N&W/Southern thru passenger service

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Tue Nov 27 19:31:14 EST 2012

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Did the Southerner and Crescent run simultaneously? I shot the Southerner several times when it detoured through Petersburg, after Hurricane Camille in 1969, but never saw the Crescent. I did see the Crescent detour by the new Collier Yard in 1971 for Agnes!

Walter Gay
waltrail1 at verizon.net

On Nov 27, 2012, at 5:53 PM, NW Mailing List wrote:

>> From the 1940's thru the mid-60's there were 3 pairs of N&W/Southern thru

> trains operated via Lynchburg and Bristol:

>

> Nos. 17 and 18 - "Birmingham Special" - Washington-Birmingham with a connection at Chattanooga to Memphis

>

> Nos. 41 and 42 - "The Pelican" - until 1946 known as the "New York-New Orleans Limited" - Washington-New Orleans

>

> Nos. 45 and 46 - "The Tennessean" - successor in 1941 to Nos. 25 and 26 - "Memphis Special" - Washington-Memphis

>

> All of the above trains handled Pullmans to and from New York handled by the PRR north of Washington, but the coaches originated and terminated in Washington.

>

> Southern Nos. 47 and 48, "The Southerner," as far as I know were the only Southern mainline trains that handled thru coaches via the PRR all the way to and from New York. South of Washington, Nos. 47 and 48 ran via Atlanta-Birmingham-Meridian to New Orleans.

>

> Southern Nos. 37 and 38, The Crescent," for much of its life was all-Pullman on the Southern between Washington and Atlanta. South of Atlanta, on the A&WP-WofA-L&N, coaches were included in their consists.

>

> Louis Newton

> --------------------------------------------------

> From: <nw-mailing-list-request at nwhs.org>

> Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2012 4:26 PM

> To: <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

> Subject: NW-Mailing-List Digest, Vol 88, Issue 42

>

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>> 1. Re: NW-Mailing-List Digest, Vol 88, Issue 40 (NW Mailing List)

>> 2. Re: NW-Mailing-List Digest, Vol 88, Issue 40 (NW Mailing List)

>> 3. Re: N&W/Southern thru passenger service (NW Mailing List)

>> 4. N&W model steam engine (NW Mailing List)

>> 5. RE: N&W/Southern thru passenger service (NW Mailing List)

>>

>>

>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------

>>

>> Message: 1

>> Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2012 13:52:33 -0500

>> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

>> Subject: Re: NW-Mailing-List Digest, Vol 88, Issue 40

>> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org

>> Message-ID: <50B50BF1.8070700 at verizon.net>

>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

>>

>> The Pelican was 41 & 42

>>

>> Dick Fisher

>>>> Don't forget the Pelican, N&W 17 and 18. Also ran New York/Washington to

>>>> New Orleans with sleeping cars for various destinations in the south.

>>>>

>>>> --Rick Morrison

>>>>

>>>>> The Birmingham Special and Tennessean were the two name trains handled by

>>>>> the N&W.

>>>>>

>>>>> James Wall

>>>>> Rural Hall, NC

>>>

>>> ------------------------------

>>>

>>

>>

>>

>> ------------------------------

>>

>> Message: 2

>> Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2012 13:58:05 -0500

>> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

>> Subject: Re: NW-Mailing-List Digest, Vol 88, Issue 40

>> To: nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org

>> Message-ID: <50B50D3D.80007 at verizon.net>

>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

>>

>> Dave:

>>

>> I think Charlie was referring to the Piedmont Limited (Nos. 33-34) which

>> ran from Washington to New Orleans via Atlanta, A&WP and L&N.

>>

>> Dick Fisher

>>

>>

>> Charlie (et all): The Piedmont went up the (old) WNC to Asheville. In

>> contrast to the Southern Crescent, which used those beautiful E-8s, the

>> Piedmont used FP-7s. Dave Phelps In a message dated 11/27/2012 7:03:44

>> A.M. Eastern Standard Time, nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org writes: Not to be

>> forgotten, my list friends, is that the Southern ran their three

>> Lynchburg trains well after Amtrak started. Without looking up dates,

>> the Lynchburg Special (the remnant of the Birmingham Special or

>> Tennessean) was cancelled first. The Piedmont, an SR Washington/Atlanta

>> (?) only train was next. The Southern Crescent survived by becoming part

>> of AMTRAK in the fall of '78. The D&RGW was the only (I think)other RR

>> to keep their regularly scheduled passenger trains after AMTRAK. Charlie

>> Long Lynchburg, VA -----Original Message-----

>>

>>

>> ------------------------------

>>

>> Message: 3

>> Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2012 16:04:00 -0500

>> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

>> Subject: Re: N&W/Southern thru passenger service

>> To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

>> Message-ID: <C6D72DEC-DD93-4FD4-BC05-4853301CAB53 at windstream.net>

>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

>>

>>>

>>> Not to be forgotten, my list friends, is that the Southern ran their three Lynchburg trains well after Amtrak started. Without looking up dates, the Lynchburg Special (the remnant of the Birmingham Special or Tennessean) was cancelled first. The Piedmont, an SR Washington/Atlanta (?) only train was next. The Southern Crescent survived by becoming part of AMTRAK in the fall of '78. The D&RGW was the only (I think)other RR to keep their regularly scheduled passenger trains after AMTRAK.

