From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 01:16:20 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 05:16:20 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: Engine "Slippery-ness"
Message-ID: <422215.79807.qm@web23907.mail.ird.yahoo.com>

To add another observation to Dave's comments, in the recent articles in both the Keystone and Arrow re: the J's test on the Pennsylvania, Pennsy's official test reports stated that the J was not slippery. 

I don't know how the Pennsylvania and N&W's plant maintenance compared, but that a crew that was unfamiliar with  the J had no problems casts some doubt on the 4.0 rule of thumb. 

Matt Goodmam
Columbus, OH

On Sep 15, 2009, at 7:04 PM, NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> wrote:

I may get zapped on this by those with first-hand experience, but IMO factor of adhesion is not the ruling factor in predicting a locomotive's propensity to slip.

N&W operated locomotives with FA's far less than the so-called magic number of 4.0 (which is an average number, not an absolute figure).  

<snip>

 On the next division (same train assignment), the same locomotive exhibited no deficiencies because of more skilled operation.


Dave Stephenson



      


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 09:51:43 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 09:51:43 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
Message-ID: <4AB74CB002000050000545E6@smtp1.mcg.edu>

I have 2150 still in the same condition as when it was given to me by an employee about 37 years ago. The studs are stil on the back and there is black paint over the numbers. I will probably donate it to the society one day.
Thanks,
Wally Edwards 

>>> NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> 09/20/09 7:32 PM >>>
Y6 number plates are selling in the $2000.00 dollar range
+or- couple hundred does depend on their condition
studs cut off the back or not. What number do you have?

Larry Evans
Kenova,WV


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 6:34 PM
Subject: RE: J #604 builders plate


> WOW! What do you think a Y6 number plate would go for?
> W.Edwards
>
>>>> NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> 09/20/09 10:57 AM >>>
>
> Good morning,
>
>      I saw where the N&WRY J#604 Builders Plate sold for $11,111.99 plus 
> $10.00 shipping on eBay!!! Too rich for most of us, I'm sure. I hope it 
> was not a reproduction. The auction ended on 9-19-09. Item #170383295546.
>
> Happy collecting,
>
> Norris Deyerle
>
>> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>> Subject: RE: J #604 builders plate
>> Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 21:58:51 -0500
>> From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
>>
>> About 1950, N&W started moving the builders plates on the J's, K2's and
>> K2a's to just below the running board. We first noticed this when the 611
>> was built with no visible builders plates. But they were there - just in 
>> a
>> new location where they were not easily visible. I suppose this was a
>> cosmetic consideration (the streamlining was not interrupted by the 
>> builders
>> plate, or maybe they didn't want people noticing how old the K's were.)
>> Anyway, this was what happened, but all the J's still had their plates
>> firmly attached to the smokebox - just lower than they had been. Don't 
>> know
>> about the 604, but some J's were stored temporarily at Bluefield before
>> being sent to the scrappers in Portsmouth. So it is just possible that 
>> some
>> fine Bluefield person stole one while the 604 was there. Or maybe they 
>> got
>> it from the scrapper and returned to Bluefield with it. Who knows? But if
>> two more people should say they have a plate from the 604, then at least 
>> one
>> of them is suspect. BTW, the J plates were chrome plated, with the 
>> recessed
>> area being painted black. If yours doesn't look like that, I would 
>> consider
>> it suspect. Jim Nichols
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
>> [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
>> Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 6:32 PM
>> To: NW Mailing List
>> Subject: J #604 builders plate
>>
>> Greetings from Dry Branch,
>> Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J"
>> builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago? I would have thought all
>> 14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does seem to be the 
>> real
>> deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I have is that it came from
>> Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures dating from after the wreck on
>> 6/12/46 show no builders plates and wonder if they could have been left 
>> off
>> after the repair. I know it's going to be difficult to piece together the
>> history but I'd like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly
>> appreciated.
>>
>> Chuck Speicher
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Ready for Fall shows? Use Bing to find helpful ratings and reviews on 
> digital tv's.
> http://www.bing.com/shopping/search?q=digital+tv's&form=MSHNCB&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MSHNCB_Vertical_Shopping_DigitalTVs_1x1
> ________________________________________
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> To change your subscription go to
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> 


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To change your subscription go to
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 10:15:23 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 10:15:23 -0400
Subject: Concord-Forest
In-Reply-To: <4AAFF4F9.2030508@vt.edu>
References: <4AAFF4F9.2030508@vt.edu>
Message-ID: <8CC08DD17C67DF0-7B4-124C7@webmail-d064.sysops.aol.com>





Following is from a hysterical plaque on US 460-



??????????????????????????????????? CONCORD DEPOT

"The Southside Railroad provided service at Concord in 1854

when the track was completed from Petersburg to Lynchburg.

During the Civil War, these rail lines were important for troops and

supplies.? On 11 June (no year stated), seven days before the 

Battle of Lynchburg, Union army forces were dispatched from

Brig.General Willard Averell's Second Calvary Division to

destroy rail and telegraph lines in the region.? On 14 June

(again, no year mentioned), the Federals burned Concord

Depot, a train, a portion of the track and other railroad

structures.? They then marched toward Rustburg."



And remember, in the 1860's, the main line Phoebe to

to Lynchburg through Concord (Six-Mile, etc.) was?THE (one and

only)??route.

????????????????????????????????????????????????????? Harry Bundy
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 10:56:14 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 10:56:14 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu> <001d01ca399e$487c6b90$d97542b0$@net>
Message-ID: <3A24087D4D954080986F61541B0672DF@Jimmy>

"About 1950, N&W started moving the builders plates on the J's, K2's and K2a's to just below the running board."

Can someone tell me exactly where that location was on the K2/K2a's and what did it look like?
Jimmy Lisle
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 11:21:37 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 11:21:37 -0400
Subject: Concord-Forest
In-Reply-To: <8CC08DD17C67DF0-7B4-124C7@webmail-d064.sysops.aol.com>
References: <4AAFF4F9.2030508@vt.edu>
	<8CC08DD17C67DF0-7B4-124C7@webmail-d064.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <8ae8c7d20909210821n65aba2f8h81e5eaa98e1d72b4@mail.gmail.com>

I think you meant "Historical"?

On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 10:15 AM, NW Mailing List
<nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>wrote:

>
>
>
> *Following is from a hysterical plaque on US 460-*
> **
> *                                    CONCORD DEPOT*
> *"The Southside Railroad provided service at Concord in 1854*
> *when the track was completed from Petersburg to Lynchburg.*
> *During the Civil War, these rail lines were important for troops and*
> *supplies.  On 11 June (no year stated), seven days before the *
> *Battle of Lynchburg, Union army forces were dispatched from*
> *Brig.General Willard Averell's Second Calvary Division to*
> *destroy rail and telegraph lines in the region.  On 14 June*
> *(again, no year mentioned), the Federals burned Concord*
> *Depot, a train, a portion of the track and other railroad*
> *structures.  They then marched toward Rustburg."*
> **
> *And remember, in the 1860's, the main line Phoebe to*
> *to Lynchburg through Concord (Six-Mile, etc.) was THE (one and*
> *only) * *route.*
> *                                                      Harry Bundy*
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>



-- 

Stephen Leacock<http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/s/stephen_leacock.html>
- "I detest life-insurance agents: they always argue that I shall some
day
die, which is not so."
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 11:19:18 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 11:19:18 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
In-Reply-To: <0KQA00FENO1QY4L5@vms173019.mailsrvcs.net>
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu><D7FD6FDE-EAB2-48F3-9957-6DFE00CEBF36@rev.net><0KQ900ETGR24AUF8@vms173013.mailsrvcs.net><741EDE222CC64CDCACEE11695330AD97@StudyComputer>
	<0KQA00FENO1QY4L5@vms173019.mailsrvcs.net>
Message-ID: <349CF121830E4DDEBA86591DD502F92C@071927350f>

Shouldn't we also mention that replica builder plates were frequently cast
in yellow brass and not the original's material, which was bronze?  Yellow
brass is easy to see by observation as it is yellowish while bronze has a
red-orange color.

Gary Rolih
Cincinnati

 
-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 8:02 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: J #604 builders plate

Larry

They all had the same size bolt after they were placed under the 
walkway above the cylinders.  Of course the 611 - 613 never had them 
mounted on the side of the smoke box with the exception of the 611 
when returned from Birmingham with the reissue plates.

The 611 had the large bolt holes. If you see a 611 plate with small 
holes there is a problem.  As info I was in the roundhouse when the 
611 plates were removed.  One of the bolts was given to me and I 
still have it. There may be a number of reissue 611 plates like the 
ones put on when it was rebuilt.  I know for a fact they had a number 
of extras for the 1218 made to give to the VIP's.

Not sure what you are talking about the 600 plate in Roanoke has 
small holes.  When the 600 came through Roanoke going to scrap it had 
the builder plate on the left side.  The one on the Engineers side 
had been removed east of Roanoke.  The plate on the 600 had the same 
size bolt or the large size. As info Tom Dressler got the plate off 
the left side of  the 600 from the scrap yard.  Not sure where it is now.

I have seen at least one original plate off most of the class J with 
the exception of the 613.


Jim

At 06:37 PM 9/20/2009, you wrote:
>Jim
>
>  In comparison with 611,602,609s original plates appears to be the same
size
>
>holes.  Although 600s Plate up north seems to have larger holes and 
>the 600 plate
>
>that's in Roanoke has the small holes.
>
>
>
>Larry
>
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "NW Mailing List" 
><nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 8:09 AM
>Subject: Re: J #604 builders plate
>
>
>>Ken
>>
>>I agree with your views.
>>
>>In addition the holes for the mounting bolts are way too small for 
>>a original J plate.  This can be seen without any close inspection.
>>
>>Jim Blacktock
>>
>>At 09:34 PM 9/19/2009, you wrote:
>>>Interestingly enough, a 604 builders plate is on ebay right now as
>>>well. I am somewhat suspicious of that one, I cannot see any kind of
>>>marks on the back from the boiler straps. But that may just be a lack
>>>of quality photos.
>>>
>>>Builders plates are a complex subject, and there are generally a lot
>>>more fakes than real ones out there. The J plates are one of the
>>>hardest and most expensive to get, I suspect most if not all were
>>>saved. I also have reason to believe that the plates of the 600 in
>>>October 1941 had multiple copies made at the time and given to folks
>>>close to the project, in addition to the reproductions made in the
>>>last 20 or so years.
>>>
>>>Good luck
>>>
>>>Ken Miller
>>>
>>>On Sep 19, 2009, at 7:32 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:
>>>
>>>>Greetings from Dry Branch,
>>>>        Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J"
>>>>builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago?  I would have
>>>>thought all 14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does
>>>>seem to be the real deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I
>>>>have is that it came from Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures
>>>>dating from after the wreck on 6/12/46 show no builders plates and
>>>>wonder if they could have been left off after the repair. I know
>>>>it's going to be difficult to piece together the history but I'd
>>>>like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly appreciated.
>>>>
>>>>Chuck Speicher
>>>>________________________________________
>>>>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>>>To change your subscription go to
>>>>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>>>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>>>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>>
>>>________________________________________
>>>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>>To change your subscription go to
>>>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>>
>>>__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
>>>signature database 4441 (20090919) __________
>>>
>>>The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>>>
>>>http://www.eset.com
>>>
>>
>>________________________________________
>>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>To change your subscription go to
>>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>
>
>
>________________________________________
>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>To change your subscription go to
>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
>__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
>signature database 4441 (20090919) __________
>
>The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
>http://www.eset.com
>
>

________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To change your subscription go to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 14:45:04 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 14:45:04 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
In-Reply-To: <3A24087D4D954080986F61541B0672DF@Jimmy>
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu> <001d01ca399e$487c6b90$d97542b0$@net>
	<3A24087D4D954080986F61541B0672DF@Jimmy>
Message-ID: <0KQC00LPN41NSVN3@vms173013.mailsrvcs.net>

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 12:14:46 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 11:14:46 -0500
Subject: J #604 builders plate
In-Reply-To: <3A24087D4D954080986F61541B0672DF@Jimmy>
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu> <001d01ca399e$487c6b90$d97542b0$@net>
	<3A24087D4D954080986F61541B0672DF@Jimmy>
Message-ID: <001b01ca3ad6$a3e2c2c0$eba84840$@net>

Same as on the J's - Just below the running board, directly in line with its
former location. You had to get your head pretty close to the cylinder and
look up behind the skirt to see it. Helped if it was a sunny day. On the K's
at least, there was a little space between the smokebox and the running
board that let a little light shine down and help you read the plate. My
father and I made the discovery by accident one day when we were at the
roundhouse and just happened to look up at a K2 which was between the
turntable and the Bluefield shop building. After that, we looked up the same
way at the 611-613 and discovered they had been built with plates in this
location.   Jim Nichols

 

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 9:56 AM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: J #604 builders plate

 

"About 1950, N&W started moving the builders plates on the J's, K2's and
K2a's to just below the running board."

