, Md., to study comets using data from the spacecraft's Ultraviolet/Optical Telescope (UVOT) and X-Ray Telescope (XRT). "Swift is an excellent platform for studying dynamic processes in comets," he says. Ultraviolet wavelengths let astronomers identify the chemical composition of the comet's atmosphere, observe the structure of dust emission, and identify the rotation of the comet's icy nucleus. X-rays reveal the structure of the comet's gas and the state of the solar wind, a stream of charged particles that flows from the sun at speeds upwards of 900,000 mph. The piece, known as fragment C, is believed to be the comet's main body, which began splintering in 1995. In 2006, astronomers counted 66 fragments. Telescopes -- including NASA's Hubble and Spitzer -- revealed dust and condensations trailing several pieces. But fragment C showed no unusual changes -- except to Swift's ultraviolet eye. "It's subtle, but Swift caught clouds of dust and perhaps small pieces that no one else was able to," Immler says. The UVOT also includes an ultraviolet grism, which combines a grating with a prism to separate incoming light by wavelength. "Swift's grism spans the wavelengths where carbon-bearing molecules and the hydroxyl molecule are most active. This gives us a unique view into the types and quantities of gas a comet produces, and that gives us clues about the origin of comets and the solar system," Bodewits explains. In fact, with the failure of the Hubble Space Telescope's ultraviolet spectrograph in 2004, Swift is currently the only space observatory covering this wavelength range. As a comet's surface warms near the sun, the ices turn to gas and form a tenuous atmosphere, or coma, measuring hundreds of thousands of miles across. The solar wind pushes this gas back to form a comet's glowing gas tail. X-ray emission is a side effect of this interaction. The X-rays arise through a process called charge exchange. Fast-moving ions in the solar wind snatch electrons from uncharged atoms in the comet's atmosphere. The solar-wind ions give off X-rays as the relocated electrons settle into their new home. Because the interaction occurs over such a broad region, the total power output of these emissions can reach one billion watts. Charge exchange may play important roles in any objects where hot, expanding gas collides with cooler gas. One example: Young stars interacting with the gas and planets that might surround them. Comets provide excellent laboratories to explore these interactions. When Comet 17P/Holmes underwent a surprising outburst in October 2007, Bodewits tasked both Swift and NASA's Chandra X-ray Observatory to observe it. "The comet was too bright to observe with the UVOT. We were afraid we'd damage the instrument," Bodewits says. "Despite this, we're still not sure whether we detected Holmes with the XRT or Chandra." At the time of the outburst, Holmes was about 19 degrees above the ecliptic, the plane in which the planets orbit the sun. At that elevation, the comet was probably experiencing a cooler, steadier flow from the solar wind. "The source of this cooler flow wasn't hot enough to produce the ions Holmes needed to make X-rays," Bodewits notes. Four years ago today, Swift captured its first x-rays. The radiation came from Cygnus X-1, one of sky's strongest sources at these energies. The system, located within our galaxy, contains a hot, blue-giant star orbited by a black hole. "Swift has operated two years longer than we had hoped," says Neil Gehrels, the mission's lead scientist at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center. "And while gamma-ray bursts and stellar explosions are the satellite's bread and butter, it's clear that Swift has a lot to contribute to other areas of astronomy." Francis Reddy NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center From Impactika at aol.com Mon Dec 15 16:35:22 2008 From: Impactika at aol.com (Impactika at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 16:35:22 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig, Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas Message-ID: Hello List-Members, I would like to send a few words of warning to anyone buying from Bob Evans: First on behalf of Dr A. Ehlmann, Curator of the Monnig Collection at TCU: He did only one trade with Bob and the pieces he gave in that trade are: 1. Beardsley, 36.7g fusion covered individual 2. Forest City, 3.7g fusion covered individual 3. Kendleton, 45.2g polished part end section with good fusion crust on back 4. Bruderheim, 20.0g block with one fusion side. 5. Mocs, 9g individual In that trade Dr. Ehlmann received a piece of Zulu Queen, Luotolax and Bialystok. And Bob represented that he had received the Zulu Queen it in a trade with UCLA. When asked UCLA responded: Impossible, they have never had any Zulu Queen in their collection. There was no serious response regarding the Bialystok and Luotolax. So where does that Zulu Queen come from? is it really Zulu Queen? How about Luotolax and Bialystok? Another list member bought a piece of another rare meteorite that was presented as being from TCU, and Dr. Ehlmann responded to that: Not true, TCU only has a tiny piece and had never traded out any of it. I will let that List-member speak for himself if he wishes to. In conclusion, Dr Ehlmann is not/will not do any more trade with Bob Evans. On my behalf: Bob, if you are planning to go to Tucson, you will not be welcomed in my room. And if you are planning on going to Michael Blood's auction, I will ask Michael to block you from bidding on any of the 40 pieces I have entered in that auction. I do not wish to sell anything to you. In conclusion, I have been a meteorite-dealer ten years (exactly ten years next week) and if there is one thing I have learned it is that Trust is absolutely paramount in the Meteorite World, and Bob, Trust is seriously lacking when dealing with you. Anne M. Black http://www.impactika.com/ IMPACTIKA at aol.com Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. _http://www.imca.cc/_ (http://www.imca.cc/) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- In a message dated 12/10/2008 2:06:42 PM Mountain Standard Time, bobe5531 at comcast.net writes: Well, After taking off several months of Dealing meteorites, I can stay away no longer. I have some very nice offerings available over the next few weeks. I was fortunate enough to purchase another small collection of meteorites with some very unique meteorites ( some I never heard of ). Most of these have Monnig and AML Cards accompanying the specimens. So you will not need to ask me where or who I got them from ( you will NOT get an answer ) I keep my methods of acquisitions and contacts confidential. Here is a partial list : Mckinney Texas La Lande N.M. Plainview Ness Co. Kansas Sandia Mountains N.M. Ladder Creek Adrian Texas Romero Texas Morland Kansas Noreatur Kansas **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From mlblood at cox.net Mon Dec 15 16:36:34 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 13:36:34 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] odds and ends In-Reply-To: <483006.32868.qm@web57802.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: on 12/15/08 11:10 AM, steve arnold at stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com wrote: > Good afternoon all.This will be my last post on the list until tucson. Oh, Come on now, Steve, Don't tease us. Michael Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From markig at westnet.com Mon Dec 15 16:45:09 2008 From: markig at westnet.com (Mark Grossman) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 16:45:09 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig, Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas References: Message-ID: <006d01c95efe$6705fe80$6501a8c0@QED> I had a similar situation with Bob involving a specimen of Mooresfort. I was told that he obtained the sample from a very reputable European dealer. When I contacted this individual, he told me he never had any specimens of Mooresfort. Mark Grossman ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 4:35 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig,Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas > Hello List-Members, > > I would like to send a few words of warning to anyone buying from Bob Evans: > > First on behalf of Dr A. Ehlmann, Curator of the Monnig Collection at TCU: > He did only one trade with Bob and the pieces he gave in that trade are: > > 1. Beardsley, 36.7g fusion covered individual > 2. Forest City, 3.7g fusion covered individual > 3. Kendleton, 45.2g polished part end section with good fusion crust on back > 4. Bruderheim, 20.0g block with one fusion side. > 5. Mocs, 9g individual > > In that trade Dr. Ehlmann received a piece of Zulu Queen, Luotolax and > Bialystok. And Bob represented that he had received the Zulu Queen it in a trade > with UCLA. When asked UCLA responded: Impossible, they have never had any Zulu > Queen in their collection. > There was no serious response regarding the Bialystok and Luotolax. So where > does that Zulu Queen come from? is it really Zulu Queen? How about Luotolax > and Bialystok? > Another list member bought a piece of another rare meteorite that was > presented as being from TCU, and Dr. Ehlmann responded to that: Not true, TCU only > has a tiny piece and had never traded out any of it. I will let that > List-member speak for himself if he wishes to. > In conclusion, Dr Ehlmann is not/will not do any more trade with Bob Evans. > > On my behalf: > Bob, if you are planning to go to Tucson, you will not be welcomed in my room. > And if you are planning on going to Michael Blood's auction, I will ask > Michael to block you from bidding on any of the 40 pieces I have entered in that > auction. I do not wish to sell anything to you. > > In conclusion, I have been a meteorite-dealer ten years (exactly ten years > next week) and if there is one thing I have learned it is that Trust is > absolutely paramount in the Meteorite World, and Bob, Trust is seriously lacking when > dealing with you. > > Anne M. Black > http://www.impactika.com/ > IMPACTIKA at aol.com > Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. > _http://www.imca.cc/_ (http://www.imca.cc/) > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > In a message dated 12/10/2008 2:06:42 PM Mountain Standard Time, > bobe5531 at comcast.net writes: > Well, > After taking off several months of Dealing meteorites, I can stay away no > longer. > I have some very nice offerings available over the next few weeks. > > I was fortunate enough to purchase another small collection of meteorites > with some very unique meteorites ( some I never heard of ). > Most of these have Monnig and AML Cards accompanying the specimens. So you > will not need to ask me where or who I got them from ( you will NOT get an > answer ) I keep my methods of acquisitions and contacts confidential. > > Here is a partial list : > > Mckinney Texas > La Lande N.M. > Plainview > Ness Co. Kansas > Sandia Mountains N.M. > Ladder Creek > Adrian Texas > Romero Texas > Morland Kansas > Noreatur Kansas > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000 010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From psc2410xi at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 16:47:05 2008 From: psc2410xi at yahoo.com (Don Rawlings) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 13:47:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig, Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <959798.98527.qm@web59316.mail.re1.yahoo.com> I doubt that it would be legal to exclude anyone from bidding on your items in a public auction. I guess we will see how that one works out soon enough. Don Rawlings --- On Mon, 12/15/08, Impactika at aol.com wrote: > From: Impactika at aol.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig, Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas > To: bobe5531 at comcast.net, meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Monday, December 15, 2008, 4:35 PM > Hello List-Members, > > > > On my behalf: > Bob, if you are planning to go to Tucson, you will not be > welcomed in my room. > And if you are planning on going to Michael Blood's > auction, I will ask > Michael to block you from bidding on any of the 40 pieces I > have entered in that > auction. I do not wish to sell anything to you. > From cynapse at charter.net Mon Dec 15 16:51:17 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 16:51:17 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA not a knight in shining armour ! In-Reply-To: <3F4AF238-0183-4CAD-B7C8-D7B648BE6020@notkin.net> References: <3F4AF238-0183-4CAD-B7C8-D7B648BE6020@notkin.net> Message-ID: <29kdk4tlv6ghfip2dmsqu4uqkn4o3rqb6o@4ax.com> On Mon, 15 Dec 2008 11:18:56 -0700, you wrote: >It's easy to sit behind a keyboard and point fingers. Not if you are trying to type at the same time. From majbaermann at web.de Mon Dec 15 17:10:16 2008 From: majbaermann at web.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Matthias_B=E4rmann?=) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 23:10:16 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig, Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas References: Message-ID: Hello Anne, To change the main subject of this thread for a moment: >>> You wrote: "In conclusion, I have been a meteorite-dealer ten years >>> (exactly ten years >>> next week) ... " Well, Anne, I congratulate you on your 10 years annEversary of meteorite-dealing! My best, Matthias Baermann ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 10:35 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig,Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas > Hello List-Members, > > I would like to send a few words of warning to anyone buying from Bob > Evans: > > First on behalf of Dr A. Ehlmann, Curator of the Monnig Collection at TCU: > He did only one trade with Bob and the pieces he gave in that trade are: > > 1. Beardsley, 36.7g fusion covered individual > 2. Forest City, 3.7g fusion covered individual > 3. Kendleton, 45.2g polished part end section with good fusion crust on > back > 4. Bruderheim, 20.0g block with one fusion side. > 5. Mocs, 9g individual > > In that trade Dr. Ehlmann received a piece of Zulu Queen, Luotolax and > Bialystok. And Bob represented that he had received the Zulu Queen it in a > trade > with UCLA. When asked UCLA responded: Impossible, they have never had any > Zulu > Queen in their collection. > There was no serious response regarding the Bialystok and Luotolax. So > where > does that Zulu Queen come from? is it really Zulu Queen? How about > Luotolax > and Bialystok? > Another list member bought a piece of another rare meteorite that was > presented as being from TCU, and Dr. Ehlmann responded to that: Not true, > TCU only > has a tiny piece and had never traded out any of it. I will let that > List-member speak for himself if he wishes to. > In conclusion, Dr Ehlmann is not/will not do any more trade with Bob > Evans. > > On my behalf: > Bob, if you are planning to go to Tucson, you will not be welcomed in my > room. > And if you are planning on going to Michael Blood's auction, I will ask > Michael to block you from bidding on any of the 40 pieces I have entered > in that > auction. I do not wish to sell anything to you. > > In conclusion, I have been a meteorite-dealer ten years (exactly ten years > next week) and if there is one thing I have learned it is that Trust is > absolutely paramount in the Meteorite World, and Bob, Trust is seriously > lacking when > dealing with you. > > Anne M. Black > http://www.impactika.com/ > IMPACTIKA at aol.com > Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. > _http://www.imca.cc/_ (http://www.imca.cc/) > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > In a message dated 12/10/2008 2:06:42 PM Mountain Standard Time, > bobe5531 at comcast.net writes: > Well, > After taking off several months of Dealing meteorites, I can stay away no > longer. > I have some very nice offerings available over the next few weeks. > > I was fortunate enough to purchase another small collection of meteorites > with some very unique meteorites ( some I never heard of ). > Most of these have Monnig and AML Cards accompanying the specimens. So you > will not need to ask me where or who I got them from ( you will NOT get an > answer ) I keep my methods of acquisitions and contacts confidential. > > Here is a partial list : > > Mckinney Texas > La Lande N.M. > Plainview > Ness Co. Kansas > Sandia Mountains N.M. > Ladder Creek > Adrian Texas > Romero Texas > Morland Kansas > Noreatur Kansas > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Mon Dec 15 18:27:54 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 15:27:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Phoenix Site on Mars May be in Dry Climate Cycle Phase Message-ID: <200812152327.PAA13044@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.cfm?release=2008-236 Phoenix Site on Mars May be in Dry Climate Cycle Phase Jet Propulsion Laboratory December 15, 2008 PASADENA, Calif. -- The Martian arctic soil that NASA's Phoenix Mars Lander dug into this year is very cold and very dry. However, when long-term climate cycles make the site warmer, the soil may get moist enough to modify the chemistry, producing effects that persist through the colder times. Phoenix found clues increasing scientists' confidence in predictive models about water vapor moving through the soil between the atmosphere and subsurface water-ice. The models predict the vapor flow can wet the soil when the tilt of Mars' axis, the obliquity, is greater than it is now. The robot worked on Mars for three months of prime mission, plus two months of overtime, after landing on May 25. The Phoenix science team will be analyzing data and running comparison experiments for months to come. With some key questions still open, team members at a meeting of the American Geophysical Union today reported on their progress. "We have snowfall from the clouds and frost at the surface, with ice just a few inches below, and dry soil in between," said Phoenix Principal Investigator Peter Smith of the University of Arizona, Tucson. "During a warmer climate several million years ago, the ice would have been deeper, but frost on the surface could have melted and wet the soil." With no large moon like Earth's to stabilize it, Mars goes through known periodic cycles when its tilt becomes much greater than Earth's. During those high-tilt periods, the sun rises higher in the sky above the Martian poles than it does now, and the arctic plain where Phoenix worked experiences warmer summers. "The ice under the soil around Phoenix is not a sealed-off deposit left from some ancient ocean," said Ray Arvidson of Washington University in St. Louis, lead scientist for the lander's robotic arm. "It is in equilibrium with the environment, and the environment changes with the obliquity cycles on scales from hundreds of thousands of years to a few million years. There have probably been dozens of times in the past 10 million years when thin films of water were active in the soil, and probably there will be dozens more times in the next 10 million years." Cloddy texture of soil scooped up by Phoenix is one clue to effects of water. The mission's microscopic examination of the soil shows individual particles characteristic of windblown dust and sand, but clods of the soil hold together more cohesively than expected for unaltered dust and sand. Arvidson said, "It's not strongly cemented. It would break up in your hand, but the cloddiness tells us that something is taking the windblown material and mildly cementing it." That cementing effect could result from water molecules adhering to the surfaces of soil particles. Or it could be from water mobilizing and redepositing salts that Phoenix identified in the soil, such as magnesium perchlorate and calcium carbonate. The Thermal and Electrical Conductivity Probe on Phoenix detected electrical-property changes consistent with accumulation of water molecules on surfaces of soil grains during daily cycles of water vapor moving through the soil, reported Aaron Zent of NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, Calif., lead scientist for that probe. "There's exchange between the atmosphere and the subsurface ice," Zent said. "A film of water molecules accumulates on the surfaces of mineral particles. It's not enough right now to transform the chemistry, but the measurements are providing verification that these molecular films are occurring when you would expect them to, and this gives us more confidence in predicting the way they would behave in other parts of the obliquity cycles." The Phoenix mission is led by Smith at the University of Arizona with project management at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif., and development partnership at Lockheed Martin, Denver. International contributions come from the Canadian Space Agency; the University of Neuchatel, Switzerland; the universities of Copenhagen and Aarhus, Denmark; Max Planck Institute, Germany; and the Finnish Meteorological Institute; and Imperial College, London. For more about Phoenix, visit: http://www.nasa.gov/phoenix . Guy Webster 818-354-6278 Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. guy.webster at jpl.nasa.gov Rachel Prucey 650-604-0643 NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, Calif. rachel.l.prucey at nasa.gov Lori Stiles 520-626-4402 University of Arizona, Tucson lstiles at u.arizona.edu 2008-236 From Metorman46 at aol.com Mon Dec 15 18:28:37 2008 From: Metorman46 at aol.com (Metorman46 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 18:28:37 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA? Message-ID: List; I for one fully support the IMCA and their methods of projecting integrity and honesty into the collecting,sales and study of meteorites for the meteorite community.It isn't a heavy handed approach but a reasoned and fair method of TRYING to solve some of the problems that arise in the meteorite community.Such a method only works if the whole organization of INDIVIDUALS supports such methods.And i believe we do.Being selective with new members and requiring sponsors in my opinion adds the air of integritry to new members.And having a logo to apply to sales and communications documents helps keep most meteoriteophiles honest.We police our own selfs,in reality and these methods help us do just that.TO THINE OWN SELF BE TRUE! Best Regards;Herman Archer IMCA 2770 **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 19:07:49 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 16:07:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Best Easel for small Riker boxes? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <8304.68296.qm@web58405.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi folks! Is there a preferred easel to prop up and display small 3x4" Riker boxes? I am building up a large number of them and I want some way to display them on a shelf. I have tried those little clear plastic easels used for coins and poker chips, but they are not really "deep" enough and the Riker box tends to slide off with the slightest disturbance. (with cats running around the house, this isn't going to work) What about those little wire-frame easels sold by MigaCorp? Do those work well with Rikers? A while back, I recall another list member asked the list about a solution for storing/displaying large numbers of Riker boxes. I don't recall him getting an answer. Does anyone know of a stepped display system that will hold a couple of dozen small Rikers? Thanks in advance! MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From tett at rogers.com Mon Dec 15 19:26:50 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 19:26:50 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Best Easel for small Riker boxes? In-Reply-To: <8304.68296.qm@web58405.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <8304.68296.qm@web58405.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4946F5CA.7060308@rogers.com> Michael, Check out August 2008 Meteorite Mag.. "Hall of Meteorites". Anita Westlake has a nice (and easy) wall mount solution for her Riker boxes. If you need a portable solution then probably your best bet is some type of custom wood frame to hold a bunch. Cheers! Mike Tettenborn Michael Gilmer wrote: > Hi folks! > > Is there a preferred easel to prop up and display small 3x4" Riker boxes? > > I am building up a large number of them and I want some way to display > them on a shelf. I have tried those little clear plastic easels used > for coins and poker chips, but they are not really "deep" enough > and the Riker box tends to slide off with the slightest disturbance. > (with cats running around the house, this isn't going to work) > > What about those little wire-frame easels sold by MigaCorp? Do those > work well with Rikers? > > A while back, I recall another list member asked the list about a > solution for storing/displaying large numbers of Riker boxes. I > don't recall him getting an answer. Does anyone know of a stepped > display system that will hold a couple of dozen small Rikers? > > Thanks in advance! > > MikeG > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From meteoritefinder at gmail.com Mon Dec 15 20:10:55 2008 From: meteoritefinder at gmail.com (Mike Miller) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 18:10:55 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Lowest prices of the year! Free world wide shipping! Buy it now is at the lowest price (sale/ad) Over $8500 in great deals! Message-ID: <468bf6050812151710v9624607xf6a29bc558d40f84@mail.gmail.com> Hello all I have not sold a single thing on E bay in more than a month, that means I either have to find a job or have a real sale. Jobs are a little tough to find right now so I decided to have a sale. I looked at the prices and took them as low as I could go then I threw in FREE SHIPPING ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD! All my sale items have the buy it now option at the LOWEST price so you don't have to wait a week to see if your low bid holds up. All you have to do is be the first one to use the buy it now and you get the lowest price right then! I have more than $8500 in great meteorites up for grabs even at these reduced prices! Old Santa might even want a couple of these great pieces in his stocking. You will not see these pieces at lower prices ever again, so if you have been looking you had better not wait any longer. Here is a link to my buy it now at the lowest price of the year auctions http://www.meteoritefinder.com/meteorite-auctions.htm -- Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr. Kingman Az 86401 www.meteoritefinder.com 928-753-6825 From carloselguapo1 at hotmail.com Mon Dec 15 20:15:11 2008 From: carloselguapo1 at hotmail.com (Carl 's) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 17:15:11 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA Message-ID: Hello All, I've been mulling over what everyone has been saying about Bob Evans lately and I know this isn't the first thread about him. Anyway, I'm kinda sticking my neck way out. I've been collecting meteorites for only a year and a half, but when I first started out I had contemplated purchasing one of those nantans from a Chinese source on eBay. The ones that look like iron potatoes. It so happened that Bob E. also ran several eBay auctions warning against those nantans but also directed newbies to this list, the IMCA and the Meteorwrong website. Websites I had no idea existed. I thought that was pretty cool of him to do that. I also remember there was one other member doing the same. Anyway, I've never bought anything from Bob E. but I did contact him just once to thank him for the info. I'm not saying he's a saint or an angel but that's my take on all this. I'm delighted the IMCA exists and always make a note of it whenever I make a purchase, though I've bought a lot of stuff from dealers without it. For what it's worth, I hope everything turns out well for everone concerned. Carl _________________________________________________________________ Send e-mail anywhere. No map, no compass. http://windowslive.com/Explore/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_anywhere_122008 From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 20:45:14 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 17:45:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE Message-ID: <653761.5696.qm@web110611.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Please, I am overwhelmed with NON meteorite-list emails. While the discussion is perfect, I am not interested in IMCA problems. Michael Farmer From mlblood at cox.net Mon Dec 15 21:36:12 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 18:36:12 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Best Easel for small Riker boxes? In-Reply-To: <8304.68296.qm@web58405.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Michael, See the previous METEORITE Magazine - article by Dave Gheesling On the GA Meteorite club - it has a photo of Anita Westlake's fabulous Display in her hallway. It is exactly what you are talking about and I have seen it in person and it knocks your socks off. It should be relatively simple to make. I am sure if you contacted Anita she would Give you any pointers she learned in the process. She is extremely Friendly and generous with her time - a real Southern Belle in the Best sense of the term. Best wishes, Michael on 12/15/08 4:07 PM, Michael Gilmer at michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com wrote: > Hi folks! > > Is there a preferred easel to prop up and display small 3x4" Riker boxes? > > I am building up a large number of them and I want some way to display > them on a shelf. I have tried those little clear plastic easels used > for coins and poker chips, but they are not really "deep" enough > and the Riker box tends to slide off with the slightest disturbance. > (with cats running around the house, this isn't going to work) > > What about those little wire-frame easels sold by MigaCorp? Do those > work well with Rikers? > > A while back, I recall another list member asked the list about a > solution for storing/displaying large numbers of Riker boxes. I > don't recall him getting an answer. Does anyone know of a stepped > display system that will hold a couple of dozen small Rikers? > > Thanks in advance! > > MikeG > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From mlblood at cox.net Mon Dec 15 21:45:33 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 18:45:33 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Question In-Reply-To: <653761.5696.qm@web110611.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: While this is not directly related to meteorites it IS applicable: Is anyone on the list thechno-savvy (ie enough Of a computer "geek") to know how to "Foreword" an Email that has attachments and INCLUDE the Attachments in the foreword??? Occasionally I want to do this, but have had to Download all attachments to my desktop and then Upload them individually to the email I am going To send. It would be SO much easier to just hit "Foreword" and include all the attachments..... So, is there a way to do that? You can post to The list as I am sure most members would love to Have this ability if it exists. Thanks, Michael Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 22:13:45 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 19:13:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE In-Reply-To: <653761.5696.qm@web110611.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <119555.58399.qm@web45603.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> But this is a list for discussion of meteorite related things and the IMCA is meteorite related. In my opinion, this has been a good discussion and is more welcomed then the normal ads that I am flooded with from here. I welcome the non ad based meteorite related posts and wish the owner of this list would start up one for ads so this list could be free of them - Im sure many others would agree. Ive said it before and I will say it again, I signed up to this list for meteorite related information and discussion and I from what I have seen, this list is used as more of a means of advertisement then anything else... This isnt anything against you Mike, the meteorites I have gotten from you are some of the nicer samples in my collection, this is just my thoughts on the subject and I hope you dont get offended. Greg --- On Mon, 12/15/08, Michael Farmer wrote: > From: Michael Farmer > Subject: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Monday, December 15, 2008, 8:45 PM > Please, > I am overwhelmed with NON meteorite-list emails. > While the discussion is perfect, I am not interested in > IMCA problems. > Michael Farmer > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From dave at fallingrocks.com Mon Dec 15 22:21:36 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 22:21:36 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Best Easel for small Riker boxes? In-Reply-To: References: <8304.68296.qm@web58405.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Michael x 2, Anita's article you're referring to was back in the August 2008 Meteorite issue, and I recall that she had a bit of a diagram in her article with measurements, pointers from the construction learning curve and the like. Very cool exhibit, indeed. The Meteorite Association of Georgia article was in the November 2008 issue. All best, Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Michael L Blood Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 9:36 PM To: Michael Gilmer IMCA candidate; Meteorite List Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Best Easel for small Riker boxes? Hi Michael, See the previous METEORITE Magazine - article by Dave Gheesling On the GA Meteorite club - it has a photo of Anita Westlake's fabulous Display in her hallway. It is exactly what you are talking about and I have seen it in person and it knocks your socks off. It should be relatively simple to make. I am sure if you contacted Anita she would Give you any pointers she learned in the process. She is extremely Friendly and generous with her time - a real Southern Belle in the Best sense of the term. Best wishes, Michael on 12/15/08 4:07 PM, Michael Gilmer at michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com wrote: > Hi folks! > > Is there a preferred easel to prop up and display small 3x4" Riker boxes? > > I am building up a large number of them and I want some way to display > them on a shelf. I have tried those little clear plastic easels used > for coins and poker chips, but they are not really "deep" enough and > the Riker box tends to slide off with the slightest disturbance. > (with cats running around the house, this isn't going to work) > > What about those little wire-frame easels sold by MigaCorp? Do those > work well with Rikers? > > A while back, I recall another list member asked the list about a > solution for storing/displaying large numbers of Riker boxes. I don't > recall him getting an answer. Does anyone know of a stepped display > system that will hold a couple of dozen small Rikers? > > Thanks in advance! > > MikeG > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and > http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - > http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From sterling_k_webb at sbcglobal.net Mon Dec 15 22:49:58 2008 From: sterling_k_webb at sbcglobal.net (Sterling K. Webb) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 21:49:58 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Question References: Message-ID: <004b01c95f31$5ee9b2e0$ff4ee146@ATARIENGINE> Hi, Michael, First, save the attached file to a handy HD somewhere. Then, create the "Forward" copy. Then Attach the saved attachment to the copy to be forwarded. Send it. Sterling K. Webb ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael L Blood" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 8:45 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Question While this is not directly related to meteorites it IS applicable: Is anyone on the list thechno-savvy (ie enough Of a computer "geek") to know how to "Foreword" an Email that has attachments and INCLUDE the Attachments in the foreword??? Occasionally I want to do this, but have had to Download all attachments to my desktop and then Upload them individually to the email I am going To send. It would be SO much easier to just hit "Foreword" and include all the attachments..... So, is there a way to do that? You can post to The list as I am sure most members would love to Have this ability if it exists. Thanks, Michael Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Mon Dec 15 22:51:31 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 19:51:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE In-Reply-To: <119555.58399.qm@web45603.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <155329.27173.qm@web110615.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Greg, I stand corrected. As I read through them, they are not actually IMCA business, but meteorite related affairs, and I agree, they are relevant. I am just leaving Tokyo to go home for all of two days, then off to the arctic to enjoy some 30 below weather for a white Christmass. Tucson is on the way, barely one month to go, so get ready everyone! Happy holidays and may some more meteorites fall before 2008 ends. Michael Farmer NON-IMCA dealer for more than 10 years, for my own personal reasons. IMCA is great concept, but I will be free to speak my mind for another 10 years. --- On Mon, 12/15/08, Greg Catterton wrote: > From: Greg Catterton > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Monday, December 15, 2008, 8:13 PM > But this is a list for discussion of meteorite related > things and the IMCA is meteorite related. In my opinion, > this has been a good discussion and is more welcomed then > the normal ads that I am flooded with from here. > I welcome the non ad based meteorite related posts and wish > the owner of this list would start up one for ads so this > list could be free of them - Im sure many others would > agree. > > Ive said it before and I will say it again, I signed up to > this list for meteorite related information and discussion > and I from what I have seen, this list is used as more of a > means of advertisement then anything else... > > This isnt anything against you Mike, the meteorites I have > gotten from you are some of the nicer samples in my > collection, this is just my thoughts on the subject and I > hope you dont get offended. > > Greg > > > > > --- On Mon, 12/15/08, Michael Farmer > wrote: > > > From: Michael Farmer > > Subject: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. > TAKE IT ELSEWHERE > > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Monday, December 15, 2008, 8:45 PM > > Please, > > I am overwhelmed with NON meteorite-list emails. > > While the discussion is perfect, I am not interested > in > > IMCA problems. > > Michael Farmer > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From pshugar at clearwire.net Mon Dec 15 23:35:57 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 22:35:57 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig, Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas References: <959798.98527.qm@web59316.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <004801c95f37$cbefa510$d0e11960@laptop> What about the signs in a lot of store windows that say: "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" Pete IMCA 1733 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Rawlings" To: Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 3:47 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig,Aml and other goodies just in time for xmas >I doubt that it would be legal to exclude anyone from bidding on your items >in a public auction. I guess we will see how that one works out soon >enough. > > Don Rawlings > > > --- On Mon, 12/15/08, Impactika at aol.com wrote: > >> From: Impactika at aol.com >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad- Monnig, Aml and other goodies just in >> time for xmas >> To: bobe5531 at comcast.net, meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> Date: Monday, December 15, 2008, 4:35 PM >> Hello List-Members, >> >> > >> On my behalf: >> Bob, if you are planning to go to Tucson, you will not be >> welcomed in my room. >> And if you are planning on going to Michael Blood's >> auction, I will ask >> Michael to block you from bidding on any of the 40 pieces I >> have entered in that >> auction. I do not wish to sell anything to you. >> > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From m42protosun at aol.com Tue Dec 16 01:14:00 2008 From: m42protosun at aol.com (m42protosun at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 01:14:00 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE In-Reply-To: <119555.58399.qm@web45603.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CB2D5C9F4E5AC4-FF8-1EF8@webmail-de08.sysops.aol.com> Greg and List, I agree. Many dealers udse this list as advertisment. In my mind too this is not the sense of such a list. Uwe (spell ew ve) -----Urspr?ngliche Mitteilung----- Von: Greg Catterton An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Verschickt: Di., 16. Dez. 2008, 4:13 Thema: Re: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE But this is a list for discussion of meteorite related things and the IMCA is meteorite related. In my opinion, this has been a good discussion and is more welcomed then the normal ads that I am flooded with from here. I welcome the non ad based meteorite related posts and wish the owner of this list would start up one for ads so this list could be free of them - Im sure many others would agree. Ive said it before and I will say it again, I signed up to this list for meteorite related information and discussion and I from what I have seen, this list is used as more of a means of advertisement then anything else... This isnt anything against you Mike, the meteorites I have gotten from you are some of the nicer samples in my collection, this is just my thoughts on the subject and I hope you dont get offended. Greg --- On Mon, 12/15/08, Michael Farmer wrote: > From: Michael Farmer > Subject: [meteorite-list] THIS IS=2 0NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Monday, December 15, 2008, 8:45 PM > Please, > I am overwhelmed with NON meteorite-list emails. > While the discussion is perfect, I am not interested in > IMCA problems. > Michael Farmer > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ________________________________________________________________________ AOL eMail auf Ihrem Handy! Ab sofort k?nnen Sie auch unterwegs Ihre AOL email abrufen. Registrieren Sie sich jetzt kostenlos. From paul at meteorite.com Tue Dec 16 02:29:59 2008 From: paul at meteorite.com (Paul Harris) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 23:29:59 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hunt Invitation by Ruben Garcia Message-ID: <494758F7.4030301@meteorite.com> Dear List, The following message is from Ruben who was unable to post to the list. Open Invitation to Hunt Meteorites In Holbrook Hi all, A few friends and myself are going to be hunting meteorites in Holbrook on Dec 27-28. Timing may be bad as these dates are obviously between Xmas and New Years. However, we'd like to invite anyone who'd like to learn the ins and outs of hunting meteorites in this famous strewnfield to join us. The more the merrier, very informal, no experience necessary.. Come meet us out there and lets hopefully find a few space rocks! Email me off list if you need directions or just want to say you're coming. my email is: Meteoritemall at yahoo.com Ruben Garcia Phoenix, Arizona From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Tue Dec 16 03:07:49 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 00:07:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: One cent ebay sale ending tonight Message-ID: <785862.31793.qm@web110615.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> http://www.meteorite.com/farmer/ Hi everyone, it has been months since I have sold much on ebay, due to constant meteorite expeditions and show trips. I am at Narita Airport in Tokyo right now, returning to Tucson for all of a couple of days. Please see the auctions at the link above, more than 30 items, all started at one cent. I expect to be up and running again shortly with some huge ebay sales soon. Michael Farmer From gmhupe at htn.net Tue Dec 16 06:42:34 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 06:42:34 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Lunar, Angrite, Lodranite, etc. - AD Message-ID: <4A90335AEA1C4933BDDB825E0C3BA4A5@Gregor> Dear List Members, I listed on eBay a nice selection of rarities, all started at just 99 cents, under my seller name, NaturesVault. Check them out here: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault There are: Angrite Granulitic Lunar Brecciated Lodranite Ungrouped (Paired to NWA 011) Aubrite Complete Martian Fresh Falls Berduc Meteorite Newspaper These are sure to go for excellent prices, so be sure to check them out if you are looking for a special collection piece. Thank you for bidding! Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault From almitt at kconline.com Tue Dec 16 07:03:48 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 07:03:48 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE In-Reply-To: <8CB2D5C9F4E5AC4-FF8-1EF8@webmail-de08.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CB2D5C9F4E5AC4-FF8-1EF8@webmail-de08.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Hi Greg, Uwe and other newer list members, In the beginning when the list first started, Art didn't want or wouldn't tolerate ads on the list. Then there was a great outcry to allow announcements of new items and occasional ads. Art asked for input on how the majority of the list felt about ads and after consideration and after being bombard by requests to allow it (to the point of being nagged) He consented to allow ads on occasion. With the number of meteorite dealers growing and compounding there was a time where there were so many ads that it was hard to pick the meat out from the fat of the ads. People began to complain and Art requested that only one ad be put on the list per week but allowed for something truly exceptional or unique to be announced on the list. If you think about how many meteorite dealers there are these days, if each one put an ad here each week, it would be pretty much wall to wall ads with some meteorite discussion in between. Since the list states that ads are allowed but no major advertising, use a link instead, most members adhere to this policy. Also the word Ad is to appear in the subject line when listing items for sell on the list so members who are not wanting to read ads can move on. I agree that it would be useful to have two areas, one for pure discussion and one for ads so list members could select the area that they want to view. You can however set up your filter to move ads into a folder and then read them later or delete. All my best! --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 1:14 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE Greg and List, I agree. Many dealers udse this list as advertisment. In my mind too this is not the sense of such a list. Uwe (spell ew ve) -----Urspr?ngliche Mitteilung----- Von: Greg Catterton An: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Verschickt: Di., 16. Dez. 2008, 4:13 Thema: Re: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE In my opinion, this has been a good discussion and is more welcomed then the normal ads that I am flooded with from here. I welcome the non ad based meteorite related posts and wish the owner of this list would start up one for ads so this list could be free of them - Im sure many others would agree. Ive said it before and I will say it again, I signed up to this list for meteorite related information and discussion and I from what I have seen, this list is used as more of a means of advertisement then anything else... Greg From michael at spacerocksinc.com Tue Dec 16 07:22:50 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 04:22:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 16, 2008 Message-ID: <5908808.3083661229430170068.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_16_2008.html From epgrondine at yahoo.com Tue Dec 16 08:23:08 2008 From: epgrondine at yahoo.com (E.P. Grondine) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 05:23:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Towards one Holocene Start Impact epicenter Message-ID: <479833.35134.qm@web36904.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi all - An inch thick layer of impact products near Sandusky, Ohio: http://www.theprogressortimes.com/news/articles.asp?articleID=10335 Did extraterrestrial event alter the course of history? BY DAN REINHART For years Sheriden Cave, west of Carey, has been recognized as one of the foremost archaeological sites in the Americas, if not the world. At the cave scientists have unearthed extinct animal species and artifacts that have been undisturbed since the last ice age. Recently, however, excavations by Dr. Ken Tankersley, an archaeologist from the University of Cincinnati, have uncovered evidence that indicate an extraterrestrial event some 13,000 years ago may have permanently altered the course of history in the Americas and possibly the whole world. As a result the cave will be featured in several upcoming documentaries on the Discovery Channel and the History Channel. "The most interesting county." "Wyandot County is the most interesting county in Ohio," Tankersley told a group gathered at Woody's restaurant in Upper Sandusky Dec. 4. Tankersley was the guest speaker at the "First Citizens Presents" breakfast and he has appeared in documentaries on a host of television channels including PBS, Discovery, National Geographic, Animal Planet and others. He also worked on a film with the late Steve Irwin. Tankersley said that besides being shaped in a square because it was the last Indian reservation in the State of Ohio, Wyandot County also contains, at Sheriden Cave, a "complete, uninterrupted archaeological sequence spanning the 13,000 years since the last ice age." Tankersley said he first became interested in the area in the early 1990s. He was in New York at the time and a friend who was doing some work at Sheriden Cave told him that excavations there had uncovered fossils from a number of extinct species ? including the short-faced bear ? that previously had never been found in the State of Ohio. National attention. Excavation at the cave also uncovered a flaked stone artifact that was dated back some 13,000 years to an ancient people known as the Clovis culture. Tankersley said that although there are other Clovis sites in the world, Sheriden Cave is the only site where animal fossils can be found right alongside the flaked stone tools ancient people of the same time period made. For that reason Sheriden Cave became a major archaeological discovery. Tankersley said he originally became involved in Sheriden Cave excavations because remnants of an ancient peccary had been found there. He came to look at the site and after finding a number of artifacts he wrote to the National Science Foundation who, with the help of the Hendricks family, who own the cave, agreed to sponsor an excavation there in 1996. Tankersley eventually found a number of bones that had been carved into tools and a fluted Clovis point among the remains of various extinct animals. He noted that some of the ancient bones found in Sheriden Cave are fresher than you might find on a modern road-kill. "It's absolutely incredible," he said. "They're abundant and very well preserved." The Black Mat. As the excavations continued workers began to uncover a lot of burnt bones. Tankersley said that at first no one paid very much attention to them but eventually questions were raised about how the bones got burned. He said it was obvious that if primitive man had cooked an animal so much that the bones were burned, no one would have wanted to eat the meat. They concluded that the primitive people must have thrown the bones in the fire after they were done eating. But there was no evidence of hearths in the cave. "Why were these animal bones so severely burned?" Tankersley asked. As excavators searched for an answer to the burnt bones they began to notice an inch-thick layer of earth in the sediment throughout the cave that was black. Scientists were able to obtain 30 radiocarbon dates that indicated the layer of burned material, or "Black Mat," was about 13,000 years old. It dated to about the same time period that Clovis man and many of the mega-beasts disappeared. (The radiocarbon dates have made Sheriden Cave one of only 12 securely dated Clovis sites in the world.) A new theory takes shape. With the help of a man named Alan West, Tankersley found that Black Mat layers have been discovered in other late Ice Age sites across the country from the Carolinas to Texas and even into Canada. In each instance the Black Mat of burnt material dates back to the same time period. Furthermore, the Black Mats contain an abundance of micrometeorites. Tankersley said that soil from the Black Mat in Sheriden Cave contains so many magnetic, microscopic meteorites that he can wave a child's magnet across samples of the soil and cover the magnet with them. Tankersley took the Black Mat material to the University of Cincinnati and magnified it 10,000 times through an electron microscope. He found it was also filled with microscopic "detonation diamonds." He said the majority of the (microscopic) diamonds in the Black Mat are extraterrestrial. Tankersley pointed out that when asteroids and meteorites explode over the earth they create diamonds. He says the ones at Sheriden Cave are either directly from objects from outer space or they are the result of a major explosion over the earth ? like a comet exploding over organic material that compressed it and made diamonds. Tankersley said it is increasingly likely that an asteroid or meteor is the reason for the disappearance of the Clovis people and the mega-beasts 13,000 years ago. Tankersley said the evidence indicates that the catastrophic event may not have wiped out Clovis man and the mega mammals completely, but life definitely changed and creatures that survived the event had to find a way to exist in a changed environment. For example, there wasn't a lot of food around and since the mega mammals required a lot of food to survive, they had to adapt or die. He said some of the mega mammals became smaller. Although evidence indicates that an asteroid created the Black Mat, no one has ever found a crater to prove where the event originated. Some scientists believe that Hudson Bay may actually be the crater. 13,000 years later. Tankersley said that the implications for us in the 21st century are sobering in that the impact of another history-altering asteroid with earth is not a question of "if" it will happen, but "when" it's going to happen next. Tankersley said that some of the people from Wyandot County who made his work at Sheriden Cave possible include Keith Hendricks and his father Richard, Kate Orians who wrote a number of stories about Tankersley and his work for The Progressor-Times and Dale Stansbery of the Ohio Archaeological Council. Tankersley also noted that the latest discoveries made at Sheriden Cave will be featured in a film on the Discovery Channel in December and another film on the History Channel this spring." Looks like I'll be making a sales call soon. Good hunting, E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas (contact me off list for special prices on signed copies) From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Tue Dec 16 09:23:06 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 15:23:06 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Advertisements (wasTHIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE) In-Reply-To: References: <8CB2D5C9F4E5AC4-FF8-1EF8@webmail-de08.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <002601c95f89$d1712020$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Hi Uwe et al. The beef of meteoritics as science and as hobby are the stones. For more than 200 years meteorite studies and meteorite collecting is based on private initiatives, collectors, hunters and dealers bringing up new stones and irons. Therefore the introducing of new finds and new meteorites or already known, but rare or remarkable specimens, is a natural part of this list and that this happens with a more or less commercial background is natural too, because it is neither a solely academic, neither a sole collector's list, but THE universal forum for meteorites. Note, that on the list many of the most interesting and scientifically most important meteorites, desert finds, new main masses, new falls of the last decade had their premiere on this list here, where you are sitting in the first row! And often it happened in form of an "AD". Check the archives, how man data, news, interesting information these ads delivered and how often fruitful discussions unfolded after such advertisements. I - half as old as the mountains, remember the days, where there wasn't any internet yet. The collectors (and often the scientists too) couldn't keep up with new recoveries and neither with the offers of material for their collections else, than to visit the 2-3 shows per year, where meteorites were offered or to exchange letters ect. (How glad they would have been, id something like this list would have existed including the offers coming in here). But also nowadays I have the impression many members do indeed appreciate the advertisements. Often they get the material first-hand here, with new material also they are the first to choose, the contact to the seller is completely different than e.g. on ebay and additionally they can discuss the offered material with like-minded people And finally they save a lot of time. Not all have the time or are in the mood, to spend hours and days in front of the ebay-pages, browsing the thousands of auctions of for them not so interesting material, waiting until a piece fitting in their collection or for their purposes comes swimming by and to have to stay awake at night or having the obligation being at home, when the auction will end. Nor do all having the time to browse all the dealers' pages, and checking them regularly for updates. Admittedly the technical standard of the list is outdated, in our times such a format is a dinosaur. And so what? New and modern doesn't mean automatically better. The list is wonderful simple and works perfectly - people like it, And as always: tribute to the chief Art! If you prefer a more modern structured and more fancy designed forum, you do have some alternatives. There are 2 fora in USA, 1 in France and 1 for Germany/Austria/Switzerland. (but the best music still plays here!). Of course I can understand that members feel molested by commercial ads, but they have possibilities to avoid to get them on their disks. You can choose, whether you get only a digest of the postings here, you can keep your computer completely free of list-mails in reading the postings online in the archives or - because almost all members are so civilized to enclose "AD" or "SALE" in the title of their advertisements, you can automatically sort them out in virtue of these catchwords into a separate folder of your email-program. Haven't checked the archives, but I guess the Ads count in for a bearable 10-15% of all posts. And as Al mentioned already, all agreed to the limitation of max. 1 Ad per nose and week - and all members are disciplined enough to follow that rule. Better to say: almost all. Only one among a thousand members has for many years now difficulties to understand this rule. Chicago-Steve - but it is much better with him now. In November he posted just once more 8 ads, in Oct 11, in Sep 10 - in his best times he used 5-10 Ads per week. He's tolerated to have this privilege, singleing him out of all the other 1000+ members, not so because of his achievements he had done to the meteoritic world, but rather he seems to have been adopted as a mascot of the meteorite-mailing-list (else I can't explain, why he hadn't been thrown off yet). So all in all, I think, it's o.k. Best! Martin ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 1:14 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE Greg and List, I agree. Many dealers udse this list as advertisment. In my mind too this is not the sense of such a list. Uwe (spell ew ve) From grf2 at verizon.net Tue Dec 16 10:24:31 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 10:24:31 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Advertisements (wasTHIS IS NOT THE IMCA list.TAKE IT ELSEWHERE) References: <8CB2D5C9F4E5AC4-FF8-1EF8@webmail-de08.sysops.aol.com> <002601c95f89$d1712020$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Message-ID: Well said Martin, in a nutshell. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Altmann" To: Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 9:23 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Advertisements (wasTHIS IS NOT THE IMCA list.TAKE IT ELSEWHERE) > Hi Uwe et al. > > The beef of meteoritics as science and as hobby are the stones. > For more than 200 years meteorite studies and meteorite collecting is > based > on private initiatives, collectors, hunters and dealers bringing up new > stones and irons. > > Therefore the introducing of new finds and new meteorites or already > known, > but rare or remarkable specimens, is a natural part of this list and that > this happens with a more or less commercial background is natural too, > because it is neither a solely academic, neither a sole collector's list, > but THE universal forum for meteorites. > > Note, that on the list many of the most interesting and scientifically > most > important meteorites, desert finds, new main masses, new falls of the last > decade had their premiere on this list here, where you are sitting in the > first row! And often it happened in form of an "AD". > > Check the archives, how man data, news, interesting information these ads > delivered and how often fruitful discussions unfolded after such > advertisements. > > I - half as old as the mountains, remember the days, where there wasn't > any > internet yet. The collectors (and often the scientists too) couldn't keep > up > with new recoveries and neither with the offers of material for their > collections else, than to visit the 2-3 shows per year, where meteorites > were offered or to exchange letters ect. > (How glad they would have been, id something like this list would have > existed including the offers coming in here). > > But also nowadays I have the impression many members do indeed appreciate > the advertisements. Often they get the material first-hand here, with new > material also they are the first to choose, the contact to the seller is > completely different than e.g. on ebay and additionally they can discuss > the > offered material with like-minded people > And finally they save a lot of time. > Not all have the time or are in the mood, to spend hours and days in front > of the ebay-pages, browsing the thousands of auctions of for them not so > interesting material, waiting until a piece fitting in their collection or > for their purposes comes swimming by and to have to stay awake at night or > having the obligation being at home, when the auction will end. > Nor do all having the time to browse all the dealers' pages, and checking > them regularly for updates. > > Admittedly the technical standard of the list is outdated, in our times > such > a format is a dinosaur. > And so what? New and modern doesn't mean automatically better. > The list is wonderful simple and works perfectly - people like it, > And as always: tribute to the chief Art! > > If you prefer a more modern structured and more fancy designed forum, > you do have some alternatives. There are 2 fora in USA, 1 in France and 1 > for Germany/Austria/Switzerland. (but the best music still plays here!). > > Of course I can understand that members feel molested by commercial ads, > but they have possibilities to avoid to get them on their disks. > You can choose, whether you get only a digest of the postings here, you > can > keep your computer completely free of list-mails in reading the postings > online in the archives or - because almost all members are so civilized to > enclose "AD" or "SALE" in the title of their advertisements, you can > automatically sort them out in virtue of these catchwords into a separate > folder of your email-program. > > Haven't checked the archives, but I guess the Ads count in for a bearable > 10-15% of all posts. > And as Al mentioned already, all agreed to the limitation of max. 1 Ad per > nose and week - and all members are disciplined enough to follow that > rule. > > Better to say: almost all. Only one among a thousand members has for many > years now difficulties to understand this rule. Chicago-Steve - but it is > much better with him now. In November he posted just once more 8 ads, in > Oct > 11, in Sep 10 - in his best times he used 5-10 Ads per week. > He's tolerated to have this privilege, singleing him out of all the other > 1000+ members, not so because of his achievements he had done to the > meteoritic world, but rather he seems to have been adopted as a mascot of > the meteorite-mailing-list (else I can't explain, why he hadn't been > thrown > off yet). > > So all in all, I think, it's o.k. > > Best! > Martin > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: ; > Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 1:14 AM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT ELSEWHERE > > > > Greg and List, > I agree. Many dealers udse this list as advertisment. > In my mind too this is not the sense of such a list. > Uwe (spell ew ve) > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From valparint at aol.com Tue Dec 16 11:11:34 2008 From: valparint at aol.com (valparint at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 09:11:34 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Help, please Message-ID: Within the last few months someone posted an amusing article about the German language. I've looked in the archives and can't find it. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Thanks Paul Swartz From grf2 at verizon.net Tue Dec 16 10:21:00 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 10:21:00 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 16, 2008 References: <5908808.3083661229430170068.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <168AB2D5D10146C3B8A10F514DD2DD1A@ASUS> Neat Twink, that's not an actual specimen is it? The TKW was 175 kg. That monument is humungous. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Johnson" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 7:22 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 16,2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_16_2008.html > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From raremeteorites at yahoo.com Tue Dec 16 11:32:16 2008 From: raremeteorites at yahoo.com (Adam Hupe) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 08:32:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Great Auctions Ending - Worth a Look! Message-ID: <21618.97679.qm@web30705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear List Members, I would like bring to your attention some great items listed on eBay that are due to end shortly. I put up some exceptional pieces this week, some so different or unique that they are definitely worth a look. Most items are started out at just 99 cents for those who have budgets of their own while other items are very reasonably priced. Click below to see some great auctions: http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/raremeteorites!_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZ MUST SEE - Two Types of Xenoliths in a Single Slice, Studied at NAU: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140288317033 Generous Sized Crusted Specimens of NWA 3160 Lunar Meteorite Started at Just 99 Cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140288318485 Nice Crusted Part Slice of NWA 3163 Lunar Meteorite Started at Just 99 Cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140288319013 Complete Amgala Individual With Unburnt Clast: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200286998152 LUNAR MAIN MASS - Dhofar 910, Legally obtained: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200287000792 COMPLETE SLICE - MARTIAN METEORITE- NWA 1195 - Largest and Only Complete Slice Left: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200287003490 Giant Olivine Diogenite Block Cut With Crust and Polished Surface: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200287004931 Largest Piece of NWA 2999 Angrite Left Started at Just 99 Cents, Fantastic Crust: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200287006824 And Many More Examples Worth Looking at Can Be Found at This Link: http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/raremeteorites!_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZ Thank you for looking and if you are bidding, good luck. Best Regards, ------------------------------------ Adam Hupe The Hupe Collection Team LunarRock IMCA 2185 raremeteorites at yahoo.com From meteoriteplaya at gmail.com Tue Dec 16 13:29:39 2008 From: meteoriteplaya at gmail.com (Mike Jensen) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 11:29:39 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] New fall page updated Message-ID: <6f9da8300812161029v659c62fodc28575ae59193df@mail.gmail.com> Hi All I just updated my new fall page with possible recovery number 8 for the year! It is the Romanian fall that Andrei Razvan first reported a couple of days ago. http://jensenmeteorites.com/New%20meteorites.htm Go to the third listing down the page. -- Mike -- Mike Jensen Meteorites 16730 E Ada PL Aurora, CO 80017-3137 USA 720-949-6220 IMCA 4264 website: www.jensenmeteorites.com From info at mcomemeteorite.it Tue Dec 16 13:39:28 2008 From: info at mcomemeteorite.it (M come Meteorite Meteorites) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 19:39:28 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] New fall page updated Message-ID: <4947f5e0.22a.5a06.1660794814@webmaildh3.aruba.it> A photo of the S.Michele meteorite its visible in my collection site in the italian meteorites section matteo ----- Original Message ----- Da : "Mike Jensen" A : "Meteorite Mailing List" Oggetto : Re: [meteorite-list] New fall page updated Data : Tue, 16 Dec 2008 11:29:39 -0700 > Hi All > I just updated my new fall page with possible recovery > number 8 for the year! It is the Romanian fall that Andrei > Razvan first reported a couple of days ago. > http://jensenmeteorites.com/New%20meteorites.htm Go to the > third listing down the page. > > -- > Mike > -- > Mike Jensen Meteorites > 16730 E Ada PL > Aurora, CO 80017-3137 > USA > 720-949-6220 > IMCA 4264 > website: www.jensenmeteorites.com > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite Meteoriti info at mcomemeteorite.it http://www.mcomemeteorite.it http://www.mcomemeteorite.info Mindat Gallery http://www.mindat.org/gallery-5018.html From gsac at gmx.net Tue Dec 16 14:30:23 2008 From: gsac at gmx.net (Alexander Seidel) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 20:30:23 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] New fall page updated In-Reply-To: <6f9da8300812161029v659c62fodc28575ae59193df@mail.gmail.com> References: <6f9da8300812161029v659c62fodc28575ae59193df@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20081216193023.272960@gmx.net> Nice compilation of the new falls, Mike - this is greatly appreciated! I wonder how it all will turn out in the end, especially with the latest ones... Seems we are living in a busy "the-sky-is-falling" time, aren?t we? Alex Berlin/Germany -------- Original-Nachricht -------- > Datum: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 11:29:39 -0700 > Von: "Mike Jensen" > An: "Meteorite Mailing List" > Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] New fall page updated > Hi All > I just updated my new fall page with possible recovery number 8 for the > year! > It is the Romanian fall that Andrei Razvan first reported a couple of days > ago. > http://jensenmeteorites.com/New%20meteorites.htm > Go to the third listing down the page. > > -- > Mike > -- > Mike Jensen Meteorites > 16730 E Ada PL > Aurora, CO 80017-3137 > USA > 720-949-6220 > IMCA 4264 > website: www.jensenmeteorites.com > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From epgrondine at yahoo.com Tue Dec 16 15:12:59 2008 From: epgrondine at yahoo.com (E.P. Grondine) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 12:12:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA, ads Message-ID: <946100.38077.qm@web36903.