From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 14 09:46:10 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 06:46:10 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Railway Express and N&W Shenandoah Division
In-Reply-To: <1060325463.145093.1252934043175.JavaMail.root@vms183.mailsrvcs.net>
Message-ID: <740335.62782.qm@web30106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Saturday
Monday, September 14, 2009 9:14 AM
From: "rnnelson1 at verizon.net" <rnnelson1 at verizon.net>
To: f_scheer at yahoo.com

Frank:

Thanks so much for the real nice time on Saturday. 

It was really something to see the station at Boyce, which I never would have thought it to be that big. 

I was thinking about it all the way home and it struck me that Boyce was just about as close as the N&W got to Winchester . In Winchester there was a relatively large Railway Express facility since people shopped by catalogue (Sears, Montgomery Ward etc) and that?s the way they received their merchandise. 

In fact, there was an extra Express car from Washington on the B&O train on Mondays. The B&O train from Brunswick to Strasburg ran daily except Sunday with a Mail, Baggage Express car from Washington. Since there was quite a lot of express held in Washington for distribution in Winchester which had arrived on Saturday and Sunday, the extra Express car was added out of Washington on Mondays. The car would come via Train 11 Wasington to Brunswick and then Train 55 Brunswick to Strasburg or in the case of the extra Express car on Mondays, just to Winchesrter ( it was on the rear and was just cut off).  The cars would return the same day on Train 54 to Brunwick and then Train 32 (Mail and Express train) to Washington.

So if an item was coming via the N&W route to Winchester or another town in the area , my guess is that it would be put off at Boyce and trucked to Winchester for distribution there. Also a good chance that the consignee could also pick it up at Boyce.

Passengers to/from Winchester wanting to use the N&W would no doubt use Boyce. So if I'm right, Boyce was in effect the N&W station for Winchester.  

Just a thought as to why the large REA portion and maybe another reason as to why the size of the whole station itself.

Ric


September 14, 2009

Hello, Ric:

I appreciate the thank you.  I'm pleased that you and others attended and enjoyed the food as well as the evening programs.

While it would be flattering to think that Railway Express from Winchester might have been trucked to Boyce, my belief is that this was unlikely.  Berryville is directly east along Virginia Route 7.  It was a day and night train order office.  If there were such transfers, I think that is the more likely location.

If there were sufficient quantities of express for destinations along the N&W, I'm guessing that it was all dispatched to Washington.  The Washington REA building would have consolidated shipments to make up a sealed REA car from Washingto to Roanoke.  At both locations, cars could be swtiched in and out of the trains within alotted dwell time.

If Boyce's space was fully utilized in its early years after 1913, it's more likely that there were express and LCL freight shipments for Boyce and Millwood plus farms in the immediately surroundng area.

Good morning,

Frank

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 14 12:05:22 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 12:05:22 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Long tunnel
Message-ID: <FD5F3C77FF16483E988CE04AA2CD7450@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 6, 1910

LONGER THAN COALDALE
------
Tunnel Near Cedar Bluff Will be 4,700 Feet--Work to Begin at Once

    The Franklin Contracting Company will send men to work at once on the Cedar Bluff tunnel and the three and one-quarter miles of grading for which they received the contract from the Norfolk and Western.  O. T. Franklin, who was in the city last night, said that the work must be completed in a little over two years and while it is heavy construction his people expect to have it done on contract time.  The tunnel, which is to be 4,700 feet in length, will be nearly 900 feet longer than the Coaldale tunnel, which is the longest tunnel on the Norfolk and Western system.  During the construction of the Coaldale tunnel the contractors struck a thick vein of coal and it is often said in this section that they cleared $75,000 on the job.  No such luck will greet the Franklin construction Company as the coal is above the tunnel and will not be touched during the work.
    As in the case of the Coaldale tunnel a fan will be necessary at the end of the tunnel, but the contract for that will not be let until after the tunnel is completed.  In addition to the work done by the Franklin Contracting Company, about three-fourths of a mile of grading will be done on the Canebrake side of the tunnel.  This work will be let under a separate contract and will permit of the opening of the No. 4 plant of the New River and Pocahontas Consolidated Collieries Company.  J. R. Rich, one of the best engineers in the employ of the Norfolk and Western, will supervise the work for that company.
------
[There are a couple of errors in the article.  First, in 1910 Coaldale tunnel (old Elkhorn tunnel) at 3,015 ft. long was only the third longest tunnel according to a tabulation on p. 78 of Prince's book on the N&W.  The two longer tunnels were Dingess tunnel, 3,327 ft. long, opened 1892 and Pepper tunnel, 3,302 ft. long, opened 1900.  Second, the new tunnel near Cedar Bluff at 4,700 ft. long would be nearly 1,700 feet longer than the Coaldale tunel instead of the "nearly 900 feet longer" as given in the article.  Interestingly, according to Prince's tabulation, five tunnels longer than Coaldale were opened 1931 or later, viz., Raitt tunnel, 3,766 ft. long, opened 1931; Staggerweed tunnel, 4,026 ft. long, opened 1933; Elkhorn tunnel (new), 7,107 ft. long, opened 1950; Sandy Ridge tunnel, 8,268 ft. long, opened 1958 (now closed); Blair tunnel, 3,100 ft. long, opened 1970.]

Gordon Hamilton
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090914/4df1ddc3/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 14 12:15:41 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 12:15:41 -0400
Subject: Railway Express and N&W Shenandoah Division
References: <740335.62782.qm@web30106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8721FBECD1A34BD689D6134D7C51A2D8@DESKTOP>


One of the men who worked nights at Shenandoah Junction up until the end of 
passenger service in 1962 had worked White Post before being assigned to the 
junction.  He told me that White Post handled a lot of Railway Express 
business.  A lot of REA shipments changed hands between N&W 1 & 2 and B&O 
trains at Shenandoah Junction.  Berryville was open 24 hours, so that's a 
logical point where business to Winchester destinations would be handled.

--Rick Morrison 


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 14 15:54:11 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 15:54:11 -0400
Subject: Concord to Lynchburg, VA
Message-ID: <CC8783544E08B540B98FC33F697A75AD2A8C7403@GATUCEXCH01ASV.nscorp.ad.nscorp.com>

Gentleman: Can anyone help me respond to this query?

"I was told by someone that years ago a train track came through Concord, Virginia to Lynchburg, Virginia.
They said the tracks were taken up in the late fifties and maybe early nineteen sixties.
Since the person saying this tends to stretch the truth sometimes.
I thought I would look it up on the Internet but cannot find anything about it.
Is that true what was said?  They said it was taken out when the four lane was put in.
Thank you for any information and forwarding this to the correct person."

Thanks,

Kyle Davis

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090914/30e25280/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 14 17:01:29 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 17:01:29 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Long tunnel
In-Reply-To: <FD5F3C77FF16483E988CE04AA2CD7450@DellVostro>
References: <FD5F3C77FF16483E988CE04AA2CD7450@DellVostro>
Message-ID: <9d5f4ad00909141401i334e432esf8c1eb7249596c6d@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Sep 14, 2009 at 12:05 PM, Gordon wrote:

>  Bluefield Daily Telegraph
> February 6, 1910
> LONGER THAN COALDALE
>
>     The Franklin Contracting Company will send men to work at once on the
> Cedar Bluff tunnel and the three and one-quarter miles of grading for which
> they received the contract from the Norfolk and Western.  O. T. Franklin,
> who was in the city last night, said that the work must be completed in a
> little over two years and while it is heavy construction his people expect
> to have it done on contract time.  The tunnel, which is to be 4,700 feet in
> length, will be nearly 900 feet longer than the Coaldale tunnel, which is
> the longest tunnel on the Norfolk and Western system.  During the
> construction of the Coaldale tunnel the contractors struck a thick vein of
> coal and it is often said in this section that they cleared $75,000 on the
> job.  No such luck will greet the Franklin construction Company as the coal
> is above the tunnel and will not be touched during the work.
>

I did a quick search and found the file on my computer and was puzzled as to
why I hadn't posted it to my website before. At any rate, some brief
background and the contract for the Coaldale tunnel is at
http://filebox.vt.edu/users/bharper/nwrwy/FlattopContract.html Per the
contract, the N&W knew the coal seam was there and planned accordingly -- it
wasn't just stuck by accident as this report seems to imply. In fact, in
1885, W.W. Coe, Chief Engineer of the N&W at the time, suggested exploiting
that coal seam in suggesting one route to reach the other side of Flat Top
Mountain: "By utilizing No. 3 vein for the purposes mentioned we would be
under ground for about 1 1-4 miles and would come out on the western slope
in the coal and by following the stream would be immediately below the coal
vein which is known to exist for many miles."

Bruce in Blacksburg
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090914/bd9f63d2/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 14 20:18:33 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 20:18:33 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Begin tunnel
Message-ID: <594A7E1E52BB4136962492B5DCE30E3D@DellVostro>

BEGIN TUNNEL AT ONCE
------
E. J. Perkins Goes to Kimball to Supervise Construction

    E. J. Perkins, of the Rinehart & Dennis Company, was in the city last night and will leave this morning for Kimball where he will supervise the work of building the Kimball tunnel.  The work will be started at once.  This company had a contract for the work some time ago but following the retrenchment policy then in vogue on this road the work was delayed until the present time.
    J. R. Serpell & Sons will also start work at once on the tunnel near Landgraff and the work will be pushed as far as possible.  It will take fully a year to complete the job and the Serpell contract may take longer.
------
Gordon Hamilton
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090914/3029d41e/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 14 14:37:49 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 14:37:49 -0400
Subject: Lettering color on early steam
In-Reply-To: <1041D15F5710485B8F7D56B33F733D98@StudyComputer>
References: <mailman.7.1248796807.71201.nw-mailing-list@nwhs.org><C6BD0157-B6FC-41F5-949B-7DBFD144750A@oscalemag.com><F96C1E47B459467D9CB9972C1C4C24A5@StudyComputer><2649CFC887C144E29F547CA7A2C98CD2@silver><COL103-W21CB372FAC1271D030F36EAFE90@phx.gbl><DB0BF3202C8943D194F50468FAC20674@071927350f>
	<1041D15F5710485B8F7D56B33F733D98@StudyComputer>
Message-ID: <B7E837FB2DFD46A88BA51339A7422212@071927350f>

Larry; The article from Charlie Schlotthober from about two years ago
covering the use of aluminum paint on passenger locomotives and the eventual
standardization of the tender side lettering in 1941 in imitation gold paint
has internal memos from N&W officials that refer to the use of gold paint on
the 1900's freight locomotives and not gold leaf.  

 

One would also have to think that the time to paint lettering in gold paint
would be much less than applying gold leaf and adhesive to the locomotive
cab side.  Paint as a technology didn't really develop until the early
1900's and started in Germany as a section of their developing chemical
technology and chemical business.  Gold leaf was probably the way to go in
the 1800's comparing the results to 1880 paint.  But, by the early 1900's,
wouldn't paint be likely and lower cost in material and application time?  

 

Thinking this way, when might the change over from gold leaf to gold paint
have occurred?

 

Gary Rolih

Cincinnati

 

 

  _____  

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 7:20 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: Lettering color on early steam

 

Gary

 

   " This was not used on locomotives" 

 

What do you base this statement on? I do not have any first hand knowledge
about Locomotive lettering with gold leaf.

But I do know for fact the N&W and C&O used real gold leaf in passenger
applications. And would think it would

be in the realm of possibility that in the day they may have use it on
passenger locomotives as the drawing suggest.

 

Larry

 

 

 

----- Original Message ----- 

From: NW <mailto:nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>  Mailing List 

To: 'NW <mailto:nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>  Mailing List' 

Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2009 5:50 PM

Subject: RE: Lettering color on early steam

 

Strictly speaking gold leaf is gold beaten extensively between two sheets of
leather so that it forms an extremely thin sheet, about 0.001" thick and
thinner. Gold is a very soft, plastic metal in pure form.  This thin sheet
would be cut up adhesively applied to jewelry and furniture.  This
technology goes back centuries.  This was not used on locomotives.  Too
expensive.

 

Gold leaf paint is paint that has actual 'ground-up' powder of actual gold
metal in it as the pigment.  Thus, it is costly.

 

"Gold" paint today has some other ground up mineral as the powder that
mimics the color and reflectivity of gold (Au) but doesn't cost that much.
Iron Pyrite (all that glitters is not gold) used to be part of the pigment
but that too became too costly.

 

DULUX gold paint is a yellow pigmented paint that is not based on a metallic
pigment.  But, it looks gold-like.  Cheaper.

 

Gary Rolih

Cincinnati

 

 


  _____  


From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2009 12:00 PM
To: Norfolk Western Mailing List
Subject: RE: Lettering color on early steam

 

In generic terms, what is gold leaf comprised of? and how is it applied to
the prototypes?
 
