<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.6000.16674" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY class=hmmessage bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=charlestrella@hotmail.com
href="mailto:charlestrella@hotmail.com">Charles Trella</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=woodcarver@six.pairlist.net
href="mailto:woodcarver@six.pairlist.net">woodcarver@six.pairlist.net</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, June 22, 2008 4:02 PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Woodcarver] Woodcarver
Digest, Vol 1415, Issue 1</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Gentle Subscribers :-) Please support our List with a donation: <A
href="http://wwwoodcarver.com/WWWList/WWWList.html">http://wwwoodcarver.com/WWWList/WWWList.html</A><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<HR>
</DIV>
<DIV> <FONT face=Arial size=3>Good idea Butch, I don't know of a subject
that could be brought up and it wouldn't be subject to some laws. We have a
lot of experts on the list. Some are experts on any subject you could think
of. Lawyers can't agree or don't want to because they would rather do a lot of
research and bring threre so called expertise to court. Some people
don't make any money on there vast knowledge.. they just want to appear like
they know it all. There are some exceptions to this of course. I believe Ivan
and Joe perhaps a few others sincerly attempt to help any of us
sincerley. If you can't get satisfactory answers from a couple of
knowledgeable People It would be my thoughts you contact a lawyer.
respectfuly Jack</FONT></DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<P>
<P></P>
<STYLE>.hmmessage P {
PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; PADDING-TOP: 0px
}
BODY.hmmessage {
FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma
}
</STYLE>
Butch wrote:<BR> <BR>"Folks, I am just a whittler from South Louisiana
and I use to like reading this group for the wish of getting better with
carving. Can we get back to carving and off laws?"<BR> <BR>With all
respect Butch - this IS an on topic discussion for those who wish to be
involved with carving beyond just whittling. Perhaps it has gone on a trifle
longer than some other discussions of late . . . any for that matter. But I
see nothing wrong with that. Why is it that some feel the need to try to
squash an on topic discussion that they have no interest in? Use the
delete key or better yet . . . start a topic more to your interest. Not
trying to start a flame war here, but I get soooo tired of people trying
to kill threads that THEY see as irrelevant when so many have obviously
found it enlightening and VERY relevant.
<BR> <BR>ChuckT<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>
<HR id=stopSpelling>
<BR>> From: woodcarver-request@six.pairlist.net<BR>> Subject: Woodcarver
Digest, Vol 1415, Issue 1<BR>> To: woodcarver@six.pairlist.net<BR>>
Date: Sun, 22 Jun 2008 12:01:58 -0400<BR>> <BR>> Send Woodcarver mailing
list submissions to<BR>> woodcarver@six.pairlist.net<BR>> <BR>> To
subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<BR>>
http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/woodcarver<BR>> or, via email,
send a message with subject or body 'help' to<BR>>
woodcarver-request@six.pairlist.net<BR>> <BR>> You can reach the person
managing the list at<BR>> woodcarver-owner@six.pairlist.net<BR>>
<BR>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more
specific<BR>> than "Re: Contents of Woodcarver digest..."<BR>> <BR>>
<BR>> Today's Topics:<BR>> <BR>> 1. Re: copyright laws (Donna
Menke)<BR>> 2. Re: copyright laws (Butch JOhnson)<BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>>
<BR>> Message: 1<BR>> Date: Sun, 22 Jun 2008 05:42:03 -0700
(PDT)<BR>> From: Donna Menke <donpbk@yahoo.com><BR>> Subject: Re:
[Woodcarver] copyright laws<BR>> To: "\[Woodcarver\]"
<woodcarver@six.pairlist.net><BR>> Message-ID:
<452126.88440.qm@web54306.mail.re2.yahoo.com><BR>> Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=us-ascii<BR>> <BR>> Don't feel bad, John, I think
you should comment when something isn't right. I provided a forum where people
could share misprints and errata from my book. I want to know- and I want them
to know- if there are mistakes. First I went through the book with a fine
toothed comb looking for the tiniest of errors. I noted every typo and vague