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi everyone - I remember when ebay first came along, and the discussions. The next generation is going to be other online auctions. CDbaby is eating ebay alive in the music business. Hopefully, at some point, the software to handle online auctions will be turn-key, and meteorites will have their own auction site. Ebay's deficits are well known, and why should they be making money instead of the dealers, and why should the customers be paying ebay premiums? While every market is down now, I still think that museum sales will expand the collector base. The spacer.com site looks good as well. I hope one of you jumps on the pen thing for your Moon and Mars cuttings. Two years ago, while some folks here were beating up on Hibben, and one year ago, when some people here were beating up on Firestone et al., I mentioned that some day there would be a market for impacttites from the black mats. With a 1 inch thick layer in Sandusky, that day is growing nearer. Good Hunting, E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas From tina-john at cox.net Tue Dec 16 17:11:48 2008 From: tina-john at cox.net (tina-john at cox.net) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 17:11:48 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Please take me off of the mailing list Message-ID: <20081216171148.BVQ8V.63784.imail@eastrmwml40> Thanky you -- John C. Miller Tina-John at cox.net I.M.C.A. #2272 From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Tue Dec 16 19:33:35 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 16:33:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] In Memoriam: Steven J. Ostro Message-ID: <200812170033.QAA29484@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> From: "John Spencer" Subject: DPS Mailing #08-27: Steve Ostro Issue 08-27, December 16th 2008 DPS Web site: http://dps.aas.org/ +-----------------------------CONTENTS--------------------------------+ 1) In Memoriam: Steven J. Ostro +---------------------------------------------------------------------+ 1---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1 IN MEMORIAM: STEVEN J. OSTRO We are very sorry to report the news that pioneering JPL radar astronomer Steve Ostro died early on the morning of Monday December 15th. The following appreciation is based on a note sent by Bonnie Buratti to Steve's Cassini colleagues. Steve was a luminary in the field of Radar Astronomy, and received the DPS Kuiper prize in 2003 for his groundbreaking work in asteroid and satellite radar studies. Steve's seminal work on the surface properties of the Galilean satellites - which he was extending to the Cassini Radar data he was gathering and analyzing up to a few days before he died - led to the development of new models to explain how electromagnetic radiation interacts with ice. He and his colleague Lance Benner almost single handedly established the field of radar studies of Near Earth Objects. Steve received his PhD from MIT in 1978 under Gordon Pettengill and Irwin Shapiro. He was a professor of Astronomy at Cornell University before coming to the Jet Propulsion Laboratory in 1984, where he established the radar astronomy group. Steve gave of his time freely to younger colleagues and students. His collegiality and intellectual honesty will be missed. Steve died of pneumonia after a silent and courageous battle with cancer. He leaves his wife of 40 years, Jeanne Ostro, and three children. We are constructing a web page, which will shortly be linked from the DPS home page at http://dps.aas.org/, where we will post any details about memorial services, etc. as we receive them. ------------------------------------ From bolidechaser at yahoo.com Tue Dec 16 20:16:27 2008 From: bolidechaser at yahoo.com (Robert Verish) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 17:16:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Sale, ad - Franconia meteorite (1 kg) Message-ID: <373839.62190.qm@web51710.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hello All, Found a 1 kilogram Franconia meteorite last week and I would like to see it go into a collection where a primo specimen such as this one, would be appreciated. Beautiful relict fusion-crust / desert varnish, museum quality piece. (Hint: Museum curators - contact me now!) Except for fluke finds (like this one) it will be harder and harder to find one this nice (at this size) in the future. $ 2.00 per gram. (Except, if you can convince me that it won't be cut-up, then make me an offer.) Contact me off list, please. From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Tue Dec 16 21:29:41 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 18:29:41 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] History Channel Program and Interesting Link In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <498447.60393.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Just a reminder for my fellow listoids - The History Channel is showing a program (on right now as I type) - "The Universe - Deadly Comets and Meteors" that centers around meteorites and impacts. It's very cool so far. :) Secondly, here is a link I discovered (thanks to this show) : http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/impacteffects/ This nifty application asks you for impactor data and target data, and then it computes the effects of an impact. (my apologies if this link has already been posted) Regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From dfpens01 at yahoo.com Tue Dec 16 22:16:42 2008 From: dfpens01 at yahoo.com (David Pensenstadler) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 19:16:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Sale, ad - Franconia meteorite (1 kg) In-Reply-To: <373839.62190.qm@web51710.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <467188.96297.qm@web90305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I spent a whole day out there last June and only found a 2.0 g piece. I'll bet I stepped right over that 1 kg piece. Dave --- On Tue, 12/16/08, Robert Verish wrote: > From: Robert Verish > Subject: [meteorite-list] Sale, ad - Franconia meteorite (1 kg) > To: "Meteoritecentral List" > Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 8:16 PM > Hello All, > > Found a 1 kilogram Franconia meteorite last week and I > would like to see it go into a collection where a primo > specimen such as this one, would be appreciated. Beautiful > relict fusion-crust / desert varnish, museum quality piece. > (Hint: Museum curators - contact me now!) Except for fluke > finds (like this one) it will be harder and harder to find > one this nice (at this size) in the future. > $ 2.00 per gram. (Except, if you can convince me that it > won't be cut-up, then make me an offer.) > Contact me off list, please. > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael at spacerocksinc.com Wed Dec 17 00:04:05 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 21:04:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 17, 2008 Message-ID: <23236589.3195011229490245944.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_17_2008.html From paseclipse at yahoo.com Wed Dec 17 00:42:56 2008 From: paseclipse at yahoo.com (Del Waterbury) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 21:42:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Sale, ad - Franconia meteorite (1 kg) In-Reply-To: <467188.96297.qm@web90305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <176621.94751.qm@web51306.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I've lost count how days I've spent metal detecting all day out there and I still haven't scored one that big! Just goes to show you they're still out there. I'll get me one sooner or later. Del --- On Tue, 12/16/08, David Pensenstadler wrote: > From: David Pensenstadler > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Sale, ad - Franconia meteorite (1 kg) > To: "Meteoritecentral List" , "Robert Verish" > Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 7:16 PM > I spent a whole day out there last June and only found a 2.0 > g piece. > > I'll bet I stepped right over that 1 kg piece. > > Dave > > > --- On Tue, 12/16/08, Robert Verish > wrote: > > > From: Robert Verish > > Subject: [meteorite-list] Sale, ad - Franconia > meteorite (1 kg) > > To: "Meteoritecentral List" > > > Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 8:16 PM > > Hello All, > > > > Found a 1 kilogram Franconia meteorite last week and I > > would like to see it go into a collection where a > primo > > specimen such as this one, would be appreciated. > Beautiful > > relict fusion-crust / desert varnish, museum quality > piece. > > (Hint: Museum curators - contact me now!) Except for > fluke > > finds (like this one) it will be harder and harder to > find > > one this nice (at this size) in the future. > > $ 2.00 per gram. (Except, if you can convince me that > it > > won't be cut-up, then make me an offer.) > > Contact me off list, please. > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Wed Dec 17 03:44:31 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 18:44:31 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] look at the crappola to apply for export in oz Message-ID: <202F55A6E9D845D7A9F6146D20915532@your0a700f0aaf> Listoids - check this out - Iz reckons we should all email or telephone or both re the repressive legislation and recommend its review - you can fire off emails to Marion.Garratt at environment.gov.au or movable.heritage at environment.gov.au - hell - send it to both... The solution (in my opinion) is only to restrict the export of scientifically significant meteorites (incl all planetaries) and allow the export of common or ordinary meteorites where no further scientic investigation is needed or warranted and maybe to set a cap ie gold nuggets worth under $15000 can presently be exported... but do I hear you say does this mean we can cut the bigger chunks up and apply separately - in my opinion no You may indeed have another useful opinion and I urge you to comment... Without some review of the legislation oz is doomed which is a shame in view of the research of the past Dear Mr ****** Thank you for your application (No ******) submitted under the Protection of Movable Cultural Heritage Act 1986 and received by post on ****** for a permanent export permit for a meteorite. Your application is receiving attention and you will be advised of its progress in due course. We recommend applicants allow 6 - 8 weeks for a non-contentious application to be processed. In the case of a contentious application (ie. one where the expert examiner who provides the assessment of the object for the National Cultural Heritage Committee makes a recommendation against export), additional expert advice is sought. Given this, and dependent upon the complexity of the case, the application process can take longer. In these circumstances applicants will be advised by letter. Please do not hesitate to contact Cultural Property Section on telephone 02 6274 1810, fax 02 6274 2731 or e-mail movable.heritage at environment.gov.au should you have any queries. Yours sincerely Marion Marion Garratt Cultural Property Section Phone: 02 6274 1810 Fax: 026274 2731 From meteoriteshow at free.fr Wed Dec 17 12:21:24 2008 From: meteoriteshow at free.fr (Meteoriteshow) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 17:21:24 -0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - EBAY AUCTIONS ENDIND ON SATURDAY Message-ID: <003a01c9606b$eed3e0c0$0600a8c0@T42> Dear All, Today is wednesday and here is my usual post in order to remind you that my ebay auctions will end soon, on saturday. You can see the list of goodies available at: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZmeteoriteshow Here are som more details: 1- CHERGACH H5 - 94.9g indiv. - WITNESSED FALL! - A nice fusion crusted individual... 2- EL AROUSS L-IMB (unclas.) - 81.4g cut indiv. - A small individual with a window that has been cut in order to display the inside structure of this beautiful IMB. 3- NWA OC - FUSION CRUST - 159.0g indiv - A beautiful fusion crusted individual, STILL AT STARTING PRICE OF $1.00! 4- NWA XXX - 8.3g Slice - HOWARDITE - Have a look at this slice, ... simply outstanding... 5- OUED EL HADJAR - 1.5g frag - WITNESSED FALL! - This is a rare witnessed fall due to the small amount available and the few sources... Still at $1.00 starting price, a good deal! 6- SAH 02503 CV3 - 2.5g partslice - A great CV3, with nice CAIs and sharply defined chondrules. 7- ZAG H3-6 - 10.7g frag. - WITNESSED FALL! - Still at $1.00 starting price, this ZAG fragment displays a beautiful slickenside. Thanks for looking and kind regards, Frederic Beroud www.meteoriteshow.com IMCA #2491 From mikewren at gilanet.com Wed Dec 17 12:47:40 2008 From: mikewren at gilanet.com (michael cottingham) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 10:47:40 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: HOLIDAY SALE ENDS TODAY! Don't Miss This One! References: Message-ID: <05AF5710-51E7-4F20-8D25-7B88B55A593C@gilanet.com> > > HAPPY HOLIDAYS TO ALL! > > Well it is well underway: > > 37 Auctions listed at 0.99 cents, with a retail value of over > $10,000.00 > > and a Store wide sale on over 200 meteorite specimens from 10% to > 30% off! > > Go to: > > http://stores.ebay.com/voyage-botanica-natural-history > > > They are some great meteorites listed and some great prices! > > > Highlights: > > Beautiful Iron, Sweden, MUONIONALUSTA, 774g, One Of The Largest > Inclusions ever! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286680831 > > Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 20.28g, One of my last auction > specimens! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721166 > > Beautiful GIBEON, IVA Iron Specimen, 432g. A fantastic complete slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721158 > > Seldom Available GRUVER, Texas, H4, 3.84g, nice one! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448362 > > Nice H3 From Namibia, KORRA KORRABES, 19.88g, Seldom available these > days > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448373 > > Pallasite From Australia-HUCKITTA, 9.98 gram, cool looking. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448385 > > Super Rare Fall BATH FURNACE, Kentucky, 1.28g, These are my last > specimens! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448407 > > Loaded W/Inclusions ODESSA, IAB, 346 gram CS, Do Not Miss This One! > Museum Grade Slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286691003 > > SEYMCHAN Meteorite with Beautiful Etching, 67 gram, Really Nice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669080 > > BRENHAM, Siderite From Kansas, 15.65 gram, You got to see this part > slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286679720 > > Rare GLORIETA MOUNTAIN, Full Slice, 274 gram!, A complete Slice- > Holiday Special- You will not see this again! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669088 > > Rare NWA 2696, Howardite From Africa, 4.00g, A real nice part slice. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448428 > > Rare NWA 2932, Mesosiderite, Nice! 2.02 gram, Again, another nice > part slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448460 > > A very Rare EL3 From Africa, NWA 2965, 200g, THE BLUE TYPE! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286448472 > > RARE, SILVERTON, Texas, H4, LTKW, 0.54 gram, Only A Few Left! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286452520 > > CANYON DIABLO Individual, 342 gram, Avery nice individual! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286452529 > > Seldom Available TULIA (b), Texas, L6, 0.51g, Nice slice. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665036 > > Seldom Available BRISCOE, Texas, L5, 4.56g, real nice. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665042 > > Classic GOLD BASIN, Arizona, L4, 52.79 gram, excellent individual! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665055 > > (NEW) NWA 4851, L6 With Shock Lines, 80.20g, I love this meteorite- > it is so cool! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665040 > > Rare NWA 2635, Metachondrite-Achondrite,1.33g, Very rare and I only > have a few! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665063 > > Rare Ureilite From Africa, NWA 2634, 1.21g, I only have a few of > these. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286665068 > > (New) NWA 4734, Lunar Specimen Display! Good Deal! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669077 > > Very Rare and Beautiful, NWA 801, CR2, 4.20g, running low on this > one too! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286679754 > > Ungrouped Ataxite, DRONINO, Russia, 109.62g, nice complete slice. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286680835 > > Super Rare GEORGETOWN, Australia, 17.28 gram, This IS my very last > slice to auction out at 0.99 cents. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286711566 > > Amazing Lunar Highlands, NWA 5000, 0.184g, nice pieces! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721163 > > TULIA (a), Texas, H5, Complete Slice, 115.5g, Bigger than most Tulia > Specimens for Sale! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721170 > > Extremely Rare NAVAJO, Arizona, IIAB Iron! Only piece I have. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286721157 > > A Beautiful Sikhote-Alin, IIAB Iron, 244g, This is a GREAT COMPLETE > SLICE! One of my last to offer! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286699668 > > JIDDAT AL HARASIS 003, Oman, L5, 3.63 gram, I only have a couple left. > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286698869 > > (New) NWA 4881, Lunar Feldspathic Specimen, these are really nice > and big! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669093 > > A Classic, OZONA, Texas, H6 Chondrite, 36.64g, This is a nice big > slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286679745 > > (New) Martian Shergottite, NWA 4925, "Mars", these are nice too! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286669097 > > Classic GOLD BASIN, Arizona, L4, 26.46 gram, must look at this slice! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286690992 > > An Early # NWA 103, L6 From Africa, 14.88g, you do not see this one > too often! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286698860 > > (NEW), LA LUZ, New Mexico, H4, LTKW, 13.17g, running low and when > these are gone that is it! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200286691010 > > HERE ARE SOME SET PRICED AUCTIONS THAT ARE SWEET< SWEET DEALS! > > Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 64g, A sweet deal for someone! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287874445 > > Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 106g NICE! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287896502 > > MAIN MASS- NWA 2083, CO3, LTKW, 35.57g !!!!! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287895439 > > Loaded W/Inclusions ODESSA, IAB, 928 gram EC, DO NOT LET THIS ONE > PASS YOU UP! > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200287885971 > > and many others!!! > > > > THANKS AND BEST WISHES > > MICHAEL COTTINGHAM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Wed Dec 17 13:01:14 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 10:01:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rock Varnish: A Promising Habitat for Martian Bacteria Message-ID: <200812171801.KAA15639@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.psi.edu/press/ Rock Varnish: A Promising Habitat for Martian Bacteria Planetary Science Institute December 16, 2008 Dec. 16, 2008 - As scientists search for life on Mars, they should take a close look at rock varnish, according to a paper in the current issue of the Journal of Geophysical Research. The paper describes how a research team led by Kimberly R. Kuhlman, of the Tucson-based Planetary Science Institute, found bacteria associated with rock varnish in an area where the surrounding soils were essentially devoid of life. The study suggests that rock varnish could provide a niche habitat for microbial life on Mars and in other extraterrestrial environments devoid of liquid water. Rock varnish is an extremely slow-growing coating that forms on the surfaces of rocks in arid and semiarid climates. In Southwestern deserts, it often appears as a tough, dark stain on light-colored canyon walls. Ancient petroglyphs are often found etched into rock varnishes. Kuhlmann's team analyzed samples of rock varnish collected from the Yungay region of Chile's Atacama Desert, which is the closest analog to Martian environments found on Earth. The bacteria apparently get most if not all of their moisture from fog, said Kuhlman, who lives in Madison, Wis. The bacteria also are aerobic. So if Martian forms exist, they would have adapted to survive their planet's low-oxygen atmosphere, she added. Rock varnish, which consists of clay glued together with iron and manganese oxides, forms very slowly and is very thin. It adds only 1 to 40 nanometers in thickness per year, and tends to be no more than 500 millimeters thick, regardless of age. Similar rock coatings may exist on Mars because photos returned by every Martian lander show what looks like rock varnish coating the rocky surfaces. However, Kuhlman cautions that these coatings might not actually be rock varnish. "A number of different coatings, like silica, can masquerade as rock varnish," Kuhlman observed. "So you can't really identify it for sure until you crack it open and look at a cross section under the microscope." If it is rock varnish, it could provide bacteria with the same benefit it does on Earth - protection from ultraviolet radiation. Whether the bacteria help create the varnish that protects them isn't known. Some believe bacteria are involved in its formation, while others think it's abiotic. Actually, both scenarios could be true, Kuhlman said. Rock varnish could consist of layers formed by entirely different processes, depending on the prevailing environmental conditions at the time. Since many bacteria cannot be cultivated in the lab, Kuhlman's team used culture-independent methods to identify many of the species found in the Atacama varnish. They looked for adenosine triphosphate, a molecule that provides energy for cells that is found in all living things on Earth, and they also identified DNA from 32 species. In addition, they were able to produce live cultures of other bacteria. Many species were related to bacteria found in the air or water, suggesting that their ancestors may have been carried into the area during wetter periods and then evolved in the varnish niche as conditions changed. A similar scenario might have played out on Mars, with varnish bacteria surviving from the planet's wetter eras. Now Kuhlman would like to discover exactly where the bacteria live. No one knows if they are found on the surface, in the middle, at the bottom or between the varnish and the rock. Similarly, scientists don't yet know if the bacteria are simply using the varnish for sunscreen or if they exist as a community within the varnish. The ultra-thin varnish coatings have made it difficult to answer these questions, but Kuhlman hopes to secure research grants to pursue these problems and to give planetary scientists a better understanding of how to pursue the search for Martian bacteria. Those working with Kuhlman on the Atacama rock-varnish project include Parth Venkat, of the Planetary Science Institute; Myron T. La Duck, of the California Institute of Technology; Gregory M. Kuhlman, of the University of Wisconsin; and Christopher P. McKay, of the NASA Ames Research Center. From m27-dumbbell at hotmail.com Wed Dec 17 13:16:37 2008 From: m27-dumbbell at hotmail.com (WWW XXX) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 12:16:37 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Advertising comment Message-ID: resend, posting probs. Uwe, posting advertising to a captive audience is what makes many of the dealers active list members. Their input is important as Martin has explained. When you mature as a list member (hope to see you around) you will realize this, unfortunately many great list members don't have time to keep up with the list. They live in the cruel world and mostly not in a toga wearing, endowed or pensioned environments in pursuit of pure knowledge. Still some are very effective at what they do and vital spokes in the wheel. There is not always the same luxury for some of the people who have the focus to drive field meteoritics to higher and higher (and sometimes lower) levels. To do these things someone wants to do without worrying about paying the bills and feeding hungry mouths, would not materialize easily and remove some of the fun they like in their lives for some minor adjustment for us. All you need to do is filter your email for SALE and AD. It is such a simple solution it makes me wonder why such intelligent people complain about this. As a scientist, consider the list raw and unbiased data. What you do with it is up to you. Why add restrictions that will stifle anyone, especially moral ones like, "I think the list should bla bla bla". Better is to be accepting and scientific about this and not ask everyone else to serve us exactly the way we think if by some trivial effort we can do it ourselves. Many list members love our dealers. Even the ones we hate. Also, your fake Nantan problem. Is this an IMCA problem really? You say the IMCA helped you get some money back but tolerated direct violations of the code of ethics (implying hypocrisy?). Were you happy with this consolation prize of cash back at the time? You don't tell us who the dealers were, how much you paid, and finally how much you recovered, and you don't tell us the other side of the story. Name the dealer and state the details if you want to make it list business and give us enough data to be sympathetic. If you hold back, I can only think you feel you have some responsibility for the problem. Many of us love to hear a real story (and others not). Also tell us if you went along with the refund arrangement and waived your right to a full refund and are now changing your mind. What independent tests were done to prove to the seller it was a fake? Who's responsibility are those independent tests, really? (seller or buyer, I don't know) Did the seller and IMCA all agree they were fakes or were they in a position of just having to trust you and give you money back for whatever you sent them back. Otherwise the post will be open to misinterpretation be limited in value to list members. Just like an advertising that is not very interesting. oh well, then it's up to me to filter I guess, lazy me. Also, thanks for posting. Some have been extremely inventive posts. Best. The Planetary Guy. > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Advertisements (wasTHIS IS NOT THE IMCA list. TAKE IT > ELSEWHERE) (Martin Altmann) > 2. Re: Advertisements (wasTHIS IS NOT THE IMCA list.TAKE IT > ELSEWHERE) (Jerry Flaherty) > 3. Help, please (valparint at aol.com) > 4. Re: Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 16, 2008 > (Jerry Flaherty) > 5. AD - Great Auctions Ending - Worth a Look! (Adam Hupe) _________________________________________________________________ Suspicious message? There?s an alert for that. http://windowslive.com/Explore/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_broad2_122008 From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Wed Dec 17 15:13:27 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 06:13:27 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] unique opportunity to own a SCORPION BIGHT fragment Message-ID: <31E2B39ABC1045BD817877ECA7805A59@your0a700f0aaf> Listoids I've listed a fragment of SCORPION BIGHT on ebay (Australia) Export laws mandate that I can only sell to an Australian resident and can only post to an Australian address Though I do hope that export will be allowed in due course... This will most likely be the last of the Western Australian meteorites ever for sale given that the ownership of new finds in Western Australia is vested in the Crown and also given the personalities involved in the bureaucracy there... Its a once in a lifetime opportunity to obtain a near type-specimen sized complete individual fragment - only seven fragments were found near the main mass of 425 grams - one 24.8 gram fragment has been donated to the Western Australian Museum as a type-specimen - one fragment has been cut to obtain a polished thin-section - the rest are pristine as is the main mass. Fayalite number = 18.7 and metsoc submission will follow in due course Its the last of the mohicans - and your only opportunity to obtain a specimen of Australia's most ferocious meteorite - most likely the world's most ferocious meteorite too... http://cgi.ebay.com.au/SCORPION-BIGHT-AUSTRALIAS-MOST-FEROCIOUS-METEORITE_W0QQitemZ230314866267QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_15?hash=item230314866267&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A1|39%3A1|240%3A1318 Cheers From roxfromspace at gmail.com Wed Dec 17 16:52:27 2008 From: roxfromspace at gmail.com (Phil Morgan) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 14:52:27 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] heavily encrusted dark grey interior - large find? Message-ID: <70baf8d20812171352u32bcea6qcbc758e7aab232f1@mail.gmail.com> Hello everyone, I've received very similar stones from multiple sources and was wondering if anyone else has noticed these. I would think it must be a find of decent size. They are heavily encrusted, but not just caliche and such - lots of sand and small stones stuck in it. I've also noticed small brassy flakes (pyrite?) stuck to them. Here is a picture of a cut face: http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c57/pkmorgan/share/encrusted_cut.jpg And here is a picture of the exterior: http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c57/pkmorgan/share/encrusted_back.jpg Even if you haven't seen these in person, any observations would be appreciated. Regards, Phil From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Wed Dec 17 18:35:20 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 15:35:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] FREE Meteorite Children's Book - Holiday Giveaway! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <17842.93953.qm@web58401.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi folks! I ran across a neat children's book on eBay - it's a Weekly Reader book from the 1970's (remember those!?), it's a hardcover, and it's in great cosmetic condition. The book is titled "The Fireball Mystery" and it's written by Mary Adrian. It's a little under 100 pages and is illustrated. The reading level appears to be about 6th grade, give or take. The story is about some kids whose father is an amateur astronomer, and they witness a fireball and meteorite fall. The story then revolves around their search for the meteorite! A very fun, educational and unusual children's book. I bought it on a whim, read it, got a kick out of it, and now I would like to pass it on to someone with kids or to someone who is a teacher or does outreach work with meteorites. If you qualify in this respect, please respond offlist and I will send the book free of charge. (shipping is on me - CONUS only) If the book is intended as a gift or stocking stuffer, I will send it via Priority Mail with a freebie UNWA chondrite. First person to respond offlist gets it. Happy Holidays and clear skies! MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Wed Dec 17 21:25:39 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 18:25:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Free Meteorite Children's Book (TAKEN) - more on Amazon In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <24403.76837.qm@web58401.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi Listoids! The freebie book is taken. I had many responses from nice people who wanted a copy for their kids, so did an Amazon search. Amazon has 9 copies available right now - one new and eight used copies. The used copies start at $1.95! http://www.amazon.com/Fireball-Mystery-Mary-Adrian/dp/B000HMB2T4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1229566926&sr=8-1 I think this a great book for kids - and I wish publishers would offer more books about meteorites for children. I recommend people with young kids should get a copy of this book - it may spark some interest in space rocks. :) Regards and Happy Holidays! MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From michael at spacerocksinc.com Thu Dec 18 05:41:58 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 02:41:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 18, 2008 Message-ID: <18046204.3327871229596918162.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_18_2008.html From grf2 at verizon.net Thu Dec 18 07:47:36 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 07:47:36 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 18, 2008 References: <18046204.3327871229596918162.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <960B47B7DFA14462B7B678A9A2B95E92@ASUS> gorgeous picture Andrei. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Johnson" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 5:41 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 18,2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_18_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Thu Dec 18 13:45:23 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 10:45:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] MRO HiRISE Images - December 17, 2008 Message-ID: <200812181845.KAA09415@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> MARS RECONNAISSANCE ORBITER HIRISE IMAGES December 17, 2008 o Scoured Crater Rim http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_010369_2065 o North Polar Layered Deposits http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_010366_2590 o Complex Crater in Arabia Terra http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_010354_2165 o Cyane Fossae Pits http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_010345_2150 o Sedimentary Layers in Columbus Crater http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_010281_1510 o Terraced Fan in Aeolis Region http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_009729_1735 o Fretted Terrain Valley Traverse http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_009719_2230 o Small Crater on Arcuate Ridge West of Olympia Mensae http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_009717_2545 o Mesa in Acidalia Region http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/PSP_009709_2155 All of the HiRISE images are archived here: http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/ Information about the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter is online at http://www.nasa.gov/mro. The mission is managed by NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, a division of the California Institute of Technology, for the NASA Science Mission Directorate, Washington, D.C. Lockheed Martin Space Systems, of Denver, is the prime contractor and built the spacecraft. HiRISE is operated by the University of Arizona. Ball Aerospace and Technologies Corp., of Boulder, Colo., built the HiRISE instrument. From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Thu Dec 18 13:47:44 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 10:47:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Cosmic Diamonds May Be Hidden in 'Carbon Onions' Message-ID: <200812181847.KAA10209@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn16259-cosmic-diamonds-may-be-hidden-in-carbon-o Cosmic diamonds may be hidden in 'carbon onions' by Rachel Courtland New Scientist 12 December 2008 An exotic carbon structure could explain why astronomers have seen very little diamond dust in the universe. Since the 1980s, researchers have puzzled over the origin of "nanodiamonds", tiny diamond deposits preserved in meteorites, such as the Allende meteorite that landed in Mexico in 1969. These tiny diamonds make up roughly 3% of the carbon in the rocks. That suggests nanodiamonds should abound in clouds of interstellar gas and dust, possibly forged in the fiery blasts of previous supernovae. But so far, signs of diamonds have only been found in the dusty discs around three young stars. Strangely, the diamonds are found close to the stars, as opposed to being distributed more evenly in the space around them. That hints that they were not left over from ancient stellar explosions but may have formed near the stars, at comparatively low pressures. Now researchers led by Miwa Goto of the Max Planck Institute for Astronomy in Heidelberg, Germany, say they have come up with an explanation. Nanodiamonds may be hidden from view in many places because they form within "carbon onions", exotic structures made up of concentric layers of graphite that can form in dusty material that is blasted with high-energy particles, the researchers say. Right conditions Carbon onions have been used to forge nanodiamonds on Earth. At high temperatures, researchers bombard the layered graphite with electrons. This knocks atoms out of the onions' outer shells, forcing the remaining atoms in the shells to rearrange and close ranks. The shells therefore squeeze inwards, eventually creating enough pressure at the centre of the onion to form diamond. But conditions must be just right to produce diamonds in carbon onions around stars. A star must eject enough charged particles to turn onions into pressure cells. Then, in order for astronomers to see the diamonds, one of two conditions must be met. There must either be a nearby source of X-rays that could slough off the outer layer of the onion to reveal the underlying gems, or the onions themselves must be warm enough - more than 300 Degrees C - for the entire carbon onion to be turned into a nanodiamond. The three stars that boast signs of diamonds are all massive young stars called Herbig Ae/Be stars. Notably, they all seem to have the required conditions to create carbon onion diamonds, Goto says. Two of the stars have binary companion stars that emit large flares that could blast charged particles towards the onions. The other has a nearby X-ray source that has yet to be identified. All have dusty discs that are warm enough to sustain diamond growth. Diamonds in the rough "It's a new idea that should definitely be taken seriously," says Louis Allamandola of NASA's Ames Research Center in Moffett Field, California, who has studied cosmic diamonds. But he adds that it's not clear how well the diamonds would survive continued irradiation by stellar flares. "If they can't cool down fast enough, they just basically erode, atoms just boil off," Allamandola told New Scientist. Light from carbon onions may resemble that from other forms of carbon, making it difficult to confirm whether such structures orbit the star. But carbon onions have been found in meteorites, including Allende. If future studies reveal nanodiamonds within those carbon onions, it would bolster the case that the universe is sprinkled with diamonds in the rough. Journal reference: Astrophysical Journal (forthcoming) From joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com Thu Dec 18 14:36:42 2008 From: joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com (JoshuaTreeMuseum) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 14:36:42 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] heavily encrusted dark grey interior - large find? Message-ID: Hi Phil, My first reaction is: some kind of slag? It's amazing the different kinds of slag people bring into the museum as possible meteorites. Phil Whitmer From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Thu Dec 18 15:52:10 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 12:52:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Scientists Find 'Missing' Mineral and Clues to Mars Mysteries Message-ID: <200812182052.MAA15835@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> Dec. 18, 2009 Steve Cole Headquarters, Washington 202-657-2194 stephen.e.cole at nasa.gov Guy Webster Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. 818-354-6278 guy.webster at jpl.nasa.gov Jennifer Huergo Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory, Laurel, Md. 240-228-5618/443-778-5618 jennifer.huergo at jhuapl.edu RELEASE: 08-331 SCIENTISTS FIND 'MISSING' MINERAL AND CLUES TO MARS MYSTERIES SAN FRANCISCO -- Researchers using a powerful instrument aboard NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter have found a long sought-after mineral on the Martian surface and, with it, unexpected clues to the Red Planet's watery past. Surveying intact bedrock layers with the Compact Reconnaissance Imaging Spectrometer for Mars, or CRISM, scientists found carbonate minerals, indicating that Mars had neutral to alkaline water when the minerals formed at these locations more than 3.6 billion years ago. Carbonates, which on Earth include limestone and chalk, dissolve quickly in acid. Therefore, their survival until today on Mars challenges suggestions that an exclusively acidic environment later dominated the planet. Instead, it indicates that different types of watery environments existed. The greater the variety of wet environments, the greater the chances one or more of them may have supported life. "We're excited to have finally found carbonate minerals because they provide more detail about conditions during specific periods of Mars' history," said Scott Murchie, principal investigator for the instrument at the Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory in Laurel, Md. The findings will appear in the Dec. 19 issue of Science magazine and were announced Thursday at a briefing at the American Geophysical Union's Fall Meeting in San Francisco. Carbonate rocks are created when water and carbon dioxide interact with calcium, iron or magnesium in volcanic rocks. Carbon dioxide from the atmosphere becomes trapped within the rocks. If all of the carbon dioxide locked in Earth's carbonates were released, our atmosphere would be thicker than that of Venus. Some researchers believe that a thick, carbon dioxide-rich atmosphere kept ancient Mars warm and kept water liquid on its surface long enough to have carved the valley systems observed today. "The carbonates that CRISM has observed are regional rather than global in nature, and therefore, are too limited to account for enough carbon dioxide to form a thick atmosphere," said Bethany Ehlmann, lead author of the article and a spectrometer team member from Brown University in Providence, R.I. "Although we have not found the types of carbonate deposits which might have trapped an ancient atmosphere," Ehlmann said, "we have found evidence that not all of Mars experienced an intense, acidic weathering environment 3.5 billion years ago, as has been proposed. We've found at least one region that was potentially more hospitable to life." The article reports clearly defined carbonate exposures in bedrock layers surrounding the 925-mile diameter Isidis impact basin, which formed more than 3.6 billion years ago. The best-exposed rocks occur along a trough system called Nili Fossae, which is 414 miles long, at the edge of the basin. The region has rocks enriched in olivine, a mineral that can react with water to form carbonate. "This discovery of carbonates in an intact rock layer, in contact with clays, is an example of how joint observations by CRISM and the telescopic cameras on the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter are revealing details of distinct environments on Mars," said Sue Smrekar, deputy project scientist for the orbiter at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, Calif. NASA's Phoenix Mars Lander discovered carbonates in soil samples. Researchers had previously found them in Martian meteorites that fell to Earth and in windblown Mars dust observed from orbit. However, the dust and soil could be mixtures from many areas, so the carbonates' origins have been unclear. The latest observations indicate carbonates may have formed over extended periods on early Mars. They also point to specific locations where future rovers and landers could search for possible evidence of past life. The Applied Physics Laboratory led the effort to build the Compact Reconnaissance Imaging Spectrometer for Mars and operates the instrument in coordination with an international team of researchers from universities, government and the private sector. NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory manages the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter mission for NASA's Science Mission Directorate in Washington. For more information about the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter, visit: http://www.nasa.gov/mro -end- From rockhoundm at abaconet.com.ar Thu Dec 18 16:31:22 2008 From: rockhoundm at abaconet.com.ar (Eduardo.) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 18:31:22 -0300 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad. ebay auctions ending in 1 day. Murchison, Tucson, La Criolla In-Reply-To: <200812182052.MAA15835@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> Message-ID: Hi My last auction pre-Tucson is ending in one day. Most of the specimens started at 0.99 and there are still many at that price Some of them worth a look, even if you are not a buyer, like the 96.6g Murchison. Just follow this link: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZsmfmeteorites Eduardo IMCA #0645 From bigpineartifacts at yahoo.com Thu Dec 18 17:25:26 2008 From: bigpineartifacts at yahoo.com (mckinney trammell) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 14:25:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] 15.8g BARWELL FREE overnite shipping , ANYWHERE Message-ID: <278779.29080.qm@web53206.mail.re2.yahoo.com> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=290283954154&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=019 have is EXCELLENT piece of a CHRISTMAS EVE FALL by CHRISTMAS. From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Thu Dec 18 17:53:43 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 08:53:43 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] KILLER TENHAM METEORITE INDIVIDUAL FOR SALE ON EBAY Message-ID: <14D92DFB6E134DA9BB33850FA3FB1FBD@your0a700f0aaf> Listoids EEK - maybe the first time I have ever posted two adds in a week but perhaps this depends on what day is the weekly cutoff ? I'll apologise now but this one is an exception rather than the rule - I do not sell often but from time to time offer something prestigious and unique KILLER TENHAM INDIVIDUAL FOR SALE ON EBAY A CLASSIC OBLONG TENHAM SLAB WITH A SUBTLE HINT OF THUMPRINTING A MUST HAVE DROP DEAD GORGEOUS MUSEUM QUALITY SPECIMEN FOR YOUR DISPLAY CABINET A BEAUTIFUL VERY FRESH CRUSTED SPECIMEN see it at http://cgi.ebay.com/KILLER-TENHAM-METEORITE-INDIVIDUAL_W0QQitemZ230315147905QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item230315147905&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50 http://www.qmig.org From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Thu Dec 18 18:19:31 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 15:19:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] New LL5 Meteorite - NWA 5511 (provisional) Message-ID: <650836.17209.qm@web45610.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I would like to announce my first officially classified meteorite, NWA 5511 (provisional) NWA 5511 was a single stone that weighed 387 grams and a slice was tested by Ted Bunch to be a LL5. It was then assigned the name/number NWA 5511. Here is a picture of the meteorite before cutting: http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c165/jedisdiamond/387gNWA.jpg and here is a picture of some of it after cutting: http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c165/jedisdiamond/uNWAmaterial.jpg I hope I announced this correctly, it is my first time doing this. I would like to publicly thank Ted Bunch for taking the time to do this for me! Greg www.wanderingstarmeteorites.com From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Thu Dec 18 18:34:10 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 09:34:10 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] not an add more a comment on the haphazard and somewhat ludicrous export laws in oz Message-ID: <28A9D43A9E7D4028B121D73763B79215@your0a700f0aaf> Listoids I've received export approval for Tenham in less than an hour - it would have been quicker had I just telephoned directly... And yet in other cases it has to meander through a different administrative path and take 6 to 8 weeks - more if there is a dissenting opinion from an expert examiner and heaven forbid how long an appeal would take Its a mess here in Australia - Martin Altmann stated it succintly in his usual pithy manner when he said Australia is doomed to be a backwater from a historical perspective I'm damned if I know if there is anything that can be done - some of the current personalities who run the museum roosts have opinions that meteorites are not something that should be held in public hands and are unwilling to admit that the endstate of their opinions has been unfortunate in the long run Ciao http://www.qmig.org From eric at meteoritewatch.com Thu Dec 18 19:16:27 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:16:27 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] MeteoriteWatch.com Forum Changes In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <494AE7DB.7060907@meteoritewatch.com> Hi guys and gals, Anyone who is a member of the MeteoriteWatch.com forums should know that there's been a few changes to the forums. I've merged a total of 4 of the meteorite forums into 2 broad forum categories to make it easier to post relevant content. Below is a list of changes. MERGED POSTS FROM: Meteorite Collecting & Specimen Displays forum INTO Meteorite Preparation, Preservation & Repair forum Changed Forum Name To: Meteorite Collecting Forum ALSO MERGED POSTS FROM: Meteorite Hunting, Adventures & Outings forum INTO Meteorite Identification forum Changed Forum Name To: Meteorite Hunting & Identification All members posts are in appropriate and relevant categories. Only the location and name of the forum has changed to better organize the site. I've also change the order of the forums as well by moving them closer to the top of the page to make it faster to find the correct forum to post topics. Hopefully you guys will like the changes. Any suggestions or complaints will be promptly replied to. Regards, Eric Wichman P.S. If you're not a member already what are you waiting for Join Now: www.meteoritewatch.com From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Thu Dec 18 19:47:41 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:47:41 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] NASA Publication - Exploring Meteorite Mysteries (for teachers) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <534654.89790.qm@web58405.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi folks! This is another heads up about a great meteorite-related item for teachers and people doing outreach work involving space sciences : It's a comprehensive lesson plan for teachers that covers all aspects of meteorites - falls, types, craters, parent bodies, chemistry, and more. It also has some great ideas for demonstrations and hands-on activities. The publication is from 1997, so some of the information is a little dated, but the majority of it is still accurate. There is also a filmstrip and meteorite sample kit that NASA will send to accompany this lesson plan (on request) - although I don't know if they are still doing this and I don't have these materials myself, just the book. The book is about 200+ doubles-sided pages that have 3-holes for a ring binder. Best of all, the book is PUBLIC DOMAIN and no permission is needed to duplicate it. It is aimed towards students from Grades 5 through 12. (pretty good coverage) In the near future, I am going to run off a couple of copies at Kinkos for loaner distribution to friends of mine who are teachers, and if anyone here on the list is interested, contact me offlist. Here are a few photos of the book (which is unbound) - My copy was brand new and still in the cellophane. http://s268.photobucket.com/albums/jj24/Meteoritethrower/Meteorites/NASA/ More good news - Amazon.com has ONE copy of this book for sale for $20! Here is a link. (I am not affiliated with the seller in any way) - http://www.amazon.com/Exploring-Meteorite-Mysteries-Teachers-Activities/dp/B0010XXSS2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1229646974&sr=8-1 Regards and Happy Holidays! MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From DRose at emersonhosp.org Thu Dec 18 19:52:58 2008 From: DRose at emersonhosp.org (Rose, David MD) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 19:52:58 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] NASA Publication - Exploring Meteorite Mysteries(for teachers) In-Reply-To: <534654.89790.qm@web58405.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <534654.89790.qm@web58405.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <05A2331BCD73614C9869F0D33EDEFEC808F00601@exchange.emersonhosp.org> Michael, You can get it for free here: http://www.outofthecradle.net/archives/2007/05/exploring-meteorite-myste ries/ -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Michael Gilmer Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 7:48 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] NASA Publication - Exploring Meteorite Mysteries(for teachers) Hi folks! This is another heads up about a great meteorite-related item for teachers and people doing outreach work involving space sciences : It's a comprehensive lesson plan for teachers that covers all aspects of meteorites - falls, types, craters, parent bodies, chemistry, and more. It also has some great ideas for demonstrations and hands-on activities. The publication is from 1997, so some of the information is a little dated, but the majority of it is still accurate. There is also a filmstrip and meteorite sample kit that NASA will send to accompany this lesson plan (on request) - although I don't know if they are still doing this and I don't have these materials myself, just the book. The book is about 200+ doubles-sided pages that have 3-holes for a ring binder. Best of all, the book is PUBLIC DOMAIN and no permission is needed to duplicate it. It is aimed towards students from Grades 5 through 12. (pretty good coverage) In the near future, I am going to run off a couple of copies at Kinkos for loaner distribution to friends of mine who are teachers, and if anyone here on the list is interested, contact me offlist. Here are a few photos of the book (which is unbound) - My copy was brand new and still in the cellophane. http://s268.photobucket.com/albums/jj24/Meteoritethrower/Meteorites/NASA / More good news - Amazon.com has ONE copy of this book for sale for $20! Here is a link. (I am not affiliated with the seller in any way) - http://www.amazon.com/Exploring-Meteorite-Mysteries-Teachers-Activities/ dp/B0010XXSS2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1229646974&sr=8-1 Regards and Happy Holidays! MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list P Please consider the impact to the environment before printing this email. P Please consider the impact to the environment before printing this email. From eric at meteoritewatch.com Thu Dec 18 19:57:17 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:57:17 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: PreSale Announcement - Meteorites USA In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <494AF16D.4080700@meteoritewatch.com> Dear list members, If you're not on my list get on it now... Starting this weekend and running until the 1st of the year all NWA meteorites are at Below Wholesale prices. Everything is going on sale. And I mean ALL meteorites I have except for a few from my personal collection will be sold! If you've been waiting on a Christmas deal this is it. I have tens of kilos of material being photographed as we speak. I will not be releasing prices until the sale starts on Friday Dec 19th. Look for it. Because the prices are so low and this material will move fast, you're going to want to be notified first. There's no second chances on this deal. Once these meteorites are gone they are gone. Go to my website now and get on my sale list! http://www.meteoritesusa.com/newsletter/ Don't wait until tomorrow, or the next day for this, if you do it will be too late. There will be lot's of chondrites, mesosiderites, H's, L's, irons, pallasites, and a couple etched irons as well. Brenham Pallasite (polished slices) Franconia H5 Canyon Diablo NWA 869 NWA 2754 Bassikounou Odessa NWA XXX NWA Slices Whole Stones Fusion Crusted Pieces Fragments Micro Mounts and more... Get on that list now so you'll get first dibs. Talk to you soon... Eric Wichman Meteorites USA From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Thu Dec 18 19:58:14 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:58:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Large Fireball Sighted in Florida Sky Message-ID: <200812190058.QAA27277@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.wptv.com/content/coastal/story/Large-fireball-sighted-in-the-sky/DdigToZTi Large fireball sighted in the sky WPTV December 18, 2008 PALM BEACH COUNTY, FL -- Numerous reports of a large fireball in the sky were called into 911 dispatchers and our NewsChannel 5 newsroom Thursday evening. Viewers reported a large green and blue fireball falling from the southern sky around 4:55pm. Initial reports were a possible plane on fire in the sky but law enforcement officials confirmed no reports of aircrafts down. Local astronomers believe it was a fireball, which is bigger and brighter than an average meteor. There were no reports it made impact into the ground, which would be a meteorite. The Geminids Meteor showers usually peak around this time of year and can be viewed to the east late at night. If you have videos or photos you would like to share with NewsChannel 5, you can call our newsroom at (561) 653-5700 and email us at NewsTips at wptv.com From meteoritefinder at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 19:59:34 2008 From: meteoritefinder at gmail.com (Mike Miller) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 17:59:34 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Glorieta knife Ad/sale Message-ID: <468bf6050812181659u105b7c25r98393b1d5bb7a749@mail.gmail.com> Hi Everyone for those interested I have up loaded the newest Glorieta Damascus meteorite knife up on my web site, they have been selling very quick so if you are interested in one better have a look. The last one never even made it to the public, it was snapped up before everyone had a chance to see it. Here is a link http://www.meteoritefinder.com/whats-new-sale.htm It has etched Glorieta bolsters and Chinga spacers. Thanks to all -- Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr. Kingman Az 86401 www.meteoritefinder.com 928-753-6825 From John at Cabassi.net Thu Dec 18 21:58:52 2008 From: John at Cabassi.net (John.L.Cabassi) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 18:58:52 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] heavily encrusted dark grey interior - largefind? References: Message-ID: <003c01c96185$bb3b9a80$4564fea9@TITAN> G'Day Phil W. I sincerely doubt that what Phil has is slag, that's just my opinion. I also have a large specimen of 1514 grams and it really is unique. What he has described is very similar to what I have and I have forward him pictures and he has replied that what he has and I have are very similar. So we'll see what we come up with. Thanks for your input, it's really appreciated. Cheers John ----- Original Message ----- From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" To: Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 11:36 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] heavily encrusted dark grey interior - largefind? > Hi Phil, > My first reaction is: some kind of slag? It's amazing the different > kinds of slag people bring into the museum as possible meteorites. > > Phil Whitmer > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Thu Dec 18 22:01:03 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 13:01:03 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] meteorite blooper of the year Message-ID: <06D9475BFAD34648B3CADD5C8E8DB0C8@your0a700f0aaf> Listoids I'm getting questions about my backside... of my Tenham of course Because I describe it as a slab I am asked does this mean the backside is sawn - in this case no Maybe I can't understand a dictionary too well but I thought slab was defined as broad, flat, thick piece, as of stone (or cheese for that matter) And why am I babbling about this Its reminded me of an olde sale on ebay - the chondrite was described as having a nicely crusted backside - cant remember who sold it now but it gave me a giggle or two at the time - in fact it reminded me of a girl I used to know... Cheers From arizonakeith at cox.net Thu Dec 18 22:04:16 2008 From: arizonakeith at cox.net (Arizona Keith) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 20:04:16 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor Sighting in Arizona and caught on film Message-ID: <41E4B5A91A484EB2A0BFED9576EDFA55@Keith2> Hello List Just found this Meteor Sighting in Arizona and caught on film on 12-18-2008 Video on Youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMmY6j1TvoU Thanks for your time Keith Chandler From STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com Thu Dec 18 22:32:52 2008 From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com (STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 22:32:52 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] heavily encrusted dark grey interior - largefind? Message-ID: Hi John, I agree with you. It looks like a meteorite. Certain meteorites have "weird" (Is that the official scientific term?) adhesion properties. I have seen some scoured by the desert sand and other who seem to grab every piece of sand/rock and make it stick. It must have something to do with the desert varnish that is growing around the native material or perhaps simple mineral migration due to weathering. I have a 7.3 Kg NWA that looks like it is completely encrusted in jewels. Fine sand bits all over! It is beautiful and unlike ant other I have seen. It has a brown interior so not a match to yours. I am embedding images. (I am sending this email to the list without pictures so if any one else wants to see the photos, just email me). Tom Phillips In a message dated 12/18/2008 7:59:14 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, John at Cabassi.net writes: G'Day Phil W. I sincerely doubt that what Phil has is slag, that's just my opinion. I also have a large specimen of 1514 grams and it really is unique. What he has described is very similar to what I have and I have forward him pictures and he has replied that what he has and I have are very similar. So we'll see what we come up with. Thanks for your input, it's really appreciated. Cheers John ----- Original Message ----- From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" To: Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 11:36 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] heavily encrusted dark grey interior - largefind? > Hi Phil, > My first reaction is: some kind of slag? It's amazing the different > kinds of slag people bring into the museum as possible meteorites. > > Phil Whitmer > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From John at Cabassi.net Thu Dec 18 23:18:56 2008 From: John at Cabassi.net (John.L.Cabassi) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 20:18:56 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] heavily encrusted dark grey interior -largefind? References: Message-ID: <00af01c96190$f1f35210$4564fea9@TITAN> G'Day Tom Thanks for your reply. I will personally accept "weird" as an official scientific term. I tend to use it alot. And I agree on your very descriptive term of encrusted in jewels. Your images are more than fantastic. Keep up the great work. I can't get enough of it! Cheers John ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 7:32 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] heavily encrusted dark grey interior -largefind? > Hi John, I agree with you. It looks like a meteorite. > > Certain meteorites have "weird" (Is that the official scientific term?) > adhesion properties. I have seen some scoured by the desert sand and > other who > seem to grab every piece of sand/rock and make it stick. It must have > something to do with the desert varnish that is growing around the native > material > or perhaps simple mineral migration due to weathering. > > I have a 7.3 Kg NWA that looks like it is completely encrusted in jewels. > Fine sand bits all over! It is beautiful and unlike ant other I have > seen. > It has a brown interior so not a match to yours. > > I am embedding images. (I am sending this email to the list without > pictures so if any one else wants to see the photos, just email me). > > Tom Phillips > > > In a message dated 12/18/2008 7:59:14 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, > John at Cabassi.net writes: > G'Day Phil W. > I sincerely doubt that what Phil has is slag, that's just my opinion. I > also > have a large specimen of 1514 grams and it really is unique. What he has > described is very similar to what I have and I have forward him pictures > and > he has replied that what he has and I have are very similar. So we'll > see > what we come up with. > > Thanks for your input, it's really appreciated. > > Cheers > John > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" > To: > Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 11:36 AM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] heavily encrusted dark grey interior - > largefind? > > >> Hi Phil, >> My first reaction is: some kind of slag? It's amazing the different >> kinds of slag people bring into the museum as possible meteorites. >> >> Phil Whitmer >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, > Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From radio_ranch at yahoo.com Fri Dec 19 00:17:52 2008 From: radio_ranch at yahoo.com (Pat Brown) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 21:17:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] NASA Publication - Exploring Meteorite Mysteries (for teachers) In-Reply-To: <534654.89790.qm@web58405.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <734173.377.qm@web51304.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi Michael and the List, This book is available as a free .pdf file at: http://books.google.com/books?id=vbF-ZLb7608C&printsec=frontcover&dq=teachers+guide+to+meteorites&lr=&as_brr=1&as_pt=ALLTYPES or just do a google book search and you will find it. With Best Regards, Pat Scientific Lifestyle Meteorites --- On Thu, 12/18/08, Michael Gilmer wrote: > From: Michael Gilmer > Subject: [meteorite-list] NASA Publication - Exploring Meteorite Mysteries (for teachers) > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Thursday, December 18, 2008, 4:47 PM > Hi folks! > > This is another heads up about a great meteorite-related > item for > teachers and people doing outreach work involving space > sciences : > > It's a comprehensive lesson plan for teachers that > covers all aspects > of meteorites - falls, types, craters, parent bodies, > chemistry, and > more. It also has some great ideas for demonstrations and > hands-on > activities. The publication is from 1997, so some of the > information > is a little dated, but the majority of it is still > accurate. There > is also a filmstrip and meteorite sample kit that NASA will > send to > accompany this lesson plan (on request) - although I > don't know if > they are still doing this and I don't have these > materials myself, > just the book. > > The book is about 200+ doubles-sided pages that have > 3-holes for a > ring binder. Best of all, the book is PUBLIC DOMAIN and no > permission is needed to duplicate it. It is aimed towards > students > from Grades 5 through 12. (pretty good coverage) > > In the near future, I am going to run off a couple of > copies at > Kinkos for loaner distribution to friends of mine who are > teachers, > and if anyone here on the list is interested, contact me > offlist. > > Here are a few photos of the book (which is unbound) - My > copy was > brand new and still in the cellophane. > > http://s268.photobucket.com/albums/jj24/Meteoritethrower/Meteorites/NASA/ > > More good news - Amazon.com has ONE copy of this book for > sale for > $20! Here is a link. (I am not affiliated with the seller > in any > way) - > > http://www.amazon.com/Exploring-Meteorite-Mysteries-Teachers-Activities/dp/B0010XXSS2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1229646974&sr=8-1 > > Regards and Happy Holidays! > > MikeG > > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and > http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael at spacerocksinc.com Fri Dec 19 05:38:40 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 02:38:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 19, 2008 Message-ID: <33281169.3434961229683120948.