Thanks,
Dave Willis
(blt 1962, c/n 4)
 
> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
> Subject: Re: Lettering color on early steam
> Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 06:20:27 -0400
> From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
> 
> It appears to me, that in VERY early photos of N&W locomotives (perhaps 
> freight only) that the lettering is white rather than gold, for example
the 
> picture of the first loco produced by Roanoke. Anyone else have data?
> Jim Cochran
> dcochran116 at roadrunner.com
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 9:20 PM
> Subject: Re: Lettering color on early steam
> 
> 
> > Joe
> >
> > I have drawing F1154 Oct 24 1884 shows gold leaf on passenger tenders 
> > and gold paint on
> > fright locomotive tenders
> >
> > Larry Evans
> > Kenova, WV
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> > To: <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> > Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2009 5:04 PM
> > Subject: Lettering color on early steam
> >
> >
> >> Gentlemen,
> >> I've been asked by a model company to supply info about the lettering
on 
> >> early N&W steam. My information is that the lettering color on both 
> >> passenger and freight pre-1900 steam was gold leaf. Can anyone confirm 
> >> or deny that?
> >> Thanks
> >> Joe Giannovario
> >> O Scale Trains Magazine
> >> ________________________________________
> >> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> >> To change your subscription go to
> >> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> >> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> >> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


  _____  


HotmailR is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. Try it now.
<http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=PID23391::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:
WM_HYGN_faster:082009> 


  _____  


________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To change your subscription go to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090914/a0cf5507/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 03:46:36 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 00:46:36 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Railway Express
In-Reply-To: <853788937.42827.1252991252362.JavaMail.root@vms228.mailsrvcs.net>
Message-ID: <595827.64036.qm@web30103.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Re: Express
Tuesday, September 15, 2009 1:07 AM
From: "rnnelson1 at verizon.net" <rnnelson1 at verizon.net>
To: f_scheer at yahoo.com

Frank:

Yes, if Boyce was just a flag stop, I'd say that would rule it out as being "the stop for Winchester" Yes, Berryville sounds much better.
As far as Shenandoah Jct goes, there was a ton of express and mail as well exchanged between N&W's 1 and 2 and the B&O. The mail from N&W 1 went on B&O Train 7. 

Ric


September 15, 2009

Thanks for your observations, Rick.

An interesting aside: I have the post office unit from Gaylord, which was a non-stop mail exchange from most trains, about three miles north of Berryville.  On it is a small sign "subscribe here to the Baltimore Sun."

I've thought about how with the mail transfer at Shenandoah Junction, the Sun had an entre in northwestern Virginia.  Of course, the Washington Post could have been dispatched via the B&O as well, but it's still interesting to me that via the connecting RPO service, the Sun was distributed to points outside an area that one might otherwise consider.

Good morning,

Frank



From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 14 23:06:11 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 23:06:11 -0400
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
Message-ID: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>

RailPictures.net image of N&W GP40 #1372 with a tuscan red passenger train 
in tow. Remarks claim its a commuter train?? Did the N&W do commuter 
service in Chicago? Sharp looking train for a commuter. :-)

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=297255

- Roger Link (who knows little about N&W passenger service)

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 08:24:46 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 08:24:46 -0400
Subject: Concord to Lynchburg, VA
In-Reply-To: <CC8783544E08B540B98FC33F697A75AD2A8C7403@GATUCEXCH01ASV.nscorp.ad.nscorp.com>
References: <CC8783544E08B540B98FC33F697A75AD2A8C7403@GATUCEXCH01ASV.nscorp.ad.nscorp.com>
Message-ID: <BLU113-W2294AE5F1A11751C92EE079DE30@phx.gbl>



Are you talking about the old passenger line that left the mainline around Concord and rejoined it at Forest after passing through downtown Lynchburg where the passenger station was at that time? 


To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 15:54:11 -0400
Subject: Concord to Lynchburg, VA
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org





Gentleman: Can anyone help me respond to this query?
 
?I was told by someone that years ago a train track came through Concord, Virginia to Lynchburg, Virginia.
They said the tracks were taken up in the late fifties and maybe early nineteen sixties.
Since the person saying this tends to stretch the truth sometimes.
I thought I would look it up on the Internet but cannot find anything about it.
Is that true what was said?  They said it was taken out when the four lane was put in.
Thank you for any information and forwarding this to the correct person.?
 
Thanks,
 
Kyle Davis
 
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090915/16138ff1/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 09:54:20 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 09:54:20 -0400
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
In-Reply-To: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>
References: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>
Message-ID: <8CC042328508C90-3330-B677@webmail-d090.sysops.aol.com>




-----Original Message-----
From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Mon, Sep 14, 2009 11:06 pm
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?


RailPictures.net image of N&W GP40 #1372 with a tuscan red passenger train in tow. Remarks claim its a commuter train?? Did the N&W do commuter service in Chicago? Sharp looking train for a commuter. :-)?
?

Yes, indeed.? NW operated a commuter service from Orland Park to LaSalle Street Station five days a week.

It was known on the Decatur Division as the "poor boy".? After Friday's arrival at Orland Park, the crew

would bring engine and cars back to Decratur??for service.? The crew would leave early Monday AM to

arrive at Orland Park to take the commuters to Chicago.?? The crew had quarters at Orland Park for

the four nights they spent away-from-home.? According to Bill Bridger, a Supt who'd started in engine

service on the Wabash, the fireman on "the poor boy" had a day job at an upscale Chicago department

store.?? From memory, the passenger cars had two seats on one side of the aisle and three on the

other.?? Believe service is now provided by the city of Chicago.???????????????????? Harry Bundy
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090915/67c2dd6d/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 10:07:25 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:07:25 -0400
Subject: Concord to Lynchburg, VA
In-Reply-To: <CC8783544E08B540B98FC33F697A75AD2A8C7403@GATUCEXCH01ASV.nscorp.ad.nscorp.com>
References: <CC8783544E08B540B98FC33F697A75AD2A8C7403@GATUCEXCH01ASV.nscorp.ad.nscorp.com>
Message-ID: <8CC0424FC3A59E2-3330-B9BC@webmail-d090.sysops.aol.com>






________________________________________

The Old Main Line diverted from the present line a mile east of

Concord at Phoebe.  Can't say that it was four-laneing US 460 

that resulted in the abandonment of the Old Main Line.  The OML

was abandoned in segments.  There was a quarry east of the James

River that N&W served well into the 70's.   Eventually, the line

was abandoned from the quarry to Island Yard.  Incidentally, had

the C&O/N&W merger been fulfilled, there was a planned connection

from the C&O at James to the N&W so that coal could be directed

to Lamberts Point.  The abandoned line was visible from US 460,

but barely a trace remains.  The N&W crossed US 460 jut east of

Moody Moving & Storage at Concord.  Harry Bundy 



-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090915/87c93127/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 10:34:45 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:34:45 -0400
Subject: Concord to Lynchburg, VA
In-Reply-To: <BLU113-W2294AE5F1A11751C92EE079DE30@phx.gbl>
References: <CC8783544E08B540B98FC33F697A75AD2A8C7403@GATUCEXCH01ASV.nscorp.ad.nscorp.com>
	<BLU113-W2294AE5F1A11751C92EE079DE30@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY143-W13E8B90F020E5D272DF0BBA8E30@phx.gbl>


Good morning friends, 

     I'll start answering this question briefly since I'm working. Ha! Yes, the tracks came through Concord, Va. Forest, Va. is the West end of the connection of the old N&W mainline {some of it is still currently being used to serve local industry off of Rt. 221} and the beltline. Phoebe Pond is the East end of the connection where the old mainline and the beltline came back together. The N&W went East out of Lynchburg, Va.'s N&W Island Yard and headed East towards 6 Mile Bridge at Mt. Athos. From Mt. Athos it went through a rock quarry then crossed over Rt. 460 East just West of Concord. It crossed Rt. 460 and went into Concord. You can still see the old mainline going under a filled in section of Rt. 24 near to Carson's Hardware store. The Concord Station was moved up into a person's yard and is still standing. The original mainline tracks that went by the Concord Station were used as a siding for a pulp wood company for years. Those tracks joined the N&W beltline {circa 1913?], currently NS mainline, at Phoebe Pond just off of Phoebe Pond Road off Rt. 460 West towards Appomattox, Va. I have been told that Phoebe Pond is where the steam locos took on water. Lee Hawkins, Blue Ridge Chapter member recalls watching the last N&W passenger train arriving at Lynchburg's 9th Street Union Station on it's last westbound run in December 1964. It would have gone by the Concord Station westbound towards Roanoke, Va. from points East that included Appomattox, Farmville and it's High Bridge, Crewe, Petersburg and Norfolk. I don't know the dates that the tracks were pulled up on Island Yard or over Rt. 460 but I'm sure Blue Ridge Chapter member and local railroad historian Aubrey Wiley would know. Please feel free to contact me if you have any specific questions and I'll and get you in touch with the local old timers! 

Liability Disclosure: I can't be held responsible for memory lapses by me or my fellow Blue Ridge Chapter members! Ha!

Have to go back to work! 

Take care, 

Norris Deyerle 

National Director

Blue Ridge Chapter, NRHS

Lynchburg, Va.

BRC, NRHS Website: www.blueridgenrhs.org            
 


To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
Subject: RE: Concord to Lynchburg, VA
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 08:24:46 -0400
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org




Are you talking about the old passenger line that left the mainline around Concord and rejoined it at Forest after passing through downtown Lynchburg where the passenger station was at that time? 


To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2009 15:54:11 -0400
Subject: Concord to Lynchburg, VA
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org





Gentleman: Can anyone help me respond to this query?
 
?I was told by someone that years ago a train track came through Concord, Virginia to Lynchburg, Virginia.
They said the tracks were taken up in the late fifties and maybe early nineteen sixties.
Since the person saying this tends to stretch the truth sometimes.
I thought I would look it up on the Internet but cannot find anything about it.
Is that true what was said?  They said it was taken out when the four lane was put in.
Thank you for any information and forwarding this to the correct person.?
 
Thanks,
 
Kyle Davis
 
_________________________________________________________________
Ready for Fall shows? Use Bing to find helpful ratings and reviews on digital tv's.
http://www.bing.com/shopping/search?q=digital+tv's&form=MSHNCB&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MSHNCB_Vertical_Shopping_DigitalTVs_1x1
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090915/68bf77be/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 10:57:45 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 10:57:45 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Concord to Lynchburg, VA
Message-ID: <26666009.1253026665774.JavaMail.root@wamui-hunyo.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090915/cdfc5115/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 12:29:59 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 12:29:59 -0400
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
In-Reply-To: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>
Message-ID: <20090915162959.1YIRF.398200.root@hrndva-web22-z01>

N&W took over the former Wabash commuter service which operated from Chicago to Orland Park.

EdKing
---- NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> wrote: 
> RailPictures.net image of N&W GP40 #1372 with a tuscan red passenger train 
> in tow. Remarks claim its a commuter train?? Did the N&W do commuter 
> service in Chicago? Sharp looking train for a commuter. :-)
> 
> http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=297255
> 
> - Roger Link (who knows little about N&W passenger service)
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 12:23:36 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 12:23:36 -0400
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
In-Reply-To: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>
References: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>
Message-ID: <b2a775a60909150923v6956ef35v6d5bb2aee17beaf1@mail.gmail.com>

Commuter train is a term that may have changed its meaning over time.
When I was growing up, I believe the New Haven 5:05APM from Boston to
points south was considered a commuter train.
-----------------
Gary L. Misch
Commander, USN (ret.)
Syria, VA




On Mon, Sep 14, 2009 at 11:06 PM, NW Mailing List
<nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> wrote:
> RailPictures.net image of N&W GP40 #1372 with a tuscan red passenger train
> in tow. Remarks claim its a commuter train?? Did the N&W do commuter service
> in Chicago? Sharp looking train for a commuter. :-)
>
> http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=297255
>
> - Roger Link (who knows little about N&W passenger service)
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 14:01:58 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 14:01:58 -0400
Subject: High Bridge
In-Reply-To: <26666009.1253026665774.JavaMail.root@wamui-hunyo.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <26666009.1253026665774.JavaMail.root@wamui-hunyo.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <8CC0445C097D7A2-677C-3867D@webmail-d078.sysops.aol.com>


While checking?out this Lynchburg bypass discussion?on?google maps, I followed the track East to see what was happening at High Bridge and was surprised to see that the bridge is still there but there's no track. I know I'm not?up-to-date on N&W alignments, but I thought I would have known whether High Bridge was still in service. I didn't.



When did traffic over the bridge end? What is the fate of the bridge? Any portion still there?