direction. Then I asked everyone who had used the book to add their
comments/corrections. I haven't gotten much response and I wish there were
more comments. <BR>> <BR>> Teaching materials should be as near to
perfect as possible. Donna Menke<BR>> http://www.woodworks-by-donna.com
<BR>> Author: The Ultimate Band Saw Box Book<BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
----- Original Message ----<BR>> > From: john archibald
<john.archibald@blueyonder.co.uk><BR>> > To: [Woodcarver]
<woodcarver@six.pairlist.net><BR>> > Sent: Saturday, June 21, 2008
9:08:27 PM<BR>> > Subject: Re: [Woodcarver] copyright laws<BR>> >
<BR>> > Gentle Subscribers :-) Please support our List with a donation:
<BR>> > http://wwwoodcarver.com/WWWList/WWWList.html<BR>> >
<BR>> > <BR>> > Well Marcia I did get a smacked wrist from the
moderator. As a great granddad <BR>> > I feel a bit silly standing in
the corner with a Dunce's cap on .<BR>> > My crime? Embarrassing those
who sell books with rotten patterns.<BR>> > <BR>> > Still we Scots
who prove to be unruly used to be sent to the colonies, Canada <BR>> >
is out, maybe New Zealand?<BR>> > Rgds<BR>> > John<BR>> >
<BR>> > -------Original Message-------<BR>> > <BR>> > From:
Marcia Berkall<BR>> > Date: 21/06/2008 17:52:27<BR>> > To:
\[Woodcarver\]<BR>> > Subject: Re: [Woodcarver] copyright laws<BR>>
> John,<BR>> > <BR>> > If you are looking to get "shot down in
flames" it won't be by me. I have no <BR>> > idea what Scottish
copyright law involves. I see no problem at all in your <BR>> > using
the originals. For one thing, they are likely WAYYYY past copyright term,
<BR>> > IF (big IF) they ever were copyrighted to begin with. If they
are that old, <BR>> > then I think we can safely assume that they were
not copyrighted and that there <BR>> > is no real original authorship on
record. I am guessing that that is how it is <BR>> > possible to
recreate and compile them in book form that would be copyrighted. <BR>>
> As for being a professional....well, we all started as beginners!!! Glad
to <BR>> > have you among us and I hope you enjoy the journey!!<BR>>
> Marcia (aka Mush)<BR>> > <BR>> > At 07:45 AM 6/21/2008, you
wrote:<BR>> > <BR>> > Gentle Subscribers :-) Please support our
List with a donation: <BR>> >
http://wwwoodcarver.com/WWWList/WWWList.html<BR>> > <BR>> >
<BR>> > Marcia, I know I'm going to get shot down in flames for this but
I'm saying this <BR>> > because I believe. <BR>> > I see
copyrighted designs that are based on designs almost 2,000 years old. <BR>>
> Pictish, Celtic whatever. For what its worth I'll use the originals , the
ones <BR>> > carved on stones over much of Scotland, when and if I
choose. Originals? <BR>> > Can any of us in all honest create an
original design? I have my doubts. If a <BR>> > triangle is used , a
circle a zig zag, then the patterns originality - to me- is <BR>> >
iffy. <BR>> > <BR>> > I recently paid for a book of patterns, only
to find they were not <BR>> > geometrically accurate. When I contacted
the author she advised me that these <BR>> > were only meant as guides
and were made before CAD. I've no problem with that <BR>> > but the time
I wasted blaming myself of an error could have been better spent.<BR>> >
As a beginner I realise others maybe professionals trying to make a living .
In <BR>> > no way am I dismissing the time and skill they need rewarded
for.<BR>> > Rgds<BR>> > John Archibald<BR>> >
Glenrothes.<BR>> > Scotland<BR>> > <BR>> > See Marcia's wood
carvings <BR>> > at: <BR>> > <BR>> >
http://whittlinsnwood.com<BR>> > *****<BR>> > Affordable Web Page
<BR>> > Design: <BR>> > http://artwebmaine.com <BR>> > *****
<BR>> > <BR>> > Get 20% Off CoffeeCup Web Design Software<BR>>
> Use this code when you checkout: 226STS <BR>> >
www.getcoffeecup.com <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
------------------------------<BR>> <BR>> Message: 2<BR>> Date: Sun,
22 Jun 2008 08:21:47 -0700 (PDT)<BR>> From: Butch JOhnson
<bjohnson2349@yahoo.com><BR>> Subject: Re: [Woodcarver] copyright
laws<BR>> To: "\[Woodcarver\]" <woodcarver@six.pairlist.net><BR>>
Message-ID: <598588.40128.qm@web37003.mail.mud.yahoo.com><BR>>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"<BR>> <BR>> Folks, I am just
a whittler from South Louisiana and I use to like reading this group for the
wish of getting better with carving. Can we get back to carving and off