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_19_2008.html From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Fri Dec 19 12:36:55 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 09:36:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Mars Odyssey THEMIS Images - December 15-19, 2008 Message-ID: <200812191736.JAA24259@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> MARS ODYSSEY THEMIS IMAGES December 15-19, 2008 o Landslides (Released 15 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081215a o Volcano (Released 16 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081216a o Lava Channels (Released 17 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081217a o Tempe Terra (Released 18 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081218a o Daedalia Planum (Released 19 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081219a All of the THEMIS images are archived here: http://themis.asu.edu/latest.html NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory manages the 2001 Mars Odyssey mission for NASA's Office of Space Science, Washington, D.C. The Thermal Emission Imaging System (THEMIS) was developed by Arizona State University, Tempe, in co.oration with Raytheon Santa Barbara Remote Sensing. The THEMIS investigation is led by Dr. Philip Christensen at Arizona State University. Lockheed Martin Astronautics, Denver, is the prime contractor for the Odyssey project, and developed and built the orbiter. Mission operations are conducted jointly from Lockheed Martin and from JPL, a division of the California Institute of Technology in Pasadena. From mmurray at montrose.net Fri Dec 19 15:09:34 2008 From: mmurray at montrose.net (Michael Murray) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 13:09:34 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] question on performing a nickel test Message-ID: Hi List, If someone has experience with the Allerderm Nickel test and wouldn't mind sharing their knowledge of how to do it... I am attempting to do a nickel test at home here and I ran into a bit of a snag. I have a piece of iron that most likely is not a piece of meteoritic iron that I was using as a test piece. I sanded a surface on it, cleaned it with alcohol several times, got out the trusty Allertest NI test kit from Allerderm, placed a drop each of the little bottles onto a cotton swab, and placed that on the cleaned surface of the metal. Using this piece of iron as a control piece, I wanted to be sure I wasn't doing something in the steps I was using that would cause me to get a false positive. On this test - test, the swab turned pink quickly. If I do the exact steps only add in placing a drop of white vinegar on the cleaned surface, wait a couple minutes and then apply the nickel test, I get almost a blood red swab in just the first second. The first time I did this test and saw this, I thought I had contaminated the surface so I sanded it again down to a fresh surface, cleaned it several times again with alcohol before attempting the nickel test without vinegar. Second time, same result. When using a drop of vinegar again, same result - blood red quickly. What am I doing wrong, if anything? Could I still have contamination on the metal that the sanding and cleaning with alcohol is not removing? Mike in CO From mlblood at cox.net Fri Dec 19 15:45:43 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 12:45:43 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] meteorite blooper of the year In-Reply-To: <06D9475BFAD34648B3CADD5C8E8DB0C8@your0a700f0aaf> Message-ID: Hi Bob, The term "slab" is almost never used for meteorites. Instead, It is slice, part slice full slice OR "end piece" (any "slice" or hunk Of meteorite with one cut face only is an "end piece"). Usually, "slab" is qualified with "a full slice forming a giant Slab" or "a flat end piece forming a slab" type of thing; but mostly "slab" is very rarely used as a meteorite term - and then, always In the context of a HUGE full slice - such as a giant slab Of Esquel (large enough to be a coffee table). In short, it is a vague term and a "slice" or "end piece" with Dimensions are much more definitive terms. Best wishes, Michael on 12/18/08 7:01 PM, Bob WALKER at qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au wrote: > Listoids > > I'm getting questions about my backside... of my Tenham of course > > Because I describe it as a slab I am asked does this mean the backside is > sawn - in this case no > > Maybe I can't understand a dictionary too well but I thought slab was > defined as broad, flat, thick piece, as of stone (or cheese for that matter) > > And why am I babbling about this > > Its reminded me of an olde sale on ebay - the chondrite was described as > having a nicely crusted backside - cant remember who sold it now but it gave > me a giggle or two at the time - in fact it reminded me of a girl I used to > know... > > Cheers > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From azizhabibi at yahoo.com Fri Dec 19 16:50:05 2008 From: azizhabibi at yahoo.com (habibi abdelaziz) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 13:50:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: two lithologies 950 gr IMB: Message-ID: <328386.40014.qm@web62005.mail.re1.yahoo.com> hi all and happy holidays, i have for sale this?950 gr two lithologies black?IMB? http://www.flickr.com/photos/azizhabibi/ all the best aziz habibi EMAIL TO aziz_habibi at hotmail.com or azizhabibi at yahoo.com ? habibi aziz www.palmserfoud.com www.palmotel.com box 70 erfoud 52200 morroco phone. 21235576145/44 fax.21235576170. From marcin at meteoryty.pl Fri Dec 19 20:15:42 2008 From: marcin at meteoryty.pl (Marcin Cimala - PolandMET) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 02:15:42 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] 4tf Meteorite Silver Coin with Pultusk References: Message-ID: <002001c96240$7a99ab50$0d00000a@polandmezrd5i9> Hi I dont see any official announcement so with pleasure :) I announce 4th Meteorite Silver Coin with real Pultusk Meteorite slice. I must say that this was the most crazy work I have ever do with meteorites. Whole 733g Pultusk meteorite specimen was completly cut into 5x5mm slices (except two 50g endpieces). Near 3000 slices! This was big luck that new Pultusk's was found recently becouse without this material we can't do this coin. I think there dont exist enough old Pultusk on market that could be purchased and cut. Ofcourse this could be also big waste of old and rare material. Soo, if You are interested I have lots of new Pultusk silver coins for sale in special price for list members. 105$ or 75euro with shipping worldwide. Only here , only now ! Photos and more info http://www.polandmet.com/ ======================================= I have also some new specimens for sale. CHINGA, 498grams complete specimen with natural surface, not sandblasted! MONT DIEU , ung-iron full slice BRAHIN pallasite slice SEYMCHAN endpiece More details on my page http://www.polandmet.com Also there is few more specimens not listed on my page. Micromount of OURIQUE H4 and JOHNSTOWN pallasite and four specimens of NORTON COUNTY (also with white crust) including nice 0.8 gram specimen with polished surface. Photos of request. -----[ MARCIN CIMALA ]-----[ I.M.C.A.#3667 ]----- http://www.Meteoryty.pl marcin(at)meteoryty.pl http://www.PolandMET.com marcin(at)meteorite.pl http://www.Gao-Guenie.com GSM: +48 (793) kosmos --------[ Member of Polish Meteoritical Society ]-------- From eric at meteoritewatch.com Fri Dec 19 21:08:29 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 18:08:29 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Meteorites USA New Years Sale - Day 1 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <494C539D.1080805@meteoritewatch.com> Hi Everyone, 14 Day Sale! Over the next 14 days I will be listing meteorites from my collection, and some other special deals until New Years Day at SUPER LOW prices. There will be more meteorites added to this page every day until the 31st, then on the 1st I'm removing everything from the Meteorite Sale page. If you miss it you miss it. I will not be listing these items at these prices again. Everything is going on sale, ALL meteorites I have except for a few from my personal collection will be sold! As promised here's the first two additions to my new years sale. Starting it off right check out these 2 beautiful sliced pieces ( 110.2 grams total ) of the famous Brenham Pallasite. Here's the meteorite for Day 1. http://www.meteoritesusa.com/meteorites-for-sale.htm What are you waiting for? Get on my sale list to stay updated on this sale! http://www.meteoritesusa.com/newsletter/ Don't wait until tomorrow, or the next day for this, if you do it will be too late. I'll be shipping these items as soon as payment is received. Shipping inside the USA is only $5 up to 1000 grams. International customers please contact me via email for shipping quote. Delivery inside the USA is only 3-5 business days. Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA 904-236-5394 From grf2 at verizon.net Fri Dec 19 21:11:53 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 21:11:53 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 19, 2008 References: <33281169.3434961229683120948.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: Very nice Geoff and Leigh Anne!! Thanks Michael ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Johnson" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Friday, December 19, 2008 5:38 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 19,2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_19_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From tett at rogers.com Fri Dec 19 21:56:33 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 21:56:33 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Buzzard Coulee Message-ID: <494C5EE1.2040809@rogers.com> List, Saw a nice batch of stones from the new Canadian fall. Buzzard Coulee or Lone Rock Or Marsden ??? Here is nice ~50 gram stone which followed me home. In the album are some more pics from the fall. Cheers, Mike Tettenborn http://picasaweb.google.com/MikeTettenborn/Meteorites#5281671186567766930 From michael at spacerocksinc.com Sat Dec 20 08:35:38 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 05:35:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 Message-ID: <1516524.65001229780138482.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_20_2008.html From Thetoprok at aol.com Sat Dec 20 09:04:48 2008 From: Thetoprok at aol.com (Thetoprok at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 09:04:48 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad.. Holbrook, DaG 956 JaH 073 and More! Message-ID: Hi List, I usually have a small sale this time of year to help fund my Tucson trip, this year is no different. http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/alienrockfarm_W0QQ_dmdZ1QQ_ipgZ50QQ_sopZ12 Happy Holidays! Larry **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1215047751x1200957972/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=De cemailfooterNO62) From chinaren76 at yahoo.com Sat Dec 20 10:01:46 2008 From: chinaren76 at yahoo.com (Ma Lan) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 07:01:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: ebay auction starting price at $0.01 Message-ID: <340009.26569.qm@web52701.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hello list, Here is two pieces of Zunhua with nice FC, and one with starting price at just 1 cent, http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/common_murre_W0QQ_dmdZ1QQ_ipgZ50QQ_sopZ12 Good luck! Best, Ma Lan IMCA #8234 Web http://www.malanmeteorites.com From altmann at meteorite-martin.de Sat Dec 20 10:08:33 2008 From: altmann at meteorite-martin.de (Martin Altmann) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 16:08:33 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 In-Reply-To: <1516524.65001229780138482.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> References: <1516524.65001229780138482.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <002001c962b4$d3c22080$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Really the best presentation of a Martian to public I ever saw. My respect! Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Michael Johnson Gesendet: Samstag, 20. Dezember 2008 14:36 An: Meteorite List Betreff: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20,2008 http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_20_2008.html ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Sat Dec 20 10:18:48 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 07:18:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 In-Reply-To: <002001c962b4$d3c22080$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Message-ID: <165821.41249.qm@web110604.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> But no information! What Mars rock, where at? Mike --- On Sat, 12/20/08, Martin Altmann wrote: > From: Martin Altmann > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Saturday, December 20, 2008, 8:08 AM > Really the best presentation of a Martian to public > I ever saw. > > My respect! > Martin > > > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im > Auftrag von Michael > Johnson > Gesendet: Samstag, 20. Dezember 2008 14:36 > An: Meteorite List > Betreff: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the > Day - December > 20,2008 > > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_20_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael at spacerocksinc.com Sat Dec 20 12:12:24 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 09:12:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 In-Reply-To: <165821.41249.qm@web110604.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <10305208.72481229793144472.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.meteorman.org/Mars_LED.htm ________________ Michael Johnson http://www.rocksfromspace.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Farmer" To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, "Martin Altmann" Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 10:18:48 AM (GMT-0500) America/New_York Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 But no information! What Mars rock, where at? Mike --- On Sat, 12/20/08, Martin Altmann wrote: > From: Martin Altmann > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Saturday, December 20, 2008, 8:08 AM > Really the best presentation of a Martian to public > I ever saw. > > My respect! > Martin > > > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im > Auftrag von Michael > Johnson > Gesendet: Samstag, 20. Dezember 2008 14:36 > An: Meteorite List > Betreff: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the > Day - December > 20,2008 > > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_20_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From aknoefel at minorplanets.de Sat Dec 20 13:46:05 2008 From: aknoefel at minorplanets.de (=?iso-8859-1?q?=41=6e=64=72=e9=20=4b=6e=f6=66=65=6c?=) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 19:46:05 +0100 (MET) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Mali Meteorites coin/medal auction ends in about 24hours on ebay. Message-ID: <200812201846.mBKIk5Ui010375@post.webmailer.de> In about 24 hours the auction for coin #050 of the new 'Mali Meteorites' coin/medal end on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160305298305 Only 100 coins are minted and no more will be produced. In this auction free shipping worldwide is included. This coin/medal contains an authentic sample (slice: 7.3 x 5.2 x 1.4mm, weight 0.18g) of the Chergach Meteorite, fall in the Tombouctou region of Mali in July 2007. coin size: 38mm (1.5") weight: ~19g base metal: zink alloy finish: antique silver The coin came in an acrylic coin capsule and with a certificate of authenticity. Season's Greetings! Andr? Kn?fel Lindenberg/Germany IMCA #4122 From korotev at wustl.edu Sat Dec 20 14:19:02 2008 From: korotev at wustl.edu (Randy Korotev) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 13:19:02 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] question on performing a nickel test In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200812201917.mBKJHjh09062@levee.wustl.edu> Mike: I've had the same experience. The problem, I think, is that the DMG test is actually TOO sensitive to nickel. All meteoritic metal is >5% (50,000 ppm) Ni. Metals with only a few hundred ppm Ni will give a positive result with DMG test, however. I think many steels and cast irons may have a few hundred ppm Ni. This subject came up a few years ago on this list and someone (I forget who) mentioned that in his experience, the swab stayed pink quite a bit longer with a real meteorite metal while the pink faded in an hour with "false positives." Randy Korotev At 14:09 19-12-08 Friday, you wrote: >Hi List, > >If someone has experience with the Allerderm Nickel test and wouldn't >mind sharing their knowledge of how to do it... > >I am attempting to do a nickel test at home here and I ran into a bit >of a snag. I have a piece of iron that most likely is not a piece of >meteoritic iron that I was using as a test piece. I sanded a surface >on it, cleaned it with alcohol several times, got out the trusty >Allertest NI test kit from Allerderm, placed a drop each of the >little bottles onto a cotton swab, and placed that on the cleaned >surface of the metal. Using this piece of iron as a control piece, I >wanted to be sure I wasn't doing something in the steps I was using >that would cause me to get a false positive. On this test - test, >the swab turned pink quickly. If I do the exact steps only add in >placing a drop of white vinegar on the cleaned surface, wait a couple >minutes and then apply the nickel test, I get almost a blood red swab >in just the first second. The first time I did this test and saw >this, I thought I had contaminated the surface so I sanded it again >down to a fresh surface, cleaned it several times again with alcohol >before attempting the nickel test without vinegar. Second time, same >result. When using a drop of vinegar again, same result - blood red >quickly. > >What am I doing wrong, if anything? Could I still have contamination >on the metal that the sanding and cleaning with alcohol is not removing? > >Mike in CO >______________________________________________ >http://www.meteoritecentral.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From eric at meteoritewatch.com Sat Dec 20 15:10:08 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 12:10:08 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: New Years Sale - Day 2 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <494D5120.3000400@meteoritewatch.com> Hi all, Here's the items for Day 2 of the sale. More Brenhams, Franconia, some very nice NWA, and a nice end cut of NWA 869. http://www.meteoritesusa.com/meteorites-for-sale.htm#day2 To order just call 904-236-5394 or email me off-list Eric From dfpens01 at yahoo.com Sat Dec 20 15:38:35 2008 From: dfpens01 at yahoo.com (David Pensenstadler) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 12:38:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 In-Reply-To: <10305208.72481229793144472.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <815650.42636.qm@web90306.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Awesome display....but, shouldn't the meteor be heading for Earth rather than Mars?? I know, I know, it would just confuse the public. Dave --- On Sat, 12/20/08, Michael Johnson wrote: > From: Michael Johnson > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 > To: "Meteorite List" > Date: Saturday, December 20, 2008, 12:12 PM > http://www.meteorman.org/Mars_LED.htm > ________________ > > Michael Johnson > http://www.rocksfromspace.org > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael Farmer" > > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, "Martin > Altmann" > Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 10:18:48 AM (GMT-0500) > America/New_York > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of > the Day - December 20, 2008 > > But no information! What Mars rock, where at? > Mike > > > --- On Sat, 12/20/08, Martin Altmann > wrote: > > > From: Martin Altmann > > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture > of the Day - December 20, 2008 > > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Saturday, December 20, 2008, 8:08 AM > > Really the best presentation of a Martian to public > > I ever saw. > > > > My respect! > > Martin > > > > > > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > > Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] > Im > > Auftrag von Michael > > Johnson > > Gesendet: Samstag, 20. Dezember 2008 14:36 > > An: Meteorite List > > Betreff: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of > the > > Day - December > > 20,2008 > > > > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_20_2008.html > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From gmhupe at htn.net Sat Dec 20 16:21:04 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 16:21:04 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Incomparable New Meteorite - NWA 5480 Message-ID: <9EC26156701B4337A0359CA78172A959@Gregor> Dear List Members, To celebrate the holiday season, I would like to announce an exciting new meteorite: NWA 5480; a fresh, and incomparable new Olivine Diogenite. Several stones were found in Arg Shash, Mali in July 2008 by nomadic meteorite hunters. Samples from two different stones were sent to the University of Washington (UofW) where they were analyzed and determined to be meteoritic. Eventually seven stones with a combined Total Known Weight (TKW) of 4912 grams were purchased in October/November 2008, and the full type sample was analyzed at UofW and multiple oxygen isotope studies were performed at the Carnegie Institution, Washington, DC. Cosmic-ray exposure (CRE) analysis is currently being performed by scientists in Japan to determine how long this meteorite had been in space before landing on Earth. With the addition of NWA 5480, there are now seven known members of the "Olivine Diogenite" group (three specimens are from Antarctica and four are from Northwest Africa). NWA 5480 is texturally very different from the others and is the most olivine-rich, and may represent the deepest specimen of the Vesta mantle yet discovered! Image of 108.2-gram complete slice displaying mottled appearance of matrix: http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa5480/nwa5480slice.jpg Close-up image of NWA 5480 showing gemmy crystals (image measures 25mm wide): http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa5480/nwa5480closeup.jpg Image of large 1.5cm chromite grains on 507-gram stone: http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa5480/nwa5480chromite.jpg False-color BSE image of NWA 5480 showing olivine grain distribution: http://www.lunarrock.com/nwa5480/nwa5480bse.jpg NWA 5480 is a very dense and hard meteorite but takes an extremely nice polish, which highlights the dazzling crystals that make up the matrix of this remarkable material. Classification submitted to the Meteoritical Bulletin for NWA 5480: Northwest Africa 5480 Mali Find: July 2008 Achondrite (olivine diogenite) History: Found near Arg Shash, Mali in July 2008 and purchased by Greg Hup? in October/November 2008 from Moroccan dealers in Erfoud and Tagounite. Physical characteristics: Seven very fresh, dense, dark brown to pale green mottled stones lacking obvious fusion crust with a total weight of 4912 g. Sporadic large, black chromite grains (up to 1.5 cm across) are visible on the exterior of some stones. Petrography: (A. Irving and S. Kuehner, UWS) Medium to coarse grained, and composed mainly of olivine (57 vol.%) and orthopyroxene (42 vol.%), with minor chromite (1 vol.%) and accessory troilite and Ni-free metal. Plagioclase is absent. The distribution of olivine and orthopyroxene is very heterogeneous, with regions composed of up to 90% of either mineral, some in irregular, schlieren-like polygranular arrays. Olivine-rich regions (brown) are composed of clusters of small, polygonal to rounded grains intergrown with chromite and orthopyroxene; orthopyroxene-rich zones (pale green) consist of interlocking, larger oikocrysts of orthopyroxene containing numerous tiny chadacrysts of olivine. Geochemistry: Orthopyroxene (Fs24.8Wo1.8, FeO/MnO = 25.6), olivine (Fa30.2, FeO/MnO = 46.6), chromite [(Cr/ Cr+Al) = 0.828, Mg/(Mg+Fe) = 0.181-0.207, TiO2 = 0.71 wt.%]. Oxygen Isotopes (D. Rumble, CIW): replicate analyses of acid-washed bulk silicates by laser fluorination gave, respectively, d18O = 3.215, 3.509; d17O = 1.459, 1.611; D17O = -0.232, -0.234 per mil. Classification: Achondrite (olivine diogenite). Specimens: A total of 21.4 g of sample and one polished thin section are on deposit at UWS. Mr. G. M. Hup? holds the main mass. I would like to thank the scientists who tirelessly studied NWA 5480. Without their hard work, we would not be able to enjoy this fantastic new Olivine Diogenite! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault From marcin at meteoryty.pl Sat Dec 20 17:19:51 2008 From: marcin at meteoryty.pl (Marcin Cimala - PolandMET) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 23:19:51 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 References: <10305208.72481229793144472.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <001201c962f1$13fa7030$0d00000a@polandmezrd5i9> > > http://www.meteorman.org/Mars_LED.htm Hello List For me the most incredible part of this display is this walls with view from the planet Mars. Ech this is what I want to do in my room from long time. :) What photos they use to do this wall-prints ? This looks sharp so this photos must be in very high resolution I think. Anyway, beautifull -----[ MARCIN CIMALA ]-----[ I.M.C.A.#3667 ]----- http://www.Meteoryty.pl marcin(at)meteoryty.pl http://www.PolandMET.com marcin(at)meteorite.pl http://www.Gao-Guenie.com GSM: +48 (793) kosmos --------[ Member of Polish Meteoritical Society ]-------- From gmhupe at htn.net Sat Dec 20 17:28:33 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 17:28:33 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 5480 Specimens - AD Message-ID: <3F825049075940C68AE198B5512381D7@Gregor> Dear List Members, I've received numerous email requests for a list of what is available of NWA 5480, the Fresh, and Incomparable new Olivine Diogenite. Because of the rarity and physical nature of NWA 5480, I hired one of the best meteorite cutters there is, his work shows in the professional quality of this prepared material. The larger slices measure 3mm thick while the smaller ones are 2mm. Here is the total selection of NWA 5480. These were difficult to photograph, large surface area with high polish. I priced NWA 5480 at Holiday rates. Considering the acquisition and preparation costs, and the cut/polish losses, you will not find a better deal on this rare of a meteorite! NWA 5480 Olivine Diogenite: 990g End Cut (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00001.jpg 670g End Cut http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00003.jpg 168.3g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00005.jpg 145.2g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00006.jpg 137g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00007.jpg 127g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00008.jpg 108.2g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00009.jpg 102.5g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00010.jpg 96.3g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00011.jpg 507g Complete Stone (with large chromites up to 1.5cm) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00001.jpg 494g Complete Stone http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00003.jpg 462g Complete Stone http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00005.jpg 269g Complete Stone http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00007.jpg 60g Complete Stone http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00009.jpg 71.3g End Cut http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00010.jpg 21.2g End Cut http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00012.jpg 16.7g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00013.jpg 16.3g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00014.jpg 16.1g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00015.jpg 14.4g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00016.jpg 14g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00017.jpg 13.3g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00018.jpg 12.7g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00020.jpg 12.6g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00021.jpg 12.5g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00022.jpg 11.7g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00023.jpg 10g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00024.jpg 3.152g fragment http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00025.jpg 1.4g ps (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00026.jpg 892mg ps (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00027.jpg 2.540g fragments (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00028.jpg cs - complete slice ps - part slice Pricing: Whole stones (just 5 available) - $10.00/g Large end cuts (Only one left) - $12.00/g Large slices (Only 5 left) - $16.00/g Small slices (9 available slices, 2 end cuts, 1 fragment) - $20.00/g Thank you for considering these! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault From almitt at kconline.com Sat Dec 20 17:55:51 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 17:55:51 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] question on performing a nickel test In-Reply-To: <200812201917.mBKJHjh09062@levee.wustl.edu> References: <200812201917.mBKJHjh09062@levee.wustl.edu> Message-ID: Hi Mike and all, In Richard Norton's new field guide, he lists some house hold chemicals that you can use to preform a nickel test also. I need to look it up and let people know which page. Haven't tried it yet but I am sure that Richard Norton has. One other problem with the jewlery nickel test kits I think, is that they tend to expire. Don't know if the chemicals have useful life span or not but had trouble with one at a show I was doing to show the nickel test result. All my best. --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: "Randy Korotev" To: Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 2:19 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] question on performing a nickel test > Mike: > > I've had the same experience. The problem, I think, is that the DMG test > is actually TOO sensitive to nickel. All meteoritic metal is >5% (50,000 > ppm) Ni. Metals with only a few hundred ppm Ni will give a positive > result with DMG test, however. I think many steels and cast irons may > have a few hundred ppm Ni. > > This subject came up a few years ago on this list and someone (I forget > who) mentioned that in his experience, the swab stayed pink quite a bit > longer with a real meteorite metal while the pink faded in an hour with > "false positives." > > Randy Korotev > > > > > > > > At 14:09 19-12-08 Friday, you wrote: >>Hi List, >> >>If someone has experience with the Allerderm Nickel test and wouldn't >>mind sharing their knowledge of how to do it... >> >>I am attempting to do a nickel test at home here and I ran into a bit >>of a snag. I have a piece of iron that most likely is not a piece of >>meteoritic iron that I was using as a test piece. I sanded a surface >>on it, cleaned it with alcohol several times, got out the trusty >>Allertest NI test kit from Allerderm, placed a drop each of the >>little bottles onto a cotton swab, and placed that on the cleaned >>surface of the metal. Using this piece of iron as a control piece, I >>wanted to be sure I wasn't doing something in the steps I was using >>that would cause me to get a false positive. On this test - test, >>the swab turned pink quickly. If I do the exact steps only add in >>placing a drop of white vinegar on the cleaned surface, wait a couple >>minutes and then apply the nickel test, I get almost a blood red swab >>in just the first second. The first time I did this test and saw >>this, I thought I had contaminated the surface so I sanded it again >>down to a fresh surface, cleaned it several times again with alcohol >>before attempting the nickel test without vinegar. Second time, same >>result. When using a drop of vinegar again, same result - blood red >>quickly. >> >>What am I doing wrong, if anything? Could I still have contamination >>on the metal that the sanding and cleaning with alcohol is not removing? >> >>Mike in CO >>______________________________________________ >>http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>Meteorite-list mailing list >>Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From dave at fallingrocks.com Sat Dec 20 18:41:46 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 18:41:46 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] FW: Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 Message-ID: Nice to see Patricia again, Tim, and you have a beautiful daughter. Congrats on what has obviously been the successful launch of that exhibit...just FANTASTIC! Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Michael Johnson Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 12:12 PM To: Meteorite List Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 http://www.meteorman.org/Mars_LED.htm ________________ Michael Johnson http://www.rocksfromspace.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Farmer" To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, "Martin Altmann" Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 10:18:48 AM (GMT-0500) America/New_York Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 But no information! What Mars rock, where at? Mike --- On Sat, 12/20/08, Martin Altmann wrote: > From: Martin Altmann > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - > December 20, 2008 > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Saturday, December 20, 2008, 8:08 AM Really the best > presentation of a Martian to public I ever saw. > > My respect! > Martin > > > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von > Michael Johnson > Gesendet: Samstag, 20. Dezember 2008 14:36 > An: Meteorite List > Betreff: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - > December > 20,2008 > > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_20_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From epgrondine at yahoo.com Sat Dec 20 18:45:52 2008 From: epgrondine at yahoo.com (E.P. Grondine) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 15:45:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] One holocene start impact epicenter? Message-ID: <23970.84202.qm@web36905.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi all - I hope that some of you find the map in this piece of interest: http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2008/07/21/comet.ART_ART_07-21-08_B1_P5APQ1P.html?sid=1017 I don't know whether diffraction lenses would form in ice, thus allowing larger fragments to survive, nor can I estimate blast cushioning of later entering smaller pieces, thus ensuring their survival, but perhaps at least some sure impact products may have formed at the bottom of any ice crater. E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas From p.marmet at sunrise.ch Sat Dec 20 18:56:57 2008 From: p.marmet at sunrise.ch (Peter Marmet) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 00:56:57 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - LUNAR NWA 4734 - new pieces added! Message-ID: <871799a20812201556w70b9d9c1o86c75f9ca06041ea@mail.gmail.com> Hello All, we just removed the sold ones and added a few more pieces of the stunning LUNAR NWA 4734 ! The discount price of $ 950.00 per gram is only guaranteed until the end of the year 2008. NWA 4734 is normally sold for $ 1400.00 - $ 1800.00 per gram. Please see here: http://www.marmet-meteorites.com/id44.html Thank you, Peter Peter Marmet Bern, Switzerland IMCA #2747 p.marmet at mysunrise.ch http://www.marmet-meteorites.com/ From midwest at meteorman.org Sat Dec 20 19:37:02 2008 From: midwest at meteorman.org (Timothy Heitz) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 18:37:02 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December20, 2008 References: <1516524.65001229780138482.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> <002001c962b4$d3c22080$177f2a59@name86d88d87e2> Message-ID: Thank You Martin !!! Tim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Altmann" To: Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 9:08 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December20, 2008 Really the best presentation of a Martian to public I ever saw. My respect! Martin -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Michael Johnson Gesendet: Samstag, 20. Dezember 2008 14:36 An: Meteorite List Betreff: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20,2008 http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_20_2008.html ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From midwest at meteorman.org Sat Dec 20 19:39:15 2008 From: midwest at meteorman.org (Timothy Heitz) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 18:39:15 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 References: Message-ID: Thank you Dave !!!!!!!!!! I'm remembering to keep it fun Tim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Gheesling" To: "'Timothy Heitz'" Cc: "'Meteorite List'" Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 5:41 PM Subject: FW: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 Nice to see Patricia again, Tim, and you have a beautiful daughter. Congrats on what has obviously been the successful launch of that exhibit...just FANTASTIC! Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Michael Johnson Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 12:12 PM To: Meteorite List Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 http://www.meteorman.org/Mars_LED.htm ________________ Michael Johnson http://www.rocksfromspace.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Farmer" To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, "Martin Altmann" Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 10:18:48 AM (GMT-0500) America/New_York Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 20, 2008 But no information! What Mars rock, where at? Mike --- On Sat, 12/20/08, Martin Altmann wrote: > From: Martin Altmann > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - > December 20, 2008 > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Saturday, December 20, 2008, 8:08 AM Really the best > presentation of a Martian to public I ever saw. > > My respect! > Martin > > > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von > Michael Johnson > Gesendet: Samstag, 20. Dezember 2008 14:36 > An: Meteorite List > Betreff: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - > December > 20,2008 > > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_20_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Sun Dec 21 04:32:34 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 19:32:34 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] QMIG UPDATE Message-ID: <75C3C16A8C9443E890F99DCB9DBE5AF4@your0a700f0aaf> Listoids Its getting closer to that time of year again tho XMAS Eve sees me turning 50 To any and all listoids a very merry XMAS and Happy New Year May all good things happen to you and yours - perhaps a lunar landing gently on your garden tho Michael would prefer one to crash through his roof... I've spent the last few days mapping out where QMIG will prioritise next year - work and family have first priority and there is never much time to chase rox (1) a trade with a southern museum since I have shitloads of M******L - now there is a gorgeous fresh stone with huge chondrules (2) more slices from a local museum (3) checking if a uni down south found the missing main mass of ******* (4) recovering from my diet of bread and dripping to save up to repatriate some stolen chondrites (5) and a snoop thru some of the other uni collections I've finally peered thru the homepage html and fixed the animated dollar for donations - I'm not html klever and making the website was something difficult... It perhaps is not the greatest but it exists and tis time for a major revamp and overhaul - methinx a cart based sales system is the first cab off the rank and I want to spend more time on polished thin-section prints... I have had the huge haul of two donations - one tiny donation from M to check if it actually worked and another from D** - I'm actively seeking donations pro tem to help with repatriating many of the chondrites that disappeared in mysterious circumstances - I know where many of them are... its yet another stolen generation... any assistance with this would be greatly appreciated Cheers http://qmig.org From michael at spacerocksinc.com Sun Dec 21 07:15:29 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 04:15:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 21, 2008 Message-ID: <20400850.98461229861729317.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_21_2008.html From rsvp321 at hotmail.com Sun Dec 21 07:26:04 2008 From: rsvp321 at hotmail.com (Pete Pete) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 07:26:04 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toronto, Canada Meteorite Display Message-ID: Greetings, all, For my fellow Canadians and northwestern New Yorkers, the Royal Ontario Museum in Toronto is featuring a great sounding meteorite display for the next few months, including Greg Hupe's NWA 5000. (Will that be the encased giant "slab", Greg?) http://www.rom.on.ca/news/releases/public.php?mediakey=lf3mjmmzij http://www.rom.on.ca/news/releases/public.php?mediakey=lf3mjmmzij Best of the holidays, Pete _________________________________________________________________ Keep in touch and up to date with friends and family. Make the connection now. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/ From tett at rogers.com Sun Dec 21 08:44:04 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 08:44:04 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toronto, Canada Meteorite Display In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <494E4824.6010901@rogers.com> Pete, A few of us saw this first hand on Thursday. The ROM has created a wonderful new Mineral exhibit which was opened to the public on Saturday and a few of us got the invite to see it before the public opening. We were lucky to meet up with Greg Hupe who brought along 8 planetary meteorites and so we were able to see NWA5000 along with Greg's other gorgeous planetaries. The ROM has created a new permanent mineral exhibit which is outstanding. Part of the display is a large cabinet beautifully organized with typical meteorites from the various classes. Nicely done in a way to excite new comers to the world of meteorites. In front of the display is are interactive monitors where visitors can see a picture of the display. Touching the specific meteorite images brings up a screen with close up shoots and detailed information. Very slick. In a separate cabinet is the temporary display of NWA5000. Very very cool! Definitely worth the trip to the ROM. Cheers! Mike Tettenborn Pete Pete wrote: > > Greetings, all, > > For my fellow Canadians and northwestern New Yorkers, the Royal Ontario Museum in Toronto is featuring a great sounding meteorite display for the next few months, including Greg Hupe's NWA 5000. (Will that be the encased giant "slab", Greg?) > > http://www.rom.on.ca/news/releases/public.php?mediakey=lf3mjmmzij > http://www.rom.on.ca/news/releases/public.php?mediakey=lf3mjmmzij > > Best of the holidays, > Pete > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Keep in touch and up to date with friends and family. Make the connection now. > http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/ > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From vs.petrovich at gmail.com Sun Dec 21 11:09:57 2008 From: vs.petrovich at gmail.com (Sergey Vasiliev) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 17:09:57 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Ebay auctions ending Message-ID: Hello List! Some of my historical auctions will end in 1 day: - Krasnojarsk (PAL-MG) - 0.855 g: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190273878705 - Kernouve (H6) - 1.203g http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200288026538 Nice slice of Verkhnyi Saltov (IIIAB) 19.86 g: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200288026494 All items (including my ebay store items) can be seen here: http://stores.ebay.com/svassiliev Thank you for your time! Merry Christmas to all! Sergey ----------------------------------------- Sergey Vasiliev U Dalnice 839, Prague 5, 15500 Czech Republic ------------------------------------------ http://www.sv-meteorites.com http://impactites.net http://systematic-mineralogy.com From gmhupe at htn.net Sun Dec 21 13:06:24 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 13:06:24 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Toronto, Canada Meteorite Display References: Message-ID: <1A63C2E200AB4B32AC0F3BCDE76D9326@Gregor> Hello Pete and List, I would like to make a correct to Pete's email to the List. NWA 5000 is my brother, Adam's, not mine. He loaned it to the Royal Ontario Museum and it caught the eye of the press; newspapers, radio, television. What is on display is the 9.6kg Main Mass of NWA 5000. It is in its own cabinet with excellent informative graphics accompanying it, very well done. I was one of the lucky ones, along with Tony Irving, who were invited and attended the grand opening party of the Teck Suite of Galleries: Earth's Treasures, the ROM's newest meteorite and mineral gallery. They did a fantastic job! Unfortunately Adam was unable to attend. For some fun Show-n-Tell for the morning after the party with some of the ROM staff and David Gregory, I brought five Lunar and three Martian planetary main masses from The Hupe Collection. Some fellow Canadian collectors who joined us in the afternoon were Mike Tettenborn, Patrick Herrmann and Roman Jirasek. We had a great time! Thanks again Patrick for dinner! I highly recommend everyone to make the trip to the ROM to see the new meteorite and mineral gallery, along with the rest of the museum, it is worth it!! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete Pete" To: "meteoritelist meteoritelist" Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 7:26 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Toronto, Canada Meteorite Display > > > Greetings, all, > > For my fellow Canadians and northwestern New Yorkers, the Royal Ontario > Museum in Toronto is featuring a great sounding meteorite display for the > next few months, including Greg Hupe's NWA 5000. (Will that be the encased > giant "slab", Greg?) > > http://www.rom.on.ca/news/releases/public.php?mediakey=lf3mjmmzij > http://www.rom.on.ca/news/releases/public.php?mediakey=lf3mjmmzij > > Best of the holidays, > Pete > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Keep in touch and up to date with friends and family. Make the connection > now. > http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/ > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From Metorman46 at aol.com Sun Dec 21 14:31:00 2008 From: Metorman46 at aol.com (Metorman46 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 14:31:00 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 21, 2008 Message-ID: Hello Mirko and michael; That is a very impressive comparison,i especially like the prominent heat affected rim zone of ziz.Great picture,thanks for taking the time to share it with all the list members. Best Regards;Herman Archer IMCA 2770. **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From yellowengine at earthlink.net Sun Dec 21 15:13:25 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 14:13:25 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: 197g Juancheng + Others. Message-ID: <1104557.1229890405697.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Good Afternoon, I have added a spectacular 197g Juancheng individual to my list of collection pieces for sale. It features 95% fusion crust (primary and secondary, with a bluish hue), large regmaglypts, and a fresh break on the corner revealing its metal flecked interior (..including a large, dark clast of sorts). Larger stones from this fall are becoming harder and harder to find, especially of this quality. Acquired from the Michael Farmer collection several years ago (..so yes, it is a top grade specimen.) Have a look, prices are listed below. Happy Holidays, Ryan J. Pawelski http://outdoors.webshots.com/album/569165160RMTnOx Bremham (Pal) - 195g "palm size" full slice (thin). $780 Gibeon - 460g etched full slice. $575 Juancheng - 197g complete stone, see description above. $985 Millbillillie - 212g complete stone, "a grade". $2,120 Moss - .60g part slice, very thin, expertly prepared. $105 From eric at meteoritewatch.com Sun Dec 21 17:17:44 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 14:17:44 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: New Years Sale - Day 3 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <494EC088.4040401@meteoritewatch.com> Hi all, Here's 4 great meteorites for Day 3 of the New Years Sale. I'll be adding more today as well. These are just teasers... ;) http://www.meteoritesusa.com/meteorites-for-sale.htm#day3 Enjoy... Eric From grf2 at verizon.net Sun Dec 21 19:08:07 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 19:08:07 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December20, 2008 References: <815650.42636.qm@web90306.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <9AB33CFEB3114DA1B250D1AF696AF41D@ASUS> DAVE, meteorite must strike Mars to release Martain fragments which then strike we'ens. confusing?? ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Pensenstadler" To: "Meteorite List" ; "Michael Johnson" Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 3:38 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December20, 2008 Awesome display....but, shouldn't the meteor be heading for Earth rather than Mars?? I know, I know, it would just confuse the public. Dave --- On Sat, 12/20/08, Michael Johnson wrote: > From: Michael Johnson > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - > December 20, 2008 > To: "Meteorite List" > Date: Saturday, December 20, 2008, 12:12 PM > http://www.meteorman.org/Mars_LED.htm > ________________ > > Michael Johnson > http://www.rocksfromspace.org > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael Farmer" > > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, "Martin > Altmann" > Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 10:18:48 AM (GMT-0500) > America/New_York > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of > the Day - December 20, 2008 > > But no information! What Mars rock, where at? > Mike > > > --- On Sat, 12/20/08, Martin Altmann > wrote: > > > From: Martin Altmann > > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture > of the Day - December 20, 2008 > > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Saturday, December 20, 2008, 8:08 AM > > Really the best presentation of a Martian to public > > I ever saw. > > > > My respect! > > Martin > > > > > > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > > Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] > Im > > Auftrag von Michael > > Johnson > > Gesendet: Samstag, 20. Dezember 2008 14:36 > > An: Meteorite List > > Betreff: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of > the > > Day - December > > 20,2008 > > > > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_20_2008.html > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From grf2 at verizon.net Sun Dec 21 20:03:01 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 20:03:01 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 21, 2008 References: <20400850.98461229861729317.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <31A71AA0E6DD4C8DAE7DB2E43D402EAA@ASUS> Irons are so magnificent. That's a beauty and silicatious is cooler than cool ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Johnson" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 7:15 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 21,2008 > > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_21_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From drtanuki at yahoo.com Sun Dec 21 22:32:56 2008 From: drtanuki at yahoo.com (drtanuki) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 19:32:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Catalogues of meteorite collections Message-ID: <27319.13344.qm@web53211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Dear List: ? I have several volumes of meteorite catalogues previously owned by the late Dr. Elbert King.?? Not all of them are listed below.? ? ? Serious offers?considered off-list; please email me. ? 1)? Catalogue of the Collection of Meteorites of the National Museum in Prague by Karel Tucek, 103pgs. and plates and map,?1968; signed by King. ? 2)? Catalogue of Meteorites in the Geological Museum of the University of Copenhagen by V.F. Buchwald and P. Graff-Peterson, 1976, 87pgs; signed Dr. Elbert A. King with the author`s compliments. ? 3)? Catalogue of Meteorites in the Mineralogical Collection of the University of Rome by A. Cavarretta Maras, 1975, 61pgs. ? 4) Catalogue of Meteorites Collection of Walter Zeitschel, 1985, 22pgs.; signed by Niki and Walter with personal letter enclosed. ? 5) Meteorites in the Fort Hays Kansas State College Museum by Miller, Constable and Brooks, period photocopy labeled "Return to Brookins", 6pgs with notes on 30 meteorites and additional information on Ness County. ? 6) Catalogue of Meteorites in the Collections of Arizona State University including the Nininger Collection by Karr, et al, 1970, 257pgs; signed King. ? 7) Catalog of Meteorites in the Collection of Arizona State University including the Nininger Meteorite Collection by Lewis and Moore, 1976, 302pgs; signed King. ? 8) The Meteorite and Tektite Collection of the American Museum of Natural History by Mason, 1964, 40pgs; signed King. ? 9)? Bibliography of Meteorites by Soviet Acad. of Science, Vol 1 and Vol 2 in Russian, 1982, 429pgs & 205pgs.; signed by King. ? 10) List of Meteorites in the Dieter Heinlein Collection, 1985, 2pgs; includes personal letter from D. H. to Dr. King. ? 11) Meteorite collection of Marlin D.?Cilz, not dated, period photocopy. ? 12) Catalog of the Collections of the Institute of Meteoritics The University of New Mexico as of Oct. 1, 1965 by LaPaz, 1965, 136pgs with numerous b/w plates; signed King. ? ?All of the above are paperbound except for the photocopies as listed.? ? ? Thank you in advance.? Best Regards, Dirk Ross...Tokyo From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Mon Dec 22 02:07:36 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:07:36 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] main mass of SCORPION BIGHT for sale (oz only pending export determination) Message-ID: <727C14969C5847A9B40A585C66262AA9@your0a700f0aaf> Listoids Main Mass of Scorpion Bight (Western Australia) for sale OZ ONLY SALE PRO TEM PENDING EXPORT DETERMINATION Few if any Australian main masses reside in private collections and this is a once in a lifetime opportunity to obtain Australia's most ferocious meteorite and probably the last Western Australian meteorite to be offered for sale A defining moment for private collectors - a unique museum grade individual main mass for advanced collectors http://cgi.ebay.com.au/SCORPION-BIGHT-AUSTRALIAS-MOST-FEROCIOUS-METEORITE_W0QQitemZ230315647662QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_15?hash=item230315647662&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A1|39%3A1|240%3A1318 And a very merry Christmas to all - ask Santa to buy this for you ! From illaenus at wp.pl Mon Dec 22 04:39:18 2008 From: illaenus at wp.pl (Tomasz Jakubowski) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 10:39:18 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD Krasnojarsk 62g Message-ID: <494f6046a7db38.02304616@wp.pl> Dear List Members, I have a rare large specimen of the renowned Krasnojarsk meteorite (the "Pallas Iron") that weighs 62g for sale. Photos and a short description regarding the provenance of the specimen are available here: http://picasaweb.google.pl/illaenus/Krasnojarsk62Grams# Please direct any questions you might have to my email - illaenus at gmail.com Kind Regards Tomasz Jakubowski IMCA #2321 -- Free Tibet ---------------------------------------------------- Sk?d pochodzi Twoje nazwisko? Sprawd? sam, kliknij: http://klik.wp.pl/?adr=http%3A%2F%2Fcorto.www.wp.pl%2Fas%2Fbliscy.html&sid=590 From drtanuki at yahoo.com Mon Dec 22 04:48:26 2008 From: drtanuki at yahoo.com (drtanuki) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 01:48:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Aircraft LIDAR -Lasers Uncover Craters- Whitecourt, CA Message-ID: <523151.28179.qm@web53206.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Dear List Members, A friend sent me a link to this article. Interesting article! Best Regards, Dirk Ross... Tokyo http://sciencenow.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/2008/1201/2?etoc Lasers Uncover Craters By Phil Berardelli ScienceNOW Daily News 1 December 2008 Researchers have uncovered a pond-sized crater in the woods of central Alberta, Canada, carved out by a meteor that slammed into Earth about 1100 years ago. The technique they used to pinpoint the pit--a laser take on radar--figures to help scientists find evidence of hundreds of similar impacts that have remained hidden until now. ... (con`t...see link for whole article). From drtanuki at yahoo.com Mon Dec 22 05:29:31 2008 From: drtanuki at yahoo.com (drtanuki) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 02:29:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Slideshow: All craters great and small Message-ID: <547194.64051.qm@web53209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Dear List, More on impact craters. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year 2009 from Japan, Dirk Ross...Tokyo http://www.meteoritesjapan.com http://www.insekijapan.com Slideshow: All craters great and small: http://www.nature.com/news/specials/cosmicimpacts/slideshow.html Interesting article on carbonates found on Mars. Carbonate deposits found on Mars --19 December 2008 http://www.nature.com/news/2008/081219/full/news.2008.1329.html Homepage of NatureNews: http://www.nature.com/news/specials/cosmicimpacts/index.html From drtanuki at yahoo.com Mon Dec 22 05:53:00 2008 From: drtanuki at yahoo.com (drtanuki) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 02:53:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] =?utf-8?q?more_impact_crater_news---_Lake_El?= =?utf-8?q?=E2=80=99gygytgyn_expedition_to_start?= Message-ID: <454432.24946.qm@web53210.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Dear Listmembers, Another impact crater news report. Dirk Ross...Tokyo ScienceDaily (Dec. 22, 2008) http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/12/081220084841.htm "Under Frozen Lake in Siberia, Geoscientists Drill For Secrets of Earth's Ancient Climate" ScienceDaily (Dec. 22, 2008) ? In the next few days, a convoy of bulldozers and trucks will set out from a remote airport in Siberia, heading for a frozen lake 62 miles north of the Arctic Circle, but the trip isn?t a holiday visit to the North Pole. Instead, the trucks will deliver core-drilling equipment for a study of sediment and meteorite-impact rocks that should provide the longest time-continuous climate record ever collected in the Arctic. Once in place next month, the drilling will allow an international team of geoscientists led by Julie Brigham-Grette of the University of Massachusetts Amherst and Martin Melles of the University of Cologne, Germany, to burrow back in time, retrieving core samples more than 3 million years old and answering questions about Earth?s ancient past. Almost impossibly remote, Lake El?gygytgyn (pronounced el?geegitgin), 11 miles in diameter, was formed 3.6 million years ago when a monster meteor, more than a half-mile across, slammed into the Earth between the Arctic Ocean and the Bering Sea. Because this part of the Arctic was never covered by ice sheets or glaciers, it has received a steady drift of sediment ? as much as a quarter mile (1,312 feet or 400 meters) deep ? since impact. Thus, it offers a continuous depositional record unlike any other in the world, say Brigham-Grette and colleagues, beneath the crater lake that?s just over 560 feet deep, equal to the height of the Washington Monument. This week?s convoy will take 25 days to crawl through the frozen dark, building a 224-mile ice road as they go, over which the heavy drilling equipment can be moved from the remote airstrip at Pevek, in the north of Russia?s Chukotka Autonomous Region. ?Lake El?gygytgyn is logistically among the most difficult places on Earth to carry out a scientific drilling program,? Brigham-Grette acknowledges. But by all accounts, the rewards should be worth all the effort. In preparation for this day, scientists from institutes in Germany, Russia and Austria as well as UMass Amherst have been flying in by helicopter for focused tests over the past 10 years, drilling pilot cores and taking other samples and measurements. The site has passed every test. For example, the lake bed has been undisturbed by earthquakes, other underground shifting or drying for thousands of years. Pilot cores of 16.7 meters long (54 feet) have already provided a snapshot of climate from 300,000 years ago. El?gygytgyn thus offers a truly unprecedented and ideal opportunity, Brigham-Grette notes, for piecing together a clearer picture of the hemisphere?s prehistoric climate and the dynamic processes of global climate change since the meteor?s impact. Notably, the researchers hope they can learn more about the unexplained shift from a warm forest ecology to permafrost, some 2 million to 3 million years ago. Comparing cores from under Lake El?gygytgyn to those from lower latitudes will help the climate scientists with a high-resolution tool to study climatic change across northeast Asia ?at millennial timescales,? Brigham-Grette says. In addition to climate data, cores may offer the researchers an opportunity to study the 3.6-million-year-old ?impact breccia,? that is, how Earth?s bedrock responded to the meteor?s impact. Some sampling began in November at the science camp drilling site on the lakeshore, where researchers will study the climate history of the permafrost (frozen ground) that surrounds the lake. The other two drill sites will be in the deepest part of the lake. Waiting until Arctic winter to transport and install the equipment, the team can use the frozen lake surface to support drills specially designed to withstand the extreme weather conditions. The scientists plan to start drilling overlapping cores at these frigid locations in February using the windswept lake ice as a drilling platform. Sampling will continue until May 2009, as part of the International Continental Scientific Drilling Program (ICDP). To ensure the safety of both scientists and drill-team members on the isolated lake in potentially life-threatening conditions, Brigham-Grette and colleagues have scrutinized how the ice shifts, cracks, and responds to heavy wind and circulation forces before settling on rig placement. Workers and scientists will live in a protected personnel carrier that will also transport cores from the rig on the lake ice to the science camp on the shore. Sediment cores will be processed for shipment and stored at the lake in a temperature-controlled container until they can be flown to St. Petersburg and later trucked to the University of Cologne, Germany, for study by the international team. An ?archive half? of each core will also be stored at the University of Minnesota. The international collaboration is funded by the U.S. National Science Foundation, the German Federal Ministry for Education and Research, the Alfred Wegener Institute for Polar and Marine Research, Bremerhaven, and GeoForschungsZentrum, Potsdam. In addition to UMass Amherst, investigators from the Russian Academy of Sciences? Far East Geological Institute, Vladivostok, the Northeast Interdisciplinary Scientific Research Institute, Magadan, and Roshydromet?s Arctic and Antarctic Research Institute, St. Petersburg, are taking part. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Adapted from materials provided by University of Massachusetts Amherst. From michael at spacerocksinc.com Mon Dec 22 06:28:09 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 03:28:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 22, 2008 Message-ID: <20569363.137261229945289832.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_22_2008.html From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Mon Dec 22 12:30:55 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 09:30:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA Alternative Group In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <547257.33317.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi Folks, I will soon be starting a Yahoo discussion group to lay the groundwork for a new meteorite group. This group will be for collectors, dealers, hunters, scientists, and the curious. The function of this group will be to maintain the scientific and cultural integrity of meteorites, as well as policing the market for frauds and frivolous use of meteoritical material. This group will also co-sponsor classifications for stones and irons belonging to members - and these new classifications will be submitted on a yearly basis to the Meteoritical Society for consideration and publication in the bulletin. This group will be all-inclusive. All persons with a SPOTLESS record of good business practice and personal ethics are invited to join. The only requirements are that members show the utmost respect to meteorites and the science of meteoritics. This club will also promote science/meteorite outreach at schools, libraries, youth groups, and other places where promising young minds can be introduced to meteoritics. The club will make available, for free, teaching and learning materials for this purpose. This organization is not intended to be a rival or competition for the IMCA - rather, it is meant as an alternative for those who are looking for a fresh perspective on the field and hobby of meteoritics. The Yahoo group I am starting is not going to be the group per-se, the Yahoo group is a temporary place to discuss and lay the groundwork for creating this organization. I want to do this right, so it will take some time - there is no rushing this. Anyone who is interested in discussing this project, please contact me offlist at mike at galactic-stone.com I am open to suggestions, constructive criticisms, and ideas. PS - eventually, all prospective members will undergo a vetting process, which includes a thorough background check of online business practices. Best regards and happy holidays! MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From daistiho at hotmail.com Mon Dec 22 12:46:44 2008 From: daistiho at hotmail.com (tracy latimer) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:46:44 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD Krasnojarsk 62g In-Reply-To: <494f6046a7db38.02304616@wp.pl> References: <494f6046a7db38.02304616@wp.pl> Message-ID: Even though I can't afford it, thank you for showing us a really superior specimen, along with the papers that make it truly a rarity. Tracy Latimer > Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 10:39:18 +0100 > From: illaenus at wp.pl > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Subject: [meteorite-list] AD Krasnojarsk 62g > > Dear List Members, > > I have a rare large specimen of the renowned Krasnojarsk meteorite > (the "Pallas Iron") that weighs 62g for sale. > > Photos and a short description regarding the provenance of the > specimen are available here: > > > http://picasaweb.google.pl/illaenus/Krasnojarsk62Grams# > > > Please direct any questions you might have to my email - > illaenus at gmail.com > > > Kind Regards > Tomasz Jakubowski > IMCA #2321 > > > > -- > Free Tibet > > ---------------------------------------------------- > Sk?d pochodzi Twoje nazwisko? > Sprawd? sam, kliknij: > http://klik.wp.pl/?adr=http%3A%2F%2Fcorto.www.wp.pl%2Fas%2Fbliscy.html&sid=590 > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list _________________________________________________________________ It's the same HotmailR. If by "same" you mean up to 70% faster. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_broad1_122008 From info at mcomemeteorite.it Mon Dec 22 13:59:39 2008 From: info at mcomemeteorite.it (M come Meteorite Meteorites) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 19:59:39 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Some ebay auctions Message-ID: <494fe39b.394.3e60.985697710@webmaildh3.aruba.it> I have put some ebay auctions after many months who want seen here http://members.ebay.it/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewUserPage&userid=mcomemeteorite Matteo M come Meteorite Meteoriti info at mcomemeteorite.it http://www.mcomemeteorite.it http://www.mcomemeteorite.info Mindat Gallery http://www.mindat.org/gallery-5018.html From korotev at wustl.edu Mon Dec 22 14:11:35 2008 From: korotev at wustl.edu (Randy Korotev) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 13:11:35 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - "Buzzard Coulee" Message-ID: <200812221910.mBMJAGh27163@levee.wustl.edu> Collectors: A couple of days ago I was contacted by telephone by Mr. Warren Wiley of Saskatchewan. (Why me?) He told me that he'd found "the second largest" stone of the Dec. 2 fireball and that he wanted to sell it. He seems to be a nice fellow, so I offered to pass his information along to the meteorite list, which was OK with him. He does not have Internet access. A friend of his sent a message this morning with the following text and some attached photos, which I've posted on this website: http://artsci.wustl.edu/~rlkorote/warren/ Mr Wiley's text: "This specimen is from the Buzzard Coulee near Lone Rock, Saskatchewan. This is an immaculate masterpiece of atmospheric sculpting. Heavily regmaglyphed, aesthetic specimen. Found December 2, 2008, 35 minutes after sundown. I have video documentation of my 4 day search; where I found it, and associate professor, Alan Hildebrand, coming to our house to authenticate. Alan Hildebrand and other scientists have completed the lab analysis on my chondrite, and it is an (H 3/4) chondrite. Warren Wiley (owner) is putting it up for bids, serious inquiries only. Contact Warren at 1-780-842-4858." Please do not contact me about this offer. I'm just the messenger and I won't respond to enquiries about this issue. I'm only doing this because I wanted to see the photos. Randy Korotev Saint Louis, MO korotev at wustl.edu From epgrondine at yahoo.com Mon Dec 22 15:54:19 2008 From: epgrondine at yahoo.com (E.P. Grondine) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 12:54:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Nature special edition Message-ID: <531042.38415.qm@web36908.