Ted Goodman, Columbus


-----Original Message-----
From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Tue, Sep 15, 2009 10:57 am
Subject: Re: Concord to Lynchburg, VA



Kyle:
Yes and no. There was another track. It was phase out in the late sixties/early seventies simply because it was out of date not because of a four lane highway. And, It had grades on it and a very low clearance (circa 1851-original) tunnel. The ROW is now a VERY nice bike trail. If you look at the google map per my link, you will see basically the northeast edge of Lynchburg. The original N&W (really Virginia & Tennessee, Southside) tracks roughly followed, from the west (left side on the map)? Blackwater Creek to the James River. That's the river on the map. It followed the James through downtown Lynchburg and proceeded east toward Concord. In Lynchburg, it crossed over to Percivals island where the shops, yard and offices were (foundations still there). It followed the island downstream then crosses to the north side of the river. It continued on to Concord from there after crossing the james once more. Around 1908, the N&W placed into service the high line route coming off 
 at Forest and reconnecting at Pheobe (Concord). This eliminated the tortuous dip through the river bottom. You can zoom in and out on the map to locate Forest and Concord. One thing about Google maps, they have a tendency to show rr tracks long gone. Here it is a benefit as it shows some of the original route and the newer line. All facilities were relocated to the newer line such as the train station (Lynchburg, still there- modern steel building on Woodall Road) and Kinney Yard. BTW, the Concord station is privately owned and has been moved but viewable from the road.
Google map:
http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=37.40371,-79.105339&spn=0.061227,0.109005&z=13

Also see:
http://www.retroweb.com/lynchburg/rails.html
This is a fascinating website by Kipp Teague is about Lynchburg and other local stuff.

Bikers:
http://www.lynchburgva.gov/Index.aspx?page=506

We had the NWHS Convention here in 02 and I think everyone had a good time particular having BBQ on a V&T President's (Owens)? house lawn (Point of Honor) and being a matter of FEET from where the Southside and the V&T joined to become the N&W!

Any more questions please ask.
Charlie Long
Lynchburg



-----Original Message----- 
From: NW Mailing List 
Sent: Sep 14, 2009 3:54 PM 
To: "'nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org'" 
Subject: Concord to Lynchburg, VA 







________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To change your subscription go to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090915/199227e4/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 15:20:32 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 15:20:32 EDT
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
Message-ID: <d69.4c2d4f47.37e14300@aol.com>

Harry,
 
I had the pleasure of meeting a Bill Bridger. He was Superintendent on the  
Shenandoah Division in 1978. Bill had a natural grin as he talked to you. 
He was  running a Southbound at Nace, VA during the strike of '78 and had 
pulled a  knuckle right at the top of the grade. When I first saw the 
locomotives  they were running repeatedly north and south within sight of their 
disabled  train. My curiosity got me and being a young eager railfan I stopped to 
see what  was going on. Seems the lead unit had no sand so they were 
sanding the rails  with the second unit. Mr. Bridger and the other fellow had 
hauled the  replacement knuckle back about 15 cars but couldn't get something in 
the drawbar  to lift so they could get the new one in. I offered to help, 
remember I did say  young and eager..., and took the flag they had used to 
carry the knuckle and  stuck one end in the drawbar, gave it a twist, and the 
part lifted. With the  knuckle replaced they recoupled. My reward was a 
short cab ride back to the  crossing.
 
As far as the commuter cars, the Roanoke Chapter, NRHS acquired No. 1009.  
Our car had two seats per side but they were spaced very close to the seat 
in  front.
 
Thanks,
 
Richard D. Shell
Troutville, VA
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090915/b2d7a58b/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 13:28:23 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 13:28:23 -0400
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
In-Reply-To: <20090915162959.1YIRF.398200.root@hrndva-web22-z01>
References: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>
	<20090915162959.1YIRF.398200.root@hrndva-web22-z01>
Message-ID: <F39D6F635E504AD9B795E6B528D2EBBD@071927350f>

Yep, came out of Dearborn station until Dearborn was closed Moved to Union
and RTA took over the service.   The line/service extends well past Orland
Park now with the growth of the suburbs.  

Gary Rolih
Cincinnati

 
-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 12:30 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?

N&W took over the former Wabash commuter service which operated from Chicago
to Orland Park.

EdKing
---- NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> wrote: 
> RailPictures.net image of N&W GP40 #1372 with a tuscan red passenger train

> in tow. Remarks claim its a commuter train?? Did the N&W do commuter 
> service in Chicago? Sharp looking train for a commuter. :-)
> 
> http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=297255
> 
> - Roger Link (who knows little about N&W passenger service)
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/

________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To change your subscription go to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: N&W 1371 color action Chicago IL 071079.jpg
Type: image/jpeg
Size: 34961 bytes
Desc: not available
Url : <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090915/6738c078/attachment-0001.jpg>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 16:11:37 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 16:11:37 -0400
Subject: FW: Concord-Forest
Message-ID: <4AAFF4F9.2030508@vt.edu>


Hi N&WHS,
      I just got this nice email from one of the founding officers of the 
Blue Ridge Chapter, NRHS, Mr. Gene Campbell. Gene is also a very well 
respected photographer here in the Lynchburg area. Gene's retired now but 
still attends our BRC, NRHS meetings regularly. I want to thank the man who 
asked the original "Concord-Lynchburg" question! He sure woke up the 
hibernating railfans here in Lynchburg! Ha! I've enjoyed reading the 
comments. That's why they call our groups railroad historical societies 
isn't it?
Take care,
Norris Deyerle
National Director
Blue Ridge Chapter, NRHS

=================================================================

Subject: Re: Concord-Forest

Norris,  What I am going to say comes from a brain that aches most of the 
time and is QUITE old. In the 40's I worked at Phoebe and Forest.  Phoebe 
was an arm strong plant.West bd left Phoebe and came by Concord and on in 
to Island and the Forest A Mr. Cross was the agent at Concord. Every day 
there was East a "turn around train" which came by Forest and at Phoebe 
would drop off cars for the East and turn around and come west and pick up 
Island and then head to Roke. I think I have this correctThere are tracks 
on old line from west of Langhorne Rd overpass on west to Forest. A local 
services the two cement plants and Frito Lay. Maybe others. Clay and Ito 
Siding I believe were flag stops. East bd app Forest heading downtown were 
routed on to middle track and then about the station were rted on down the 
old line.Forest was an interesting place( and I didn't own a camera) Powder 
trains and troop trains coming east and troop and freight going west. I 
remember one day going to work at Forest and there were 8 trains on the 
board. And  you better not slow one down or you were in trouble.I'm pretty 
sure all of this is true. All aboard! Wish I hadn't gotten sick and had a 
camera, What a show I could put on.

GENE

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 16:21:43 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 16:21:43 -0400
Subject: More Lynchburg questions
Message-ID: <540e48700909151321p6edbd822o2d97abe255483915@mail.gmail.com>

Seeing this exchange of information sparks me to ask about the
Southern Railway's original mainline thru Lynchburg vis the Orange
Bridge. I know the new alignment was in service by and before Kemper
first opened in November 1912 and the old line across the James was
also in service at that time. The old line (Orange Bridge) was gone by
or before September 1934.

I know this isn't strictly N&W but any assistance will be appreciated
as the old Southern line also connected with the N&W in places. I also
am well aware that the part from the Kemper station area still exists
down to the CSX connection but no longer crosses the river and that's
the crux of the question. Any narrowing of dates will be greatly
appreciated.

Please feel free to contact me off-list if you desire at ORLCo96782 at yahoo.com

Thank you.

Bob Cohen

> Good morning friends,
>
> ? ? I'll start answering this question briefly since I'm working. Ha! Yes, the tracks came through Concord, Va. Forest, Va. is the West end of the connection of the old N&W mainline {some of it is still currently being used to serve local industry off of Rt. 221} and the beltline. Phoebe Pond is the East end of the connection where the old mainline and the beltline came back together. The N&W went East out of Lynchburg, Va.'s N&W Island Yard and headed East towards 6 Mile Bridge at Mt. Athos. From Mt. Athos it went through a rock quarry then crossed over Rt. 460 East just West of Concord. It crossed Rt. 460 and went into Concord. You can still see the old mainline going under a filled in section of Rt. 24 near to Carson's Hardware store. The Concord Station was moved up into a person's yard and is still standing. The original mainline tracks that went by the Concord Station were used as a siding for a pulp wood company for years. Those tracks joined the N&W beltline {circa 1
> ?913?], currently NS mainline, at Phoebe Pond just off of Phoebe Pond Road off Rt. 460 West towards Appomattox, Va. I have been told that Phoebe Pond is where the steam locos took on water. Lee Hawkins, Blue Ridge Chapter member recalls watching the last N&W passenger train arriving at Lynchburg's 9th Street Union Station on it's last westbound run in December 1964. It would have gone by the Concord Station westbound towards Roanoke, Va. from points East that included Appomattox, Farmville and it's High Bridge, Crewe, Petersburg and Norfolk. I don't know the dates that the tracks were pulled up on Island Yard or over Rt. 460 but I'm sure Blue Ridge Chapter member and local railroad historian Aubrey Wiley would know. Please feel free to contact me if you have any specific questions and I'll and get you in touch with the local old timers!
>
> Liability Disclosure: I can't be held responsible for memory lapses by me or my fellow Blue Ridge Chapter members! Ha!
>
> Have to go back to work!
>
> Take care,
>
> Norris Deyerle
> National Director
>Blue Ridge Chapter, NRHS
>Lynchburg, Va.
>
> BRC, NRHS Website: www.blueridgenrhs.org
>
> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
> Subject: RE: Concord to Lynchburg, VA
> Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 08:24:46 -0400
> From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>
> Are you talking about the old passenger line that left the mainline around Concord and rejoined it at Forest after passing through downtown Lynchburg where the passenger station was at that time?
>
> Gentleman: Can anyone help me respond to this query?
>
> ?I was told by someone that years ago a train track came through Concord, Virginia to Lynchburg, Virginia.
> They said the tracks were taken up in the late fifties and maybe early nineteen sixties.
> Since the person saying this tends to stretch the truth sometimes.
> I thought I would look it up on the Internet but cannot find anything about it.
> Is that true what was said? ?They said it was taken out when the four lane was put in.
> Thank you for any information and forwarding this to the correct person.?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Kyle Davis

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 16:52:07 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 16:52:07 -0400
Subject: Concord-Forest
Message-ID: <4AAFFE77.2000006@vt.edu>

OK, You guys can go back into hibernation now! My poor brain is overloaded! 
Here's BRC, NRHS member Lee Hawkins latest memory.

Norris Deyerle
National Director
Blue Ridge Chapter, NRHS

==========================================================

The train that Gene called the ?turn around train? was still alive in the 
60?s and beyond, it was called the ?Phoebe Turn? (freight only). It would 
run from Roanoke to Lynchburg (ole main line) to Phoebe go around the 
Phoebe Y and return to Roanoke by way of Kinney yard (belt line) with no 
effort. I think this train picked up and set off transfers from other 
railroads like C&O (transferred cars downtown, ole main line) and Southern 
(transferred cars at Kinney, belt line) and back to Roanoke for the West.

My dad was the guru on transfers (freight car and train movements), since 
he would set up Southern transfers with other roads. He did this long 
before he moved to Kemper street station and passenger service(I was 16 
when he took the job at Kemper) . I would get the story almost every night 
up to then. ?Dad where do the box cars go??

FYI: Both Phoebe and Forest had  Y?s so trains could turn from one line(ole 
main line) to the other (belt line) or whichever all the time.


How do you like this?????


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 17:41:32 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 17:41:32 -0400
Subject: Engine "Slippery-ness"
Message-ID: <616A17CC-7D28-44DD-96A3-F7587DE76A3B@earthlink.net>

I know factor of adhesion is the ruling factor of slippery-ness in  
locomotives.   How much of this feature was because of the engineers  
handling of the engine?

I see on the may videotapes and DVD's the society sells the Y6b's  
slipping a front engine or an A class slipping a rear engine and I'm  
sure the engineer is right on the throttle to back it off  a notch or 2.
The engines of lesser boiler pressure are not so slippery but thats  
due to less push on the cylinders.

How touchy was the handling of the power right at the theoretical  
limits of their design?

I know of lots of things which limit some engines, like back pressure  
and counterweight limitations because of wheel diameter, but these  
factors don't interfere with the slipperiness.

I'm very interested in what it was like to be the engineer or fireman  
on several N&W Locomotives.
Pushers, Mine runs, and time freights all interest me.

I model the 1930's for the look of the engines.  The K3's and Z1's are  
wonderful.
My favorite is the M2c and M class engines.

I may end up designing a fleet of them based on my Sunset brass one.


Mark Lindsey
y3a at earthlink.net




From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 19:04:16 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 16:04:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Engine "Slippery-ness"
In-Reply-To: <616A17CC-7D28-44DD-96A3-F7587DE76A3B@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <863370.51923.qm@web31807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I may get zapped on this by those with first-hand experience, but IMO factor of adhesion is not the ruling factor in predicting a locomotive's propensity to slip.

N&W operated locomotives with FA's far less than the so-called magic number of 4.0 (which is an average number, not an absolute figure).  As a company, it didn't seem to have any problems keeping the A, J and Y5-Y6 classes on their feet, so-to speak. It's always sounded to me as if locomotive control is a general mixture of handling (engineer skill), track condition (geometry and maintenance), rail condition (clean, wet, icy, etc), locomotive condition (maintenance, preparation) and likely many other factors.  Let any one of these go to pot, and you may end up with a hard-handle-locomotive.  N&W seemed to have these variables under daily control and was therefore able to use locomotives that would be slippery based solely on numerical indicators.  Based on research, it seems as if engineer skill is a big factor overall.  There are stories relating how the same locomotive was flogged over a division with considerable complaining by one engineer.  On the
 next division (same train assignment), the same locomotive exhibited no deficiencies because of more skilled operation.