 

Can someone tell me exactly where that location was on the K2/K2a's and what
did it look like?

Jimmy Lisle

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 12:36:49 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 12:36:49 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
In-Reply-To: <0KQA00FENO1QY4L5@vms173019.mailsrvcs.net>
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu><D7FD6FDE-EAB2-48F3-9957-6DFE00CEBF36@rev.net><0KQ900ETGR24AUF8@vms173013.mailsrvcs.net><741EDE222CC64CDCACEE11695330AD97@StudyComputer>
	<0KQA00FENO1QY4L5@vms173019.mailsrvcs.net>
Message-ID: <2A6DE96C9E3D4BEDA74E8C209DAD6061@071927350f>

Jim:  One 'original' 600 plate exists down in a Florida museum it seems.  I
had an inquiry from a gentleman who has one with mostly beat off chrome and
the corrosion stripes across the back for an 'under-mounted' plate.  He got
it from another museum collection that folded.  So, he did not know any of
its history.  He contacted the NWHS to see what we could tell him.  It would
seem that two others can be located for the 600 that are originals as well.
Larry Evans was instrumental in describing the mounting configuration and
its influence on the back.  

Since builder's plates are easy and simple to cast if you have a pattern,
one has to wonder if the Roanoke Shops poured 'extras' for stock to replace
any that fell off in service or were damaged?  Dressler told me about how he
got his Class J class plate; the shop was pouring a bunch of them and they
gave one to him.  One has to assume that class plates were vulnerable to
side-swiping and that they could shake loose from the cylinder jackets over
time.  Or?  

Gary Rolih
Cincinnati

 
-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 8:02 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: J #604 builders plate

Larry

They all had the same size bolt after they were placed under the 
walkway above the cylinders.  Of course the 611 - 613 never had them 
mounted on the side of the smoke box with the exception of the 611 
when returned from Birmingham with the reissue plates.

The 611 had the large bolt holes. If you see a 611 plate with small 
holes there is a problem.  As info I was in the roundhouse when the 
611 plates were removed.  One of the bolts was given to me and I 
still have it. There may be a number of reissue 611 plates like the 
ones put on when it was rebuilt.  I know for a fact they had a number 
of extras for the 1218 made to give to the VIP's.

Not sure what you are talking about the 600 plate in Roanoke has 
small holes.  When the 600 came through Roanoke going to scrap it had 
the builder plate on the left side.  The one on the Engineers side 
had been removed east of Roanoke.  The plate on the 600 had the same 
size bolt or the large size. As info Tom Dressler got the plate off 
the left side of  the 600 from the scrap yard.  Not sure where it is now.

I have seen at least one original plate off most of the class J with 
the exception of the 613.


Jim

At 06:37 PM 9/20/2009, you wrote:
>Jim
>
>  In comparison with 611,602,609s original plates appears to be the same
size
>
>holes.  Although 600s Plate up north seems to have larger holes and 
>the 600 plate
>
>that's in Roanoke has the small holes.
>
>
>
>Larry
>
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "NW Mailing List" 
><nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 8:09 AM
>Subject: Re: J #604 builders plate
>
>
>>Ken
>>
>>I agree with your views.
>>
>>In addition the holes for the mounting bolts are way too small for 
>>a original J plate.  This can be seen without any close inspection.
>>
>>Jim Blacktock
>>
>>At 09:34 PM 9/19/2009, you wrote:
>>>Interestingly enough, a 604 builders plate is on ebay right now as
>>>well. I am somewhat suspicious of that one, I cannot see any kind of
>>>marks on the back from the boiler straps. But that may just be a lack
>>>of quality photos.
>>>
>>>Builders plates are a complex subject, and there are generally a lot
>>>more fakes than real ones out there. The J plates are one of the
>>>hardest and most expensive to get, I suspect most if not all were
>>>saved. I also have reason to believe that the plates of the 600 in
>>>October 1941 had multiple copies made at the time and given to folks
>>>close to the project, in addition to the reproductions made in the
>>>last 20 or so years.
>>>
>>>Good luck
>>>
>>>Ken Miller
>>>
>>>On Sep 19, 2009, at 7:32 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:
>>>
>>>>Greetings from Dry Branch,
>>>>        Would anyone have any ideas on how I can authenticate a "J"
>>>>builders plate I came across a couple weeks ago?  I would have
>>>>thought all 14 numbers had been accounted for by now but this does
>>>>seem to be the real deal. It's from the 604 and the only history I
>>>>have is that it came from Bluefield. I've noticed that pictures
>>>>dating from after the wreck on 6/12/46 show no builders plates and
>>>>wonder if they could have been left off after the repair. I know
>>>>it's going to be difficult to piece together the history but I'd
>>>>like to try. Any suggestions or info will be greatly appreciated.
>>>>
>>>>Chuck Speicher
>>>>________________________________________
>>>>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>>>To change your subscription go to
>>>>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>>>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>>>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>>
>>>________________________________________
>>>NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>>To change your subscription go to
>>>http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>>Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>>http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>>
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>>To change your subscription go to
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>________________________________________
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>__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus 
>signature database 4441 (20090919) __________
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>The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
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To change your subscription go to
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Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 14:57:48 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 14:57:48 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Near wreck
Message-ID: <43F8E7BCD9CD4CA1ABB890ADB3432F6B@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 23, 1910

THE GRAHAM DAILY NEWS
------
Wreck Narrowly Averted

    Train No. 11 was delayed at Graham yesterday for more than an hour by a large rock that slipped from the top of the deep cut at the furnace and obstructed the track.  Tom Leedy, who walked through the cut just a few minutes before the westbound passenger train was due, saw the rock fall and hastened to the tower and notified the operator of the obstruction just in time to catch the passenger train, thus preventing by a close call what might have proved a very serious wreck.  Conductor Moran of the passenger train stated that the engine would have struck the boulder without a doubt had the train not been flagged, as the cut is a very deep one and situated in a stiff curve.
------
Gordon Hamilton 
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 20:08:24 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 19:08:24 -0500
Subject: "J" Builders Plates
Message-ID: <00BADC33-83E2-4887-A9AC-514795902DF4@earthlink.net>

Sorry about leaving off my name, I sometimes forget to add my name,  
figuring the computer will put it in the heading.

Here is a post I put up a few years ago; 2004:

     From: Ronald  Peisker <
Date: Fri Aug 20, 2004  01:33:29  PM US/Central
To: N&W MAILING LIST < nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Subject: N&W ARTIFACTS

While this Forum is on the subject of builders plates, I thought I  
would add this comment.

When my brother and I were driving thru Portmouth, Ohio in 1958, we  
noticed a scrapper right next to the N&W was scrapping steam  
locomotives.  In 1959, my brother and a friend drove down (Chicago  
area) to Portsmouth in my 1956 Studebaker, and purchased as much as  
they could fit into that vehicle.

They got the following BP's (At $1.00 each)  #268 (Y6 - 2120 - Sept  
1936 - 1st of Y6 series.), #279 (A - 1208 -  May 1937.), #394 (Y6b -  
2191 - Nov 1950.), and #411(S1a - 213-  Oct 1951.).   The bell off of  
Y3 - 2073 and a Clinchfieid top mounted bell of unknown origin, at  
$75.00 each.  My brother requested, and they did torch around the  
Pile National Headlight on  "J" 605 and took the marker lights off of  
606, all at $75.00.  Those BP's were already gone.  The last item was  
an air horn.  He had his eye on a N&W whistle, but worried about the  
car springs. When everything was loaded it looked like the the  
Studebaker would "Bottom out".

After he got home, we thought about renting a truck, driving down,  
and loading it up, but sorry to say we never got to do that.

I have that roughly cut out section of 605's nose (~32" dia.) mounted  
on the wall in my basement shop along with the markers.  It's a shame  
he could not have gotten the whole nose mounted on top of that  
Studebaker.   BP's are relatively easy to copy, and I have done this  
with these and other BP's, but headlights and marker lights are  
almost impossible to copy.   I'm in the process of making a copy of  
the bell off of 2073, but that's for a future email.

Ron Peisker


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 20:10:00 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 20:10:00 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu> <001d01ca399e$487c6b90$d97542b0$@net>
	<3A24087D4D954080986F61541B0672DF@Jimmy>
	<001b01ca3ad6$a3e2c2c0$eba84840$@net>
Message-ID: <F5CBF9AC482EA54EB3F59D6E0CFC3294010D6F8B@EXEVS02.its.uncc.edu>

Any particular reason they moved them?

Mike Weeks
Greenville NC


-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org on behalf of NW Mailing List
Sent: Mon 9/21/2009 12:14 PM
To: 'NW Mailing List'
Subject: RE: J #604 builders plate
 
Same as on the J's - Just below the running board, directly in line with its former location. You had to get your head pretty close to the cylinder and look up behind the skirt to see it. Helped if it was a sunny day. On the K's at least, there was a little space between the smokebox and the running board that let a little light shine down and help you read the plate. My father and I made the discovery by accident one day when we were at the roundhouse and just happened to look up at a K2 which was between the turntable and the Bluefield shop building. After that, we looked up the same way at the 611-613 and discovered they had been built with plates in this location.   Jim Nichols

 

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 9:56 AM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: J #604 builders plate

 

"About 1950, N&W started moving the builders plates on the J's, K2's and K2a's to just below the running board."

 

Can someone tell me exactly where that location was on the K2/K2a's and what did it look like?

Jimmy Lisle


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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 22:33:39 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 22:33:39 -0400
Subject: J #604 builders plate
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu>
	<001d01ca399e$487c6b90$d97542b0$@net><3A24087D4D954080986F61541B0672DF@Jimmy><001b01ca3ad6$a3e2c2c0$eba84840$@net>
	<F5CBF9AC482EA54EB3F59D6E0CFC3294010D6F8B@EXEVS02.its.uncc.edu>
Message-ID: <293C777CEC02455BADD55001EBFFBACD@StudyComputer>

Jimmy
    K2 Would have had the regular Alco Brooks rectangle plate, K2a Would 
have a regular 9 1/4 Baldwin
round plate. Some that I have seen were chromed but not all of them may have 
worn off  like  most of the
Js did.

Larry Evans
Kenova,WV


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 8:10 PM
Subject: RE: J #604 builders plate


Any particular reason they moved them?

Mike Weeks
Greenville NC


-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org on behalf of NW Mailing List
Sent: Mon 9/21/2009 12:14 PM
To: 'NW Mailing List'
Subject: RE: J #604 builders plate

Same as on the J's - Just below the running board, directly in line with its 
former location. You had to get your head pretty close to the cylinder and 
look up behind the skirt to see it. Helped if it was a sunny day. On the K's 
at least, there was a little space between the smokebox and the running 
board that let a little light shine down and help you read the plate. My 
father and I made the discovery by accident one day when we were at the 
roundhouse and just happened to look up at a K2 which was between the 
turntable and the Bluefield shop building. After that, we looked up the same 
way at the 611-613 and discovered they had been built with plates in this 
location.   Jim Nichols



From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org 
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 9:56 AM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: J #604 builders plate



"About 1950, N&W started moving the builders plates on the J's, K2's and 
K2a's to just below the running board."