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi Dirk - I wonder what's going to happen when Nature finds out about cometary impacts. E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Mon Dec 22 16:38:58 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 13:38:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Mars Express Reveals Link Between Ferric Oxides and Sulfates in Equatorial Region of Mars Message-ID: <200812222138.NAA16171@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://sci.esa.int/science-e/www/object/index.cfm?fobjectid=43946 Mars Express reveals a link between ferric oxides and sulfates in equatorial regions of Mars 18 Dec 2008 Observations made with the OMEGA imaging spectrometer onboard Mars Express reveal very strong signatures of sulfates and ferric oxides in Aram Chaos. Detailed morphological analyses indicate that the concentration of ferric oxides in this region results from the alteration of a sulfate rich sedimentary formation resting on the floor of the crater. These results are reported by M. Masse and colleagues in the 9 December 2008 issue of the Journal of Geophysical Research. Aram Chaos is a 280 km crater located northeast of Valles Marineris. This depression is connected to the Ares Vallis outflow channel by a 15 km wide and 2.5 km deep gorge cutting though the eastern wall of the crater. In order to decipher the geological history of this area, Masse and colleagues compared the mineralogical data provided by OMEGA with high spatial resolution imagery from a number of Mars orbiters. OMEGA observations are acquired with three detectors: Visible Near Infrared (VNIR, 0.38 to 1.05 ??m), Short-Wavelength Infrared (SWIR, 0.93-2.73 ??m) and Long-Wavelength Infrared (LWIR, 2.55 to 5.2 ??m). Images are obtained at a spatial resolution ranging from 300 m to 4 km per pixel. For the study reported here the team restricted their analysis to the spectral domain between 0.4 and 2.6 ??m. In a systematic survey of ferric oxide signatures on Mars, Aram Chaos exhibited the strongest signature. An in-depth analysis of the spectra for this region revealed regions with mineralogical compositions consistent with ferric oxides and with a mix of ferric oxides and sulfates. Correlation of the spectral signatures with high resolution images allowed Masse and colleagues to infer a formation scenario for the Aram Chaos crater in which the depression seems to have been filled by two sequences of sediments. The older sediment corresponds to chaotic terrains whose mineralogical composition cannot be ascertained since the region is covered by dust. The younger one corresponds to a dome-shaped, 900 m thick, layered sedimentary formation emplaced later on the chaotic terrains. The bulk of this formation is composed of one single bright material containing both sulfates and ferric oxides. After its emplacement, this dome-shaped formation has been grooved by large eolian corridors. In these corridors, eolian removal of the bright material has left local accumulations, in the form of dark sand sheets and dunes of residual grains enriched in ferric oxides. The processes involved in this deposition are most probably very similar to the ones observed by the Opportunity rover in Meridiani Planum suggesting a common geological development process for both regions, and a possible role of water in the past. Reference publication: Masse, M., et al., 2008, "Mineralogical composition, structure, morphology and geological history of Aram Chaos crater fill on Mars derived from OMEGA Mars Express data", Journal of Geophysical Research, 113, E12006, doi:10.1029/2008JE003131 From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Mon Dec 22 16:54:50 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 13:54:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Thousands of Meteorites May Have Fallen in Canadian Meteorite Fall Message-ID: <200812222154.NAA18347@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20081222/meteorites_earth_081222/ 10,000 meteorites touched down in Sask.: scientist CTV.ca December 22, 2008 The sheer number of meteorite fragments that touched down on Nov. 20 in Saskatchewan -- first lighting up the sky in a dramatic light show witnessed by people across the prairies -- may have set a new Canadian record. Rather than just one space rock hitting the ground, as first thought, the bounty appears to consist of thousands of meteorite fragments, according to the team that has co-ordinated the recovery. The group, organized by the University of Calgary, has recovered more than 100 meteorites from the site southwest of Lloydminster, on the border of Alberta and Saskatchewan, and says many more are still out there. Volunteer searcher Ellen Milley, who is pursuing her master's at the University of Calgary's geoscience department, found the first meteorite fragments on Nov. 27. U of C planetary scientist Alan Hildebrand said in a written statement there are roughly 2,000 meteorites of 10 grams or more, per square kilometre, in the northern part of the field where the fragments were found. Altogether, he calculated, there are likely more than 10,000 meteorites on the ground in the area. "The last day that the search teams were out, it snowed all day and we still found five meteorites which is ridiculous. It shows just how many are out there," Hildebrand said. The area where the meteorites were discovered is being called Buzzard Coulee, after a valley near the hamlet of Lone Rock, Sask., where Milley found the first fragments. The largest meteor fall previously on record occurred when hundreds of fragments were recovered near Bruderheim, Alta. in 1960. Hildebrand said the November event could easily surpass those numbers. "I think that the number of individual meteorites that will be recovered for Buzzard Coulee will easily set the Canadian record for the largest fall recovery, but we still don't know how big the biggest meteorite out there is, so we don't know how much mass we can expect to be recovered of the approximately 1 tonne that fell," Hildebrand said. A large-scale search will be held in the spring, prior to the start of cultivation and seeding, to recover as many meteorites as possible, Hildebrand said. He said the initiative planned for spring will be "the biggest meteorite search effort that Canada has ever seen." Scientists are still examining the fragments in an attempt to learn more about where the meteor came from. It has already been classified as an H4 type. The rock is on the low end of the H4 scale, meaning it didn't experience high heat on its parent asteroid. "The meteorite also appears to show that different types of material are mixed together in a subtle way, but we will have to study more thin sections to better understand this," said Dr. Melinda Hutson, a Canadian scientist at Cascadia Meteorite Laboratory at Portlant State University who helped classify the meteorite. "The meteorite is slightly shocked, so the material was possibly stirred by an impact on its parent asteroid." From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Mon Dec 22 17:58:51 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 08:58:51 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] I better not say there's more for sale in my ebay shop so I won't Message-ID: <1B21A172665B4ED2A9BC6AEB64E5E14A@your0a700f0aaf> http://shop.ebay.com.au/merchant/9710bob From tett at rogers.com Mon Dec 22 18:02:08 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 18:02:08 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - "Buzzard Coulee" In-Reply-To: <200812221910.mBMJAGh27163@levee.wustl.edu> References: <200812221910.mBMJAGh27163@levee.wustl.edu> Message-ID: <49501C70.9050200@rogers.com> Thanks for sharing this Randy. It looks genuine (and incredibly beautiful!) but a little odd that Alan Hildebrand advised that this is an H3/4. This seams a little fast for classification but perhaps that is what it is. I guess an H3/4 is better than an H 5 or H6. Cheers! Mike Tettenborn Randy Korotev wrote: > Collectors: > > A couple of days ago I was contacted by telephone by Mr. Warren Wiley of > Saskatchewan. (Why me?) He told me that he'd found "the second > largest" stone of the Dec. 2 fireball and that he wanted to sell it. He > seems to be a nice fellow, so I offered to pass his information along to > the meteorite list, which was OK with him. He does not have Internet > access. A friend of his sent a message this morning with the following > text and some attached photos, which I've posted on this website: > > http://artsci.wustl.edu/~rlkorote/warren/ > > Mr Wiley's text: "This specimen is from the Buzzard Coulee near Lone > Rock, Saskatchewan. This is an immaculate masterpiece of atmospheric > sculpting. Heavily regmaglyphed, aesthetic specimen. Found December 2, > 2008, 35 minutes after sundown. I have video documentation of my 4 day > search; where I found it, and associate professor, Alan Hildebrand, > coming to our house to authenticate. Alan Hildebrand and other > scientists have completed the lab analysis on my chondrite, and it is an > (H 3/4) chondrite. Warren Wiley (owner) is putting it up for bids, > serious inquiries only. Contact Warren at 1-780-842-4858." > > Please do not contact me about this offer. I'm just the messenger and I > won't respond to enquiries about this issue. I'm only doing this > because I wanted to see the photos. > > > > Randy Korotev > Saint Louis, MO > korotev at wustl.edu > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From meteoriteplaya at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 18:10:32 2008 From: meteoriteplaya at gmail.com (Mike Jensen) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 16:10:32 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - "Buzzard Coulee" In-Reply-To: <49501C70.9050200@rogers.com> References: <200812221910.mBMJAGh27163@levee.wustl.edu> <49501C70.9050200@rogers.com> Message-ID: <6f9da8300812221510t7d65ee8dy28078f635f49351c@mail.gmail.com> Hi Tett Randy and list Here are some thin section photos...near the bottom of the page... if you want to guess at a classification. Also includes a photo of several beautiful stones as well as a nice oriented stone as well. Just wish I could legally hold one in my hands today. Mike -- Mike Jensen Meteorites 16730 E Ada PL Aurora, CO 80017-3137 USA 720-949-6220 IMCA 4264 website: www.jensenmeteorites.com On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 4:02 PM, tett wrote: > Thanks for sharing this Randy. > > It looks genuine (and incredibly beautiful!) but a little odd that Alan > Hildebrand advised that this is an H3/4. > > This seams a little fast for classification but perhaps that is what it is. > I guess an H3/4 is better than an H 5 or H6. > > Cheers! > > Mike Tettenborn > > Randy Korotev wrote: >> >> Collectors: >> >> A couple of days ago I was contacted by telephone by Mr. Warren Wiley of >> Saskatchewan. (Why me?) He told me that he'd found "the second largest" >> stone of the Dec. 2 fireball and that he wanted to sell it. He seems to be >> a nice fellow, so I offered to pass his information along to the meteorite >> list, which was OK with him. He does not have Internet access. A friend of >> his sent a message this morning with the following text and some attached >> photos, which I've posted on this website: >> >> http://artsci.wustl.edu/~rlkorote/warren/ >> >> Mr Wiley's text: "This specimen is from the Buzzard Coulee near Lone >> Rock, Saskatchewan. This is an immaculate masterpiece of atmospheric >> sculpting. Heavily regmaglyphed, aesthetic specimen. Found December 2, 2008, >> 35 minutes after sundown. I have video documentation of my 4 day search; >> where I found it, and associate professor, Alan Hildebrand, coming to our >> house to authenticate. Alan Hildebrand and other scientists have completed >> the lab analysis on my chondrite, and it is an (H 3/4) chondrite. Warren >> Wiley (owner) is putting it up for bids, serious inquiries only. Contact >> Warren at 1-780-842-4858." >> >> Please do not contact me about this offer. I'm just the messenger and I >> won't respond to enquiries about this issue. I'm only doing this because I >> wanted to see the photos. >> >> >> >> Randy Korotev >> Saint Louis, MO >> korotev at wustl.edu >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From MeteorHntr at aol.com Mon Dec 22 18:10:29 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 18:10:29 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Odds and Ends for sale Message-ID: Hey List, I was doing some sorting of stuff getting ready for Tucson and I found some small things I thought I would try to clear out now. Before taking the time and spending the money on Ebay, I thought I would toss out a list of some of what I have here. If you guys don't want them I will be tossing them up on Ebay later today. Oh, I have a couple of pieces of Aerogel, the type NASA uses to catch mirco meteoroids in space with. It is the lightest weight solid in existence. For a details about any of these including dimensions, photos and prices on any of these contact me directly. I do have some of these in duplicate, so if you might want some bigger or smaller, ask. Camel Donga 0.112g Eucrite w/crust Dhofar 007 7.6g Eucrite full slice w/crust Weston 0.010g USA #1 Kapoeta 0.040g Howardite from King Collection Bells CM2 Fall Sept 9, 1961 This Section butt Brenham 9.8g Pallasite Ahumada 0.284g Pallasite Dhofar 011 0.088 LL7 Odessa 6.6g Small Iron JaH026 0.05g L3.1 Brownfield 1937 H3 0.032g Beaver 0.186 L5 Jail Door Stop Tatahouine 0.452g Diogenite Faucett,MO 0.08g H5 Murchison CM2 Fall 0.014g Igdi 0.014g Eucrite-mmict Mount Padbury 0.108g Mesosiderite A1 Lamont, KS 0.068g Mesosiderite Colony, OK 0.258g CO3.0 Lowest CO3 Canyon Diablo 29.4g Monahans 1998, H5 From the Monahans 7 Fukang 3.1g Pallasite, nice cabochon Imilac 4.8g Pallasite individual Oriented Gao 29.5g H5 NWA 1110 0.202g SNC Mars Shergotite NWA 1955 0.224g HL3-4 The only one of this class Hughes 04 Australia 0.030g Crumbs Howardite Ultra rare Bilanga 0.17g Achondrite Diogenite Fall Oct 27 1999 NWA 1877 0.19g Olivine Diogenite Dhofar 025 0.125g Lunar Beechar 8g Dalgety Downs L4 2.9g Ghubara11.4g L5 Kaffir c 7.24g L6 Wagon Mound 14g L6 HaH 222 11.7g L6 Dhofar 018 Thin Section Howardite Aerogel, the NASA type, the worlds lightest weight solid, NOT a Meteorite NWA 002 0.508 EL6 Tambo Quemado 1.906g IIIAB NWA 047 0.9g Eucrite Stannern Eucrite 0.066g Fell may 22, 1808 Richfield, KS LL3.7 0.20g Kainsaz Russia CO3.2 3.81g Fell 1937 NWA 3111 LL3.9 3.766g Caldwell L imb various sizes Thanks, Steve Arnold #1 **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From tett at rogers.com Mon Dec 22 18:18:36 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 18:18:36 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - "Buzzard Coulee" In-Reply-To: <6f9da8300812221510t7d65ee8dy28078f635f49351c@mail.gmail.com> References: <200812221910.mBMJAGh27163@levee.wustl.edu> <49501C70.9050200@rogers.com> <6f9da8300812221510t7d65ee8dy28078f635f49351c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4950204C.7000902@rogers.com> Mike, Can't find the images. Mike Tettenborn Mike Jensen wrote: > Hi Tett Randy and list > Here are some thin section photos...near the bottom of the page... if > you want to guess at a classification. Also includes a photo of > several beautiful stones as well as a nice oriented stone as well. > Just wish I could legally hold one in my hands today. > > Mike > > -- > Mike Jensen Meteorites > 16730 E Ada PL > Aurora, CO 80017-3137 > USA > 720-949-6220 > IMCA 4264 > website: www.jensenmeteorites.com > > > On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 4:02 PM, tett wrote: >> Thanks for sharing this Randy. >> >> It looks genuine (and incredibly beautiful!) but a little odd that Alan >> Hildebrand advised that this is an H3/4. >> >> This seams a little fast for classification but perhaps that is what it is. >> I guess an H3/4 is better than an H 5 or H6. >> >> Cheers! >> >> Mike Tettenborn >> >> Randy Korotev wrote: >>> Collectors: >>> >>> A couple of days ago I was contacted by telephone by Mr. Warren Wiley of >>> Saskatchewan. (Why me?) He told me that he'd found "the second largest" >>> stone of the Dec. 2 fireball and that he wanted to sell it. He seems to be >>> a nice fellow, so I offered to pass his information along to the meteorite >>> list, which was OK with him. He does not have Internet access. A friend of >>> his sent a message this morning with the following text and some attached >>> photos, which I've posted on this website: >>> >>> http://artsci.wustl.edu/~rlkorote/warren/ >>> >>> Mr Wiley's text: "This specimen is from the Buzzard Coulee near Lone >>> Rock, Saskatchewan. This is an immaculate masterpiece of atmospheric >>> sculpting. Heavily regmaglyphed, aesthetic specimen. Found December 2, 2008, >>> 35 minutes after sundown. I have video documentation of my 4 day search; >>> where I found it, and associate professor, Alan Hildebrand, coming to our >>> house to authenticate. Alan Hildebrand and other scientists have completed >>> the lab analysis on my chondrite, and it is an (H 3/4) chondrite. Warren >>> Wiley (owner) is putting it up for bids, serious inquiries only. Contact >>> Warren at 1-780-842-4858." >>> >>> Please do not contact me about this offer. I'm just the messenger and I >>> won't respond to enquiries about this issue. I'm only doing this because I >>> wanted to see the photos. >>> >>> >>> >>> Randy Korotev >>> Saint Louis, MO >>> korotev at wustl.edu >>> >>> ______________________________________________ >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>> >>> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From tett at rogers.com Mon Dec 22 18:56:22 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 18:56:22 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Buzzard Coulee . H4 and maybe transitional to H3 In-Reply-To: <200812222154.NAA18347@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> References: <200812222154.NAA18347@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <49502926.9060607@rogers.com> Another new article. http://www.physorg.com/news149168723.html A University of Calgary-organized team recovered more than one hundred meteorites from the November 20 meteorite fall southwest of Lloydminster, Saskatchewan/Alberta, which is expected to set a new Canadian record for the largest recorded meteorite fall. "Finding all we could before the snow came on December 6 was a real challenge and tough on searchers with wind chills routinely colder than ? degrees," said Dr. Alan Hildebrand, holder of the Canada Research Chair in Planetary Science. "We did as well as we did by collaborating with experienced researchers from The University of Western Ontario including Dr. Phil McCausland and Dr. Peter Brown." Both Hildebrand and Brown are veterans of the Tagish Lake (2000) and St-Robert (1994) meteorite recovery efforts and McCausland is a veteran of the Tagish Lake recovery. Volunteer searchers numbered up to twenty people per day including local residents, U of C staff and graduate & undergraduate students, professors from the University of Saskatchewan and the University of Regina, amateur astronomers from the Saskatoon, Calgary and Edmonton Centres of the Royal Astronomical Society of Canada, and geoscientists from ConocoPhillips Canada. Most searchers found at least one meteorite despite having a thin layer of snow down the last five days. "The last day that the search teams were out, it snowed all day and we still found five meteorites which is ridiculous. It shows just how many are out there," Hildebrand said. Using the abundance of meteorites on the pond where U of C grad student Ellen Milley found the first fragments on November 27, Hildebrand calculated that about 2,000 meteorites of more than 10 grams in size occur per square kilometer in the northern part of the strewn field, and probably more than 10,000 meteorites of this size are on the ground altogether. Many local residents and landowners also found meteorites, as well as persons from across the prairies and meteorite dealers who traveled to Saskatchewan to try their luck. "We have had great cooperation from landowners, who are having a once-in-a-lifetime experience of a meteorite harvest," Hildebrand said. "Approximately 130 well-substantiated meteorites have been found totaling about 40 kg, but probably double that number, weighing more than 50 kg, have been recovered." Hildebrand encourages everyone who has collected specimens to please send him the masses (in grams) and locations (GPS coordinates, NAD27 datum) of their finds to help map the strewn field. Milley and Hildebrand have formally proposed the name Buzzard Coulee to describe the fall to the International Meteoritical Society. The name comes from the picturesque valley near the hamlet of Lone Rock, Sask. where the first meteorites were discovered. Typing of the meteorite has been completed with the collaboration of Dr. Alex Ruzicka and Dr. Melinda Hutson, a husband and wife team at the Cascadia Meteorite Laboratory at Portland State University, Portland, Oregon. "The meteorite is at the low end of the H4 type and may be transitional with type 3. It will take some more work to sort out everything, but we have good prospects to learn a lot about the rock's history," Ruzicka said. A lower number in the classification indicates that a meteorite experienced less heating on its parent asteroid, making it of more interest to researchers and potentially to collectors as well. Lower metamorphic grades are relatively unusual in meteorites of the H, or "high iron" type, such as the Buzzard Coulee rocks. Dr. Hutson observed: "The meteorite also appears to show that different types of material are mixed together in a subtle way, but we will have to study more thin sections to better understand this. The meteorite is slightly shocked, so the material was possibly stirred by an impact on its parent asteroid." Hand specimens of the meteorite show only rare fragmental texture, but with the prospect of hundreds of meteorites to study, including some large ones (the largest recovered to date is approximately 13 kg), more will be learned about the history of the asteroid fragment that fell at Buzzard Coulee than for most falls. "It was a great experience to visit the Cascadia Meteorite Lab to see how they do things, and it has been fun to apply the things that we learned in class to a new meteorite fall," said Milley, who is pursuing her MSc with Hildebrand in the U of C's Department of Geoscience. "It feels good to be making a real research contribution. When we determine the orbit we will also know from where in the asteroid belt this rock originated." The recovered meteorites are being stored in an inert nitrogen atmosphere in a clean room in the meteorite lab at the University of Calgary to prevent weathering by the Earth's atmosphere. "Since these meteorites are a fresh fall collected early and nearly dry, they are unweathered for the most part and deserve the best care anywhere," Milley said. The U of C researchers and their collaborators will now turn their attention back to determining the orbit for the space rock. The H4 classification matches the history of meteorite falls of this type that usually occur during the afternoon or evening. About 8 million years ago a large impact occurred on an asteroid of H composition and further studies will be done to see if Buzzard Coulee is another fragment from that impact. Although orbit evolution is chaotic, determining this rock's orbit may help locate that impact. Knowing the fireball's exact trajectory will also help better plan for the spring searching. "I think that the number of individual meteorites that will be recovered for Buzzard Coulee will easily set the Canadian record for the largest fall, but we still don't know how big the biggest meteorite out there is, so we don't know how much mass we can expect to be recovered of the approximately 1 tonne that fell," Hildebrand said. The largest Canadian meteorite fall currently on record dates to 1960 when hundreds of meteorites fell near Bruderheim, Alberta. "During the spring before cultivating and seeding, we will try to organize the biggest meteorite search effort that Canada has ever seen," Hildebrand said. "One of our ambitions at the Prairie Meteorite Search project is to train everyone in the country to recognize meteorites so more new ones will be discovered, and this is a great opportunity to introduce hundreds of people to rocks from space." Source: University of Calgary From tett at rogers.com Mon Dec 22 19:01:45 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 19:01:45 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Yet another article on Buzzard Coulee In-Reply-To: <49502926.9060607@rogers.com> References: <200812222154.NAA18347@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> <49502926.9060607@rogers.com> Message-ID: <49502A69.3080103@rogers.com> http://www.thespec.com/Wire/News_Wire/Science/article/485822 December 22, 2008 Shannon Montgomery, THE CANADIAN PRESS The Canadian Press, 2008 CALGARY - More than 100 well-preserved meteorites collected after a heavenly fireball flashed across the prairie sky last month could provide a glimpse into the very beginnings of our solar system - or even earlier. University of Calgary geologist Alan Hildebrand has been studying pieces that were rapidly collected from the fall site near the Alberta-Saskatchewan boundary before the season's first snow. "Most things about these rocks date from 4 1/2 billion years ago, so it will show us more about the origin of the solar system, I would think," he said. Hildebrand estimated about 10,000 pieces weighing 10 grams or more fell to the ground when a meteor streaked across Manitoba, Saskatchewan and Alberta on Nov. 20. He said there's no doubt that when recovery efforts resume in the spring, they'll manage to find at least 1,000 of the dark, dimpled rocks, which would set a Canadian record for the largest number of pieces found from a single fall. A sample size that large would allow scientists to figure out a wide range of things about the original meteorite, which likely weighed 10 tonnes and was about the size of a desk when it slammed into earth's atmosphere at a speed of about 14 kilometres per second. They'll be able to extract clues about the meteorite itself, as well as the parent asteroid that it originally left behind. They will also be able to study the fireball some witnesses said was as bright as the sun. "This one obviously made these spectacular, bright bursts that eyewitnesses were describing, the blue-white flashes," Hildebrand said. "Each one of those flashes was a fragmentation episode, and with hundreds of fragments we can better understand that process in the atmosphere." The space rocks have been classified as a type called H4. That means they're high in iron and experienced a lower level of heat than some other types of meteorites. This is important because the more heat a meteorite experiences, the more its components blend together, making it more difficult to figure out what elements were involved when it was created. It's possible that the rocks even contain fragments from before our solar system existed. To check for this, scientists need to churn through a lot of samples looking for what is essentially a pre-solar needle in a haystack. "To find them, you have to destroy a lot of meteorites," Hildebrand said. "Because we have lots of meteorites here, and probably have hundreds of kilograms of it, there will be material available for people who want to do these experiments." Hildebrand said some of the experiments will focus on whether the meteorite comes from a known strike between two bodies in an asteroid belt about eight million years ago. About half of similar meteorites that fall to earth have been found to come from that strike, he said. "In a geologic sense, that's still the blink of an eye. These rocks are 4.5 billion years old, leftover from the start of the solar system, so what's eight million years compared to 4.5 billion?" Since they collected the meteorites so quickly after they hit the ground, many of the elements will still be intact. Hildebrand pointed out that some well-preserved meteorites have been found to contain salt, something that suggests the one-time presence of water. Still, it's only been a month since the first meteorite chunk was plucked from a pond near Buzzard Coulee, Sask., Hildebrand said, and it's still hard to hazard a guess about what secrets lie beneath the rocks' exteriors. "It may be something we haven't thought of at all, yet." From meteoriteplaya at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 19:23:55 2008 From: meteoriteplaya at gmail.com (Mike Jensen) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:23:55 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - "Buzzard Coulee" In-Reply-To: <4950204C.7000902@rogers.com> References: <200812221910.mBMJAGh27163@levee.wustl.edu> <49501C70.9050200@rogers.com> <6f9da8300812221510t7d65ee8dy28078f635f49351c@mail.gmail.com> <4950204C.7000902@rogers.com> Message-ID: <6f9da8300812221623r6b4bf4aaw27c23d12e48f26@mail.gmail.com> Hi Tett & John Sorry about that; http://skyriver.ca/astro/bruce/meteorite.htm Look near the bottom of the page for the thin section photos. Mike Mike Jensen Meteorites 16730 E Ada PL Aurora, CO 80017-3137 USA 720-949-6220 IMCA 4264 website: www.jensenmeteorites.com On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 4:18 PM, tett wrote: > Mike, > > Can't find the images. > > Mike Tettenborn > > Mike Jensen wrote: >> >> Hi Tett Randy and list >> Here are some thin section photos...near the bottom of the page... if >> you want to guess at a classification. Also includes a photo of >> several beautiful stones as well as a nice oriented stone as well. >> Just wish I could legally hold one in my hands today. >> >> Mike >> >> -- >> Mike Jensen Meteorites >> 16730 E Ada PL >> Aurora, CO 80017-3137 >> USA >> 720-949-6220 >> IMCA 4264 >> website: www.jensenmeteorites.com >> >> >> On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 4:02 PM, tett wrote: >>> >>> Thanks for sharing this Randy. >>> >>> It looks genuine (and incredibly beautiful!) but a little odd that Alan >>> Hildebrand advised that this is an H3/4. >>> >>> This seams a little fast for classification but perhaps that is what it >>> is. >>> I guess an H3/4 is better than an H 5 or H6. >>> >>> Cheers! >>> >>> Mike Tettenborn >>> >>> Randy Korotev wrote: >>>> >>>> Collectors: >>>> >>>> A couple of days ago I was contacted by telephone by Mr. Warren Wiley of >>>> Saskatchewan. (Why me?) He told me that he'd found "the second >>>> largest" >>>> stone of the Dec. 2 fireball and that he wanted to sell it. He seems to >>>> be >>>> a nice fellow, so I offered to pass his information along to the >>>> meteorite >>>> list, which was OK with him. He does not have Internet access. A >>>> friend of >>>> his sent a message this morning with the following text and some >>>> attached >>>> photos, which I've posted on this website: >>>> >>>> http://artsci.wustl.edu/~rlkorote/warren/ >>>> >>>> Mr Wiley's text: "This specimen is from the Buzzard Coulee near Lone >>>> Rock, Saskatchewan. This is an immaculate masterpiece of atmospheric >>>> sculpting. Heavily regmaglyphed, aesthetic specimen. Found December 2, >>>> 2008, >>>> 35 minutes after sundown. I have video documentation of my 4 day search; >>>> where I found it, and associate professor, Alan Hildebrand, coming to >>>> our >>>> house to authenticate. Alan Hildebrand and other scientists have >>>> completed >>>> the lab analysis on my chondrite, and it is an (H 3/4) chondrite. Warren >>>> Wiley (owner) is putting it up for bids, serious inquiries only. Contact >>>> Warren at 1-780-842-4858." >>>> >>>> Please do not contact me about this offer. I'm just the messenger and I >>>> won't respond to enquiries about this issue. I'm only doing this >>>> because I >>>> wanted to see the photos. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Randy Korotev >>>> Saint Louis, MO >>>> korotev at wustl.edu >>>> >>>> ______________________________________________ >>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>>> >>>> >>> ______________________________________________ >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> > From mark at meteorites.cc Mon Dec 22 21:09:07 2008 From: mark at meteorites.cc (Mark Crawford) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 02:09:07 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA Alternative Group In-Reply-To: <547257.33317.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <547257.33317.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <49504843.50405@meteorites.cc> Michael Gilmer wrote: > I will soon be starting a Yahoo discussion group to lay the groundwork > for a new meteorite group. Why? -- Mark's Meteorite Pages: http://meteorites.cc From mikewren at gilanet.com Mon Dec 22 21:24:04 2008 From: mikewren at gilanet.com (michael cottingham) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 19:24:04 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: SPECIAL HOLIDAY SALE-3 items Only, Paypal Only, Check These Out! Message-ID: <91D82A20-05C3-434D-A39D-5CFB33A163A1@gilanet.com> HELLO, I decided to put 3 meteorites on SUPER SALE! I will pick 3 meteorites tonight (22nd), and the 23rd, and 24th. Each Night I will RE-MARK the 3 items to a price you can not resist. IF, they do not sell tonight, they will be marked back up tomorrow and 3 new ones will be picked. Use the BUY IT NOW button and use PAYPAL Only, sorry. Tonight is: Meteorite DHOFAR 938, LL5, Complete Slice, 185.60 gram, Marked down to $150.00! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200242574098 METEORITE Loaded W/Inclusions ODESSA, IAB, 928 gram EC, Marked down to $900.00 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200290644099 METEORITE MAIN MASS of NWA 4956, H5, 1200 gram Beauty!, Marked down to $700.00 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200290644096 Thanks and Best Wishes Michael Cottingham From STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com Mon Dec 22 22:37:41 2008 From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com (STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 22:37:41 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Request for help in ID of a mineral Message-ID: Hi, I was thinking some of you might know what this is. I bought it off eBay just this last week. 250342026204 It was sold as a meteorite and while I had my doubts, my curiosity was tweaked. The photos are quite good and they speak for themselves. My observation is, it is not iron! While it is highly attracted to a magnet (nearly like iron), it is brittle and not malleable. It is crystal structured and there is a section of fine grid shaped crystals. The crusted ends look like they COULD be sand blasted thumbprints but also look as if they could of been formed by molten material dropped on sand. If you have seen this stuff before, please share with me. Is it a nice example of a natural crystal or is it industrial scrap? Thanks! Tom Phillips **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From blurtheline at gmail.com Tue Dec 23 00:37:42 2008 From: blurtheline at gmail.com (Art) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 21:37:42 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] From the meteorite-list Admin - posting Ads Message-ID: <998a6e0f0812222137g1a428bcfw60739753c9d0d62f@mail.gmail.com> Good evening! I wanted to send a quick reminder regarding posting ads on the list. While most members do like seeing all of the interesting specimens that are offered for sale on the list, sometimes ads tend to get a bit overwhelming. To keep things from getting out of control please limit ads to one per week. Also remember to start the subject line of the email with 'SALE' or 'AD'. Hope everyone has a wonderful holiday and prosperous new year! Best Regards, Art From cynapse at charter.net Tue Dec 23 01:52:02 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 01:52:02 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] More Buzzard Coulee in the news In-Reply-To: <49502926.9060607@rogers.com> References: <200812222154.NAA18347@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> <49502926.9060607@rogers.com> Message-ID: <6h21l4l4cg6682f5vgpemetbdf7804som0@4ax.com> Estimates of 10,000 pieces larger than 10 grams reaching the ground. http://www.thetechherald.com/article.php/200852/2667/Canadian-scientists-begin-examination-of-hundreds-of-meteorites http://www.metronews.ca/calgary/local/article/158806 http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20081222/meteorites_earth_081222/20081222?hub=CTVNewsAt11 From michael at spacerocksinc.com Tue Dec 23 06:47:54 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 03:47:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 23, 2008 Message-ID: <26919305.60681230032862247.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_23_2008.html From info at meteorites.com.au Tue Dec 23 07:44:43 2008 From: info at meteorites.com.au (Jeff Kuyken) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 23:44:43 +1100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - "Buzzard Coulee" In-Reply-To: <200812221910.mBMJAGh27163@levee.wustl.edu> References: <200812221910.mBMJAGh27163@levee.wustl.edu> Message-ID: Thanks Randy... very interesting pics. Maybe it's just the light in the photo but it appears one side is completely without primary fusion crust. If that's the case then I'd guess that due to the shape and size/number/type of regmaglypts I would not be surprised if another even larger mass turned up closely fitting this one. Maybe even the main mass for the fall. But that's just a guess! ;-) Hope everyone has safe and happy holidays, Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Randy Korotev" To: Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 6:11 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - "Buzzard Coulee" > Collectors: > > A couple of days ago I was contacted by telephone by Mr. Warren Wiley of > Saskatchewan. (Why me?) He told me that he'd found "the second largest" > stone of the Dec. 2 fireball and that he wanted to sell it. He seems to > be a nice fellow, so I offered to pass his information along to the > meteorite list, which was OK with him. He does not have Internet access. > A friend of his sent a message this morning with the following text and > some attached photos, which I've posted on this website: > > http://artsci.wustl.edu/~rlkorote/warren/ > > Mr Wiley's text: "This specimen is from the Buzzard Coulee near Lone > Rock, Saskatchewan. This is an immaculate masterpiece of atmospheric > sculpting. Heavily regmaglyphed, aesthetic specimen. Found December 2, > 2008, 35 minutes after sundown. I have video documentation of my 4 day > search; where I found it, and associate professor, Alan Hildebrand, coming > to our house to authenticate. Alan Hildebrand and other scientists have > completed the lab analysis on my chondrite, and it is an (H 3/4) > chondrite. Warren Wiley (owner) is putting it up for bids, serious > inquiries only. Contact Warren at 1-780-842-4858." > > Please do not contact me about this offer. I'm just the messenger and I > won't respond to enquiries about this issue. I'm only doing this because > I wanted to see the photos. > > > > Randy Korotev > Saint Louis, MO > korotev at wustl.edu > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From valparint at aol.com Tue Dec 23 10:02:18 2008 From: valparint at aol.com (valparint at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 08:02:18 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA Alternative Group Message-ID: Mr. Gilmer, "All-inclusive" seems a stretch since you cite several reasons for excluding people. Who will do the vetting? If I don't pass the process will I be able to face my accusers? Will there be any recourse? If I state publicly that some meteorites are simply ugly, looking no better than do-it-yourself concrete, will I run afoul of the "utmost respect" rule? Ick! Paul Swartz >This group will be all-inclusive. All persons with a SPOTLESS record of >good business practice and personal ethics are invited to join. >The only requirements are that members show the utmost respect to >meteorites and the science of meteoritics. >eventually, all prospective members will undergo a vetting >process, which includes a thorough background check of online >business practices. From wahlperry at aol.com Tue Dec 23 10:28:25 2008 From: wahlperry at aol.com (wahlperry at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 10:28:25 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Lunar Dry Lake Nevada meteorites. Sale Add Message-ID: <8CB332A3BA487FA-1B8-155@FWM-D14.sysops.aol.com> Hi List , I have two meteorites that were recovered on Lunar Dry Lake Nevada by a friend last summer. # 1 - 26 gram fragment. # 2 - 41 gram fragment . Both meteorites appear to be paired to the original find of an L-5. Contact off list for price and pictures. Thanks, Sonny From wahlperry at aol.com Tue Dec 23 10:59:04 2008 From: wahlperry at aol.com (wahlperry at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 10:59:04 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] oops sorry sale ad not add! Message-ID: <8CB332E83830806-1B8-2E9@FWM-D14.sysops.aol.com> From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Tue Dec 23 13:09:24 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 10:09:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] IMCA Alternative Group Message-ID: <254230.41157.qm@web58406.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Paul said : ---------------- Mr. Gilmer, "All-inclusive" seems a stretch since you cite several reasons for excluding people. Who will do the vetting? If I don't pass the process will I be able to face my accusers? Will there be any recourse? If I state publicly that some meteorites are simply ugly, looking no better than do-it-yourself concrete, will I run afoul of the "utmost respect" rule? Ick! Paul Swartz ------------------------ >From my original post : > Anyone who is interested in discussing this project, please contact > me offlist at mike at galactic-stone.com > ------------------------ Hi Paul, I understand your concerns and agree with them. But please note that we are discussing this project off-list. I don't want to clutter up the list or cause unneccesary friction. I realize that many new ideas are met with hostility on the list (such as suggested new forums, blogs, etc) - so I expect there will be some measure of necessary skepticism. I welcome to that. But I also want to discuss this in private until the details are hammered out to a sufficient degree for public presentation. At this point, this idea is only an idea. I would be happy to discuss your concerns off-list. Best regards, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From mikewren at gilanet.com Tue Dec 23 13:49:36 2008 From: mikewren at gilanet.com (michael cottingham) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 11:49:36 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: TODAY'S HOLIDAY SPECIAL! Until The 25th! BEST WISHES ! Message-ID: <516C5CCA-9CE0-4419-BA6A-CCACD179FBAC@gilanet.com> HELLO, OK. Since I do not want to list each day 3 new items, and keep sending "AD'S" out each and everyday... I will list a total of 9 items for my pre-XMAS Super Sale. I will leave them up and available until Xmas day. If not sold by then, they will go back to the regular price! USE THE BUY IT NOW BUTTONS & Remember, PAYPAL only, please. UNTIL XMAS DAY! All Available Now. MONDAY SALE: Meteorite DHOFAR 938, LL5, Complete Slice, 185.60 gram, Marked down to $150.00! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200242574098 METEORITE Loaded W/Inclusions ODESSA, IAB, 928 gram EC, Marked down to SOLD http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200290644099 METEORITE MAIN MASS of NWA 4956, H5, 1200 gram Beauty!, Marked down to $700.00 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200290644096 TUESDAY SALE: METEORITE Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 25.56g, Really Nice Slice! Marked Down To $500.00! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200254122065 METEORITE Superb Campo Del Cielo, End Cut, 4,176 gram, A Nice 1/2 Individual. Marked down to $725.00 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200290644133 METEORITE Super Rare Fall BATH FURNACE, Kentucky, 7.14g, Marked Down To $200.00 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200285698829 WEDS SALE: METEORITE Super Fine ESQUEL, Pallasite Slice, 106g, Marked Down To $2200.00, A Steal At This Price! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200290644087 METEORITE A Beautiful Sikhote-Alin, IIAB Iron, 2130g, Marked Down To $750.00 !!! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200290644123 METEORITE Rare NWA 2696, Howardite From Africa, 15.86g, Marked Down To $85.00 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200285666568 ALSO, ON MY HIGHER PRICED COLLECTION PIECES I WILL CONSIDER GOOD OFFERS. I AM NOT IN ANY HURRY TO SELL A LOT OF THESE, BUT IF THERE IS SOMETHING YOU LIKE-MAKE A GOOD OFFER & I WILL THINK ABOUT IT. YOU NEVER KNOW. HAVE A GREAT HOLIDAY! SAFE, HEALTHY, and lots of PEACEFUL TIMES!!! Best Wishes Michael Cottingham From bobe5531 at comcast.net Tue Dec 23 16:31:39 2008 From: bobe5531 at comcast.net (Bob Evans) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 15:31:39 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] More Buzzard Coulee in the news References: <200812222154.NAA18347@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov><49502926.9060607@rogers.com> <6h21l4l4cg6682f5vgpemetbdf7804som0@4ax.com> Message-ID: <003501c96545$de319530$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Oh well, So much for $50 per gram. Thats about 9000 more pieces than the market will consume. Happy Holidays to all my friends ! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darren Garrison" To: "Meteorite Mailing List" Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 12:52 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] More Buzzard Coulee in the news > Estimates of 10,000 pieces larger than 10 grams reaching the ground. > > http://www.thetechherald.com/article.php/200852/2667/Canadian-scientists-begin-examination-of-hundreds-of-meteorites > > http://www.metronews.ca/calgary/local/article/158806 > > http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20081222/meteorites_earth_081222/20081222?hub=CTVNewsAt11 > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mccartney at blackbearddata.com Tue Dec 23 16:53:39 2008 From: mccartney at blackbearddata.com (McCartney Taylor) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 15:53:39 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Lone Rock / Buzzard Coulee Sold Out Message-ID: <5b47273a88c6414593fb705653e7c883@ucv1.vhostdns.com> All of our material has been sold. None made it to the US. To those who wanted to wait...bad luck. -mt IMCA 2760 From m42protosun at aol.com Tue Dec 23 17:12:14 2008 From: m42protosun at aol.com (m42protosun at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 17:12:14 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Xmas greetings Message-ID: <8CB3362A50E93BE-16D8-47A@WEBMAIL-DY01.sysops.aol.com> Dear Michael, dear list The story about the discovery SA will be published in Feb 09 magazine. I wish you a Merry Xmas and a happy New Year. Uwe from Germany ________________________________________________________________________ AOL eMail auf Ihrem Handy! Ab sofort k?nnen Sie auch unterwegs Ihre AOL email abrufen. Registrieren Sie sich jetzt kostenlos. From gmhupe at htn.net Tue Dec 23 17:55:45 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 17:55:45 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 5480 More Info & AD Message-ID: Dear List Members, I recently announced the "Incomparable Meteorite", NWA 5480, a fresh and new Olivine Diogenite that is completely different! Here is some additional information, Hot off the Press, along with the updated list of what is still available. It is starting to go quick, so if you are interested in a truly One-of-a-Kind meteorite, NWA 5480 is it! Additional Information: "Scientists are very excited about NWA 5480 because it exhibits unique textural characteristics not previously found in any other known meteorites! They say the material must have been heated to a point where it became "plasticized" and mixed, presumably in the deep interior (mantle) of the NWA 5480 parent body (presumably Vesta-related). By analogy with deformed olivine-orthopyroxene-rich samples of the Earth's mantle (known as harzburgites), it appears likely that temperatures were high enough that NWA 5480 represents a solid residue after partial melting to produce molten magma, which presumably ascended towards the surface of the parent body. The "swirl" texture that can be seen on the interior and exterior graphically displays the flowing and mixing of the olivine and orthopyroxene grains, with intermingled chromite crystals." Updated list of what is available and what has been sold: NWA 5480 Olivine Diogenite: 990g End Cut (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00001.jpg 670g End Cut http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00003.jpg 168.3g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00005.jpg 145.2g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00006.jpg 137g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00007.jpg 127g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00008.jpg 108.2g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00009.jpg 102.5g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00010.jpg 96.3g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/large/dsc00011.jpg 507g Complete Stone (with large chromites up to 1.5cm)(SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00001.jpg 494g Complete Stone (Awesome "swirl" feature) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00003.jpg 462g Complete Stone (Great display of the 'mixed' minerals) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00005.jpg 269g Complete Stone http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00007.jpg 60g Complete Stone (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00009.jpg 71.3g End Cut http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00010.jpg 21.2g End Cut http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00012.jpg 16.7g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00013.jpg 16.3g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00014.jpg 16.1g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00015.jpg 14.4g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00016.jpg 14g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00017.jpg 13.3g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00018.jpg 12.7g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00020.jpg 12.6g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00021.jpg 12.5g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00022.jpg 11.7g cs http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00023.jpg 10g cs (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00024.jpg 3.152g fragment http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00025.jpg 1.4g ps (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00026.jpg 892mg ps (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00027.jpg 2.540g fragments (SOLD) http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00028.jpg cs - complete slice ps - part slice Pricing: Whole stones (Just 3 available) - $10.00/g Large end cuts (Only one left) - $12.00/g Large slices (Only 3 left) - $16.00/g Small slices (9 available slices, 1 end cut 1 fragment) - $20.00/g Thank you for considering these! Merry Christmas! Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault From tett at rogers.com Tue Dec 23 18:12:16 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 18:12:16 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] More Buzzard Coulee in the news In-Reply-To: <003501c96545$de319530$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> References: <200812222154.NAA18347@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov><49502926.9060607@rogers.com> <6h21l4l4cg6682f5vgpemetbdf7804som0@4ax.com> <003501c96545$de319530$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> Message-ID: <49517050.4090303@rogers.com> The 10K is a guestimate based on a small sampling in one area. It could be more or could be considerably less. As well, the stuff to be collected in the spring may be rusty as heck. Even some of the fresh stuff picked up a few days after the fall show signs of weathering. The fresh stuff may still fetch high prices. Time will tell. Mike Tettenborn Bob Evans wrote: > Oh well, > So much for $50 per gram. Thats about 9000 more pieces than the market > will consume. > Happy Holidays to all my friends ! > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darren Garrison" > To: "Meteorite Mailing List" > Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 12:52 AM > Subject: [meteorite-list] More Buzzard Coulee in the news > > >> Estimates of 10,000 pieces larger than 10 grams reaching the ground. >> >> http://www.thetechherald.com/article.php/200852/2667/Canadian-scientists-begin-examination-of-hundreds-of-meteorites >> >> >> http://www.metronews.ca/calgary/local/article/158806 >> >> http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20081222/meteorites_earth_081222/20081222?hub=CTVNewsAt11 >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Tue Dec 23 18:08:08 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 23 Dec 2008 23:08:08 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 5480 More Info & AD Message-ID: I must disagree with part of this statement ;-) > Updated list of what is available and what has been sold: > 21.2g End Cut > http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00012.jpg .. I must disagree because this one has been sold to me!!! Merry Christmas!!! Listees, Listoids, List + Art Bernd To: gmhupe at htn.net meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com From mlblood at cox.net Tue Dec 23 18:18:10 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 15:18:10 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Jerry Armstrong (AD) In-Reply-To: <26919305.60681230032862247.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, As you know, Jerry is lecturing prior to the Auction in Tucson and His 16 x 20 originals are going to go up from $600 to $750 each. This Was going to happen Dec. 31, but we decided to extend the price to orders Received by the Tucson Show. Furthermore, orders for originals of that Size placed by Dec.31 can be hand delivered to you at the Show. While no other prices will be changing at this time, many people are Placing orders for his superb reproductions to be brought to them at the Tucson Show (in a tube for easy transport). He also sells 8 X 10 cards at $10 each, so, every possible option is open to you. You can see all his work (don't miss the new Bruderheim!) at: http://michaelbloodmeteorites.com/JerryArmstrong.html Jerry and I wish you the best possible Christmas and holiday season, Michael From gmhupe at htn.net Tue Dec 23 18:24:45 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 18:24:45 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 5480 More Info & AD References: Message-ID: <4F5D488132024764AC1C1E4AE46FD690@Gregor> Hi Bernd and List, I knew I would miss one of them that was spoken for! You will be happy to know I shipped the 21.2g end cut to you yesterday!! Did I mention that it is starting to go quick!! Take care, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 6:08 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NWA 5480 More Info & AD >I must disagree with part of this statement ;-) > >> Updated list of what is available and what has been sold: >> 21.2g End Cut >> http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00012.jpg > > .. I must disagree because this one has been sold to me!!! > > Merry Christmas!!! > Listees, > Listoids, > List + Art > > Bernd > > To: gmhupe at htn.net > meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com Tue Dec 23 19:20:59 2008 From: STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com (STARSANDSCOPES at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 19:20:59 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 5480 More Info & AD Message-ID: Way to go Bernd!!! I can't wait to get some on a scope! OD's are SO BEAUTIFUL in Xpol!!! Tom In a message dated 12/23/2008 4:15:50 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, bernd.pauli at paulinet.de writes: I must disagree with part of this statement ;-) > Updated list of what is available and what has been sold: > 21.2g End Cut > http://www.lunarrock.com/ebay/nwa5480/dsc00012.jpg .. I must disagree because this one has been sold to me!!! Merry Christmas!!! Listees, Listoids, List + Art Bernd To: gmhupe at htn.net meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From jeffkrosschell at comcast.net Tue Dec 23 19:58:42 2008 From: jeffkrosschell at comcast.net (Jeff Krosschell) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 16:58:42 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD Message-ID: <6E42EE8A1BA94EEEB401C6109B1ED203@JeffVistaPC> Hello and Happy Holidays, I have several auctions ending within the next hour that you might want to check out. Looks like things will be going cheap! http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/kalani_oftheheavens Regards, Jeff Krosschell From carloselguapo1 at hotmail.com Tue Dec 23 20:14:40 2008 From: carloselguapo1 at hotmail.com (Carl 's) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 17:14:40 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 2924/2932 Mesosiderite question. Message-ID: Hello, I've been wondering if NWA 2924 and NWA 2932 are paired? I looked in the Met List and noted NWA 2932 is paired with NWA 2923. However when I checked NWA 2923, it is listed as a diogenite not a mesosiderite. Is it a typo and NWA 2924 was meant? I see NWA 2924 was found in Algeria and NWA 2932 was in Morocco, but location may not be that important if both found near the border? I Hope this subject is not too sensitive? Just asking for clarification for my records. Thanks in advance. Carl _________________________________________________________________ It?s the same Hotmail?. If by ?same? you mean up to 70% faster. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_broad1_122008 From psc2410xi at yahoo.com Tue Dec 23 21:03:42 2008 From: psc2410xi at yahoo.com (Don Rawlings) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 18:03:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Lone Rock / Buzzard Coulee Sold Out Message-ID: <894150.32500.qm@web59301.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Or maybe not so bad luck if the predictions that we read recently about thousands of pieces on the ground waiting to be picked up. I predict that this fall will follow the same pattern as nearly all falls..... High prices in the beginning followed by lower prices for those who are willing to wait. ? Don Rawlings --- On Tue, 12/23/08, McCartney Taylor wrote: From: McCartney Taylor Subject: [meteorite-list] Lone Rock / Buzzard Coulee Sold Out To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Date: Tuesday, December 23, 2008, 4:53 PM All of our material has been sold.? None made it to the US.? To those who wanted to wait...bad luck.? -mt IMCA 2760 ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Tue Dec 23 23:46:38 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 20:46:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Buzzard Coulee H4 classified? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <652885.99976.qm@web58402.mail.re3.yahoo.com> According to this story, the new Canadian fall has been classified as an H4 chondrite. Is this correct? Was this already mentioned on the list and I missed it? If so, please forgive this repost. http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2008/12/22/cgy-meteorite-recovery.html Regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From michael at spacerocksinc.com Wed Dec 24 00:03:38 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 21:03:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 24, 2008 Message-ID: <26195733.33341230095018954.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_24_2008.html From yellowengine at earthlink.net Wed Dec 24 02:02:19 2008 From: yellowengine at earthlink.net (RJP) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 01:02:19 -0600 (GMT-06:00) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD Pricing Feedback Message-ID: <24140304.1230102139758.JavaMail.root@elwamui-chisos.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Hello All, I am just wondering, since I have not received any replies what so ever, would anyone care to share their thoughts or suggestions regarding the prices that I have set on my collection pieces? I believe they are fairly reasonable for the quality at hand here, but perhaps I am mistaken. I'm just trying to figure this out. And no Steve, I cannot list these as give aways (aka "freebies"). Saludos, Ryan http://outdoors.webshots.com/album/569165160RMTnOx Bremham (Pal) - 195g "palm size" full slice (thin). $780 Gibeon - 460g etched full slice. $575 Juancheng - 197g complete stone, see description above. $985 Millbillillie - 212g complete stone, "a grade". $2,120 Moss - .60g part slice, very thin, expertly prepared. $105 From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 10:58:16 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 07:58:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite article in German Playboy Message-ID: <624910.85494.qm@web110602.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Hi everyone, I have been on the road heading north for days now, so little email contact. I just wanted to let my friends in Germany know that there is a meteorite article about Bob Haag and I in German Playboy Magazine, December issue. I have yet to see it, but it deals with meteorites in general, and focuses on Carancas. Time is running out to get a copy, so grab one before they are gone. I should have a few copies in Tucson, and I am sure there are other attributes in the magazine if you don't like the story about Bob and I:) Happy Holidays from snowy and very cold Montana. Michael Farmer From cynapse at charter.net Wed Dec 24 11:08:12 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 11:08:12 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD Pricing Feedback In-Reply-To: <24140304.1230102139758.JavaMail.root@elwamui-chisos.atl.sa.earthlink.net> References: <24140304.1230102139758.JavaMail.root@elwamui-chisos.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <6hn4l4l8ap4efbrb9kjohthfdsio804bpc@4ax.com> On Wed, 24 Dec 2008 01:02:19 -0600 (GMT-06:00), you wrote: >Hello All, > >I am just wondering, since I have not received any replies what so ever, would anyone care to share their thoughts or suggestions regarding the prices that I have set on my collection pieces? I believe they are fairly reasonable for the quality at hand here, but perhaps I am mistaken. I'm just trying to figure this out. And no Steve, I cannot list these as give aways (aka "freebies"). Maybe 1.) people are spent out because of Christmas and 2.) people are spent out because of global economic collapse. From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 11:34:55 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 08:34:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD Pricing Feedback In-Reply-To: <6hn4l4l8ap4efbrb9kjohthfdsio804bpc@4ax.com> Message-ID: <523059.40376.qm@web110611.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> That is the problem, I think people are with family, I drove to Montana in blizzards, lucky to have made it here, snowing right now, supposed to snow all night and all day tomorrow. I am only 20 miles from the Canadian border. Economy in the tank and everyone on hold I think. Michael Farmer --- On Wed, 12/24/08, Darren Garrison wrote: > From: Darren Garrison > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD Pricing Feedback > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 9:08 AM > On Wed, 24 Dec 2008 01:02:19 -0600 (GMT-06:00), you wrote: > > >Hello All, > > > >I am just wondering, since I have not received any > replies what so ever, would anyone care to share their > thoughts or suggestions regarding the prices that I have set > on my collection pieces? I believe they are fairly > reasonable for the quality at hand here, but perhaps I am > mistaken. I'm just trying to figure this out. And no > Steve, I cannot list these as give aways (aka > "freebies"). > > Maybe 1.) people are spent out because of Christmas and 2.) > people are spent out > because of global economic collapse. > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From tett at rogers.com Wed Dec 24 13:38:05 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 13:38:05 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite article in German Playboy In-Reply-To: <624910.85494.qm@web110602.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <624910.85494.qm@web110602.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4952818D.2020502@rogers.com> Wow Hoooo! An excuse to get a Playboy Mag. Bernd, can you get me a copy? Maybe you should buy a dozen for other meteorite friends. Mike Michael Farmer wrote: > Hi everyone, I have been on the road heading north for days now, so little email contact. > I just wanted to let my friends in Germany know that there is a meteorite article about Bob Haag and I in German Playboy Magazine, December issue. > I have yet to see it, but it deals with meteorites in general, and focuses on Carancas. > Time is running out to get a copy, so grab one before they are gone. > I should have a few copies in Tucson, and I am sure there are other attributes in the magazine if you don't like the story about Bob and I:) > Happy Holidays from snowy and very cold Montana. > Michael Farmer > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From mikewren at gilanet.com Wed Dec 24 13:40:00 2008 From: mikewren at gilanet.com (michael cottingham) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 11:40:00 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite article in German Playboy In-Reply-To: <4952818D.2020502@rogers.com> References: <624910.85494.qm@web110602.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <4952818D.2020502@rogers.com> Message-ID: I am not sure if I want to see Mike Farmer nude! Hehehehheheheh, HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!! M. Cottingham On Dec 24, 2008, at 11:38 AM, tett wrote: > Wow Hoooo! An excuse to get a Playboy Mag. > > Bernd, can you get me a copy? Maybe you should buy a dozen for > other meteorite friends. > > Mike > > Michael Farmer wrote: >> Hi everyone, I have been on the road heading north for days now, so >> little email contact. >> I just wanted to let my friends in Germany know that there is a >> meteorite article about Bob Haag and I in German Playboy Magazine, >> December issue. I have yet to see it, but it deals with meteorites >> in general, and focuses on Carancas. Time is running out to get a >> copy, so grab one before they are gone. I should have a few copies >> in Tucson, and I am sure there are other attributes in the magazine >> if you don't like the story about Bob and I:) >> Happy Holidays from snowy and very cold Montana. >> Michael Farmer >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From psc2410xi at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 14:11:15 2008 From: psc2410xi at yahoo.com (Don Rawlings) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 11:11:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD Pricing Feedback Message-ID: <439821.57183.qm@web59312.mail.re1.yahoo.com> I see lots of stuff selling on eBay, do a search on completed auctions. Over priced specimens (and I am not saying these are) will always go begging for buyers. Don Rawlings --- On Wed, 12/24/08, Michael Farmer wrote: From: Michael Farmer Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD Pricing Feedback To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, cynapse at charter.net Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 11:34 AM That is the problem, I think people are with family, I drove to Montana in blizzards, lucky to have made it here, snowing right now, supposed to snow all night and all day tomorrow. I am only 20 miles from the Canadian border. Economy in the tank and everyone on hold I think. Michael Farmer --- On Wed, 12/24/08, Darren Garrison wrote: > From: Darren Garrison > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD Pricing Feedback > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 9:08 AM > On Wed, 24 Dec 2008 01:02:19 -0600 (GMT-06:00), you wrote: > > >Hello All, > > > >I am just wondering, since I have not received any > replies what so ever, would anyone care to share their > thoughts or suggestions regarding the prices that I have set > on my collection pieces? I believe they are fairly > reasonable for the quality at hand here, but perhaps I am > mistaken. I'm just trying to figure this out. And no > Steve, I cannot list these as give aways (aka > "freebies"). > > Maybe 1.) people are spent out because of Christmas and 2.) > people are spent out > because of global economic collapse. > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From iann at rom.on.ca Wed Dec 24 14:11:46 2008 From: iann at rom.on.ca (Ian Nicklin) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 14:11:46 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] exporting Buzzard Coulee meteorites Message-ID: <49524322020000140073B331@romfs77.rom.on.ca> ** Low Priority ** good afternoon, list members; I have recently joined the list and also work at the Royal Ontario Museum in Toronto, in the Earth Sciences section. We are glad to see such another large mass of Buzzard surface. There has been a fair degree of confusion in the past regarding Canada's export laws regarding meteorites. Hopefully this email may shed some light on the process involved. All meteorites recovered in Canada - regardless of value - are withheld from export pending the export review process. In a nutshell the system works like this: the owner of the meteorite decides he or she wishes to sell the piece. They apply to our Ministry of Heritage for an export permit. Normally the Ministry withholds granting the permit for a 6 month period. This gives Canadian institutions the opportunity to decide if they want to attempt to acquire the piece in question. If after the end of 6 months no institution has notified the Ministry of their intention to purchase the piece the export permit is granted and the owner can sell the sample to anyone they choose, anywhere in the world, perfectly legally. The owner of the 8kg mass, Mr. Wiley, has been told about the need to apply for an export permit and has been told about advantages offered by the Ministry which encourage Canadians to sell to Canadian institutions. We are aware that this law rankles many around the world however it's intention is only to give Canadians a chance first so that important material from our country remain here for the enjoyment of Canadians. This is hardly an unreasonable thing. It seems likely that there will be a large amount of material from the Buzzard Coulee fall recovered. So it is likely that there will be a significant amount of material making it's way to the international market. However it is to everyone's advantage - the buyer and the seller- that export be done according to the law. Ian Nicklin From mdavidhardy at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 14:18:17 2008 From: mdavidhardy at yahoo.com (David Hardy) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 11:18:17 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite article in German Playboy References: <624910.85494.qm@web110602.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <4952818D.2020502@rogers.com> Message-ID: <911868.6112.qm@web50203.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I am ABSOLUTELY sure I don't!!! David H. ----- Original Message ---- From: michael cottingham To: tett Cc: "bernd.pauli at paulinet.de" ; meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com; meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 1:40:00 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite article in German Playboy I am not sure if I want to see Mike Farmer nude! Hehehehheheheh, HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!! M. Cottingham On Dec 24, 2008, at 11:38 AM, tett wrote: > Wow Hoooo! An excuse to get a Playboy Mag. > > Bernd, can you get me a copy? Maybe you should buy a dozen for other meteorite friends. > > Mike > > Michael Farmer wrote: >> Hi everyone, I have been on the road heading north for days now, so little email contact. >> I just wanted to let my friends in Germany know that there is a meteorite article about Bob Haag and I in German Playboy Magazine, December issue. I have yet to see it, but it deals with meteorites in general, and focuses on Carancas. Time is running out to get a copy, so grab one before they are gone. I should have a few copies in Tucson, and I am sure there are other attributes in the magazine if you don't like the story about Bob and I:) >> Happy Holidays from snowy and very cold Montana. >> Michael Farmer >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 14:30:43 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 11:30:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite article in German Playboy In-Reply-To: <911868.6112.qm@web50203.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <82847.29648.qm@web110616.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> he he, Never fear, I think I recall Playboy tending to focus more on the fairer sex. No nude posing here. I did hear though that the issue features the past 12 months of more attractive "heavenly" bodies;) Michael Farmer --- On Wed, 12/24/08, David Hardy wrote: > From: David Hardy > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite article in German Playboy > To: "michael cottingham" , "tett" > Cc: "bernd.pauli at paulinet.de" , meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, meteoriteguy at yahoo.com > Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 12:18 PM > I am ABSOLUTELY sure I don't!!! > > David H. > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: michael cottingham > To: tett > Cc: "bernd.pauli at paulinet.de" > ; > meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com; meteoriteguy at yahoo.com > Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 1:40:00 PM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite article in German > Playboy > > I am not sure if I want to see Mike Farmer nude! > Hehehehheheheh, > > HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!! > > M. Cottingham > On Dec 24, 2008, at 11:38 AM, tett wrote: > > > Wow Hoooo! An excuse to get a Playboy Mag. > > > > Bernd, can you get me a copy? Maybe you should buy a > dozen for other meteorite friends. > > > > Mike > > > > Michael Farmer wrote: > >> Hi everyone, I have been on the road heading north > for days now, so little email contact. > >> I just wanted to let my friends in Germany know > that there is a meteorite article about Bob Haag and I in > German Playboy Magazine, December issue. I have yet to see > it, but it deals with meteorites in general, and focuses on > Carancas. Time is running out to get a copy, so grab one > before they are gone. I should have a few copies in Tucson, > and I am sure there are other attributes in the magazine if > you don't like the story about Bob and I:) > >> Happy Holidays from snowy and very cold Montana. > >> Michael Farmer > >> ______________________________________________ > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 15:41:45 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 12:41:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Happy Meteorite Holidays! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <89538.69787.qm@web58406.