I'm as interested as Mark in hearing what those with real-world experience can add to this.  I'm just an observer and number cruncher.

Dave Stephenson


--- On Tue, 9/15/09, NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> wrote:

> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Subject: Engine "Slippery-ness"
> To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 15, 2009, 5:41 PM

> I know factor of adhesion is the ruling factor of slippery-ness in
> locomotives.???How much of this feature was because of the engineers handling of the engine?
> 
> I see on the may videotapes and DVD's the society sells the Y6b's slipping a front engine or an A class slipping a rear engine and I'm sure the engineer is right on the throttle to back it off? a notch or 2. The engines of lesser boiler pressure are not so slippery but thats due to less push on the cylinders.
> 
> How touchy was the handling of the power right at the theoretical limits of their design?
> 
> I know of lots of things which limit some engines, like back pressure and counterweight limitations because of wheel diameter, but these factors don't interfere with the slipperiness.
> 
> I'm very interested in what it was like to be the engineer or fireman on several N&W Locomotives. Pushers, Mine runs, and time freights all interest me.
> 
> I model the 1930's for the look of the engines.? The K3's and Z1's are wonderful. My favorite is the M2c and M class engines.
> 
> I may end up designing a fleet of them based on my Sunset brass one.
> 
> 
> Mark Lindsey
> y3a at earthlink.net
> 



      

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 19:23:32 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 16:23:32 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Engine "Slippery-ness"
In-Reply-To: <616A17CC-7D28-44DD-96A3-F7587DE76A3B@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <836800.47713.qm@web31801.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I should have mentioned that one of the best examples of an A's performance right on the edge of its max capability is on Winston Link's Mainline to Panther album/CD.

There is one sequence where an A is westbound on Blue Ridge grade and manages to keep moving with an overload down to about 10-12 mph. It holds the rail for a considerable length of time, with the two engines going in an out of step, sometimes staying one way or the other for sustained periods of time. It finally slipped, reportedly on the turnout near the summit and was unable to recover.  Generally when one engine of a 4-cylinder simple slips, the throttle must be shut off all the way until the slip stops.  In the cited example there was one slip with full recovery, and two additional slips in succession before finally stalling.  It's great example of a very skilled crew getting every last ounce of low speed performance from an A.

BTW, the A's FA is 3.79 based on its RATED TE, which at low speeds is less than what the locomotive actually developed during tests. 

Dave Stephenson



      

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 21:18:42 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 21:18:42 -0400
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
References: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>
Message-ID: <4485AF6B8857482BB4C4E000D1101CFC@DellVostro>

As others have pointed out, the N&W inherited the Orland Park commuter 
service from the Wabash as a result of the October 16, 1964, inclusion of 
the Wabash into the N&W.

As additional info, ten surplus N&W cars were converted into Orland Park 
commuter cars by increasing the seating capacity to 82 passengers each. 
Eight Class Pm (former Pocahontas) cars in series 1720-1732 were converted 
and renumbered 1001-1008 inc. in 1969-70, and two Class P3 (former Powhatan 
Arrow) cars 537 and 534 were converted and renumbered 1009 and 1010 in 1975.

This service is now provided by METRA.

Gordon Hamilton

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 11:06 PM
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?


> RailPictures.net image of N&W GP40 #1372 with a tuscan red passenger train
> in tow. Remarks claim its a commuter train?? Did the N&W do commuter
> service in Chicago? Sharp looking train for a commuter. :-)
>
> http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=297255
>
> - Roger Link (who knows little about N&W passenger service)
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.96/2369 - Release Date: 09/14/09 
05:51:00


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 15 22:27:49 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 22:27:49 -0400
Subject: Virginian in 1910--Bluefield inspection
Message-ID: <1B202C04356B41EE8799A8FF4333AE5D@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 12, 1910

VIRGINIAN OFFICIALS INSPECT LOCAL YARD
------
Declare They Never Saw Such a High Degree of Efficiency in Handling Traffic Anywhere Else

    Superintendent Taylor of the Virginian Railway, and R. P. C. Sanderson, superintendent of motive power of the road, were in the city yesterday on a tour of inspection of the local yard.  Mr. Taylor said that the Norfolk and Western Bluefield yards have a reputation for efficiency and that he and Mr. Sanderson had come to this city to look them over.  The Telegraph representative told Mr. Taylor that he was seeing the yard under the most adverse condition that have ever been present here, on account of the severe storm.  Mr. Taylor admitted that this was true and said that under the conditions he had never seen such a high degree of efficiency.  He was borne out in this statement by Mr. Sanderson, who said the local yard had a most efficient method of handling traffic and even the severe storm of yesterday did not seem to affect the well trained men who have made the local yard a success.
    When asked if they had visited the west end yards the gentlemen said they had and were pleasantly surprised both as to the equipment and the efficient way in which the trains are handled.
    The gentlemen expected that they would find a number of methods in use here which would be of service to them at Princeton and other places along the Virginian.
    Messrs. Taylor and Sanderson are only a few of the foreign railroad superintendents who have visited the local yards at various times and every time they come here they go away surprised at the modern methods in use here and the excellent "corps d'esprit" [sic] which exists among the local forces who make the yards a success from a railroad standpoint.
------
[Article headers in that day's issue describe the previous day's storm as being the "Worst Storm City Has Ever Seen."  The attached picture from the Va. Tech image base shows the traffic handled by the Bluefield yard in 1910.]

Gordon Hamilton
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090915/3a95c6f5/attachment.htm>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: BlfdYardCars.jpg
Type: image/jpeg
Size: 31976 bytes
Desc: not available
Url : <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090915/3a95c6f5/attachment-0001.jpg>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 16 00:38:11 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 00:38:11 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Virginian in 1910--Bluefield
Message-ID: <7779974.1253075891465.JavaMail.root@wamui-june.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090916/1866b257/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 16 07:04:59 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 07:04:59 -0400
Subject: High Bridge
Message-ID: <4AB0C65B.3090506@vt.edu>

Hi Ted,
      I don't remember when the track was abandoned by NS. It's probably 
been 3-4 years ago. High Bridge is still in tack. It's been turned into 
rails to trails. There may be more information on the Virginia Park Service 
website.

Take care,
Norris Deyerle
National Director
Blue Ridge Chapter, NRHS

To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
Subject: High Bridge
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 14:01:58 -0400
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org

While checking out this Lynchburg bypass discussion on google maps, I 
followed the track East to see what was happening at High Bridge and was 
surprised to see that the bridge is still there but there's no track. I 
know I'm not up-to-date on N&W alignments, but I thought I would have known 
whether High Bridge was still in service. I didn't.

When did traffic over the bridge end? What is the fate of the bridge? Any 
portion still there?

Ted Goodman, Columbus


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 16 12:14:40 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 12:14:40 -0400
Subject: Engine "Slippery-ness"
In-Reply-To: <836800.47713.qm@web31801.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8CC04FFECBAE946-12D4-4F38@webmail-d028.sysops.aol.com>


I witnessed a slip of a 1200 (class A) as a kid growing up in Circleville. In '52 or '53 westbound coal drags would periodically "set off" stock at?the cattle pens next to the local freight station on the north side of town.?They would stop the train south of town so as to not block all those grade crossings and?deliver the stock cars, maybe 3?or 4 of them?(and boy did they smell!), 2 miles to the pens and?run reverse?thru town back to the train. They would then start the train and accelerate with memorable stack talk thru town past my home. I saw this 3 or 4 times. On one occasion while I was watched from one of the grade crossings the engine returned to the train and started. To watch that alone was a sight to behold, but as the engine approached where I was - maybe 1500 or 2000 feet from where it started - with drivers turning at probably 60 to 80 rpm by then, the front engine broke and very rapidly spun up. I'm sure it was unexpected because it must have been turning 4 or
  500 rpm (6or8 per second)?by the time the engineer got the throttle closed. This occurred on tangent track near the passenger train stop where the rail may have been oily. It is hard to imagine so much weight spinning so rapidly. It scared the devil out of me. But, it slowed quickly, regained traction and continued on it's way as if nothing had happened. What a spectacle! And to think the railroaders saw such things often. The recent talk of?the J's at 110 mph spinning so fast reminded me of what I had seen.



Ted Goodman, Columbus

-----Original Message-----
From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Tue, Sep 15, 2009 7:23 pm
Subject: Re: Engine "Slippery-ness"




I should have mentioned that one of the best examples of an A's performance 
right on the edge of its max capability is on Winston Link's Mainline to Panther 
album/CD.

There is one sequence where an A is westbound on Blue Ridge grade and manages to 
keep moving with an overload down to about 10-12 mph. It holds the rail for a 
considerable length of time, with the two engines going in an out of step, 
sometimes staying one way or the other for sustained periods of time. It finally 
slipped, reportedly on the turnout near the summit and was unable to recover.  
Generally when one engine of a 4-cylinder simple slips, the throttle must be 
shut off all the way until the slip stops.  In the cited example there was one 
slip with full recovery, and two additional slips in succession before finally 
stalling.  It's great example of a very skilled crew getting every last ounce of 
low speed performance from an A.

BTW, the A's FA is 3.79 based on its RATED TE, which at low speeds is less than 
what the locomotive actually developed during tests. 

Dave Stephenson



      
________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To change your subscription go to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090916/e4410e11/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 16 11:12:31 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 10:12:31 -0500
Subject: High Bridge
In-Reply-To: <4AB0C65B.3090506@vt.edu>
References: <4AB0C65B.3090506@vt.edu>
Message-ID: <001601ca36e0$1d4dc290$57e947b0$@net>

At least 4 years. I was there in April,2006, and track was all gone.   Jim
Nichols

-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 6:05 AM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: RE: High Bridge

Hi Ted,
      I don't remember when the track was abandoned by NS. It's probably 
been 3-4 years ago. High Bridge is still in tack. It's been turned into 
rails to trails. There may be more information on the Virginia Park Service 
website.

Take care,
Norris Deyerle
National Director
Blue Ridge Chapter, NRHS

To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
Subject: High Bridge
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 14:01:58 -0400
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org

While checking out this Lynchburg bypass discussion on google maps, I 
followed the track East to see what was happening at High Bridge and was 
surprised to see that the bridge is still there but there's no track. I 
know I'm not up-to-date on N&W alignments, but I thought I would have known 
whether High Bridge was still in service. I didn't.

When did traffic over the bridge end? What is the fate of the bridge? Any 
portion still there?

Ted Goodman, Columbus

________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To change your subscription go to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 16 14:41:20 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 14:41:20 -0400
Subject: High Bridge
References: <4AB0C65B.3090506@vt.edu> <001601ca36e0$1d4dc290$57e947b0$@net>
Message-ID: <7730ABF298184C3C8F1FA6C538E76167@lewisdl0ls5whv>

February 2005 issue of Trains Magazine stated that NS was approved on 
10/20/2004 to abandon 33.4 miles between Pamplin and Burkeville. The track 
was taken out shortly afterward.

Bud Jeffries

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: "'NW Mailing List'" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 11:12 AM
Subject: RE: High Bridge


> At least 4 years. I was there in April,2006, and track was all gone.   Jim
> Nichols
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
> [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 6:05 AM
> To: NW Mailing List
> Subject: RE: High Bridge
>
> Hi Ted,
>      I don't remember when the track was abandoned by NS. It's probably
> been 3-4 years ago. High Bridge is still in tack. It's been turned into
> rails to trails. There may be more information on the Virginia Park 
> Service
> website.
>
> Take care,
> Norris Deyerle
> National Director
> Blue Ridge Chapter, NRHS
>
> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
> Subject: High Bridge
> Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 14:01:58 -0400
> From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>
> While checking out this Lynchburg bypass discussion on google maps, I
> followed the track East to see what was happening at High Bridge and was
> surprised to see that the bridge is still there but there's no track. I
> know I'm not up-to-date on N&W alignments, but I thought I would have 
> known
> whether High Bridge was still in service. I didn't.
>
> When did traffic over the bridge end? What is the fate of the bridge? Any
> portion still there?
>
> Ted Goodman, Columbus
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
> 



From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 16 17:21:08 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2009 17:21:08 -0400
Subject: Q on NS/NW Clinch Valley Ops
In-Reply-To: <7779974.1253075891465.JavaMail.root@wamui-june.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <7779974.1253075891465.JavaMail.root@wamui-june.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <SNT117-W5843202F23B7CAA55B3FBA92E20@phx.gbl>


All;

 

In looking at Maps dot live dot com, N&W and NS served/serve an App Electric plant at Carbo, VA. Inside the plant there is a Fly Ash load out. Scrolling across to St. Paul, there are 100 ton NS/NW/Sou cement hoppers in the mini yard north/east of the CRR connection. The ready mix concrete plant served by NS in St. Paul appears to receive cement in ATSF/BN/BNSF cement hoppers.