Can someone tell me exactly where that location was on the K2/K2a's and what 
did it look like?

Jimmy Lisle





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/ 



From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Mon Sep 21 22:34:15 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 22:34:15 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman
Message-ID: <7E2CB0DDC4A947FB963C234DFB4B3456@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 23, 1910

IN CITY AND COALFIELD
------
Pullman Car Change

    Commencing March 6th the Pullman car which now runs between Gary and Philadelphia will run between Gary and Jersey City.  The Pullman from Roanoke will be discontinued to Jersey City and the Gary Car will do the work.  For a number of years every man from this section who has visited the union station in Philadelphia has smiled and thought of home when he saw a sign at the station saying, "This car for Gary, W. Va."  They can now be at home in Jersey City as they will be greeted by a sign across the river from New York which will say in large type, "This car for Gary, W. Va."  Locally the car will have to be called the New York special, as the people in this section will feel that they are not being treated right unless they feel that all the world knows that a car runs direct from Gary and this city to New York.
------
[There are two thing puzzling about this report.  One, the June 1915 Official Guide shows the New York connections then were over the PRR into Pennsylvania Station in Manhattan--not Jersey City.  Could B&O trains have been used to Jersey City in 1910?  Two, this same 1915 guide shows Trains 1 and 2 on the Shenandoah Valley route  handling a Pullman between Winston-Salem and New York and a Pullman between Gary  and Philadelphia.  If the latter were shifted to Jersey City in 1910, it apparently was shifted back to Philadelphia by 1915.]

Gordon Hamilton
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 22 01:58:51 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 00:58:51 -0500
Subject: J #604 builders plate
In-Reply-To: <F5CBF9AC482EA54EB3F59D6E0CFC3294010D6F8B@EXEVS02.its.uncc.edu>
References: <4AB56A09.8040704@vt.edu>
	<001d01ca399e$487c6b90$d97542b0$@net>	<3A24087D4D954080986F61541B0672DF@Jimmy>	<001b01ca3ad6$a3e2c2c0$eba84840$@net>
	<F5CBF9AC482EA54EB3F59D6E0CFC3294010D6F8B@EXEVS02.its.uncc.edu>
Message-ID: <000f01ca3b49$c330b100$49921300$@net>

One can only guess. The decision had to have been made prior to the building
of the 611-613 in 1950, as they are the first to show up with no builders
plates visible. The fact that they then proceeded to move them from their
existing locations on 11 J's and 22 K's indicates that they did not want
them visible on streamlined locomotives. Did somebody think their appearance
distracted from the streamlining? The only other possibility that occurs to
me is that they didn't want people to see how relatively old the K's were.
But if that were the reason, why would they start by moving them on brand
new J's? I have never been able to figure it out.          Jim Nichols

-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 7:10 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: RE: J #604 builders plate

Any particular reason they moved them?

Mike Weeks
Greenville NC

"About 1950, N&W started moving the builders plates on the J's, K2's and
K2a's to just below the running board."

 



From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 22 09:04:57 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 09:04:57 -0400
Subject: Concord-Forest
In-Reply-To: <8ae8c7d20909210821n65aba2f8h81e5eaa98e1d72b4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4AAFF4F9.2030508@vt.edu><8CC08DD17C67DF0-7B4-124C7@webmail-d064.sysops.aol.com>
	<8ae8c7d20909210821n65aba2f8h81e5eaa98e1d72b4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8CC099C6B51D0C6-3600-192E@webmail-m071.sysops.aol.com>




-----Original Message-----
From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Mon, Sep 21, 2009 11:21 am
Subject: Re: Concord-Forest


I think you meant "Historical"?

? No, it's hysterical, e.g. I am a member of the N&W 

Hysterical Society.?? Harry Bundy
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 22 09:47:51 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 08:47:51 -0500
Subject: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman
In-Reply-To: <7E2CB0DDC4A947FB963C234DFB4B3456@DellVostro>
References: <7E2CB0DDC4A947FB963C234DFB4B3456@DellVostro>
Message-ID: <000c01ca3b8b$4781c3e0$d6854ba0$@net>

When was Penn Station opened? Looks like we need a 1910 Official Guide.
Jim Nichols

 

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 9:34 PM
To: 3N&W Mailing List
Subject: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman

 

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 23, 1910

 

IN CITY AND COALFIELD

------

Pullman Car Change

 

    Commencing March 6th the Pullman car which now runs between Gary and
Philadelphia will run between Gary and Jersey City.  The Pullman from
Roanoke will be discontinued to Jersey City and the Gary Car will do the
work.  For a number of years every man from this section who has visited the
union station in Philadelphia has smiled and thought of home when he saw a
sign at the station saying, "This car for Gary, W. Va."  They can now be at
home in Jersey City as they will be greeted by a sign across the river from
New York which will say in large type, "This car for Gary, W. Va."  Locally
the car will have to be called the New York special, as the people in this
section will feel that they are not being treated right unless they feel
that all the world knows that a car runs direct from Gary and this city to
New York.

------

[There are two thing puzzling about this report.  One, the June 1915
Official Guide shows the New York connections then were over the PRR into
Pennsylvania Station in Manhattan--not Jersey City.  Could B&O trains have
been used to Jersey City in 1910?  Two, this same 1915 guide shows Trains 1
and 2 on the Shenandoah Valley route  handling a Pullman between
Winston-Salem and New York and a Pullman between Gary  and Philadelphia.  If
the latter were shifted to Jersey City in 1910, it apparently was shifted
back to Philadelphia by 1915.]

 

Gordon Hamilton

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 22 09:37:53 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 09:37:53 -0400
Subject: Concord-Forest
In-Reply-To: <8CC099C6B51D0C6-3600-192E@webmail-m071.sysops.aol.com>
References: <4AAFF4F9.2030508@vt.edu>
	<8CC08DD17C67DF0-7B4-124C7@webmail-d064.sysops.aol.com>
	<8ae8c7d20909210821n65aba2f8h81e5eaa98e1d72b4@mail.gmail.com>
	<8CC099C6B51D0C6-3600-192E@webmail-m071.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <8ae8c7d20909220637p6986ec0fr47ebc0ead86fb4ac@mail.gmail.com>

Heh heh gotcha!

On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 9:04 AM, NW Mailing List
<nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>wrote:

>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Sent: Mon, Sep 21, 2009 11:21 am
> Subject: Re: Concord-Forest
>
> I think you meant "Historical"?
>
>   No, it's hysterical, e.g. I am a member of the N&W
> Hysterical Society.   Harry Bundy
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>



-- 

Charles de Gaulle<http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/c/charles_de_gaulle.html>
- "The better I get to know men, the more I find myself loving dogs."
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 22 12:09:53 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 12:09:53 -0400
Subject: Dates for NH Penn Station
Message-ID: <A14A22EE58A74E788AB96A85B22CDA82@NEWDELL>

>From Triumph V - Philadelphia to New York 1830 - 2002

Authors David W. Messer and Charles S. Roberts.

26 Dec 1901 PRR President Cassatt presented a plan for electrifying the
railroad from Harrison NJ thru the NJ Meadow Lands and then via a tunnel
under Bergin Hill and the Hudson River to a grand Terminal in midtown
Manhattan.

 

In April 1902 Charles Follen McKim was contracted as Architect. 

Ground breaking for the station was held at 31st Street and Ninth Avenue 9
July 1904.

Pennsylvania Station was formally opened on 1 Aug 1910

The first train was Long Island RR on 8 September 1910.

At 1202 AM 27 November 1910 the first west bound PRR Train departed the
station.

At 12:50 AM the first east bound train arrived from Philadelphia.

 

Pete Heimbach

 

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 22 13:42:26 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 13:42:26 -0400
Subject: "J" Builders Plates
References: <00BADC33-83E2-4887-A9AC-514795902DF4@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <002c01ca3bac$0dce7b90$6500a8c0@Dad>

Thanks, Ron.


Sam Putney

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "NW Mailing List" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: "N&W MAILING LIST LIST MAILING" <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 8:08 PM
Subject: Re:"J" Builders Plates


> Sorry about leaving off my name, I sometimes forget to add my name,  
> figuring the computer will put it in the heading.
> 
> Here is a post I put up a few years ago; 2004:
> 
>     From: Ronald  Peisker <
> Date: Fri Aug 20, 2004  01:33:29  PM US/Central
> To: N&W MAILING LIST < nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Subject: N&W ARTIFACTS
> 
> While this Forum is on the subject of builders plates, I thought I  
> would add this comment.
> 
> When my brother and I were driving thru Portmouth, Ohio in 1958, we  
> noticed a scrapper right next to the N&W was scrapping steam  
> locomotives.  In 1959, my brother and a friend drove down (Chicago  
> area) to Portsmouth in my 1956 Studebaker, and purchased as much as  
> they could fit into that vehicle.
> 
> They got the following BP's (At $1.00 each)  #268 (Y6 - 2120 - Sept  
> 1936 - 1st of Y6 series.), #279 (A - 1208 -  May 1937.), #394 (Y6b -  
> 2191 - Nov 1950.), and #411(S1a - 213-  Oct 1951.).   The bell off of  
> Y3 - 2073 and a Clinchfieid top mounted bell of unknown origin, at  
> $75.00 each.  My brother requested, and they did torch around the  
> Pile National Headlight on  "J" 605 and took the marker lights off of  
> 606, all at $75.00.  Those BP's were already gone.  The last item was  
> an air horn.  He had his eye on a N&W whistle, but worried about the  
> car springs. When everything was loaded it looked like the the  
> Studebaker would "Bottom out".
> 
> After he got home, we thought about renting a truck, driving down,  
> and loading it up, but sorry to say we never got to do that.
> 
> I have that roughly cut out section of 605's nose (~32" dia.) mounted  
> on the wall in my basement shop along with the markers.  It's a shame  
> he could not have gotten the whole nose mounted on top of that  
> Studebaker.   BP's are relatively easy to copy, and I have done this  
> with these and other BP's, but headlights and marker lights are  
> almost impossible to copy.   I'm in the process of making a copy of  
> the bell off of 2073, but that's for a future email.
> 
> Ron Peisker
> 
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 22 19:29:34 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 19:29:34 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman
In-Reply-To: <000c01ca3b8b$4781c3e0$d6854ba0$@net>
References: <7E2CB0DDC4A947FB963C234DFB4B3456@DellVostro>
	<000c01ca3b8b$4781c3e0$d6854ba0$@net>
Message-ID: <F5CAD0B9D3F62341B4B6EA482A168E5FD254CB6E46@SWEC9965.w-intra.net>

Penn Station in Manhattan, NYC was opened on  November 27, 1910.

Ed Painter;  Narrows, Va living in Russellville, AR

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:48 AM
To: 'NW Mailing List'
Subject: RE: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman

When was Penn Station opened? Looks like we need a 1910 Official Guide.   Jim Nichols

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 9:34 PM
To: 3N&W Mailing List
Subject: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 23, 1910

IN CITY AND COALFIELD
------
Pullman Car Change

    Commencing March 6th the Pullman car which now runs between Gary and Philadelphia will run between Gary and Jersey City.  The Pullman from Roanoke will be discontinued to Jersey City and the Gary Car will do the work.  For a number of years every man from this section who has visited the union station in Philadelphia has smiled and thought of home when he saw a sign at the station saying, "This car for Gary, W. Va."  They can now be at home in Jersey City as they will be greeted by a sign across the river from New York which will say in large type, "This car for Gary, W. Va."  Locally the car will have to be called the New York special, as the people in this section will feel that they are not being treated right unless they feel that all the world knows that a car runs direct from Gary and this city to New York.
------
[There are two thing puzzling about this report.  One, the June 1915 Official Guide shows the New York connections then were over the PRR into Pennsylvania Station in Manhattan--not Jersey City.  Could B&O trains have been used to Jersey City in 1910?  Two, this same 1915 guide shows Trains 1 and 2 on the Shenandoah Valley route  handling a Pullman between Winston-Salem and New York and a Pullman between Gary  and Philadelphia.  If the latter were shifted to Jersey City in 1910, it apparently was shifted back to Philadelphia by 1915.]