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi fellow listees! As my first year on the list comes to a close, I want to thank everyone here who has provided me with sage advice and great deals. I have learned much here in my time and this list has enriched my enjoyment of meteorites. I want to wish everyone a happy and safe holiday season - for whatever holiday you may celebrate. May our listmembers and their families find joy and prosperity. :) And I hope everyone that was good this year finds meteorite goodies under their Christmas tree. I was very good apparently, Santa Claus brought me the following so-far : 1) a copy of Kevin Kichinka's The Art of Collecting Meteorites. 2) a renewal of my Meteorite Magazine subscription. 3) a renewal of my Meteoritical Society membership. 4) small etched slices of Udei Station and Gibeon. 5) a nice 60mg Tagish Lake micromount 6) a nice (but small) Bassi whole individual. 7) a nice (but small) Chergach whole individual. 8) a .5 gram Carancas micromount 9) a small slice of Juvinas. 10) micromounts of NWA 482, NWA 3135, and NWA 3151. 11) 45 gram Las Palmas(?) iron 12) Acer Aspire One netbook and aluminum brief case You folks should see how much stuff I had to get the wife to create enough smokescreen to sneak these meteorite purchases in! ;) LOL (actually #1 was a gift from my stepdaughter!) Santa was good to me this year, I'll be sure to leave some milk and cookies out. :) Best regards and happy holidays! MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From MeteorHntr at aol.com Wed Dec 24 16:22:03 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 16:22:03 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights Message-ID: Hey List, Does anyone here have experience encasing meteorites in clear resin, paperweight style? If so, could you contact me off the list? Thanks, Steve Arnold #1 **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 16:28:47 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 13:28:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <229675.69223.qm@web110601.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> I know it is hard to do, and a waste of time, as junk like that hardly sells. It has been tried with disastrous results. Michael Farmer --- On Wed, 12/24/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 2:22 PM > Hey List, > > Does anyone here have experience encasing meteorites in > clear resin, > paperweight style? > > If so, could you contact me off the list? > > Thanks, > > Steve Arnold #1 > > **************One site keeps you connected to all your > email: AOL Mail, > Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From fuzzfoot at comcast.net Wed Dec 24 16:38:22 2008 From: fuzzfoot at comcast.net (Mike Bandli) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 13:38:22 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20081224213825.3175A10554@mailwash5.pair.com> I wouldn't do it for rock or meteorite. The resin/Lucite/acrylic will likely crack unless you put your material in a vacuum and remove as much water as possible. Even some of the Apollo lunar material Lucites cracked and they had been in vacuum for millions of years. I have looked into it extensively and was advised that the failure rate is incredible for this kind of material. Good luck! Mike Bandli -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of MeteorHntr at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 1:22 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights Hey List, Does anyone here have experience encasing meteorites in clear resin, paperweight style? If so, could you contact me off the list? Thanks, Steve Arnold #1 **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000 025) ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From Impactika at aol.com Wed Dec 24 16:50:36 2008 From: Impactika at aol.com (Impactika at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 16:50:36 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights Message-ID: Hello Steve, and all, Next time you are in Fort Worth, you might ask Art Ehlmann to show you the main mass of Somervell County. When Oscar Monnig bought it, it was already a very old and weathered pallasite, and he was adviced to have it encased in plastic to protect it. That did not work for very long, and it just broke in pieces. Too bad because it is a pretty pallasite. Anne M. Black http://www.impactika.com/ IMPACTIKA at aol.com Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. http://www.imca.cc/ In a message dated 12/24/2008 2:38:36 PM Mountain Standard Time, fuzzfoot at comcast.net writes: I wouldn't do it for rock or meteorite. The resin/Lucite/acrylic will likely crack unless you put your material in a vacuum and remove as much water as possible. Even some of the Apollo lunar material Lucites cracked and they had been in vacuum for millions of years. I have looked into it extensively and was advised that the failure rate is incredible for this kind of material. Good luck! Mike Bandli -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of MeteorHntr at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 1:22 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights Hey List, Does anyone here have experience encasing meteorites in clear resin, paperweight style? If so, could you contact me off the list? Thanks, Steve Arnold #1 **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From mikewren at gilanet.com Wed Dec 24 17:01:42 2008 From: mikewren at gilanet.com (michael cottingham) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 15:01:42 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: LAST SALE OF THE YEAR-Take A Peak Under The Tree! 24hr Only! Message-ID: <3E76949C-FCD4-4C59-B128-CE72061EEA87@gilanet.com> HELLO, Worth A Peak! Go to: http://stores.ebay.com/voyage-botanica-natural-history Best Wishes Michael Cottingham From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 17:19:55 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 14:19:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights In-Reply-To: <20081224213825.3175A10554@mailwash5.pair.com> Message-ID: <514161.3595.qm@web110616.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Darrly Pitt made those Mars cubes, (now, those were pretty cool) but the Zagami dust was inside a glass vial and thus the lucite stuck to it easier than it would to a raw meteorite. He told me the failure rate for those was more than 60%. That is what I was referring to. I have seen Fukang encased in resin as well, when it works, it looks great, but again, massive failure rate, and the material encased is really destroyed in the process. The resin does not often adhere to the object, and shows a bubble where it fails to adhere, making the object look like crap. Michael Farmer --- On Wed, 12/24/08, Mike Bandli wrote: > From: Mike Bandli > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights > To: MeteorHntr at aol.com, meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 2:38 PM > I wouldn't do it for rock or meteorite. The > resin/Lucite/acrylic will likely > crack unless you put your material in a vacuum and remove > as much water as > possible. Even some of the Apollo lunar material Lucites > cracked and they > had been in vacuum for millions of years. I have looked > into it extensively > and was advised that the failure rate is incredible for > this kind of > material. > > Good luck! > > Mike Bandli > > -----Original Message----- > From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On > Behalf Of > MeteorHntr at aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 1:22 PM > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights > > > Hey List, > > Does anyone here have experience encasing meteorites in > clear resin, > paperweight style? > > If so, could you contact me off the list? > > Thanks, > > Steve Arnold #1 > > **************One site keeps you connected to all your > email: AOL Mail, > Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000 > 025) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From tett at rogers.com Wed Dec 24 17:38:39 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 17:38:39 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Raw Buzzard Coulee photo In-Reply-To: <514161.3595.qm@web110616.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> References: <514161.3595.qm@web110616.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4952B9EF.8080108@rogers.com> Thought I would share this 20 power view from a ground face of Buzzard Coulee. Notice some oxidation forming around metal grains. Merry Christmas to all and may your stockings be stuffed with at least one little meteorite. Here is the pic: http://picasaweb.google.com/MikeTettenborn/Meteorites#5283488187988944482 Cheers! Mike Tettenborn From grf2 at verizon.net Wed Dec 24 18:56:27 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 18:56:27 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] From the meteorite-list Admin - posting Ads References: <998a6e0f0812222137g1a428bcfw60739753c9d0d62f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <13A003EEA2C8453780EDEBA704E86211@ASUS> Merry Christmas Art and a Happy New Year too!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Art" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 12:37 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] From the meteorite-list Admin - posting Ads > Good evening! > > I wanted to send a quick reminder regarding posting ads on the list. > While most members do like seeing all of the interesting specimens > that are offered for sale on the list, sometimes ads tend to get a bit > overwhelming. To keep things from getting out of control please limit > ads to one per week. Also remember to start the subject line of the > email with 'SALE' or 'AD'. > > Hope everyone has a wonderful holiday and prosperous new year! > > Best Regards, Art > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From grf2 at verizon.net Wed Dec 24 18:58:33 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 18:58:33 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 23, 2008 References: <26919305.60681230032862247.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: Oink oink!!!!!!!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Johnson" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 6:47 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 23,2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_23_2008.html > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 20:50:14 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 17:50:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] merry christmas and thanks Message-ID: <876379.3924.qm@web57808.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Good evening everyone.I want to personally wish everyone on this list and thier family's a very Merry Christmas.I know for myself it has been a rough year job wise,but I am looking forward to a better 2009.I wanted to also thank a few meteorite dealers who have helped me with all my sikote-alin meteorite buys.First is jim strope,who has given me many great looking sa's to add to my collection,also geoff notkin,bob haag,mike johnson,dave gheesling,eric twelker,and a few more.It makes it so much easier to collect,when you only collect 1 item.I now have 61?piece's of sikote-alins totalling 10.4 kilo's.Most can be viewed on my website.Thanks again and merry christmas to all. ? Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From michael at spacerocksinc.com Wed Dec 24 21:40:31 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 18:40:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] MERRY CHRISTMAS! Message-ID: <25787146.3141230172831643.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/MERRY-CHRISTMAS.html From meteoritefinder at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 21:47:06 2008 From: meteoritefinder at yahoo.com (Robert Woolard) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 18:47:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Merry Christmas, Thanks, and 40 Years Ago Today Message-ID: <682367.46006.qm@web39608.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hello List, Just snuck away from the family celebrations to quickly say Merry Christmas to everyone on "The List"--- especially to Art for providing it for us all. Also, I'm sure every one knows already, but it was 40 years ago today, Christmas Eve 1968, when Apollo 8 became the first manned craft to orbit the Moon. Wow. Forty years ago today. Do all you guys who were alive then remember that night like I do? (I KNOW you do, Greg (LUNAtic) Redfern! ;-) Best wishes to all, Robert Woolard From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 21:48:58 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 18:48:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] MERRY CHRISTMAS! In-Reply-To: <25787146.3141230172831643.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: <323814.30030.qm@web45606.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Yes, Merry Christmas to all and be safe! --- On Wed, 12/24/08, Michael Johnson wrote: > From: Michael Johnson > Subject: [meteorite-list] MERRY CHRISTMAS! > To: "Meteorite List" > Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 9:40 PM > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/MERRY-CHRISTMAS.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From azizhabibi at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 22:30:47 2008 From: azizhabibi at yahoo.com (habibi abdelaziz) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 19:30:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] new fall over mountains in atlas Message-ID: <504935.84620.qm@web62001.mail.re1.yahoo.com> merry Christmas to all and happy holidays, may?Allah bring peace and happiness into our heart , and may this next year bring us a lot of meteorite and? bonheur and friendship,and may allah make us ?passing true this world crisis in good way. joyeux No?l a tous , et bonne ann?e , qu'allah?inchallah mettra bcp de bonheur dans notre vie, et que cette nouvelle ann?e soit une merveilleuse ann?e pour nous tous, qu'allah nous garde en bonne sant?, et que cette crise mondilae nous ne affecte pas, === back to meteorite ; there? was a big fireball over irghrem in the high mountain atlas , there is ?four days , member of my family saw it ?from agadir , the?military? was looking for it by helicopter , and i heard they have gps coordinate fo this new fall, we will see if we can find anything, and i hope its not a common chondrite this time, stay in peace and enjoy your holidays ? habibi aziz www.palmserfoud.com www.palmotel.com box 70 erfoud 52200 morroco phone. 21235576145 fax.21235576170 From psc2410xi at yahoo.com Wed Dec 24 22:34:04 2008 From: psc2410xi at yahoo.com (Don Rawlings) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 19:34:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights Message-ID: <846397.24347.qm@web59303.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Been there, done that.......... http://www.universecollection.com/product_detail.asp?CategoryID=3&SubCategoryID=51&ProductID=685 Don Rawlings --- On Wed, 12/24/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: From: MeteorHntr at aol.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 4:22 PM Hey List, Does anyone here have? experience encasing meteorites in clear resin, paperweight style? If so,? could you contact me off the list? Thanks, Steve Arnold #1? **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From Impactika at aol.com Wed Dec 24 22:48:21 2008 From: Impactika at aol.com (Impactika at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 22:48:21 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] MERRY CHRISTMAS! Message-ID: In a message dated 12/24/2008 7:40:58 PM Mountain Standard Time, michael at spacerocksinc.com writes: http://www.rocksfromspace.org/MERRY-CHRISTMAS.html ______________________________________________ Thank you Michael, Merry Christmas to you and to all the List-Members around the Globe. (Thank you Art) Anne M. Black http://www.impactika.com/ IMPACTIKA at aol.com Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. http://www.imca.cc/ **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From MeteorHntr at aol.com Wed Dec 24 23:11:55 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 23:11:55 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights Message-ID: In a message dated 12/24/2008 3:50:36 P.M. Central Standard Time, Impactika writes: Hello Steve, and all, Next time you are in Fort Worth, you might ask Art Ehlmann to show you the main mass of Somervell County. When Oscar Monnig bought it, it was already a very old and weathered pallasite, and he was adviced to have it encased in plastic to protect it. That did not work for very long, and it just broke in pieces. Too bad because it is a pretty pallasite. Anne M. Black http://www.impactika.com/ IMPACTIKA at aol.com Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. http://www.imca.cc/ Hello Anne, Yes I am aware of the Somervell County. It is a great story. As I understand, Dupont Laboratories had invented this new stuff called plastic, and Monnig heard about it. It might be that the Somervell County was the very first thing ever encapsulated in plastic, or at least that new kind. Of course, that was a huge entire mass with lots of rusting and cracking going on before it was put in, which couldn't help from the inside. And of course years of light hitting it would cause it to deteriorate from the exterior. What I am thinking about is for thin slices of Brenham. I put a slice of Brenham in some about 3 years ago, and it has been preserved perfectly since then. Of course it could still start rusting inside at any minute. But it has encouraged me that something like this might work for slices. My question to the list was to ask to talk with anyone who has tried doing something similar. It doesn't matter to me if the results were successful or not, as long as I can glean some information from others experiments. Obviously Monnig failed at his Somervell County experiment, at least in the long run. Why that failed could be attributed to many things: 1930's plastic quality, poor workmanship on the encasing, moisture in the rock, and even that particular specimen. To say that one failure dooms ALL future attempts I think is a little unscientific. Steve Arnold #1 **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From MeteorHntr at aol.com Wed Dec 24 23:21:30 2008 From: MeteorHntr at aol.com (MeteorHntr at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 23:21:30 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights Message-ID: In a message dated 12/24/2008 4:20:02 P.M. Central Standard Time, meteoriteguy at yahoo.com writes: I have seen Fukang encased in resin as well, when it works, it looks great, but again, massive failure rate, and the material encased is really destroyed in the process. The resin does not often adhere to the object, and shows a bubble where it fails to adhere, making the object look like crap. Mike and All, Yea, I totally forgot about the Fukang. Of course, a 60% failure rate with a $20/g thin slice hurts worse than a possible 60% failure rate with a $3/g Brenham. Also, it might be easier to sand away the resin on a thick slice of Brenham compared to trying to salvage a thin Fukang in a botched job. I will talk with the encaser of the Fukang for any insight he might have. Thanks for the tip. Steve Arnold #1 **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From gredfern at earthlink.net Wed Dec 24 23:46:45 2008 From: gredfern at earthlink.net (Greg Redfern) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 23:46:45 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Merry Christmas, Thanks, and 40 Years Ago Today In-Reply-To: <682367.46006.qm@web39608.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <36BFF7930C934BA28DB7836FBC3A509E@gregufeopu010a> Of course I do Robert! The Moon was 5 days old, 30% illuminated and high in the SW skies of Southern California. Venus was also in the same section of sky as it is now. I used my 6" f/8 Edmund Scientific Newtonian to observe the Moon while Apollo 8 was in lunar orbit....probably why I am such a lunatic observer AND collector of 21 lunar meteorites including some of the best in the world made possible by you. Happy Holidays to all and may we live in an age where the 1.5 second transmission delay of astronauts on the Moon occurs again! Greg Greg Redfern NASA JPL Solar System Ambassador http://www2.jpl.nasa.gov/ambassador/index.html WHAT'S UP?: THE SPACE PLACE http://www.wtopnews.com/?sid=600113&nid=421 ASTROCAST http://astrocast.tv/ -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Robert Woolard Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 9:47 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Merry Christmas, Thanks, and 40 Years Ago Today Hello List, Just snuck away from the family celebrations to quickly say Merry Christmas to everyone on "The List"--- especially to Art for providing it for us all. Also, I'm sure every one knows already, but it was 40 years ago today, Christmas Eve 1968, when Apollo 8 became the first manned craft to orbit the Moon. Wow. Forty years ago today. Do all you guys who were alive then remember that night like I do? (I KNOW you do, Greg (LUNAtic) Redfern! ;-) Best wishes to all, Robert Woolard ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From grf2 at verizon.net Wed Dec 24 23:57:55 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 23:57:55 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ALL Message-ID: AND TO ALL A GOOD NIGHT Jerry Flaherty From michael at spacerocksinc.com Thu Dec 25 00:04:47 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 21:04:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 25, 2008 Message-ID: <20562014.5681230181487075.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_25_2008.html From grf2 at verizon.net Thu Dec 25 00:09:14 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 00:09:14 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 25, 2008 References: <20562014.5681230181487075.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: How nice Twink, Jim's remembered fondly. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Johnson" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 12:04 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 25,2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_25_2008.html > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From bristolia at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 00:46:13 2008 From: bristolia at yahoo.com (Paul) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 21:46:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Online PDF files about Permian-Triassic extinction Message-ID: <450579.86663.qm@web36208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear Friends, The PDF files for a number of papers about the Permian - Triassic extinction can be downloaded from: http://pangea.stanford.edu/research/paleobiology/publications.php They include: Payne, J.L. and Kump, L.R. 2007. Evidence for recurrent Early Triassic massive volcanism from quantitative interpretation of carbon isotope fluctuations. Earth and Planetary Science Letters. vol. 256, pp. 264-277. http://pangea.stanford.edu/~jlpayne/Payne%20and%20Kump%202007%20EPSL.pdf Payne, J.L., Lehrmann, D.J., Follett, D., Seibel, M., Kump, L.R., Riccardi, A., Altiner, D., Sano, H., and Wei, J. 2007. Erosional truncation of uppermost Permian shallow-marine carbonates and implications for Permian-Triassic boundary events. Geological Society of America Bulletin. vol. 119, pp. 771-784. http://pangea.stanford.edu/~jlpayne/Payne_et_al_2007_GSABull.pdf Knoll, A.H., Bambach, R.K., Payne, J.L., Pruss, S., and Fischer, W. 2007. Paleophysiology and end-Permian mass extinction. Earth and Planetary Science Letters. vol. 256, pp. 295-313. http://pangea.stanford.edu/~jlpayne/Knoll%20et%20al%202007%20EPSL%20Permian%20Triassic%20paleophysiology.pdf Lehrmann, D. J., Payne, J. L., Pei, D., Enos, P., Ellwood, B., Orchard, M.J., Zhang, J., and Wei, J. 2007. Record of the end-Permian extinction and Triassic biotic recovery in the Chongzuo-Pingguo Platform, southern Nanpanjiang Basin, Guangxi, south China. Palaeogeography, Palaeoclimatology, Palaeoecology. vol. 252, pp. 200-217. http://pangea.stanford.edu/~jlpayne/Lehrmann%20et%20al%202006%20Geology.pdf Yours, Paul H. From pshugar at clearwire.net Thu Dec 25 00:47:24 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 23:47:24 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Christmas Greetings Message-ID: <001501c96654$44e7ae90$d0e11960@laptop> May I please have a few moments of your time to offer a very heartfelt thanks to all the great meteorite dealers as well the many collectors that grace our wonderful list with so much wisdom, wit, and yes, even some bickering amoungst other list members. I can not help but feel that each and every meteorite is a messenger from the Gods. The science learned from all the meteorite falls and finds has made us all far more knowledgeable of how our little corner of the universe was formed and as this process still continues today. I watched the complete space program from start to finish. That was a long time ago. Just over two years ago, I lived in a wonderful spot----on the Northern edge of the Odessa strewnfield. I visited the new museum, even getting to be there at the dedication. My first meteorite was an Odessa (I still have it). Then I discovered Ebay and one of my first purchases was a Lunar meteorite--a very small micro.(Thank you, Greg). With wonder, I opened the gem jar and actually touched the moon, a place that over 35 years ago, I watched in facination as Neil stepped into history. Meteorite collecting and dealing is a world wide business. Let us never lose sight of the fact that our hobby just may ignite a joy, a love of science, that will raise up a new Armstrong (to maybe in our lifetime) walk on another planet----Mars. May the seasons best wishes visit all in the coming new year. Pete IMCA 1733 From daistiho at hotmail.com Thu Dec 25 01:40:22 2008 From: daistiho at hotmail.com (tracy latimer) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 06:40:22 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Happy Holidays! Message-ID: Best wishes to all, and may a meteorite of your choice fall in your back yard (maybe striking a grill or tool shed :) Tracy Latimer _________________________________________________________________ Send e-mail anywhere. No map, no compass. http://windowslive.com/oneline/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_anywhere_122008 From sterling_k_webb at sbcglobal.net Thu Dec 25 02:09:40 2008 From: sterling_k_webb at sbcglobal.net (Sterling K. Webb) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 01:09:40 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Happy Holidays! References: Message-ID: <00f501c9665f$c21174e0$ed4ae146@ATARIENGINE> Hi, Tracy, List, > may a meteorite of your choice fall in your backyard... The ideal "wish" meteorite? Hmmm... OK, it will be the first unequivocal Mercurian meteorite, or a Lunaite (which Randy Korotev will demonstrate came from the Moon's farside and is a unique type). It will strike the steel support of your TV antenna and bounce off, smashing the edge of your roof, thus becoming a house-smasher. It will bound downward and strike the obnoxious neighbor standing in your yard arguing with you a glancing blow, thus becoming a people-striking meteorite, not seriously harming him, but shutting him up. It will complete its re-entry by dealing a fatal blow to the neighbor's yappy little dog who wakes you up in the middle of the night; the dog becomes the first witnessed authentic dog-killed-by-a-meteorite. You become the sole owner of the 11.7 kg meteorite, conservatively estimated by the market sages of the List to be worth $1728 per gram, not mention the value of pieces of your roof and antenna, old Band-Aids off the neighbor, and the dead dog, of course, all eminently collectible. Other than getting possession of a meteorite that strikes Santa in his sled, I don't see how you could do better than that. Sterling K. Webb ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "tracy latimer" To: Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 12:40 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Happy Holidays! Best wishes to all, and may a meteorite of your choice fall in your back yard (maybe striking a grill or tool shed :) Tracy Latimer _________________________________________________________________ Send e-mail anywhere. No map, no compass. http://windowslive.com/oneline/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_anywhere_122008 ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From waltbranch at bellsouth.net Thu Dec 25 04:12:05 2008 From: waltbranch at bellsouth.net (Walter Branch) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 04:12:05 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Merry Christmas Message-ID: <084FC0294008402181FB0F081D2EE84A@Walter> Hello Everyone, Just wanted to wish everyone a Merry Christmas. I hope today brings a little joy to everyone. 2008 was a rocky year for most, with the global economic meltdown. I hope 2009 will be better. I have been MIA from much of meteorite collecting and the list in 2008, though I have developed an interest in primarily Lunar and Martian meteorites, particularly the idea of source crater pairing. Anyway, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to come! -Walter Branch From lebofsky at lpl.arizona.edu Thu Dec 25 06:28:24 2008 From: lebofsky at lpl.arizona.edu (lebofsky at lpl.arizona.edu) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 04:28:24 -0700 (MST) Subject: [meteorite-list] MERRY CHRISTMAS! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <50874.71.226.60.25.1230204504.squirrel@timber.lpl.arizona.edu> Hello Everyone: Nancy and I want to wish you and your families a happy holiday season, on this, the fortieth anniversary of one of the most famous images from the Apollo era. On Christmas Eve, 1968, Bill Anders in the Apollo spacecraft orbiting the Moon, took the attached image as the Earth ?rose? over the barren lunar landscape. This image brought home to many how beautiful, yet fragile, our home is. http://meteoritemagazine.blogspot.com/ Larry and Nancy PS This is an experiment with a Blog I have created for Meteorite magazine. I hope it works! PPS If you were standing on the Moon, would you ever see the Earth rise? From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Thu Dec 25 07:48:02 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 25 Dec 2008 12:48:02 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Re-2: Meteorite article in German Playboy Message-ID: Mike F. wrote: "I am sure there are other attributes in the magazine" hmm, ..., hhmm, ...hhmm, .... ??? Mike T. wrote: "Bernd, can you get me a copy? Maybe you should buy a dozen for other meteorite friends." Ahem, ... what are these guys talking about ?!?!?! :-)) ;-)) :-)) Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays Wherever you are, whoever you are, Wahtever ou are doing, Bernd To: tett at rogers.com meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com From grf2 at verizon.net Thu Dec 25 10:55:54 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 10:55:54 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Online PDF files about Permian-Triassic extinction References: <450579.86663.qm@web36208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <74EFAF7B763F43BA8C13BF46F96F8FB0@ASUS> Thanks Paul, they're in my favorites. Now all I have to do is devote the time to read [and interpret] them. Jerry Flaherty ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul" To: Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 12:46 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Online PDF files about Permian-Triassic extinction > Dear Friends, > > The PDF files for a number of papers about the Permian > - Triassic extinction can be downloaded from: > > http://pangea.stanford.edu/research/paleobiology/publications.php > > They include: > > Payne, J.L. and Kump, L.R. 2007. Evidence for recurrent > Early Triassic massive volcanism from quantitative > interpretation of carbon isotope fluctuations. Earth > and Planetary Science Letters. vol. 256, pp. 264-277. > > http://pangea.stanford.edu/~jlpayne/Payne%20and%20Kump%202007%20EPSL.pdf > > Payne, J.L., Lehrmann, D.J., Follett, D., Seibel, M., > Kump, L.R., Riccardi, A., Altiner, D., Sano, H., and > Wei, J. 2007. Erosional truncation of uppermost Permian > shallow-marine carbonates and implications for > Permian-Triassic boundary events. Geological Society > of America Bulletin. vol. 119, pp. 771-784. > > http://pangea.stanford.edu/~jlpayne/Payne_et_al_2007_GSABull.pdf > > Knoll, A.H., Bambach, R.K., Payne, J.L., Pruss, S., > and Fischer, W. 2007. Paleophysiology and end-Permian > mass extinction. Earth and Planetary Science Letters. > vol. 256, pp. 295-313. > > http://pangea.stanford.edu/~jlpayne/Knoll%20et%20al%202007%20EPSL%20Permian%20Triassic%20paleophysiology.pdf > > Lehrmann, D. J., Payne, J. L., Pei, D., Enos, P., > Ellwood, B., Orchard, M.J., Zhang, J., and Wei, J. > 2007. Record of the end-Permian extinction and > Triassic biotic recovery in the Chongzuo-Pingguo > Platform, southern Nanpanjiang Basin, Guangxi, > south China. Palaeogeography, Palaeoclimatology, > Palaeoecology. vol. 252, pp. 200-217. > > http://pangea.stanford.edu/~jlpayne/Lehrmann%20et%20al%202006%20Geology.pdf > > Yours, > > Paul H. > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 10:55:55 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 07:55:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Merry Christmas! Message-ID: <620827.47019.qm@web110605.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Good Christmas morning to everyone. I hope the best of the holidays to all and look forward to a new year, full of meteorite finds and fall. 2008 was really one for the record books as far as falls went, and I hope 2009 will be better. Don't forget, the Tucson show is almost here, my room will be open in less than one month! If you have no reservations (car, room, flight), I would get on it. Michael Farmer From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 11:52:08 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 08:52:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Encasing meteorites in resin to make trinkets In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <951217.82976.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> This practice should be ILLEGAL. It's gaudy and it cheapens all meteorites by association. If I could, I would buy up all of this meteorite resin junk in existence, throw it in a big pile and burn it up. Just my two cents. Happy Holidays! MikeG ---------------------------------- Message: 6 Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 19:34:04 -0800 (PST) From: Don Rawlings Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Message-ID: <846397.24347.qm at web59303.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Been there, done that.......... http://www.universecollection.com/product_detail.asp?CategoryID=3&SubCategoryID=51&ProductID=685 ------------------------------------------------------ Don Rawlings --- On Wed, 12/24/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote: From: MeteorHntr at aol.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 4:22 PM Hey List, Does anyone here have? experience encasing meteorites in clear resin, paperweight style? If so,? could you contact me off the list? Thanks, Steve Arnold #1? From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 12:02:33 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 09:02:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Encasing meteorites in resin to make trinkets In-Reply-To: <951217.82976.qm@web58407.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <326995.44646.qm@web110613.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> This, I have to disagree on. Those who come to Tucson, can see in my room a piece of Brenham, encased in Lucite by Nininger himself. The interesting part, is that it is a partslice, perfectly preserved, in oil! Inside the Lucite cube, the slice is suspended in some kind of oil, where it moves, and looks like it was cut and polished yesterday. I have the receipt with it, Nininger sold it in the 1940s. This kind of preservation for a rusty meteorite with a huge amount of material is OK for me. A gaudy paperweight is a different story. I would like to know how this was done, as it would be a great way to display slices of crappy rusting meteorites like Admire, which on it's own, will turn into kitty litter in a short time. Michael Farmer --- On Thu, 12/25/08, Michael Gilmer wrote: > From: Michael Gilmer > Subject: [meteorite-list] Encasing meteorites in resin to make trinkets > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Thursday, December 25, 2008, 9:52 AM > This practice should be ILLEGAL. > > It's gaudy and it cheapens all meteorites by > association. > > If I could, I would buy up all of this meteorite resin junk > in > existence, throw it in a big pile and burn it up. > > Just my two cents. > > Happy Holidays! > > MikeG > > > ---------------------------------- > > Message: 6 > Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 19:34:04 -0800 (PST) > From: Don Rawlings > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Message-ID: > <846397.24347.qm at web59303.mail.re1.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 > > Been there, done that.......... > > http://www.universecollection.com/product_detail.asp?CategoryID=3&SubCategoryID=51&ProductID=685 > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Don Rawlings > > --- On Wed, 12/24/08, MeteorHntr at aol.com > wrote: > > > From: MeteorHntr at aol.com > Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Paperweights > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 4:22 PM > > > > Hey List, > > Does anyone here have? experience encasing meteorites in > clear resin, > paperweight style? > > If so,? could you contact me off the list? > > Thanks, > > Steve Arnold #1? > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From aeromadness at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 16:46:12 2008 From: aeromadness at yahoo.com (Harry) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 13:46:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? Message-ID: <317630.18141.qm@web57801.mail.re3.yahoo.com> I was wondering what the proper name for someone who studies/hunts/collects meteorites. I had heard it was meteoricist but that might be wrong. Sent from my iPhone From cynapse at charter.net Thu Dec 25 16:51:39 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 16:51:39 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? In-Reply-To: <317630.18141.qm@web57801.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <317630.18141.qm@web57801.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 25 Dec 2008 13:46:12 -0800 (PST), you wrote: >I was wondering what the proper name for someone who studies/hunts/collects meteorites. I had heard it was meteoricist but that might be wrong. > >Sent from my iPhone A scientist who studies meteorites is called a "meteoriticist". A person who hunts/collects meteorites is called an "obsessed nut". Sent from my dEsktop. From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Thu Dec 25 16:46:53 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 25 Dec 2008 21:46:53 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Re-2: Name? Message-ID: A scientist who studies meteorites is called a "m e t e o r i t i c i s t". A person who hunts/collects meteorites is called an "obsessed *n u t* ". That's it in a "*n u t* shell"! :-) Bernd To: cynapse at charter.net meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com From fuzzfoot at comcast.net Thu Dec 25 17:06:08 2008 From: fuzzfoot at comcast.net (Mike Bandli) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 14:06:08 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? In-Reply-To: <317630.18141.qm@web57801.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20081225220612.80D851058A@mailwash5.pair.com> A meteoriticist is a cyst that looks like a meteorite. No, but really: In short, a meteoriticist is some who studies the science of meteors and meteorites. A meteoriticist should have a background and knowledge of many things including meteors, astrophysics, geology, petrology, etc.. I think that the word meteoriticist is tossed around too much within our hobby when in reality it is more of a true profession. That is not to say that you cannot be an amateur meteoriticist! If you hunt meteorites are you a meteoriticist? Not necessarily. If you collect meteorites are you a meteoriticist? Not necessarily. A meteoriticist can, however, hunt and collect meteorites :) Merry Christmas! Mike Bandli -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Harry Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 1:46 PM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? I was wondering what the proper name for someone who studies/hunts/collects meteorites. I had heard it was meteoricist but that might be wrong. Sent from my iPhone ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From Metorman46 at aol.com Thu Dec 25 17:33:37 2008 From: Metorman46 at aol.com (Metorman46 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 17:33:37 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Merry Christmas! Message-ID: Merry christmas;; To all the members of the greatest and most unique meteorite list in the universe. >From the many membered Herman and Billie Archer family. IMCA # 2770 **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From mlblood at cox.net Thu Dec 25 17:40:10 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 14:40:10 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? In-Reply-To: <20081225220612.80D851058A@mailwash5.pair.com> Message-ID: I have used, "Meteoritophile," "meteorite enthusiast," "meteorite Collector," etc. From the celestial mind of Michael Blood (though some have referred to it using less honorific terminology). on 12/25/08 2:06 PM, Mike Bandli at fuzzfoot at comcast.net wrote: > A meteoriticist is a cyst that looks like a meteorite. > > No, but really: > > In short, a meteoriticist is some who studies the science of meteors and > meteorites. A meteoriticist should have a background and knowledge of many > things including meteors, astrophysics, geology, petrology, etc.. > > I think that the word meteoriticist is tossed around too much within our > hobby when in reality it is more of a true profession. That is not to say > that you cannot be an amateur meteoriticist! > > If you hunt meteorites are you a meteoriticist? Not necessarily. > > If you collect meteorites are you a meteoriticist? Not necessarily. > > A meteoriticist can, however, hunt and collect meteorites :) > > Merry Christmas! > > Mike Bandli > > -----Original Message----- > From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Harry > Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 1:46 PM > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? > > I was wondering what the proper name for someone who studies/hunts/collects > meteorites. I had heard it was meteoricist but that might be wrong. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From gmhupe at htn.net Thu Dec 25 18:07:32 2008 From: gmhupe at htn.net (Greg Hupe) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 18:07:32 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? References: <317630.18141.qm@web57801.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Harry, I think the name would be "Passionate" Obsessed *Nut* Meteoritophile Enthusiasts! Greg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Harry" To: Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 4:46 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? >I was wondering what the proper name for someone who studies/hunts/collects >meteorites. I had heard it was meteoricist but that might be wrong. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From edeckert at triad.rr.com Thu Dec 25 18:14:49 2008 From: edeckert at triad.rr.com (Ed Deckert) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 18:14:49 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? References: <317630.18141.qm@web57801.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <03fd01c966e6$95dc6510$6401a8c0@EdDeckertMain> So, would a person who studies/hunts/collects only meteorites from the moon be called a "Lunartic"? :-) Ed ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Hupe" To: "Harry" Cc: Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 6:07 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Name? > Hi Harry, > > I think the name would be "Passionate" Obsessed *Nut* Meteoritophile > Enthusiasts! > > Greg > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Harry" > To: > Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 4:46 PM > Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? > > >>I was wondering what the proper name for someone who >>studies/hunts/collects meteorites. I had heard it was meteoricist but that >>might be wrong. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (6.0.0.386) > Database version: 5.11410 > http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/ E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (6.0.0.386) Database version: 5.11410 http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/ From pshugar at clearwire.net Thu Dec 25 19:23:17 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 18:23:17 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Test Message-ID: <001501c966f0$29214440$d0e11960@laptop> Ignore this. Pete From ensoramanda at ntlworld.com Thu Dec 25 19:24:05 2008 From: ensoramanda at ntlworld.com (ensoramanda at ntlworld.com) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 0:24:05 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Merry Christmas In-Reply-To: <084FC0294008402181FB0F081D2EE84A@Walter> Message-ID: <20081226002405.HFAPC.138739.root@web02-winn.ispmail.private.ntl.com> Hi Walter and all, A merry Christmas from the UK...Boxing day here now...just. Walter..I found your mention of pairing Lunar and Matian meteorites with craters interesting. Just wondered how many and which had been paired already and how? Graham Ensor, Nr Barwell... ---- Walter Branch wrote: > Hello Everyone, > > Just wanted to wish everyone a Merry Christmas. I hope today brings a > little joy to everyone. 2008 was a rocky year for most, with the global > economic meltdown. I hope 2009 will be better. > > I have been MIA from much of meteorite collecting and the list in 2008, > though I have developed an interest in primarily Lunar and Martian > meteorites, particularly the idea of source crater pairing. > > Anyway, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to come! > > -Walter Branch > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mark at meteorites.cc Thu Dec 25 19:26:16 2008 From: mark at meteorites.cc (Mark Crawford) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 00:26:16 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? In-Reply-To: References: <317630.18141.qm@web57801.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <495424A8.4030704@meteorites.cc> When I started out, a wise man told me, "I can only say two things about this hobby: it'll become an obsession, and your wife will never understand." :) Mark Greg Hupe wrote: > Hi Harry, > > I think the name would be "Passionate" Obsessed *Nut* Meteoritophile > Enthusiasts! > > Greg > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Harry" > To: > Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 4:46 PM > Subject: [meteorite-list] Name? > > >> I was wondering what the proper name for someone who >> studies/hunts/collects meteorites. I had heard it was meteoricist but >> that might be wrong. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.0/1864 - Release Date: 25/12/2008 09:40 > > -- Mark's Meteorite Pages: http://meteorites.cc From aeromadness at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 19:30:42 2008 From: aeromadness at yahoo.com (Harry) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 16:30:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Most important person in modern meteorites Message-ID: <541666.55068.qm@web57805.mail.re3.yahoo.com> There are many names out there, but who in your mind is the most important name in meteorites From pshugar at clearwire.net Thu Dec 25 19:37:41 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 18:37:41 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] test Message-ID: <000801c966f2$2b1e13c0$d0e11960@laptop> ignore From pshugar at clearwire.net Thu Dec 25 19:39:20 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 18:39:20 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Most important person in modern meteorites References: <541666.55068.qm@web57805.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000d01c966f2$66fdfd10$d0e11960@laptop> me From pshugar at clearwire.net Thu Dec 25 19:45:17 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 18:45:17 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] test Message-ID: <001401c966f3$3c200fb0$d0e11960@laptop> ignore From pshugar at clearwire.net Thu Dec 25 19:45:25 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 18:45:25 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] (no subject) Message-ID: <001501c966f3$3f4396d0$d0e11960@laptop> From John at Cabassi.net Thu Dec 25 19:46:01 2008 From: John at Cabassi.net (John.L.Cabassi) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 16:46:01 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] MERRY CHRISTMAS! References: Message-ID: <00a901c966f3$58adefd0$4564fea9@TITAN> G'Day Everyone Thanks for the great year of input. I'd like to wish every one of you and your families a very Merry Christmas. Everyone be safe out there. Cheers John and Katina ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 7:48 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] MERRY CHRISTMAS! > In a message dated 12/24/2008 7:40:58 PM Mountain Standard Time, > michael at spacerocksinc.com writes: > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/MERRY-CHRISTMAS.html > > ______________________________________________ > > > Thank you Michael, > > Merry Christmas to you and to all the List-Members around the Globe. > (Thank you Art) > > Anne M. Black > http://www.impactika.com/ > IMPACTIKA at aol.com > Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. > http://www.imca.cc/ > **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, > Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From pshugar at clearwire.net Thu Dec 25 19:47:14 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 18:47:14 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] test Message-ID: <001901c966f3$9251a4c0$d0e11960@laptop> ignore From mlblood at cox.net Thu Dec 25 19:49:14 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 16:49:14 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] UK & "Boxing Day" Merry Christmas In-Reply-To: <20081226002405.HFAPC.138739.root@web02-winn.ispmail.private.ntl.com> Message-ID: Please, There must be a lot of US folks who, like I, wonder just what "Boxing Day" really is.... I mean, do you all start hitting one another, Or what? Is it a celebration of dogs with pointy ears? Is it a day y'all Hold a lot of boxing matches? what? Michael on 12/25/08 4:24 PM, ensoramanda at ntlworld.com at ensoramanda at ntlworld.com wrote: > Hi Walter and all, > > A merry Christmas from the UK...Boxing day here now...just. > > Walter..I found your mention of pairing Lunar and Matian meteorites with > craters interesting. Just wondered how many and which had been paired already > and how? > > Graham Ensor, Nr Barwell... > > ---- Walter Branch wrote: >> Hello Everyone, >> >> Just wanted to wish everyone a Merry Christmas. I hope today brings a >> little joy to everyone. 2008 was a rocky year for most, with the global >> economic meltdown. I hope 2009 will be better. >> >> I have been MIA from much of meteorite collecting and the list in 2008, >> though I have developed an interest in primarily Lunar and Martian >> meteorites, particularly the idea of source crater pairing. >> >> Anyway, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to come! >> >> -Walter Branch >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From pshugar at clearwire.net Thu Dec 25 19:49:48 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 18:49:48 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] testing Message-ID: <001f01c966f3$dc3cfbc0$d0e11960@laptop> trying this to see if it works!!!!!!!!!!!!! From pshugar at clearwire.net Thu Dec 25 19:53:06 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 18:53:06 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] try this Message-ID: <002b01c966f4$524d49a0$d0e11960@laptop> test ingore From John at Cabassi.net Thu Dec 25 19:55:40 2008 From: John at Cabassi.net (John.L.Cabassi) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 16:55:40 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] UK & "Boxing Day" Merry Christmas References: Message-ID: <00bc01c966f4$ae406940$4564fea9@TITAN> G'Day Michael Google is your friend ;-) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxing_Day Cheers Johnno ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael L Blood" To: ; "Meteorite List" ; "Walter Branch" Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 4:49 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] UK & "Boxing Day" Merry Christmas > Please, > There must be a lot of US folks who, like I, wonder just what > "Boxing Day" really is.... I mean, do you all start hitting one another, > Or what? Is it a celebration of dogs with pointy ears? Is it a day y'all > Hold a lot of boxing matches? what? > Michael > > on 12/25/08 4:24 PM, ensoramanda at ntlworld.com at ensoramanda at ntlworld.com > wrote: > >> Hi Walter and all, >> >> A merry Christmas from the UK...Boxing day here now...just. >> >> Walter..I found your mention of pairing Lunar and Matian meteorites with >> craters interesting. Just wondered how many and which had been paired >> already >> and how? >> >> Graham Ensor, Nr Barwell... >> >> ---- Walter Branch wrote: >>> Hello Everyone, >>> >>> Just wanted to wish everyone a Merry Christmas. I hope today brings a >>> little joy to everyone. 2008 was a rocky year for most, with the global >>> economic meltdown. I hope 2009 will be better. >>> >>> I have been MIA from much of meteorite collecting and the list in 2008, >>> though I have developed an interest in primarily Lunar and Martian >>> meteorites, particularly the idea of source crater pairing. >>> >>> Anyway, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to come! >>> >>> -Walter Branch >>> >>> ______________________________________________ >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mlblood at cox.net Thu Dec 25 20:16:24 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 17:16:24 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] UK & "Boxing Day" Merry Christmas In-Reply-To: <00bc01c966f4$ae406940$4564fea9@TITAN> Message-ID: Maybe so, But not as much fun as yammering with meteorite buddies! Michael on 12/25/08 4:55 PM, John.L.Cabassi at John at Cabassi.net wrote: > G'Day Michael > Google is your friend ;-) > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxing_Day > > Cheers > Johnno > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael L Blood" > To: ; "Meteorite List" > ; "Walter Branch" > > Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 4:49 PM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] UK & "Boxing Day" Merry Christmas > > >> Please, >> There must be a lot of US folks who, like I, wonder just what >> "Boxing Day" really is.... I mean, do you all start hitting one another, >> Or what? Is it a celebration of dogs with pointy ears? Is it a day y'all >> Hold a lot of boxing matches? what? >> Michael >> >> on 12/25/08 4:24 PM, ensoramanda at ntlworld.com at ensoramanda at ntlworld.com >> wrote: >> >>> Hi Walter and all, >>> >>> A merry Christmas from the UK...Boxing day here now...just. >>> >>> Walter..I found your mention of pairing Lunar and Matian meteorites with >>> craters interesting. Just wondered how many and which had been paired >>> already >>> and how? >>> >>> Graham Ensor, Nr Barwell... >>> >>> ---- Walter Branch wrote: >>>> Hello Everyone, >>>> >>>> Just wanted to wish everyone a Merry Christmas. I hope today brings a >>>> little joy to everyone. 2008 was a rocky year for most, with the global >>>> economic meltdown. I hope 2009 will be better. >>>> >>>> I have been MIA from much of meteorite collecting and the list in 2008, >>>> though I have developed an interest in primarily Lunar and Martian >>>> meteorites, particularly the idea of source crater pairing. >>>> >>>> Anyway, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to come! >>>> >>>> -Walter Branch >>>> >>>> ______________________________________________ >>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>> >>> ______________________________________________ >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >>> Meteorite-list mailing list >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From ensoramanda at ntlworld.com Thu Dec 25 20:17:03 2008 From: ensoramanda at ntlworld.com (ensoramanda at ntlworld.com) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 1:17:03 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] UK & "Boxing Day" Merry Christmas In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20081226011703.ZT6ZI.138886.root@web02-winn.ispmail.private.ntl.com> Hi Michael and All, Never really considered it to be just a UK thing...but anyway...nowadays with us it seems to be an excuse to have yet another Christmas get together and meal at another family members house...well thats what has happened with our family for many years....but the name comes from a very old tradition of boxing up presents to give away to those less fortunate on that day...a lost tradition it seems. Happy new year and best regards Graham ---- Michael L Blood wrote: > Please, > There must be a lot of US folks who, like I, wonder just what > "Boxing Day" really is.... I mean, do you all start hitting one another, > Or what? Is it a celebration of dogs with pointy ears? Is it a day y'all > Hold a lot of boxing matches? what? > Michael > > on 12/25/08 4:24 PM, ensoramanda at ntlworld.com at ensoramanda at ntlworld.com > wrote: > > > Hi Walter and all, > > > > A merry Christmas from the UK...Boxing day here now...just. > > > > Walter..I found your mention of pairing Lunar and Matian meteorites with > > craters interesting. Just wondered how many and which had been paired already > > and how? > > > > Graham Ensor, Nr Barwell... > > > > ---- Walter Branch wrote: > >> Hello Everyone, > >> > >> Just wanted to wish everyone a Merry Christmas. I hope today brings a > >> little joy to everyone. 2008 was a rocky year for most, with the global > >> economic meltdown. I hope 2009 will be better. > >> > >> I have been MIA from much of meteorite collecting and the list in 2008, > >> though I have developed an interest in primarily Lunar and Martian > >> meteorites, particularly the idea of source crater pairing. > >> > >> Anyway, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to come! > >> > >> -Walter Branch > >> > >> ______________________________________________ > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > > > > From ensoramanda at ntlworld.com Thu Dec 25 20:20:39 2008 From: ensoramanda at ntlworld.com (ensoramanda at ntlworld.com) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 1:20:39 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] UK & "Boxing Day" Merry Christmas Message-ID: <20081226012039.676NW.138891.root@web02-winn.ispmail.private.ntl.com> Hi Michael and All, Never really considered it to be just a UK thing...but anyway...nowadays with us it seems to be an excuse to have yet another Christmas get together and meal at another family members house...well thats what has happened with our family for many years....but the name comes from a very old tradition of boxing up presents to give away to those less fortunate on that day...a lost tradition it seems. Happy new year and best regards Graham ---- Michael L Blood wrote: > Please, > There must be a lot of US folks who, like I, wonder just what > "Boxing Day" really is.... I mean, do you all start hitting one another, > Or what? Is it a celebration of dogs with pointy ears? Is it a day y'all > Hold a lot of boxing matches? what? > Michael > > on 12/25/08 4:24 PM, ensoramanda at ntlworld.com at ensoramanda at ntlworld.com > wrote: > > > Hi Walter and all, > > > > A merry Christmas from the UK...Boxing day here now...just. > > > > Walter..I found your mention of pairing Lunar and Matian meteorites with > > craters interesting. Just wondered how many and which had been paired already > > and how? > > > > Graham Ensor, Nr Barwell... > > > > ---- Walter Branch wrote: > >> Hello Everyone, > >> > >> Just wanted to wish everyone a Merry Christmas. I hope today brings a > >> little joy to everyone. 2008 was a rocky year for most, with the global > >> economic meltdown. I hope 2009 will be better. > >> > >> I have been MIA from much of meteorite collecting and the list in 2008, > >> though I have developed an interest in primarily Lunar and Martian > >> meteorites, particularly the idea of source crater pairing. > >> > >> Anyway, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to come! > >> > >> -Walter Branch > >> > >> ______________________________________________ > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > > > > From Metorman46 at aol.com Thu Dec 25 20:25:55 2008 From: Metorman46 at aol.com (Metorman46 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 20:25:55 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Name!! Message-ID: When I started out, a wise man told me, "I can only say two things about this hobby: it'll become an obsession, and your wife will never understand." :) This is one, i second,never spoken so true.The nail has been hit on the head. Herman Archer IMCA 2770 **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From drtanuki at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 22:05:24 2008 From: drtanuki at yahoo.com (drtanuki) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 19:05:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Molina de Segura, Spain meteorite fall Christmas Eve 1858 Message-ID: <7758.3189.qm@web53202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Dear List Members, An interesting article about the Molina de Segura fall in Spain on Christmas Eve 1858. Spain?s Biggest Meteorite Strike Remembered 150 Years On ScienceDaily (Dec. 24, 2008) ? Early on Christmas Eve, 1858 ?people who in the streets, on pathways and in the fields saw a magnificent ball of fire appear, which shone with a brilliant, blinding light and all the colours of the rainbow, obscured the light of the moon and descended majestically from the sky?. For the whole story go to the link: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/12/081224094630.htm Best Regards, Dirk Ross...Tokyo h From pshugar at clearwire.net Thu Dec 25 23:20:38 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 22:20:38 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] seeing if I can send email Message-ID: <002b01c96711$56ee69e0$d0e11960@laptop> I just can't figure out what went wrong. Pete From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 23:36:20 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 20:36:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] seeing if I can send email In-Reply-To: <002b01c96711$56ee69e0$d0e11960@laptop> Message-ID: <709100.44589.qm@web110610.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Um, considering the 20 emails I have from you, it seems to be working fine. Mike --- On Thu, 12/25/08, Pete Shugar wrote: > From: Pete Shugar > Subject: [meteorite-list] seeing if I can send email > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Thursday, December 25, 2008, 9:20 PM > I just can't figure out what went wrong. > Pete > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From psc2410xi at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 23:39:08 2008 From: psc2410xi at yahoo.com (Don Rawlings) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 20:39:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] seeing if I can send email Message-ID: <91307.15149.qm@web59316.mail.re1.yahoo.com> All these tests are worse than the spam I get from nigerian scammers. Don Rawlings --- On Thu, 12/25/08, Pete Shugar wrote: From: Pete Shugar Subject: [meteorite-list] seeing if I can send email To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Date: Thursday, December 25, 2008, 11:20 PM I just can't figure out what went wrong. Pete ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From psc2410xi at yahoo.com Thu Dec 25 23:42:15 2008 From: psc2410xi at yahoo.com (Don Rawlings) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 20:42:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Most important person in modern meteorites Message-ID: <377839.62906.qm@web59303.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Steve Arnold of Chicago. Always thinking of his fellow collectors and friends and not obsessed with self-promotion like some other people involved in this hobby. Don Rawlings --- On Thu, 12/25/08, Harry wrote: From: Harry Subject: [meteorite-list] Most important person in modern meteorites To: "meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com" Date: Thursday, December 25, 2008, 7:30 PM There are many names out there, but who in your mind is the most important name in meteorites ? ? ? ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From pshugar at clearwire.net Thu Dec 25 23:58:39 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 22:58:39 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] So many tests Message-ID: <004c01c96716$9f0d9a20$d0e11960@laptop> I humbly appologize for the many posts. I used to get a copy everytime I sent one, but since Clearewire has changed it's server to yahoo's Gmail, I no longer get a copy of the sent email. As a result, I did not think that I was sending to the list. What was messing with my last two remaining active brain cells was the fact that I could send to members and get replies. Again, please forgive me. Pete From mstreman53 at yahoo.com Fri Dec 26 02:47:31 2008 From: mstreman53 at yahoo.com (Mr EMan) Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 23:47:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records References: Message-ID: <127207.70104.qm@web55201.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Hello Folks-- Season's greetings. I just wanted to share some thoughts on forming new meteorite interest groups--past empire building in the meteorite world in general and why some succeeded and some failed. Please, no one take this as an attack, trolling,disparagement, discouragement, or a "dissing" of anyone. It is not directed at any one, although it may have been bumped to the forefront by Mike's recent thread. An honest idea was proposed and I am not per se addressing his proposal in any way so please keep an open mind. On this list we are as close as can be to inclusive(99%) in having a collection of members within the existing meteorite interest niches. As a long time member with observations regarding "empire building" as an alternative to the Meteorite Central list, The Meteorite Times web space, IMCA, etc. there have been a plenty. I could list a long string of people who wanted to make a big splash campaigning to improve/perfect the culture they did not remotely understand. In spite of -- or because of--self caused blunders, there were many patient old timers willing to advise them on how to get oriented to the list rather than making the list fit around them. They tried to help them get up to speed and direction with the technical side, the meteorite market, and the meteorite culture often being rebuffed, accused of trying to squash competition, or rejected as not knowing what they were talking about. What was hard for some novices to accept was that their own mindset was the reason they were unable to make inroads into the community as a true mover/shaker. There were many more that took the help and are strong respected contributors today. Not wanting to get in their way, the long-time members stepped aside, letting them fall into craters of their own making--some many times over. Many, many, times we have seen Internet/ web page savvy folks offer to provide "alternatives " to the meteorite forum communities. For the majority of those past forums, I'd have to look hard to see if they were still around. Some were more noble than others. There were some who spend a lot of effort making dust clouds promoting a solution looking for a problem. When the dust settled they sat wondering what went wrong and why their enterprise/forum/ efforts failed to hold attention. Just in passing, there are several meteorite interest groups/ mailing lists: some active but with only duplicate postings, some are inactive/abandoned with only newbie postings who never bothered to look at the membership numbers or posting activity, some private technical lists which are by invitation only, and of course-- the dealer's own list where ads go directly to the member. For reasons beyond the scope of this babbling of mine, 99% of all the inhabitable niches for this hobby have been taken and are being served well by the host. There is a saturation point and economy-of-scale even in this field of interest. In the words of a frequent poster "it is a free county" so anyone coould feel free to start up all the groups or forums they wish--the Internet is a very large place. Those that offer a truly unique and desirable service will last and those that are offering another way to slice up the limited pie won't-- and will end up on the ash pile of Internet redundancy entirely on their own. Those that did succeed, did so by offering real value and in an unselfish manner within many many manhours and personal expense to do so. What I found is that people who take shortcuts don't succeed: those who rely too much on assumptions, those that don't take a thoughtful look at the true market for their service, those that overestimate their expertise and time committment, those that don't attempt a basic understanding of the meteorite science to understand the commodity. Basically those who arrive thinking their personal marketing talents will overcome technical, knowledge, and cultural issues-- don't last over the long haul. Perhaps potential members are jaded by all the flash-in-the night sky "dealers" so they come to accept those proven members only after a long time of watching how they behave. I don't know of any shortcut to this period of watching and slowly winning people over. This community isn't a automobile dealership, it isn't a church, it isn't the Elks, it isn't a group of folks with a lot of mandated loyalty--it is a field where you are known by your reputation--reputation means everything to the majority of people. You can't forge (as in fake ) those credentials ; you have to forge them (as in earn them) by hard work over time. That seems to be the final obstacle to work through by those offering an alternative folks are willing sign up for. I've probably been ignored, filtered, and moderated over the years more than 99% of the folks here so I I feel like I know much of the list from both sides. I do wish any and everyone who is willing to go it for the long haul the best of success. If you promote it for the love of meteorites instead the love of self then you'll have a better shot at long term success. Elton From paul at meteorite.com Fri Dec 26 05:06:22 2008 From: paul at meteorite.com (Paul Harris) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 02:06:22 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ruben's Holbrook Outing Message-ID: <4954AC9E.4050805@meteorite.com> Dear List, I'm posting this for Ruben Ruben's Holbrook Outing Hi All, Thanks to all who inquired about (and planned on attending) the Holbrook outing this weekend Dec 27-28. I'm sorry to say that it will have to be canceled till a later and warmer date. The weather is just too bad!!! There will be better days ahead and it makes sense to postpone till then...... Thanks, Ruben Garcia Phoenix, Arizona From Metorman46 at aol.com Fri Dec 26 09:03:38 2008 From: Metorman46 at aol.com (Metorman46 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 09:03:38 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records Message-ID: Hello Elton; That is a great description of this matter,I think.You have covered all the bases for giving sound advice to individuals wanting to branch out to another meteorite list.I especially like your description of "reputation in the meteorite field of endeavor".Thanks for posting such a positive and informative post on this matter. Have a happy new year and all the best in the new year. Herman Archer IMCA 2770 **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From geohiggins at yahoo.com Fri Dec 26 10:07:52 2008 From: geohiggins at yahoo.com (John higgins) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 07:07:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records References: <127207.70104.qm@web55201.