 

Are some or all of these company cement cars interchanged to CRR/CSX and forwarded from there, or do some/all of these cars travel south across the CV to the Interstate and then to Knoxville, or are they picked up by an NS train that runs across CRR/CSX to Frisco and then back to NS?

 

Confused?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Regards,
Russ Goodwin

Buford, GA

_________________________________________________________________
Ready for Fall shows? Use Bing to find helpful ratings and reviews on digital tv's.
http://www.bing.com/shopping/search?q=digital+tv's&form=MSHNCB&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MSHNCB_Vertical_Shopping_DigitalTVs_1x1
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090916/64cb0180/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Thu Sep 17 00:41:31 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 00:41:31 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Cincinnati Rail Abandond
Message-ID: <27020365.1253162491350.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Word around Cincy is that the N&W/NS Hydepark line is now out of service. I got in late on the emails so I don't know to much.  They were saying the end of track would be around the Wooster Pike bridge. Another sad day in railroad history.

Jeffrey Wood
N&W VGN Hist. Soc.
Southern Ohio Railway Enthusiast

________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Thu Sep 17 00:49:52 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 00:49:52 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Return To Williamson
Message-ID: <7138604.1253162993429.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Yes it is true. I finally got to get back into Williamson, West Virginia. In the early 80's we were in eastern Ky. for a weeks vacation. We had the chance to get into Virginia and West Virginia, two states we had not been in yet at that time. Some years ago, I was looking for pictures I took of that trip of N&W coal hoppers at a loadout facility. In the batch was a picture of the city sign to Williamson. I didn't even remember taking it. That prompted me to right a story about it. Now I can finally finish it. The trip was fantastic, though short. I was like a kid in a free candy day candy store. Took 7 rolls of film. Will write more of it when I get all my notes figured out. WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jeffrey Wood
N&W VGN Hist. Soc.
Southern Ohio Railway Enthusiast

________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Thu Sep 17 08:46:22 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 08:46:22 -0400
Subject: "Taking Twenty" with the Virginian Brethren
Message-ID: <4AB22F9E.5070301@vt.edu>

Last night I had the pleasure of "Takin' Twenty" with eight of the Brethren 
and Friends of the Virginian Railway. We passed around a sign up sheet for 
our Road Trip on October third to the Gathering of Virginian Brethren at 
Victoria. Most are anxious to visit old friends and see the new Virginian 
display at the Rail Park of the G5 VGN Gon donated by the Roanoke Chapter NRHS.

The ebay report this time includes sale of Virginian Railway items: 
Lima-Hamilton Paperweight of VGN AG locomotive $104.57; 1931 VGN employee 
pass $25.48; negative of 2-8-4 #507 and Electric #128 $11.11; negative of 
Mullens Motor Barn and Yard $21.01; "Virginian Rails" by Kurt Reisweber 
$48.79; "N&W and VGN in Color" by H. Reid $48.89; and an original slide of 
VGN #54 FM $112.50.

Passed around was the photo that Saltwater Salmon posted from the Princeton 
Station Museum showing a Virginian "Bobber" caboose at Princeton. Ruf and 
Landon had never seen or knew that the VGN had a two axle four wheel 
caboose. Landon said "that little thing would be airborne on the Norfolk 
Division behind the Ford train".

Also passed was the Summer 2009 NRHS "Bulletin" that highlights trains in 
"flyover country" and gas-electric cars. Another interesting discussion was 
ignited when Gordon Hamilton's February 5, 1910 article from the Bluefield 
"Daily Telegraph" was passed around. The article is titled "How the 
Virginian can get into Bluefield". The Brethren had "never heard of such a 
thing".

Ruf Wingfield,Jeff Sanders, and I were entertained by Susan our waitress, 
when she produced a gold plated dime. Ruf remembered buying a "gold silver 
dollar" from VGN hogger "Hustle Bubble" Mattingly for $2.00.

Also passed around were several photos from last Friday's Flag Pole 
Ceremony at the Virginian Station. The highlight was one showing our own 
Landon Gregory, representing the Brethren, speaking about Henry Huddleston 
Rogers and how the VGN came together at the VA-WV state lines. He was 
flanked by US Congressman Bob Goodlatte and Roanoke Mayor David Bowers. 
Landon was also featured on local TV telling the group about the release of 
money to advertise for bids to start station/depot renovation construction. 
At the Ceremony were 10 of the Virginian Brethren. Each wore a distinctive 
name badge identifying them as former VGN Employees. We had over 100 guests 
including two State Senators, Sheriffs, Police, Fire, Rescue, Delegates and 
Friends of the Virginian Railway. Since this was also a 9-11 event on 
Patriot's Day, the flag was raised with three gongs of a locomotive bell, 
to remember those who lost their lives at the World Trade Center, the 
Pentagon and Shanksville, PA on September 11, 2001.

Ruf told us about working at his church and overhearing two young boys. One 
started to tell the other something during the service. The other quietly 
told him to be quiet and not talk above a whisper during the service. The 
other asked "Why?" He was told to look at the back of the church and 
observe the two very large gentlemen by the door. "They're hushers, and 
will come get you if you talk out loud", instructed the boy. Ruf said that 
he served as a "Husher" at his church for years...

Time to pull the pin on this one!

Departing Now from V248,

Skip Salmon

=============

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Thu Sep 17 12:36:22 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:36:22 -0400
Subject: Hyde Park Line in Cincinnati
Message-ID: <12F3E0ACA6E741DE83719E629F41F639@071927350f>

At the end of August Norfolk Southern's transloading facility in Norwood,
OH, a suburb of Cincinnati was closed.  This facility lies at the end of the
former N&W Hyde Park branch and is the only customer on the line. It had
been switched once or twice per week. 

The railroad gate is open at the east end (which was always locked except
while switching), derail switch closed, rusty rails, an empty yard, and a
sign in the office door window stating that the office was closed. I do not
know if this is a permanent closure.  Bulk transfer company Matlac closed in
2004 then Superior Carriers took over. Norfolk Southern owns this property.
Since 2004 NS has been working twice a week there most weeks. Many of the
tank cars and of course the flour cars contained ingredients for Frisch's
(local franchise restaurant "Big Boy') commissary. But, Clare Yard is also a
bulk transfer facility operated under lease by Bulkmatic.  

 

Whether this line, by the reuse of Norwood yard, will ever be reopened
cannot be speculated upon right now.  For some years NS has offered this
line to SORTA, the Southern Regional Transportation Authority, bu they have
no purchased it.  

 

TQ07 was the switcher/shifter that went up the line from Clare to bring in,
shift and take out cars.  These would go to Clare and eventually be taken to
Sharon yard by the T51 local that also goes out the old Peavine to Peebles.
TQ07 and T51 still operate but not in the regular manner of last year.
We'll have to seen how and when business turns around.

 

Strictly speculation, the condition of the three bridges on the line might
define the possibility of this line being reopened, the bridge over Big Duck
Creek and Red bank Road, the bridge west of this, hog Back, and the bridge
over I -71.  I haven't heard of any plans to abandon the line so far.  But,
NS has abandoned formally a short section of the line from Idlewild to Berry
Yard between Paddock Road and Tennessee Avenue.

 

Norwood yard and the area surrounding it was a hot spot for business in the
1900-1920's for the N&W as well as the industrial yard for cars moved by the
PRR/CL&N on to their spurs on the CL&N.  Just to the west was the connection
to the CL&N at Idelwild (Xavier University now).

 

Gary Rolih

Cincinnati

 

 

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090917/678db346/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Thu Sep 17 15:26:35 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 15:26:35 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Speculation
Message-ID: <34C35BCA6F814F848C16A11E67AA21F9@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 15, 1910

NORFOLK AND WESTERN HOLDS MASTER HAND
------
May Eventually Have Line Giving the Shortest Route Between Great Lakes and Panama Canal

    What will the Norfolk and Western do when the leases which the Virginia Iron, Coal and Coke Company and the Louisville and Nashville have with the Norfolk and Western expire next year?  Will the Norfolk and Western secure the Virginia and Southwestern and ship Clinch Valley coal from the lower Clinch field over the Bristol division, via the Virginia and Southwestern?  If this is done it will mean that the Norfolk and Western will switch some of its Clinch Valley coal over the Bristol division, thus taking it away from Bluefield.  Or, will the Norfolk and Western eventually own the Carolina, Clinchfield and Ohio Railway, and have a line from Sandusky, Ohio, on the Great Lakes to Charleston, S. C., on the Atlantic seaboard, thus giving the shortest distance between the lakes and the Panama canal?  Or will the road continue to give trackage rights to the Louisville and Nashville and the Virginia Iron, Coal and Coke Company?  It may be possible that the Norfolk and Western has out-Harrimaned Harriman and out-Hawleyed Hawley and made plans for a road which would embrace the best coal fields in the Virginias and Tennessee as well as having taken over the cream of the Ohio business.
    With the narrow guage [sic] road between Devon and a possible outlet near Kiser, on the Clinch Valley, it would be possible for the Norfolk and Western to have a route from Sandusky to Charleston but it would necessitate the acquisition of the Columbus, Sandusky and Hocking and the Carolina, Clinchfield and Ohio railway.
    The Norfolk and Western holds a strategic position.  Situated in the coal fields of the Virginias and Tennessee, it holds a master hand and it will be in the running when all the other hands are forced to sit back and watch the game played out for the big pot as well as all the side pots.  It is understood that the Norfolk and Western will not renew its traffic arrangements with the Louisville and Nashville and the Virginia and Southwestern but will, as has been rumored many times, run its own trains over its own track to Big Stone Gap, where it can connect with the Virginia and Southwestern.  The Virginia and Southwestern runs to Bristol and the Norfolk and Western has a line from Bristol to Radford.  This line also reaches Pulaski, where there is a furnace which needs coke and coal.  Years ago a mighty sized empire was planned for the southwest and its apparent chances for realization never appeared brighter than they do right now.  This may be where the cry of "go south, young man," comes from, as the time may have come and the fairy hand which makes all these things possible may be the Norfolk and Western and its allies, the financiers.
------
[The reporter does not how the N&W could go from Norton "...over its own track...." to Big Stone Gap where it would connect with the Virginia and Southwestern.]

Gordon Hamilton
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090917/3cb7b31c/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Thu Sep 17 18:01:41 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 18:01:41 -0400
Subject: High Bridge
References: <4AB0C65B.3090506@vt.edu> <001601ca36e0$1d4dc290$57e947b0$@net>
	<7730ABF298184C3C8F1FA6C538E76167@lewisdl0ls5whv>
Message-ID: <005801ca37e2$706193a0$6500a8c0@Dad>

I don't think they wasted any time once they got the go-ahead.  Except for a 
few hundred yards west of Burkeville, which the railroad appeared to be 
using for car storage, and a few hundred yards east of Pamplin, which I 
believe serves a pulpwood yard, It was all up by January when I made a 
circle drive all around the mainline (sorry, Farmville line) and beltline 
just to see what it looked like.  For someone who grew up in Farmville it 
was pretty depressing.

Sam Putney


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 2:41 PM
Subject: Re: High Bridge


> February 2005 issue of Trains Magazine stated that NS was approved on 
> 10/20/2004 to abandon 33.4 miles between Pamplin and Burkeville. The track 
> was taken out shortly afterward.
>
> Bud Jeffries
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> To: "'NW Mailing List'" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 11:12 AM
> Subject: RE: High Bridge
>
>
>> At least 4 years. I was there in April,2006, and track was all gone. 
>> Jim
>> Nichols
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
>> [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 6:05 AM
>> To: NW Mailing List
>> Subject: RE: High Bridge
>>
>> Hi Ted,
>>      I don't remember when the track was abandoned by NS. It's probably
>> been 3-4 years ago. High Bridge is still in tack. It's been turned into
>> rails to trails. There may be more information on the Virginia Park 
>> Service
>> website.
>>
>> Take care,
>> Norris Deyerle
>> National Director
>> Blue Ridge Chapter, NRHS
>>
>> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>> Subject: High Bridge
>> Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 14:01:58 -0400
>> From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>>
>> While checking out this Lynchburg bypass discussion on google maps, I
>> followed the track East to see what was happening at High Bridge and was
>> surprised to see that the bridge is still there but there's no track. I
>> know I'm not up-to-date on N&W alignments, but I thought I would have 
>> known
>> whether High Bridge was still in service. I didn't.
>>
>> When did traffic over the bridge end? What is the fate of the bridge? Any
>> portion still there?
>>
>> Ted Goodman, Columbus
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>
>
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/ 


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 18 12:27:18 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 12:27:18 -0400
Subject: High Bridge
In-Reply-To: <005801ca37e2$706193a0$6500a8c0@Dad>
References: <4AB0C65B.3090506@vt.edu> <001601ca36e0$1d4dc290$57e947b0$@net>
	<7730ABF298184C3C8F1FA6C538E76167@lewisdl0ls5whv>
	<005801ca37e2$706193a0$6500a8c0@Dad>
Message-ID: <F5CAD0B9D3F62341B4B6EA482A168E5FD254CB6E13@SWEC9965.w-intra.net>

http://www.dcr.virginia.gov/state_parks/hig.shtml#visitorcentergiftshop

http://www.americantrails.org/resources/railtrails/HighBridgeVA08.html

Above are a couple of web sites about High Bridge State Park that may be of interest.  

