[meteorite-list] Orientation, the 1000th re-hash

[Walter Branch]

>The important part of that photo was the

>look on that kids face! He was clearly thrilled at


Yes, Mike.  You are correct.  That was the whole point of the
photo.

Now, about those specks ......... :-)

-Walter Branch

-----------------------------------------------------
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Michael Farmer" <meteoriteguy at yahoo.com>
To: <dave at fallingrocks.com>; <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 12:02 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Orientation, the 1000th re-hash



> Dave, no problem, I think the attack on you was not

> justified, I know that the photo did not show any hint

> of orientation, and perhaps more photos would have

> been good but a request for more photos or explanation

> would have been better. I got a call from Morocco

> today at 5 am about a large oriented meteorite, I

> yawned and told them to email me photos, oriented and

> morrocan-oriented are two very different things. They

> now describe everything as oriented. I applaud your

> outreach work, I wish I had more time to do some of

> those things. The important part of that photo was the

> look on that kids face! He was clearly thrilled at

> holding a huge meteorite. I never saw a meteorite when

> I was a kid.

> Michael Farmer

> --- Dave Gheesling <dave at fallingrocks.com> wrote:

>

>> Mike and List,

>> Mike, thanks for getting this debate -- which

>> emerged for all of the wrong

>> reasons -- onto some quality ground.  There is

>> absolutely no doubt that the

>> term "oriented" is abused and that this is a

>> problem.  It's great to have

>> watch dogs out there, but rabid and presumptive dogs

>> are not much help.  I'd

>> be curious to hear what you think about the piece in

>> question when you see

>> the images I sent you off line (those on my site

>> were taken quickly and with

>> bad lighting, as it's a pain to move that piece

>> around).  There are

>> certainly degrees of orientation, but -- and this is

>> important -- a few

>> seconds of oriented flight is modifying a

>> pre-existing shape (and these are

>> obviously not all consistent, thus Lafayette is not

>> always the result).  Had

>> I known in advance that this would be such a

>> sensitive matter, I'd have

>> either changed the caption (again, the photo had

>> little at all to do with

>> the stone itself) or included other images to show

>> orientation.  Have a

>> great day, everybody...

>> Dave

>>

>> -----Original Message-----

>> From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com

>> [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com]

>> On Behalf Of Michael

>> Farmer

>> Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 11:27 AM

>> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com

>> Subject: [meteorite-list] Orientation, the 1000th

>> re-hash

>>

>> Come on people, this has been a pet peeve of mine

>> for

>> many years. I go on eBay, or I see the Rocks from

>> Space photos all the time, with meteorites claimed

>> to

>> be oriented. Half of these people would not know

>> what

>> oriented was if it fell an embedded in their heads!

>> Dave's stone is nice, not highly oriented, but

>> oriented with the photos on his website. The photo

>> in

>> Rocks from Space showed nothing to suggest

>> orientation.

>>

>>

>> So, let's see some examples on eBay right now!

>> A fine flight-oriented Sikhote-Alin that belongs to

>> me, you can clearly see the hundreds of flow lines

>> emanating from the bullet-nose, flowing back, all in

>> the same direction, which proves the direction of

>> flight to all but the dimmest of collectors. Notice

>> how I take the time and pay for the extra photos?

>> This

>> shows the attributes I want to show on the stone.

>>

> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=140211035108

>>

>>

>>

>>

> http://cgi.ebay.com/Oriented-Sikhote-Alin-METEORITE-with-Rollover-Line_W0QQi

>> temZ180217699381

>> Take this one for example, small rollover rim, but

>> not

>> the slightest hint of orientation, NOT ORIENTED.

>>

>> Here is an oriented Gao stone, note the nice cone

>> shape, and the massive rollover lip and bubbles on

>> the

>> back to prove it! Lipping alone does not make

>> orientation. I have see blocky meteorites with a lip

>> on one side.

>>

> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=350030529345

>>

>> And then there is this one, not the slightest hint

>> of

>> orientation, just a typical rounded complete Gao

>> stone.

>>

> http://cgi.ebay.com/ORIENTED-Gao-Guenie-Meteorite-Burkina-Faso-3-6-Grams_W0Q

>> QitemZ200203882988

>>

>>

> http://cgi.ebay.com/UNCLASSIFIED-Meteorite-Oriented-Individual-84-40g_W0QQit

>> emZ120214504213

>> Here is another one, old chondrite, just becuase it

>> is

>> rounded, does not make it in any way oriented!

>> Please

>> people, this is pitiful.

>>

>> If you are selling a meteorite, you have the duty to

>> properly photograph it to present the stone as it

>> is.

>> Saying it is oriented, and then being too cheap to

>> pay

>> for multiple photographs shows that you do not care

>> about the piece, do not care about your product, and

>> are likely lying about the orientation part.

>> Every time I sell an oriented meteorite on ebay, you

>> will get 6-15 photos showing all sides, aspects,

>> flow

>> lines, lipping, nosecone etc.

>> Buyer beware, if the seller does not show you these

>> things, then do you really think you are going to

>> get

>> them?

>> Michael Farmer

>> ______________________________________________

>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com

>> Meteorite-list mailing list

>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com

>>

> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list

>>

>> ______________________________________________

>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com

>> Meteorite-list mailing list

>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com

>>

> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list

>>

>

> ______________________________________________

> http://www.meteoritecentral.com

> Meteorite-list mailing list

> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com

> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list