signals under electrification

Sun Mar 12 08:12:15 EDT 2017

Bud, all,
Thanks once again for your responses.  I was looking at the shots from the
electrified section of Thieme's book and found some pertinent information.
First, page 123 shows #2125 at Coaldale "under the wire" in 1937 and what
looks a whole lot like PL signals (a 3-armer to boot) guarding the West
entrance to the tunnel.  So it would appear that at least some PLs made it
into the electrification.  And on the flip-side of the coin, page 125 shows
one of several shots he made on August 4th, 1950, a month and a half after
electric operations were discontinued, with semaphores still in use at
Landgraff.  Also from August 4th, page 127 shows a West-bound passenger
train exiting the West portal of the new tunnel, so it would appear that
the "split" operations using both tunnels lasted only a few weeks.
Jim Cochran

On Wed, Mar 8, 2017 at 11:14 AM, NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
wrote:

> A little more than five miles of relocated main line, including the new
> double tracked tunnel, was placed in service on June 26, 1950 between
> Cooper and Lick Branch.  This ended N&W’s electric operation.  When the
> new line and tunnel opened, only the eastbound track was in place, while
> westbound traffic with steam continued using the old grade and the old
> single track tunnel for about three months until the second (westbound)
> track was completed through the new tunnel on the relocated main line.
> During 1950-52, another five miles of the old double track main line
> between Lick Branch and North Fork was relocated with major grade revisions
> and completed.  The whole Elkhorn project was done from 1947 to 1952.
>
>
>
> Bud Jeffries
>
> *From:* NW Mailing List
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 07, 2017 10:08 AM
> *To:* NW Mailing List
> *Subject:* Re: signals under electrification
>
> Eastbound traffic used the entire new line from day one. If the new bridge
> at Cooper was unfinished, it would have been only the westbound track.
>
> Jim Nichols
>
>
> On Tuesday, March 7, 2017 5:36 AM, NW Mailing List <
> nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> wrote:
>
>
> Jim, thanks for the clarification on the re-alignment,  I am still a bit
> fuzzy on the actual sequence/extent of the new construction.  I went back
> and read page 92 of Mason's book which indicates that in June of '50 they
> put into operation an Eastbound only bypass through the new tunnel which
> allowed the discontinuation of all electrified operations.  Westbound
> traffic still used the old tunnel for a period of time (anybody know
> exactly when the use of the old tunnel was discontinued entirely?).  I get
> the impression that the new bridge at Coopers may not have been completely
> finished by 06/50 and that even the Eastbound traffic may have switched
> back over to the older line somewhere between the tunnel and the bridge.
> I'm not really sure where this would have taken place because I believe the
> older line was higher than the new line in this section for the most part.
> I would also like to know exactly where the new bypass tied into the old
> line on the West end.  Mason says just past Maybeury bridge, but again
> there is a significant grade differential until you get West to about the
> point where the spur went down into the "bottom".  Not really sure of the
> precise location of this switch either, the pictures I have seen show a
> water tank just East of the diverging point which is East of the power
> house, but I believe it would have been East of the point where the Lick
> Branch spur left the main.  Any additional information would be most
> welcome.
> Jim Cochran
>
> On Mon, Mar 6, 2017 at 8:49 AM, NW Mailing List <nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org>
> wrote:
>
> The re-alignment did not take place prior to the end of the
> electrification. The new tunnel was the first part, and the re-alignment
> west of Maybeury took place after that. So there was never any problem with
> the wires. Based on the photos, it looks like PL's were not installed until
> after the wires were dropped. That probably would have made them the newest
> ones on the system. By the way: they did not become CPL's until years later.
>
> Jim Nichols
>
>
> On Monday, March 6, 2017 5:43 AM, NW Mailing List <
> nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> wrote:
>
>
> Thanks to Jim, Mason and especially Harry for the information.  Harry, I
> agree that the 01/01 date is suspect not only because of the foliage, but
> also, since the new tunnel wasn't opened until June, I don't think they
> could have removed the wire prior.  But that does bring up and interesting
> side question.  They were  re-aligning the grade from Northfork to Coopers
> for 2 or 3 years prior to ending electrified operations.  I assume much of
> the traffic though the old tunnel still needed electric units for the same
> reasons they were brought on in the first place, so I would further assume
> that to get the electrics where they needed to go, they had to maintain the
> whole electrified section actively while the construction was taking place
> by either moving components as they moved the right of way, or building new
> stuff, which seems a bit of a waste knowing that it was only going to be
> used for a couple years.  Did they de-electrify any of the main or branches
> prior to throwing the big switch when the new tunnel was placed in service?
> Also, I ran across archive item NW01199 (attached) labelled as Powhatan
> showing a signal bridge that was clearly build for the electrification
> (latticed supports) with PL signals, but the shot was obviously post
> electric operations because the wires are all gone, there are no other
> supports in site, and the tops of the supports that would have carried the
> high-tension lines have even been removed.  Can't draw any conclusions
> about my original proposition because there's no way to know if the PLs
> were installed prior to the end of electric operations, but environmental
> kudos to N&W for re-using infrastructure.  I'm still on the hunt for
> evidence of PLs being used in the electrified section.
> Jim Cochran
>
> On Tue, Feb 28, 2017 at 7:49 PM, NW Mailing List via NW-Mailing-List <
> nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org> wrote:
>
>
>
> Jim:
> If you go to the NWHS website, you can view Negative NG100054
> made at Vivian, WV.  Catenary has been removed, but one semaphore
> appears.  Note the trainman walking around Bottom Creek Curve.
> He may be en route to a telephone to get the dispatcher to "talk" him
> by the eastward signal.  Date shows as 01/01/1950, but with all the
> vegetation showing, that may not be correct date.     Harry Bundy
>
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