Gordon Hamilton
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 22 16:27:34 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 16:27:34 -0400
Subject: Dates for NH Penn Station
In-Reply-To: <A14A22EE58A74E788AB96A85B22CDA82@NEWDELL>
References: <A14A22EE58A74E788AB96A85B22CDA82@NEWDELL>
Message-ID: <BAY143-W19EC883E2485B28525B6E0A8DC0@phx.gbl>


Hi Friends, 

     Since we're on the Penn Station topic, I wanted to add a little known fact fo local interest. One of the 16 eagles from the main Penn Station entrance pediments is located near the end zone at the football field of Hampden-Sydney College near Farmville, Va. Log on to www.shorpy.com/node/299 for more info.  

Take care, 

Norris Deyerle 

Lynchburg, Va. 


To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
Subject: Dates for NH Penn Station
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 12:09:53 -0400
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org







>From Triumph V ? Philadelphia to New York 1830 ? 2002
Authors David W. Messer and Charles S. Roberts.
26 Dec 1901 PRR President Cassatt presented a plan for electrifying the railroad from Harrison NJ thru the NJ Meadow Lands and then via a tunnel under Bergin Hill and the Hudson River to a grand Terminal in midtown Manhattan.
 
In April 1902 Charles Follen McKim was contracted as Architect. 
Ground breaking for the station was held at 31st Street and Ninth Avenue 9 July 1904.
Pennsylvania Station was formally opened on 1 Aug 1910
The first train was Long Island RR on 8 September 1910.
At 1202 AM 27 November 1910 the first west bound PRR Train departed the station.
At 12:50 AM the first east bound train arrived from Philadelphia.
 
Pete Heimbach
  		 	   		  
_________________________________________________________________
Bing?  brings you maps, menus, and reviews organized in one place.   Try it now.
http://www.bing.com/search?q=restaurants&form=MLOGEN&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MLOGEN_Core_tagline_local_1x1
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Tue Sep 22 22:02:29 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 22:02:29 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman
References: <7E2CB0DDC4A947FB963C234DFB4B3456@DellVostro><000c01ca3b8b$4781c3e0$d6854ba0$@net>
	<F5CAD0B9D3F62341B4B6EA482A168E5FD254CB6E46@SWEC9965.w-intra.net>
Message-ID: <748B54C15D2641A0AC8C32C10ACADEB2@DellVostro>

Thanks to all who pointed out that Pennsylvania Station in New York City had not yet been opened when the Bluefield newspaper announced that the Gary Pullman's northern terminus was being switched from Philadelphia to Jersey City.  So, the PRR trains as of the March 6, 1910, effective date in the article would have terminated at Jersey City's Pennsylvania station, later known at Exchange Place, where passengers would have taken a ferry, or the Hudson Tubes, across the Hudson to Manhattan.  I rode into and out of Exchange Place several times in the late 1950's when the PRR still used that terminal for a few of its  New York and Long Branch RR trains, such as its named commuter train, The Broker.  Although it entailed a ferry ride or a ride on the Hudson Tubes, trains like The Broker provided a more direct access to Wall Street than those that used Manhattan's Pennsylvania Station, which was farther north.

Gordon Hamilton

Gordon Hamilton
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: NW Mailing List 
  To: 'NW Mailing List' 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 7:29 PM
  Subject: RE: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman


  Penn Station in Manhattan, NYC was opened on  November 27, 1910.

   

  Ed Painter;  Narrows, Va living in Russellville, AR

   

  From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
  Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:48 AM
  To: 'NW Mailing List'
  Subject: RE: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman

   

  When was Penn Station opened? Looks like we need a 1910 Official Guide.   Jim Nichols

   

  From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
  Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 9:34 PM
  To: 3N&W Mailing List
  Subject: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman

   

  Bluefield Daily Telegraph
  February 23, 1910

   

  IN CITY AND COALFIELD

  ------

  Pullman Car Change

   

      Commencing March 6th the Pullman car which now runs between Gary and Philadelphia will run between Gary and Jersey City.  The Pullman from Roanoke will be discontinued to Jersey City and the Gary Car will do the work.  For a number of years every man from this section who has visited the union station in Philadelphia has smiled and thought of home when he saw a sign at the station saying, "This car for Gary, W. Va."  They can now be at home in Jersey City as they will be greeted by a sign across the river from New York which will say in large type, "This car for Gary, W. Va."  Locally the car will have to be called the New York special, as the people in this section will feel that they are not being treated right unless they feel that all the world knows that a car runs direct from Gary and this city to New York.

  ------

  [There are two thing puzzling about this report.  One, the June 1915 Official Guide shows the New York connections then were over the PRR into Pennsylvania Station in Manhattan--not Jersey City.  Could B&O trains have been used to Jersey City in 1910?  Two, this same 1915 guide shows Trains 1 and 2 on the Shenandoah Valley route  handling a Pullman between Winston-Salem and New York and a Pullman between Gary  and Philadelphia.  If the latter were shifted to Jersey City in 1910, it apparently was shifted back to Philadelphia by 1915.]

   

  Gordon Hamilton



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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 23 00:26:09 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 23:26:09 -0500
Subject: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman
In-Reply-To: <F5CAD0B9D3F62341B4B6EA482A168E5FD254CB6E46@SWEC9965.w-intra.net>
References: <7E2CB0DDC4A947FB963C234DFB4B3456@DellVostro>	<000c01ca3b8b$4781c3e0$d6854ba0$@net>
	<F5CAD0B9D3F62341B4B6EA482A168E5FD254CB6E46@SWEC9965.w-intra.net>
Message-ID: <001601ca3c05$fa56b550$ef041ff0$@net>

Well, that answers the question. On March 6, 1910, the closest they could
get to New York on the Pennsy was Jersey City. Presumably the line was
extended to Penn Station once it was opened.      Jim Nichols

 

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 6:30 PM
To: 'NW Mailing List'
Subject: RE: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman

 

Penn Station in Manhattan, NYC was opened on  November 27, 1910.

 

Ed Painter;  Narrows, Va living in Russellville, AR

 

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 8:48 AM
To: 'NW Mailing List'
Subject: RE: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman

 

When was Penn Station opened? Looks like we need a 1910 Official Guide.
Jim Nichols

 

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 9:34 PM
To: 3N&W Mailing List
Subject: N&W in 1910--Gary Pullman

 

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 23, 1910

 

IN CITY AND COALFIELD

------

Pullman Car Change

 

    Commencing March 6th the Pullman car which now runs between Gary and
Philadelphia will run between Gary and Jersey City.  The Pullman from
Roanoke will be discontinued to Jersey City and the Gary Car will do the
work.  For a number of years every man from this section who has visited the
union station in Philadelphia has smiled and thought of home when he saw a
sign at the station saying, "This car for Gary, W. Va."  They can now be at
home in Jersey City as they will be greeted by a sign across the river from
New York which will say in large type, "This car for Gary, W. Va."  Locally
the car will have to be called the New York special, as the people in this
section will feel that they are not being treated right unless they feel
that all the world knows that a car runs direct from Gary and this city to
New York.

------

[There are two thing puzzling about this report.  One, the June 1915
Official Guide shows the New York connections then were over the PRR into
Pennsylvania Station in Manhattan--not Jersey City.  Could B&O trains have
been used to Jersey City in 1910?  Two, this same 1915 guide shows Trains 1
and 2 on the Shenandoah Valley route  handling a Pullman between
Winston-Salem and New York and a Pullman between Gary  and Philadelphia.  If
the latter were shifted to Jersey City in 1910, it apparently was shifted
back to Philadelphia by 1915.]

 

Gordon Hamilton

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 23 10:38:28 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 10:38:28 EDT
Subject: Dates for NH Penn Station
Message-ID: <be3.5132fa2d.37eb8ce4@aol.com>

Another one graces the Valley Forge Militaty Academy and College in Wayne,  
Pa\
 
Neil K Yerger
 
audreyly at aol.com
 
 
In a message dated 9/22/2009 8:55:10 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org writes:

Hi  Friends, 
Since we're on the Penn Station  topic, I wanted to add a little known fact 
fo local interest. One of  the 16 eagles from the main Penn Station 
entrance pediments is  located near the end zone at the football field of 
Hampden-Sydney College near  Farmville, Va. Log on to _www.shorpy.com/node/299_ 
(http://www.shorpy.com/node/299)  for more  info.  
Take care, 
Norris Deyerle 
Lynchburg, Va. 
 
____________________________________
To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
Subject: Dates for NH Penn Station
Date:  Tue, 22 Sep 2009 12:09:53 -0400
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org


>From Triumph V ? Philadelphia to New York 1830 ?  2002 
Authors David W. Messer and Charles S.  Roberts. 
26 Dec 1901 PRR President Cassatt presented a plan for  electrifying the 
railroad from Harrison NJ thru the NJ Meadow Lands and then  via a tunnel 
under Bergin Hill and the Hudson River to a grand Terminal in  midtown 
Manhattan. 
In April 1902 Charles Follen McKim was contracted as  Architect.  
Ground breaking for the station was held at  31st Street and Ninth Avenue 9 
July 1904. 
Pennsylvania Station was formally opened on 1 Aug  1910 
The first train was Long Island RR on 8 September  1910. 
At 1202 AM 27 November 1910 the first west bound PRR  Train departed the 
station. 
At 12:50 AM the first east bound train arrived from  Philadelphia. 
Pete Heimbach 


 
____________________________________
Bing? brings you maps, menus, and reviews organized in one place. _Try it 
now._ 
(http://www.bing.com/search?q=restaurants&form=MLOGEN&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MLOGEN_Core_tagline_local_1x1)   =

________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To  change your subscription go  to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the  NW-Mailing-List archives  at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 23 16:09:02 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 16:09:02 -0400
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
In-Reply-To: <8CC042328508C90-3330-B677@webmail-d090.sysops.aol.com>
References: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>
	<8CC042328508C90-3330-B677@webmail-d090.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <4ABA805E.9090609@verizon.net>

But they sure didn't use Red cars. All blue as I recall, with a blue 
(Wabash?) E8
Tom Cosgrove

NW Mailing List wrote:
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Sent: Mon, Sep 14, 2009 11:06 pm
> Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
>
> RailPictures.net image of N&W GP40 #1372 with a tuscan red passenger 
> train in tow. Remarks claim its a commuter train?? Did the N&W do 
> commuter service in Chicago? Sharp looking train for a commuter. :-) 
>  
> Yes, indeed.  NW operated a commuter service from Orland Park to 
> LaSalle Street Station five days a week.
> It was known on the Decatur Division as the "poor boy".  After 
> Friday's arrival at Orland Park, the crew
> would bring engine and cars back to Decratur  for service.  The crew 
> would leave early Monday AM to
> arrive at Orland Park to take the commuters to Chicago.   The crew had 
> quarters at Orland Park for
> the four nights they spent away-from-home.  According to Bill Bridger, 
> a Supt who'd started in engine
> service on the Wabash, the fireman on "the poor boy" had a day job at 
> an upscale Chicago department
> store.   From memory, the passenger cars had two seats on one side of 
> the aisle and three on the
> other.   Believe service is now provided by the city of 
> Chicago.                     Harry Bundy
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


-- 
Tom Cosgrove
N2VFK
NREMT-B
SKYWARN Spotter LME002
Red Cross Disaster Volunteer since 1995



From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 23 17:54:11 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 16:54:11 -0500
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
In-Reply-To: <4ABA805E.9090609@verizon.net>
References: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>	<8CC042328508C90-3330-B677@webmail-d090.sysops.aol.com>
	<4ABA805E.9090609@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <001201ca3c98$62fb1c80$28f15580$@net>

Ah, but they DID use red cars (after the blue ex-Wabash cars had been
replaced by N&W PM's and P3's) The picture of 1372 with the red cars IS the
commuter train to Orland Park (just later than when it had blue cars).   Jim
Nichols

-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 3:09 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?

