[N&W] Re: E8 and other early diesel electrics.

[nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org]

 > Recently I asked about the authenticity of the Rivarossi red 'N&W' E8s, and
 > was told positively that the N&W did not have any E8s of its own, and this
 > livery was imaginary.  It was therefor intriguing to see that the 'favourite
 > train' at the 2000 convention featured an E8 in what is presumably also a
 > fictional paint scheme. Was the train in the 'might have been' class of
 > entries?
 >      On the same subject, Al Seever quoted a forthcoming F7A from Stewart
 > Hobbies in N & W black.  Is not this more imagineering???
 >      Ted Roberts  Stamford, England.

Without doing any deep research I'd like to give a basic answer to both
questions.
The N&W had ex Wabash E8's in solid blue with one yellow stripe along the
side to a V on the nose.  (I hope I am remembering this correctly.}
F7's in different blue and black paint schemes were use almost exclusively
in Canada.  Occasionally they would show up in Buffalo.

Kean Pangman
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Ted,
 From photos I have seen, the Stewart Hobbies F7A is correct. The N&W
rostered some F units after merging with the Wabash railroad. The reason
Stewart Hobbies is doing them now, is they now offer F units without dynamic
brakes. All of their F units before this had dynamic brakes. None of the
Wabash/N&W F units had dynamic brakes to the best of my knowledge. The N&W
did not purchase new any F units, or E units. They did have the former
Wabash F units, and some E units. Some F's got the black paint, some the C&O
inspired blue. Some even blue and gray like when they were Wabash
locomotives. Many, if not all, of the E units were repainted blue, and
recieved N&W lettering. None to my knowledge were ever black, or tuscan red.
Al Seever
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Ted -

N&W's E8s were former Wabash engines, painted in blue with yellow striping
and lettering; they used the "hamburger" heralds.

N&W's F7s also came from the Wabash, and appeared in both blue and black.
So Stewart's engines should be close.

EdKing
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Ted,
as noted before,and as far as I remember there were no E8's in the
tuscan paint and i don't think there was a might have been class,also the F7
sounds like more imagineering as you say.

Stephen Daniel Chesapeake,Va
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Ted:

The train pictured, modeled by Steve Rinear, depicts one of the post-merger
Wabash E-8s, painted in N&W blue. Such a locomotive did indeed exist.
The train itself, being silver, is theoretically "The Tennessean", a Southern
train operated by the N&W between Lynchburg and Bristol. The one stretch
was, to my knowledge, no blue E-8's operated on The Tennessean, (by that
time, the Southern green E's ran straight through) but hey.... it COULD have.
Perhaps there was a power shortage that day....

Jarrell Greever
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N&W did not purchase any diesels until 1955 - pretty
much after the heyday of the carbody type diesels.

N&W owned rostered both the EMD E8 and the EMD F7. N&W
"inherited" these ex-Wabash units after the 1964
merger with NKP/WABASH/P&WV. The E8 units were
repainted in the new blue scheme. Some F7 units were
repainted black, some in the new blue. I don't know of
any F7 units in the black "NW" scheme, but can't say
for sure (this has been hashed on this list a few
times). No merger units were ever painted N&W red.

Here is a roster from December 1968 which reveals two
E8 units remaining and a bunch of F7 units (some F7
units survived well into the mid 1970s):

http://nwry.railfan.net/rosterpix.html

I can't vouch for the accuracy of this roster - but
it's generally accurate.

Hope this helps!

Mark Peele
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Ted:

Actually, while N&W E8's seem elusive, they did exist. When the Wabash
merger was completed, N&W found itself with a few. Unfortunately while I am
at my office, my notes are at home. But Withers and Bowers has a book on
N&W diesels that is really excellent (two volumes, actually), and in one the
E's are shown. The rear of the book has a color section, and shows at least
one E, as I recall. The color was totally blue (which is no surprise
considering where it came from and the time of the merger), with thin gold
stripes. If my memory is serving me right, one was running length-wise
under the grills and one ran along the base of the sides and both came to
the front. I thought it was attractive, though not as dramatic as the more
well-known (in my opinion) gray, blue and white E's of the Wabash, a color
scheme used earlier.

The red Rivarossi E's are interesting. Its true that the N&W did not run
those, but they present a good question of what the road would have done if
they kept using the E's. Personally, I think there is likelihood of their
eventually using the tuscan red as a color on E's if they had really liked
the idea of having them to begin with. Still, running the red E's is poetic
license, and it does look good in modeling.

Please keep in mind too that N&W ran some leased E's from the Atlantic Coast
Line RR and the Richmond, Fredericksburg & Potomac RR. The society had some
lettered correctly for N&W, and the colors were the colors of the roads
where they were actually owned. These are very attractive, and I believe in
the Withers and Bowers book.

If you can find those two volumes somewhere, I'd recommend them highly as
good reference books on N&W early diesels. They are out of print now, but
show up from time to time in various places.

Hope this helps.

John McRae
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Dear Ted,

N&W did not had any EDM/EMC "first generation" diesel (cab unit), but 
leased and
stenciled "Norforl and Westens"on the sides if some ACL E-7 engines.

rgds,

Luiz Affonso
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The N&W got E-8A's and F-7A's from the Wabash. The E-8's were painted Blue
and the F-7's were painted both Black and Blue.
Ed Painter Jr