Concrete Water Tank

Wed Feb 11 23:18:05 EST 2015

Skip,

I don’t have the design drawing for accurate measurements but the Radford tank wall is about two feet thick on the lower portion.   It has a thick ceiling above the lower room which serves as the floor to the tank above.  The portion holding the water has to be about 38-40 feet tall to hold 200,000 gallons and the thickness of the wall for this portion could be less that than the two feet below.

My point is this: it was mentioned that the footer was only holding 800+ tons of water while the structure probably weighed at least double the weight of the water being held by it.  You can drop the word incidental but the weight of the structure was very significant.

Bud Jeffries

From: NW Mailing List 
Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2015 4:21 PM
To: 'NW Mailing List' 
Subject: RE: Concrete Water Tank

Let’s take a closer look at the water tank described.  A 30 foot diameter tank 60 feet tall with 1 foot thick walls would contain about 5500 cubic feet of concrete.  At 150 pounds per cubic foot the weight would be around 825,000 pounds.  Assume another 175,000 pounds for the concrete foundation and you have a structure weighing 1,000,000 pounds.  If that tank held 200,000 gal of water at 8.33 pounds per gallon you would have water weight of 1,666,000 pounds.  The water weight is not quite as incidental as one might suppose.

Skip Chamberlayne

From: NW-Mailing-List [mailto:nw-mailing-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Mailing List
Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2015 9:54 PM
To: NW Mailing List
Subject: Re: Concrete Water Tank

The weight of water is incidental to the weight of the structure.  While water is 8.33 pounds per gallon, concrete is about 150 pounds per cubic foot or about two tons per cubic yard.  I don’t know the number of cubic yards of concrete in a water tank, but it is many.  The weight of the structure is huge and the weight of water in relation is incidental.  A water tank that has one-foot thick walls, sixty feet tall and about 30 feet across has many cubic yards of concrete.  The footers and foundation has to support a huge weight.

Bud Jeffries

From: NW Mailing List 

Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2015 9:07 PM

To: NW Mailing List 

Subject: Re: Concrete Water Tank

Chief Engineer's drawing L-230, "Norfolk & Western Railroad [sic] Standard 200,000 and 250,000 Gallon Reinforced Concrete Water Tank," 6/17/19 (NWHS No. HS-D00252) that I mentioned in a previous posting shows a 9' - 6" wide circular footing with the bottom of the footing 6' - 6" below base of rail.  A "Detail of Footing where Piles Are Used" on the same drawing shows a 5' - 6" wide circular footing bearing on 50 piles (size not specified), with the bottom of the footer likewise 6' - 6" below base of rail.  A note under the latter detail reads, "If larger foundation is required than shown on drawing, size to be satisfactory to the Engineer of the N. and W. Railroad [sic]."

Gordon Hamilton

  ----- Original Message ----- 

  From: NW Mailing List 

  To: N&W Mailing List 

  Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 8:25 AM

  Subject: Re: Concrete Water Tank

  This discussion can be carried to another level.

  A 200,000 gal water tank holds about 800 tons of water (200,000  gals X 8 lb gal = 800 tons.)  Spread that weight out over a dozen footers, and each footer must support (only) 66 tons of water + some additional load for the structure.

  That is not a lot of weight for a footer to carry, but I am wondering how footings were handled in places like the Dismal Swamp?  How deeply were they carried down, and how does one excavate to bed rock in a swamp...?

  A 200,000 gal tank could fill twenty very old 10,000 gal tenders, ten modern 20,000 gal tenders, or 6.6  30,000 gal whopper tenders.  This makes me wonder about the re-fill rate.  Anyone know the hourly capacity of the steam, distillate engine and electric motor pumps which were, over the years, used to re-fill the N&W tanks?

  Some railroads had a Superintendent of Water Service.  Who, on the N&W, wore the King-Waterboy hat?  And did this function (water supply) fall under the Motive Power or the MW Department?

  -- abram burnett

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