But they sure didn't use Red cars. All blue as I recall, with a blue 
(Wabash?) E8
Tom Cosgrove

NW Mailing List wrote:
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> Sent: Mon, Sep 14, 2009 11:06 pm
> Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
>
> RailPictures.net image of N&W GP40 #1372 with a tuscan red passenger 
> train in tow. Remarks claim its a commuter train?? Did the N&W do 
> commuter service in Chicago? Sharp looking train for a commuter. :-) 
>  
> Yes, indeed.  NW operated a commuter service from Orland Park to 
> LaSalle Street Station five days a week.
> It was known on the Decatur Division as the "poor boy".  After 
> Friday's arrival at Orland Park, the crew
> would bring engine and cars back to Decratur  for service.  The crew 
> would leave early Monday AM to
> arrive at Orland Park to take the commuters to Chicago.   The crew had 
> quarters at Orland Park for
> the four nights they spent away-from-home.  According to Bill Bridger, 
> a Supt who'd started in engine
> service on the Wabash, the fireman on "the poor boy" had a day job at 
> an upscale Chicago department
> store.   From memory, the passenger cars had two seats on one side of 
> the aisle and three on the
> other.   Believe service is now provided by the city of 
> Chicago.                     Harry Bundy
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


-- 
Tom Cosgrove
N2VFK
NREMT-B
SKYWARN Spotter LME002
Red Cross Disaster Volunteer since 1995


________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To change your subscription go to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 23 19:43:21 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 19:43:21 -0400
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
In-Reply-To: <4ABA805E.9090609@verizon.net>
References: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>
	<8CC042328508C90-3330-B677@webmail-d090.sysops.aol.com>
	<4ABA805E.9090609@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <7B236D14-87E7-488F-8D80-10EEEF44450F@rev.net>

Actually they did. After the end of regular passenger service, the N&W  
quietly returned to tuscan red. Car 537, renumbered to 1009 on  
conversion to a commuter car, rolled out of the paint shop in tuscan  
in 1971 or 1972, don't have the exact dates in front of me.

Ken Miller

On Sep 23, 2009, at 4:09 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:

> But they sure didn't use Red cars. All blue as I recall, with a blue  
> (Wabash?) E8
> Tom Cosgrove
>
> NW Mailing List wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>> To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>> Sent: Mon, Sep 14, 2009 11:06 pm
>> Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
>>
>> RailPictures.net image of N&W GP40 #1372 with a tuscan red  
>> passenger train in tow. Remarks claim its a commuter train?? Did  
>> the N&W do commuter service in Chicago? Sharp looking train for a  
>> commuter. :-)  Yes, indeed.  NW operated a commuter service from  
>> Orland Park to LaSalle Street Station five days a week.
>> It was known on the Decatur Division as the "poor boy".  After  
>> Friday's arrival at Orland Park, the crew
>> would bring engine and cars back to Decratur  for service.  The  
>> crew would leave early Monday AM to
>> arrive at Orland Park to take the commuters to Chicago.   The crew  
>> had quarters at Orland Park for
>> the four nights they spent away-from-home.  According to Bill  
>> Bridger, a Supt who'd started in engine
>> service on the Wabash, the fireman on "the poor boy" had a day job  
>> at an upscale Chicago department
>> store.   From memory, the passenger cars had two seats on one side  
>> of the aisle and three on the
>> other.   Believe service is now provided by the city of  
>> Chicago.                     Harry Bundy
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
>
> -- 
> Tom Cosgrove
> N2VFK
> NREMT-B
> SKYWARN Spotter LME002
> Red Cross Disaster Volunteer since 1995
>
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 23 21:27:53 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 21:27:53 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Dry Fork
Message-ID: <6DD6462A1B9141CFA84754A6140D9A66@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 23, 1910

DRY FORK TO FRONT
------
New Coal Mines Being Opened--Line Into Buchanan County

    The Norfolk and Western will, it is understood, add another passenger train to its present service on the Dry Fork branch between Iaeger and Berwind.  That section has grown and is continually growing.  New coal mines have been opened and there are a few uncut timber tracts which are valuable.  If the Norfolk and Western gets into Buchanan county, it will likely leave Bradshaw, on the Dry Fork branch, as has been surveyed.  Some time ago the railroad had a force of men at work on that branch looking over a proposed route and it has been reported a number of times that the road is to commence development.  The New River and Pocahontas Consolidated Collieries Company have a large plant on the line; the Yukon and War Creek Coal Company have also good sized plants while A. E. Litz, of Welch, and Colonel W. H. Thomas are interested in good sized plants along the line.  The Dry Fork branch will be a big producer in a few years, as coal can be shipped via the main line or via the Cedar Bluff extension, to make which possible the Norfolk and Western has recently let a contract for a tunnel 4,700 feet long.  This extension will connect the Pocahontas and Clinch Valley divisions.
------
Gordon Hamilton
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Wed Sep 23 23:07:52 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 23:07:52 -0400
Subject: New Railroad in 1910--Princeton
Message-ID: <4FDB34908EA54335B39C67F0FE344175@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 26, 1910

IN CITY AND COALFIELD
------
New Railroad Project

    There is a good prospect for a railroad up Camp Creek, toward Flattop and Bluff Mountains.  Options have been secured on the lands along the creek.  C. L. Harvey secured the options for a short time only.  If this road is built it will connect with the Bluestone Land and Lumber Company's road near Princeton.  This road will develop a large timber and coal area in the Bluff and Flattop mountains.
------

[A 1931 Flattop Quadrangle topo map shows a lumber railroad extending about three miles down Mash Fork (starting about a mile an one-half northeast of the community of Buff Mountain) to Camp Creek, up Camp Creek and its Cub Branch to a series of four switchbacks up to Sam's Ridge.  The line then runs along at the high elevation for about three miles, passing near the community of Flat Top.  From there it generally follows Glade Creek down stream for about three and one-half miles before crossing over a divide to follow Beaver Creek down stream for about seven miles to a meeting with the C&O near Beckley.  Could this be the line mentioned in the article?  Unfortunately, a 1926 Bluefield Quadrangle  topo map does not show the Bluestone Land and Lumber Company line, which would have met the Virginian at Gardner Junction just outside of Princeton.]

Gordon Hamilton
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Thu Sep 24 08:27:56 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 08:27:56 -0400
Subject: "Taking Twenty" with the Virginian Brethren
Message-ID: <4ABB65CC.30400@vt.edu>

Last night I had the pleasure of "Takin' Twenty" with eight of the Brethren
and Friends of the Virginian Railway. Landon Gregory is home recovering
from hip replacement surgery. We observed a new fish on the menu at Country
Cookin' called "pangasius". It is a new "no bone shark catfish" that tastes
"just like chicken" said VGN clerk Wis Sowder.

We discussed who and how we will be traveling to Victoria to meet with the
other Virginian Brethren at the Gathering on October third.

Passed around was the September/October "Turntable Times", newsletter of
the Roanoke Chapter NRHS. The cover has two photos of Chesapeake Western
Baldwin Diesel Switch engine #663 in original CW livery with Brakeman
"Sandy" Winegard, Chapter member, posing with the engineer and another
brakeman. This and other "Turntable Times", some with VGN items, can be
seen on the Chapter's web site: www.roanokeNRHS.org
This CW #663 is one of the "Lost engines of Roanoke" and now belongs to the
Roanoke Chapter and plans are to cosmetically restore her.

This Monday's "100 years ago today" in the Roanoke paper listed the
following: "Plans for the new passenger station of the Virginia railroad
were this morning placed in the hands of City engineer Gibboney". For some
reason, those who work at "The Roanoke Times" think the name of our beloved
fallen flag was "The V-I-R-G-I-N-I A Railroad".

Frank Breedlove, VGN brakeman and conductor, brought an article from
Roanoke's other newspaper, "The Roanoke Star Sentinal", from 9-18-09
entitled "September 11 Remembered at Old Passenger Station". This article
told about our flag pole dedication ceremony on 9-11-09. It also told of
what we are doing with the restoration project and included a color photo
of our flag at half mast.

Also shown was a 9-17-09 article in the "The Roanoke Times" about the VGN
Station's renovation. This article prompted an editorial in the same paper
on 9-22-09 in which the "Times" editor challenged the Roanoke Chapter to
have a "grander vision" for a use of the Station other than "a storage
facility with a few offices" (their words, not ours). The Brethren had a
great discussion about this and were disappointed with the "Times" opinion.
Also shown was the ad that will appear in this Sunday's paper for the Fall
Excursion Trains on November 7 to Bluefield and November 8 to Shenandoah.
Information about these trains can be obtained from calling 540-774-0611
and the Chapter web site listed above. Also in this Sunday's paper in
Roanoke, Richmond and Charlotte, will be the ad for application for bids
for a contractor to perform Phase I of the Renovation of the VGN Station.

Also discussed was the tragic fire at the N&W Bedford Station Restaurant. I
showed the Brethren a photo that Blue Ridge Chapter Director Norris Deyerle
sent showing the Station in service in the 1950s with a Powhatan Arrow
approaching. Several recalled eating "real" catfish at the restaurant.
Landon Gregory has told us about working there after the merger. When Smith
Mountain lake dam was being constructed, a spur track was put in near the
new N&W/VGN connection at Hurt and Altavista. It was called the "dam
track". Landon said that when passengers were waiting on the train at the
Bedford Station, they could hear all railroad radio traffic. After many
messages referring to the "dam track" were broadcast, and several ladies
were obviously distresses hearing the language used, Landon explained to
the ladies what the track was.

We discussed the Open House this Saturday at the Roanoke Chapter facility
at the Roanoke Industrial Park that will be open to the public for train
rides between 11:30 AM and 2:30 PM. All Chapter Rolling Stock, including
VGN, and "The Lost Trains of Roanoke" can be observed.

Yard Engineer William Scott has a golfing buddy who is trying to quit
smoking cigarettes. Scotty said that "he told me he'd tried everything
including the nicotine patches, 'OPs" (Other People's), 'AKs' (Any Kind)
and fake cigarettes. I told him to try what I used that helped me: carrot
sticks". He said "That didn't work, couldn't get 'em to light".

Time to pull the pin on this one!

Departing Now from V248,

Skip Salmon



=============



From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Thu Sep 24 17:55:47 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 17:55:47 -0400
Subject: Ohio Railway Museum/N&W combine possibly available
Message-ID: <0A30AE300D1443F79FCB7FDA0449D4CF@customerpc>

I received this information second hand, and have not been able to verify it through the museum's website, but someone told me the Ohio Railway Museum in Worthington (Columbus), OH, is making a couple of pieces of their equipment available, including an N&W combine and PRR RPO.  There was no mention of E2a 578.  Earlier this year, they did move a couple of heavyweight Pullmans from the museum to another museum in Dennison, OH.  The person who gave me this information is involved with the private restoration and operating of passenger cars, so he does have some contacts.  
So if any individual, group, or museum wanted to own a Norfolk & Western passenger car, this may be a good opportunity.

Marty Flick
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Thu Sep 24 20:58:43 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 20:58:43 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Signal
Message-ID: <A093CBD1D5D74F5B9857746C78BDFD59@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 27, 1910

ELIMINATES DANGER
------
Novel Switch Arrangement in Use at Big Stony Junction

    One of the most interesting switches on the Virginian and Norfolk and Western railways from a railroad safety point of view is the automatic arrangement which has been installed at the junction of the Virginian Railway and the Big Stony branch of the Norfolk and Western.  The Virginian Railway crosses this branch at Big Stony Junction and at that point the tracks are always cleared for the Virginian.  In case the Norfolk and Western wishes to use the tracks, a switch must be thrown and to do this the Norfolk and Western man has to enter a small house which is always kept locked.  He unlocks it and enters and the door automatically closes on him so that he cannot open it to leave the building until he has again thrown open the switch so that the Virginian trains have the right of way.  Of course he cannot do this until the Big Stony branch train has left the switch.  As soon as the train has gone over and the switch is again opened for the Virginian then the door automatically opens and he can leave the building, the door of which is again automatically locked and cannot be opened until the proper key is again inserted in the lock.  In this way there is positively no danger of a wreck at any time, as the track is open for the Virginian at all times except when a Norfolk and Western train is crossing.
------
[This is a strange attempt to eliminate human error, but there is no mention of any signal to let an approaching Virginian crew know that the crossing ahead may be blocked by the N&W train.  Also, I wonder how long it was before the automatic locking door got out of order in some way--maybe by a human who did not like the idea of being confined on a hot day.]