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <547373.5673.qm@web63208.mail.re1.yahoo.com> ?Hi Elton, this post is not in any way intended to be? a attack, trolling, disparagement, of you or anyone else who feels the same way. And the meteorite working group, would perfer this conversation be OFF-LIST. We don't want this to be a meteorite list issue! Instead of discouraging other people, which you have obvisouly acclompished with flying colors. Come and join in our discussion. Get to know the people you are calling untalented auto salesman, and see if when you are done you still think of us as selfish, greedy self centered folks, who only have their own self intrest at heart. A dicussion is all it is at this point. If the idea gets far, and you still disagree. Then bash it all you want. Our group already stated that we want a private dicussion, you are trying to bash us in a public forum, not very nice. Maybe somebody can make comments on your moral judgement and nature for doing so, but that is not in our nature, so we cannot comment on that. I have already responded to your post in Mike's yahoo chat group. Anybody who is intrested, should go there and comment. You can find my post as well as others at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/meteoriteworkinggroup/ Have a Great Day! John Higgins ----- Original Message ---- From: Mr EMan To: valparint at aol.com; meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 2:47:31 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records Hello Folks--? Season's greetings. I just wanted to share some thoughts on? forming new meteorite interest groups--past empire building in the meteorite world in general and why some succeeded and some failed. Please, no one take this as an attack, trolling,disparagement, discouragement, or a "dissing" of anyone.? It is not directed at any one, although it may have been bumped to the forefront by Mike's recent thread. An honest idea was proposed and I am not per se addressing his proposal in any way so please keep an open mind.? On this list we are as close as can be to inclusive(99%) in having a collection of members within the existing meteorite interest niches.? As a long time member? with observations regarding "empire building" as an alternative to the Meteorite Central list, The Meteorite Times web space, IMCA, etc.? there have been a plenty.? I could list a long string of people who wanted to make a big splash campaigning to improve/perfect the culture they did not remotely understand. In spite of -- or because of--self caused blunders, there were many patient old timers willing to? advise them on how to get oriented to the list rather than making the list fit around them.? They tried to help them get up to speed and direction with the technical side, the meteorite market, and the meteorite culture often being rebuffed, accused of trying to squash competition, or rejected as not knowing what they were talking about.? What was hard for some? novices to accept was that their own mindset was the reason they were unable to make inroads into the community as a true mover/shaker.? There were many more that took the help and are strong respected contributors today. Not wanting to get in their way, the long-time members stepped aside, letting them fall into craters of their own making--some many times over.? Many, many, times we have seen Internet/ web page savvy folks offer to provide? "alternatives " to the meteorite forum communities.? For the majority of those past forums, I'd have to look hard to see if they were still around.? Some were more noble than others.? There were some who spend a lot of effort making dust clouds promoting a solution looking for a problem.? When the dust settled they sat wondering what went wrong and why their enterprise/forum/ efforts failed to hold attention.? Just in passing, there are several meteorite interest groups/ mailing lists: some active but with only duplicate postings, some are inactive/abandoned with only newbie postings who never bothered to look at the membership numbers or posting activity,? some private technical lists which are by invitation only, and of course-- the dealer's own list where ads go directly to the member.? For reasons beyond the scope of this babbling of mine, 99% of all the inhabitable niches for this hobby have been taken and are being served well by the host. There is a saturation point and economy-of-scale even in this field of interest.? In the words of a frequent poster "it is a free county" so anyone coould feel free to start up all the groups or forums they wish--the Internet is a very large place.? Those that offer a truly unique and desirable service will last and those that are offering another way to slice up the limited pie won't--? and will end up on the ash pile of Internet redundancy entirely on their own. Those that did succeed, did so by offering real value and in an unselfish manner within many many manhours and personal expense to do so. What I found is that people who take shortcuts don't succeed: those who rely too much on assumptions, those that don't take a thoughtful look at the true market for their service, those that overestimate their expertise and time committment, those that don't attempt a basic understanding of the meteorite science to understand the commodity.? Basically those who arrive thinking their personal marketing talents will overcome technical, knowledge, and cultural issues-- don't last over the long haul.? Perhaps potential members are jaded by all the flash-in-the night sky "dealers" so they come to accept those proven members only after a long time of watching how they behave.? I don't know of any shortcut to this period of watching and slowly winning people over. This community isn't a automobile dealership, it isn't a church, it isn't the Elks, it isn't a group of folks with a lot of mandated loyalty--it is a field where you are known by your reputation--reputation means everything to the majority of people.? You can't forge (as in fake ) those credentials ; you have to forge them (as in earn them) by hard work over time.? That seems to be the final obstacle to work through by those offering an alternative folks are willing sign up for.? I've probably been ignored, filtered, and moderated over the years more than 99% of the folks here so I I feel like I know much of the list from both sides.? I do wish any and everyone who is willing to go it for the long haul the best of success. If you promote it for the love of meteorites instead the love of self then you'll have a better shot at long term success. Elton ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From bobl at peaktopeak.com Fri Dec 26 11:14:27 2008 From: bobl at peaktopeak.com (Bob Loeffler) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 09:14:27 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Need a meteorite picture repository (was Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records) In-Reply-To: <547373.5673.qm@web63208.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20081226161427.CC73D1053D@mailwash5.pair.com> Hi all, I'm not posting this to MikeG's chat group discussion because my idea is not the focus of that discussion. I see only one thing missing from this Meteorite list: A picture repository for list members who don't have websites. We can have all of the meteorite-related discussions that we so desire on this list, but if a member wants to show us pictures of his meteorites, he/she has to use a service like Flickr if he/she doesn't have his/her own website. Flickr and some of the others are nice for general use, but then we have pictures strewn about all over the web and it's impossible to search for them. Not easy for new members (or old members) to view them. What I would like to see is a meteor/meteorite picture storage site that is easy to navigate and easy for people to post their pictures to. It would need to be moderated (e.g. someone posts a picture and caption, then the moderator would need to OK it before it is viewable by everyone) and you would need to be a "member" of the website (free, of course, but donations would be good) to be able to post (so it would cut down on "spammer posts"). The moderator would then prevent the few spammer posts to be uploaded. Each member would get his/her own folder (or album) to post pictures into. And maybe they could create more folders within their main folder. It would need to be searchable (e.g. I want to see all Sikhote Alin meteorites). Anyone could become a member, even dealers who already have a website, because they might want to share their personal collection with everyone else without putting it on their dealer website. There would be no advertising on this, but you could add your website URL to the caption of a picture if you want people to be able to easily find your website. There would be NO discussion on the website since we already have a place for that. :-) Just pictures and their captions. It should be able to have it's own website domain name (e.g. www.met-list-meteorites.com). I volunteer to pay the yearly domain name fee if others would share the monthly web hosting fee (I could help with that, too) and the daily work. I am too stretched on other volunteer work, so I can't do much of the daily moderation (which of course could be done every couple of days instead of daily). Is there any website system out there that can do this already? Or is there anyone who could make one? Thanks and Happy Holidays! Regards, Bob Loeffler COMETS http://www.peaktopeak.com/comets/ -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of John higgins Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 8:08 AM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records ?Hi Elton, this post is not in any way intended to be? a attack, trolling, disparagement, of you or anyone else who feels the same way. And the meteorite working group, would perfer this conversation be OFF-LIST. We don't want this to be a meteorite list issue! Instead of discouraging other people, which you have obvisouly acclompished with flying colors. Come and join in our discussion. Get to know the people you are calling untalented auto salesman, and see if when you are done you still think of us as selfish, greedy self centered folks, who only have their own self intrest at heart. A dicussion is all it is at this point. If the idea gets far, and you still disagree. Then bash it all you want. Our group already stated that we want a private dicussion, you are trying to bash us in a public forum, not very nice. Maybe somebody can make comments on your moral judgement and nature for doing so, but that is not in our nature, so we cannot comment on that. I have already responded to your post in Mike's yahoo chat group. Anybody who is intrested, should go there and comment. You can find my post as well as others at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/meteoriteworkinggroup/ Have a Great Day! John Higgins ----- Original Message ---- From: Mr EMan To: valparint at aol.com; meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 2:47:31 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records Hello Folks--? Season's greetings. I just wanted to share some thoughts on? forming new meteorite interest groups--past empire building in the meteorite world in general and why some succeeded and some failed. Please, no one take this as an attack, trolling,disparagement, discouragement, or a "dissing" of anyone.? It is not directed at any one, although it may have been bumped to the forefront by Mike's recent thread. An honest idea was proposed and I am not per se addressing his proposal in any way so please keep an open mind.? On this list we are as close as can be to inclusive(99%) in having a collection of members within the existing meteorite interest niches.? As a long time member? with observations regarding "empire building" as an alternative to the Meteorite Central list, The Meteorite Times web space, IMCA, etc.? there have been a plenty.? I could list a long string of people who wanted to make a big splash campaigning to improve/perfect the culture they did not remotely understand. In spite of -- or because of--self caused blunders, there were many patient old timers willing to? advise them on how to get oriented to the list rather than making the list fit around them.? They tried to help them get up to speed and direction with the technical side, the meteorite market, and the meteorite culture often being rebuffed, accused of trying to squash competition, or rejected as not knowing what they were talking about.? What was hard for some? novices to accept was that their own mindset was the reason they were unable to make inroads into the community as a true mover/shaker.? There were many more that took the help and are strong respected contributors today. Not wanting to get in their way, the long-time members stepped aside, letting them fall into craters of their own making--some many times over.? Many, many, times we have seen Internet/ web page savvy folks offer to provide? "alternatives " to the meteorite forum communities.? For the majority of those past forums, I'd have to look hard to see if they were still around.? Some were more noble than others.? There were some who spend a lot of effort making dust clouds promoting a solution looking for a problem.? When the dust settled they sat wondering what went wrong and why their enterprise/forum/ efforts failed to hold attention.? Just in passing, there are several meteorite interest groups/ mailing lists: some active but with only duplicate postings, some are inactive/abandoned with only newbie postings who never bothered to look at the membership numbers or posting activity,? some private technical lists which are by invitation only, and of course-- the dealer's own list where ads go directly to the member.? For reasons beyond the scope of this babbling of mine, 99% of all the inhabitable niches for this hobby have been taken and are being served well by the host. There is a saturation point and economy-of-scale even in this field of interest.? In the words of a frequent poster "it is a free county" so anyone coould feel free to start up all the groups or forums they wish--the Internet is a very large place.? Those that offer a truly unique and desirable service will last and those that are offering another way to slice up the limited pie won't--? and will end up on the ash pile of Internet redundancy entirely on their own. Those that did succeed, did so by offering real value and in an unselfish manner within many many manhours and personal expense to do so. What I found is that people who take shortcuts don't succeed: those who rely too much on assumptions, those that don't take a thoughtful look at the true market for their service, those that overestimate their expertise and time committment, those that don't attempt a basic understanding of the meteorite science to understand the commodity.? Basically those who arrive thinking their personal marketing talents will overcome technical, knowledge, and cultural issues-- don't last over the long haul.? Perhaps potential members are jaded by all the flash-in-the night sky "dealers" so they come to accept those proven members only after a long time of watching how they behave.? I don't know of any shortcut to this period of watching and slowly winning people over. This community isn't a automobile dealership, it isn't a church, it isn't the Elks, it isn't a group of folks with a lot of mandated loyalty--it is a field where you are known by your reputation--reputation means everything to the majority of people.? You can't forge (as in fake ) those credentials ; you have to forge them (as in earn them) by hard work over time.? That seems to be the final obstacle to work through by those offering an alternative folks are willing sign up for.? I've probably been ignored, filtered, and moderated over the years more than 99% of the folks here so I I feel like I know much of the list from both sides.? I do wish any and everyone who is willing to go it for the long haul the best of success. If you promote it for the love of meteorites instead the love of self then you'll have a better shot at long term success. Elton From cynapse at charter.net Fri Dec 26 11:17:18 2008 From: cynapse at charter.net (Darren Garrison) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 11:17:18 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Possibly meteorite related sale In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Got an after-Christmas sales ad from Buy.com. One of the items listed is black diamonds: http://www.buy.com/prod/3-00-ctw-black-diamond-solitaire-pendant-stud-earrings-set-in-white/q/loc/64934/210453208.html Which, I remember, are suggested to have a possible asteroidal origin: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/01/070122-black-diamonds.html From bobadebt at ec.rr.com Fri Dec 26 11:18:21 2008 From: bobadebt at ec.rr.com (David & Kitt Deyarmin) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 11:18:21 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Spend your Christmas Money Here :) CHEAP ZAG Message-ID: <98539354C9194AE08866BBA4D58BE382@David> I'm going to offer any Zag Slice on my web site to this list at $2 per gram over the week end I only have 2 large slices left and a nice variety of smaller slices. I have a new web address so if you want to browse my selection click this: http://home.roadrunner.com/~bobadebt/Subpages/FS%20Zag.htm If you are interested in anything listed please contact me off list at bobadebt at ec.rr.com Thanks From meteoriteshow at free.fr Fri Dec 26 12:47:16 2008 From: meteoriteshow at free.fr (meteoriteshow at free.fr) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 18:47:16 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - ebay Auctions ending on Saturday Message-ID: <1230313636.495518a43e6c6@imp.free.fr> Dear Meteorite Officionados, I WISH YOU ALL A MERRY CHRISTMAS, HOPING THAT YOU HAD A GREAT EVENING LAST NIGHT. Tomorrow our current auctions will end and you can see the meteorites that are offered at: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZmeteoriteshow Here are the highlights: 1- DAG 591 H/L6 - 72.8g MAIN MASS!!!!: THE unique Main Mass together with the bag in which Michel Franco packed it when he found it in Dar Al Gani 1998. A MUST!!! http://cgi.ebay.com/METEORITE-DAG-591-H-L6-72-8g-MAIN-MASS_W0QQitemZ330293494467QQihZ014QQcategoryZ3239QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem 2- HaH299 H6 - 18.1g partslice: This slice is almost a complete one and still at a very low price ; a good deal to be made! http://cgi.ebay.com/METEORITE-HaH299-H6-18-1g-partslice_W0QQitemZ330293494502QQihZ014QQcategoryZ3239QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem 3- NWA 859 (Taza) IRON UNGR. - 36.5g oriented: This oriented individual is simply gorgeous... http://cgi.ebay.com/METEORITE-NWA-859-Taza-IRON-UNGR-36-5g-oriented_W0QQitemZ330293494549QQihZ014QQcategoryZ3239QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem 4- NWA XXX - 0.6g Partslice - HOWARDITE: A partslice of this fresh and nice howardite, still at the starting price of $1.00 http://cgi.ebay.com/METEORITE-NWA-XXX-0-6g-Partslice-HOWARDITE_W0QQitemZ330293494567QQihZ014QQcategoryZ3239QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem 5- NWA XXX - 6.7g Partslice - HOWARDITE: This one is a FULL slice, with fusion crust all around. http://cgi.ebay.com/METEORITE-NWA-XXX-6-7g-Partslice-HOWARDITE_W0QQitemZ330293494632QQihZ014QQcategoryZ3239QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem 6- SAH 02501 EUC - 8.79g partslice: here is an opportunity to get a nice partslice of this rare eucrite... Do not miss it! http://cgi.ebay.com/METEORITE-SAH-02501-EUC-8-79g-partslice_W0QQitemZ330293494656QQihZ014QQcategoryZ3239QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem 7- SET OF 7 NWA OCs - FUSION CRUST - 41.0g: Still at the starting price of $1.00, this set of 7 complete individuals, ALL OF THEM FUSION CRUSTED and 3 OF THEM ORIENTED!!!!!!!! They are waiting for youuuuuuuuuuuu! http://cgi.ebay.com/METEORITE-SET-OF-7-NWA-OCs-FUSION-CRUST-41-0g_W0QQitemZ330293494708QQihZ014QQcategoryZ3239QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem 8- TATAHOUINE DIO - 1.5g - WITNESSED FALL!: Also at the starting price of $1.00, thes 3 fragments of Tatahouine are looking for a new home! http://cgi.ebay.com/METEORITE-TATAHOUINE-DIO-1-5g-WITNESSED-FALL_W0QQitemZ330293494719QQihZ014QQcategoryZ3239QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Thanks for looking and good luck!!! Kind regards Frederic Beroud www.meteoriteshow.com IMCA #2491 From freequarks at gmail.com Fri Dec 26 12:50:22 2008 From: freequarks at gmail.com (Dark Matter) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 10:50:22 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Molina de Segura, Spain meteorite fall Christmas Eve 1858 In-Reply-To: <7758.3189.qm@web53202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <7758.3189.qm@web53202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <822da19a0812260950s5f53596i58ce83c0f6911f1b@mail.gmail.com> Hi Dirk, Thanks for the link. Molina is near and dear to my heart. Here is an article I wrote about my collection piece of Molina, and it prior ownership including that of the collection of the famous Dr. Urey. http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2004/October/Accretion_Desk.htm Best, Martin On Thu, Dec 25, 2008 at 8:05 PM, drtanuki wrote: > Dear List Members, > > An interesting article about the Molina de Segura fall in Spain on Christmas Eve 1858. > > Spain's Biggest Meteorite Strike Remembered 150 Years On > ScienceDaily (Dec. 24, 2008) ? Early on Christmas Eve, 1858 "people who in the streets, on pathways and in the fields saw a magnificent ball of fire appear, which shone with a brilliant, blinding light and all the colours of the rainbow, obscured the light of the moon and descended majestically from the sky". > For the whole story go to the link: > > http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/12/081224094630.htm > > Best Regards, Dirk Ross...Tokyo > h > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From mstreman53 at yahoo.com Fri Dec 26 12:49:26 2008 From: mstreman53 at yahoo.com (Mr EMan) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 09:49:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Possibly meteorite related sale References: Message-ID: <999829.21160.qm@web55207.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Hello Darren these are not the carbonados(sp) --the comet related diamonds of extra hardness. Carbonados can't even be cut as they are stronger than terrestrial diamond dust which is used to cut diamonds. When used in drill bits they are fused as found into the metal. Elton ----- Original Message ---- > From: Darren Garrison > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 11:17:18 AM > Subject: [meteorite-list] Possibly meteorite related sale > > Got an after-Christmas sales ad from Buy.com. One of the items listed is black > diamonds: > > http://www.buy.com/prod/3-00-ctw-black-diamond-solitaire-pendant-stud-earrings-set-in-white/q/loc/64934/210453208.html > > Which, I remember, are suggested to have a possible asteroidal origin: > > http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/01/070122-black-diamonds.html > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Fri Dec 26 13:29:59 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 10:29:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Re : Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <66263.60042.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi Elton, You said : "In the words of a frequent poster "it is a free > county" so anyone coould feel free to start up all the > groups or forums they wish--the Internet is a very large > place. Those that offer a truly unique and desirable > service will last and those that are offering another way to > slice up the limited pie won't-- and will end up on the > ash pile > of Internet redundancy entirely on their own. Those that > did succeed, did so by offering real value and in an > unselfish manner within many many manhours and personal > expense to do so. > " I agree with this statement 100%. And I do not want this idea to become another noble but doomed meteorite endeavor. That's why at this point it's only an idea being discussed - we are trying to sort out what exactly is missing from the extant meteorite groups, and what the defunct groups did wrong. We want to avoid competition and redundancy. So it's entirely possible that nothing will come from this discussion - it might just be a brainstorming session. It is my hope that something positive and useful will come from this. If not, then I see no harm in having explored the possibilities. Elton, feel free to join Yahoo list and share your insights there. All points of view are welcome - especially those with veteran experience in the area. Best regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 16 > Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 23:47:31 -0800 (PST) > From: Mr EMan > Subject: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group > Track Records > To: valparint at aol.com, meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Message-ID: > <127207.70104.qm at web55201.mail.re4.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Hello Folks-- Season's greetings. I just wanted to > share some thoughts on forming new meteorite interest > groups--past empire building in the meteorite world in > general and why some succeeded and some failed. Please, no > one take this as an attack, trolling,disparagement, > discouragement, or a "dissing" of anyone. It is > not directed at any one, although it may have been bumped to > the forefront by Mike's recent thread. An honest idea > was proposed and I am not per se addressing his proposal in > any way so please keep an open mind. On this list we are > as close as can be to inclusive(99%) in having a collection > of members within the existing meteorite interest niches. > As a long time member with observations regarding > "empire building" as an alternative to the > Meteorite Central list, The Meteorite Times web space, IMCA, > etc. there have been a plenty. I could list a long string > of people who wanted to make a big splash campaigning to > improve/perfect the > culture they did not remotely understand. In spite of -- > or because of--self caused blunders, there were many patient > old timers willing to advise them on how to get oriented to > the list rather than making the list fit around them. They > tried to help them get up to speed and direction with the > technical side, the meteorite market, and the meteorite > culture often being rebuffed, accused of trying to squash > competition, or rejected as not knowing what they were > talking about. What was hard for some novices to accept > was that their own mindset was the reason they were unable > to make inroads into the community as a true mover/shaker. > There were many more that took the help and are strong > respected contributors today. > > Not wanting to get in their way, the long-time members > stepped aside, letting them fall into craters of their own > making--some many times over. Many, many, times we have > seen Internet/ web page savvy folks offer to provide > "alternatives > " to the meteorite forum communities. For the > majority of those past forums, I'd have to look hard to > see if they were still around. Some were more noble than > others. There were some who spend a lot of effort making > dust clouds promoting a solution looking for a problem. > When the dust settled they sat wondering what went wrong and > why their enterprise/forum/ efforts failed to hold > attention. > > Just in passing, there are several meteorite interest > groups/ mailing lists: some active but with only duplicate > postings, some are inactive/abandoned with only newbie > postings who never bothered to look at the membership > numbers or posting activity, some private technical lists > which are by invitation only, and of course-- the > dealer's own list where ads go directly to the member. > For reasons beyond the scope of this babbling of mine, 99% > of all the inhabitable niches for this hobby have been taken > and are being served well by the host. There is a saturation > point and economy-of-scale even in this field of interest. > In the words of a frequent poster "it is a free > county" so anyone coould feel free to start up all the > groups or forums they wish--the Internet is a very large > place. Those that offer a truly unique and desirable > service will last and those that are offering another way to > slice up the limited pie won't-- and will end up on the > ash pile > of Internet redundancy entirely on their own. Those that > did succeed, did so by offering real value and in an > unselfish manner within many many manhours and personal > expense to do so. > > What I found is that people who take shortcuts don't > succeed: those who rely too much on assumptions, those that > don't take a thoughtful look at the true market for > their service, those that overestimate their expertise and > time committment, those that don't attempt a basic > understanding of the meteorite science to understand the > commodity. Basically those who arrive thinking their > personal marketing talents will overcome technical, > knowledge, and cultural issues-- don't last over the > long haul. Perhaps potential members are jaded by all the > flash-in-the night sky "dealers" so they come to > accept those proven members only after a long time of > watching how they behave. I don't know of any shortcut > to this period of watching and slowly winning people over. > > This community isn't a automobile dealership, it > isn't a church, it isn't the Elks, it isn't a > group of folks with a lot of mandated loyalty--it is a field > where you are known by your reputation--reputation means > everything to the majority of people. You can't forge > (as in fake ) those credentials ; you have to forge them (as > in earn them) by hard work over time. That seems to be the > final obstacle to work through by those offering an > alternative folks are willing sign up for. I've > probably been ignored, filtered, and moderated over the > years more than 99% of the folks here so I I feel like I > know much of the list from both sides. I do wish any and > everyone who is willing to go it for the long haul the best > of success. If you promote it for the love of meteorites > instead the love of self then you'll have a better shot > at long term success. > > Elton > > From epgrondine at yahoo.com Fri Dec 26 13:34:23 2008 From: epgrondine at yahoo.com (E.P. Grondine) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 10:34:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Definition of meteorite dealer Message-ID: <245526.10142.qm@web36906.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi all I greatly enjoyed the definition of "meteorite collector". So how does one define a meteorite dealer? How about "a meteorite collector who needs more money to add to his collection"? good hunting, and hopefully a better year ahead for all of us, E.P. Grondine Man and Impact in the Americas From mlblood at cox.net Fri Dec 26 14:23:27 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 11:23:27 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Need a meteorite picture repository (was Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records) In-Reply-To: <20081226161427.CC73D1053D@mailwash5.pair.com> Message-ID: Bob, I don't see the problem... There are many free photo sites - Upload your photo, get the URL, put the click-to URL into your Post to the list and there you are. Hundreds do it. The worst Case scenario is you have to copy/paste the URL to your browser. I like "Webshots" : http://www.webshots.com/ ....because of the Ease of use and the option to pay a little and expand your capacity, but there are dozens out there - just choose one (I will admit there is at least one list member that cannot seem To get this basic concept, talks about a photo we certainly should Be sure to see - and leaves the URL out of his posts.... Concluding with ..."Enjoy!" - enjoy WHAT?) Other than that, how easy can it get, Bob? These sites are Out there - pick one, use it, post to the list. Best wishes, Michael on 12/26/08 8:14 AM, Bob Loeffler at bobl at peaktopeak.com wrote: > Hi all, > > I'm not posting this to MikeG's chat group discussion because my idea is not > the focus of that discussion. > > I see only one thing missing from this Meteorite list: A picture repository > for list members who don't have websites. We can have all of the > meteorite-related discussions that we so desire on this list, but if a > member wants to show us pictures of his meteorites, he/she has to use a > service like Flickr if he/she doesn't have his/her own website. Flickr and > some of the others are nice for general use, but then we have pictures > strewn about all over the web and it's impossible to search for them. Not > easy for new members (or old members) to view them. > > What I would like to see is a meteor/meteorite picture storage site that is > easy to navigate and easy for people to post their pictures to. It would > need to be moderated (e.g. someone posts a picture and caption, then the > moderator would need to OK it before it is viewable by everyone) and you > would need to be a "member" of the website (free, of course, but donations > would be good) to be able to post (so it would cut down on "spammer posts"). > The moderator would then prevent the few spammer posts to be uploaded. Each > member would get his/her own folder (or album) to post pictures into. And > maybe they could create more folders within their main folder. It would > need to be searchable (e.g. I want to see all Sikhote Alin meteorites). > > Anyone could become a member, even dealers who already have a website, > because they might want to share their personal collection with everyone > else without putting it on their dealer website. There would be no > advertising on this, but you could add your website URL to the caption of a > picture if you want people to be able to easily find your website. There > would be NO discussion on the website since we already have a place for > that. :-) Just pictures and their captions. > > It should be able to have it's own website domain name (e.g. > www.met-list-meteorites.com). I volunteer to pay the yearly domain name fee > if others would share the monthly web hosting fee (I could help with that, > too) and the daily work. I am too stretched on other volunteer work, so I > can't do much of the daily moderation (which of course could be done every > couple of days instead of daily). > > Is there any website system out there that can do this already? Or is there > anyone who could make one? > > Thanks and Happy Holidays! > > Regards, > > Bob Loeffler > COMETS > http://www.peaktopeak.com/comets/ > > > -----Original Message----- > From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of John > higgins > Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 8:08 AM > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records > > ?Hi Elton, this post is not in any way intended to be? a attack, trolling, > disparagement, of you or anyone else who feels the same way. And the > meteorite working group, would perfer this conversation be OFF-LIST. We > don't want this to be a meteorite list issue! Instead of discouraging other > people, which you have obvisouly acclompished with flying colors. Come and > join in our discussion. Get to know the people you are calling untalented > auto salesman, and see if when you are done you still think of us as > selfish, greedy self centered folks, who only have their own self intrest at > heart. A dicussion is all it is at this point. If the idea gets far, and you > still disagree. Then bash it all you want. Our group already stated that we > want a private dicussion, you are trying to bash us in a public forum, not > very nice. Maybe somebody can make comments on your moral judgement and > nature for doing so, but that is not in our nature, so we cannot comment on > that. I have already responded to your post in Mike's yahoo chat group. > Anybody who is intrested, should go there and comment. You can find my post > as well as others at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/meteoriteworkinggroup/ > Have a Great Day! > John Higgins > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Mr EMan > To: valparint at aol.com; meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 2:47:31 AM > Subject: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records > > Hello Folks--? Season's greetings. I just wanted to share some thoughts on? > forming new meteorite interest groups--past empire building in the meteorite > world in general and why some succeeded and some failed. Please, no one take > this as an attack, trolling,disparagement, discouragement, or a "dissing" of > anyone.? It is not directed at any one, although it may have been bumped to > the forefront by Mike's recent thread. An honest idea was proposed and I am > not per se addressing his proposal in any way so please keep an open mind.? > On this list we are as close as can be to inclusive(99%) in having a > collection of members within the existing meteorite interest niches.? As a > long time member? with observations regarding "empire building" as an > alternative to the Meteorite Central list, The Meteorite Times web space, > IMCA, etc.? there have been a plenty.? I could list a long string of people > who wanted to make a big splash campaigning to > improve/perfect the > culture they did not remotely understand. In spite of -- or because of--self > caused blunders, there were many patient old timers willing to? advise them > on how to get oriented to the list rather than making the list fit around > them.? They tried to help them get up to speed and direction with the > technical side, the meteorite market, and the meteorite culture often being > rebuffed, accused of trying to squash competition, or rejected as not > knowing what they were talking about.? What was hard for some? novices to > accept was that their own mindset was the reason they were unable to make > inroads into the community as a true mover/shaker.? There were many more > that took the help and are strong respected contributors today. > > Not wanting to get in their way, the long-time members stepped aside, > letting them fall into craters of their own making--some many times over.? > Many, many, times we have seen Internet/ web page savvy folks offer to > provide? "alternatives > " to the meteorite forum communities.? For the majority of those past > forums, I'd have to look hard to see if they were still around.? Some were > more noble than others.? There were some who spend a lot of effort making > dust clouds promoting a solution looking for a problem.? When the dust > settled they sat wondering what went wrong and why their enterprise/forum/ > efforts failed to hold attention.? > > Just in passing, there are several meteorite interest groups/ mailing lists: > some active but with only duplicate postings, some are inactive/abandoned > with only newbie postings who never bothered to look at the membership > numbers or posting activity,? some private technical lists which are by > invitation only, and of course-- the dealer's own list where ads go directly > to the member.? For reasons beyond the scope of this babbling of mine, 99% > of all the inhabitable niches for this hobby have been taken and are being > served well by the host. There is a saturation point and economy-of-scale > even in this field of interest.? In the words of a frequent poster "it is a > free county" so anyone coould feel free to start up all the groups or forums > they wish--the Internet is a very large place.? Those that offer a truly > unique and desirable service will last and those that are offering another > way to slice up the limited pie won't--? and will end up on the ash > pile > of Internet redundancy entirely on their own. Those that did succeed, did so > by offering real value and in an unselfish manner within many many manhours > and personal expense to do so. > > What I found is that people who take shortcuts don't succeed: those who rely > too much on assumptions, those that don't take a thoughtful look at the true > market for their service, those that overestimate their expertise and time > committment, those that don't attempt a basic understanding of the meteorite > science to understand the commodity.? Basically those who arrive thinking > their personal marketing talents will overcome technical, knowledge, and > cultural issues-- don't last over the long haul.? Perhaps potential members > are jaded by all the flash-in-the night sky "dealers" so they come to accept > those proven members only after a long time of watching how they behave.? I > don't know of any shortcut to this period of watching and slowly winning > people over. > > This community isn't a automobile dealership, it isn't a church, it isn't > the Elks, it isn't a group of folks with a lot of mandated loyalty--it is a > field where you are known by your reputation--reputation means everything to > the majority of people.? You can't forge (as in fake ) those credentials ; > you have to forge them (as in earn them) by hard work over time.? That seems > to be the final obstacle to work through by those offering an alternative > folks are willing sign up for.? I've probably been ignored, filtered, and > moderated over the years more than 99% of the folks here so I I feel like I > know much of the list from both sides.? I do wish any and everyone who is > willing to go it for the long haul the best of success. If you promote it > for the love of meteorites instead the love of self then you'll have a > better shot at long term success. > > Elton > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From mlblood at cox.net Fri Dec 26 14:28:23 2008 From: mlblood at cox.net (Michael L Blood) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 11:28:23 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Possibly meteorite related sale In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Darren and all, Carbonado Black Diamonds are offered in the upcomming Tucson Auction (Lots 5 through 13) with NO MINIMUM BID. See at: http://michaelbloodmeteorites.com/AuctionTucson09.html Best wishes, Michael on 12/26/08 8:17 AM, Darren Garrison at cynapse at charter.net wrote: > Got an after-Christmas sales ad from Buy.com. One of the items listed is > black > diamonds: > > http://www.buy.com/prod/3-00-ctw-black-diamond-solitaire-pendant-stud-earrings > -set-in-white/q/loc/64934/210453208.html > > Which, I remember, are suggested to have a possible asteroidal origin: > > http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/01/070122-black-diamonds.html > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From michael at spacerocksinc.com Fri Dec 26 14:44:07 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 11:44:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 26, 2008 Message-ID: <7611372.44371230320647460.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://rocksfromspace.org/December_26_2008.html From meteoritekid at gmail.com Fri Dec 26 14:46:01 2008 From: meteoritekid at gmail.com (Jason Utas) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 11:46:01 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Need a meteorite picture repository (was Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records) In-Reply-To: References: <20081226161427.CC73D1053D@mailwash5.pair.com> Message-ID: <93aaac890812261146h71e3532cs1c5990efbfe40c32@mail.gmail.com> Hola Bob, Michael, I would go for either flickr.com (free account gives you 200 fairly high-res pictures - per account, and unlimited photos of even higher resolution if you pay), or the encyclopedia of meteorites site, run by our list's own Pierre-Marie Pele. Have a look: http://encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/ Creating an account is free, though donations aren't frowned upon. I find that webshots and picasa...well, I've never used either, but it seems to me that either they have lower resolution capabilities than flickr - or people simply choose to upload smaller images. Never having used either, I can't say which is true. Regards, Jason On Fri, Dec 26, 2008 at 11:23 AM, Michael L Blood wrote: > Bob, > I don't see the problem... There are many free photo sites - > Upload your photo, get the URL, put the click-to URL into your > Post to the list and there you are. Hundreds do it. The worst > Case scenario is you have to copy/paste the URL to your browser. > I like "Webshots" : http://www.webshots.com/ ....because of the > Ease of use and the option to pay a little and expand your capacity, > but there are dozens out there - just choose one > (I will admit there is at least one list member that cannot seem > To get this basic concept, talks about a photo we certainly should > Be sure to see - and leaves the URL out of his posts.... > Concluding with ..."Enjoy!" - enjoy WHAT?) > Other than that, how easy can it get, Bob? These sites are > Out there - pick one, use it, post to the list. > Best wishes, Michael > > on 12/26/08 8:14 AM, Bob Loeffler at bobl at peaktopeak.com wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> I'm not posting this to MikeG's chat group discussion because my idea is not >> the focus of that discussion. >> >> I see only one thing missing from this Meteorite list: A picture repository >> for list members who don't have websites. We can have all of the >> meteorite-related discussions that we so desire on this list, but if a >> member wants to show us pictures of his meteorites, he/she has to use a >> service like Flickr if he/she doesn't have his/her own website. Flickr and >> some of the others are nice for general use, but then we have pictures >> strewn about all over the web and it's impossible to search for them. Not >> easy for new members (or old members) to view them. >> >> What I would like to see is a meteor/meteorite picture storage site that is >> easy to navigate and easy for people to post their pictures to. It would >> need to be moderated (e.g. someone posts a picture and caption, then the >> moderator would need to OK it before it is viewable by everyone) and you >> would need to be a "member" of the website (free, of course, but donations >> would be good) to be able to post (so it would cut down on "spammer posts"). >> The moderator would then prevent the few spammer posts to be uploaded. Each >> member would get his/her own folder (or album) to post pictures into. And >> maybe they could create more folders within their main folder. It would >> need to be searchable (e.g. I want to see all Sikhote Alin meteorites). >> >> Anyone could become a member, even dealers who already have a website, >> because they might want to share their personal collection with everyone >> else without putting it on their dealer website. There would be no >> advertising on this, but you could add your website URL to the caption of a >> picture if you want people to be able to easily find your website. There >> would be NO discussion on the website since we already have a place for >> that. :-) Just pictures and their captions. >> >> It should be able to have it's own website domain name (e.g. >> www.met-list-meteorites.com). I volunteer to pay the yearly domain name fee >> if others would share the monthly web hosting fee (I could help with that, >> too) and the daily work. I am too stretched on other volunteer work, so I >> can't do much of the daily moderation (which of course could be done every >> couple of days instead of daily). >> >> Is there any website system out there that can do this already? Or is there >> anyone who could make one? >> >> Thanks and Happy Holidays! >> >> Regards, >> >> Bob Loeffler >> COMETS >> http://www.peaktopeak.com/comets/ >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com >> [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of John >> higgins >> Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 8:08 AM >> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records >> >> Hi Elton, this post is not in any way intended to be a attack, trolling, >> disparagement, of you or anyone else who feels the same way. And the >> meteorite working group, would perfer this conversation be OFF-LIST. We >> don't want this to be a meteorite list issue! Instead of discouraging other >> people, which you have obvisouly acclompished with flying colors. Come and >> join in our discussion. Get to know the people you are calling untalented >> auto salesman, and see if when you are done you still think of us as >> selfish, greedy self centered folks, who only have their own self intrest at >> heart. A dicussion is all it is at this point. If the idea gets far, and you >> still disagree. Then bash it all you want. Our group already stated that we >> want a private dicussion, you are trying to bash us in a public forum, not >> very nice. Maybe somebody can make comments on your moral judgement and >> nature for doing so, but that is not in our nature, so we cannot comment on >> that. I have already responded to your post in Mike's yahoo chat group. >> Anybody who is intrested, should go there and comment. You can find my post >> as well as others at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/meteoriteworkinggroup/ >> Have a Great Day! >> John Higgins >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ---- >> From: Mr EMan >> To: valparint at aol.com; meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 2:47:31 AM >> Subject: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records >> >> Hello Folks-- Season's greetings. I just wanted to share some thoughts on >> forming new meteorite interest groups--past empire building in the meteorite >> world in general and why some succeeded and some failed. Please, no one take >> this as an attack, trolling,disparagement, discouragement, or a "dissing" of >> anyone. It is not directed at any one, although it may have been bumped to >> the forefront by Mike's recent thread. An honest idea was proposed and I am >> not per se addressing his proposal in any way so please keep an open mind. >> On this list we are as close as can be to inclusive(99%) in having a >> collection of members within the existing meteorite interest niches. As a >> long time member with observations regarding "empire building" as an >> alternative to the Meteorite Central list, The Meteorite Times web space, >> IMCA, etc. there have been a plenty. I could list a long string of people >> who wanted to make a big splash campaigning to >> improve/perfect the >> culture they did not remotely understand. In spite of -- or because of--self >> caused blunders, there were many patient old timers willing to advise them >> on how to get oriented to the list rather than making the list fit around >> them. They tried to help them get up to speed and direction with the >> technical side, the meteorite market, and the meteorite culture often being >> rebuffed, accused of trying to squash competition, or rejected as not >> knowing what they were talking about. What was hard for some novices to >> accept was that their own mindset was the reason they were unable to make >> inroads into the community as a true mover/shaker. There were many more >> that took the help and are strong respected contributors today. >> >> Not wanting to get in their way, the long-time members stepped aside, >> letting them fall into craters of their own making--some many times over. >> Many, many, times we have seen Internet/ web page savvy folks offer to >> provide "alternatives >> " to the meteorite forum communities. For the majority of those past >> forums, I'd have to look hard to see if they were still around. Some were >> more noble than others. There were some who spend a lot of effort making >> dust clouds promoting a solution looking for a problem. When the dust >> settled they sat wondering what went wrong and why their enterprise/forum/ >> efforts failed to hold attention. >> >> Just in passing, there are several meteorite interest groups/ mailing lists: >> some active but with only duplicate postings, some are inactive/abandoned >> with only newbie postings who never bothered to look at the membership >> numbers or posting activity, some private technical lists which are by >> invitation only, and of course-- the dealer's own list where ads go directly >> to the member. For reasons beyond the scope of this babbling of mine, 99% >> of all the inhabitable niches for this hobby have been taken and are being >> served well by the host. There is a saturation point and economy-of-scale >> even in this field of interest. In the words of a frequent poster "it is a >> free county" so anyone coould feel free to start up all the groups or forums >> they wish--the Internet is a very large place. Those that offer a truly >> unique and desirable service will last and those that are offering another >> way to slice up the limited pie won't-- and will end up on the ash >> pile >> of Internet redundancy entirely on their own. Those that did succeed, did so >> by offering real value and in an unselfish manner within many many manhours >> and personal expense to do so. >> >> What I found is that people who take shortcuts don't succeed: those who rely >> too much on assumptions, those that don't take a thoughtful look at the true >> market for their service, those that overestimate their expertise and time >> committment, those that don't attempt a basic understanding of the meteorite >> science to understand the commodity. Basically those who arrive thinking >> their personal marketing talents will overcome technical, knowledge, and >> cultural issues-- don't last over the long haul. Perhaps potential members >> are jaded by all the flash-in-the night sky "dealers" so they come to accept >> those proven members only after a long time of watching how they behave. I >> don't know of any shortcut to this period of watching and slowly winning >> people over. >> >> This community isn't a automobile dealership, it isn't a church, it isn't >> the Elks, it isn't a group of folks with a lot of mandated loyalty--it is a >> field where you are known by your reputation--reputation means everything to >> the majority of people. You can't forge (as in fake ) those credentials ; >> you have to forge them (as in earn them) by hard work over time. That seems >> to be the final obstacle to work through by those offering an alternative >> folks are willing sign up for. I've probably been ignored, filtered, and >> moderated over the years more than 99% of the folks here so I I feel like I >> know much of the list from both sides. I do wish any and everyone who is >> willing to go it for the long haul the best of success. If you promote it >> for the love of meteorites instead the love of self then you'll have a >> better shot at long term success. >> >> Elton >> >> ______________________________________________ >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): > http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From paul at meteorite.com Fri Dec 26 14:57:21 2008 From: paul at meteorite.com (Paul Harris) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 11:57:21 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite-Times Annual Tucson Information Page Message-ID: <49553721.1020905@meteorite.com> Dear List, We hope you all had a wonderful Christmas Day yesterday and that most of you are getting to relax today :-) Jim and I are starting up our annual Tucson Information page on Meteorite-Times so it's time to start entering your Tucson Show information. http://www.meteorite-times.com/tucson/form/ Please allow a few days for your information to show as the updates are a manual process. The Tucson Information page is accessible from the current issue of Meteorite-Times. http://www.meteorite-times.com/meteorite_frame.htm or direct access here http://www.meteorite-times.com/tucson/index.htm The page is currently loading slowly at times due slow response from weather.com which shows the current Tucson weather. Thank you! Paul and Jim From eric at meteoritewatch.com Fri Dec 26 18:50:45 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 15:50:45 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Don't Change! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49556DD5.3020208@meteoritewatch.com> Hi all, This is a long one, but it's one I hope you'll read and give some feedback on. With all the talk here recently about spamming, ADs, marketing, new and old failed meteorite sites, groups, forums, lists, advertising, flaming, trolling, BS, back stabbing, libelous, fraud, trash talk, bullying, and websites that just don't take off I'd like to chime in a bit. Normally I just keep quiet and read list posts quietly except for the occasional little meteorite for sale ad. But as someone who has started no less than 3 meteorite related websites, forums and more recently a blog I can say from experience it's not as easy as it sounds. Take this as you will. I mean it with no malice or disrespect to anyone whatsoever. If someone wants to jump on building a new Meteorite Photo website here's some domain names that are available: meteoritephotos.com meteorite-photos.com meteoritegallery.com meteoritealbum.com No, I'm not saying build another meteorite related site, what I am saying is stop trying to "change the world" (I'm guilty of this) to anyone and everyone who posts to the Met-List trying to become the next best thing in the meteorite world. What I mean is this... If you're trying to change the world you're setting yourself up for failure and most likely you don't even realize it. The meteorite world is small. Very small. Meteorite collectors and dealers are rare compared to other industries world wide, and whether we like it or not there are cliques and niches within this limited group. At last count I think there were some 950+ members on the Met-List but I could be wrong it might be more now. Now I know there are lots of people in the meteorite biz who aren't on the Met-List and who are members of other forums and yahoo groups all over the web, some are members of my forum as well. There's the Nugget Shooter meteorite forums, Illinois meteorites Sky Rock Cafe, and of course my own Meteorite Watch forum. Not to mention IMCA members, private collectors, dealers, museums, educational institutions and other related groups are all part of the meteorite world pie. Regardless of what kind of site it is, forum, blog, dealer shop, encyclopedia, photo gallery, or a new group, the point is the math doesn't work if you're solely trying to change the meteorite world by starting a "better meteorite site". If you're familiar with real world advertising and marketing you must look at market share to evaluate whether a new product or service idea is viable. You do that by figuring demographics, estimating numbers of current customers and prospects and use a pie graph to visually represent certain areas of the market share in any given industry. This is where we get the phrase "a piece of the pie" in marketing terms. Google for example enjoys an estimated 65% of market share in the search engine industry. This is a HUGE piece of the largest pie in the world. The pie consists of all people who have an internet connection and who uses search engines to help navigate the trillions of web pages out there. You can only imagine how large this industry will become. It has unlimited growth potential considering the great numbers of future internet users. As new internet users sign on each day this pie grows at an exponential rate which will never end unless the internet goes away. Google's product is knowledge and everyone wants that product! The meteorite world is quite different in contrast. There is a very limited supply of meteorites. The laws of supply and demand have a greater effect on an industry who's product is limited in scope. Everything being equal, the meteorite world's pie is very small. Maybe at most in the number range of tens of thousands of collectors, scientists and dealers. To be successful in any industry one must provide a viable product or service at a reasonable price based on a need or want. The product herein is meteorites and the pieces of the pie are all the dealer websites, groups, forums and lists out there. The Met-List has the majority of the forum market share. That will probably not change, there's really no need to... It provides a good service that does what people need it to do. No more no less. The meteorite world itself will change when someone provides something that the "majority" of people in this industry need or want. Not something that "everyone" needs. Who is anyone to dictate what people need though? Don't make the mistake of looking for or trying to provide a solution for a problem that doesn't exist. I made this mistake as did many others on list and off. In my excitement for meteorites I forgot some very basic rules in marketing. I've only been in this biz for a little over a year. I started back in August of 07' after my girlfriend got me a meteorite for my birthday. In that time I've started many meteorite related websites including a list, a group a forum and most recently a blog. I know from experience it is not easy to change something. Especially when it really doesn't need to be changed. Ever since I got my first meteorite I've been hooked just like many new meteorite enthusiasts are when they first get into the field.The excitement of meteorites is universal and they become extremely addicting to the small percentage of people who are fascinated at first glance. Then you have your "that's cool" people who simply say "that's cool" and never get into meteorites like we do. The point being that the customer base is super small, the product supply is even smaller and trying to make a be all website just doesn't work. The only way to really change things is to help people, not change them. It's about psychology, philosophy, statistics and it's cliche, but it's true nonetheless. As a friend of mine recently told me, the way to change is to "Provide a difference". If you provide a difference people both want and need the change will be automatic. Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA From wahlperry at aol.com Fri Dec 26 20:33:29 2008 From: wahlperry at aol.com (wahlperry at aol.com) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 20:33:29 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Thanks for the meteorite list ! Message-ID: <8CB35DA41A4A7E9-1468-112B@WEBMAIL-DF07.sysops.aol.com> Hi All, I just wanted to say thanks to everyone on the Meteorite list for 2008. I don't know about you guys but my day usually starts out by letting the dog out ,making my morning cup of coffee and reading the Met list. Special thanks to all the meteorite hunters ,enthusiasts, and everyone else across the world that made this list possible! I wonder where the new falls will be and what new finds will be made in 2009? Sonny From grf2 at verizon.net Fri Dec 26 20:40:07 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 20:40:07 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Possibly meteorite related sale References: Message-ID: Darren, obviously a great find as demonstrated by the interest your post generated. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darren Garrison" To: Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 11:17 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Possibly meteorite related sale > Got an after-Christmas sales ad from Buy.com. One of the items listed is > black > diamonds: > > http://www.buy.com/prod/3-00-ctw-black-diamond-solitaire-pendant-stud-earrings-set-in-white/q/loc/64934/210453208.html > > Which, I remember, are suggested to have a possible asteroidal origin: > > http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/01/070122-black-diamonds.html > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mdavidhardy at yahoo.com Fri Dec 26 20:41:16 2008 From: mdavidhardy at yahoo.com (David Hardy) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 17:41:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Don't Change! References: <49556DD5.3020208@meteoritewatch.com> Message-ID: <159969.62653.qm@web50206.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Look at www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com. Free site where collectors can post their collection WITH photos. Lots of great information already there. David H. ----- Original Message ---- From: Eric Wichman To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 6:50:45 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Don't Change! Hi all, This is a long one, but it's one I hope you'll read and give some feedback on. With all the talk here recently about spamming, ADs, marketing, new and old failed meteorite sites, groups, forums, lists, advertising, flaming, trolling, BS, back stabbing, libelous, fraud, trash talk, bullying, and websites that just don't take off I'd like to chime in a bit. Normally I just keep quiet and read list posts quietly except for the occasional little meteorite for sale ad. But as someone who has started no less than 3 meteorite related websites, forums and more recently a blog I can say from experience it's not as easy as it sounds. Take this as you will. I mean it with no malice or disrespect to anyone whatsoever. If someone wants to jump on building a new Meteorite Photo website here's some domain names that are available: meteoritephotos.com meteorite-photos.com meteoritegallery.com meteoritealbum.com No, I'm not saying build another meteorite related site, what I am saying is stop trying to "change the world" (I'm guilty of this) to anyone and everyone who posts to the Met-List trying to become the next best thing in the meteorite world. What I mean is this... If you're trying to change the world you're setting yourself up for failure and most likely you don't even realize it. The meteorite world is small. Very small. Meteorite collectors and dealers are rare compared to other industries world wide, and whether we like it or not there are cliques and niches within this limited group. At last count I think there were some 950+ members on the Met-List but I could be wrong it might be more now. Now I know there are lots of people in the meteorite biz who aren't on the Met-List and who are members of other forums and yahoo groups all over the web, some are members of my forum as well. There's the Nugget Shooter meteorite forums, Illinois meteorites Sky Rock Cafe, and of course my own Meteorite Watch forum. Not to mention IMCA members, private collectors, dealers, museums, educational institutions and other related groups are all part of the meteorite world pie. Regardless of what kind of site it is, forum, blog, dealer shop, encyclopedia, photo gallery, or a new group, the point is the math doesn't work if you're solely trying to change the meteorite world by starting a "better meteorite site". If you're familiar with real world advertising and marketing you must look at market share to evaluate whether a new product or service idea is viable. You do that by figuring demographics, estimating numbers of current customers and prospects and use a pie graph to visually represent certain areas of the market share in any given industry. This is where we get the phrase "a piece of the pie" in marketing terms. Google for example enjoys an estimated 65% of market share in the search engine industry. This is a HUGE piece of the largest pie in the world. The pie consists of all people who have an internet connection and who uses search engines to help navigate the trillions of web pages out there. You can only imagine how large this industry will become. It has unlimited growth potential considering the great numbers of future internet users. As new internet users sign on each day this pie grows at an exponential rate which will never end unless the internet goes away. Google's product is knowledge and everyone wants that product! The meteorite world is quite different in contrast. There is a very limited supply of meteorites. The laws of supply and demand have a greater effect on an industry who's product is limited in scope. Everything being equal, the meteorite world's pie is very small. Maybe at most in the number range of tens of thousands of collectors, scientists and dealers. To be successful in any industry one must provide a viable product or service at a reasonable price based on a need or want. The product herein is meteorites and the pieces of the pie are all the dealer websites, groups, forums and lists out there. The Met-List has the majority of the forum market share. That will probably not change, there's really no need to... It provides a good service that does what people need it to do. No more no less. The meteorite world itself will change when someone provides something that the "majority" of people in this industry need or want. Not something that "everyone" needs. Who is anyone to dictate what people need though? Don't make the mistake of looking for or trying to provide a solution for a problem that doesn't exist. I made this mistake as did many others on list and off. In my excitement for meteorites I forgot some very basic rules in marketing. I've only been in this biz for a little over a year. I started back in August of 07' after my girlfriend got me a meteorite for my birthday. In that time I've started many meteorite related websites including a list, a group a forum and most recently a blog. I know from experience it is not easy to change something. Especially when it really doesn't need to be changed. Ever since I got my first meteorite I've been hooked just like many new meteorite enthusiasts are when they first get into the field.The excitement of meteorites is universal and they become extremely addicting to the small percentage of people who are fascinated at first glance. Then you have your "that's cool" people who simply say "that's cool" and never get into meteorites like we do. The point being that the customer base is super small, the product supply is even smaller and trying to make a be all website just doesn't work. The only way to really change things is to help people, not change them. It's about psychology, philosophy, statistics and it's cliche, but it's true nonetheless. As a friend of mine recently told me, the way to change is to "Provide a difference". If you provide a difference people both want and need the change will be automatic. Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Fri Dec 26 21:04:59 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 18:04:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Mars Odyssey THEMIS Images: December 22-26, 2008 Message-ID: <200812270204.SAA27669@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> MARS ODYSSEY THEMIS IMAGES December 22-26, 2008 o Platy Lava Flow (Released 22 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081222a o Dunes (Released 23 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081223a o Dunes (Released 24 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081224a o Dark Slope Streak (Released 25 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081225a o Ganges Chasma (Released 26 December 2008) http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20081226a All of the THEMIS images are archived here: http://themis.asu.edu/latest.html NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory manages the 2001 Mars Odyssey mission for NASA's Office of Space Science, Washington, D.C. The Thermal Emission Imaging System (THEMIS) was developed by Arizona State University, Tempe, in co.oration with Raytheon Santa Barbara Remote Sensing. The THEMIS investigation is led by Dr. Philip Christensen at Arizona State University. Lockheed Martin Astronautics, Denver, is the prime contractor for the Odyssey project, and developed and built the orbiter. Mission operations are conducted jointly from Lockheed Martin and from JPL, a division of the California Institute of Technology in Pasadena. From schoner at mybluelight.com Fri Dec 26 21:28:28 2008 From: schoner at mybluelight.com (Steve Schoner) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 02:28:28 GMT Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? Message-ID: <20081226.192828.3996.0@webmail05.dca.untd.com> This presentation of Apollo 11 moon dust from Armstrong's film magazine absolutely real. Beyond a shadow of a doubt. Florian Noller put these together after purchasing in a space memorabilia auction this moon dust tape mounted in an official NASA presentation board that was given to Mr. Slezak by NASA. Mr. Slezak was the first earth bound human to have been "infected" with moon dust and thus was put into quarantine with the three Apollo 11 astronauts. Florian cut this tape into tiny 3mm+ triangles, and mounted them on a photo that Armstrong took using the same film magazine that he dropped. These presentations cost no less than $1,000 in 2006, now they are all sold and the last one is $1,895. So, yes the moon dust on the tape is the real deal; from the first mission to the moon. A major historical event... Something that will be remembered as long as Mankind can remember. Is it worth it? Yes. And for $456... Absolutely. Steve Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 06:43:36 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Gilmer Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Message-ID: <8157.56049.qm at web58406.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi ladies and gentlemen (and friends watching at home!) - It's time to play America's favorite game - "REAL OR BOGUS?" http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320324463986 Today's offering comes from the intrepid world of eBay. Here we see something billed as real moon dust that was recovered from Neil Armstrong's camera magazine. So, I have to ask everyone who is playing - REAL OR BOGUS? (If I was a gambling man, I'd say BOGUS) Regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... ____________________________________________________________ Can't pay your bills? Click here to learn about filing for bankruptcy. http://thirdpartyoffers.mybluelight.com/TGL2341/fc/PnY6rzGtHjqleQviOxjSFjLJmnG2CRTGYJLsZQx0wnkD1O67nw0O4/ From michael at spacerocksinc.com Sat Dec 27 08:44:15 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 05:44:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 27, 2008 Message-ID: <2788114.64641230385455940.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_27_2008.html From mark at meteorites.cc Sat Dec 27 11:21:15 2008 From: mark at meteorites.cc (Mark Crawford) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 16:21:15 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite impacts Scotland Message-ID: <495655FB.7010800@meteorites.cc> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/highlands_and_islands/7795381.stm (OK, it was a little while back :) ) M -- Mark's Meteorite Pages: http://meteorites.cc From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Sat Dec 27 12:52:20 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 09:52:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] (AD) SIKOTE-ALIN METEORITES WITH HOLES FORSALE Message-ID: <444241.29545.qm@web57806.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi list.I hope everyone had a merry christmas.I have 2 sikote-alin's with holes forsale.I want to raise a little money for tucson.These weigh 79 grams and 77 grams.They won't be cheap,but not what I paid for them.Pics and $$$$$ amount upon request.Please off-list. ? Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From abdelaziz_alhyane at yahoo.com Sat Dec 27 13:38:03 2008 From: abdelaziz_alhyane at yahoo.com (Abdelaziz Alhyane) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 10:38:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall Message-ID: <829260.25488.qm@web45405.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Hello List Members, Last Saturday, about 10:30 pm, a huge and bright fireball seen over Taliouine travelleing from southwest to the northeast, poeple in high atlas mountains confirmed that they have heard the firball hit a mountain in between Tahnaout and Ait ourir, Marrakech region. inhabitants was so scared since they have never seen a thing like that, it is so very hard to find the meteorites because of the snow, much trees, and unfortunately much stories, most are blabla. but we are always optimistic and trying to get more correct infos and why not to find this meteorite, It would be a happy ending of the 2008. My best Aziz From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Sat Dec 27 13:44:59 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 11:44:59 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall References: <829260.25488.qm@web45405.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <996CD47EFC20434FB105493AFCDF1DE5@bellatrix> I'll take that as a fireball that produced sounds. I very much doubt anybody heard an impact. Still, sonic booms are a strong indicator of meteorite production. Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Abdelaziz Alhyane" To: Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 11:38 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall > Hello List Members, > > Last Saturday, about 10:30 pm, a huge and bright fireball seen over > Taliouine travelleing from southwest to the northeast, poeple in high > atlas mountains confirmed that they have heard the firball hit a mountain > in between Tahnaout and Ait ourir, Marrakech region. inhabitants was so > scared since they have never seen a thing like that, it is so very hard to > find the meteorites because of the snow, much trees, and unfortunately > much stories, most are blabla. but we are always optimistic and trying to > get more correct infos and why not to find this meteorite, It would be a > happy ending of the 2008. > > My best > Aziz From abdelaziz_alhyane at yahoo.com Sat Dec 27 13:50:22 2008 From: abdelaziz_alhyane at yahoo.com (Abdelaziz Alhyane) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 10:50:22 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall In-Reply-To: <996CD47EFC20434FB105493AFCDF1DE5@bellatrix> Message-ID: <225298.24364.qm@web45402.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Yes, poeple heard the impact and this is why they are scared, Aziz --- On Sat, 12/27/08, Chris Peterson wrote: > From: Chris Peterson > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Saturday, December 27, 2008, 10:44 AM > I'll take that as a fireball that produced sounds. I > very much doubt anybody heard an impact. Still, sonic booms > are a strong indicator of meteorite production. > > Chris > > ***************************************** > Chris L Peterson > Cloudbait Observatory > http://www.cloudbait.com > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Abdelaziz > Alhyane" > To: > Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 11:38 AM > Subject: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall > > > > Hello List Members, > > > > Last Saturday, about 10:30 pm, a huge and bright > fireball seen over Taliouine travelleing from southwest to > the northeast, poeple in high atlas mountains confirmed that > they have heard the firball hit a mountain in between > Tahnaout and Ait ourir, Marrakech region. inhabitants was so > scared since they have never seen a thing like that, it is > so very hard to find the meteorites because of the snow, > much trees, and unfortunately much stories, most are blabla. > but we are always optimistic and trying to get more correct > infos and why not to find this meteorite, It would be a > happy ending of the 2008. > > > > My best > > Aziz > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Sat Dec 27 14:02:09 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 11:02:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall In-Reply-To: <225298.24364.qm@web45402.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <227179.41934.qm@web110613.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> If they heard the impact, then Morocco would be in trouble. Michael Farmer --- On Sat, 12/27/08, Abdelaziz Alhyane wrote: > From: Abdelaziz Alhyane > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com, "Chris Peterson" > Date: Saturday, December 27, 2008, 11:50 AM > Yes, poeple heard the impact and this is why they are > scared, Aziz > > > --- On Sat, 12/27/08, Chris Peterson > wrote: > > > From: Chris Peterson > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall > > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > Date: Saturday, December 27, 2008, 10:44 AM > > I'll take that as a fireball that produced sounds. > I > > very much doubt anybody heard an impact. Still, sonic > booms > > are a strong indicator of meteorite production. > > > > Chris > > > > ***************************************** > > Chris L Peterson > > Cloudbait Observatory > > http://www.cloudbait.com > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Abdelaziz > > Alhyane" > > To: > > Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 11:38 AM > > Subject: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall > > > > > > > Hello List Members, > > > > > > Last Saturday, about 10:30 pm, a huge and bright > > fireball seen over Taliouine travelleing from > southwest to > > the northeast, poeple in high atlas mountains > confirmed that > > they have heard the firball hit a mountain in between > > Tahnaout and Ait ourir, Marrakech region. inhabitants > was so > > scared since they have never seen a thing like that, > it is > > so very hard to find the meteorites because of the > snow, > > much trees, and unfortunately much stories, most are > blabla. > > but we are always optimistic and trying to get more > correct > > infos and why not to find this meteorite, It would be > a > > happy ending of the 2008. > > > > > > My best > > > Aziz > > > > ______________________________________________ > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Sat Dec 27 14:07:29 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 12:07:29 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall References: <225298.24364.qm@web45402.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <48E193EF661D4429B303C924768A573F@bellatrix> Impacts that are audible are exceedingly rare events. Except for the utterly bizarre, and possibly singular example of Carancas, I don't know of any meteorite fall that was audible to anybody more than a few meters from the impact (I would guess a few Sikhote-Alin craters produced a fair bit of noise). If people actually heard the impact when they were too far away to immediately identify the site, this was a crater forming event- possible, but not very likely. Far more likely is that people heard sonic booms echoing around hills and valleys- sounds that would be far more impressive (and "scarier") than any impact sound. Of course, if there was a hypervelocity impact, people will be coming from all over the world to study it- and there may well be no meteorites at all. Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Abdelaziz Alhyane" To: ; "Chris Peterson" Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 11:50 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Moroccan fall > Yes, poeple heard the impact and this is why they are scared, Aziz From Thetoprok at aol.com Sat Dec 27 17:39:48 2008 From: Thetoprok at aol.com (Thetoprok at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 17:39:48 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad.. Sacramento Wash 005, Holbrook, ' 869 and More Message-ID: Some of these end in a few minutes! Raising cash for this years hunt following the Tucson show. Help me find more meteorites with your bids! http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/alienrockfarm_W0QQ_dmdZ1QQ_ipgZ50QQ_sopZ12 Thanks, Larry **************Don't be the last to know - click here for the latest news that will have people talking. (http://www.aol.com/?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000021) From meteoritefinder at gmail.com Sat Dec 27 19:53:48 2008 From: meteoritefinder at gmail.com (Mike Miller) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 17:53:48 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad/sale Three of the best Canyon Diablo's I ever held on the block for sale! Message-ID: <468bf6050812271653n43f64078vfa43985b9d5d8d96@mail.gmail.com> Hi all here are some of the best Canyon Diablo meteorites you will ever have the chance to purchase. They are in my personal collection when any one of the top 3 sells the other 2 will be removed from my for sale page. And at least for now remain in my collection so if you want one you better get it now. I hope you never get another chance at any of these again. Here is a link and I am not seeking offers these are the prices. Not available for trade http://www.meteoritefinder.com/whats-new-sale.htm Thanks -- Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr. Kingman Az 86401 www.meteoritefinder.com 928-753-6825 From grf2 at verizon.net Sat Dec 27 20:43:05 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:43:05 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Thanks for the meteorite list ! References: <8CB35DA41A4A7E9-1468-112B@WEBMAIL-DF07.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <9B73AFF90F0D4CE7A9A8F665D22F7AC9@ASUS> A huge Second to that Sonny! ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 8:33 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Thanks for the meteorite list ! > Hi All, > > I just wanted to say thanks to everyone on the Meteorite list for 2008. > I don't know about you guys but my day usually starts out by letting > the dog out ,making my morning cup of coffee and reading the Met list. > Special thanks to all the meteorite hunters ,enthusiasts, and everyone > else across the world that made this list possible! I wonder where the > new falls will be and what new finds will be made in 2009? > > Sonny > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From grf2 at verizon.net Sat Dec 27 20:46:31 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:46:31 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? References: <20081226.192828.3996.0@webmail05.dca.untd.com> Message-ID: Steve, must be true this is the second time you posted this info. Thanks! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Schoner" To: Cc: Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 9:28 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? > This presentation of Apollo 11 moon dust from Armstrong's film magazine > absolutely real. > > Beyond a shadow of a doubt. > > Florian Noller put these together after purchasing in a space memorabilia > auction this moon dust tape mounted in an official NASA presentation board > that was given to Mr. Slezak by NASA. Mr. Slezak was the first earth > bound human to have been "infected" with moon dust and thus was put into > quarantine with the three Apollo 11 astronauts. Florian cut this tape > into tiny 3mm+ triangles, and mounted them on a photo that Armstrong took > using the same film magazine that he dropped. These presentations cost no > less than $1,000 in 2006, now they are all sold and the last one is > $1,895. > > So, yes the moon dust on the tape is the real deal; from the first mission > to the moon. A major historical event... Something that will be > remembered as long as Mankind can remember. > > Is it worth it? > > Yes. > > And for $456... > > Absolutely. > > Steve > > > > > Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 06:43:36 -0800 (PST) > From: Michael Gilmer > Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus? > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Message-ID: <8157.56049.qm at web58406.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Hi ladies and gentlemen (and friends watching at home!) - > > It's time to play America's favorite game - "REAL OR BOGUS?" > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320324463986 > > Today's offering comes from the intrepid world of eBay. Here we see > something billed as real moon dust that was recovered from Neil > Armstrong's camera magazine. > > So, I have to ask everyone who is playing - REAL OR BOGUS? > > (If I was a gambling man, I'd say BOGUS) > > Regards and clear skies, > > MikeG > > ......................................................... > Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) > Member of the Meteoritical Society. > Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. > Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com > MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale > .......................................................... > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Can't pay your bills? Click here to learn about filing for bankruptcy. > http://thirdpartyoffers.mybluelight.com/TGL2341/fc/PnY6rzGtHjqleQviOxjSFjLJmnG2CRTGYJLsZQx0wnkD1O67nw0O4/ > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From JPBrockets at aol.com Sat Dec 27 21:33:12 2008 From: JPBrockets at aol.com (JPBrockets at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 21:33:12 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Ad - NWA pieces Message-ID: Dear List: For those possibly interested I have 4 NWA items up on eBay. Thanks for looking. http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/jpbrockets_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZQQ_ sopZ14 Juris jpbrockets at aol.com **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From bristolia at yahoo.com Sat Dec 27 22:47:36 2008 From: bristolia at yahoo.com (Paul) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 19:47:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite impacts Scotland Message-ID: <345074.56934.qm@web36201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> "http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/highlands_and_islands/7795381.stm (OK, it was a little while back :) )" More details can be found at: Microscopic meteorites show early life on Earth faced rain of rocks Media Releases, Office of External Affairs, University of Aberdeen, King's College, Aberdeen. http://www.abdn.ac.uk/mediareleases/release.php?id=1643 "Microscopic meteorites found in Scotland have unveiled major clues about a catastrophic event which dramatically altered the Earth?s surface nearly 500 million years ago." The paper discussed in the above articles is: Parnall, J., 2009, Global mass wasting at continental margins during Ordovician high meteorite influx. Nature Geoscience. vol. 2, no. 1, pp. 57 - 61, Published online: 14 December 2008 | doi:10.1038/ngeo386 http://www.nature.com/ngeo/journal/v2/n1/abs/ngeo386.html http://www.nature.com/ngeo/journal/v2/n1/index.html Yours, Paul H. From azizhabibi at yahoo.com Sun Dec 28 05:59:20 2008 From: azizhabibi at yahoo.com (habibi abdelaziz) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 02:59:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: 16200 GR NW SILCATED IRON AND A 400 GR LODRANITE BRECCIA Message-ID: <588057.64338.qm@web62005.mail.re1.yahoo.com> HI ALL ; hope this find everyone well in this holidays. for sale = 16200 gr new silcated iron under studies and its not paired to ziz iron as has been sad on the list ; look more beautyfull, = 400 gr lodranite breccia, http://www.flickr.com/photos/azizhabibi/ email for price, to aziz_habibi at hotmail.com or to azizhabibi at yahoo.com thanks aziz habibi habibi aziz www.palmserfoud.com www.palmotel.com box 70 erfoud 52200 morroco phone. 21235576145 fax.21235576170 From azizhabibi at yahoo.com Sun Dec 28 08:50:08 2008 From: azizhabibi at yahoo.com (habibi abdelaziz) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 05:50:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] cut face of the new silcated iron Message-ID: <965708.77517.qm@web62002.mail.re1.yahoo.com> hi all; after many emails, asking about the interior of this new ironhow it ?look like. the best photo is in space rock of the day from mirko graul. http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_21_2008.html the one up is ziz silicated iron the one down is the new algerian silicated iron; i think also there was nice slices on auctions, the 16200 gr is here. http://www.flickr.com/photos/azizhabibi/ my best aziz ?habibi aziz box 70 erfoud 52200 morroco phone. 21235576145 fax.21235576170 From meteoritefinder at yahoo.com Sun Dec 28 09:32:24 2008 From: meteoritefinder at yahoo.com (Robert Woolard) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 06:32:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Another Fall??? Message-ID: <87626.12555.qm@web39601.mail.mud.yahoo.com> All, A lot of you may already have seen this, but if not, here is a Spaceweather report on yesterday's fireball over CA. CALIFORNIA FIREBALL: A remarkable fireball blazed across Califonia on Dec. 27th around 1:50 am PST. Its brilliant blue-green light caught the attention of onlookers (some inside their homes) all the way from San Francisco Bay in the north to the Los Angeles metropolitan area in the south--a range of more than 340 miles. According to one account, the object exploded with a thunderous boom, producing a spray of golden-colored fragments. Dec. 27, 2008 Location: Bishop, California Comments: Grant Bentley: "I got up to go to the bathroom this morning around 1 AM and, as luck would have it, my bathroom's west-facing window framed an intense fireball in the sky about 30 degrees in declination over the Wheeler Crest. It was as if someone had set off a rescue flare that instantly bathed the countryside around Bishop in whitish blue-green light. You could see portions of the object disintegrating as it trended left to right at an angle of about 15 degrees below horizontal. At one point, the path of the incoming meteor went behind a cirrus-stratus cloud that it backlit in snowy green light. After a brilliant show of less than three seconds (time enough to register the impressions I am describing now) it was gone without a trace. It was easily the most massive object I have ever seen burning up as it entered the Earth's atmosphere." Location: Corona, California Comments: Will Wilkens: "At 1:50 a.m. PST I witnessed what appeared to be a large meteor over Southern California. I am located in South Corona in western Riverside County. Sitting at my computer facing my window (blinds were open) which looks north, saw a very bright descending ball of light towards the northwest?..I stood up to look closer and watched it descend quickly behind the nearby hills. Angle of descent was 60 deg. Very bright. Saw it for about 8 seconds." Location: San Jose, California Comments: George Shirakawa: "I was driving in San Jose on Interstate 280 and saw the event...I have never seen anything like it!" Location: Merced, California Comments: Erika Knorn: "Close to 2:00 a.m. I got up from watching TV to let my dog outside. As she was walking around the grass I was looking up over our house and what I saw was the most beautiful ball of light I have ever seen!!!! As it came over my house I saw the ball of light get more of a trail behind it. Then it got brighter and looked like it strated to get bigger, then it blew outwords into a perfect big green circle that formed around the ball. I then saw the green circle flash a couple quick flashes of green/blue light then it looked like the fireball blew gold and white flashes behind it and disappeared! I was so surprised from what I had just seen that I stood outside for a couple of minutes to see if maybe what I had just saw was some kind of missile or flare. Then I heard about 50secs or so later a loud distant boom and a slight rumble like a thunder clap! We had no rain or thunder in our area lastnight so I knew it wasn't thunder! It also sounded like a sonic boom. I have been in Merced for along time and when Castel Air Force Base was active, I did get to hear a few sonic booms and that is what it also sounded like. I called my brother-law Ken in Modesto California north of Merced this morning and I told him what I had witnessed. He then told me he heard something while he was on his computer around the same time I was outside seeing this all happen!!! I have seen meteor showers before, but I have NEVER seen something like this! I'm still in complete wow on the how big it was." From michael at spacerocksinc.com Sun Dec 28 10:53:10 2008 From: michael at spacerocksinc.com (Michael Johnson) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 07:53:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 28, 2008 Message-ID: <4069998.97671230479590094.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_28_2008.html From grf2 at verizon.net Sun Dec 28 11:52:04 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 11:52:04 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 28, 2008 References: <4069998.97671230479590094.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com> Message-ID: Bernd, the wealth of tiny fissures visible in the third pic aptly document its chaotic origin. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Johnson" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Sunday, December 28, 2008 10:53 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 28,2008 > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_28_2008.html > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com Sun Dec 28 17:00:09 2008 From: michael_w_gilmer at yahoo.com (Michael Gilmer) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 14:00:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Metal Detectors for Meteorites Shootout In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <852935.96842.qm@web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com> The author of this series of articles has compared several metal detectors for performance when searching for various types of meteorites. The articles can be found here - http://www.whiteriverprep.com/meteor/shootout.html Forgive me if this is a repost. As someone who will soon be in the market for a metal detector (primarily for meteorite prospecting, but also for gold and relics), I found these reviews to be interesting, but I am wondering what some of our experienced prospectors here on the list think. I don't recall seeing the author of these articles on this list. Regards and clear skies, MikeG ......................................................... Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA) Member of the Meteoritical Society. Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network. Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale .......................................................... From John at Cabassi.net Sun Dec 28 18:46:09 2008 From: John at Cabassi.net (John.L.Cabassi) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 15:46:09 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 4024 Message-ID: <002101c96946$7757f4d0$4564fea9@TITAN> G'Day Everyone, I'd appreciate some help on this one. I try to take one met each weekend and gather as much information and notes on it. This weekend, it was NWA 4024. My problem is conflicting amounts of the Total Known Weight. The piece I received provided the basic information, but the total known weight was left out. The Met Bull states 38.1 grams, but I've also noticed on some of Mike's cards, it's placed at 745 grams. Can anybody help? I would really appreciate it. Thanks in advance. Cheers, John From bristolia at yahoo.com Mon Dec 29 00:58:40 2008 From: bristolia at yahoo.com (Paul) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 21:58:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Siberian flood basalts and the end-Permian environmental crisis Message-ID: <203098.65877.qm@web36207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In press in the "Earth and Planetary Science Letters" is: Svensen, H., S. Planke, A. G. Polozov, N. Schmidbauer, F. Corfu, Y. Y. Podladchikov, and B. Jamtveit, in press, Siberian gas venting and the end-Permian environmental crisis. Earth and Planetary Science Letters. The PDF file for this paper can be found at: http://folk.uio.no/yuripo/papers/svensen_epsl_09.pdf They concluded that that heating of Tunguska Basin sediments by the ascending magma of the Siberian Traps Large Igneous Province was capable of playing a key role in end-Permian environmental crisis. They argue that the cooking of organic-rich shales and petroleum-bearing evaporites around sill intrusions produced sufficient volumes of greenhouse gases and halocarbons to cause warming and atmospheric ozone depletion on a global scale. They estimated that the metamorphism of organic matter and petroleum generated over 100,000 Gigatons of CO2 that were released through enormous pipe structures associated with kilometre-sized craters. They also argue from laboratory experiments that cooking of petroleum-bearing rock salt at high temperatures by the magmas generated huge quantities of methyl chloride and methyl bromide that have resulted not only in global warming but also global ozone depletion. PDF files of ther papers of Dr Henrik Svensen can be found at: http://folk.uio.no/hensven/publications.htm The source of PDF file of related papers where noted in "[meteorite-list] Online PDF files about Permian-Triassic extinction" at; http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/meteorite-list/2008-December/048424.html Note: I am only summarizing what the above paper states. As result, this post reflect only the opinions of the authors of the above paper and **not** my own opinions on this subject. Thus, any disagreements should directed to the paper and it authors and **not** me. Furthermore I feel no obligation to defend their conclusions as I am still in the process of evaluating the arguments made in this paper. Yours, Paul H. From pshugar at clearwire.net Mon Dec 29 02:55:26 2008 From: pshugar at clearwire.net (Pete Shugar) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 01:55:26 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] Pallasite Vs Mesosiderite Message-ID: <000d01c9698a$d55831a0$d0e11960@laptop> OK, to me they look the same when you cut them open. What gives? Does one have more metal or more olivine than the other? Brahin is a Pallasite with beautiful olivine and metal to hold it all together. Altho I have as yet to see a slice of Vaca Muerta, a mesosiderite, just looking at it I can see what appears to be olivine crystals. Would someone chime in with a concise defination of the two, please? Thanks for the help. Pete From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Mon Dec 29 03:23:29 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 29 Dec 2008 08:23:29 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] Jim Kriegh's Birthday Message-ID: Hello Dear Jim, Even though we all know that you can no longer be with us, we'd like to send to you our heartfelt birthday wishes. So, all the best up there in your heavenly abode for your 79th birthday! Just in case some list members don't recall Jim's abode up there in the inner asteroid belt: It's asteroid 149244 Kriegh (S-type asteroid, about 1 km in diameter) discovered 2002, Sep 14 by our list member, Rob Matson. Best to You, Jim, and a Prosperous, Peaceful 2009 to All of us! Bernd From bobadebt at ec.rr.com Mon Dec 29 16:40:44 2008 From: bobadebt at ec.rr.com (David & Kitt Deyarmin) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:40:44 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Pallasite Vs Mesosiderite Message-ID: I have never seen a Pallasite that looked like a Mesosiderite. Pallasites have olivine crystals set in an iron matrix and Mesosiderites have iron globules set in a stony matrix. when cut thin, one looks like pieces of stained glass set in a metal frame and the other looks like large flecks of iron set in rock. From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Mon Dec 29 17:25:10 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 14:25:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Mars Rovers Near Five Years of Science and Discovery Message-ID: <200812292225.OAA00611@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> Dec. 29, 2008 Dwayne Brown Headquarters, Washington 202-358-1726 dwayne.c.brown at nasa.gov Guy Webster Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. 818-354-6278 guy.webster at jpl.nasa.gov RELEASE: 08-337 Mars Rovers Near Five Years of Science and Discovery PASADENA, Calif. -- NASA rovers Spirit and Opportunity may still have big achievements ahead as they approach the fifth anniversaries of their memorable landings on Mars. Of the hundreds of engineers and scientists who cheered at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory (JPL), in Pasadena, Calif., on Jan. 3, 2004, when Spirit landed safely, and 21 days later when Opportunity followed suit, none predicted the team would still be operating both rovers in 2009. "The American taxpayer was told three months for each rover was the prime mission plan," said Ed Weiler, associate administrator for NASA's Science Mission Directorate at NASA Headquarters in Washington. "The twins have worked almost 20 times that long. That's an extraordinary return of investment in these challenging budgetary times." The rovers have made important discoveries about wet and violent environments on ancient Mars. They also have returned a quarter-million images, driven more than 13 miles, climbed a mountain, descended into craters, struggled with sand traps and aging hardware, survived dust storms, and relayed more than 36 gigabytes of data via NASA's Mars Odyssey orbiter. To date, the rovers remain operational for new campaigns the team has planned for them. "These rovers are incredibly resilient considering the extreme environment the hardware experiences every day," said John Callas, JPL project manager for Spirit and Opportunity. "We realize that a major rover component on either vehicle could fail at any time and end a mission with no advance notice, but on the other hand, we could accomplish the equivalent duration of four more prime missions on each rover in the year ahead." Occasional cleaning of dust from the rovers' solar panels by Martian wind has provided unanticipated aid to the vehicles' longevity. However, it is unreliable aid. Spirit has not had a good cleaning for more than 18 months. Dust-coated solar panels barely provided enough power for Spirit to survive its third southern-hemisphere winter, which ended in December. "This last winter was a squeaker for Spirit," Callas said. "We just made it through." With Spirit's energy rising for spring and summer, the team plans to drive the rover to a pair of destinations about 200 yards south of the site where Spirit spent most of 2008. One is a mound that might yield support for an interpretation that a plateau Spirit has studied since 2006, called Home Plate, is a remnant of a once more-extensive sheet of explosive volcanic material. The other destination is a house-size pit called Goddard. "Goddard doesn't look like an impact crater," said Steve Squyres of Cornell University, in Ithaca, N.Y. Squyres is principal investigator for the rover science instruments. "We suspect it might be a volcanic explosion crater, and that's something we haven't seen before." A light-toned ring around the inside of the pit might add information about a nearby patch of bright, silica-rich soil that Squyres counts as Spirit's most important discovery so far. Spirit churned up the silica in mid-2007 with an immobile wheel that the rover has dragged like an anchor since it quit working in 2006. The silica was likely produced in an environment of hot springs or steam vents. For Opportunity, the next major destination is Endeavour Crater. It is approximately 14 miles in diameter, more than 20 times larger than another impact crater, Victoria, where Opportunity spent most of the past two years. Although Endeavour is 7 miles from Victoria, it is considerably farther as the rover drives on a route evading major obstacles. Since climbing out of Victoria four months ago, Opportunity has driven more than a mile of its route toward Endeavour and stopped to inspect the first of several loose rocks the team plans to examine along the way. High-resolution images from NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter, which reached Mars in 2006, are helping the team plot routes around potential sand traps that were not previously discernable from orbit. "The journeys have been motivated by science, but have led to something else important," said Squyres. "This has turned into humanity's first overland expedition on another planet. When people look back on this period of Mars exploration decades from now, Spirit and Opportunity may be considered most significant not for the science they accomplished, but for the first time we truly went exploring across the surface of Mars." For more information about Spirit and Opportunity, visit: http://www.nasa.gov/rovers . -end- From m_graul at yahoo.de Mon Dec 29 17:51:43 2008 From: m_graul at yahoo.de (Mirko Graul) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 22:51:43 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Peekskill and rare iron on ebay Message-ID: <29785.62380.qm@web26301.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Dear List Members, i have offer now on ebay a very nice slice of Peekskill and also rare iron meteorites. Peekskill: http://cgi.ebay.com/Meteorite-PEEKSKILL-slice-with-thick-crust-Car-Smasher_W0QQitemZ250349363025QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item250349363025&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1308%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50 ebay store: http://stores.ebay.com/Mirko-Graul-Meteorite Thank you for interest. Best wishes to all for the new year 2009 Mirko Mirko Graul Meteorite Quittenring.4 16321 Bernau GERMANY Phone: 0049-1724105015 E-Mail: m_graul at yahoo.de WEB: www.meteorite-mirko.de Member of The Meteoritical Society (International Society for Meteoritics and Planetery Science) IMCA-Member: 2113 (International Meteorite Collectors Association) From romanj at sympatico.ca Mon Dec 29 18:46:28 2008 From: romanj at sympatico.ca (Roman) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 18:46:28 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Buzzard Coulee (Lone Rock) SK Canada References: Message-ID: Below are the specimens I was able to acquire from a friend out west. He found a few himself and obtained the rest from local landowners. These were all picked up only days after the fall. Very nice! http://www.meteoritelabels.com/LR.html Export permits will be needed if you are not Canadian, so I am planning on applying for buyers that want to purchase now. Your name will go on the permit and you may have to wait up to 6 months before it gets aproved for export. The cost is $25./g US. plus shipping. (cheque or money order) Sure you can wait for the stones that get recovered this spring, and maybe pay less. But they will not be as fresh. Your choice. Please email me with any questions. Thank you, and Happy New Year! Roman Jirasek www.meteoritelabels.com IMCA#9653 From rob at nakhladogmeteorites.com Mon Dec 29 19:21:43 2008 From: rob at nakhladogmeteorites.com (Rob Wesel) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:21:43 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Peekskill and rare iron on ebay References: <29785.62380.qm@web26301.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <003101c96a14$986ed3e0$6501a8c0@windows9bb74fe> And camping off the ad for Mirko's awesome piece of Peekskill is the kit to go with it containing paint from the car and the original newspaper along with videos and papers of scientific and human interest. Can sell without the micro for $125 http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com/catalog/peekskill.html Good luck on Mirko's piece, they don't get much better! Rob Wesel http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com ------------------ We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mirko Graul" To: Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 2:51 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Peekskill and rare iron on ebay > Dear List Members, > > i have offer now on ebay a very nice slice of Peekskill and also > rare iron meteorites. > > Peekskill: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/Meteorite-PEEKSKILL-slice-with-thick-crust-Car-Smasher_W0QQitemZ250349363025QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item250349363025&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1308%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50 > > ebay store: > > http://stores.ebay.com/Mirko-Graul-Meteorite > > Thank you for interest. > > Best wishes to all for the new year 2009 > > Mirko > > > > Mirko Graul Meteorite > Quittenring.4 > 16321 Bernau > GERMANY > > Phone: 0049-1724105015 > E-Mail: m_graul at yahoo.de > WEB: www.meteorite-mirko.de > > Member of The Meteoritical Society > (International Society for Meteoritics and Planetery Science) > > IMCA-Member: 2113 > (International Meteorite Collectors Association) > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From eric at meteoritewatch.com Mon Dec 29 19:22:03 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:22:03 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] California Fireball: New Meteorite Fall? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <495969AB.4060603@meteoritewatch.com> Anyone heard anything on this? If so please post it here: http://www.meteoritesusa.com/blog/meteorite-news/california-fireball-new-meteorite-fall/ Regards, Eric From almitt at kconline.com Mon Dec 29 21:09:24 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 21:09:24 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Pallasite Vs Mesosiderite In-Reply-To: <000d01c9698a$d55831a0$d0e11960@laptop> References: <000d01c9698a$d55831a0$d0e11960@laptop> Message-ID: <87731FBD95B24BAC8ED261EDB3B858D6@StarmanPC> Hi Pete and all, Pallasites are named from their discover the German naturalist Protr Pallas and are NOT named from the asteroid 2 Pallas. As said previously they are stony-iron material containing olivine crystals that are enclosed in an iron metal. The crystals are often of gem quality. Their is variation on the amount of crystal to iron metal ratio. Sometimes having more crystals and less metal and sometime just the opposite. Some specimens like Glorieta Mtns. the crystal material simply runs out and you are left with all metal. The Olivine in most pallasites are rich in magnesium, the metals have nickel (of course) germanium, and gallium contents that are very similar to the iron meteorite group (IIIAB) which is the most populous and contains over 200 meteorites. There are three groups of Pallasites, Eagle Station, Kentucky is one that has iron rich olivines and metals which are composed differently from the other iron groups. Suggesting similar formation but from a different parent body. Mesosiderites are stony-irons composed of nearly equal amounts of metal and silicates. It is thought that the iron and the silicates formed from two different parent body sources and then through collision mixed and solidified. The stony material in mesosiderites consists mostly of pyroxenes and plagioclase. Many of the fragments that contain the silicate are similar to eucrites, diogenites, and howardites or come from an achondrite body. Missing in mesosiderites (in any abundance) is olivine, the most abundant mineral in ordinary chondrites. So mesosiderites are mixtures of core material and crust materials from a highly differentiation parent body. The stony material in these have been recrystallized from possible mixing with molten iron. Age for these are the same as iron and other achondrite bodies suggesting that the formation occurred early on in the solar system history. There are something like 40 different mesosiderite find and falls. The cooling rate is interesting as these cooled very slowly and no explanation as how they could of cooled so slowly unless they formed within a very large asteroid parent body. Best! --AL Mitterling Mitterling Meteorites ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete Shugar" To: Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 2:55 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Pallasite Vs Mesosiderite > OK, to me they look the same when you cut them open. > What gives? Does one have more metal or more olivine > than the other? > Brahin is a Pallasite with beautiful olivine and metal to hold > it all together. > Altho I have as yet to see a slice of Vaca Muerta, a mesosiderite, just > looking at it > I can see what appears to be olivine crystals. > Would someone chime in with a concise defination of the two, please? > Thanks for the help. > Pete > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > From drtanuki at yahoo.com Mon Dec 29 21:21:24 2008 From: drtanuki at yahoo.com (drtanuki) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 18:21:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: Original Casts of Peekskill and LaCroilla Message-ID: <623035.24723.qm@web53201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Dear List, I have just added photos to my website of original casts of Peekskill, New York and LaCroilla, Argentina that I am offering for sale. For viewing: http://meteoritesjapan.com/forsale.aspx Thank you! Best in 2009, Dirk Ross http://meteoritesjapan.com http://insekijapan.com From bobadebt at ec.rr.com Mon Dec 29 23:57:12 2008 From: bobadebt at ec.rr.com (David & Kitt Deyarmin) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 23:57:12 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] If you're Bored I need a Web Site Check Message-ID: <089AFC8CD3B74D7AAC5FC68794282A6C@David> I had to migrate my web site to a new server and had to go into all of the pages associated with my site to change the URLS. If you are very good at surfing and have lots of time on you hands please verify that I don;t have any broken links on my site. You can click this to get to it. http://home.roadrunner.com/~bobadebt/ >From the main page you can click on any sphere title and go to a history page and in those pages I have several links to other pages on my site. I don't think I missed anything but a second set of eyes wouldn't hurt. All links to other sites should still work. If you find anything please let me know via email at bobadebt at ec.rr.com Thanks From rob at nakhladogmeteorites.com Tue Dec 30 01:04:55 2008 From: rob at nakhladogmeteorites.com (Rob Wesel) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 22:04:55 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Another $10 Meteorite tee shirt on shirt.woot Message-ID: <004a01c96a44$8a614280$6501a8c0@windows9bb74fe> For the next 24 hours http://shirt.woot.com/ Rob Wesel http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com ------------------ We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 From carloselguapo1 at hotmail.com Tue Dec 30 03:36:42 2008 From: carloselguapo1 at hotmail.com (Carl 's) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 00:36:42 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Pallasite vs Mesosiderite Message-ID: Hi Al, Pete and others, Thank you for the explanation. Visually, I've always thought mesosiderites were similar to H Chondrites but only with much more iron sprinkled thruout...sort of like Super H Chondrites. Nice to have such a clear answer. Great question, Pete. Carl Al Mitterling wrote: ...Missing in mesosiderites (in any abundance) is olivine, the most abundant mineral in ordinary chondrites... _________________________________________________________________ Life on your PC is safer, easier, and more enjoyable with Windows Vista?. http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/127032870/direct/01/ From mark at meteorites.cc Tue Dec 30 04:11:43 2008 From: mark at meteorites.cc (Mark Crawford) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 09:11:43 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] If you're Bored I need a Web Site Check In-Reply-To: <089AFC8CD3B74D7AAC5FC68794282A6C@David> References: <089AFC8CD3B74D7AAC5FC68794282A6C@David> Message-ID: <4959E5CF.2050504@meteorites.cc> Try http://www.dead-links.com/ Mark David & Kitt Deyarmin wrote: > I had to migrate my web site to a new server and had to go into all of > the pages associated with my site to change the URLS. > > If you are very good at surfing and have lots of time on you hands > please verify that I don;t have any broken links on my site. > > You can click this to get to it. > > http://home.roadrunner.com/~bobadebt/ > >> From the main page you can click on any sphere title and go to a history > page and in those pages I have several links to other pages on my site. > > I don't think I missed anything but a second set of eyes wouldn't hurt. > > All links to other sites should still work. > > If you find anything please let me know via email at bobadebt at > ec.rr.com > > Thanks > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.1/1868 - Release Date: 29/12/2008 10:48 > > -- Mark's Meteorite Pages: http://meteorites.cc From stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com Tue Dec 30 08:17:54 2008 From: stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com (steve arnold) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 05:17:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] meso vs. pallasite Message-ID: <427889.74432.qm@web57807.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi list and all.If you go from one end of the spectrum to the other,my opinion,estherville is the KING of the meso's and esquel is the KING of the pallasites.Both as stable as a fresh new fall in a dry location.Good day all!Tucson, 38 days to go. ? Steve R.Arnold,Chicago! http://chicagometeorites.net/ From tett at rogers.com Tue Dec 30 09:23:45 2008 From: tett at rogers.com (tett) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 09:23:45 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] The hunt for green crystals in Udei Station In-Reply-To: <427889.74432.qm@web57807.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <427889.74432.qm@web57807.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <495A2EF1.4020605@rogers.com> List, While searching various web sites I stumbled across some nice images of green crystals (Olivine?) found in various cut faces of Udei Station. These crystals are a deep emerald green and very striking. So, I thought I would look and my slice and after a few minutes of searching found a solitary single crystal. Anyone else out there with a scope and some Udei Station may want to hunt for these little gems. Here is a pic: http://picasaweb.google.com/MikeTettenborn/Meteorites#5285588073310892626 Cheers Mike Tettenborn Owen Sound, Ontario From ted at filigreeinc.com Tue Dec 30 10:12:44 2008 From: ted at filigreeinc.com (ted) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 10:12:44 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Pallasite vs Mesosiderite In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Likewise, Thanks guys for clearing that up for me as well. I really get allot out of your infomails. Ted Betz -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Carl 's Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2008 3:37 AM To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Pallasite vs Mesosiderite Hi Al, Pete and others, Thank you for the explanation. Visually, I've always thought mesosiderites were similar to H Chondrites but only with much more iron sprinkled thruout...sort of like Super H Chondrites. Nice to have such a clear answer. Great question, Pete. Carl Al Mitterling wrote: ...Missing in mesosiderites (in any abundance) is olivine, the most abundant mineral in ordinary chondrites... _________________________________________________________________ Life on your PC is safer, easier, and more enjoyable with Windows VistaR. http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/127032870/direct/01/ ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From p.marmet at sunrise.ch Tue Dec 30 11:46:17 2008 From: p.marmet at sunrise.ch (Peter Marmet) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 17:46:17 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] The hunt for green crystals in Udei Station In-Reply-To: <495A2EF1.4020605@rogers.com> References: <427889.74432.qm@web57807.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <495A2EF1.4020605@rogers.com> Message-ID: <871799a20812300846g6e349a7dq2a926d25f27ee99f@mail.gmail.com> Hi Mike and All, that's very interesting! I found a similar - about 2 mm wide - green inclusion in a slice of my Steinbach meteorite. See here (scroll down to: Germany, Steinbach, 2nd slice: http://www.marmet-meteorites.com/id3.html Further infos highly appreciated:-) Peter Marmet 2008/12/30 tett : > List, > > While searching various web sites I stumbled across some nice images of > green crystals (Olivine?) found in various cut faces of Udei Station. These > crystals are a deep emerald green and very striking. So, I thought I would > look and my slice and after a few minutes of searching found a solitary > single crystal. > > Anyone else out there with a scope and some Udei Station may want to hunt > for these little gems. > > Here is a pic: > http://picasaweb.google.com/MikeTettenborn/Meteorites#5285588073310892626 > > Cheers > > Mike Tettenborn > Owen Sound, Ontario > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Tue Dec 30 12:34:12 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 30 Dec 2008 17:34:12 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] The hunt for green crystals in Udei Station Message-ID: Hi Mike, Peter and List, Peter writes: "I found a similar - about 2 mm wide - green inclusion in a slice of my Steinbach meteorite" Mike T. writes: "Anyone else out there with a scope and some Udei Station may want to hunt for these little gems" These emerald green gems are pyroxene crystals - augite to be exact! You find them in several irons, especially the silicate-bearing ones like these that I have in my collection: - Udei Station - Landes - Miles (from Martin Horejsi's collection) - Patagonia (Remember Mike Farmer's emerald green jewel in one of his specimens!?) - Caddo County [not (yet) in my collection] Hope everyone had a wonderful Xmas and is looking forward to a Happy, Peaceful 2009! Bernd From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Tue Dec 30 12:58:28 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 09:58:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Fireball Streaks Over California Message-ID: <200812301758.JAA13285@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://www.mercedsunstar.com/167/story/615048.html Fireball streaks across night sky over Merced By SCOTT JASON Merced Sun-Star December 30, 2008 A glowing tomato-green fireball shot through the black Merced sky early Saturday, stunning those fortunate enough to see its brief life. Merced resident Erika Knorn, 42, had awoken just before 2 a.m. to take her dog, Shadow, to the bathroom before returning to bed. She gazed toward the sky and noticed the burst of color above her house near East Olive and Parsons avenues. Erika Knorn describes witnessing a spectacular "fireball" in the sky above Merced early Saturday morning. "Oh my gosh! Oh my gosh! What is that?" she recalled saying that night as if someone would answer. "Oh my gosh!" Was it a flare? she wondered. Was it a missile? The flash, which resembled a bright white beach ball, moved in a northwesterly descent for about six seconds, she said. Then it turned blue-green. Three waves of light pulsed through the sky. It then began releasing gold and white sparks. About a minute later she heard three sharp booms that startled her dog into barking a few times. Other dogs in the neighborhood began howling. She hasn't been able to get the image of it out of her head. "It was beautiful and scary in a way," she explained Monday. "I don't think I want to see one that close again." Knorn was pointed to www.spaceweather.com, which allows people to post stories about fireball sightings. There she found a few other accounts from people in Bishop in Inyo County, Corona in Riverside County and San Jose. Grant Bentley wrote, "It was as if someone had set off a rescue flare that instantly bathed the countryside around Bishop in whitish blue-green light. It was easily the most massive object I have ever seen burning up as it entered the Earth's atmosphere." George Shirakawa was driving on Interstate 280 in San Jose at the time. He wrote, "I have never seen anything like it!" Arizona-based meteorite hunter Robert Ward said the noise Knorn heard was meteor crashing into land, thereby becoming a meteorite. Ward, 32, has gone on more than 30 successful meteorite expeditions in the Middle East, Europe, Africa and North America. He sells and trades some of the pieces he finds. Prices average at about $1 a gram, but can get as expensive as $1,000 a gram if the meteorite is from Mars or the moon. (A little more than 28 grams make an ounce.) Based on the descriptions he's read, Ward said Knorn and others probably saw a fireball, which is a brighter version of a meteor. Meteorites can be the size of microwave ovens and even refrigerators, he said. They travel between 11,000 and 30,000 miles an hour. The noise she heard means the meteorite may have gone to ground near or even in Merced County, he said. He's found space rocks 50 miles from people who've heard sonic booms. Ward is contacting people in the state who have sky cameras to see if he can re-create the meteor's path and begin a recovery effort. "If I got the right information, I'd leave immediately," he said. The most common type of meteorite is a chondrite, which is mostly silicate but contains traces of nickel and iron. After seeing the fireball, Knorn stayed in her backyard and scanned the sky to see if any others would fall. "I am going to start (meteor watching). It made me go, 'Wow, life,'" she said. "It changed my way of looking up." Reporter Scott Jason can be reached at (209) 385-2453 or sjason at mercedsun-star.com From clp at alumni.caltech.edu Tue Dec 30 13:56:47 2008 From: clp at alumni.caltech.edu (Chris Peterson) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 11:56:47 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fireball Streaks Over California References: <200812301758.JAA13285@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <95E3F3993ED74C0D82590199C5A65A8F@bellatrix> I hope the author misquoted Robert Ward. I'm pretty sure he knows that the sound that was heard was a sonic boom, at fairly high altitude, and not the sound of a meteor "crashing into land". Chris ***************************************** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Baalke" To: "Meteorite Mailing List" Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2008 10:58 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Fireball Streaks Over California > > http://www.mercedsunstar.com/167/story/615048.html > > Fireball streaks across night sky over Merced > By SCOTT JASON > Merced Sun-Star > December 30, 2008 > > A glowing tomato-green fireball shot through the black Merced sky early > Saturday, stunning those fortunate enough to see its brief life. > > Merced resident Erika Knorn, 42, had awoken just before 2 a.m. to take > her dog, Shadow, to the bathroom before returning to bed. > > She gazed toward the sky and noticed the burst of color above her house > near East Olive and Parsons avenues. > > Erika Knorn describes witnessing a spectacular "fireball" in the sky > above Merced early Saturday morning. > > "Oh my gosh! Oh my gosh! What is that?" she recalled saying that night > as if someone would answer. "Oh my gosh!" > > Was it a flare? she wondered. Was it a missile? > > The flash, which resembled a bright white beach ball, moved in a > northwesterly descent for about six seconds, she said. > > Then it turned blue-green. Three waves of light pulsed through the sky. > It then began releasing gold and white sparks. About a minute later she > heard three sharp booms that startled her dog into barking a few times. > Other dogs in the neighborhood began howling. > > She hasn't been able to get the image of it out of her head. "It was > beautiful and scary in a way," she explained Monday. "I don't think I > want to see one that close again." > > Knorn was pointed to www.spaceweather.com, > which allows people to post stories about fireball sightings. > > There she found a few other accounts from people in Bishop in Inyo > County, Corona in Riverside County and San Jose. > > Grant Bentley wrote, "It was as if someone had set off a rescue flare > that instantly bathed the countryside around Bishop in whitish > blue-green light. It was easily the most massive object I have ever seen > burning up as it entered the Earth's atmosphere." > > George Shirakawa was driving on Interstate 280 in San Jose at the time. > He wrote, "I have never seen anything like it!" > > Arizona-based meteorite hunter Robert Ward said the noise Knorn heard > was meteor crashing into land, thereby becoming a meteorite. > > Ward, 32, has gone on more than 30 successful meteorite expeditions in > the Middle East, Europe, Africa and North America. He sells and trades > some of the pieces he finds. Prices average at about $1 a gram, but can > get as expensive as $1,000 a gram if the meteorite is from Mars or the > moon. (A little more than 28 grams make an ounce.) > > Based on the descriptions he's read, Ward said Knorn and others probably > saw a fireball, which is a brighter version of a meteor. Meteorites can > be the size of microwave ovens and even refrigerators, he said. They > travel between 11,000 and 30,000 miles an hour. > > The noise she heard means the meteorite may have gone to ground near or > even in Merced County, he said. He's found space rocks 50 miles from > people who've heard sonic booms. > > Ward is contacting people in the state who have sky cameras to see if he > can re-create the meteor's path and begin a recovery effort. "If I got > the right information, I'd leave immediately," he said. > > The most common type of meteorite is a chondrite, which is mostly > silicate but contains traces of nickel and iron. > > After seeing the fireball, Knorn stayed in her backyard and scanned the > sky to see if any others would fall. > > "I am going to start (meteor watching). It made me go, 'Wow, life,'" she > said. "It changed my way of looking up." > > Reporter Scott Jason can be reached at (209) 385-2453 or > sjason at mercedsun-star.com > From meteoritefinder at yahoo.com Tue Dec 30 14:24:11 2008 From: meteoritefinder at yahoo.com (Robert Woolard) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 11:24:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Perhaps another fall?? Message-ID: <490358.81548.qm@web39603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> List, I don't know if any of you found the posting I made the other day about the possible CA fall interesting or not, but if so, here is a report on perhaps yet another ( ??? ) on the other side of the USA. ******************************************* NEW ENGLAND FIREBALL: Last night, Dec. 29th at 9:30 p.m. EST, sky watchers in Maine, New Hampshire, Massachusetts, New York and New Jersey witnessed a magnitude -9 fireball that exploded colorfully in mid-flight. No one knows if fragments of the meteoroid reached the ground. Location: North Bay Shore, New York Comments: Dan Linek: "At approximately 2130 EST, I was sitting in a car and noticed a quick bright light right in front of my eyes. It took me a couple of seconds to realize I had just seen the brightest meteor of my life. It came out of the eastern sky heading to the north about 20-30 degrees above the horizon near the constellation Cancer. It was a bright blue color with a hint of green and lasted about a half second to a full second. In that short time, it seemed as though there were a few pieces falling right below it but I do not think anything reached the ground. I estimate it was about a -9 magnitude based on -8 magnitude Iridium Satellite Flares I have seen." Location: New Hampshire Comments: Joe Hanley: "I was driving due south on Route 93 in southern New Hampshire at 9:30 p.m. EST when my wife Mary and I saw what appeared to be a low and very bright shooting star flying across the sky from the east towards the west. We were amazed at the how low, bright and extended it was when it then burst into colorful pieces, leaving a very quick and multi-colored trail." Location: Roslyn, New York Comments: Bernadette of Glen Cove, New York: "Tonight at 9:30 pm EST my husband and I were driving east on the expressway in the town of Roslyn, NY. We couldn't help but see the brightest meteor! I am sure it lasted more than 7 seconds. It was very bright with a long tail. I feel I saw an orange color as well. This certainly makes up for all those nights I have stared into the sky hoping to see something an felt disappointed." Location: Cummington, Massachusetts Comments: Steve Sauter: "I was driving East on Rte. 9 in Cummington, Ma. on 12/29. My daughter and her fiance were in the south passenger seats when both yelled, fireworks, whoa! Sparks, a tail! They then described a huge kelly green ball of sparks, "falling straight to the ground with a tail of green sparks stretching up and to the left (east). Extremely bright, large. This should mean a landing around Windsor, Ma." Location: Mansfield, Massachusetts Comments: Andy Stearns: "Wow! At approximately 9:30PM local time I witnessed a very bright fireball against a clear starlit sky. It initially appeared between 45? and 60? above the southern horizon and approximately 90? above the eastern horizon. It was traveling west. Unfortunately, my house obstructed my view at about 45? on the western horizon. The core of the fireball was distinctly green with a very bright white trail. There may have been some blue fringes. Although the view became obstructed by my house, there was about 2 seconds where the western sky was illuminated by the meteor's travel west. This illumination was terminated by a green flash that lit up the entire western quadrant of the sky. My impression was that the fireball exploded, but unfortunately, I could not witness any fragmenting or the actual explosion due to my obstruction. From first observation until the explosion was about 4 seconds (no more than 5). I've witnessed thousands of meteors over my 43 year lifetime including 1 meteor burst several years ago (which was brilliant white). This ranks #1 to me due to the intensity of the light, the brilliant green color, and the green flash it produced over the western horizon." Location: Perry Hall, Maryland Comments: Dan Dutrow: "While driving home tonight around 9:30 PM, I saw something I've never seen before. While headed North in Perry Hall, Maryland on I-95, I witnessed a green flash of light rapidly falling away from me to the east. It was either a rocket hurling towards Best Buy or a meteor flying North over Perry Hall and into the horizon, hopefully the latter." Location: Bangor, Maine. Comments: Edward W. Gould: "Last night, I was in my backyard with one of our dogs, when I saw a bright flash out of the corner of my eye. It lasted long enough for me to turn and catch a glimpse of it as it shot low across the southern sky traveling from east to west. It was a bright green ball with a long tail. What struck me was both how bright it was and how low in the sky it was, just visible above the tree and house lines. I thanked my dog for having to go out to give me the opportunity to see it!" Location: Maine Comments: Nicole Ricci: "I live in a very small town in Southern Maine and went out around 9:30pm to let my dog out and saw a orange ball fall from the sky." Location: Sunderland, Massachusetts Comments: Kris Moriarty: "My daughters and I were on our way home at 9:30 pm last night when we saw a greenish oblong shaped fireball in the sky. It was shooting down & had a fiery orange tail. It then seemed to break apart as it came down. We were driving on route 47 south in Sunderland, Ma. It was so neat!!! Thanks for letting us know we weren't crazy & weren?t the only ones who witnessed such a spectacular event!" Location: Coyle Field, Chatsworth, New Jersey Comments: Jim Mack, Willingboro Astronomical Society: "There were a number of observers at Coyle field last night and you either saw the fire ball or saw the bright light from it. After reading your article on the New England Fireball I put together the night's events which leads me to beleive what we saw was the same Fireball! While observing M42 thru my friend Mitch's new 24" StarMaster we saw the Fireball looking towards the North East everything lit up. Shortly afterward we packed up as clouds came in and went home. When I was leaving, the clock in my car said 10:10." Location: Monson, Maine Comments: Eric B Smith: "Was on my computer Monday evening and saw the fireball out the window seeming to come from ENE to WSW. Very bright. By the time I got outside it was gone." Location: Belmont, MA Comment: Alison Anderson: "I was sitting indoors at my computer, in front of a window, and saw a bright and large ball flash across the sky at 9:30 pm. It went from SSE to S before my view was blocked by a neighboring house. The fireball was bright white, brighter than the moon (I could see it through my window, despite reflections of indoor lighting), and its size was about a quarter of a full moon. My viewing was very brief, perhaps only one or two seconds." Location: Boxford, MA Comments: Paul Siebols: "I was outside and already looking at the constellation Orion when I saw an orange streak heading approximately SW. After a momentary fade, it brightened intensely. I did not see disintegration from my vantage point because of trees, but the fireball origin was approximately in the Monoceros or Lepus area between Sirius and Orion's Belt. It was a beautiful sight to witness, and among the brightest I have seen." From bobl at peaktopeak.com Tue Dec 30 14:39:30 2008 From: bobl at peaktopeak.com (Bob Loeffler) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 12:39:30 -0700 Subject: [meteorite-list] Need a meteorite picture repository In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20081230193926.5C07910535@mailwash5.pair.com> Hi Michael, Edward, Steve, etc. All of those free photo sites are nice, but there are too many of them and therefore everyone's photos are scattered all over the web. Even if everyone adds a URL link to their photos in an e-mail and posts it to this list, it's a major pain in the butt. That's what many of us don't want. For example, if someone joins our list tomorrow and is looking for photos of Sikhote Alin, they have no way to go back and search through all of the list e-mails for Sikhote Alin photos links that were uploaded to Flickr or Webshots 3 or 6 or 9 months ago... unless there is a search function in our list's archives (I couldn't find one). Even if there were a search function, it would still be a pain to go look at some on Flickr, then go to Webshots, then go to Picassa, etc. Too much jumping around. So, they should all be in a centralized location. Jason, Rob and Norbert all mentioned the Encyclopedia of Meteorites website. >From what I've seen on it in just the few minutes that I've looked at it, that DOES seem to be a good place to post meteorite (or meteorite-related) photos, so maybe it has most/all of the features I was inquiring about. I had heard about the Encyclopedia of Meteorites a year ago, but personal photo collections are not what I would expect in an encyclopedia, so I didn't even think to look there. Thanks all! Bob -----Original Message----- From: Michael L Blood [mailto:mlblood at cox.net] Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 12:23 PM To: Bob Loeffler; Meteorite List Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Need a meteorite picture repository (was Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records) Bob, I don't see the problem... There are many free photo sites - Upload your photo, get the URL, put the click-to URL into your Post to the list and there you are. Hundreds do it. The worst Case scenario is you have to copy/paste the URL to your browser. I like "Webshots" : http://www.webshots.com/ ....because of the Ease of use and the option to pay a little and expand your capacity, but there are dozens out there - just choose one (I will admit there is at least one list member that cannot seem To get this basic concept, talks about a photo we certainly should Be sure to see - and leaves the URL out of his posts.... Concluding with ..."Enjoy!" - enjoy WHAT?) Other than that, how easy can it get, Bob? These sites are Out there - pick one, use it, post to the list. Best wishes, Michael on 12/26/08 8:14 AM, Bob Loeffler at bobl at peaktopeak.com wrote: > Hi all, > > I'm not posting this to MikeG's chat group discussion because my idea is not > the focus of that discussion. > > I see only one thing missing from this Meteorite list: A picture repository > for list members who don't have websites. We can have all of the > meteorite-related discussions that we so desire on this list, but if a > member wants to show us pictures of his meteorites, he/she has to use a > service like Flickr if he/she doesn't have his/her own website. Flickr and > some of the others are nice for general use, but then we have pictures > strewn about all over the web and it's impossible to search for them. Not > easy for new members (or old members) to view them. > > What I would like to see is a meteor/meteorite picture storage site that is > easy to navigate and easy for people to post their pictures to. It would > need to be moderated (e.g. someone posts a picture and caption, then the > moderator would need to OK it before it is viewable by everyone) and you > would need to be a "member" of the website (free, of course, but donations > would be good) to be able to post (so it would cut down on "spammer posts"). > The moderator would then prevent the few spammer posts to be uploaded. Each > member would get his/her own folder (or album) to post pictures into. And > maybe they could create more folders within their main folder. It would > need to be searchable (e.g. I want to see all Sikhote Alin meteorites). > > Anyone could become a member, even dealers who already have a website, > because they might want to share their personal collection with everyone > else without putting it on their dealer website. There would be no > advertising on this, but you could add your website URL to the caption of a > picture if you want people to be able to easily find your website. There > would be NO discussion on the website since we already have a place for > that. :-) Just pictures and their captions. > > It should be able to have it's own website domain name (e.g. > www.met-list-meteorites.com). I volunteer to pay the yearly domain name fee > if others would share the monthly web hosting fee (I could help with that, > too) and the daily work. I am too stretched on other volunteer work, so I > can't do much of the daily moderation (which of course could be done every > couple of days instead of daily). > > Is there any website system out there that can do this already? Or is there > anyone who could make one? > > Thanks and Happy Holidays! > > Regards, > > Bob Loeffler > COMETS > http://www.peaktopeak.com/comets/ > > > -----Original Message----- > From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of John > higgins > Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 8:08 AM > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records > > ?Hi Elton, this post is not in any way intended to be? a attack, trolling, > disparagement, of you or anyone else who feels the same way. And the > meteorite working group, would perfer this conversation be OFF-LIST. We > don't want this to be a meteorite list issue! Instead of discouraging other > people, which you have obvisouly acclompished with flying colors. Come and > join in our discussion. Get to know the people you are calling untalented > auto salesman, and see if when you are done you still think of us as > selfish, greedy self centered folks, who only have their own self intrest at > heart. A dicussion is all it is at this point. If the idea gets far, and you > still disagree. Then bash it all you want. Our group already stated that we > want a private dicussion, you are trying to bash us in a public forum, not > very nice. Maybe somebody can make comments on your moral judgement and > nature for doing so, but that is not in our nature, so we cannot comment on > that. I have already responded to your post in Mike's yahoo chat group. > Anybody who is intrested, should go there and comment. You can find my post > as well as others at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/meteoriteworkinggroup/ > Have a Great Day! > John Higgins > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Mr EMan > To: valparint at aol.com; meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 2:47:31 AM > Subject: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records > > Hello Folks--? Season's greetings. I just wanted to share some thoughts on? > forming new meteorite interest groups--past empire building in the meteorite > world in general and why some succeeded and some failed. Please, no one take > this as an attack, trolling,disparagement, discouragement, or a "dissing" of > anyone.? It is not directed at any one, although it may have been bumped to > the forefront by Mike's recent thread. An honest idea was proposed and I am > not per se addressing his proposal in any way so please keep an open mind.? > On this list we are as close as can be to inclusive(99%) in having a > collection of members within the existing meteorite interest niches.? As a > long time member? with observations regarding "empire building" as an > alternative to the Meteorite Central list, The Meteorite Times web space, > IMCA, etc.? there have been a plenty.? I could list a long string of people > who wanted to make a big splash campaigning to > improve/perfect the > culture they did not remotely understand. In spite of -- or because of--self > caused blunders, there were many patient old timers willing to? advise them > on how to get oriented to the list rather than making the list fit around > them.? They tried to help them get up to speed and direction with the > technical side, the meteorite market, and the meteorite culture often being > rebuffed, accused of trying to squash competition, or rejected as not > knowing what they were talking about.? What was hard for some? novices to > accept was that their own mindset was the reason they were unable to make > inroads into the community as a true mover/shaker.? There were many more > that took the help and are strong respected contributors today. > > Not wanting to get in their way, the long-time members stepped aside, > letting them fall into craters of their own making--some many times over.? > Many, many, times we have seen Internet/ web page savvy folks offer to > provide? "alternatives > " to the meteorite forum communities.? For the majority of those past > forums, I'd have to look hard to see if they were still around.? Some were > more noble than others.? There were some who spend a lot of effort making > dust clouds promoting a solution looking for a problem.? When the dust > settled they sat wondering what went wrong and why their enterprise/forum/ > efforts failed to hold attention.? > > Just in passing, there are several meteorite interest groups/ mailing lists: > some active but with only duplicate postings, some are inactive/abandoned > with only newbie postings who never bothered to look at the membership > numbers or posting activity,? some private technical lists which are by > invitation only, and of course-- the dealer's own list where ads go directly > to the member.? For reasons beyond the scope of this babbling of mine, 99% > of all the inhabitable niches for this hobby have been taken and are being > served well by the host. There is a saturation point and economy-of-scale > even in this field of interest.? In the words of a frequent poster "it is a > free county" so anyone coould feel free to start up all the groups or forums > they wish--the Internet is a very large place.? Those that offer a truly > unique and desirable service will last and those that are offering another > way to slice up the limited pie won't--? and will end up on the ash > pile > of Internet redundancy entirely on their own. Those that did succeed, did so > by offering real value and in an unselfish manner within many many manhours > and personal expense to do so. > > What I found is that people who take shortcuts don't succeed: those who rely > too much on assumptions, those that don't take a thoughtful look at the true > market for their service, those that overestimate their expertise and time > committment, those that don't attempt a basic understanding of the meteorite > science to understand the commodity.? Basically those who arrive thinking > their personal marketing talents will overcome technical, knowledge, and > cultural issues-- don't last over the long haul.? Perhaps potential members > are jaded by all the flash-in-the night sky "dealers" so they come to accept > those proven members only after a long time of watching how they behave.? I > don't know of any shortcut to this period of watching and slowly winning > people over. > > This community isn't a automobile dealership, it isn't a church, it isn't > the Elks, it isn't a group of folks with a lot of mandated loyalty--it is a > field where you are known by your reputation--reputation means everything to > the majority of people.? You can't forge (as in fake ) those credentials ; > you have to forge them (as in earn them) by hard work over time.? That seems > to be the final obstacle to work through by those offering an alternative > folks are willing sign up for.? I've probably been ignored, filtered, and > moderated over the years more than 99% of the folks here so I I feel like I > know much of the list from both sides.? I do wish any and everyone who is > willing to go it for the long haul the best of success. If you promote it > for the love of meteorites instead the love of self then you'll have a > better shot at long term success. > > Elton > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Get 30% to 50% more gas mileage immediately (I did!): http://go4best.water4gas.hop.clickbank.net/ From grf2 at verizon.net Tue Dec 30 16:17:48 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 16:17:48 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Perhaps another fall?? References: <490358.81548.qm@web39603.