Ed Painter; Narrows, VA living in Russellville, AR



-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 5:02 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: High Bridge

I don't think they wasted any time once they got the go-ahead.  Except for a 
few hundred yards west of Burkeville, which the railroad appeared to be 
using for car storage, and a few hundred yards east of Pamplin, which I 
believe serves a pulpwood yard, It was all up by January when I made a 
circle drive all around the mainline (sorry, Farmville line) and beltline 
just to see what it looked like.  For someone who grew up in Farmville it 
was pretty depressing.

Sam Putney


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 2:41 PM
Subject: Re: High Bridge


> February 2005 issue of Trains Magazine stated that NS was approved on 
> 10/20/2004 to abandon 33.4 miles between Pamplin and Burkeville. The track 
> was taken out shortly afterward.
>
> Bud Jeffries
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> To: "'NW Mailing List'" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 11:12 AM
> Subject: RE: High Bridge
>
>
>> At least 4 years. I was there in April,2006, and track was all gone. 
>> Jim
>> Nichols
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
>> [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 6:05 AM
>> To: NW Mailing List
>> Subject: RE: High Bridge
>>
>> Hi Ted,
>>      I don't remember when the track was abandoned by NS. It's probably
>> been 3-4 years ago. High Bridge is still in tack. It's been turned into
>> rails to trails. There may be more information on the Virginia Park 
>> Service
>> website.
>>
>> Take care,
>> Norris Deyerle
>> National Director
>> Blue Ridge Chapter, NRHS
>>
>> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>> Subject: High Bridge
>> Date: Tue, 15 Sep 2009 14:01:58 -0400
>> From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>>
>> While checking out this Lynchburg bypass discussion on google maps, I
>> followed the track East to see what was happening at High Bridge and was
>> surprised to see that the bridge is still there but there's no track. I
>> know I'm not up-to-date on N&W alignments, but I thought I would have 
>> known
>> whether High Bridge was still in service. I didn't.
>>
>> When did traffic over the bridge end? What is the fate of the bridge? Any
>> portion still there?
>>
>> Ted Goodman, Columbus
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>
>
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/ 

________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To change your subscription go to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 18 13:01:57 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 13:01:57 -0400
Subject: BEDFORD STATION ON FIRE
Message-ID: <8CC0698DD8E1593-2C18-1BF8@webmail-d056.sysops.aol.com>


There is a report that the former N&W passenger station in Bedford, VA is on fire.? Can anyone confirm this?



Jeff Morfit
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090918/a9159f52/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 18 14:01:51 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 14:01:51 -0400
Subject: BEDFORD STATION ON FIRE
In-Reply-To: <8CC0698DD8E1593-2C18-1BF8@webmail-d056.sysops.aol.com>
References: <8CC0698DD8E1593-2C18-1BF8@webmail-d056.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <9d5f4ad00909181101j421420d9q8addc33d0f31dff8@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Sep 18, 2009 at 1:01 PM, Jeff wrote:

> There is a report that the former N&W passenger station in Bedford, VA is
> on fire.  Can anyone confirm this?
>

WDBJ Channel 7 has a report at
http://www.wdbj7.com/Global/story.asp?S=11156393

Bruce in Blacksburg
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090918/8a9e8b3f/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 18 19:43:46 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 23:43:46 GMT
Subject: Sights to See?
Message-ID: <20090918.194346.5424.0@webmail03.vgs.untd.com>

Listers,
I know this is a rather short notice but thought I'd try to pick the brains of N&W's Best.  I'll be heading to Strasburg PA to visit the railroad and the museum leaving this Monday from the Cincinnati area.  I was wondering if any one has some suggestions for sights to see on my way to/from Strasburg relating-of course- to the N&W.  I don't have much time to stray far off the direct pathway between Cincinnati and Strasburg.  Any suggestions, with directional aids and helps, will be appreciated.
Thanks
Dave Moorehead
Milford, OH
____________________________________________________________
Find out what's hot in makeup. Click now to find the latest products and trends.
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsD9WOZSSEZoYKIhzPFq3Q0RJHxh3furaI8buKgrsfoBSbN1CcbWqU/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090918/4378a85a/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 19 10:09:23 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 10:09:23 -0400
Subject: Sights to =?UTF-8?Q?See=3F?=
In-Reply-To: <20090918.194346.5424.0@webmail03.vgs.untd.com>
References: <20090918.194346.5424.0@webmail03.vgs.untd.com>
Message-ID: <6ac07c2d86c89ba97ca270350e0681c9@ptd.net>

Dave,
Check out Horseshoe Curve and Altoona.
Tom Anson




On Fri, 18 Sep 2009 23:43:46 GMT, NW Mailing List
<nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
wrote:
> Listers,
> I know this is a rather short notice but thought I'd try to pick the
brains
> of N&W's Best.  I'll be heading to Strasburg PA to visit the railroad and
> the museum leaving this Monday from the Cincinnati area.  I was wondering
> if any one has some suggestions for sights to see on my way to/from
> Strasburg relating-of course- to the N&W.  I don't have much time to
stray
> far off the direct pathway between Cincinnati and Strasburg.  Any
> suggestions, with directional aids and helps, will be appreciated.
> Thanks
> Dave Moorehead
> Milford, OH
> ____________________________________________________________
> Find out what's hot in makeup. Click now to find the latest products and
> trends.
>
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsD9WOZSSEZoYKIhzPFq3Q0RJHxh3furaI8buKgrsfoBSbN1CcbWqU/

-- 
Tom Anson

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 19 14:46:46 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 14:46:46 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Weather
Message-ID: <BB5F24B0C40E406791AD26C29F9B24D9@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 18, 1910

STORM STRIKES HERE
------
Mercury Drops Forty-three Degrees Within Five Hours

    At three o'clock this morning every wire connecting Bluefield with the outside world was down and out as a result of the terrific snowstorm which is in the west.  Train No. 4 left Columbus last night one hour and forty minutes late, hauled by three engine, and as snow was falling all the way to Kenova, it is hard to tell when it will arrive here this morning.  Shortly after midnight there was reported twenty-four inches of snow in Columbus and still snowing.  All the way down the Ohio river to Kenova the snow was reported as falling fast.  Cincinnati is tied up worse than it has been for fifty years, while hardly a telegraph office with Western Union wires has a connection with any of the larger cities.  It is a complete tie-up.  Locally even Williamson cannot be reached on account of the ice and sleet which has covered the wires, and there was a light snowfall early this morning.  The thermometer fell forty-three degrees in five hours last night, giving some idea of the suddenness with which the storm struck Bluefield.  Every town in Ohio, Indiana and parts of Illinois report snow, and judging from what reports have been received, in no place is it less than twenty inches deep.
    Last night about 7 o'clock the high wind tore out a large plate glass window in the Hearn building, occupied by W. A. Bodell.  Every revolving sign in the city was tearing off a speed of about 2,000 miles per hour and all of the refuse cans on the streets were turned over.  The streets were so slippery that walking was dangerous.
------
Gordon Hamilton
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090919/72e07f0a/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 19 12:20:29 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 12:20:29 EDT
Subject: Sights to See?
Message-ID: <c25.6397f7cd.37e65ecd@aol.com>

Dave :
 
When I visited Cincy in July I traveled 32 to Parkersburg, WV (some old  
B&O) items  there
- then 50 to Clarksburg (another old B&O town) - 79 to Morgantown, WV -  68 
to Cumberland, MD (lot's of CSX action there) - 68 to Hancock, MD - 70 to  
Hagerstown, MD (2 Western MD RR museums & some N&W items) now lot's  of NS 
action - 81 north to PA Turnpike (76).
 
If you travel 71N to 70E to 76E there is no RR action till you get the  
Strasburg, PA.
 
For more details contact me direct at _marshallnsfan at aol.com_ 
(mailto:marshallnsfan at aol.com) 
 
Regards,
Terry Marshall
Hagerstown, MD
 
 
 
 
In a message dated 9/18/2009 8:48:05 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org writes:

Listers, 
I know this is a rather short notice but thought I'd try to pick the brains 
 of N&W's Best.  I'll be heading to Strasburg PA to visit the  railroad and 
the museum leaving this Monday from the Cincinnati area.  I  was wondering 
if any one has some suggestions for sights to see on my way  to/from 
Strasburg relating-of course- to the N&W.  I don't have much  time to stray far off 
the direct pathway between Cincinnati and  Strasburg.  Any suggestions, 
with directional aids and helps, will  be appreciated. 
Thanks 
Dave Moorehead
Milford, OH

____________________________________________________________  
_Find out what's hot in makeup. Click now to find the latest  products and  
trends._ 
(http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2132/fc/BLSrjnsD9WOZSSEZoYKIhzPFq3Q0RJHxh3furaI8buKgrsfoBSbN1CcbWqU/) 




________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To  change your subscription go  to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the  NW-Mailing-List archives  at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090919/1ced6a12/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 19 16:05:16 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 16:05:16 -0400
Subject: info on engines - 1447 and 1136
In-Reply-To: <0AFC37BBE2C84D6D9F6F59BF1B397749@lewisdl0ls5whv>
References: <COL119-W2B516119D85578D1454ABF8010@phx.gbl>
	<0AFC37BBE2C84D6D9F6F59BF1B397749@lewisdl0ls5whv>
Message-ID: <8CC077BA3DBE28A-7DD4-4663@webmail-d041.sysops.aol.com>









What districts/stations did they serve at?

??? Don't have specific answers. Both used across the N&W system during their lives.


>From the Engine Assignment ledger:

Eng 1136 - originally assigned to Norfolk Division.

???????????????? 8/08/21 - transferred to Radford Division.

???????????????????? ?????? - transferred to Shenandoah Division.

???????????????? 3/19/28 - transferred to Norfolk Terminal.

??????????????? 10/15/29 - transferred to Roanoke Terminal



Eng. 1447 - 1/01/1919 - assigned to Scioto Division.

????????????????? 5/21/25???? - transferred to Norfolk Division

???????????????????2/11/29??? - transferred to Scioto Division.?



??????????????????????????????????????????????? Harry Bundy






Hotmail? is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. Try it now. 




________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To change your subscription go to
http://lis
t.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/



________________________________________
W-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
o change your subscription go to
ttp://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
rowse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
ttp://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090919/7046f9cb/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 19 19:32:25 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 19:32:25 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
Message-ID: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu>

Greetings from Dry Branch,
         Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J" 
builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago?  I would have thought all 
14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does seem to be the real 
deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I have is that it came from 
Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures dating from after the wreck on 
6/12/46 show no builders plates and wonder if they could have been left off 
after the repair. I know it's going to be difficult to piece together the 
history but I'd like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly 
appreciated.

Chuck Speicher

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 19 20:57:07 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 20:57:07 EDT
Subject: Sights to See?
Message-ID: <c94.5006f322.37e6d7e3@aol.com>

If you plan to go through Harrisburg, PA, you can take Business 11, 15  
along the west side of the river.  Just south of I-81 the road (Enola St.)  
rises quite a bit.  The west side of the road is all businesses.  The  east 
side is only a guard rail where you can look down on the very large Enola  Yard 
complex.  Park at an eatery or gas station and then walk very  carefully 
across the road and stand just on the safe side of the guard rail and  you can 
look down on the yard.  Then head north to see the Rockville Bridge  just 
north of the I-81 bridge.
 
Bob Lang
San Diego
 
 
In a message dated 9/19/2009 4:27:50 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,  
nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org writes:

Dave :
 
When I visited Cincy in July I traveled 32 to Parkersburg, WV (some old  
B&O) items  there
- then 50 to Clarksburg (another old B&O town) - 79 to Morgantown, WV  - 68 
to Cumberland, MD (lot's of CSX action there) - 68 to Hancock, MD - 70 to  
Hagerstown, MD (2 Western MD RR museums & some N&W items) now lot's  of NS 
action - 81 north to PA Turnpike (76).
 
If you travel 71N to 70E to 76E there is no RR action till you get the  
Strasburg, PA.
 