Gordon Hamilton
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Thu Sep 24 21:04:42 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 21:04:42 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Pennsy
Message-ID: <3BDBDDF44D6A41079E0C6E7879403E0B@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
February 27, 1910

PENNSY GETS CONTROL OF NORFOLK AND WESTERN
------
Report Current in Financial Circles But Road Makes No Official Announcement

    Philadelphia, Pa., Feb. 26--It is reported in financial circles that the Pennsylvania Railroad Company has acquired sufficient of the stock of the Norfolk and Western Railway to give it absolute control of the road.  The Pennsylvania has made no official announcement to that effect.
------
Gordon Hamilton
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 08:39:00 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 05:39:00 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Ohio Railway Museum/N&W combine possibly available
In-Reply-To: <0A30AE300D1443F79FCB7FDA0449D4CF@customerpc>
References: <0A30AE300D1443F79FCB7FDA0449D4CF@customerpc>
Message-ID: <96796.92628.qm@web52511.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

They're currently asking $9,500.00 for it. A little information and alot of pictures can be found 
here: http://www.ozarkmountainrailcar.com/nw_combine_1511.htm.

Brian D.




________________________________
From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: N&W Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 5:55:47 PM
Subject: Ohio Railway Museum/N&W combine possibly available


I received this information second hand, and have not been able to verify it through the museum's website, but someone told me the Ohio Railway Museum in Worthington (Columbus), OH, is making a couple of pieces of their equipment available, including an N&W combine and PRR RPO.? There was no mention of E2a 578.? Earlier this year, they did move a couple of heavyweight Pullmans from the museum to another museum in Dennison, OH.? The person who gave me this information is involved with the private restoration and operating of passenger cars, so he does have some contacts.? 
So if any individual, group, or museum wanted to own a Norfolk & Western passenger car, this may be a good opportunity.
?
Marty Flick


      
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 11:47:55 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 11:47:55 -0400
Subject: K2/K2a Build months
Message-ID: <D7DBDE19A9544D09BEE8DF26AF000B7E@Jimmy>

Would anyone know which month each K2 & K2a were built?
Jimmy Lisle
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 11:56:29 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 11:56:29 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Dining cars
Message-ID: <5F45C4802145499AB595529410450669@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
March 1, 1910

IN CITY AND COALFIELD
------
New Dining Cars
    The Norfolk and Western expects to receive in a short time seven new dining cars of the latest improved heavy type which will be put in service.  All but two of the present cars will be converted to other uses while the two cars to be retained will be used for extra work in case one of the new cars is put in for repairs.  The cars will be used on the regular trains which now have a dining car service.
------
[The pride in the "heavy type" is in contrast to the pride in lightweight passenger cars several decades later.  These seven 1910 diners may have been wooden cars because they did not survive (like some 1914 diners) to be listed in a 1950's MP Data Book, which listed these dining cars:  3 De, 1012--1014 inc., ACF, 1914--1915;  7 De, 1015--1021, Pullman 1923;  3 De 1022--1024, Pullman 1927;  and 4 D1, 491--494, Pullman 1949.]

Gordon Hamilton
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 13:17:23 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 13:17:23 -0400
Subject: K2/K2a Build months
References: <D7DBDE19A9544D09BEE8DF26AF000B7E@Jimmy>
Message-ID: <6A0CE3D6B7304FB88DC2A92FAFA3E173@Jimmy>

Let me clarify that. What month was each engine originally built in 1919 & 1923?

Jimmy
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 15:09:27 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 15:09:27 -0400
Subject: K2/K2a Build months
References: <D7DBDE19A9544D09BEE8DF26AF000B7E@Jimmy>
	<6A0CE3D6B7304FB88DC2A92FAFA3E173@Jimmy>
Message-ID: <EF513560C2454DAB8FEC3308DA7A5FC0@DellVostro>

All K2's built in May 1919.  K2a's 126-129 Apr. 1923;  130-134 May 1923;  135 & 136 June 1923;  137 July 1923.

Gordon Hamilton
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: NW Mailing List 
  To: NW Mailing List 
  Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 1:17 PM
  Subject: Re: K2/K2a Build months


  Let me clarify that. What month was each engine originally built in 1919 & 1923?

  Jimmy


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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 15:52:23 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 14:52:23 -0500
Subject: N&W in 1910--Dining cars
In-Reply-To: <5F45C4802145499AB595529410450669@DellVostro>
References: <5F45C4802145499AB595529410450669@DellVostro>
Message-ID: <001d01ca3e19$b5ad2bd0$21078370$@net>

These WERE wood cars, bought second hand from the Pennsy , numbered in the
1000 series. N&W class RC and RD (later DC and DD ?) They were, of course,
replaced by the steel cars (DE, 1210-etc.) Some of them (if not all) ended
up in MofW service.   Jim Nichols

 

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 10:56 AM
To: 3N&W Mailing List
Subject: N&W in 1910--Dining cars

 

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
March 1, 1910

 

IN CITY AND COALFIELD

------

New Dining Cars

    The Norfolk and Western expects to receive in a short time seven new
dining cars of the latest improved heavy type which will be put in service.
All but two of the present cars will be converted to other uses while the
two cars to be retained will be used for extra work in case one of the new
cars is put in for repairs.  The cars will be used on the regular trains
which now have a dining car service.

------

[The pride in the "heavy type" is in contrast to the pride in lightweight
passenger cars several decades later.  These seven 1910 diners may have been
wooden cars because they did not survive (like some 1914 diners) to be
listed in a 1950's MP Data Book, which listed these dining cars:  3 De,
1012--1014 inc., ACF, 1914--1915;  7 De, 1015--1021, Pullman 1923;  3 De
1022--1024, Pullman 1927;  and 4 D1, 491--494, Pullman 1949.]

 

Gordon Hamilton

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 16:31:59 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 15:31:59 -0500
Subject: N&W in 1910--Dining cars
References: <5F45C4802145499AB595529410450669@DellVostro>  
Message-ID: <003d01ca3e1f$3bc6c0f0$b35442d0$@net>

 

 

From: James Nichols [mailto:jamesanichols at bellsouth.net] 
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 3:25 PM
To: 'James Nichols'
Subject: RE: N&W in 1910--Dining cars

 

 

 

Supplemental information: Dad's records show them as 1000 and 1001, class
RC, and 1002-1005 as class RD, built Pullman 1910 and purchased from the
Pennsylvania. The mystery is: how long did PRR own them, since N&W bought
them the same year they were built? Or maybe Dad was mistaken about the
built date. There is a picture of one of the PRR cars in Dubin's Some
Classic Trains. In any event, PRR was buying steel cars because of the new
Penn Station in New York, so were happy to unload these almost new wood
cars.      Jim Nichols

 

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 10:56 AM
To: 3N&W Mailing List
Subject: N&W in 1910--Dining cars

 

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
March 1, 1910

 

IN CITY AND COALFIELD

------

New Dining Cars

    The Norfolk and Western expects to receive in a short time seven new
dining cars of the latest improved heavy type which will be put in service.
All but two of the present cars will be converted to other uses while the
two cars to be retained will be used for extra work in case one of the new
cars is put in for repairs.  The cars will be used on the regular trains
which now have a dining car service.

------

[The pride in the "heavy type" is in contrast to the pride in lightweight
passenger cars several decades later.  These seven 1910 diners may have been
wooden cars because they did not survive (like some 1914 diners) to be
listed in a 1950's MP Data Book, which listed these dining cars:  3 De,
1012--1014 inc., ACF, 1914--1915;  7 De, 1015--1021, Pullman 1923;  3 De
1022--1024, Pullman 1927;  and 4 D1, 491--494, Pullman 1949.]

 

Gordon Hamilton

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 16:09:18 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 15:09:18 -0500
Subject: K2/K2a Build months
In-Reply-To: <6A0CE3D6B7304FB88DC2A92FAFA3E173@Jimmy>
References: <D7DBDE19A9544D09BEE8DF26AF000B7E@Jimmy>
	<6A0CE3D6B7304FB88DC2A92FAFA3E173@Jimmy>
Message-ID: <002701ca3e1c$106e7040$314b50c0$@net>

116-125 built by Brooks (Alco) serial 61047-61056: 116 - 119, April 1919;
120-125, May 1919.

126-137 built by Baldwin serial 56138 and 56279-56289: 126-132, April 1923;
133-135, May 1923; 136 & 137, June 1923   Jim Nichols

 

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 12:17 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: K2/K2a Build months

 

Let me clarify that. What month was each engine originally built in 1919 &
1923?

 

Jimmy

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 17:39:46 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 17:39:46 -0400
Subject: K2/K2a Build months
References: <D7DBDE19A9544D09BEE8DF26AF000B7E@Jimmy><6A0CE3D6B7304FB88DC2A92FAFA3E173@Jimmy>
	<002701ca3e1c$106e7040$314b50c0$@net>
Message-ID: <BA2B191D83CD4B2CAFC850B911898E3B@Jimmy>

"All K2's built in May 1919.  K2a's 126-129 Apr. 1923;  130-134 May 1923;  135 & 136 June 1923;  137 July 1923.
Gordon Hamilton"
"116-125 built by Brooks (Alco) serial 61047-61056: 116 - 119, April 1919; 120-125, May 1919.

126-137 built by Baldwin serial 56138 and 56279-56289: 126-132, April 1923; 133-135, May 1923; 136 & 137, June 1923   Jim Nichols"

Thank you Gordon & Jim, but we seem to have a bit of discrepency in the dates. 

Jimmy
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 20:35:27 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 20:35:27 -0400
Subject: K2/K2a Build months
References: <D7DBDE19A9544D09BEE8DF26AF000B7E@Jimmy><6A0CE3D6B7304FB88DC2A92FAFA3E173@Jimmy><002701ca3e1c$106e7040$314b50c0$@net>
	<BA2B191D83CD4B2CAFC850B911898E3B@Jimmy>
Message-ID: <AC19DF2BC0E9461E9ED605CB69E8064C@DellVostro>

My dates are from "Description and Classification of N&W Locomotives Office Gen'l Supt. Motive Power Roanoke, Va., revised 8-21-51" (Dwg. F36300).

Gordon Hamilton
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: NW Mailing List 
  To: NW Mailing List 
  Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 5:39 PM
  Subject: Re: K2/K2a Build months


  "All K2's built in May 1919.  K2a's 126-129 Apr. 1923;  130-134 May 1923;  135 & 136 June 1923;  137 July 1923.
  Gordon Hamilton"
  "116-125 built by Brooks (Alco) serial 61047-61056: 116 - 119, April 1919; 120-125, May 1919.

  126-137 built by Baldwin serial 56138 and 56279-56289: 126-132, April 1923; 133-135, May 1923; 136 & 137, June 1923   Jim Nichols"

  Thank you Gordon & Jim, but we seem to have a bit of discrepency in the dates. 