laws?<BR>> Butch <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> I would rather have a mind
opened <BR>> by wonder than one closed by belief<BR>> <BR>> --- On
Sat, 6/21/08, lbpatch@fbx.com <lbpatch@fbx.com> wrote:<BR>> <BR>>
From: lbpatch@fbx.com <lbpatch@fbx.com><BR>> Subject: Re:
[Woodcarver] copyright laws<BR>> To: "[Woodcarver]"
<woodcarver@six.pairlist.net><BR>> Date: Saturday, June 21, 2008,
8:59 PM<BR>> <BR>> Gentle Subscribers :-) Please support our List with a
donation:<BR>> http://wwwoodcarver.com/WWWList/WWWList.html<BR>>
<BR>> > when ever i get done with mi work, I sign it "carved by and
then<BR>> myname. would that work?<BR>> <BR>> Brad<BR>> <BR>>
<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> Gentle Subscribers :-) Please
support our List with a donation:<BR>> >
http://wwwoodcarver.com/WWWList/WWWList.html<BR>> ><BR>> > Most
books have some king of caveat or notice as to how many copies<BR>> > of
a pattern may be made "for personal use". Technically, once<BR>>
you<BR>> > reproduce that pattern for use in a class or in any situation
that<BR>> > involves making a profit from them, it does constitute a
violation.<BR>> ><BR>> > Jan, how fast can you run? :)<BR>>
><BR>> > Marcia (aka Mush)<BR>> ><BR>> > At 11:21 AM
6/21/2008, you wrote:<BR>> >> New sellers need a workable
understanding of the concept<BR>> >> of "original work" that would
respect the creations of<BR>> others and<BR>> >> would not get
carvers into legal trouble for copying.<BR>> >><BR>> >>A
workable definition of "originality" for artists has to lie<BR>>
>>somewhere between the "nothing is original" and the<BR>>
"everything is<BR>> >>original" arguments.<BR>> >><BR>>
>><BR>> >><BR>> >>Ivan Whillock Studio<BR>>
>>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++<BR>> >>So what's up ?
when I use Your book or Tom Wolf or Who ever and<BR>> >>teach others
to do that type of carving let say on the lawn chairs<BR>> >>or
caricatures ????<BR>> >>I use several pictures from differend books
and mags<BR>> >>Is this allowed ? or is this wrong ???<BR>>
>> Woodbutcher Jan<BR>> >><BR>> >><BR>> >>You
are invited to check out my website..<BR>> >> <BR>>
<http://www.janscarvingstudio.com>http://www.janscarvingstudio.com<BR>>
>><BR>> >>Also take a look at my picture trail albums
...<BR>> >><BR>>
>><http://www.picturetrail.com/woodbutcher>http://www.picturetrail.com/woodbutcher<BR>>
>><BR>> >>http://www.woodcarvingillustrated.com/forum/<BR>>
>><BR>> >><BR>>
>><http://www.woodcarvingillustrated.com/pdfdownloads/2082ChristmasGnome.pdf>http://www.woodcarvingillustrated.com/pdfdownloads/2082ChristmasGnome.pdf<BR>>
>>_______________________________________________<BR>>
>>Woodcarver mailing list<BR>>
>>Woodcarver@six.pairlist.net<BR>>
>>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/woodcarver<BR>>
><BR>> > See Marcia's wood carvings<BR>> > at:<BR>>
><BR>> > http://whittlinsnwood.com<BR>> > *****<BR>> >
Affordable Web Page<BR>> > Design:<BR>> >
http://artwebmaine.com<BR>> > *****<BR>> ><BR>> > Get 20%
Off CoffeeCup Web Design Software<BR>> > Use this code when you
checkout: 226STS<BR>> > www.getcoffeecup.com
_______________________________________________<BR>> > Woodcarver
mailing list<BR>> > Woodcarver@six.pairlist.net<BR>> >
http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/woodcarver<BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
_______________________________________________<BR>> Woodcarver mailing
list<BR>> Woodcarver@six.pairlist.net<BR>>
http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/woodcarver<BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
<BR>> -------------- next part --------------<BR>> An HTML attachment
was scrubbed...<BR>> URL:
<http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/woodcarver/attachments/20080622/d75e4d5d/attachment.html><BR>>
<BR>> ------------------------------<BR>> <BR>>
_______________________________________________<BR>> Woodcarver mailing
list<BR>> Woodcarver@six.pairlist.net<BR>>
http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/woodcarver<BR>> <BR>> End of
Woodcarver Digest, Vol 1415, Issue 1<BR>>
*******************************************<BR><BR>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>_______________________________________________<BR>Woodcarver mailing
list<BR>Woodcarver@six.pairlist.net<BR>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/woodcarver</BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>