For more details contact me direct at _marshallnsfan at aol.com_ 
(mailto:marshallnsfan at aol.com) 
 
Regards,
Terry Marshall
Hagerstown, MD
 
 
 
 
In a message dated 9/18/2009 8:48:05 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org writes:

Listers, 
I know this is a rather short notice but thought I'd try to pick the  
brains of N&W's Best.  I'll be heading to Strasburg PA to  visit the railroad and 
the museum leaving this Monday from the Cincinnati  area.  I was wondering 
if any one has some suggestions for sights to  see on my way to/from 
Strasburg relating-of course- to the N&W.  I  don't have much time to stray far off 
the direct pathway between  Cincinnati and Strasburg.  Any suggestions, 
with directional aids and  helps, will be appreciated. 
Thanks 
Dave Moorehead
Milford, OH

____________________________________________________________  
_Find out what's hot in makeup. Click now to find the latest  products and  
trends._ 
(http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2132/fc/BLSrjnsD9WOZSSEZoYKIhzPFq3Q0RJHxh3furaI8buKgrsfoBSbN1CcbWqU/) 






________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To  change your subscription go  to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the  NW-Mailing-List archives  at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/

________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To  change your subscription go  to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the  NW-Mailing-List archives  at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090919/eac88f19/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 19 21:34:34 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:34:34 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
In-Reply-To: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu>
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu>
Message-ID: <D7FD6FDE-EAB2-48F3-9957-6DFE00CEBF36@rev.net>

Interestingly enough, a 604 builders plate is on ebay right now as  
well. I am somewhat suspicious of that one, I cannot see any kind of  
marks on the back from the boiler straps. But that may just be a lack  
of quality photos.

Builders plates are a complex subject, and there are generally a lot  
more fakes than real ones out there. The J plates are one of the  
hardest and most expensive to get, I suspect most if not all were  
saved. I also have reason to believe that the plates of the 600 in  
October 1941 had multiple copies made at the time and given to folks  
close to the project, in addition to the reproductions made in the  
last 20 or so years.

Good luck

Ken Miller

On Sep 19, 2009, at 7:32 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:

> Greetings from Dry Branch,
>        Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J"  
> builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago?  I would have  
> thought all 14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does  
> seem to be the real deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I  
> have is that it came from Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures  
> dating from after the wreck on 6/12/46 show no builders plates and  
> wonder if they could have been left off after the repair. I know  
> it's going to be difficult to piece together the history but I'd  
> like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly appreciated.
>
> Chuck Speicher
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 19 22:58:51 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:58:51 -0500
Subject: J #604 builders plate
In-Reply-To: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu>
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu>
Message-ID: <001d01ca399e$487c6b90$d97542b0$@net>

About 1950, N&W started moving the builders plates on the J's, K2's and
K2a's to just below the running board. We first noticed this when the 611
was built with no visible builders plates. But they were there - just in a
new location where they were not easily visible. I suppose this was a
cosmetic consideration (the streamlining was not interrupted by the builders
plate, or maybe they didn't want people noticing how old the K's were.)
Anyway, this was what happened, but all the J's still had their plates
firmly attached to the smokebox - just lower than they had been. Don't know
about the 604, but some J's were stored temporarily at Bluefield before
being sent to the scrappers in Portsmouth. So it is just possible that some
fine Bluefield person stole one while the 604 was there. Or maybe they got
it from the scrapper and returned to Bluefield with it. Who knows? But if
two more people should say they have a plate from the 604, then at least one
of them is suspect. BTW, the J plates were chrome plated, with the recessed
area being painted black. If yours doesn't look like that, I would consider
it suspect.    Jim Nichols


-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 6:32 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: J #604 builders plate

Greetings from Dry Branch,
         Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J" 
builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago?  I would have thought all 
14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does seem to be the real 
deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I have is that it came from 
Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures dating from after the wreck on 
6/12/46 show no builders plates and wonder if they could have been left off 
after the repair. I know it's going to be difficult to piece together the 
history but I'd like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly 
appreciated.

Chuck Speicher
________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To change your subscription go to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 19 23:05:21 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 23:05:21 -0400
Subject: BEDFORD STATION ON FIRE
In-Reply-To: <mailman.3.1253376007.7352.nw-mailing-list@nwhs.org>
References: <mailman.3.1253376007.7352.nw-mailing-list@nwhs.org>
Message-ID: <018b01ca399f$31151910$933f4b30$@net>

Another story on the fire:  http://www.wdbj7.com/Global/story.asp?S=11156393


Skip Sledge
Have a nice day, it is much better than a bad one!




From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 08:48:02 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 08:48:02 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
In-Reply-To: <D7FD6FDE-EAB2-48F3-9957-6DFE00CEBF36@rev.net>
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu>
	<D7FD6FDE-EAB2-48F3-9957-6DFE00CEBF36@rev.net>
Message-ID: <91316F07-A05A-4D74-87FC-DE0838787124@rev.net>

I'd also suggest that you contact Larry Evans at lsevans at zoominternet.net 
, Larry knows quite a bit about these plates and can probably easily  
tell you why it is real or not.

Ken Miller


On Sep 19, 2009, at 9:34 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:

> Interestingly enough, a 604 builders plate is on ebay right now as  
> well. I am somewhat suspicious of that one, I cannot see any kind of  
> marks on the back from the boiler straps. But that may just be a  
> lack of quality photos.
>
> Builders plates are a complex subject, and there are generally a lot  
> more fakes than real ones out there. The J plates are one of the  
> hardest and most expensive to get, I suspect most if not all were  
> saved. I also have reason to believe that the plates of the 600 in  
> October 1941 had multiple copies made at the time and given to folks  
> close to the project, in addition to the reproductions made in the  
> last 20 or so years.
>
> Good luck
>
> Ken Miller
>
> On Sep 19, 2009, at 7:32 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:
>
>> Greetings from Dry Branch,
>>       Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J"  
>> builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago?  I would have  
>> thought all 14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does  
>> seem to be the real deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I  
>> have is that it came from Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures  
>> dating from after the wreck on 6/12/46 show no builders plates and  
>> wonder if they could have been left off after the repair. I know  
>> it's going to be difficult to piece together the history but I'd  
>> like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly appreciated.
>>
>> Chuck Speicher
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 08:51:18 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 07:51:18 -0500
Subject: "J" Builders Plates
Message-ID: <2D22E4C0-505C-4167-A780-3C037F8CB0CB@earthlink.net>

I have a small foundry in my backyard, at which I pour aluminum,  
brass and bronze. Though I mainly pour parts for my 1/8th scale RR  
hobby, I have occasionally poured builders plates.  If you have an  
original to use as a pattern, a builders plate is one of the easiest  
castings to make.

I bought a plaster replica of a "J" plate on the internet a couple of  
years ago. It is my intention to not only duplicate that plate in  
metal, (so I can use it outdoors) but by changing the numbers, pour  
all the "J" series in bronze, when I find the time.

Because they are so easy to copy, it certainly is "BUYER BEWARE" for  
builders plates.

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 08:09:13 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 08:09:13 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
In-Reply-To: <D7FD6FDE-EAB2-48F3-9957-6DFE00CEBF36@rev.net>
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu>
	<D7FD6FDE-EAB2-48F3-9957-6DFE00CEBF36@rev.net>
Message-ID: <0KQ900ETGR24AUF8@vms173013.mailsrvcs.net>

Ken

I agree with your views.

In addition the holes for the mounting bolts are way too small for a 
original J plate.  This can be seen without any close inspection.

Jim Blacktock

At 09:34 PM 9/19/2009, you wrote:
>Interestingly enough, a 604 builders plate is on ebay right now as
>well. I am somewhat suspicious of that one, I cannot see any kind of
>marks on the back from the boiler straps. But that may just be a lack
>of quality photos.
>
>Builders plates are a complex subject, and there are generally a lot
>more fakes than real ones out there. The J plates are one of the
>hardest and most expensive to get, I suspect most if not all were
>saved. I also have reason to believe that the plates of the 600 in
>October 1941 had multiple copies made at the time and given to folks
>close to the project, in addition to the reproductions made in the
>last 20 or so years.
>
>Good luck
>
>Ken Miller
>
>On Sep 19, 2009, at 7:32 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:
>
>>Greetings from Dry Branch,
>>        Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J"
>>builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago?  I would have
>>thought all 14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does
>>seem to be the real deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I
>>have is that it came from Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures
>>dating from after the wreck on 6/12/46 show no builders plates and
>>wonder if they could have been left off after the repair. I know
>>it's going to be difficult to piece together the history but I'd
>>like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly appreciated.
>>
>>Chuck Speicher
>>________________________________________
>>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>To change your subscription go to
>>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
>________________________________________
>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>To change your subscription go to
>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
>__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
>signature database 4441 (20090919) __________
>
>The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
>http://www.eset.com
>
>


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 09:44:02 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 09:44:02 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Contract
Message-ID: <D01FC00A6AE44278B584E3503816FF8F@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 19, 1910

    IN CITY AND COALFIELD
------
Declined Contract

    When the Norfolk and Western gave out contracts for double track last week, a contract for three miles and several tunnels was awarded to J. R. Serpell & Sons, of Louisville, Ky.  Wednesday a letter was received at Roanoke stating that owing to conditions with them they would decline the contract.  The contract was then awarded to Carpenter & Boxley of Roanoke.
------
Gordon Hamilton
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090920/f8ccb9df/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 10:57:28 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 10:57:28 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
In-Reply-To: <001d01ca399e$487c6b90$d97542b0$@net>
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu> <001d01ca399e$487c6b90$d97542b0$@net>
Message-ID: <BAY143-W112DE36517845303AA52ECA8DE0@phx.gbl>


Good morning, 

      I saw where the N&WRY J#604 Builders Plate sold for $11,111.99 plus $10.00 shipping on eBay!!! Too rich for most of us, I'm sure. I hope it was not a reproduction. The auction ended on 9-19-09. Item #170383295546. 

Happy collecting, 

Norris Deyerle  
 
> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
> Subject: RE: J #604 builders plate
> Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:58:51 -0500
> From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
> 
> About 1950, N&W started moving the builders plates on the J's, K2's and
> K2a's to just below the running board. We first noticed this when the 611
> was built with no visible builders plates. But they were there - just in a
> new location where they were not easily visible. I suppose this was a
> cosmetic consideration (the streamlining was not interrupted by the builders
> plate, or maybe they didn't want people noticing how old the K's were.)
> Anyway, this was what happened, but all the J's still had their plates
> firmly attached to the smokebox - just lower than they had been. Don't know
> about the 604, but some J's were stored temporarily at Bluefield before
> being sent to the scrappers in Portsmouth. So it is just possible that some
> fine Bluefield person stole one while the 604 was there. Or maybe they got
> it from the scrapper and returned to Bluefield with it. Who knows? But if
> two more people should say they have a plate from the 604, then at least one
> of them is suspect. BTW, the J plates were chrome plated, with the recessed
> area being painted black. If yours doesn't look like that, I would consider
> it suspect. Jim Nichols
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
> [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
> Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 6:32 PM
> To: NW Mailing List
> Subject: J #604 builders plate
> 
> Greetings from Dry Branch,
> Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J" 
> builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago? I would have thought all 
> 14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does seem to be the real 
> deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I have is that it came from 
> Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures dating from after the wreck on 
> 6/12/46 show no builders plates and wonder if they could have been left off 
> after the repair. I know it's going to be difficult to piece together the 
> history but I'd like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly 
> appreciated.
> 
> Chuck Speicher
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
> 
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/

_________________________________________________________________
Ready for Fall shows? Use Bing to find helpful ratings and reviews on digital tv's.
http://www.bing.com/shopping/search?q=digital+tv's&form=MSHNCB&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MSHNCB_Vertical_Shopping_DigitalTVs_1x1
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090920/a8c31f7f/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 16:48:47 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 16:48:47 -0400
Subject: Roanoke VGN Station news
Message-ID: <20090920204854.XVNA11036.eastrmmtao104.cox.net@eastrmimpo03.cox.net>

An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090920/bf17251b/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 17:04:13 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 17:04:13 -0400
Subject: VGN Roanoke Station - Invitation for bids
Message-ID: <20090920211542.NYZO19495.eastrmmtao106.cox.net@eastrmimpo03.cox.net>

An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090920/49645de6/attachment.html>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 16:45:49 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 16:45:49 -0400
Subject: BEDFORD STATION ON FIRE
In-Reply-To: <018b01ca399f$31151910$933f4b30$@net>
References: <mailman.3.1253376007.7352.nw-mailing-list@nwhs.org>
	<018b01ca399f$31151910$933f4b30$@net>
Message-ID: <20090920204556.OBJG913.eastrmmtao103.cox.net@eastrmimpo01.cox.net>

Roanoke Times article on the Bedford station fire

http://www.roanoke.com/news/roanoke/wb/219562

Ron Davis


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 17:17:57 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 17:17:57 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Norton station
Message-ID: <351BAA0B3BE24D8B9C35545160879651@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 20, 1910

NORTON NEWS NOTES
------

    Citizens of Norton are just in receipt of a brief from the law firm of Irving & Morrison, Big Stone Gap, in the Norton board of trade versus the Norfolk and Western and Interstate railway.  The object of the proceedings is to compel the two roads to connect at Norton.  The Interstate railroad runs from Stonega, via Appalachia and intermediate points to Norton, paralleling the Louisville and Nashville.  When the Interstate was completed into Norton last fall, it made a proposition to the Norfolk and Western to use their tracks and depot, but the proposition was turned down.  The board of trade then took up the matter and appealed to the corporation commission.  At a hearing in Richmond soon after the commission refused to make the roads connect, which was appealed to the supreme court, Irvine & Morrison present a strong case and it is believed that the corporation commission will be reversed.  The depots of the two roads are about a mile apart at present.
------
Gordon Hamilton
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090920/f01b8064/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 18:34:03 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 18:34:03 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
Message-ID: <4AB6759B0200005000054544@smtp1.mcg.edu>

WOW! What do you think a Y6 number plate would go for?
W.Edwards

>>> NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> 09/20/09 10:57 AM >>>

Good morning, 

      I saw where the N&WRY J#604 Builders Plate sold for $11,111.99 plus $10.00 shipping on eBay!!! Too rich for most of us, I'm sure. I hope it was not a reproduction. The auction ended on 9-19-09. Item #170383295546. 