  Jimmy



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  To change your subscription go to
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  http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/


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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 20:59:27 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 20:59:27 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Faster than a speeding bullet,
	more powerful than a locomotive???
Message-ID: <F5E5C983F1E74327A96EB2B0B01495E7@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
March 3, 1910

JUMPS FROM TRAIN AND OUTRUNS BULLETS
------
Italian After Shooting Clerk in Hand Escapes From Officer Who Arrested Him
    Thousands of people have read of shooting scrapes in this section, but yesterday morning at St. Paul about two hundred people had a chance to see a human target running as fast as he could from an officer who fired four shots after him while several were shouting for someone else to shoot.  Fortunately for the Italian, no one else had fire arms and he made good his escape for the time being.
    The Italian, who will have to be nameless as he left without divulging his identity, was arrested at Dante where he had shot a clerk in the hand.  Officer Kelly of the Carolina, Clinchfield and Ohio police was taking the man to Lebanon to the county jail and was seated in the Norfolk and Western first class coach when the Italian, who was handcuffed on one hand, asked to be allowed to go into the smoker.  The officer agreed to this and walked behind the prisoner until he reached the platform, when the man made a flying leap from the train and started on the run before the officer recovered from his surprise.
    Immediately pulling his gun the officer went after the Italian, while all of the passengers in both the Norfolk and Western and Clinchfield trains put their heads out of the windows to see what was going on.  Interest in the uneven race seemed to take the breath from the people, who as in every case of the kind, wanted to see the prisoner get away, no matter what he was charged with.  Four shots were fired at the man, but when the train left the place the man was still uncaptured.
    The sight, said passengers on train No. 2 yesterday afternoon was a thrilling one and everybody expected to see the running Italian drop every time the pistol cracked, sending a leaden messenger after him.
    The shooting occurred 9 o'clock yesterday morning just as the Carolina, Clinchfield and Ohio and Norfolk and Western trains had met at St. Paul, the junction point between the two roads.

Gordon Hamilton
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 21:49:08 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 21:49:08 -0400
Subject: No wood cars in Penn Station?
Message-ID: <db3f29370909251849m1f5a5b16jdb605878c3f8a37f@mail.gmail.com>

Hello, Jim -

I'll play the dummy and ask how steel cars are related to Penn
Station. I'm going to -guess- that wooden cars were prohibited because
of the fire hazard in such an enclosed space. Is this the case?

- Marty Swartz

[Jim Nichols said:]
> Supplemental information: Dad?s records show them as 1000 and 1001, class RC, and 1002-1005 as class RD, built Pullman 1910 and purchased from the Pennsylvania. The mystery is: how long did PRR own them, since N&W bought them the same year they were built? .... In any event, PRR was buying steel cars because of the new Penn Station in New York, so were happy to unload these almost new wood cars.??? ??Jim Nichols

From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 22:13:09 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 22:13:09 -0400
Subject: K2/K2a Build months
References: <D7DBDE19A9544D09BEE8DF26AF000B7E@Jimmy><6A0CE3D6B7304FB88DC2A92FAFA3E173@Jimmy>
	<002701ca3e1c$106e7040$314b50c0$@net>
	<BA2B191D83CD4B2CAFC850B911898E3B@Jimmy>
Message-ID: <FAC246F16D244CD1A1F3936ABF9E1AE6@lewisdl0ls5whv>

Dates presented here are both correct in their own right. There are different dates for the building of these locomotives. I have the dates from ALCO and BLW for these engines when built which are earlier than the dates given in the N&W records. The N&W records are actually the dates when the engines went into service rather than actually built. If there are two differnet dates, I would go with the later one for "in service date" rather than built date.

Bud Jeffries
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: NW Mailing List 
  To: NW Mailing List 
  Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 5:39 PM
  Subject: Re: K2/K2a Build months


  "All K2's built in May 1919.  K2a's 126-129 Apr. 1923;  130-134 May 1923;  135 & 136 June 1923;  137 July 1923.
  Gordon Hamilton"
  "116-125 built by Brooks (Alco) serial 61047-61056: 116 - 119, April 1919; 120-125, May 1919.

  126-137 built by Baldwin serial 56138 and 56279-56289: 126-132, April 1923; 133-135, May 1923; 136 & 137, June 1923   Jim Nichols"

  Thank you Gordon & Jim, but we seem to have a bit of discrepency in the dates. 

  Jimmy



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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 22:17:34 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 21:17:34 -0500
Subject: K2/K2a Build months
In-Reply-To: <BA2B191D83CD4B2CAFC850B911898E3B@Jimmy>
References: <D7DBDE19A9544D09BEE8DF26AF000B7E@Jimmy><6A0CE3D6B7304FB88DC2A92FAFA3E173@Jimmy>	<002701ca3e1c$106e7040$314b50c0$@net>
	<BA2B191D83CD4B2CAFC850B911898E3B@Jimmy>
Message-ID: <000601ca3e4f$829d8420$87d88c60$@net>

Trust mine. They are based on personal observation of the builders plates on
the actual engines.  Jim Nichols

 

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 4:40 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: K2/K2a Build months

 

"All K2's built in May 1919.  K2a's 126-129 Apr. 1923;  130-134 May 1923;
135 & 136 June 1923;  137 July 1923.

Gordon Hamilton"

"116-125 built by Brooks (Alco) serial 61047-61056: 116 - 119, April 1919;
120-125, May 1919.

126-137 built by Baldwin serial 56138 and 56279-56289: 126-132, April 1923;
133-135, May 1923; 136 & 137, June 1923   Jim Nichols"

Thank you Gordon & Jim, but we seem to have a bit of discrepency in the
dates. 

Jimmy

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Fri Sep 25 22:49:47 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 22:49:47 -0400
Subject: K2/K2a Build months
References: <D7DBDE19A9544D09BEE8DF26AF000B7E@Jimmy><6A0CE3D6B7304FB88DC2A92FAFA3E173@Jimmy>	<002701ca3e1c$106e7040$314b50c0$@net><BA2B191D83CD4B2CAFC850B911898E3B@Jimmy>
	<000601ca3e4f$829d8420$87d88c60$@net>
Message-ID: <2CB9F89EA636493B94C5FD6157B279CD@Jimmy>

Jim,
    You mentioned that the plates were under the running board. were they ahead of or behind the steam pipes?
Jimmy
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 26 00:51:48 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 23:51:48 -0500
Subject: No wood cars in Penn Station?
In-Reply-To: <db3f29370909251849m1f5a5b16jdb605878c3f8a37f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <db3f29370909251849m1f5a5b16jdb605878c3f8a37f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <001801ca3e65$0ecd3930$2c67ab90$@net>

The Hudson River tunnel, Marty! And there was probably a New York City
ordinance regarding fire hazard. That is why New York Central and New Haven
had to run electrics into Grand Central.   Jim

-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 8:49 PM
To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org
Subject: No wood cars in Penn Station?

Hello, Jim -

I'll play the dummy and ask how steel cars are related to Penn
Station. I'm going to -guess- that wooden cars were prohibited because
of the fire hazard in such an enclosed space. Is this the case?

- Marty Swartz

[Jim Nichols said:]
> Supplemental information: Dad?s records show them as 1000 and 1001, class
RC, and 1002-1005 as class RD, built Pullman 1910 and purchased from the
Pennsylvania. The mystery is: how long did PRR own them, since N&W bought
them the same year they were built? .... In any event, PRR was buying steel
cars because of the new Penn Station in New York, so were happy to unload
these almost new wood cars.??? ??Jim Nichols
________________________________________
NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
To change your subscription go to
http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 26 10:35:12 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2009 10:35:12 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Faster than a speeding bullet,
	more powerful than a locomotive???
References: <F5E5C983F1E74327A96EB2B0B01495E7@DellVostro>
Message-ID: <F5CBF9AC482EA54EB3F59D6E0CFC3294010D6F8C@EXEVS02.its.uncc.edu>

"Interest in the uneven race seemed to take the breath from the people, who as in every case of the kind, wanted to see the prisoner get away, no matter what he was charged with."

What do you think that was all about?

Mike Weeks
Greenville NC


-----Original Message-----
From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org on behalf of NW Mailing List
Sent: Fri 9/25/2009 8:59 PM
To: 3N&W Mailing List
Subject: N&W in 1910--Faster than a speeding bullet,more powerful than a locomotive???
 
Bluefield Daily Telegraph
March 3, 1910
 
JUMPS FROM TRAIN AND OUTRUNS BULLETS
------
Italian After Shooting Clerk in Hand Escapes From Officer Who Arrested Him
    Thousands of people have read of shooting scrapes in this section, but yesterday morning at St. Paul about two hundred people had a chance to see a human target running as fast as he could from an officer who fired four shots after him while several were shouting for someone else to shoot.  Fortunately for the Italian, no one else had fire arms and he made good his escape for the time being.
    The Italian, who will have to be nameless as he left without divulging his identity, was arrested at Dante where he had shot a clerk in the hand.  Officer Kelly of the Carolina, Clinchfield and Ohio police was taking the man to Lebanon to the county jail and was seated in the Norfolk and Western first class coach when the Italian, who was handcuffed on one hand, asked to be allowed to go into the smoker.  The officer agreed to this and walked behind the prisoner until he reached the platform, when the man made a flying leap from the train and started on the run before the officer recovered from his surprise.
    Immediately pulling his gun the officer went after the Italian, while all of the passengers in both the Norfolk and Western and Clinchfield trains put their heads out of the windows to see what was going on.  Interest in the uneven race seemed to take the breath from the people, who as in every case of the kind, wanted to see the prisoner get away, no matter what he was charged with.  Four shots were fired at the man, but when the train left the place the man was still uncaptured.
    The sight, said passengers on train No. 2 yesterday afternoon was a thrilling one and everybody expected to see the running Italian drop every time the pistol cracked, sending a leaden messenger after him.
    The shooting occurred 9 o'clock yesterday morning just as the Carolina, Clinchfield and Ohio and Norfolk and Western trains had met at St. Paul, the junction point between the two roads.
 
Gordon Hamilton

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 26 11:07:06 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2009 10:07:06 -0500
Subject: K2/K2a Build months
In-Reply-To: <2CB9F89EA636493B94C5FD6157B279CD@Jimmy>
References: <D7DBDE19A9544D09BEE8DF26AF000B7E@Jimmy><6A0CE3D6B7304FB88DC2A92FAFA3E173@Jimmy>	<002701ca3e1c$106e7040$314b50c0$@net><BA2B191D83CD4B2CAFC850B911898E3B@Jimmy>	<000601ca3e4f$829d8420$87d88c60$@net>
	<2CB9F89EA636493B94C5FD6157B279CD@Jimmy>
Message-ID: <000901ca3ebb$035a81b0$0a0f8510$@net>

Above.    Jim

 

From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org
[mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 9:50 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: K2/K2a Build months

 

Jim,

    You mentioned that the plates were under the running board. were they
ahead of or behind the steam pipes?