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Wow! best around here since Peeksill. Need some more reports to detrermine if anything hit the ground. Hopeful from Plymouth, MA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Woolard" To: Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2008 2:24 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Perhaps another fall?? > List, > > I don't know if any of you found the posting I made the other day about > the possible CA fall interesting or not, but if so, here is a report on > perhaps yet another ( ??? ) on the other side of the USA. > > ******************************************* > > > NEW ENGLAND FIREBALL: Last night, Dec. 29th at 9:30 p.m. EST, sky watchers > in Maine, New Hampshire, Massachusetts, New York and New Jersey witnessed > a magnitude -9 fireball that exploded colorfully in mid-flight. No one > knows if fragments of the meteoroid reached the ground. > > Location: North Bay Shore, New York > Comments: Dan Linek: "At approximately 2130 EST, I was sitting in a car > and noticed a quick bright light right in front of my eyes. It took me a > couple of seconds to realize I had just seen the brightest meteor of my > life. It came out of the eastern sky heading to the north about 20-30 > degrees above the horizon near the constellation Cancer. It was a bright > blue color with a hint of green and lasted about a half second to a full > second. In that short time, it seemed as though there were a few pieces > falling right below it but I do not think anything reached the ground. I > estimate it was about a -9 magnitude based on -8 magnitude Iridium > Satellite Flares I have seen." > > Location: New Hampshire > Comments: Joe Hanley: "I was driving due south on Route 93 in southern New > Hampshire at 9:30 p.m. EST when my wife Mary and I saw what appeared to be > a low and very bright shooting star flying across the sky from the east > towards the west. We were amazed at the how low, bright and extended it > was when it then burst into colorful pieces, leaving a very quick and > multi-colored trail." > > Location: Roslyn, New York > Comments: Bernadette of Glen Cove, New York: "Tonight at 9:30 pm EST my > husband and I were driving east on the expressway in the town of Roslyn, > NY. We couldn't help but see the brightest meteor! I am sure it lasted > more than 7 seconds. It was very bright with a long tail. I feel I saw an > orange color as well. This certainly makes up for all those nights I have > stared into the sky hoping to see something an felt disappointed." > > Location: Cummington, Massachusetts > Comments: Steve Sauter: "I was driving East on Rte. 9 in Cummington, Ma. > on 12/29. My daughter and her fiance were in the south passenger seats > when both yelled, fireworks, whoa! Sparks, a tail! They then described a > huge kelly green ball of sparks, "falling straight to the ground with a > tail of green sparks stretching up and to the left (east). Extremely > bright, large. This should mean a landing around Windsor, Ma." > > Location: Mansfield, Massachusetts > Comments: Andy Stearns: "Wow! At approximately 9:30PM local time I > witnessed a very bright fireball against a clear starlit sky. It initially > appeared between 45? and 60? above the southern horizon and approximately > 90? above the eastern horizon. It was traveling west. Unfortunately, my > house obstructed my view at about 45? on the western horizon. The core of > the fireball was distinctly green with a very bright white trail. There > may have been some blue fringes. Although the view became obstructed by my > house, there was about 2 seconds where the western sky was illuminated by > the meteor's travel west. This illumination was terminated by a green > flash that lit up the entire western quadrant of the sky. My impression > was that the fireball exploded, but unfortunately, I could not witness any > fragmenting or the actual explosion due to my obstruction. From first > observation until the explosion was about 4 seconds (no more than 5). I've > witnessed thousands > of meteors over my 43 year lifetime including 1 meteor burst several years > ago (which was brilliant white). This ranks #1 to me due to the intensity > of the light, the brilliant green color, and the green flash it produced > over the western horizon." > > Location: Perry Hall, Maryland > Comments: Dan Dutrow: "While driving home tonight around 9:30 PM, I saw > something I've never seen before. While headed North in Perry Hall, > Maryland on I-95, I witnessed a green flash of light rapidly falling away > from me to the east. It was either a rocket hurling towards Best Buy or a > meteor flying North over Perry Hall and into the horizon, hopefully the > latter." > > Location: Bangor, Maine. > Comments: Edward W. Gould: "Last night, I was in my backyard with one of > our dogs, when I saw a bright flash out of the corner of my eye. It lasted > long enough for me to turn and catch a glimpse of it as it shot low across > the southern sky traveling from east to west. It was a bright green ball > with a long tail. What struck me was both how bright it was and how low in > the sky it was, just visible above the tree and house lines. I thanked my > dog for having to go out to give me the opportunity to see it!" > > Location: Maine > Comments: Nicole Ricci: "I live in a very small town in Southern Maine and > went out around 9:30pm to let my dog out and saw a orange ball fall from > the sky." > > Location: Sunderland, Massachusetts > Comments: Kris Moriarty: "My daughters and I were on our way home at 9:30 > pm last night when we saw a greenish oblong shaped fireball in the sky. It > was shooting down & had a fiery orange tail. It then seemed to break apart > as it came down. We were driving on route 47 south in Sunderland, Ma. It > was so neat!!! Thanks for letting us know we weren't crazy & weren?t the > only ones who witnessed such a spectacular event!" > > Location: Coyle Field, Chatsworth, New Jersey > Comments: Jim Mack, Willingboro Astronomical Society: "There were a number > of observers at Coyle field last night and you either saw the fire ball or > saw the bright light from it. After reading your article on the New > England Fireball I put together the night's events which leads me to > beleive what we saw was the same Fireball! While observing M42 thru my > friend Mitch's new 24" StarMaster we saw the Fireball looking towards the > North East everything lit up. Shortly afterward we packed up as clouds > came in and went home. When I was leaving, the clock in my car said > 10:10." > > Location: Monson, Maine > Comments: Eric B Smith: "Was on my computer Monday evening and saw the > fireball out the window seeming to come from ENE to WSW. Very bright. By > the time I got outside it was gone." > > Location: Belmont, MA > Comment: Alison Anderson: "I was sitting indoors at my computer, in front > of a window, and saw a bright and large ball flash across the sky at 9:30 > pm. It went from SSE to S before my view was blocked by a neighboring > house. The fireball was bright white, brighter than the moon (I could see > it through my window, despite reflections of indoor lighting), and its > size was about a quarter of a full moon. My viewing was very brief, > perhaps only one or two seconds." > > Location: Boxford, MA > Comments: Paul Siebols: "I was outside and already looking at the > constellation Orion when I saw an orange streak heading approximately SW. > After a momentary fade, it brightened intensely. I did not see > disintegration from my vantage point because of trees, but the fireball > origin was approximately in the Monoceros or Lepus area between Sirius and > Orion's Belt. It was a beautiful sight to witness, and among the brightest > I have seen." > > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > From eric at meteoritewatch.com Tue Dec 30 16:37:45 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 13:37:45 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD: New Years Sale - 2 Days Left In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <495A94A9.3040908@meteoritewatch.com> Hi All, The New Years sale is ending at midnight Jan 1. If you want a deal then you better grab it while you can. Look for more meteorites tonight and tomorrow and until Jan 1 at Midnight. I'm dropping my price on the Brenham pallasite slices to move them fast. If you're interested they'll be dropping from $2.50/g to only $2/g After the New Years Sale is over in 2 days, the price goes back to my normal $3.50/g Brenham Pallasite: Only $2/g I will not be dropping them this low again! 64.3g Brenham Pallasite: http://www.meteoritesusa.com/meteorites-for-sale/stony-iron-meteorites/643g-brenham-pallasite-polished-slice/ 45.9g Brenham Pallasite: http://www.meteoritesusa.com/meteorites-for-sale/stony-iron-meteorites/459g-brenham-pallasite-polished-slice/ MAIN SALES PAGE: http://www.meteoritesusa.com/meteorites-for-sale/ More meteorites to be added tonight and tomorrow... Look for them. Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA From bobe5531 at comcast.net Tue Dec 30 17:00:42 2008 From: bobe5531 at comcast.net (Bob Evans) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 16:00:42 -0600 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD- Catalog of the Antarctic Meteorites VERY Rare Book Message-ID: <003601c96aca$0fc5f760$0201a8c0@yourae066c3a9b> In excellent condition , NON - Library book and starting at one penny : Catalog of the Antarctic Meteorites Collected From December 1969 to December 1994 with special reference to those represented in the collections of the National Institute of Polar Research, Tokyo 1995 Author : Keizo Yanai Link : http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZmaccers531 It has: 230 pages 36 color photos one map of Antarctica showing locations where meteorites where collected a table giving locality names, abbreviations, latitudes & longitudes for areas where the meteorites were collected a table describing the meteorite naming 22 pages of figures showing meteorite compositions in terms of pyroxene quadrilaterals, anorthite content of feldspar, and fayalite content of olivine 33 pages giving chemical analyses of about 600 meteorites a table describing meteorite classification with two pages of notes describing the table about 120 pages of tabular material listing all meteorites, weight, class, %Fa in olivine, %Fs in pyroxene, etc. With the ever increasing population of meteorite collectors making books like this more and more difficult to obtain, It took me 4 years to get this book and I consider myself lucky to get one. Also check out the colorful Type 3 NWA Chondrite up for auction . Thanks for looking ! Bob Evans From joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com Tue Dec 30 17:52:16 2008 From: joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com (JoshuaTreeMuseum) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 17:52:16 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD- Catalog of the Antarctic Meteorites VERY Rare Book Message-ID: <105D979A1486485BAD4576FBF8E03923@ET> A respected and important member of the meteorite community checked out the provenance of the last offerings on eBay by Bob Evans and they turned out to be shady to say the least. It looks like Bob Evans was selling stones with fake Monnig provenance according to his own source. Wouldn't this constitute fraud on a felony level? Can't something be done to stop this guy? When he comes back out of hiding after his latest rip off scams I say flame him until he crawls back into the scum from whence he came. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth & Space Museum From p.marmet at sunrise.ch Tue Dec 30 18:37:30 2008 From: p.marmet at sunrise.ch (Peter Marmet) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 00:37:30 +0100 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - some smaller slices of NWA 4734 LUNAR available! Message-ID: <871799a20812301537i29b92854gb794f89fada13aac@mail.gmail.com> Hello All, on request we have a few more smaller slices of the stunning LUNAR NWA 4734 available! The discount price of $ 950.00 per gram is guaranteed until January 5, 2009. Five smaller slices available: 25 mg, 75 mg, 82 mg, 110 mg, 128 mg Pictures on request! More slices available here: http://www.marmet-meteorites.com/id44.html Thank you, Peter Peter Marmet Bern, Switzerland IMCA #2747 p.marmet at mysunrise.ch http://www.marmet-meteorites.com/ From Metorman46 at aol.com Tue Dec 30 18:59:20 2008 From: Metorman46 at aol.com (Metorman46 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 18:59:20 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] The hunt for green crystals in Udei Station Message-ID: Hello Mike ,peter and list; I have a 200g chunk of udei station that is eat up with green ( diopside possibly ) inclusions.There is also some on the outside,one looks like an actual faceted crystal,to me anyway. I have also found green inclusions in campo del cielo silicated iron slices.I love the green and yellows that show up in some of these specimens. Thanks for posting such an interesting observation and interesting subject. Best Regards;Herman Archer IMCA 2770 **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From bernd.pauli at paulinet.de Tue Dec 30 19:09:41 2008 From: bernd.pauli at paulinet.de (bernd.pauli at paulinet.de) Date: 31 Dec 2008 00:09:41 UT Subject: [meteorite-list] The hunt for green crystals in Udei Station Message-ID: Hi Herman and List, "I have a 200g chunk of Udei Station...with green (diopside possibly) inclusions." Wow, 200 grams!!! Well, call it diopside, call it augite, it is a calcic clinopyroxene, and sooo beautiful! Diopside = CaMgSi2O6 Augite = (Ca,Mg,Fe2+, Fe3+,Al)2(Si,Al)2O6 Best, Bernd From star_wars_collector at yahoo.com Tue Dec 30 19:21:27 2008 From: star_wars_collector at yahoo.com (Greg Catterton) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 16:21:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] fraud and ebay In-Reply-To: <105D979A1486485BAD4576FBF8E03923@ET> Message-ID: <737575.56965.qm@web45610.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Concerning fraud and ebay... I contacted ebay by phone and email for about 2 weeks concerning Mitch Minors fake lunar material. I provided them with several documents that clearly showed his material was not authentic. I also informed them of the legal liability they assumed if they continued to allow him to list the it after they had been provided with proof of my claims of the fraudulent listings. Mitch Minor no longer is selling the fake lunar material, his auctions were removed. I would suggest for you to call ebay and handle it directly with them. Here is a phone number that will allow you to speak with a real person: 1-800-701-3229 - Ebay Remember, you will need to provide reasonable amount of proof to have them take action. As far as flaming anyone, I feel that that will only reflect badly on the people that resort to that type of activity and also the members of this list in general. I do think if the proof of guilt is substantial enough, the offender should be removed from this list - by allowing him to remain on this list will only condone his actions. Greg www.wanderingstarmeteorites.com --- On Tue, 12/30/08, JoshuaTreeMuseum wrote: > From: JoshuaTreeMuseum > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD- Catalog of the Antarctic Meteorites VERY Rare Book > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Tuesday, December 30, 2008, 5:52 PM > A respected and important member of the meteorite community > checked out the provenance of the last offerings on eBay by > Bob Evans and they turned out to be shady to say the least. > It looks like Bob Evans was selling stones with fake Monnig > provenance according to his own source. Wouldn't this > constitute fraud on a felony level? Can't something be > done to stop this guy? When he comes back out of hiding > after his latest rip off scams I say flame him until he > crawls back into the scum from whence he came. > > Phil Whitmer > Joshua Tree Earth & Space Museum > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From mexicodoug at aim.com Tue Dec 30 19:49:34 2008 From: mexicodoug at aim.com (mexicodoug at aim.com) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 19:49:34 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD- Catalog of the Antarctic Meteorites VERY Rare Book In-Reply-To: <105D979A1486485BAD4576FBF8E03923@ET> References: <105D979A1486485BAD4576FBF8E03923@ET> Message-ID: <8CB38F8C89792BE-9F0-1168@WEBMAIL-MA19.sysops.aol.com> " I say flame him until he crawls back into the scum from whence he came." Hello Phil, My request to you is a takeout of this order to the list owner, appropriate court, etc. The latter suggestion of spamming 950 list members into the funny farm over and over, because of presumed, judged and execution style vigilantism is just not my cup of tea in these tedious cases, nor systematically feeding avoidable potty-mouthed posts with the best mob morals, or sour grapes or pusses and posses. If an absence of community respect is trumped by a continuing and vicious food fight that the majority relishes, I would be like have my happy meal that the list kindly provides gratis with a standard keyword (I beg your kind sides as a personal favor) in this sort of late bombardment of presumed rogues, such as including the keyword BEWARE in the title of the post. Then at least a few of us who are in a pickle trying to Ketchup with all the positive attributes of this delicious list can filter out these onionskins and stellar flare-ups. As a personal favor! Sorry but the subject has become like an old worn out song that keeps coming back to haunt, and every time I see Bob's name I get this stupid vision of Bob?s Big Boy statue blasting off into space from the top of a hamburger restaurant (I don't remember what B movie that was in). http://images.quickblogcast.com/108258-101114/BigBoyInSky.jpg 0A For the record, the only altercation or business I ever had with Bob was his calling some of my hopeful finds I posted lake rocks like the ones behind his house. Being a sensitive meteorite daddy, and having my babies so insulted destructively, I found peace by having Captain Blood remove me from Meteorite friends so I would not share such company while other meteoroids were hitting the fan. Only God knows the true extent, but this is not a unique problem to one person. It's a tough planet... Best wishes for an authentic, peaceful, rewarding and healthful New Year, druling with stardust on top Doug A respected and important member of the meteorite community checked out the provenance of the last offerings on eBay by Bob Evans and they turned out to be shady to say the least. It looks like Bob Evans was selling stones with fake Monnig provenance according to his own source. Wouldn't this constitute fraud on a felony level? Can't something be done to stop this guy? When he comes back out of hiding after his latest rip off scams I say flame him until he crawls back into the scum from whence he came. -----Original Message----- From: JoshuaTreeMuseum To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 4:52 pm Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD- Catalog of the Antarctic Meteorites VERY Rare Book A respected and important20member of the meteorite community checked out the provenance of the last offerings on eBay by Bob Evans and they turned out to be shady to say the least. It looks like Bob Evans was selling stones with fake Monnig provenance according to his own source. Wouldn't this constitute fraud on a felony level? Can't something be done to stop this guy? When he comes back out of hiding after his latest rip off scams I say flame him until he crawls back into the scum from whence he came.? ? Phil Whitmer? Joshua Tree Earth & Space Museum ? ______________________________________________? http://www.meteoritecentral.com? Meteorite-list mailing list? Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com? http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list? From wpiatek at indy.rr.com Tue Dec 30 20:04:58 2008 From: wpiatek at indy.rr.com (Wendy Piatek) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 20:04:58 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Bob Evans In-Reply-To: <105D979A1486485BAD4576FBF8E03923@ET> References: <105D979A1486485BAD4576FBF8E03923@ET> Message-ID: I couldn't agree more with Phil. I have no idea why he is allowed to continue his communications on this list. We should not continue to look away and let some unsuspecting collector be taken advantage of. It can eventually affect the value of all of our collections. What needs to be done to get Art to remove him from the list. This was brought up in the past but no action was taken. I was hoping he would just pick a different hobby. Not so lucky... Al, Phil,McCartney,Anne,Martin H,Art...Everyone.... What is the next step? Jay Piatek MD ----- Original Message ----- From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" To: Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2008 5:52 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD- Catalog of the Antarctic Meteorites VERYRare Book >A respected and important member of the meteorite community checked out the >provenance of the last offerings on eBay by Bob Evans and they turned out >to be shady to say the least. It looks like Bob Evans was selling stones >with fake Monnig provenance according to his own source. Wouldn't this >constitute fraud on a felony level? Can't something be done to stop this >guy? When he comes back out of hiding after his latest rip off scams I say >flame him until he crawls back into the scum from whence he came. > > Phil Whitmer > Joshua Tree Earth & Space Museum > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From Impactika at aol.com Tue Dec 30 21:15:18 2008 From: Impactika at aol.com (Impactika at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 21:15:18 EST Subject: [meteorite-list] Bob Evans Message-ID: Hello Jay, Joshua, and List members, I would be happy to help, and I certainly wish I had seen those Ebay auctions with a fake Monnig Collection provenance. I just looked on Ebay but did not see them. And I do not check Ebay auctions very often. Maybe one of you can email me if you spot another one, I certainly will check with Art Ehlmann as quickly as possible. I do know that Laurence Garvie is also member of this list, maybe he can alert us if ASU does any trade with Mr Evans. And I'll be glad to talk to our esteemed List-Owner in Tucson. Maybe it will take the collaboration of a lot of members to get this problem resolved. Anne M. Black http://www.impactika.com/ IMPACTIKA at aol.com Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc. http://www.imca.cc/ In a message dated 12/30/2008 6:05:24 PM Mountain Standard Time, wpiatek at indy.rr.com writes: I couldn't agree more with Phil. I have no idea why he is allowed to continue his communications on this list. We should not continue to look away and let some unsuspecting collector be taken advantage of. It can eventually affect the value of all of our collections. What needs to be done to get Art to remove him from the list. This was brought up in the past but no action was taken. I was hoping he would just pick a different hobby. Not so lucky... Al, Phil,McCartney,Anne,Martin H,Art...Everyone.... What is the next step? Jay Piatek MD ----- Original Message ----- From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" To: Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2008 5:52 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD- Catalog of the Antarctic Meteorites VERYRare Book >A respected and important member of the meteorite community checked out the >provenance of the last offerings on eBay by Bob Evans and they turned out >to be shady to say the least. It looks like Bob Evans was selling stones >with fake Monnig provenance according to his own source. Wouldn't this >constitute fraud on a felony level? Can't something be done to stop this >guy? When he comes back out of hiding after his latest rip off scams I say >flame him until he crawls back into the scum from whence he came. > > Phil Whitmer > Joshua Tree Earth & Space Museum **************One site keeps you connected to all your email: AOL Mail, Gmail, and Yahoo Mail. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000025) From almitt at kconline.com Tue Dec 30 21:22:31 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 21:22:31 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Bob Evans In-Reply-To: References: <105D979A1486485BAD4576FBF8E03923@ET> Message-ID: <6AAAD24A1263427F9E56DAF0F3E484C3@StarmanPC> Hi Jay, Phil and other concerned list members. Since this individual keeps showing up on this list and peddling his misrepresented meteorites here (he is substituting certain common falls for rarer types), I'd suggest that people email Art and tell him of your concern. If you have been ripped off by this individual or know of any illegitimate business practices you can email Art here: Art and tell him of your difficulties. I doubt that Art wants someone like this on the list. I plan on emailing him to make a request to have Bob Evans removed and I hope that others will do the same, whether you are a victim or not. Phil did he send his package by mail?? Do you still have the box it was shipped in. If so you can go to the post office and file a mail fraud complaint against him which could land him in jail. Since I live close to you, I'd be glad to help you out with this. We can also bring other documentation to further enforce our side. I'd urge others to do the same. If they see several people filing against the same individual then it will weigh heavily on him. I agree with Mexico Doug that flaming won't make the group look good to perspective aficionados. All my best! --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: "Wendy Piatek" To: Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2008 8:04 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Bob Evans >I couldn't agree more with Phil. > I have no idea why he is allowed to continue his communications on this > list. We should not continue to look away and let some unsuspecting > collector be taken advantage of. It can eventually affect the value of all > of our collections. > What needs to be done to get Art to remove him from the list. > > This was brought up in the past but no action was taken. I was hoping he > would just pick a different hobby. Not so lucky... > > Al, Phil,McCartney,Anne,Martin H,Art...Everyone.... What is the next step? > > > Jay Piatek MD > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2008 5:52 PM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD- Catalog of the Antarctic Meteorites > VERYRare Book > > >>A respected and important member of the meteorite community checked out >>the provenance of the last offerings on eBay by Bob Evans and they turned >>out to be shady to say the least. It looks like Bob Evans was selling >>stones with fake Monnig provenance according to his own source. Wouldn't >>this constitute fraud on a felony level? Can't something be done to stop >>this guy? When he comes back out of hiding after his latest rip off scams >>I say flame him until he crawls back into the scum from whence he came. >> >> Phil Whitmer >> Joshua Tree Earth & Space Museum >> From bobadebt at ec.rr.com Tue Dec 30 21:41:55 2008 From: bobadebt at ec.rr.com (David & Kitt Deyarmin) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 21:41:55 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] WTB: a Single Clear Olivine Crystal Message-ID: I would like to buy a large single olivine crystal to have it made into a charm for my wife's bracelet. I don't know the translation into carat size but I would want the finished measurements to be close to 5mm x 5mm. I would like a green crystal since she already has a citrine charm, which is her birthstone. I have seen them on ebay but don't know if I can trust the sellers, how do you know it's from a meteorite and not created in a lab???? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks From eric at meteoritewatch.com Tue Dec 30 22:12:41 2008 From: eric at meteoritewatch.com (Eric Wichman) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 19:12:41 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteor or Meteorite? CA Fireball! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <495AE329.3050600@meteoritewatch.com> Hi all, I'm following this Merced, CA fireball story closely. If anyone has any info, links, photos, videos, or reports please let me know on-list or off-list. The easiest way to report it is to go to my site where I have a created a map of the sighting area based on eyewitness accounts from SpaceWeather.com. Map: http://www.meteoritesusa.com/blog/meteorite-news/california-fireball-new-meteorite-fall/ Add a comment, click the Report Sighting Link or send me an email if you here anything about this. Responses are greatly appreciated! Regards, Eric Wichman Meteorites USA From John at Cabassi.net Tue Dec 30 22:15:33 2008 From: John at Cabassi.net (John.L.Cabassi) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 19:15:33 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 4024 References: <002101c96946$7757f4d0$4564fea9@TITAN> Message-ID: <002f01c96af6$0fdbec60$4564fea9@TITAN> G'Day Everyone, I just wanted to let all the people who have replied off list to me in regards to the NWA 4024, you all really supplied me with alot of information, more than I expected. Thank you all so much. Have a very Happy and Safe New Year!! Cheers John ----- Original Message ----- From: "John.L.Cabassi" To: Sent: Sunday, December 28, 2008 3:46 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 4024 > G'Day Everyone, > I'd appreciate some help on this one. I try to take one met each weekend > and gather as much information and notes on it. This weekend, it was NWA > 4024. My problem is conflicting amounts of the Total Known Weight. The > piece I received provided the basic information, but the total known > weight was left out. The Met Bull states 38.1 grams, but I've also > noticed on some of Mike's cards, it's placed at 745 grams. > > Can anybody help? I would really appreciate it. > > Thanks in advance. > Cheers, John > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From searchingforfun at sbcglobal.net Wed Dec 31 03:37:01 2008 From: searchingforfun at sbcglobal.net (Brian Cox) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 00:37:01 -0800 Subject: [meteorite-list] AD SALE Meteorite Auctions ending 12/31 on ebay and over the next few days Message-ID: <063801c96b22$f46aa660$4001a8c0@BRIANSCOMPUTER> Hello List Members, I hope everyone is having a Great week! I have several ebay auctions ending 12/31 and over the next few days. Please take a look. FAUCETT METEORITE CHONDRITE 21.5gm CHONDRULES COA IMCA http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=270322572894&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=017 NORTHBRANCH METEORITE CHONDRITE 57.0 gm COA IMCA NICE http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=270322578812&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=017 ESTHERVILLE METEORITE MESOSIDERITE 9.50gm COA IMCA http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=270322587559&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=017 GRETNA METEORITE 46.50 GMS L5 CHONDRITE 1912 HARD TO FIND http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=280297679919&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=018 ATOKA METEORITE 1.518 gm L6 RARE 1945 COA IMCA CRUST http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=280297717500&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=018 SMYER METEORITE RARE 28.35 gm H-6 COA IMCA TEXAS NICE http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=270322843199&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=017 ALLENDE METEORITE CV3 CARBONACE 8.00gm BLACK CRUST IMCA http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=270323345922&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=017 AGOULT METEORITE .61g IMCA ACHONDRITE EUCRITE RARE RARE http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=280297736494&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT&ih=018 Thanks for looking. Brian Cox searchingforfun on ebay IMCA # 6387 From qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au Wed Dec 31 03:03:57 2008 From: qwalkra at mailbox.ezadsl.net.au (Bob WALKER) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 18:03:57 +1000 Subject: [meteorite-list] can we have a thread on regmaglyphted meteorwrongs please Message-ID: <84933BB5834940DB8A1FD4BD8A4ABAA4@your0a700f0aaf> Listoids Checkout my pseudo regmaglyphted meteorwrong (this one from MB) http://qmig.net/meteorwrong.jpg Can other listoids please post pictures of any regmaglyphted meteorwrongs they have... I'd like to beg borrow buy or donate a kidney if you have any spare native iron meteorwrongs or regmaglyphted meteorwrongs so let me know off list if you have any to donate sell or horsetrade... And of course a happy new year to all incl Bob Evans CY From mark at meteorites.cc Wed Dec 31 05:34:12 2008 From: mark at meteorites.cc (Mark Crawford) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 10:34:12 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs Message-ID: <495B4AA4.3010702@meteorites.cc> I was reflecting yesterday on the fun I get showing my collection to guests, and talking about meteorites to non-hobbyists. It got me thinking that there are some standard questions which come up time and again. * "Where do you get them from?" [One of the few opportunities to use the line 'I buy from dealers by the gram' in polite conversation :) ] * "How do you know they haven't just gone to the local DIY store and bought a bag of gravel?" [or various versions of this] * "How do you know it really comes from Mars/the Moon/the asteroids?" ...and I suppose if the conversation comes round to it: * "HOW much???" :) I wondered if other list members had any fun regular (or occasional) ones to share? Mark -- Mark's Meteorite Pages: http://meteorites.cc From rockhoundm at abaconet.com.ar Wed Dec 31 08:20:04 2008 From: rockhoundm at abaconet.com.ar (Eduardo.) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 10:20:04 -0300 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs In-Reply-To: <495B4AA4.3010702@meteorites.cc> Message-ID: One I had several times: "If a meteorite fell in your head will it kill you?" "Was somebody ever been killed by a meteorite?" (they usually go one after the other) I always show the Park Porest Garza stone kit here. also "Were the dinosaurs really been killed by meteorites?" (most of the times by kids who love dinosaurs) Eduardo -----Original Message----- From: Mark Crawford To: Meteorite List Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 10:34:12 +0000 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs > I was reflecting yesterday on the fun I get showing my collection to > guests, and talking about meteorites to non-hobbyists. It got me > thinking that there are some standard questions which come up time and > again. > > * "Where do you get them from?" [One of the few opportunities to use > the line 'I buy from dealers by the gram' in polite conversation :) ] > > * "How do you know they haven't just gone to the local DIY store and > bought a bag of gravel?" [or various versions of this] > > * "How do you know it really comes from Mars/the Moon/the asteroids?" > > ...and I suppose if the conversation comes round to it: > > * "HOW much???" :) > > > I wondered if other list members had any fun regular (or occasional) > ones to share? > > Mark > > -- > Mark's Meteorite Pages: http://meteorites.cc > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoriteguy at yahoo.com Wed Dec 31 10:37:26 2008 From: meteoriteguy at yahoo.com (Michael Farmer) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 07:37:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 4024 In-Reply-To: <002101c96946$7757f4d0$4564fea9@TITAN> Message-ID: <619899.13656.qm@web110608.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> John, it is simple, and typical for Moroccan meteorites. Since the first piece was bought, more pieces have come out. In Morocco one person generally never gets or keeps all of a meteorite. They break them up or sell pieces to many different people, so it takes time for the pieces to work their way out. I often see pieces of the same meteorite hundreds of miles away in different Moroccan villages. So for most meteorites from Morocco, we will likely never know the exact total weight. Michael Farmer --- On Sun, 12/28/08, John.L.Cabassi wrote: > From: John.L.Cabassi > Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 4024 > To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Sunday, December 28, 2008, 4:46 PM > G'Day Everyone, > I'd appreciate some help on this one. I try to take one > met each weekend and gather as much information and notes on > it. This weekend, it was NWA 4024. My problem is conflicting > amounts of the Total Known Weight. The piece I received > provided the basic information, but the total known weight > was left out. The Met Bull states 38.1 grams, but I've > also noticed on some of Mike's cards, it's placed at > 745 grams. > > Can anybody help? I would really appreciate it. > > Thanks in advance. > Cheers, John > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From meteoritefinder at yahoo.com Wed Dec 31 11:09:24 2008 From: meteoritefinder at yahoo.com (Robert Woolard) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 08:09:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Update on New England Fireball of 12-29-08 Message-ID: <770526.3948.qm@web39605.mail.mud.yahoo.com> List, Thanks to several of you who have emailed me with their appreciation for my previous postings on the two recent fireballs/possible falls. I appreciate you guys taking the time to do that. Here is PART of an update on the New England fireball. The map that accompanies the report can be seen by going to: www.spaceweather.com NEW ENGLAND FIREBALL: On Dec. 29th, around 9:30 pm EST, a blue-green fireball 100+ times brighter than Venus soared over New England and exploded colorfully in mid-air. Onlookers saw the flash from at least nine US states: eye-witness reports. Dan Linek of North Bay Shore, New York, was one of the eye witnesses. Combining his own observations with those of others, he created a hand-drawn map of sightings and the probable location of the fireball when it exploded: ********** ( see map at www.spaceweather.com ) ************* If any fragments reached the ground, they might have landed in the western half of Linek's trapezoid. (The meteor was traveling east to west.) Believe it or not, meteors like this are not rare--they are just rarely seen. The New England fireball stands out because it hit a densely populated area only a few hours after sunset. It was bound to be seen. From dave at fallingrocks.com Wed Dec 31 11:13:01 2008 From: dave at fallingrocks.com (Dave Gheesling) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 11:13:01 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs In-Reply-To: <495B4AA4.3010702@meteorites.cc> References: <495B4AA4.3010702@meteorites.cc> Message-ID: Mark/All, Good one here, and the examples could string out a thread for a week. My favorite in doing educational outreach, which comes up all the time after answering another question around how we know the ages of meteorites (i.e. half lives of unstable, decaying radioactive isotopes), is "Are these meteorites radioactive?" (this question usually comes after they've been handling them for quite some time, and it's usually asked by a seemingly concerned teacher). The answer, of course, is "Yes." Panic typically sets in, until they hear "...but no more radioactive than you are." Happy New Year, Dave www.fallingrocks.com -----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Mark Crawford Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2008 5:34 AM To: Meteorite List Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs I was reflecting yesterday on the fun I get showing my collection to guests, and talking about meteorites to non-hobbyists. It got me thinking that there are some standard questions which come up time and again. * "Where do you get them from?" [One of the few opportunities to use the line 'I buy from dealers by the gram' in polite conversation :) ] * "How do you know they haven't just gone to the local DIY store and bought a bag of gravel?" [or various versions of this] * "How do you know it really comes from Mars/the Moon/the asteroids?" ...and I suppose if the conversation comes round to it: * "HOW much???" :) I wondered if other list members had any fun regular (or occasional) ones to share? Mark -- Mark's Meteorite Pages: http://meteorites.cc ______________________________________________ http://www.meteoritecentral.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From raremeteorites at yahoo.com Wed Dec 31 11:25:43 2008 From: raremeteorites at yahoo.com (Adam Hupe) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 08:25:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] AD - Great Items/Last Chance On Many! Message-ID: <625702.95943.qm@web30708.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear List Members, Happy New Years! I would like bring to your attention some great items now listed on eBay. The auctions that are ending today will not be relisted on eBay. My next step will be to place them in an auction house where they more then likely will realize many times my eBay asking price. Several dealers have purchased material like this from me and then ran them in other auction venues for huge profits so I would say they are a sound investment or a rare opportunity to add a world class specimen to your collection. Most other items are started out at just 99 cents for those who have budgets like myself. Click below to see some great auctions: http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/raremeteorites!_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZ MUST SEE - Two Types of Xenoliths in a Single Slice, Studied at NAU, Last Time I Will List This Piece: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140290977932 Three Generous Sized Lunar Meteorite Specimens Started at Just 99 Cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200293285168 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200293298649 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200293299284 Genuine Meteor Crater Stock Certificate - Price Lowered - Will Not Run Again:: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140290977974 Complete Mesosiderite Priced Below My Costs: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200293291916 LUNAR MAIN MASS - Dhofar 910, Legally obtained, Will Not Run Again! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140290977795 Complete Slice of Lunar Meteorite Dhofar 910, Legally obtained, Will Not Run Again! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140290977727 Complete Slice of Lunar Meteorite Dhofar 908, Legally obtained, ROSETTA VERSION - Will Not Run Again! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200291753527 COMPLETE SLICE - MARTIAN METEORITE- NWA 1195 - Largest and Only Complete Slice Left - Will Not Run Again: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140290977910 And Many More Examples Worth Looking at Can Be Found at This Link: http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/raremeteorites!_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZ Thank you for looking and if you are bidding, good luck. Best Regards, ------------------------------------ Adam Hupe The Hupe Collection Team LunarRock IMCA 2185 raremeteorites at yahoo.com From almitt at kconline.com Wed Dec 31 12:25:46 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 12:25:46 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs In-Reply-To: <495B4AA4.3010702@meteorites.cc> References: <495B4AA4.3010702@meteorites.cc> Message-ID: <8C7C4AE6B10F49EE8DEBCE1312CDF603@StarmanPC> Hi Mark and all, One thing I didn't realize for a long time was peoples preception of part slices and small fragments that many of us dealers sort of take for granted. One lady commented to me one time that she was amazed that they could find such a small crumb of Mars I had in my micro mounts (it was Zagami). It then dawned on me that some people see these small micros and think that was the whole piece found. I explained that it was from a much larger specimen that was cut and broke down to sell to micro collectors and that it would be really tough to test such a small piece as it would be mostly consumed and nothing left for sale. I have had other people comment on slices saying they sure are flat looking, not knowing they are looking at a slice being sold from a whole stone. Sure there are other misconceptions when they are looking but now know to let them know the small pieces and slices are cut from much larger specimens. Best!! --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Crawford" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2008 5:34 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs >I was reflecting yesterday on the fun I get showing my collection to >guests, and talking about meteorites to non-hobbyists. It got me thinking >that there are some standard questions which come up time and again. > > * "Where do you get them from?" [One of the few opportunities to use the > line 'I buy from dealers by the gram' in polite conversation :) ] > > * "How do you know they haven't just gone to the local DIY store and > bought a bag of gravel?" [or various versions of this] > > * "How do you know it really comes from Mars/the Moon/the asteroids?" > > ...and I suppose if the conversation comes round to it: > > * "HOW much???" :) > > > I wondered if other list members had any fun regular (or occasional) ones > to share? > > Mark From almitt at kconline.com Wed Dec 31 12:27:01 2008 From: almitt at kconline.com (al mitterling) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 12:27:01 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs In-Reply-To: <495B4AA4.3010702@meteorites.cc> References: <495B4AA4.3010702@meteorites.cc> Message-ID: Hi Mark and all, One thing I didn't realize for a long time was peoples perception of part slices and small fragments that many of us dealers sort of take for granted. One lady commented to me one time that she was amazed that they could find such a small crumb of Mars I had in my micro mounts (it was Zagami). It then dawned on me that some people see these small micros and think that was the whole piece found. I explained that it was from a much larger specimen that was cut and broke down to sell to micro collectors and that it would be really tough to test such a small piece as it would be mostly consumed and nothing left for sale. I have had other people comment on slices saying they sure are flat looking, not knowing they are looking at a slice being sold from a whole stone. Sure there are other misconceptions when they are looking but now know to let them know the small pieces and slices are cut from much larger specimens. Best!! --AL Mitterling ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Crawford" To: "Meteorite List" Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2008 5:34 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs >I was reflecting yesterday on the fun I get showing my collection to >guests, and talking about meteorites to non-hobbyists. It got me thinking >that there are some standard questions which come up time and again. > > * "Where do you get them from?" [One of the few opportunities to use the > line 'I buy from dealers by the gram' in polite conversation :) ] > > * "How do you know they haven't just gone to the local DIY store and > bought a bag of gravel?" [or various versions of this] > > * "How do you know it really comes from Mars/the Moon/the asteroids?" > > ...and I suppose if the conversation comes round to it: > > * "HOW much???" :) > > > I wondered if other list members had any fun regular (or occasional) ones > to share? > > Mark From joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com Wed Dec 31 12:43:12 2008 From: joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com (JoshuaTreeMuseum) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 12:43:12 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs Message-ID: <8C8961D73C0B45B39200E8318519B1DF@ET> Hello and Happy New Year to Al, Mark, and the List: A related question I get a lot is when people see meteorite spheres, they always want to know if they fell that way and how can meteorites be perfectly round. People also are confused about meteors from comets and meteors from the asteroid belt. They always want to know how many stones make it to Earth from the meteor showers. People also comment a lot about how hot meteorites must be when they make it to Earth. They're shocked when I tell them they are more likely to be cold. Phil Whitmer From dmerchan at rochester.rr.com Wed Dec 31 13:08:14 2008 From: dmerchan at rochester.rr.com (Don Merchant) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 13:08:14 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs References: <8C8961D73C0B45B39200E8318519B1DF@ET> Message-ID: <000c01c96b72$c00051e0$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant> Hi List. One of the most difficult questions (ends up a 2 part question) is "how do you know that these are REAL METEORITES".....I explain that I only deal with the top 10 or so Renown Dealers/Collectors in the world. This leads to the 2nd part question..."How do you know these Dealers/Collectors are selling that particular type Meteorite" Hmmmmm.......this has not been an easy question to answer. Though most will supply you with an identification card most do not have an official COA (Certificate of Authenticity) I know that Rob Elliot always supplied a nice looking COA which helped back-up the meteorite sale as authentic. I usually would reply to those asking me if the Dealers I buy from are really selling legit meteorites by saying..."These Dealers (Most of them) send a piece of the meteorite they find to a Laboratory to be analyzed and confirmed before selling them" Still a very hard question to answer. Anyone else run into this question? How do you answer it to your admirers of your collection? Sincerely Don Merchant ----- Original Message ----- From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2008 12:43 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Fun questions, or public FAQs > Hello and Happy New Year to Al, Mark, and the List: > > A related question I get a lot is when people see meteorite spheres, they > always want to know if they fell that way and how can meteorites be > perfectly round. People also are confused about meteors from comets and > meteors from the asteroid belt. They always want to know how many stones > make it to Earth from the meteor showers. People also comment a lot about > how hot meteorites must be when they make it to Earth. They're shocked > when I tell them they are more likely to be cold. > > Phil Whitmer > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov Wed Dec 31 15:44:52 2008 From: baalke at zagami.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 12:44:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [meteorite-list] Dawn Journal - December 30, 2008 Message-ID: <200812312044.MAA05222@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov> http://dawn.jpl.nasa.gov/mission/journal_12_30_08.asp Dawn Journal Dr. Marc Rayman December 30, 2008 Dear Dawncember30ths, Having fulfilled all of its assignments for 2008, the Dawn spacecraft has been unusually quiescent recently. While its operators on faraway Earth have no shortage of work, the probe patiently coasts in its orbit around the Sun, awaiting a brief encounter with Mars on February 17, which will steer it into a new orbit. On October 31, Dawn completed nearly all the ion thrusting that had been planned for 2008. On November 20, mission controllers directed the spacecraft to execute a short maneuver to fine-tune its trajectory. Its only activity since then has been the routine maintenance of the gimbal system used to point ion thruster #1. On December 3, it moved the mechanism through a range of angles to help redistribute lubricant, following the same commands that were used 2 months earlier. As viewed from Earth, Dawn passed through solar conjunction this month, appearing to be very close to the Sun. To visualize the geometry, suppose the Sun were at the center of a clock, with Earth at the end of the hour hand and the spacecraft at the tip of the minute hand. With the relative distances at the time of conjunction, the minute hand would be almost 1.6 times the length of the hour hand - an elegant design indeed. (This analogy applies only for the separation as viewed from Earth under limited circumstances. As explained in an earlier log, while Dawn is indeed farther from the Sun than Earth is, the planet travels more quickly around its orbit than the spacecraft does. This would be more akin to a clock on which the hour hand is longer than the minute hand; such timepieces are back-ordered at Dawn souvenir shops.) When Earth, the Sun, and the spacecraft are on a straight line, such as at 6:00, the Sun and spacecraft would appear to overlap from the perspective of an observer on Earth, near the bottom of the clock. As we noted last month, Dawn would not pass directly behind the Sun, because it does not orbit in the same plane as Earth. Therefore, the precisely linear arrangement of hands at exactly 6:00:00 never occurs. Pushing the clock analogy beyond its limits of usefulness, the minute hand would be bent toward the clock face, so it does not circle in quite the same plane as the hour hand. We shall ignore that enhancement for now but return to this point below. In the meantime, let's consider the arrangements that have occurred. On December 12, when the angle between the Sun and the spacecraft was at its minimum, it would be analogous to the alignment of the hands about 10 seconds from the hour, or the arrangement at 6:00:10. (Remember, this clock only has hour and minute hands; your correspondent types too slowly to be able to construct a useful analogy with a clock that includes a second hand.) When most modern interplanetary craft are within about 2 degrees of the Sun, normal communications may be less reliable. This limitation, which lasted about 2 weeks for Dawn, would correspond to half a minute on either side of 6:00, or between about 5:59:30 and 6:00:30. Despite the powerful interference caused by radio signals passing through the distorting environment of the Sun on their way from the spacecraft to Earth, enough of the transmissions made it through for engineers to confirm that the spacecraft remained healthy throughout the conjunction period. Dawn was programmed to modify its radio transmissions to account for the angle between it and the Sun. Operators chose to accept a reduced return of information from the ship's systems in exchange for boosting the quality of the signals used for navigation because of the upcoming flight by Mars. Some usable navigation data were obtained every day, but, as expected, most of the data, particularly during the 4 days when the spacecraft was nearest the Sun, were too degraded to be useful in refining the parameters of Dawn's orbit. Now, as Earth and the spacecraft have progressed in their separate travels around the Sun (making an angle today equivalent to about 6:01:45 on our Dawn clock), the radio waves traverse a less tortuous path, so the signal quality has improved. After collecting and analyzing more navigational data, engineers will determine what refinement is needed to the trajectory to guarantee Dawn encounters Mars in just the right way to provide the needed gravitational deflection. Following the same procedure applied to the design of Dawn's first trajectory correction maneuver (TCM), the team will begin designing the second TCM early next month for the spacecraft to perform on January 15. In fact, the creative process has already begun; the maneuver has been given the imaginative appellation TCM2. Using those 4 characters (and perhaps a few others as well), the next log will report on the maneuver and provide some details on the nature of Dawn's gravitational interaction with Mars and how it affects the trajectory. The only reason for Dawn to travel to the vicinity of Mars is for the help to reach its targets in the asteroid belt. Nevertheless, as the probe races by, the team will take advantage of the opportunity to accomplish some bonus goals. Some of the plans will be covered in an upcoming log. In the meantime, as the thrill of conjunction begins to fade, our vast staff has yet to sort through all the data on how many terrestrial readers used this convenient alignment to guide their mental eyes toward the spacecraft. The Dawn project sincerely hopes all observers reaped the maximum possible inspiration and joy from solar conjunction, as the mission will not offer another like it. Our destinations, Vesta and Ceres, do not orbit the Sun in the same plane that Earth does, and Dawn must match its orbit to that of its targets. (The major planets orbit closer to the plane of Earth's orbit, and no spacecraft has ventured as far out of that plane to orbit another body as Dawn will.) While the probe is already in a slightly different plane from Earth's orbit now, the gravity of Mars and subsequent ion thrusting will propel it to still a greater angle. As a result, when Dawn and Earth find themselves on opposite sides of the Sun in the future, the alignment will not be as close as it was this month. Dawn's next apparent encounter with the Sun will be in November 2010, but it will appear to pass far enough north of the Sun that communications should not be significantly compromised. Following that, there will be 3 more times before the primary mission ends in 2015 that Earth and the spacecraft will be on opposite sides of the Sun, but in each case Dawn's path through Earth's skies will take it farther north or south of the brilliant landmark than in the 2008 conjunction. Nevertheless, each will be close enough that it may provide a visual reference once again to stir meditation upon the magnificence of a journey far away in the depths of space. Dawn is 11 million kilometers (7 million miles) from Mars. It is 372 million kilometers (231 million miles) from Earth, or 930 times as far as the moon and 2.53 times as far as the Sun. Radio signals, traveling at the universal limit of the speed of light, take 41 minutes to make the round trip. From romanj at sympatico.ca Wed Dec 31 16:10:15 2008 From: romanj at sympatico.ca (Roman) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 16:10:15 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Astronomy Picture of the Day 2008 December 31 References: <8C8961D73C0B45B39200E8318519B1DF@ET> <000c01c96b72$c00051e0$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant> Message-ID: Astronomy Picture of the Day 2008 December 31 http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap081231.html Click on the link and turn your sound up with full screen. Absolutely beautiful! HAPPY NEW YEAR. Roman Jirasek From grf2 at verizon.net Wed Dec 31 22:03:34 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 22:03:34 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Update on New England Fireball of 12-29-08 References: <770526.3948.qm@web39605.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <472C322B41F941488AEDB6DAE7DCA33A@ASUS> Thanks Much Robert. Keep us in the loop. That's only 100+ miles from me!!!!!!!!!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Woolard" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2008 11:09 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Update on New England Fireball of 12-29-08 > List, > > Thanks to several of you who have emailed me with their appreciation for > my previous postings on the two recent fireballs/possible falls. I > appreciate you guys taking the time to do that. > > Here is PART of an update on the New England fireball. The map that > accompanies the report can be seen by going to: > > www.spaceweather.com > > > NEW ENGLAND FIREBALL: On Dec. 29th, around 9:30 pm EST, a blue-green > fireball 100+ times brighter than Venus soared over New England and > exploded colorfully in mid-air. Onlookers saw the flash from at least nine > US states: eye-witness reports. > > Dan Linek of North Bay Shore, New York, was one of the eye witnesses. > Combining his own observations with those of others, he created a > hand-drawn map of sightings and the probable location of the fireball when > it exploded: > > ********** ( see map at www.spaceweather.com ) ************* > > > If any fragments reached the ground, they might have landed in the western > half of Linek's trapezoid. (The meteor was traveling east to west.) > > Believe it or not, meteors like this are not rare--they are just rarely > seen. The New England fireball stands out because it hit a densely > populated area only a few hours after sunset. It was bound to be seen. > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list From grf2 at verizon.net Wed Dec 31 22:10:20 2008 From: grf2 at verizon.net (Jerry Flaherty) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 22:10:20 -0500 Subject: [meteorite-list] Astronomy Picture of the Day 2008 December 31 References: <8C8961D73C0B45B39200E8318519B1DF@ET> <000c01c96b72$c00051e0$6401a8c0@donaldmerchant> Message-ID: <662CC7C8DF204369A875CE1D3E2D2869@ASUS> Roman, How delightful!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roman" To: "metlist" Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2008 4:10 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Astronomy Picture of the Day 2008 December 31 > Astronomy Picture of the Day 2008 December 31 > > http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap081231.html > > Click on the link and turn your sound up with full screen. > Absolutely beautiful! > > HAPPY NEW YEAR. > > Roman Jirasek > > > > > ______________________________________________ > http://www.meteoritecentral.com > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list