Happy collecting, 

Norris Deyerle  
 
> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
> Subject: RE: J #604 builders plate
> Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:58:51 -0500
> From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
> 
> About 1950, N&W started moving the builders plates on the J's, K2's and
> K2a's to just below the running board. We first noticed this when the 611
> was built with no visible builders plates. But they were there - just in a
> new location where they were not easily visible. I suppose this was a
> cosmetic consideration (the streamlining was not interrupted by the builders
> plate, or maybe they didn't want people noticing how old the K's were.)
> Anyway, this was what happened, but all the J's still had their plates
> firmly attached to the smokebox - just lower than they had been. Don't know
> about the 604, but some J's were stored temporarily at Bluefield before
> being sent to the scrappers in Portsmouth. So it is just possible that some
> fine Bluefield person stole one while the 604 was there. Or maybe they got
> it from the scrapper and returned to Bluefield with it. Who knows? But if
> two more people should say they have a plate from the 604, then at least one
> of them is suspect. BTW, the J plates were chrome plated, with the recessed
> area being painted black. If yours doesn't look like that, I would consider
> it suspect. Jim Nichols
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
> [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
> Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 6:32 PM
> To: NW Mailing List
> Subject: J #604 builders plate
> 
> Greetings from Dry Branch,
> Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J" 
> builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago? I would have thought all 
> 14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does seem to be the real 
> deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I have is that it came from 
> Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures dating from after the wreck on 
> 6/12/46 show no builders plates and wonder if they could have been left off 
> after the repair. I know it's going to be difficult to piece together the 
> history but I'd like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly 
> appreciated.
> 
> Chuck Speicher
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
> 
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/

_________________________________________________________________
Ready for Fall shows? Use Bing to find helpful ratings and reviews on digital tv's.
http://www.bing.com/shopping/search?q=digital+tv's&form=MSHNCB&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MSHNCB_Vertical_Shopping_DigitalTVs_1x1

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 18:37:41 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 18:37:41 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu><D7FD6FDE-EAB2-48F3-9957-6DFE00CEBF36@rev.net>
	<0KQ900ETGR24AUF8@vms173013.mailsrvcs.net>
Message-ID: <741EDE222CC64CDCACEE11695330AD97@StudyComputer>

Jim

  In comparison with 611,602,609s original plates appears to be the same 
size

holes.  Although 600s Plate up north seems to have larger holes and the 600 
plate

that's in Roanoke has the small holes.



Larry



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 8:09 AM
Subject: Re: J #604 builders plate


> Ken
>
> I agree with your views.
>
> In addition the holes for the mounting bolts are way too small for a 
> original J plate.  This can be seen without any close inspection.
>
> Jim Blacktock
>
> At 09:34 PM 9/19/2009, you wrote:
>>Interestingly enough, a 604 builders plate is on ebay right now as
>>well. I am somewhat suspicious of that one, I cannot see any kind of
>>marks on the back from the boiler straps. But that may just be a lack
>>of quality photos.
>>
>>Builders plates are a complex subject, and there are generally a lot
>>more fakes than real ones out there. The J plates are one of the
>>hardest and most expensive to get, I suspect most if not all were
>>saved. I also have reason to believe that the plates of the 600 in
>>October 1941 had multiple copies made at the time and given to folks
>>close to the project, in addition to the reproductions made in the
>>last 20 or so years.
>>
>>Good luck
>>
>>Ken Miller
>>
>>On Sep 19, 2009, at 7:32 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:
>>
>>>Greetings from Dry Branch,
>>>        Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J"
>>>builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago?  I would have
>>>thought all 14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does
>>>seem to be the real deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I
>>>have is that it came from Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures
>>>dating from after the wreck on 6/12/46 show no builders plates and
>>>wonder if they could have been left off after the repair. I know
>>>it's going to be difficult to piece together the history but I'd
>>>like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly appreciated.
>>>
>>>Chuck Speicher
>>>________________________________________
>>>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>>To change your subscription go to
>>>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>
>>________________________________________
>>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>To change your subscription go to
>>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>
>>__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
>>signature database 4441 (20090919) __________
>>
>>The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>>
>>http://www.eset.com
>>
>>
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
> 



From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 19:32:47 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 19:32:47 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
References: <4AB6759B0200005000054544@smtp1.mcg.edu>
Message-ID: <792990B8DACA49268C475F50D5A5B50F@StudyComputer>

Y6 number plates are selling in the $2000.00 dollar range
+or- couple hundred does depend on their condition
studs cut off the back or not. What number do you have?

Larry Evans
Kenova,WV


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 6:34 PM
Subject: RE: J #604 builders plate


> WOW! What do you think a Y6 number plate would go for?
> W.Edwards
>
>>>> NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> 09/20/09 10:57 AM >>>
>
> Good morning,
>
>      I saw where the N&WRY J#604 Builders Plate sold for $11,111.99 plus 
> $10.00 shipping on eBay!!! Too rich for most of us, I'm sure. I hope it 
> was not a reproduction. The auction ended on 9-19-09. Item #170383295546.
>
> Happy collecting,
>
> Norris Deyerle
>
>> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>> Subject: RE: J #604 builders plate
>> Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:58:51 -0500
>> From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>>
>> About 1950, N&W started moving the builders plates on the J's, K2's and
>> K2a's to just below the running board. We first noticed this when the 611
>> was built with no visible builders plates. But they were there - just in 
>> a
>> new location where they were not easily visible. I suppose this was a
>> cosmetic consideration (the streamlining was not interrupted by the 
>> builders
>> plate, or maybe they didn't want people noticing how old the K's were.)
>> Anyway, this was what happened, but all the J's still had their plates
>> firmly attached to the smokebox - just lower than they had been. Don't 
>> know
>> about the 604, but some J's were stored temporarily at Bluefield before
>> being sent to the scrappers in Portsmouth. So it is just possible that 
>> some
>> fine Bluefield person stole one while the 604 was there. Or maybe they 
>> got
>> it from the scrapper and returned to Bluefield with it. Who knows? But if
>> two more people should say they have a plate from the 604, then at least 
>> one
>> of them is suspect. BTW, the J plates were chrome plated, with the 
>> recessed
>> area being painted black. If yours doesn't look like that, I would 
>> consider
>> it suspect. Jim Nichols
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
>> [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
>> Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 6:32 PM
>> To: NW Mailing List
>> Subject: J #604 builders plate
>>
>> Greetings from Dry Branch,
>> Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J"
>> builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago? I would have thought all
>> 14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does seem to be the 
>> real
>> deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I have is that it came from
>> Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures dating from after the wreck on
>> 6/12/46 show no builders plates and wonder if they could have been left 
>> off
>> after the repair. I know it's going to be difficult to piece together the
>> history but I'd like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly
>> appreciated.
>>
>> Chuck Speicher
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Ready for Fall shows? Use Bing to find helpful ratings and reviews on 
> digital tv's.
> http://www.bing.com/shopping/search?q=digital+tv's&form=MSHNCB&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MSHNCB_Vertical_Shopping_DigitalTVs_1x1
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
> 



From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 20:01:52 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 20:01:52 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
In-Reply-To: <741EDE222CC64CDCACEE11695330AD97@StudyComputer>
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu>
	<D7FD6FDE-EAB2-48F3-9957-6DFE00CEBF36@rev.net>
	<0KQ900ETGR24AUF8@vms173013.mailsrvcs.net>
	<741EDE222CC64CDCACEE11695330AD97@StudyComputer>
Message-ID: <0KQA00FENO1QY4L5@vms173019.mailsrvcs.net>

Larry

They all had the same size bolt after they were placed under the 
walkway above the cylinders.  Of course the 611 - 613 never had them 
mounted on the side of the smoke box with the exception of the 611 
when returned from Birmingham with the reissue plates.

The 611 had the large bolt holes. If you see a 611 plate with small 
holes there is a problem.  As info I was in the roundhouse when the 
611 plates were removed.  One of the bolts was given to me and I 
still have it. There may be a number of reissue 611 plates like the 
ones put on when it was rebuilt.  I know for a fact they had a number 
of extras for the 1218 made to give to the VIP's.

Not sure what you are talking about the 600 plate in Roanoke has 
small holes.  When the 600 came through Roanoke going to scrap it had 
the builder plate on the left side.  The one on the Engineers side 
had been removed east of Roanoke.  The plate on the 600 had the same 
size bolt or the large size. As info Tom Dressler got the plate off 
the left side of  the 600 from the scrap yard.  Not sure where it is now.

I have seen at least one original plate off most of the class J with 
the exception of the 613.


Jim

At 06:37 PM 9/20/2009, you wrote:
>Jim
>
>  In comparison with 611,602,609s original plates appears to be the same size
>
>holes.  Although 600s Plate up north seems to have larger holes and 
>the 600 plate
>
>that's in Roanoke has the small holes.
>
>
>
>Larry
>
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "NW Mailing List" 
><nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 8:09 AM
>Subject: Re: J #604 builders plate
>
>
>>Ken
>>
>>I agree with your views.
>>
>>In addition the holes for the mounting bolts are way too small for 
>>a original J plate.  This can be seen without any close inspection.
>>
>>Jim Blacktock
>>
>>At 09:34 PM 9/19/2009, you wrote:
>>>Interestingly enough, a 604 builders plate is on ebay right now as
>>>well. I am somewhat suspicious of that one, I cannot see any kind of
>>>marks on the back from the boiler straps. But that may just be a lack
>>>of quality photos.
>>>
>>>Builders plates are a complex subject, and there are generally a lot
>>>more fakes than real ones out there. The J plates are one of the
>>>hardest and most expensive to get, I suspect most if not all were
>>>saved. I also have reason to believe that the plates of the 600 in
>>>October 1941 had multiple copies made at the time and given to folks
>>>close to the project, in addition to the reproductions made in the
>>>last 20 or so years.
>>>
>>>Good luck
>>>
>>>Ken Miller
>>>
>>>On Sep 19, 2009, at 7:32 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:
>>>
>>>>Greetings from Dry Branch,
>>>>        Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J"
>>>>builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago?  I would have
>>>>thought all 14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does
>>>>seem to be the real deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I
>>>>have is that it came from Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures
>>>>dating from after the wreck on 6/12/46 show no builders plates and
>>>>wonder if they could have been left off after the repair. I know
>>>>it's going to be difficult to piece together the history but I'd
>>>>like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly appreciated.
>>>>
>>>>Chuck Speicher
>>>>________________________________________
>>>>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>>>To change your subscription go to
>>>>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>>>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>>>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>>
>>>________________________________________
>>>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>>To change your subscription go to
>>>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>>
>>>__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
>>>signature database 4441 (20090919) __________
>>>
>>>The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>>>
>>>http://www.eset.com
>>>
>>
>>________________________________________
>>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>To change your subscription go to
>>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>
>
>
>________________________________________
>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>To change your subscription go to
>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
>__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
>signature database 4441 (20090919) __________
>
>The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
>http://www.eset.com
>
>


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 22:23:52 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 22:23:52 EDT
Subject: J #604 builders plate
Message-ID: <c67.5f5bc6ba.37e83db8@aol.com>

I just want to thank everyone who responded about my builders plate. I've 
learned alot and am still learning! Regards,
Charles Speicher
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/attachments/20090920/8d986243/attachment.htm>

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 20 23:25:16 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 23:25:16 -0400
Subject: "J" Builders Plates
References: <2D22E4C0-505C-4167-A780-3C037F8CB0CB@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <003301ca3a6b$23c44f20$6500a8c0@Dad>

Would you please identify yourself.  I'm sure this was just an oversight.

Thanks,

Sam Putney


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: "N&W MAILING LIST LIST MAILING" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 8:51 AM
Subject: "J" Builders Plates


>I have a small foundry in my backyard, at which I pour aluminum,  
> brass and bronze. Though I mainly pour parts for my 1/8th scale RR  
> hobby, I have occasionally poured builders plates.  If you have an  
> original to use as a pattern, a builders plate is one of the easiest  
> castings to make.
> 
> I bought a plaster replica of a "J" plate on the internet a couple of  
> years ago. It is my intention to not only duplicate that plate in  
> metal, (so I can use it outdoors) but by changing the numbers, pour  
> all the "J" series in bronze, when I find the time.
> 
> Because they are so easy to copy, it certainly is "BUYER BEWARE" for  
> builders plates.
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/