Jimmy

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 26 12:03:52 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2009 12:03:52 -0400
Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
In-Reply-To: <7B236D14-87E7-488F-8D80-10EEEF44450F@rev.net>
References: <4AAF04A3.8000009@vt.edu>
	<8CC042328508C90-3330-B677@webmail-d090.sysops.aol.com>
	<4ABA805E.9090609@verizon.net>
	<7B236D14-87E7-488F-8D80-10EEEF44450F@rev.net>
Message-ID: <4ABE3B68.9000007@verizon.net>

OK, I'll stand corrected.
I sure won't argue with Ken or Jim.
Tom Cosgrove

NW Mailing List wrote:
> Actually they did. After the end of regular passenger service, the N&W 
> quietly returned to tuscan red. Car 537, renumbered to 1009 on 
> conversion to a commuter car, rolled out of the paint shop in tuscan 
> in 1971 or 1972, don't have the exact dates in front of me.
>
> Ken Miller
>
> On Sep 23, 2009, at 4:09 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:
>
>> But they sure didn't use Red cars. All blue as I recall, with a blue 
>> (Wabash?) E8
>> Tom Cosgrove
>>
>> NW Mailing List wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>>> To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
>>> Sent: Mon, Sep 14, 2009 11:06 pm
>>> Subject: N&W GP40 #1372 with commuter train?
>>>
>>> RailPictures.net image of N&W GP40 #1372 with a tuscan red passenger 
>>> train in tow. Remarks claim its a commuter train?? Did the N&W do 
>>> commuter service in Chicago? Sharp looking train for a commuter. 
>>> :-)  Yes, indeed.  NW operated a commuter service from Orland Park 
>>> to LaSalle Street Station five days a week.
>>> It was known on the Decatur Division as the "poor boy".  After 
>>> Friday's arrival at Orland Park, the crew
>>> would bring engine and cars back to Decratur  for service.  The crew 
>>> would leave early Monday AM to
>>> arrive at Orland Park to take the commuters to Chicago.   The crew 
>>> had quarters at Orland Park for
>>> the four nights they spent away-from-home.  According to Bill 
>>> Bridger, a Supt who'd started in engine
>>> service on the Wabash, the fireman on "the poor boy" had a day job 
>>> at an upscale Chicago department
>>> store.   From memory, the passenger cars had two seats on one side 
>>> of the aisle and three on the
>>> other.   Believe service is now provided by the city of 
>>> Chicago.                     Harry Bundy
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________________
>>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>>> To change your subscription go to
>>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Tom Cosgrove
>> N2VFK
>> NREMT-B
>> SKYWARN Spotter LME002
>> Red Cross Disaster Volunteer since 1995
>>
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
>> To change your subscription go to
>> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
>> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
>> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
> ________________________________________
> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org
> To change your subscription go to
> http://list.nwhs.org/mailman/options/nw-mailing-list
> Browse the NW-Mailing-List archives at
> http://list.nwhs.org/pipermail/nw-mailing-list/
>
>


-- 
Tom Cosgrove
N2VFK
NREMT-B
SKYWARN Spotter LME002
Red Cross Disaster Volunteer since 1995



From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 26 15:11:02 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2009 15:11:02 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Shay accident
Message-ID: <65C2ED62A4B34769BF7E93C3F0B3C6A4@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
March 4, 1910

FIREMAN CARTER SERIOUSLY BURNED
------
Engineer Rinard Also Injured by Explosion on Engine on Williamson Yard
    The well known Shay engine which was a source of so much trouble between this city and Flat Fop, where it was used, has again sprung into the limelight at Williamson, where it has been used of late to push cars over the hump leading to the scales.  In some way the saddle exploded yesterday morning about 2 o'clock and as a result Engineer W. J. Rinard and Fireman O. H. Carter were injured.  The men were taken to the Railroad Y. M. C. A. at Williamson where they were treated in the temporary hospital.  Mr. Rinard was not seriously burned and was joined last night by his wife.  The fireman was brought to Bluefield last night on No. 16 and taken to a local hospital for treatment.  His burns are considered serious.  The engine, which is known as No. 56, was used at one time between this city and Flat Top for pushing coal trains, but as it was not able to make more than twelve miles per hour, it continually got in the way of other traffic and in that way became too expensive to operate.  It was a frequent visitor to the shops and on account of its complicated mechanism, the sight of it wending its way in the shops was disliked by every man on the line.
------
[The following info on this unique N&W locomotive comes from Prince's book on the N&W and Koch's book on Shay locomotives:  It was built 8-21-1907 as N&W No. 1, but later renumbered N&W No. 56.  This 150-ton, 4-truck Shay was among the largest Shays ever built.  Sold by N&W in 1915 to Birmingham Rail & Locomotive Co. (dealer), Birmingham, AL; Sold 4-5-1917 to Phelps-Dodge Corp., for use on El Paso & Southwestern Ry. as No. 99; Sold 1919 to O. W. Brown Loco. & Supply (dealer), Seattle, WA; Sold 12-1919 to United Commercial Co. (dealer), San Francisco, CA; Sold 2-1920 to Red River Lumber Co., Westwood, CA as No. 99; Scrapped 1934.  This history has to qualify it as being one of the most traveled and/or having the most owners of any N&W steam locomotive.

I can understand how the Shay would have caused congestion as a Flat Top to Bluefield pusher.  The problem was probably not so much its 12 mph limit when pushing coal trains, but its slow speed returning downgrade from Bluefield to Flat Top.]

Gordon Hamilton
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sat Sep 26 21:53:42 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2009 21:53:42 -0400
Subject: Virginian in 1910--Equipment
Message-ID: <894CB38E354D44FD8BD88299A643084D@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
March 4, 1910

VIRGINIAN RAILWAY LACKS EQUIPMENT
------
Has Never Found Slightest Difficulty in Finding a Market for Its Coal
    Raymond Dupuy, vice president and general manager of the Virginian railway, and George Reith, division superintendent, arrived in the city Tuesday afternoon from Norfolk and spent the night at Hotel Roanoke, says the Roanoke Times.  They are making a tour of inspection over the line and from Roanoke will go to the western terminus.  Mr. Dupuy has been connected with the Virginian almost from the day the building of the road began.  He has seen it pass through many vicissitudes, through the depression of 1907 and 1908, and through its early struggles, and he is today the guiding genius of its destiny.  He knows every foot of the Virginian from Norfolk to Deepwater, and is familiar with every hill and valley through which it passes.
    The growth of business on the Virginian has been most gratifying to those who are interested in it.  The volume of its traffic has increased steadily and the number of trains now going through Roanoke is much larger than what it was a few months ago. An official of the Virginian says that the road needs badly more engines.  Its car equipment has kept ahead of the locomotive equipment and the principal trouble now encountered is in procuring the power to handle its trains.  A large number of engines are being built and are being delivered from time to time, but the delivery does not keep pace with the increase of business.
    Speaking of the real supply of the mines along the road, it is said that the Virginian has never had the slightest difficulty in finding a market for its output; that it has had a place for every ton of coal taken out of the ground, and that as the mines are opened their output is taken care of without the slightest trouble.  "The Winding Gulf" says a Virginian official, "will develop one of the richest coal sections in West Virginia, and when the various operations there are at work the road will be able to meet every demand for coal which it may receive.'
------
Gordon Hamilton
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 27 11:49:25 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 10:49:25 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: N&W in 1910--Faster than a speeding bullet,
	more powerful than a locomotive???
Message-ID: <430322405.304604.1254066565467.JavaMail.root@vms246.mailsrvcs.net>

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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 27 16:56:05 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 16:56:05 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Faster than a speeding bullet,
	more powerful than a locomotive???
References: <430322405.304604.1254066565467.JavaMail.root@vms246.mailsrvcs.net>
Message-ID: <C5AFF69435B54D3A92E75779E51A7EEF@601ek604>

That's why I didn't go to the movie Titanic.  I know how it ends - the  darn boat sinks.

EdKing
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: NW Mailing List 
  To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org 
  Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 11:49 AM
  Subject: Re: RE: N&W in 1910--Faster than a speeding bullet,more powerful than a locomotive???


  Just rhetoric and hyperbole on the part of the reporter.
  Us Virgininians still root for General Lee even though we know how the movie ends.
  People usually root for the underdog until all the facts weigh in and allow 'rational' to take over.
  Tom Cosgrove


  Sep 26, 2009 09:14:29 PM, nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org wrote:

    "Interest in the uneven race seemed to take the breath from the people, who as in every case of the kind, wanted to see the prisoner get away, no matter what he was charged with."

    What do you think that was all about?

    Mike Weeks
    Greenville NC


    -----Original Message-----
    From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org on behalf of NW Mailing List
    Sent: Fri 9/25/2009 8:59 PM
    To: 3N&W Mailing List
    Subject: N&W in 1910--Faster than a speeding bullet,more powerful than a locomotive???

    Bluefield Daily Telegraph
    March 3, 1910

    JUMPS FROM TRAIN AND OUTRUNS BULLETS
    ------
    Italian After Shooting Clerk in Hand Escapes From Officer Who Arrested Him
    Thousands of people have read of shooting scrapes in this section, but yesterday morning at St. Paul about two hundred people had a chance to see a human target running as fast as he could from an officer who fired four shots after him while several were shouting for someone else to shoot. Fortunately for the Italian, no one else had fire arms and he made good his escape for the time being.
    The Italian, who will have to be nameless as he left without divulging his identity, was arrested at Dante where he had shot a clerk in the hand. Officer Kelly of the Carolina, Clinchfield and Ohio police was taking the man to Lebanon to the county jail and was seated in the Norfolk and Western first class coach when the Italian, who was handcuffed on one hand, asked to be allowed to go into the smoker. The officer agreed to this and walked behind the prisoner until he reached the platform, when the man made a flying leap from the train and started on the run before the officer recovered from his surprise.
    Immediately pulling his gun the officer went after the Italian, while all of the passengers in both the Norfolk and Western and Clinchfield trains put their heads out of the windows to see what was going on. Interest in the uneven race seemed to take the breath from the people, who as in every case of the kind, wanted to see the prisoner get away, no matter what he was charged with. Four shots were fired at the man, but when the train left the place the man was still uncaptured.
    The sight, said passengers on train No. 2 yesterday afternoon was a thrilling one and everybody expected to see the running Italian drop every time the pistol cracked, sending a leaden messenger after him.
    The shooting occurred 9 o'clock yesterday morning just as the Carolina, Clinchfield and Ohio and Norfolk and Western trains had met at St. Paul, the junction point between the two roads.

    Gordon Hamilton



----------------------------------------------------------------------------

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    To change your subscription go to
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 27 17:24:13 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 17:24:13 -0400
Subject: N&W/CC&O in 1910--Dumps Creek Branch
Message-ID: <AB65A427169E4DC1AB4BED485AA4F8B9@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
March 5, 1910

RAPID TRACK LAYING
------
Dumps Creek Extension Will Soon Be Ready for Traffic

    The grading and laying of track on the Dumps Creek extension is progressing at such a rapid rate that it will not be a long time until the Carolina, Clinchfield and Ohio Railway will be able to maintain a regular schedule service on the extension.  It will be only a short time before the company will be prepared to ship coal through the Clinchfield Fuel Company, the new company organized to sell the output of the Clinchfield Coal Corporation, which has mines at Dante and Toms Creek as well as at Dumps Creek.  The post office at Dumps Creek will be known as Clinchfield.
------
[Of course, the CC&O Dumps Creek branch became the N&W Dumps Creek branch in 1956.]

Gordon Hamilton
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From nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org  Sun Sep 27 20:27:23 2009
From: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org (NW Mailing List)
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2009 20:27:23 -0400
Subject: N&W in 1910--Sandusky line
Message-ID: <936A5A7DE0874682B6FA0F1CB42D8571@DellVostro>

Bluefield Daily Telegraph
March 6, 1910

NORFOLK AND WESTERN ACQUIRES COLUMBUS, SANDUSKY AND HOCKING
------
Announcement of Deal Will be Made Within Two Weeks--Securing of Lake Outlet Will Please Coal Operators
    According to what appears to be reliable information the Daily Telegraph is able to state that announcement will be made within the next two weeks, from the main offices of the Norfolk and Western or from the Philadelphia offices, that the road has acquired the Columbus, Sandusky and Hocking Railroad, which runs between Columbus, Ohio and Sandusky on Lake Erie.  Final arrangements for the transfer of the road are in course of completion and by the first of April the Norfolk and Western will have acquired the line.
    The above deal has been reported as under consideration for some time in the Daily Telegraph, and the reports have caused a great deal of satisfaction in the coal field, where the shippers have for a long time wanted to see the Norfolk and Western acquire a lake outlet which would prevent the holding of cars at Columbus until other roads were able to take care of them.  The acquirement of the Columbus, Sandusky and Hocking will also help the Norfolk and Western car question by enabling the road to handle its cars over its own tracks and in this way prevent their being diverted to other lines, thereby preventing them from being returned to the field as soon as would like.
    What connection the arrangement has with the statements which have been published that the Pennsylvania has secured control of the Norfolk and Western is not known, and as long as it does not affect the broad policy of the Norfolk and Western the local operators do not care.  As has been reported the Norfolk and Western has secured right-of-way at Columbus, near the Franklin county buildings, which gives the road plenty of yard space and by the moving of the Norfolk and Western tracks about forty feet the road will be able to send its own trains on to Sandusky.  It is also likely that in a short time contracts for shops and other improvements on the Norfolk and Western property near Columbus will be let.  Instead of Columbus, Cincinnati, Norfolk, Shenandoah, Winston-Salem, Bristol and Norton being the main terminals of the local road Columbus will in the future have to be left out and Sandusky added to the list.

[This reporter was prescient by about 54 years.]

Gordon Hamilton
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