>>> Charlie Long

>>> Lynchburg, VA

>>>

>>

>> I believe we have most of the name trains that ran the Washington to Atlanta route of Southern. First the Southerner and Crescent, with the Peach Queen.

>> My June 15, 1969 schedule shows Southerner as trains 47/48, the Crescent train 38 north bound, the Peach Queen the Southbound train 29. These trains were merged by the next timetable I have for May1974 to form the Southern Crescent, trains 1 and 2, which is the train Amtrak(19/20) still operates today. Power was always the the green and imitation aluminum E8's. As someone mentioned routing at times was over the A&WP and L&N. In 1974 The Crescent ran daily to Birmingham and try-weekly on to New Orleans.

>>

>> The Piedmont was I believe a all coach train(was assigned a grill/coach) that ran Washington to Atlanta. Power was usually the FP7's and freight locos as late in life this train handled hot shot piggybacks to Potomac yard. At times handled local locomotives that were moved to and from Atlanta for service and inspection. Now is a NCDOT train with Amtrak for Charlotte to Raleigh service(73/74)

>>

>> The Asheville Train was the Carolina Special which came from Cincinnati to Asheville and was split there into two sections, one to South Carolina running I believe all the way to Charleston for a period using Saluda grade. the North Carolina section ran from Asheville to Greenville, NC via Winston Salem/ Greensboro. Power was passenger equipped F3's and or FP7's. It did have the Wabash dome from the N&W. The Asheville special ran Asheville to Greensboro, NC via Winston Salem, to connect with the Peach Queen and Crescent. Later was from Salisbury to Asheville. The other dome from the N&W was assigned to the Crescent but came no farther north than Atlanta in that service.

>>

>> The Carolinian was another all coach which I believe was Charlotte, NC to Washington DC thru Raleigh there transferred to the Seaboard. This train is operated by Amtrak(79/80) with the same routing.

>>

>> The Pelican is listed in 1969 as DC to Bristol.

>>

>> I hope this wasn't to long and not really what I had in mind with my original question. But thanks for the great discussion and I hope this helps.

>>

>> James Wall

>> Rural Hall, NC

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>>

>> Message: 4

>> Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2012 13:54:26 -0600

>> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

>> Subject: N&W model steam engine

>> To: <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

>> Message-ID: <006301cdccd9$02076120$06162360$@com>

>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>>

>> Gentlemen,

>>

>> I have picked up a N&W steam engine with the number 2009 on it. It is a

>> 2-8-8-2 with number boards up by the bell. I don't know just what series

>> this engine is and was wondering if it was one at all.

>>

>> I have a Y3a and a Y6b and the engine doesn't resemble either one. There are

>> 2 sets of 4 cylinders on the face.

>>

>> The model was made by Life-Like in the Proto 2000 Heritage Series.

>>

>> Can anyone tell anything about this engine?

>>

>> Thank you very much.

>>

>> Macdonald, RB

>>

>> mac at macdonald-studios.com

>>

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>> ------------------------------

>>

>> Message: 5

>> Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2012 15:10:10 -0500

>> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

>> Subject: RE: N&W/Southern thru passenger service

>> To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>

>> Message-ID:

>> <4B1678DCD8B2EE44B96F3B345421309218DF1ED281 at lx98ex1.lexington.com>

>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>>

>> Denver, Rio Grande & Western was another hold-out.

>>

>> George Weber

>> High Point

>>

>> From: nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List

>> Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2012 10:54 AM

>> To: NW Mailing List

>> Subject: Re: N&W/Southern thru passenger service

>>

>> I seem to remember Rock Island as the other hold out.

>>

>> Jim Nichols

>>

>> ________________________________

>> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>>

>> To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>>

>> Sent: Tue, November 27, 2012 6:03:42 AM

>> Subject: Re: N&W/Southern thru passenger service

>>

>> Not to be forgotten, my list friends, is that the Southern ran their three Lynchburg trains well after Amtrak started. Without looking up dates, the Lynchburg Special (the remnant of the Birmingham Special or Tennessean) was cancelled first. The Piedmont, an SR Washington/Atlanta (?) only train was next. The Southern Crescent survived by becoming part of AMTRAK in the fall of '78. The D&RGW was the only (I think)other RR to keep their regularly scheduled passenger trains after AMTRAK.

>> Charlie Long

>> Lynchburg, VA

>>

>>

>> -----Original Message-----

>>> From: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>>

>>> Sent: Nov 26, 2012 11:52 AM

>>> To: NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>>

>>> Subject: Re: N&W/Southern thru passenger service

>>>

>>> Thanks for the answers. I reason I asked was a photo in the new Southern in color V3 was captioned as a southbound train that would be going over the N&W. It was dated for after Amtrak day. So I say the caption is wrong!

>>>

>>> James Wall

>>> Rural Hall, NC

>>> ________________________________________

>>> NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org<mailto:NW-Mailing-List at nwhs.org>

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>>

>>

>>

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